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Windows 10 forced update you like it or not.

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  • BlinkennBlinkenn Member UncommonPosts: 166
    Originally posted by psiic

    Call me paranoid if you want but we are still dealing with the fallout of the NSA keeping a database of our cell calls without warrant or due process of law. 

    There is no way in hell I will ever agree to giving anyone complete and unrestricted access to any aspect of my online or offline life for ANY reason. 

    There is NOTHING to justify that kind of privacy violation, especially the cheesy ass excuses microsoft offered as explanation. 

     

    Screw windows 10, screw Microsoft, and screw the US Government.. You are NOT getting into my home without a warrant and due process of law EVER.

     

    There are alternatives... 

     

    Ubuntu http://www.ubuntu.com/download/desktop

    Haiku  http://www.haiku-os.org

    I wouldn't recommend Ubuntu, but there are other flavors of linux like Debian, etc. https://prism-break.org/en/all/

  • RidelynnRidelynn Member EpicPosts: 7,383


    Originally posted by Torval
    Why trust packages and package maintainers? If you really want to do it right you're going to have roll with Gentoo starting with compiling the kernel from a tarball.

    And what will it take to get gaming running on that system? Nothing that won't compromise the walled garden.

    Not only that, but odds are, especially on Linux, your browser fingerprint is small enough that you will be more easily tracked than a Windows or even Mac user. Are you going to run through tors and proxies? It takes a lot of work run under the radar and still have a system that does anything useful. Forget about playing mmos.


    I agree with Torval here. To go a step further:

    There is a price to pay for living in a plugged-in society. That price is the loss of anonymity to some degree. If that price is too steep for you, the only option you have is to live life unplugged, which while it is exceedingly hard to do, is not impossible.

    I also think there is a price to pay for living "free" - a lot of people in the US think that's just paid by the military, but it's not. The price for living free is giving up some portion of your safety and security. You can either be 100% free to do as you will (which I think is defined as Anarchy, if you look it up), or 100% safe and secure (by virtue of giving up your right to do anything that could compromise the safety and security of those around you). You can have varying degrees of each, but you can't have it both ways.

    I see being online the same way. You can be online, or you can private and anonymous, but you can't be both. There is no expectation of privacy when your device is blasting 1W radio waves in all directions, and your using a system that is interconnected with over a billion other people. There are so many interconnected systems: anything you do online leaves a fingerprint somewhere, and people/systems that matching up fingerprints to revenue is an inevitable consequence in a capitalistic society.

    Automated updates are possibly the best thing you could do for security and anonymity - it's the only way a company has to reliably patch 0-day exploits, and while not all tracking/hacking/identity theft is done by hackers using exploits, the most malicious and detrimental kinds are.

  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 25,353
    Originally posted by Classicstar

    I won't upgrade and give up my key for windows10 unless proven it's not forced and spying.

    What makes you think that Microsoft wants to spy on you in Windows 10 but not in Windows 7 or 8 or whatever you use?  You'd better get away from Windows entirely and try OS/2 Warp.  :p

  • Asm0deusAsm0deus Member EpicPosts: 4,405
    Originally posted by Torval
    Originally posted by Asm0deus

    It's a conspiracy...NASA, the CIA, DOD, Homeland, the ASIS, CSIS, MI6, ISI, RAW, FSSRF, DGSE, MOSSAD, MSS, all managed to get secret deals with MS to spy on everyone and find out all your deep dark secrets and they are the ones that backed MS or put them up to windows 10 and thus it's shitty design.

    You should be very very afraid, hell you should throw away all electronic devices, all money and sell your identity and then move to some cave no one knows about and live off the land for 20 years. You might be safe after all this time but.....depends have you given blood before do they have your DNA?

    You forgot the most important and most powerful secret organization of all: The Pentaverate.

    Start at 1:00 minute.

    Sorry my tinfoil hat maybe isn't 100% up to date lol

    Brenics ~ Just to point out I do believe Chris Roberts is going down as the man who cheated backers and took down crowdfunding for gaming.





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  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 25,353

    Does a tin foil hat made out of aluminum foil work the same, or does it have to be actual tin?  :D

    How many people look at every proposed update to anything on their computer and manually decide whether to allow it?  The real problem is not one of people wanting to cherry-pick which updates they'll accept.  It's people who disable updates entirely, never check to see what is there, and leave themselves vulnerable to long-patched security holes.

  • wrightstufwrightstuf Member UncommonPosts: 659

     Its ALL a conspiracy.  The government has always tried to control us. They employ various methods, the latest being subliminal messages hidden in computer software. What better place to accomplish that, but in the most popular OS. Think about it...ALL the MMOs are really government controlled software to turn our minds to mush. Then we can be the mindless lemmings the government hopes for.

     Your only hope to escape is to burn your computer, burn your tablet, burn your smartphone...Burn it all! Invite all your friends over to play a nice game of dungeons and dragons.

  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719

    What's most ridiculous about this thread is that it makes a beeline from forced auto-udates to paranoid schizo territory while ignoring the one and only problem I see with this - which I expected the complaint to be about: Forced updates can happen at inconvenient times if Windows is less than perfect at predicting idle time - which is why I always set it to notify me only.

     

    I don't want it nor any other program I use to auto-update anything while I'm in the middle of a game and they have been known to do just that.

     

    So... I'm hoping the idle detect routines have improved enough over the years that this won't be a problem.

    "Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”

    ― Umberto Eco

    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED

  • RidelynnRidelynn Member EpicPosts: 7,383


    Originally posted by greenreen
    There is too much accusation of tin foil hatting these days. Frankly it makes me believe those who engage it is just making a weak attempt at calling someone a name - which pretty much means you have no data and are arguing like an 8 year old.

    If you would - because you are so tin free - please open all your windows and doors tonight in both vehicles and homes. Then if you survive - please be sure to post all your vital information online for us. That would be your full name address and the contents of your entire wallet including all pin numbers stored in your head. 


    I'll admit - I don't lock my doors, even when I leave. I sleep with the front door open most of the time. I'm ok with that, and have done so for years. Maybe I'm just lucky.

    There is acting with some measure of reason and prudence, there's also going over one extreme or the other. My in-laws don't feel secure unless they have an alarm set - that isn't the same standard of security I have personally, but I don't think it's outside what is prudent, or the societal norm. Posting your name/address/SSN online is definitely going too far off the deep end, just like the guy that has 4 deadbolts and a shotgun under their pillow is probably a bit far off the other end. Too far off to either extreme - yeah, it's going to get pointed out that it isn't typical. That's what humans do best - identify deviations from the norm.

    So yeah, I am calling him a name. I'll even go so far as to say it's not thinly veiled. Because I think it's an individual who is going outside of societal norms in reaction to what they perceive. Now, to get something straight - I don't ridicule his beliefs - there are people who believe that stuff, they have went out of their way to educate themselves about it, and more power to them if that's really what they believe after they have done their homework. Then there's the echo-chamber people, who have no idea what they are talking about and knee-jerk to some headline at Drudge Report or Fix News - and those people I 100% ridicule, and I truly believe they deserve it, not because of what they believe, but because of their ineptitude, or maybe it's just their insufficient motivation to read beyond the headline and the echo-chamber shouts aand really form a true opinion.

    I fall prey to group-think from time to time, I'm not immune to it. But I try really hard not to. And for those that dive into it willingly, I have no respect for at all.

  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 25,353
    The way Windows Update works for me with Windows 7 is that it downloads updates in the background, but doesn't install them until I shut down the computer unless I manually do it sooner.  For the former, it should be pretty easy for Microsoft to set it to stop downloading updates if there's other Internet activity, so even if the Internet connection was idle when it started the download, it can halt it immediately if you start doing anything.
  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    Originally posted by Quizzical
    The way Windows Update works for me with Windows 7 is that it downloads updates in the background, but doesn't install them until I shut down the computer unless I manually do it sooner.  For the former, it should be pretty easy for Microsoft to set it to stop downloading updates if there's other Internet activity, so even if the Internet connection was idle when it started the download, it can halt it immediately if you start doing anything.

    You might be right. I have been using notify-only for so long that maybe this is the way it works now.

     

    I do know that in my Win7 computer at work, updates are pushed from the network and I get a pop-up window on the task bar that let's me delay for up to 4 hours but it won't install them unless I press oK... or it auto-installs them when I shut down which can be a bit of a pain if I'm taking the lap-top out of the office -  I have to wait for it to do its thing before I can unplug it and take it with me, This of course, is guaranteed to happen if I'm in a hurry :)

    "Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”

    ― Umberto Eco

    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED

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  • psiicpsiic Member RarePosts: 1,640

    Before you flock to windows 10 READ

    http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/microsoft-services-agreement

     

    Understand 10 is a service and you do not own it.. you are borrowing it at best, and the owner can come in at any time and even lock you out if they decide to.

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  • RidelynnRidelynn Member EpicPosts: 7,383


    Originally posted by greenreen
    That could happen but what happens when all systems are trying to download at hours off-peak.
    ...So maybe the solution there becomes regions - at 6am windows users on x continent can access the d/l - etc.
     

    A lot of things auto-update, not just Windows. I don't think the sudden surge in off-peak "auto-update" bandwidth will do a whole lot to the internet as a whole. Most patches aren't that large to begin with, and even a large patch like a Service Pack... is like one HD Netflix movie.

    Besides, it's called off-peak for a reason. Because people aren't normally using it then.

    Where did you invent this entire queue and consequences for auto-updated downloads? Microsoft has data centers all the globe over to ensure sufficient bandwidth ($15B worth of them if you believe the marketing) - so that would be the queue right there, I have never been told to "call back later" on an update from any company to date, let alone Microsoft. And as far as consequences - where did you get that your computer would force updates and lot let you multitask through the download (and probably install, something that has been standard for, oh, more than a decade now), or shut down the computer, or not let you online or not tell you to get updates? ALl of that sounds made up.

    And finally - "regions". They already exist. It's called time zones.

  • NanfoodleNanfoodle Member LegendaryPosts: 10,617
    The second you go online you give up your privacy. Everything and everyone is tracking where you go and what you buy. What you look at and how you got there. Only real problem with Windows 10 forced updates is they keep installing the wrong drivers for my video card and its keep messing things up. So every few days I need to reinstall my AMD drivers. 
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  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,919
    Originally posted by Iselin
    Originally posted by Quizzical
    The way Windows Update works for me with Windows 7 is that it downloads updates in the background, but doesn't install them until I shut down the computer unless I manually do it sooner.  For the former, it should be pretty easy for Microsoft to set it to stop downloading updates if there's other Internet activity, so even if the Internet connection was idle when it started the download, it can halt it immediately if you start doing anything.

    You might be right. I have been using notify-only for so long that maybe this is the way it works now.

     

    I do know that in my Win7 computer at work, updates are pushed from the network and I get a pop-up window on the task bar that let's me delay for up to 4 hours but it won't install them unless I press oK... or it auto-installs them when I shut down which can be a bit of a pain if I'm taking the lap-top out of the office -  I have to wait for it to do its thing before I can unplug it and take it with me, This of course, is guaranteed to happen if I'm in a hurry :)

    Auto-update work like that for Windows 8 and 8.1 as well. (Administrators control how updates are installed in a business environment). 

  • botrytisbotrytis Member RarePosts: 3,363
    Originally posted by rojoArcueid

    MS has been spying on us for a long time now. Im sure these new measures will do just what Quizzical explained, along with more spying.

    Nothing else will change.

     

    I dont know how their spying stuff work, but if they can watch my content without paying for it then i expect to not be blamed when i get free stuff from the internet too. image

    Well, this site spies as do does Google, who is the biggest spy of them all (Google ads reading your cookies off your PC to see where you have been).

     

    MS was the first to offer private web browsing, not Google or any of the others. MS also fought the US gov't tries to get emails from Hotmail. Google didn't and Apple didn't either.

     

    Too much conspiracy kool aid going around.


  • psiicpsiic Member RarePosts: 1,640
    Originally posted by zymurgeist

    First herd immunity works well only if enough of the herd is immune.

    Second if you think Microsoft has nothing better to do than "spy" on you I wonder what you're up to.

    Third Good news, since it takes at minimum six people to provide 24 hour coverage on one person I think we've solved the unemployment problem. Bad news, the suicide rate due to boredom among the watchers is bound to sky rocket. Or is that good news too?

    This is not the issue, the issue is that windows 10 on your device does not belong to you. It belongs to microsoft, you are being allowed access to their house, to set up home, but microsoft has the right to come into your home anytime they like, move shit around however they want, take pictures of anything you are doing, and even kick you out anytime they want for any reason they want. 

     

    As if that is not bad enough microsoft is claiming the right to bring other people into your home anytime they like without your permission.  That means anytime they want advertisers, law enforcement, government can just roam all through your home digging through your crap and do not need your permission because when you agree to use windows 10 you are giving consent for them to search you anytime for any reason.

    FUCK THAT

  • KrimzinKrimzin Member UncommonPosts: 687

    So many people complaining.
    Been running it now for over a year and absolutely love it.

    As for the not owning things.. who the fuck cares.
    Not like they are going to come in and shut it off arbitrarily. Do you really think you owned any of the past versions. No.. you didnt. The only people this affects are those who dont buy the software they have..

    Windows 10 runs great.. even as a tech preview I had zero issues.

    Just because I'm a gamer doesn't mean I drive a Honda.
    Best Duo Ever

    Lets see your Battle Stations /r/battlestations
    Battle Station 
  • psiicpsiic Member RarePosts: 1,640
    Originally posted by Torval
    Originally posted by psiic

    Before you flock to windows 10 READ

    http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/microsoft-services-agreement

    Understand 10 is a service and you do not own it.. you are borrowing it at best, and the owner can come in at any time and even lock you out if they decide to.

    You should read your current agreements and find out you don't own those Windows versions either. You don't own your iOS or OSX. You don't own most of your Linux software either because you can't do whatever you want with it. The closest you'll get are BSD, MIT, and a distant Apache license which is pretty permissive.

    Yes but we have rights and protections associated with a lease. The difference is pretty simple.

    When you lease a property, the owner can not just barge into your house anytime they like without your permission and can never sell/give other people permission to enter your home without your consent.

    Now with windows 10 you are being given the right to live in a house that microsoft owns, they retain all rights to the house, and they can come in anytime they like and bring anyone they want anytime for any reason.

    Do you not see the issue?

  • RidelynnRidelynn Member EpicPosts: 7,383


    Originally posted by psiic
    Originally posted by zymurgeist First herd immunity works well only if enough of the herd is immune. Second if you think Microsoft has nothing better to do than "spy" on you I wonder what you're up to. Third Good news, since it takes at minimum six people to provide 24 hour coverage on one person I think we've solved the unemployment problem. Bad news, the suicide rate due to boredom among the watchers is bound to sky rocket. Or is that good news too?
    This is not the issue, the issue is that windows 10 on your device does not belong to you. It belongs to microsoft, you are being allowed access to their house, to set up home, but microsoft has the right to come into your home anytime they like, move shit around however they want, take pictures of anything you are doing, and even kick you out anytime they want for any reason they want. 

     

    As if that is not bad enough microsoft is claiming the right to bring other people into your home anytime they like without your permission.  That means anytime they want advertisers, law enforcement, government can just roam all through your home digging through your crap and do not need your permission because when you agree to use windows 10 you are giving consent for them to search you anytime for any reason.

    FUCK THAT


    Umm, that's the way nearly all software is sold. You may own the physical media, but the software itself is only licensed - you don't own it, your just paying for the right to use it, and the company has the right to do whatever they want to it.

    It doesn't mean "anyone" can roam through your data. Your data is still yours - even though the OS system software isn't. While the EULA does outline what data Microsoft will collect, and how they will collect it, it doesn't give them a blank check to every item on your hard drive, nor does it give anyone apart from Microsoft rights to view it (without applicable legal precedings, at least).

    Data ownership and software licensing are not exactly the same thing.


  • NanfoodleNanfoodle Member LegendaryPosts: 10,617
    Originally posted by psiic
    Originally posted by zymurgeist

    First herd immunity works well only if enough of the herd is immune.

    Second if you think Microsoft has nothing better to do than "spy" on you I wonder what you're up to.

    Third Good news, since it takes at minimum six people to provide 24 hour coverage on one person I think we've solved the unemployment problem. Bad news, the suicide rate due to boredom among the watchers is bound to sky rocket. Or is that good news too?

    This is not the issue, the issue is that windows 10 on your device does not belong to you. It belongs to microsoft, you are being allowed access to their house, to set up home, but microsoft has the right to come into your home anytime they like, move shit around however they want, take pictures of anything you are doing, and even kick you out anytime they want for any reason they want. 

     

    As if that is not bad enough microsoft is claiming the right to bring other people into your home anytime they like without your permission.  That means anytime they want advertisers, law enforcement, government can just roam all through your home digging through your crap and do not need your permission because when you agree to use windows 10 you are giving consent for them to search you anytime for any reason.

    FUCK THAT

    Thats the agreement for every bit of software you own or download. Every web page and account you have online. The second you connect your PC to the internet, you have given up your privacy. If you think you had it before windows 10 its only because you didnt know. Now you do!

  • CalmOceansCalmOceans Member UncommonPosts: 2,437

    As long as you don't use your real nane online, it's really hard for anyone to do something with your posts online.

    Without knowing who you are, they have nothing. ISP don't tend to hand over personal information unless there is a court order to do so.

    That is far more important to consider than if Windows updates automatically or not.

     

    As long as you don't post personal information online that identifies you, there is no window into your personal life. I don't know that many gamers who have Facebook / Twitter, many are quite careful about posting anything about themselves and most use an alias online.

    And if you regularly change your IP address by shutting off your modem at night, they won't have anything on you.

     

    ISP know who you are and what you do, but unless you are involved in criminal activities, no one but the ISP has access to that.

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