Lol don't mind him and the constant crap he spews. FF:ARR is doing more than fine without him. In fact, his constant negative comments have not stunted the games healthy growth the least bit.
One does wonder about the obsessive fixation though. It is probably to the point where help should be sought but that is not my call.
The more vocal haters a game has, the more successful it actually is. WoW has proven this to be true.
Success rubs some people the wrong way, especially when a hater feels that said success is not warranted (because he doesn't like the game).
This isn't exactly the case. Its not that people hate on games simply because they are successful, people hate the fact that the success of some titles has stifled the advancement and innovation in the industry.
While the industry has been off following models and formulas rather than making the games they're passionate about, they've left players with a very limited selection of games. That pisses people off, so they blame it on WoW. Its displaced anger really, but what do you expect; with billions of people on the internet, the MMO industry has followed behind a game pulling a mere 10M of those potential players. Its disappointing to see a genre that once had so much potential fall so short.
That does not give them the right to endlessly flame games they do not like just because they do not like what has happened in the industry. I hate a lot of things that has happened and I hate a lot of games in the industry. However I do not day after day week after week flame the same games over and over again pointlessly. Darkfalas89 just should be ban from this site because it does no one any good.
Edit
The reason why the industry has following WOWs models and formula is because investors got involved; and not because they like MMOs or Games. They got involved to make money and thats what it comes down to. Not saying its right just saying thats how it is and because big money got into the industry its screwed a lot of innovation. That will not come back until there is a large failure in the industry that drives the investors out.
This isn't exactly the case. Its not that people hate on games simply because they are successful, people hate the fact that the success of some titles has stifled the advancement and innovation in the industry.
While the industry has been off following models and formulas rather than making the games they're passionate about, they've left players with a very limited selection of games. That pisses people off, so they blame it on WoW. Its displaced anger really, but what do you expect; with billions of people on the internet, the MMO industry has followed behind a game pulling a mere 10M of those potential players. Its disappointing to see a genre that once had so much potential fall so short.
That does not give them the right to endlessly flame games they do not like just because they do not like what has happened in the industry. I hate a lot of things that has happened and I hate a lot of games in the industry. However I do not day after day week after week flame the same games over and over again pointlessly. Darkfalas89 just should be ban from this site because it does no one any good.
Edit
The reason why the industry has following WOWs models and formula is because investors got involved; and not because they like MMOs or Games. They got involved to make money and thats what it comes down to. Not saying its right just saying thats how it is and because big money got into the industry its screwed a lot of innovation. That will not come back until there is a large failure in the industry that drives the investors out.
Much like I've admitted in another thread here I definitely feel I could of went about things in a more behaved manner; it's still out of the feeling that FFXIV could do much better than what it currently stands as. I've supported this game well past it's horrendous original launch and well into a possibly prosperous future, so to wish for better future for the game I once loved to be called trolling truly is comical to say the least. Using a better choice of words moving forward and toning down the hipster logic this game has endowed me with I can certainly agree would be a needed change if anything. In closing I simply feel it is only right that players should play the free trial and cast their own decision on whether the game is worth subbing to. Trying to string others along promising them great riches/battles/fun as long as they stick with the game past the meager overture is not. If the game can't inspire you to press onward on its own, then the game simply isn't worth playing to you (SE drives a hard bargain with the Titan dinner party banquet, that questline claimed many friends alone that I tried to win over from other MMOS including FFXI) In the end I was the most vocal in my disagreement with the MSQ barrier to access expansion features. Even after completing the MSQ for HW I can say it is still unfair for those purchasing the game to be uninformed as to SE's very unorthodox decision of gating Expansion content in light of the current generation of MMO's.
Originally posted by mayanking meh didn't like the idea i don't get a free month for buying there 40 dollar expansion if it was 30 without free month i'd be ok but no thx. my friends are already 60 and completed alot of the content -.-
What expansion gives free game time?
Well? I'm waiting?
GW2's expansion gives free game time, includes the base game for free, and is only $10 more ....
GW2 is buy to play, so the expansion doesn't give you any free time, and FFXIV ARR + HW costs $59.99.
If you don't have the base game, the GW2 expansion is bundled with the base game and gives you unlimited free game time all for less than the cost of just the FF14RR expansion and just one month game time.
Yea and GW2 has a cash shop that is in your face at all times. ARR has a cash shop of stuff that is very cheap that is hidden. Plus GW2 does not use the Trinity system you basically heal yourself and some classes you can solo the instances your self. Very Single Player Driven game. FFXIV pushes people to group and groups are required for a lot in this game, plus Jobs are built for grouping not single player.
Since I will no longer play any non P2P games I will never play a game like GW2 also I dont like that it does not have a Trinity. So trying to say this game is B2P and using it as a tempting thing, its really not. I would rather go buy a single player game and never have to see or deal with cash shop stuff ever.
Good point- FF14ARR in addition to charging a sub, box price for base game, and charging for an expansion (that includes no game time in the price) ALSO has a cash shop.
Btw I have played GW2 since it launched, put thousands of hours into it and the only thing I have bought from the cash shop (which is really not "in your face") is just is an extra character slot. I also found GW2 pushes me to group more than most other mmos I have played, it is very much built around easy grouping. The flexible character development lets you build to be tanky/supportive/high damage, not so much based on class but on gear and skill/ trait selection.
However, our personal opinion about the merits of these games has little bearing on the topic: someone made quite an innocuous comment about wishing the expansion had free play time and the OP rudely demanded to be given examples of other games that do this, I am merely giving one such example. Hopefully the OP won't be so "Uniinformed" now.
Originally posted by mayanking meh didn't like the idea i don't get a free month for buying there 40 dollar expansion if it was 30 without free month i'd be ok but no thx. my friends are already 60 and completed alot of the content -.-
What expansion gives free game time?
Well? I'm waiting?
GW2's expansion gives free game time, includes the base game for free, and is only $10 more ....
GW2 is buy to play, so the expansion doesn't give you any free time, and FFXIV ARR + HW costs $59.99.
If you don't have the base game, the GW2 expansion is bundled with the base game and gives you unlimited free game time all for less than the cost of just the FF14RR expansion and just one month game time.
Yea and GW2 has a cash shop that is in your face at all times. ARR has a cash shop of stuff that is very cheap that is hidden. Plus GW2 does not use the Trinity system you basically heal yourself and some classes you can solo the instances your self. Very Single Player Driven game. FFXIV pushes people to group and groups are required for a lot in this game, plus Jobs are built for grouping not single player.
Since I will no longer play any non P2P games I will never play a game like GW2 also I dont like that it does not have a Trinity. So trying to say this game is B2P and using it as a tempting thing, its really not. I would rather go buy a single player game and never have to see or deal with cash shop stuff ever.
Good point- FF14ARR in addition to charging a sub, box price for base game, and charging for an expansion (that includes no game time in the price) ALSO has a cash shop.
Btw I have played GW2 since it launched, put thousands of hours into it and the only thing I have bought from the cash shop (which is really not "in your face") is just is an extra character slot. I also found GW2 pushes me to group more than most other mmos I have played, it is very much built around easy grouping. The flexible character development lets you build to be tanky/supportive/high damage, not so much based on class but on gear and skill/ trait selection.
However, our personal opinion about the merits of these games has little bearing on the topic: someone made quite an innocuous comment about wishing the expansion had free play time and the OP rudely demanded to be given examples of other games that do this, I am merely giving one such example. Hopefully the OP won't be so "Uniinformed" now.
"easy grouping" LOL
last time i played shitwars 2 i had to go to an external website to enter a pseudo chat thingie to run fractals
Originally posted by mayanking meh didn't like the idea i don't get a free month for buying there 40 dollar expansion if it was 30 without free month i'd be ok but no thx. my friends are already 60 and completed alot of the content -.-
What expansion gives free game time?
Well? I'm waiting?
GW2's expansion gives free game time, includes the base game for free, and is only $10 more ....
GW2 is buy to play, so the expansion doesn't give you any free time, and FFXIV ARR + HW costs $59.99.
If you don't have the base game, the GW2 expansion is bundled with the base game and gives you unlimited free game time all for less than the cost of just the FF14RR expansion and just one month game time.
Yea and GW2 has a cash shop that is in your face at all times. ARR has a cash shop of stuff that is very cheap that is hidden. Plus GW2 does not use the Trinity system you basically heal yourself and some classes you can solo the instances your self. Very Single Player Driven game. FFXIV pushes people to group and groups are required for a lot in this game, plus Jobs are built for grouping not single player.
Since I will no longer play any non P2P games I will never play a game like GW2 also I dont like that it does not have a Trinity. So trying to say this game is B2P and using it as a tempting thing, its really not. I would rather go buy a single player game and never have to see or deal with cash shop stuff ever.
Good point- FF14ARR in addition to charging a sub, box price for base game, and charging for an expansion (that includes no game time in the price) ALSO has a cash shop.
Btw I have played GW2 since it launched, put thousands of hours into it and the only thing I have bought from the cash shop (which is really not "in your face") is just is an extra character slot. I also found GW2 pushes me to group more than most other mmos I have played, it is very much built around easy grouping. The flexible character development lets you build to be tanky/supportive/high damage, not so much based on class but on gear and skill/ trait selection.
However, our personal opinion about the merits of these games has little bearing on the topic: someone made quite an innocuous comment about wishing the expansion had free play time and the OP rudely demanded to be given examples of other games that do this, I am merely giving one such example. Hopefully the OP won't be so "Uniinformed" now.
I think its ok for people to have different opinions on games. It's really in the end what will drive the market to be better overall when businesses start to realize that there is no WOW formula to get rich. WOW was based on luck and word of mouth not what MMOs do today.
On Different opinions, Personally after playing ArcheAge, and other F2P MMOs, I refuse to play another F2P MMO ever. Why I feel this way is because I see F2P MMOs like SWTOR spend more time and money on Developing content for that cash shop than game content. When I say Game Content I look at FFXIV for example, they came out 3 to 4 instances every 3 to 4 months with ARR plus other what people call fluff but content none the less. SWTOR works on spending time developing things for their cash shop and not fixing bugs or coming out with flash points. Games like AA make the cash shop a casino just look at the regrades and how you have to buy crystals to help your chance at regrades. Then Add Neverwinter another game I played where everything was expensive and revolved around buying keys for chest, no thank you.
FFXIV's Cash shop is character renames, character redesigns, seasonal events which if you missed you could buy that stuff or just wait until that event happens again, and they have one mount that you cannot get in game. None of what is on the cash shop really matters accept to a few people who likes all the minions or character looks. Add to that I feel at a $12.99 per month cost where I get new instances every 3 to 4 months I am getting real value. WOW does not do this and WOW waters down their dungeon content to the point your bored of the instances after 2 months. FFXIV at my pace with my friends are not likely to burn out because we can mix and match what we need to do with other instances we might want to do.
So when I look at my reasoning behind things I like with FFXIV; FFXIV is the game for myself, my wife, and a few of my friends. I know its not for all my friends however that is their opinion and I will not force my opinion on them regardless of whether they go back to WOW every 6 months for 2 to 3 months play all the time and cannot find happiness or not. I will tell them where I am and what I am up to however they are free to bang their heads against a brick wall all they want.
As for the OP he is allowed to have his opinion. With that said I never bought an expansion for ANY MMO and got a free month. He can complain about it all he wants; this is how it is and he can either live with it and sub to FFXIV or walk away. This is nothing new with ANY MMO.
Originally posted by Kyleran But apparently they've lost enough players to make it worth the effort to entice them to come back.
lol
Nope its called MARKETING. Give players a reason to come back and spend some money. GW2 does this, SWTOR does this, WOW does this, ArcheAge does this, Rift does this and so on and so on.
Now not all MMOs give Free Months or weekends, others give XP boost, or Free Credits to their in game shop, others with rez scrolls to get people to come back for free for 14 days. So its not that they lost enough players, its they are just trying to make MONEY. Thats all it comes down to at the end of the day is this
Originally posted by NightHaveN First I don't remember expansions giving free time. At least neither in Swtor, WoW or Rift.
Second, the expansion was announced some time ago and with the details of the locked content in advance so that people had time to prepare. Even non FFXIV players like myself heard the news so either will go full ahead and burn the content, or simply stay down and wait for waters to calm (queues, any fixes to land) before purchasing the game.
Perhaps some of those players left the game because they didn't like the original content and would only consider returning for the new content, but are not willing to rehash the old to get there? Designing that roadblock on purpose will only limit returning players as yet again SE is either out of touch with the market or willfully arrogant in forcing would be returning players to slog through the old crap first.
Lol don't mind him and the constant crap he spews. FF:ARR is doing more than fine without him. In fact, his constant negative comments have not stunted the games healthy growth the least bit.
One does wonder about the obsessive fixation though. It is probably to the point where help should be sought but that is not my call.
The more vocal haters a game has, the more successful it actually is. WoW has proven this to be true.
Success rubs some people the wrong way, especially when a hater feels that said success is not warranted (because he doesn't like the game).
This isn't exactly the case. Its not that people hate on games simply because they are successful, people hate the fact that the success of some titles has stifled the advancement and innovation in the industry.
While the industry has been off following models and formulas rather than making the games they're passionate about, they've left players with a very limited selection of games. That pisses people off, so they blame it on WoW. Its displaced anger really, but what do you expect; with billions of people on the internet, the MMO industry has followed behind a game pulling a mere 10M of those potential players. Its disappointing to see a genre that once had so much potential fall so short.
Nothing has been stifled, this is how every industry works. First there is a lot of innovation and experimentation, then the industry matures with less innovation. Someday a revolution may come and replace the old industry but this process is not stifled by the old industry at all - it comes if there is potential for it to come.
MMOs have matured and any sort of revolution is not coming anytime soon. Please try to accept the fact, MMO industry is following the model of every industry to exist ever and is no different from them.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
This isn't exactly the case. Its not that people hate on games simply because they are successful, people hate the fact that the success of some titles has stifled the advancement and innovation in the industry.
While the industry has been off following models and formulas rather than making the games they're passionate about, they've left players with a very limited selection of games. That pisses people off, so they blame it on WoW. Its displaced anger really, but what do you expect; with billions of people on the internet, the MMO industry has followed behind a game pulling a mere 10M of those potential players. Its disappointing to see a genre that once had so much potential fall so short.
Nothing has been stifled, this is how every industry works. First there is a lot of innovation and experimentation, then the industry matures with less innovation. Someday a revolution may come and replace the old industry but this process is not stifled by the old industry at all - it comes if there is potential for it to come.
MMOs have matured and any sort of revolution is not coming anytime soon. Please try to accept the fact, MMO industry is following the model of every industry to exist ever and is no different from them.
This isn't exactly the case. Its not that people hate on games simply because they are successful, people hate the fact that the success of some titles has stifled the advancement and innovation in the industry.
While the industry has been off following models and formulas rather than making the games they're passionate about, they've left players with a very limited selection of games. That pisses people off, so they blame it on WoW. Its displaced anger really, but what do you expect; with billions of people on the internet, the MMO industry has followed behind a game pulling a mere 10M of those potential players. Its disappointing to see a genre that once had so much potential fall so short.
Nothing has been stifled, this is how every industry works. First there is a lot of innovation and experimentation, then the industry matures with less innovation. Someday a revolution may come and replace the old industry but this process is not stifled by the old industry at all - it comes if there is potential for it to come.
MMOs have matured and any sort of revolution is not coming anytime soon. Please try to accept the fact, MMO industry is following the model of every industry to exist ever and is no different from them.
Thanks oh wise prophet, for this revelation.
He does have a point though, the problem with many people that want change keep forgetting that the industry operates just like everyone else "a business". While I still agree with this I can't say that a revolution is as far away as you think it is, looking at recent articles of how WoW is doing makes me start to reconsider. I don't have charts, graphs and facts but we can see that WoW has been harboring some of the worst first month retention rates post expansion launch for many expansions now. While WoW is but a single example it still goes to show that even with the expected drops, its loyal and vast fanbase is getting fed up with their crap.
This isn't exactly the case. Its not that people hate on games simply because they are successful, people hate the fact that the success of some titles has stifled the advancement and innovation in the industry.
While the industry has been off following models and formulas rather than making the games they're passionate about, they've left players with a very limited selection of games. That pisses people off, so they blame it on WoW. Its displaced anger really, but what do you expect; with billions of people on the internet, the MMO industry has followed behind a game pulling a mere 10M of those potential players. Its disappointing to see a genre that once had so much potential fall so short.
Nothing has been stifled, this is how every industry works. First there is a lot of innovation and experimentation, then the industry matures with less innovation. Someday a revolution may come and replace the old industry but this process is not stifled by the old industry at all - it comes if there is potential for it to come.
MMOs have matured and any sort of revolution is not coming anytime soon. Please try to accept the fact, MMO industry is following the model of every industry to exist ever and is no different from them.
Thanks oh wise prophet, for this revelation.
If you don't want a discussion then don't start one, lol. In this case it is indeed better to have your hands on your ears, so that there is no need to face the reality of the situation.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
Comments
That does not give them the right to endlessly flame games they do not like just because they do not like what has happened in the industry. I hate a lot of things that has happened and I hate a lot of games in the industry. However I do not day after day week after week flame the same games over and over again pointlessly. Darkfalas89 just should be ban from this site because it does no one any good.
Edit
The reason why the industry has following WOWs models and formula is because investors got involved; and not because they like MMOs or Games. They got involved to make money and thats what it comes down to. Not saying its right just saying thats how it is and because big money got into the industry its screwed a lot of innovation. That will not come back until there is a large failure in the industry that drives the investors out.
Much like I've admitted in another thread here I definitely feel I could of went about things in a more behaved manner; it's still out of the feeling that FFXIV could do much better than what it currently stands as. I've supported this game well past it's horrendous original launch and well into a possibly prosperous future, so to wish for better future for the game I once loved to be called trolling truly is comical to say the least. Using a better choice of words moving forward and toning down the hipster logic this game has endowed me with I can certainly agree would be a needed change if anything. In closing I simply feel it is only right that players should play the free trial and cast their own decision on whether the game is worth subbing to. Trying to string others along promising them great riches/battles/fun as long as they stick with the game past the meager overture is not. If the game can't inspire you to press onward on its own, then the game simply isn't worth playing to you (SE drives a hard bargain with the Titan dinner party banquet, that questline claimed many friends alone that I tried to win over from other MMOS including FFXI) In the end I was the most vocal in my disagreement with the MSQ barrier to access expansion features. Even after completing the MSQ for HW I can say it is still unfair for those purchasing the game to be uninformed as to SE's very unorthodox decision of gating Expansion content in light of the current generation of MMO's.
Strange, I only see the ingame shop when I actually CLICK ON IT.
And adding to that: the GW2 ingame shop is 100% free. You can buy everything with ingame gold.
Very easy to acquire ingame, plus you don't even need to use it.
"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"
Good point- FF14ARR in addition to charging a sub, box price for base game, and charging for an expansion (that includes no game time in the price) ALSO has a cash shop.
Btw I have played GW2 since it launched, put thousands of hours into it and the only thing I have bought from the cash shop (which is really not "in your face") is just is an extra character slot. I also found GW2 pushes me to group more than most other mmos I have played, it is very much built around easy grouping. The flexible character development lets you build to be tanky/supportive/high damage, not so much based on class but on gear and skill/ trait selection.
However, our personal opinion about the merits of these games has little bearing on the topic: someone made quite an innocuous comment about wishing the expansion had free play time and the OP rudely demanded to be given examples of other games that do this, I am merely giving one such example. Hopefully the OP won't be so "Uniinformed" now.
lol
"easy grouping" LOL
last time i played shitwars 2 i had to go to an external website to enter a pseudo chat thingie to run fractals
I think its ok for people to have different opinions on games. It's really in the end what will drive the market to be better overall when businesses start to realize that there is no WOW formula to get rich. WOW was based on luck and word of mouth not what MMOs do today.
On Different opinions, Personally after playing ArcheAge, and other F2P MMOs, I refuse to play another F2P MMO ever. Why I feel this way is because I see F2P MMOs like SWTOR spend more time and money on Developing content for that cash shop than game content. When I say Game Content I look at FFXIV for example, they came out 3 to 4 instances every 3 to 4 months with ARR plus other what people call fluff but content none the less. SWTOR works on spending time developing things for their cash shop and not fixing bugs or coming out with flash points. Games like AA make the cash shop a casino just look at the regrades and how you have to buy crystals to help your chance at regrades. Then Add Neverwinter another game I played where everything was expensive and revolved around buying keys for chest, no thank you.
FFXIV's Cash shop is character renames, character redesigns, seasonal events which if you missed you could buy that stuff or just wait until that event happens again, and they have one mount that you cannot get in game. None of what is on the cash shop really matters accept to a few people who likes all the minions or character looks. Add to that I feel at a $12.99 per month cost where I get new instances every 3 to 4 months I am getting real value. WOW does not do this and WOW waters down their dungeon content to the point your bored of the instances after 2 months. FFXIV at my pace with my friends are not likely to burn out because we can mix and match what we need to do with other instances we might want to do.
So when I look at my reasoning behind things I like with FFXIV; FFXIV is the game for myself, my wife, and a few of my friends. I know its not for all my friends however that is their opinion and I will not force my opinion on them regardless of whether they go back to WOW every 6 months for 2 to 3 months play all the time and cannot find happiness or not. I will tell them where I am and what I am up to however they are free to bang their heads against a brick wall all they want.
As for the OP he is allowed to have his opinion. With that said I never bought an expansion for ANY MMO and got a free month. He can complain about it all he wants; this is how it is and he can either live with it and sub to FFXIV or walk away. This is nothing new with ANY MMO.
Nope its called MARKETING. Give players a reason to come back and spend some money. GW2 does this, SWTOR does this, WOW does this, ArcheAge does this, Rift does this and so on and so on.
Now not all MMOs give Free Months or weekends, others give XP boost, or Free Credits to their in game shop, others with rez scrolls to get people to come back for free for 14 days. So its not that they lost enough players, its they are just trying to make MONEY. Thats all it comes down to at the end of the day is this
Perhaps some of those players left the game because they didn't like the original content and would only consider returning for the new content, but are not willing to rehash the old to get there? Designing that roadblock on purpose will only limit returning players as yet again SE is either out of touch with the market or willfully arrogant in forcing would be returning players to slog through the old crap first.
Nothing has been stifled, this is how every industry works. First there is a lot of innovation and experimentation, then the industry matures with less innovation. Someday a revolution may come and replace the old industry but this process is not stifled by the old industry at all - it comes if there is potential for it to come.
MMOs have matured and any sort of revolution is not coming anytime soon. Please try to accept the fact, MMO industry is following the model of every industry to exist ever and is no different from them.
The industry standard is somewhere around 30~40% retention rates after initial purchase. Yes, it is worth the effort to entice the 60% to come back.
Thanks oh wise prophet, for this revelation.
He does have a point though, the problem with many people that want change keep forgetting that the industry operates just like everyone else "a business". While I still agree with this I can't say that a revolution is as far away as you think it is, looking at recent articles of how WoW is doing makes me start to reconsider. I don't have charts, graphs and facts but we can see that WoW has been harboring some of the worst first month retention rates post expansion launch for many expansions now. While WoW is but a single example it still goes to show that even with the expected drops, its loyal and vast fanbase is getting fed up with their crap.
If you don't want a discussion then don't start one, lol. In this case it is indeed better to have your hands on your ears, so that there is no need to face the reality of the situation.