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They still refuse to offer an expansion only copy

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  • DistopiaDistopia Member EpicPosts: 21,183
    Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter
    Originally posted by Distopia

     Probably because every other post in this thread brings up WOW and it's $50 expansion+SUB. I've seen few supportive posts that didn't bring that up, fewer still that focused on what folks have actually been expressing concern with... IE what actually comes in this box. Which it seems has become the thing most deflected in this conversation, the value is argued from every angle but that, I find that concerning.

    Guild Wars 2 is a AAA MMORPG.

    WoW is a AAA MMORPG.

    Some AAA MMORPGs do charge $40-50 for expansions.

    We know what comes in the box.

    A few PvE maps that are iterations based on what Anet learned about Dry Top and Silverwastes - will have outposts, adventures and challenging content.

    More Personal Story.

    Guild Halls with missions and content associated to them.

    A WvW map and a new PvP mode (also available to people that own the base game, greedy Anet giving stuff for free).

    Mastery system.

    A new class and 9 specializations.

    Future Living World will take place in the new areas.

    The point was the price is meaningless when comparing what someone else charges without considering what they offer for that dollar amount. It also doesn't excuse it if both turn out to be a rip off. Two wrongs don't make it right, that's as simple as it can get.

    For $50 I'd get some new quests, a guild hall, a new class, some exploration. I can't count the future living world stuff if they handle it as they did the first iterations of that. IE they'll eventually charge for it if you weren't there during a certain window... (which hey that's fine, it just shouldn't be counted as free if they monetize it)... ANd please spare me the "well you can make the game dull and grind so you don't have to pay"...that's exactly the kind of thing this game was not supposed to be.I'd rather just pay than go against the grain.

    All I can say is those zones better offer quite a bit of content. That's the only thing I could see making it worth $50. IF not I'll definitely skip this one.

     

     

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • grimalgrimal Member UncommonPosts: 2,920
    Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter
    Originally posted by grimal

     

    You said I only played a few weeks which is absolutely untrue.

    I said If you only lasted a few weeks.

    As it seemed you were implying.

    I have no idea how much time you played, hence the if.

    It seems to me the more time anyone spent in the game the higher they will value the additional content of the expansion (with a few exceptions depending on what of the facets of GW2 you prefer).

    How did

    totalPlaytime < year

    Imply totalPlaytime == 3weeks ?

     

    Your last statement can be applied to almost anything (movie, book, game, etc).   I just have not heard a compelling reason why they do not offer the expansion itself at a reduced price that excludes the base game.

     

     

     

     

     

  • BladestromBladestrom Member UncommonPosts: 5,001
    ^^ a compelling reason? It's $2 a month averaged out, should it be $30 and $150 a year sub instead?

    rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar

    Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D

  • DistopiaDistopia Member EpicPosts: 21,183
    Originally posted by Bladestrom
    ^^ a compelling reason? It's $2 a month averaged out, should it be $30 and $150 a year sub instead?

    Depends how you're breaking that down. The original purchase might average out that way. Yet the expansion has yet to live up to that, on paper it seems to be about a month or so of new content, included in the purchase, the PVP could be had without the purchase, a new class carries about as much worth as any other class (to a person who doesn't make alts),  TBH I don't really find much appeal in repeating too many things in GW2 (or any other MMO), for me I doubt this expansion would be much different.

    Does anyone know if the living story will be handled as it was in the base game? IE limited run content, that costs extra later on? To me this expansion doesn't seem to be much more than ESO has added with their updates, like Craglorn. NOR TOR has added with their mini expansions which are dirt cheap in comparison.

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • quixadhalquixadhal Member UncommonPosts: 215

    Why is this a big deal?

    SOE has done this with EQ and EQ2 for many years, and it's a good idea.  Let me tell you why...

    If you use the Blizzard model, or the SOE model from 2004, you buy the game and play it,and then as each expansion comes out, you buy the expansions.  If, at some point, you stop playing and then decide you want to rejoin a few years later, you have to plunk down the cash for *ALL* the expansions between where you stopped playing and now.  That's a good sized chunk of change!

    Now, imagine you talk your friend into playing... they have to buy the base game and ALL the expansions, pretty much all at once.  Sure, you can just play with the base game... except your friends will want to do things that are locked to you, which is no fun.

    SOE figured out that the best way to get new players *AND* get older players to return is to just bundle everything.  You buy the current game, with all the expansions to that point.  You don't pay $300 for them, you pay the same price you'd pay anyways and get all the older stuff as part of the deal.

    Blizzard hasn't figure this out yet.  And that's why their sub numbers are dropping... (well, part of it).  If you played WoW during the Lich King and had fun, maybe you were tempted to go  back but resisted because Cataclysm sounded silly, and Panda-land was even more silly.  But now, even if you like the idea of the new expansion, do you want to fork out $120?  Well, you have to because you can't play the newest content without ALL the previous expansions.

     

  • cagancagan Member UncommonPosts: 445
    Originally posted by Nephaerius
    Originally posted by Leon1e
    Originally posted by Braindome
    Originally posted by Leon1e

    If you like the game, want to support the dev and want to see the new content first and 50$ is a no brainer for you - bend over and take it like the unappreciated consumer you are.

    If the price seem too high, wait until christmas, I bet there would be a sale then. No need to cry about it and trying to make a thing out of the fact that you are having to pay twice for the base game instead of paying for the expansion like is normally done.

    I rewrote that for you and filled in the lines to make sense of what you are actually trying to say. In all honest I don't understand where consumers like you come from. Could you explain to us more about your gaming habits, income and what you do in your spare time? I would really like to understand consumers like you.....cause I don't.

     

    I work as a PR consultant, my boyfriend is a programmer. We are gaming on most of our free time. We've both clocked over 2000 hours in Guild Wars 2 and various other titles. 50$ is not an issue to our household in the slightest. 

    We also don't live in a basement as other gamer brethren, trying to tell me how fucked up we are for paying 50$. 

    You know, there are restaurants where dinner for 2 costs more than that.

    What you have to understand is that some are willing to pay a lot more than others for entertainment. That is why you have a multi million dollar cars. That's not their real value. 

    Besides we can talk all week but the fact remain is that value is in the eye of the beholder. With the vet perks 50$ is worth it in my eyes. If it is too much for you, move along, plenty of games in the world.

    Or you know ... get a better job. 

    Zero people in this thread have argued that they can't afford the expansion. What they are saying is that it does not contain $50 worth of content. So instead of lording how much money you have over other people and telling them to get jobs, how about actually reading their posts first.

    To prove my point, I have masters degree and a full time job at one of the highest ranked hospitals in the country. I share my costs with my gf who I live with. I had a family member pass away recently who was extremely wealthy. I have more money atm than i know what to do with. I love GW2. Guess how many copies of the expansion I'm buying? Zero. Why? Because it's literally a joke how little content it contains.

    Guess what I did do? Buy FFXIV + Expansion and a 6 month sub. Wait! You might say. That's more than GW2 + Expansion 2x over. True story. However, I actually think I'm getting my money's worth in comparison to the offerings from ANet.

    TLDR - we've all got the money. The question is: what's the value of the expansion to you? For me it's not $50 that's for sure.

    I completely agree, it is not the cost but is it worth it. I know some people here are broke college students or people on low income and $50 is a lot of money for them. (then maybe you should stop playing games and work overtime?) I just bought a few games on steam and gave away to my friends - way more than $50. Am I buying gw2? nope... pretty much any f2p game has more content than the expansion right now...

    Then again I am still pissed as a former ranger that after 3 years still they did not fix pet pathing AI. I will go back to Gw2 when they fix that  :)

  • StoneRosesStoneRoses Member RarePosts: 1,683
    Originally posted by Nephaerius
    Originally posted by Leon1e
    Originally posted by Braindome
    Originally posted by Leon1e

    If you like the game, want to support the dev and want to see the new content first and 50$ is a no brainer for you - bend over and take it like the unappreciated consumer you are.

    If the price seem too high, wait until christmas, I bet there would be a sale then. No need to cry about it and trying to make a thing out of the fact that you are having to pay twice for the base game instead of paying for the expansion like is normally done.

    I rewrote that for you and filled in the lines to make sense of what you are actually trying to say. In all honest I don't understand where consumers like you come from. Could you explain to us more about your gaming habits, income and what you do in your spare time? I would really like to understand consumers like you.....cause I don't.

     

    I work as a PR consultant, my boyfriend is a programmer. We are gaming on most of our free time. We've both clocked over 2000 hours in Guild Wars 2 and various other titles. 50$ is not an issue to our household in the slightest. 

    We also don't live in a basement as other gamer brethren, trying to tell me how fucked up we are for paying 50$. 

    You know, there are restaurants where dinner for 2 costs more than that.

    What you have to understand is that some are willing to pay a lot more than others for entertainment. That is why you have a multi million dollar cars. That's not their real value. 

    Besides we can talk all week but the fact remain is that value is in the eye of the beholder. With the vet perks 50$ is worth it in my eyes. If it is too much for you, move along, plenty of games in the world.

    Or you know ... get a better job. 

    Zero people in this thread have argued that they can't afford the expansion. What they are saying is that it does not contain $50 worth of content. So instead of lording how much money you have over other people and telling them to get jobs, how about actually reading their posts first.

    To prove my point, I have masters degree and a full time job at one of the highest ranked hospitals in the country. I share my costs with my gf who I live with. I had a family member pass away recently who was extremely wealthy. I have more money atm than i know what to do with. I love GW2. Guess how many copies of the expansion I'm buying? Zero. Why? Because it's literally a joke how little content it contains.

    Guess what I did do? Buy FFXIV + Expansion and a 6 month sub. Wait! You might say. That's more than GW2 + Expansion 2x over. True story. However, I actually think I'm getting my money's worth in comparison to the offerings from ANet.

    TLDR - we've all got the money. The question is: what's the value of the expansion to you? For me it's not $50 that's for sure.

    Thank you both! 2 different consumers with 2 different values.

    I'm not rich or poor, I know I do not come close making what you and Leon1e make. But telling folks to get a better job I find insulting... looking@Leon1e.

    I do Purchasing/IT for small local business sacrificing pay to see a small business blossom.

    • Planing a Wedding
    • Child Support
    • Fiancee laid off for almost 6 months
    • Lawyer fees
    This all adds up. I do not have a need for things like most folks. MMOs are my entertainment. Just as much as dinning out or cooking at home with quality food.
     
    Yes, I know what it's like to enjoy an overpriced Big Mac or enjoying $10-$15 sandwich or burger. Even just to head over to a 7 Eleven and grab a couple Torenados. Many of us see
     
    Value over time, they delivered and entertained me for 3 yrs. Looking forward to another 3 I drop $50.
     
    FFXIV has always felt restrictive and zones too small. No exploration. Are the maps bigger in the new expansion?

     

    MMORPGs aren't easy, You're just too PRO!
  • Void425Void425 Member UncommonPosts: 170

    People may complain about the $50 price, but regardless they will still pay it anyways just to have it.

     

    Even if they reduced the price to $40, that is 20% less profits they receive.

     

    The company is willing to gamble on the fact that they will not lose more then 20% of there playbase .

    Especilaly if you count the number of new players the bundled package will bring in.

     

    It a pure and simple money move to maximize profits....regardless if players think the price is fair or not.

  • NephaeriusNephaerius Member UncommonPosts: 1,671
    Originally posted by Torval
    Originally posted by Nephaerius

    Guess what I did do? Buy FFXIV + Expansion and a 6 month sub. Wait! You might say. That's more than GW2 + Expansion 2x over. True story. However, I actually think I'm getting my money's worth in comparison to the offerings from ANet.

    TLDR - we've all got the money. The question is: what's the value of the expansion to you? For me it's not $50 that's for sure.

    You haven't said anything new either. Value is subjective. Well there's a breaking news story. I personally don't think FF14 is worth spending $40 for an xpac and $156 a year rental fee for a gear treadmill. If I wanted to play a gear treadmill game I would go back to Rift, not because Rift is cheaper, but because it's a better progression game.

    I think clunky boring combat and artificial subscription timesinks aren't worth my money. I should probably head to all the FF14 threads about Heavensward and point out how it's not worth the money and let everyone know I'm not going to buy it until it's $10. That'll show em.

    I never said otherwise. You are arguing with me but I agreed with that point from the start. Value is subjective. The person I was responding to that people not being able to afford it is the issue.

    Steam: Neph

  • NephaeriusNephaerius Member UncommonPosts: 1,671
    Originally posted by StoneRoses
     

    Thank you both! 2 different consumers with 2 different values.

    I'm not rich or poor, I know I do not come close making what you and Leon1e make. But telling folks to get a better job I find insulting... looking@Leon1e.

    I do Purchasing/IT for small local business sacrificing pay to see a small business blossom.

    • Planing a Wedding
    • Child Support
    • Fiancee laid off for almost 6 months
    • Lawyer fees
    This all adds up. I do not have a need for things like most folks. MMOs are my entertainment. Just as much as dinning out or cooking at home with quality food.
     
    Yes, I know what it's like to enjoy an overpriced Big Mac or enjoying $10-$15 sandwich or burger. Even just to head over to a 7 Eleven and grab a couple Torenados. Many of us see
     
    Value over time, they delivered and entertained me for 3 yrs. Looking forward to another 3 I drop $50.
     
    FFXIV has always felt restrictive and zones too small. No exploration. Are the maps bigger in the new expansion?

     

    Personally I find the zones to be reasonably large enough where they don't feel overly restrictive and I've had my moments of exploration but nothing compared to say Darkfall. I would agree that GW2's zones feel larger. Like you state I think it's about perceived value not about how much money people have. 

    Regardless GW2 is a solid title and I plan to buy the expansion. Just not for $50.

    Steam: Neph

  • cagancagan Member UncommonPosts: 445

    Another fact is marketing + box cost + retailer cost.

    Back in the day Blizzard advertised the game on all media, sent the boxed game to gamestop, target etc and then sold for $50.

    (numbers are estimated)

    around $10-14 goes to retailer and transportation costs

    another $5-8 for marketing

    and finally around $15 for development and box cost, which leaves a net profit of $15-20 per box sold.

     

    Lets take the new gw2 expansion:

    -marketing costs : very low maybe $1-2 per box

    - no shipping or retail costs on digital box sales.

    -only net cost is development costs, which is not that high since it is just 1 new class + few new zones added.

     

    Basicly Arena can sell the product at a very low cost but they are trying to push for maximum profits thinking lost %20-30 of customers are going to be offset by increased %50 profit.

    Me and most of my friends are not buying the expansion, not that we do not have $50, but they would rather pay $15 a month to FFivX plus buy and try a few new indie games. ( we all bought ark survival few days ago, well its really not an indie company since the developer is the evil EA)

  • YashaXYashaX Member EpicPosts: 2,960
    Originally posted by quixadhal

    Why is this a big deal?

    SOE has done this with EQ and EQ2 for many years, and it's a good idea.  Let me tell you why...

    If you use the Blizzard model, or the SOE model from 2004, you buy the game and play it,and then as each expansion comes out, you buy the expansions.  If, at some point, you stop playing and then decide you want to rejoin a few years later, you have to plunk down the cash for *ALL* the expansions between where you stopped playing and now.  That's a good sized chunk of change!

    Now, imagine you talk your friend into playing... they have to buy the base game and ALL the expansions, pretty much all at once.  Sure, you can just play with the base game... except your friends will want to do things that are locked to you, which is no fun.

    SOE figured out that the best way to get new players *AND* get older players to return is to just bundle everything.  You buy the current game, with all the expansions to that point.  You don't pay $300 for them, you pay the same price you'd pay anyways and get all the older stuff as part of the deal.

    Blizzard hasn't figure this out yet.  And that's why their sub numbers are dropping... (well, part of it).  If you played WoW during the Lich King and had fun, maybe you were tempted to go  back but resisted because Cataclysm sounded silly, and Panda-land was even more silly.  But now, even if you like the idea of the new expansion, do you want to fork out $120?  Well, you have to because you can't play the newest content without ALL the previous expansions.

     

    Exactly, its a totally awesome move by Anet.

    However, WoW and FF14ARR make you pay up sub+base game price+expansion price not because they haven't figured this out, but because people like the OP and others freaking out at this haven't figured out that they are getting a great deal. Blizzard etc charge those prices because they can leverage their brand name to have players willing to pay through the nose and they can happily just rake in all the fat loot.

    The irony is I rarely see people making threads that pick up lots of attention for games that clearly charge outrageous prices (like WoW and FF14RR), whereas possibly the best deal in the business gets ripped apart, its hilarious.

    ....
  • HellCasterHellCaster Member UncommonPosts: 234

    I personally don't have a problem with the cost of the expansion or the fact it comes bundled with the base game. I am concerned with:

    1) pre-ordering a game without any kind of release date 

    2) knowing very little about what is total scope of the expac yet it costs a minimum of $50

    Playing: varies every day it seems.

  • TheOctagonTheOctagon Member UncommonPosts: 411
    Well, seeing as your all getting a free copy of Guild Wars 2 whether you want it or not anyways, can I have an extra key for it?
  • TsobotTsobot Member UncommonPosts: 12
    Whether its a fair price is irrelevant with the expansion your not just buying the base things your also buying the immense amount of living world that will follow all next year, which will be loads of content period.
  • DistopiaDistopia Member EpicPosts: 21,183
    Originally posted by MadOtaku
    Whether its a fair price is irrelevant with the expansion your not just buying the base things your also buying the immense amount of living world that will follow all next year, which will be loads of content period.

    That would only be a fair point if they do not monetize the LS like they have in the past. Once they do it's no longer a free content update, it's paid DLC., which shouldn't be factored into such arguments. As it places said content outside the binds of the box fee.

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • SteeJanzSteeJanz Member UncommonPosts: 334
    Originally posted by Distopia
    Originally posted by MadOtaku
    Whether its a fair price is irrelevant with the expansion your not just buying the base things your also buying the immense amount of living world that will follow all next year, which will be loads of content period.

    That would only be a fair point if they do not monetize the LS like they have in the past. Once they do it's no longer a free content update, it's paid DLC., which shouldn't be factored into such arguments. As it places said content outside the binds of the box fee.

    Your argument is a little disingenuous isn't it.  It kind of changes when you add other facts, that it actually was offered for free by merely logging in anytime during the LS chapter.  You got it whether you played it or not.  Those that didn't log in or couldn't can obtain it with in-game gold without spending any RL money or can group with someone that has the LS content and play it for free. 

    While you have a point, it seems a pretty big stretch to apply here since this is nowhere close to traditional DLC.  

  • grimalgrimal Member UncommonPosts: 2,920
    Originally posted by TheOctagon
    Well, seeing as your all getting a free copy of Guild Wars 2 whether you want it or not anyways, can I have an extra key for it?

    From my understanding you can't trade the keys or else you lose the expansion.

  • DistopiaDistopia Member EpicPosts: 21,183
    Originally posted by SteeJanz
    Originally posted by Distopia
    Originally posted by MadOtaku
    Whether its a fair price is irrelevant with the expansion your not just buying the base things your also buying the immense amount of living world that will follow all next year, which will be loads of content period.

    That would only be a fair point if they do not monetize the LS like they have in the past. Once they do it's no longer a free content update, it's paid DLC., which shouldn't be factored into such arguments. As it places said content outside the binds of the box fee.

    Your argument is a little disingenuous isn't it.  It kind of changes when you add other facts, that it actually was offered for free by merely logging in anytime during the LS chapter.  You got it whether you played it or not.  Those that didn't log in or couldn't can obtain it with in-game gold without spending any RL money or can group with someone that has the LS content and play it for free. 

    While you have a point, it seems a pretty big stretch to apply here since this is nowhere close to traditional DLC.  

    I don't see how simply saying once they start charging for it, it's no longer to be considered part of the box fee, is disingenuous. I'd say it's being disingenuous to ignore it becoming a revenue stream. 

    It's limited run content that has a window of free time, once that window is over it becomes part of their every day revenue (ie the cash shop). That's when it essentially becomes DLC.

    I think you might be misunderstanding the angle my argument is coming from, it's a matter of trying to argue something that is monetized is free, it might have been free for you, someone has paid for it though, it wouldn't be much different than arguing ROTHC was free for all, because they offered a window where you got it free with paying your sub before the Revan expansion came out. People were still paying for that update , as are folks in GW2 paying for living story content.

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • SteeJanzSteeJanz Member UncommonPosts: 334
    Originally posted by Distopia
    Originally posted by SteeJanz
    Originally posted by Distopia
    Originally posted by MadOtaku
    Whether its a fair price is irrelevant with the expansion your not just buying the base things your also buying the immense amount of living world that will follow all next year, which will be loads of content period.

    That would only be a fair point if they do not monetize the LS like they have in the past. Once they do it's no longer a free content update, it's paid DLC., which shouldn't be factored into such arguments. As it places said content outside the binds of the box fee.

    Your argument is a little disingenuous isn't it.  It kind of changes when you add other facts, that it actually was offered for free by merely logging in anytime during the LS chapter.  You got it whether you played it or not.  Those that didn't log in or couldn't can obtain it with in-game gold without spending any RL money or can group with someone that has the LS content and play it for free. 

    While you have a point, it seems a pretty big stretch to apply here since this is nowhere close to traditional DLC.  

    I don't see how simply saying once they start charging for it, it's no longer to be considered part of the box fee, is disingenuous. I'd say it's being disingenuous to ignore it becoming a revenue stream. 

    It's limited run content that has a window of free time, once that window is over it becomes part of their every day revenue (ie the cash shop).

    Again, not completely true on the "limited" run for free statement.  I have taken a buddy of mine through a chapter of the LS so that he didn't have to pay for it.  I can take you tomorrow.  It only becomes part of  revenue stream if the consumer chooses it for convenience sake.  And whether we like it or not, it isn't up to us to determine what others are willing to contribute to the cash shop for the convenience of not farming for gold or having a friend.

    I agree with you if a purchase is required to obtain the content.   But when a developer provides multiple avenues to obtaining missed content, we as players should be encouraging it.   Again, I like your argument but I believe you are stretching it in its application here.  For your box price, you can experience the LS content that you missed without paying for it.  You can argue the ways to obtain it, but you have a choice whether to contribute to the cash shop or not and still get the content.  

    I guess I should have worded it that it is disingenuous not mention all options in your argument.  

  • grimalgrimal Member UncommonPosts: 2,920
    Originally posted by Bladestrom
    ^^ a compelling reason? It's $2 a month averaged out, should it be $30 and $150 a year sub instead?

    What is their reason for not offering the expansion separately?

  • VolkonVolkon Member UncommonPosts: 3,748
    Originally posted by grimal
    Originally posted by Bladestrom
    ^^ a compelling reason? It's $2 a month averaged out, should it be $30 and $150 a year sub instead?

    What is their reason for not offering the expansion separately?

    You're looking at it wrong. The expansion is separate. However, if you're a new player they're adding the core game whereas if you're a veteran you're getting an additional character slot. 

     

    The core is an added incentive, not a part of the expansion. The character slot is an incentive, not a part of the expansion.

    Oderint, dum metuant.

  • DistopiaDistopia Member EpicPosts: 21,183
    Originally posted by SteeJanz
    Originally posted by Distopia
    Originally posted by SteeJanz
    Originally posted by Distopia
    Originally posted by MadOtaku
    Whether its a fair price is irrelevant with the expansion your not just buying the base things your also buying the immense amount of living world that will follow all next year, which will be loads of content period.

    That would only be a fair point if they do not monetize the LS like they have in the past. Once they do it's no longer a free content update, it's paid DLC., which shouldn't be factored into such arguments. As it places said content outside the binds of the box fee.

    Your argument is a little disingenuous isn't it.  It kind of changes when you add other facts, that it actually was offered for free by merely logging in anytime during the LS chapter.  You got it whether you played it or not.  Those that didn't log in or couldn't can obtain it with in-game gold without spending any RL money or can group with someone that has the LS content and play it for free. 

    While you have a point, it seems a pretty big stretch to apply here since this is nowhere close to traditional DLC.  

    I don't see how simply saying once they start charging for it, it's no longer to be considered part of the box fee, is disingenuous. I'd say it's being disingenuous to ignore it becoming a revenue stream. 

    It's limited run content that has a window of free time, once that window is over it becomes part of their every day revenue (ie the cash shop).

    Again, not completely true on the "limited" run for free statement.  I have taken a buddy of mine through a chapter of the LS so that he didn't have to pay for it.  I can take you tomorrow.  It only becomes part of  revenue stream if the consumer chooses it for convenience sake.  And whether we like it or not, it isn't up to us to determine what others are willing to contribute to the cash shop for the convenience of not farming for gold or having a friend.

    I agree with you if a purchase is required to obtain the content.   But when a developer provides multiple avenues to obtaining missed content, we as players should be encouraging it.   Again, I like your argument but I believe you are stretching it in its application here.  For your box price, you can experience the LS content that you missed without paying for it.  You can argue the ways to obtain it, but you have a choice whether to contribute to the cash shop or not and still get the content.  

    I guess I should have worded it that it is disingenuous not mention all options in your argument.  

    I personally play GW2 with my wife, so pretty much anything we do we do on our own, it's a fast moving experience, which makes the whole meeting others thing problematic, everyone is zigging and zagging their way toward what ever event pops. GW2 also isn't my main game, I'd rather not spend the time I do with it, grinding gold, I don't mind paying for the LS stuff, I just don't like the argument that i got it for free...or With my original box cost. OR that i should factor the future LS stuff into this box purchase. As it will probably be the same story there. It just seems like a have your cake and eat it too argument.

    The issue again isn't that they charge for it, it's ignoring that they do, it may not be on your dime, that's not the case for everyone. The only reason I didn't argue the complexities is because they were covered under his post. I gave the other side of the story.

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • StoneRosesStoneRoses Member RarePosts: 1,683
    Originally posted by Distopia
    Originally posted by MadOtaku
    Whether its a fair price is irrelevant with the expansion your not just buying the base things your also buying the immense amount of living world that will follow all next year, which will be loads of content period.

    That would only be a fair point if they do not monetize the LS like they have in the past. Once they do it's no longer a free content update, it's paid DLC., which shouldn't be factored into such arguments. As it places said content outside the binds of the box fee.

    As many have suggested you can still get it for free.

    MMORPGs aren't easy, You're just too PRO!
  • StoneRosesStoneRoses Member RarePosts: 1,683
    Originally posted by SteeJanz
    Originally posted by Distopia
    Originally posted by SteeJanz
    Originally posted by Distopia
    Originally posted by MadOtaku
    Whether its a fair price is irrelevant with the expansion your not just buying the base things your also buying the immense amount of living world that will follow all next year, which will be loads of content period.

    That would only be a fair point if they do not monetize the LS like they have in the past. Once they do it's no longer a free content update, it's paid DLC., which shouldn't be factored into such arguments. As it places said content outside the binds of the box fee.

    Your argument is a little disingenuous isn't it.  It kind of changes when you add other facts, that it actually was offered for free by merely logging in anytime during the LS chapter.  You got it whether you played it or not.  Those that didn't log in or couldn't can obtain it with in-game gold without spending any RL money or can group with someone that has the LS content and play it for free. 

    While you have a point, it seems a pretty big stretch to apply here since this is nowhere close to traditional DLC.  

    I don't see how simply saying once they start charging for it, it's no longer to be considered part of the box fee, is disingenuous. I'd say it's being disingenuous to ignore it becoming a revenue stream. 

    It's limited run content that has a window of free time, once that window is over it becomes part of their every day revenue (ie the cash shop).

    Again, not completely true on the "limited" run for free statement.  I have taken a buddy of mine through a chapter of the LS so that he didn't have to pay for it.  I can take you tomorrow.  It only becomes part of  revenue stream if the consumer chooses it for convenience sake.  And whether we like it or not, it isn't up to us to determine what others are willing to contribute to the cash shop for the convenience of not farming for gold or having a friend.

    I agree with you if a purchase is required to obtain the content.   But when a developer provides multiple avenues to obtaining missed content, we as players should be encouraging it.   Again, I like your argument but I believe you are stretching it in its application here.  For your box price, you can experience the LS content that you missed without paying for it.  You can argue the ways to obtain it, but you have a choice whether to contribute to the cash shop or not and still get the content.  

    I guess I should have worded it that it is disingenuous not mention all options in your argument.  

    People do not want options or they ignore it all together. They see a price tag on it and it suddenly becomes an issue.

     

    MMORPGs aren't easy, You're just too PRO!
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