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Making Amends?

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  • StoneRosesStoneRoses Member RarePosts: 1,683
    Originally posted by Distopia
    Originally posted by StoneRoses

    Vanilla WoW $49.99

    3yr $14.99  $539.64

    1st Xpac TBC $49.99 + $29.99 Base Game

    Blizzard's marketing in 2007. Many of would rather go back here than be down there.

    ***********

    GW2 $69.99

    3yr $0.00

    1st Xpac Hot $49.99 + Free Base Game

    Anet's marketing 2015. Rather than being here you would rather be up there.

     

    HUGE FUCKING PROBLEM THERE!!

    I think you're too hung up on the B2P model, it just seems like an agenda at this point. You realize Blizz gets some of the loudest complaints about their offerings right? Especially in regard to their frequency in updates and content additions. Because people expect it to be worth it. B2P isn't an explain all answer to value.

    ANY company with that kind of volume of customers will always get the loudest complaints.

    Look at Comcast and Sprint as example. The list is pretty long.

     

    MMORPGs aren't easy, You're just too PRO!
  • DistopiaDistopia Member EpicPosts: 21,183
    Originally posted by StoneRoses
    Originally posted by Distopia
    Originally posted by StoneRoses

    Vanilla WoW $49.99

    3yr $14.99  $539.64

    1st Xpac TBC $49.99 + $29.99 Base Game

    Blizzard's marketing in 2007. Many of would rather go back here than be down there.

    ***********

    GW2 $69.99

    3yr $0.00

    1st Xpac Hot $49.99 + Free Base Game

    Anet's marketing 2015. Rather than being here you would rather be up there.

     

    HUGE FUCKING PROBLEM THERE!!

    I think you're too hung up on the B2P model, it just seems like an agenda at this point. You realize Blizz gets some of the loudest complaints about their offerings right? Especially in regard to their frequency in updates and content additions. Because people expect it to be worth it. B2P isn't an explain all answer to value.

    ANY company with that kind of volume of customers will always get the loudest complaints.

    Look at Comcast and Sprint as example. The list is pretty long.

     

    Can't say much about it, but I have first hand experience with that customer feedback in regard to both. It was because of their gouging. Just like it is with Blizz, or anyone else who does it. EA, SONY, UBI, etc... There's a reason other companies don't suffer the same ridicule. Paying it forward. It's all they can do. Sadly some realize PT was right and don't give a F^^^. I'm not saying Anet is underhanded, however, you can bet they're not going to use the arguments being used here to defend themselves.

     

     

     

     

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • GinazGinaz Member RarePosts: 2,283
    Originally posted by StoneRoses

    Vanilla WoW $49.99

    3yr $14.99  $539.64

    1st Xpac TBC $49.99 + $29.99 Base Game

    Blizzard's marketing in 2007. Many of would rather go back here than be down there.

    ***********

    GW2 $69.99

    3yr $0.00

    1st Xpac Hot $49.99 + Free Base Game

    Anet's marketing 2015. Rather than being here you would rather be up there.

     

    HUGE FUCKING PROBLEM THERE!!

    No need to be so angry and defensive.  While the price might be a little higher than some would hope, it's not too out of line IMO.  I think it's a good idea to bundle the base game into the expansion because it lowers the barrier of entry for new players.  More players is always good for an MMO.  The bigger issue is Arena Net's actions up to availability of the pre-orders.  Selling new players the game by hyping the expansion and then selling said expansion with the base game is very shady since they knew all along how their pricing was going to work. Instead of letting people know this early on, they seem to have decided to milk as much money out of base GW2 as they could.

    Is a man not entitled to the herp of his derp?

    Remember, I live in a world where juggalos and yugioh players are real things.

  • StoneRosesStoneRoses Member RarePosts: 1,683
    Originally posted by Ginaz
    Originally posted by StoneRoses

    Vanilla WoW $49.99

    3yr $14.99  $539.64

    1st Xpac TBC $49.99 + $29.99 Base Game

    Blizzard's marketing in 2007. Many of would rather go back here than be down there.

    ***********

    GW2 $69.99

    3yr $0.00

    1st Xpac Hot $49.99 + Free Base Game

    Anet's marketing 2015. Rather than being here you would rather be up there.

     

    HUGE FUCKING PROBLEM THERE!!

    No need to be so angry and defensive.  While the price might be a little higher than some would hope, it's not too out of line IMO.  I think it's a good idea to bundle the base game into the expansion because it lowers the barrier of entry for new players.  More players is always good for an MMO.  The bigger issue is Arena Net's actions up to availability of the pre-orders.  Selling new players the game by hyping the expansion and then selling said expansion with the base game is very shady since they knew all along how their pricing was going to work. Instead of letting people know this early on, they seem to have decided to milk as much money out of base GW2 as they could.

    Again as many have pointed out this is not the issue. Anet has stated that they will help anyone out who just bought the core game and would like to make the change to a HoT pre-purchase.

    MMORPGs aren't easy, You're just too PRO!
  • eye_meye_m Member UncommonPosts: 3,317
    Originally posted by Dakeru
    Originally posted by eyelolled

    However, if you do choose to pay, then you don't get to take advantage of that special offer.

    And how is that the same then?

    Let's try it like this. Don't buy the expansion. You can tell everybody how you're making a stand.  You can tell yourself about how you're making a difference in the world.  I'll play the game.  Neither of us will actually change the world.  I'll just enjoy my time not changing the world and you will do something else. 

    All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.

    I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.

    I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.

    I don't hate much, but I hate Apple© with a passion. If Steve Jobs was alive, I would punch him in the face.

  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 21,457
    Originally posted by Ginaz
    Originally posted by StoneRoses

    Vanilla WoW $49.99

    3yr $14.99  $539.64

    1st Xpac TBC $49.99 + $29.99 Base Game

    Blizzard's marketing in 2007. Many of would rather go back here than be down there.

    ***********

    GW2 $69.99

    3yr $0.00

    1st Xpac Hot $49.99 + Free Base Game

    Anet's marketing 2015. Rather than being here you would rather be up there.

     

    HUGE FUCKING PROBLEM THERE!!

    No need to be so angry and defensive.  While the price might be a little higher than some would hope, it's not too out of line IMO.  I think it's a good idea to bundle the base game into the expansion because it lowers the barrier of entry for new players.  More players is always good for an MMO.  The bigger issue is Arena Net's actions up to availability of the pre-orders.  Selling new players the game by hyping the expansion and then selling said expansion with the base game is very shady since they knew all along how their pricing was going to work. Instead of letting people know this early on, they seem to have decided to milk as much money out of base GW2 as they could.

    I explained this a few posts up when you mentioned it. ANet has said they will refund a base game purchase if you want to exchange it for the expansion. They will make good on that. It's in the main bitch about the xpac thread in the official forums.

    traveller, interloper, anomaly, iteration


  • GinazGinaz Member RarePosts: 2,283
    Originally posted by Torval
    Originally posted by Ginaz
    Originally posted by StoneRoses

    Vanilla WoW $49.99

    3yr $14.99  $539.64

    1st Xpac TBC $49.99 + $29.99 Base Game

    Blizzard's marketing in 2007. Many of would rather go back here than be down there.

    ***********

    GW2 $69.99

    3yr $0.00

    1st Xpac Hot $49.99 + Free Base Game

    Anet's marketing 2015. Rather than being here you would rather be up there.

     

    HUGE FUCKING PROBLEM THERE!!

    No need to be so angry and defensive.  While the price might be a little higher than some would hope, it's not too out of line IMO.  I think it's a good idea to bundle the base game into the expansion because it lowers the barrier of entry for new players.  More players is always good for an MMO.  The bigger issue is Arena Net's actions up to availability of the pre-orders.  Selling new players the game by hyping the expansion and then selling said expansion with the base game is very shady since they knew all along how their pricing was going to work. Instead of letting people know this early on, they seem to have decided to milk as much money out of base GW2 as they could.

    I explained this a few posts up when you mentioned it. ANet has said they will refund a base game purchase if you want to exchange it for the expansion. They will make good on that. It's in the main bitch about the xpac thread in the official forums.

    While that's good to hear, I don't think they would have done it if people hadn't complained.  If you feel something is wrong, don't listen to the raging fanboys and white knights who will tell you to shut up and take it.  Making your concerns known to the company, in a respectful manner, can achieve results.

    Is a man not entitled to the herp of his derp?

    Remember, I live in a world where juggalos and yugioh players are real things.

  • GinazGinaz Member RarePosts: 2,283
    Originally posted by StoneRoses
    Originally posted by Ginaz
    Originally posted by StoneRoses

    Vanilla WoW $49.99

    3yr $14.99  $539.64

    1st Xpac TBC $49.99 + $29.99 Base Game

    Blizzard's marketing in 2007. Many of would rather go back here than be down there.

    ***********

    GW2 $69.99

    3yr $0.00

    1st Xpac Hot $49.99 + Free Base Game

    Anet's marketing 2015. Rather than being here you would rather be up there.

     

    HUGE FUCKING PROBLEM THERE!!

    No need to be so angry and defensive.  While the price might be a little higher than some would hope, it's not too out of line IMO.  I think it's a good idea to bundle the base game into the expansion because it lowers the barrier of entry for new players.  More players is always good for an MMO.  The bigger issue is Arena Net's actions up to availability of the pre-orders.  Selling new players the game by hyping the expansion and then selling said expansion with the base game is very shady since they knew all along how their pricing was going to work. Instead of letting people know this early on, they seem to have decided to milk as much money out of base GW2 as they could.

    Again as many have pointed out this is not the issue. Anet has stated that they will help anyone out who just bought the core game and would like to make the change to a HoT pre-purchase.

    Yes, but only because these "entitled" players didn't listen to people like you and took their concerns to the company instead of shutting up and taking it, which is what you and many others would have preferred them to do.

    Is a man not entitled to the herp of his derp?

    Remember, I live in a world where juggalos and yugioh players are real things.

  • StoneRosesStoneRoses Member RarePosts: 1,683
    Originally posted by eyelolled
    Originally posted by Dakeru
    Originally posted by eyelolled

    However, if you do choose to pay, then you don't get to take advantage of that special offer.

    And how is that the same then?

    Let's try it like this. Don't buy the expansion. You can tell everybody how you're making a stand.  You can tell yourself about how you're making a difference in the world.  I'll play the game.  Neither of us will actually change the world.  I'll just enjoy my time not changing the world and you will do something else. 

    That's actually pretty fucking hilarious!

    MMORPGs aren't easy, You're just too PRO!
  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 21,457
    Originally posted by Ginaz
    Originally posted by Torval
    Originally posted by Ginaz

    No need to be so angry and defensive.  While the price might be a little higher than some would hope, it's not too out of line IMO.  I think it's a good idea to bundle the base game into the expansion because it lowers the barrier of entry for new players.  More players is always good for an MMO.  The bigger issue is Arena Net's actions up to availability of the pre-orders.  Selling new players the game by hyping the expansion and then selling said expansion with the base game is very shady since they knew all along how their pricing was going to work. Instead of letting people know this early on, they seem to have decided to milk as much money out of base GW2 as they could.

    I explained this a few posts up when you mentioned it. ANet has said they will refund a base game purchase if you want to exchange it for the expansion. They will make good on that. It's in the main bitch about the xpac thread in the official forums.

    While that's good to hear, I don't think they would have done it if people hadn't complained.  If you feel something is wrong, don't listen to the raging fanboys and white knights who will tell you to shut up and take it.  Making your concerns known to the company, in a respectful manner, can achieve results.

    It's a fair complaint. Steams new refund policy even covers this situation. Not every complaint is reasonable and not every complaint is presented reasonably.

    Complaining about the price of an xpac isn't unreasonable or even the included features for the price. Perceived value is subjective so there isn't really a right or wrong answer there.

    The knee-jerk reaction to the xpac and how it was presented was unreasonable. Some portion of the playerbase feels entitled to special perks and acknowledgement for being a customer and started making demands about features. The OP even stated plainly that they feel entitled to an extra key for the xpac.

    traveller, interloper, anomaly, iteration


  • DakeruDakeru Member EpicPosts: 3,797
    Originally posted by eyelolled
    Originally posted by Dakeru
    Originally posted by eyelolled

    However, if you do choose to pay, then you don't get to take advantage of that special offer.

    And how is that the same then?

    Let's try it like this. Don't buy the expansion. You can tell everybody how you're making a stand.  You can tell yourself about how you're making a difference in the world.  I'll play the game.  Neither of us will actually change the world.  I'll just enjoy my time not changing the world and you will do something else. 

    There are not enough people in this world who try to change something - but since you mention it.. here is a nice link:

    https://www.change.org/p/anet-add-one-character-slot-for-all-expansion-purchases-and-offer-a-standalone-hot-expansion-purchase-2b57d70e-fe5e-4ffa-844d-c487e154dc74#petition-letter

    Harbinger of Fools
  • BeansnBreadBeansnBread Member EpicPosts: 7,254
    Originally posted by Dakeru
    Originally posted by eyelolled
    Originally posted by Dakeru
    Originally posted by eyelolled

    However, if you do choose to pay, then you don't get to take advantage of that special offer.

    And how is that the same then?

    Let's try it like this. Don't buy the expansion. You can tell everybody how you're making a stand.  You can tell yourself about how you're making a difference in the world.  I'll play the game.  Neither of us will actually change the world.  I'll just enjoy my time not changing the world and you will do something else. 

    There are not enough people in this world who try to change something - but since you mention it.. here is a nice link:

    https://www.change.org/p/anet-add-one-character-slot-for-all-expansion-purchases-and-offer-a-standalone-hot-expansion-purchase-2b57d70e-fe5e-4ffa-844d-c487e154dc74#petition-letter

    So then $50 for the expansion and $20-30 for the game. The expansion comes with an extra character slot. That doesn't sound unreasonable to me - although it is far more expensive for new players. Would you think it was "fair" if new players then made a thread about how it costs $70+ just to start playing GW2? Would you think that those people had entitlement issues?

  • DakeruDakeru Member EpicPosts: 3,797
    Originally posted by BeansnBread

    So then $50 for the expansion and $20-30 for the game. The expansion comes with an extra character slot. That doesn't sound unreasonable to me - although it is far more expensive for new players. Would you think it was "fair" if new players then made a thread about how it costs $70+ just to start playing GW2? Would you think that those people had entitlement issues?

    Ok all the time you guys talk about value of the product and appreciation for the company.

    And now you argue that the basic game is not worth 20$?

    Harbinger of Fools
  • BeansnBreadBeansnBread Member EpicPosts: 7,254
    Originally posted by Dakeru
    Originally posted by BeansnBread

    So then $50 for the expansion and $20-30 for the game. The expansion comes with an extra character slot. That doesn't sound unreasonable to me - although it is far more expensive for new players. Would you think it was "fair" if new players then made a thread about how it costs $70+ just to start playing GW2? Would you think that those people had entitlement issues?

    Ok all the time you guys talk about value of the product and appreciation for the company.

    And now you argue that the basic game is not worth 20$?

    I'm not arguing. I literally thought they sold the base game for $20-30 at this point. I know they had a sale for $10 fairly recently. I think that if you spent $20-30 on the base game you'd be getting an incredible deal on it. The value is amazing at that price point. The value is amazing at $60 in my opinion. And paying an additional $50 for access to the expansion and all future content is also an amazing value in my opinion.

     

    This is what is particularly strange about your comment. Do you think people should pay MORE for the base game? New players should have to pay $100 or something just to play with the current expansion? It's like you are arguing for the game to be more expensive because you are bitter about paying the full price 3 years ago.

  • DakeruDakeru Member EpicPosts: 3,797
    Originally posted by BeansnBread
    Originally posted by Dakeru
    Originally posted by BeansnBread

    So then $50 for the expansion and $20-30 for the game. The expansion comes with an extra character slot. That doesn't sound unreasonable to me - although it is far more expensive for new players. Would you think it was "fair" if new players then made a thread about how it costs $70+ just to start playing GW2? Would you think that those people had entitlement issues?

    Ok all the time you guys talk about value of the product and appreciation for the company.

    And now you argue that the basic game is not worth 20$?

    I'm not arguing. I literally thought they sold the base game for $20-30 at this point. I know they had a sale for $10 fairly recently. I think that if you spent $20-30 on the base game you'd be getting an incredible deal on it. The value is amazing at that price point. The value is amazing at $60 in my opinion. And paying an additional $50 for access to the expansion and all future content is also an amazing value in my opinion.

     

    This is what is particularly strange about your comment. Do you think people should pay MORE for the base game? New players should have to pay $100 or something just to play with the current expansion? It's like you are arguing for the game to be more expensive because you are bitter about paying the full price 3 years ago.

    Please highlight the lines for me where I apparently said that new players should pay 100$ and more.

    You are one of the few I actually respect in this argument but if you start making stuff up now or answer with "this is hilarious!" (in your case "you are bitter because you bought the game 3 years ago") comments like Stone then you are hurting your own creditability.

    Harbinger of Fools
  • BeansnBreadBeansnBread Member EpicPosts: 7,254
    Originally posted by Dakeru
    Originally posted by BeansnBread
    Originally posted by Dakeru
    Originally posted by BeansnBread

    So then $50 for the expansion and $20-30 for the game. The expansion comes with an extra character slot. That doesn't sound unreasonable to me - although it is far more expensive for new players. Would you think it was "fair" if new players then made a thread about how it costs $70+ just to start playing GW2? Would you think that those people had entitlement issues?

    Ok all the time you guys talk about value of the product and appreciation for the company.

    And now you argue that the basic game is not worth 20$?

    I'm not arguing. I literally thought they sold the base game for $20-30 at this point. I know they had a sale for $10 fairly recently. I think that if you spent $20-30 on the base game you'd be getting an incredible deal on it. The value is amazing at that price point. The value is amazing at $60 in my opinion. And paying an additional $50 for access to the expansion and all future content is also an amazing value in my opinion.

     

    This is what is particularly strange about your comment. Do you think people should pay MORE for the base game? New players should have to pay $100 or something just to play with the current expansion? It's like you are arguing for the game to be more expensive because you are bitter about paying the full price 3 years ago.

    Please highlight the lines for me where I apparently said that new players should pay 100$ and more.

    You are one of the few I actually respect in this argument but if you start making stuff up now or answer with "this is hilarious!" (in your case "you are bitter because you bought the game 3 years ago") comments like Stone then you are hurting your own creditability.

    I'll highlight the line in red that made me wonder about what you wanted new players to actually pay. That line, in my opinion, implied that the base game should cost more than $20. I agree that the value is there for paying more. But if the base game costs more than $20 (or up to $30 like I actually said), then new players would have to pay $20-30 plus the expansion which is $50. $70-80.

     

    But what I wonder is, do you think new players should pay the full price of GW2 in 2012 ($60) and then have to pay $50 on top of it to make it fair to you?

  • DakeruDakeru Member EpicPosts: 3,797
    Originally posted by BeansnBread
    Originally posted by Dakeru
    Originally posted by BeansnBread
    Originally posted by Dakeru
    Originally posted by BeansnBread

    So then $50 for the expansion and $20-30 for the game. The expansion comes with an extra character slot. That doesn't sound unreasonable to me - although it is far more expensive for new players. Would you think it was "fair" if new players then made a thread about how it costs $70+ just to start playing GW2? Would you think that those people had entitlement issues?

    Ok all the time you guys talk about value of the product and appreciation for the company.

    And now you argue that the basic game is not worth 20$?

    I'm not arguing. I literally thought they sold the base game for $20-30 at this point. I know they had a sale for $10 fairly recently. I think that if you spent $20-30 on the base game you'd be getting an incredible deal on it. The value is amazing at that price point. The value is amazing at $60 in my opinion. And paying an additional $50 for access to the expansion and all future content is also an amazing value in my opinion.

     

    This is what is particularly strange about your comment. Do you think people should pay MORE for the base game? New players should have to pay $100 or something just to play with the current expansion? It's like you are arguing for the game to be more expensive because you are bitter about paying the full price 3 years ago.

    Please highlight the lines for me where I apparently said that new players should pay 100$ and more.

    You are one of the few I actually respect in this argument but if you start making stuff up now or answer with "this is hilarious!" (in your case "you are bitter because you bought the game 3 years ago") comments like Stone then you are hurting your own creditability.

    I'll highlight the line in red that made me wonder about what you wanted new players to actually pay. That line, in my opinion, implied that the base game should cost more than $20. I agree that the value is there for paying more. But if the base game costs more than $20 (or up to $30 like I actually said), then new players would have to pay $20-30 plus the expansion which is $50. $70-80.

     

    But what I wonder is, do you think new players should pay the full price of GW2 in 2012 ($60) and then have to pay $50 on top of it to make it fair to you?

    I never said something about the full price, I just picked up the value you randomly chose.

    To me the base game costs 10€ cause that's the price they have been selling it for in all the recent "get ready for HoT and buy now!" events.

    And that's the price people were willing to pay and all would be good if Anet didn't make a last minute decision where they ninja'ed their faq.

     

    Also I often see that those people who bought the game with the large discount can contact the customer support for help.

     

    From what I heard the help means that their Gw2 account will be deleted and they will get a refund and then they can buy HoT if they like.

    Personally I don't consider it valid help when all characters and progress are deleted.

     

    But that's hearsay - if you find details of what the help really looks like feel free to show it here.

    Harbinger of Fools
  • BeansnBreadBeansnBread Member EpicPosts: 7,254
    Originally posted by Dakeru

    I never said something about the full price, I just picked up the value you randomly chose.

    To me the base game costs 10€ cause that's the price they have been selling it for in all the recent "get ready for HoT and buy now!" events.

    And that's the price people were willing to pay and all would be good if Anet didn't make a last minute decision where they ninja'ed their faq.

     

    Also I often see that those people who bought the game with the large discount can contact the customer support for help.

     

    From what I heard the help means that their Gw2 account will be deleted and they will get a refund and then they can buy HoT if they like.

    Personally I don't consider it valid help when all characters and progress are deleted.

     

    But that's hearsay - if you find details of what the help really looks like feel free to show it here.

    This is a huge problem with your argument in general. You don't know facts. You don't know what is in the expansion. You don't know HOW they are upgrading accounts from the $10 version to the HoT version (my guess and likely everyone else's guess on the planet would be that you keep progress). You don't have an opinion on what a new player should pay for HoT and the base game. You don't even have an opinion about what a player with the base game should have to pay for the expansion.

     

    You want two keys for $50. That is literally the only thing I know about what you think is fair. And to be honest, that is never, ever going to happen. And my question to you is... do you think that is fair to new players? Should they have to pay full price for the base game and an additional $50 for the expansion. You keep avoiding the question, but I really, really want to know what you think is fair.

     

    Edit: Especially since your entire argument rests upon fairness.

  • AeanderAeander Member LegendaryPosts: 6,805
    Originally posted by Dakeru
    Originally posted by BeansnBread
    Originally posted by Dakeru

    Yes I am throwing in the generalization card because that's what people seem to do on the Heart of Robbery thread nonstop.

    Entitlement Entitlement Entitlement

     

    If a new player pays 50$ and gets GW2 and HoT as bundle then I want the same. Same price - same product.

    It's as easy as that.

    Wait, what? You expect a 3 year old game to cost the same 3 years ago as it does today?

    No I expect to pay 50$ and get one code for the basic game which I will give to a friend and one code for HoT which I will use for myself.

     

    Which would be pointless, given that the friend would then have to buy the expansion and receive an extra game code themself.

     

    I mean, yes you can technically play and be viable without it, but who in their right mind would choose to leave advanced classes, mastery progression, and guild halls out of their play experience? 

  • DakeruDakeru Member EpicPosts: 3,797
    Originally posted by BeansnBread

    This is a huge problem with your argument in general. You don't know facts. You don't know what is in the expansion. You don't know HOW they are upgrading accounts from the $10 version to the HoT version (my guess and likely everyone else's guess on the planet would be that you keep progress). You don't have an opinion on what a new player should pay for HoT and the base game. You don't even have an opinion about what a player with the base game should have to pay for the expansion.

     

    You want two keys for $50. That is literally the only thing I know about what you think is fair. And to be honest, that is never, ever going to happen. And my question to you is... do you think that is fair to new players? Should they have to pay full price for the base game and an additional $50 for the expansion. You keep avoiding the question, but I really, really want to know what you think is fair.

     

    Edit: Especially since your entire argument rests upon fairness.

    Thing here is when you accuse me of not knowing facts you make it sound like you know the facts -  you don't.

    Here is one of the posts of the official forum I stumbled over:

     

    "According to this reddit post (https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/3a46s4/preorders_for_heart_of_thorns_are_now_live/cs96lfu) an Anet representative has stated “We’ll most certainly help anyone out who just bought the core game and would like to make the change to a HoT pre-purchase.” Can you please explain what that help will be? According to responses in the forums, it will be terminating the original account(s) and not refunding gem purchases. Is this seriously the “help” being offered, the choice between losing all progress in the game and money spent on it, or being charged an exorbitant price for an expansion, that I was under the impression I was preparing for by purchasing the game and additional character slot?"

     

    I created this thread simply with the message that people on the official forum are angry and the message is being forwarded to Anet so things may change.

    You are so eager to prove that there is a problem with my opinion that you keep arguing.

    So go ahead - prove me wrong. But back it up with proof instead of making up claims.

    Harbinger of Fools
  • BeansnBreadBeansnBread Member EpicPosts: 7,254
    Originally posted by Dakeru
    Originally posted by BeansnBread

    This is a huge problem with your argument in general. You don't know facts. You don't know what is in the expansion. You don't know HOW they are upgrading accounts from the $10 version to the HoT version (my guess and likely everyone else's guess on the planet would be that you keep progress). You don't have an opinion on what a new player should pay for HoT and the base game. You don't even have an opinion about what a player with the base game should have to pay for the expansion.

     

    You want two keys for $50. That is literally the only thing I know about what you think is fair. And to be honest, that is never, ever going to happen. And my question to you is... do you think that is fair to new players? Should they have to pay full price for the base game and an additional $50 for the expansion. You keep avoiding the question, but I really, really want to know what you think is fair.

     

    Edit: Especially since your entire argument rests upon fairness.

    Thing here is when you accuse me of not knowing facts you make it sound like you know the facts -  you don't.

    Here is one of the posts of the official forum I stumbled over:

     

    "According to this reddit post (https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/3a46s4/preorders_for_heart_of_thorns_are_now_live/cs96lfu) an Anet representative has stated “We’ll most certainly help anyone out who just bought the core game and would like to make the change to a HoT pre-purchase.” Can you please explain what that help will be? According to responses in the forums, it will be terminating the original account(s) and not refunding gem purchases. Is this seriously the “help” being offered, the choice between losing all progress in the game and money spent on it, or being charged an exorbitant price for an expansion, that I was under the impression I was preparing for by purchasing the game and additional character slot?"

     

    I created this thread simply with the message that people on the official forum are angry and the message is being forwarded to Anet so things may change.

    You are so eager to prove that there is a problem with my opinion that you keep arguing.

    So go ahead - prove me wrong. But back it up with proof instead of making up claims.

    I'm not proving you wrong. You aren't answering my questions - on purpose. You have decided instead to deflect. And your deflection is specifically hilarious because it shows that you indeed do not have the facts after all. You literally linked to a reddit thread, highlighted a bunch of words that you wrote yourself, and then acted like they were facts. This was one of the more awful displays of an attempt at appearing legitimate that I've ever seen.

     

  • DakeruDakeru Member EpicPosts: 3,797
    Originally posted by BeansnBread

    I'm not proving you wrong. You aren't answering my questions - on purpose. You have decided instead to deflect. And your deflection is specifically hilarious because it shows that you indeed do not have the facts after all. You literally linked to a reddit thread, highlighted a bunch of words that you wrote yourself, and then acted like they were facts. This was one of the more awful displays of an attempt at appearing legitimate that I've ever seen.

     

    Not my words - just a post on the official forum. Again you seem to have facts. Show us your facts.

    Harbinger of Fools
  • BeansnBreadBeansnBread Member EpicPosts: 7,254
    Originally posted by Dakeru
    Originally posted by BeansnBread

    I'm not proving you wrong. You aren't answering my questions - on purpose. You have decided instead to deflect. And your deflection is specifically hilarious because it shows that you indeed do not have the facts after all. You literally linked to a reddit thread, highlighted a bunch of words that you wrote yourself, and then acted like they were facts. This was one of the more awful displays of an attempt at appearing legitimate that I've ever seen.

     

    Not my words - just a post on the official forum. Again you seem to have facts. Show us your facts.

    Facts about what? I literally don't know what you're going on about. I asked you a few question. You have been unable to answer them. And in a strange twist, you have asked me for the "facts". 

     

    Can you at least link to the post on the official forum if you are going to quote it? You literally linked something, "quoted" it, and then said it was on a different forum than you linked. How about you show me where this random said those words on the official forums?

  • KanethKaneth Member RarePosts: 2,286
    Originally posted by Amjoco
    Originally posted by Dakeru

    Yes I am throwing in the generalization card because that's what people seem to do on the Heart of Robbery thread nonstop.

    Entitlement Entitlement Entitlement

     

    If a new player pays 50$ and gets GW2 and HoT as bundle then I want the same. Same price - same product.

    It's as easy as that.

    No one complained when they purchased WoD and got all the expansions up to MoP for free. I bought WoD and didn't feel cheated because someone else bought it and got 3 or 4 other expansions for the same thing I did. This entire thread and the other one make no sense to me. If you want the expansion just buy it.

    You keep saying this, but it's not true. You get core through MoP for $19.99 USD, you got WoD for the expansion price and nothing more. 

    https://us.battle.net/shop/en/product/world-of-warcraft store page for the base game (which is on sale atm)

    https://us.battle.net/shop/en/product/world-of-warcraft-warlords-of-draenor store page for WoD (which is also on sale)

  • DakeruDakeru Member EpicPosts: 3,797
    Originally posted by BeansnBread

    Facts about what? I literally don't know what you're going on about. I asked you a few question. You have been unable to answer them. And in a strange twist, you have asked me for the "facts". 

     

    Can you at least link to the post on the official forum if you are going to quote it? You literally linked something, "quoted" it, and then said it was on a different forum than you linked. How about you show me where this random said those words on the official forums?

    You are so eager to mark me as a liar that it's amusing.

    I never said I have facts - I said this is what I heard:

    https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/hot/HoT-Price-Feedback-Base-game-included-merged/page/72

    And that is just one of the posts about this, which I saw while skipping over the 70 pages of angry people.

    So I asked you to prove me wrong with your facts.

     

    The whole message of this thread was "Players are angry - Anet acknowledges it - things may change" 

    Having said so I will stop answering you because your attempts to discredit me are resulting in a spam here that makes people forget about the original message.

     

    Oh but before I quit answering you, I think I owe you an answer - or at least you feel that way.

    Anet sold the original client for 10€ several times. People bought it for that price which is usually a sign that they don't feel the price is unfair.

    So if they find it fair to pay that amount then why should I consider it unfair?

    Harbinger of Fools
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