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Not so f2p

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  • Fly666monkeyFly666monkey Member UncommonPosts: 161
    Originally posted by observer
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by silhaku

      Everyone knows by now that Wildstar is going free to play and I think that its a awesome decision. Its a really good game but has a small player base and this will open the doors wide open to those willing to try it out. I've have plenty of guildmates from other games try the free trial with me and said that they would love to play it if it goes free. Now that its about to happen I figured wildstar would be the next big move for us, until I saw the free limits. Sub players get more exp, gold, auction house slots, etc. All reasonable stuff.

     

      Until I see you can't join a guild or do warplots on free accounts and then im like wtf. Why!? It makes no sense. Having a sub is suppose to give rewards like extra perks while and while not playing but taking away guilds and warplots from free players is a punishment. I mean guilds is a major social aspect from a game meant to be focused on interacting with other players. Now no one wants to play anymore because we were all excited to play a new action mmo with our guild tags held high and you put this pay wall in front of us.

     

       I know what a lot of you are thinking. I'm just whining because im too cheap to pay sub. Not it at all. I've paid the sub and am willing to pay again. Only reason I stopped playing was because the player base was so little. If I had a better group of people to play with, "my cross game guildies for example" I would still be playing it today.

    But back to the subject at hand, this pay to join guilds and to do warplots thing will deter a lot of people. People that are needed to bring this game back from the grave. Its not like the sub would be worthless if these "perks" were given to everyone. I mean these are major pieces of content in the game. It shouldn't only be giving to those who pay a sub.

     

      That's all I wanted to rant about, please give your thoughts on the subject plz.

     

    10 year in and people still are surprised that "Free" to play games aren't actually free.  Boggles my freaking mind...

    That's a generalization.  F2P players don't expect everything free.  They see a distinction between free access to the servers, and free gameplay features.  The former is expected, but the latter is what most people voice their opinions about, especially with comparisons to other F2P titles.

    If the restrictions are too extreme, then people won't even bother playing it.  Look at how much ridicule Swtor got for restricting hotbars.

    I personally have never understood the logic of Hybrid Free To Play models. If players were willing to pay a sub fee to play the game, it would not have gone F2P to begin with.

    I would also not be shocked if the "Bonus" XP and whatnot given to subs is actually the Pre-F2P XP rate, while free players are getting a lower rate than that.

  • GhavriggGhavrigg Member RarePosts: 1,308

    Way to be misinformed, OP. 

    The F2P seems very reasonable, and I might give it a go at some point, but probably not.

  • rodingorodingo Member RarePosts: 2,867
    Originally posted by Octagon7711
    Each company defines F2P.  It's not a universal meaning when it comes to gaming. 

    Exactly.  Look at EA's definition of f2p.

    "If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor

  • reeereeereeereee Member UncommonPosts: 1,636
    Originally posted by Fly666monkey
    Originally posted by observer
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by silhaku

      Everyone knows by now that Wildstar is going free to play and I think that its a awesome decision. Its a really good game but has a small player base and this will open the doors wide open to those willing to try it out. I've have plenty of guildmates from other games try the free trial with me and said that they would love to play it if it goes free. Now that its about to happen I figured wildstar would be the next big move for us, until I saw the free limits. Sub players get more exp, gold, auction house slots, etc. All reasonable stuff.

     

      Until I see you can't join a guild or do warplots on free accounts and then im like wtf. Why!? It makes no sense. Having a sub is suppose to give rewards like extra perks while and while not playing but taking away guilds and warplots from free players is a punishment. I mean guilds is a major social aspect from a game meant to be focused on interacting with other players. Now no one wants to play anymore because we were all excited to play a new action mmo with our guild tags held high and you put this pay wall in front of us.

     

       I know what a lot of you are thinking. I'm just whining because im too cheap to pay sub. Not it at all. I've paid the sub and am willing to pay again. Only reason I stopped playing was because the player base was so little. If I had a better group of people to play with, "my cross game guildies for example" I would still be playing it today.

    But back to the subject at hand, this pay to join guilds and to do warplots thing will deter a lot of people. People that are needed to bring this game back from the grave. Its not like the sub would be worthless if these "perks" were given to everyone. I mean these are major pieces of content in the game. It shouldn't only be giving to those who pay a sub.

     

      That's all I wanted to rant about, please give your thoughts on the subject plz.

     

    10 year in and people still are surprised that "Free" to play games aren't actually free.  Boggles my freaking mind...

    That's a generalization.  F2P players don't expect everything free.  They see a distinction between free access to the servers, and free gameplay features.  The former is expected, but the latter is what most people voice their opinions about, especially with comparisons to other F2P titles.

    If the restrictions are too extreme, then people won't even bother playing it.  Look at how much ridicule Swtor got for restricting hotbars.

    I personally have never understood the logic of Hybrid Free To Play models. If players were willing to pay a sub fee to play the game, it would not have gone F2P to begin with.

    I would also not be shocked if the "Bonus" XP and whatnot given to subs is actually the Pre-F2P XP rate, while free players are getting a lower rate than that.

    If someone's primary concern about a F2P game is asking: How much can I get for free?  It tells me they don't really understand the model or it's drawbacks at all... or they're really poor.

     

    The benefit of the SWTOR model is that for $15 a month you're on an even playing field with everyone else paying $15 a month, as opposed to so many other F2P games where paying $15 a month puts you at a huge disadvantage to the person spending $100 and up a month. 

     

    The benefits for SWTOR going F2P are:

    1) Star Wars nerds spend hundreds of dollars on cash shop mounts/outfits.

    2) People who want to pay less than $15 but not $0 can be monetized.

    3) People are far more interested in trying free games than in free trials they know will end in a few days, given how strong SWTOR's low level content is, getting new people through the door is critical to getting them to spend.

    4) Free players make the game feel far less dead than with the traditional sub.

    5) Given that they're making far more money as F2P there is clearly an advantage.

  • strawhat0981strawhat0981 Member UncommonPosts: 1,008
    Originally posted by mcrippins

    Great movie, but can that correlate into the gaming industry?

    Originally posted by laokoko
    "if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".

  • skeaserskeaser Member UncommonPosts: 3,969
    Still better than selling hotbar slots.
    Sig so that badges don't eat my posts.


  • HrimnirHrimnir Member RarePosts: 2,413
    Originally posted by zaberfangx
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by silhaku

      *snip* 

    10 year in and people still are surprised that "Free" to play games aren't actually free.  Boggles my freaking mind...

    10 years people do forget the meaning of free to play, get to play for free not free on everything.

    I know, i was making a roundabout remark on the fact that free to play games never were and never will be truly free. Just not sure what people expect.  Of course like they say, there is a sucker born every minute.

    "The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."

    - Friedrich Nietzsche

  • skeaserskeaser Member UncommonPosts: 3,969
    Originally posted by strawhat0981
    Originally posted by mcrippins

    Great movie, but can that correlate into the gaming industry?

    Cuz OP got showed up and won't post in the thread anymore...use your context clues.

    Sig so that badges don't eat my posts.


  • strawhat0981strawhat0981 Member UncommonPosts: 1,008
    Originally posted by skeaser
    Originally posted by strawhat0981
    Originally posted by mcrippins

    Great movie, but can that correlate into the gaming industry?

    Cuz OP got showed up and won't post in the thread anymore...use your context clues.

    Can not tell, talking shit to me, or the op?

    Originally posted by laokoko
    "if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".

  • strawhat0981strawhat0981 Member UncommonPosts: 1,008
    Originally posted by skeaser
    Originally posted by strawhat0981
    Originally posted by mcrippins

    Great movie, but can that correlate into the gaming industry?

    Cuz OP got showed up and won't post in the thread anymore...use your context clues.

    Sorry, I finally got it. Word to my brother!

    Originally posted by laokoko
    "if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".

  • strawhat0981strawhat0981 Member UncommonPosts: 1,008
    Damn, I feel dumb. 

    Originally posted by laokoko
    "if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".

  • mbrodiembrodie Member RarePosts: 1,475
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by zaberfangx
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by silhaku

      *snip* 

    10 year in and people still are surprised that "Free" to play games aren't actually free.  Boggles my freaking mind...

    10 years people do forget the meaning of free to play, get to play for free not free on everything.

    I know, i was making a roundabout remark on the fact that free to play games never were and never will be truly free. Just not sure what people expect.  Of course like they say, there is a sucker born every minute.

    which is wrong, there is plenty of F2P games where you are not forced to spend money to keep up....

     

    Aion & ESO spring to mind off the top of my head, they limit nothing, Aion has boxes you can unlock with keys from a cash shop but you don't require them to play, i was also going to say TERA, but TERA limits the amount of dailies you can do a day etc... ESO you just get boosts basically for having a sub

  • strawhat0981strawhat0981 Member UncommonPosts: 1,008
    Originally posted by mbrodie
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by zaberfangx
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by silhaku

      *snip* 

    10 year in and people still are surprised that "Free" to play games aren't actually free.  Boggles my freaking mind...

    10 years people do forget the meaning of free to play, get to play for free not free on everything.

    I know, i was making a roundabout remark on the fact that free to play games never were and never will be truly free. Just not sure what people expect.  Of course like they say, there is a sucker born every minute.

    which is wrong, there is plenty of F2P games where you are not forced to spend money to keep up....

     

    Aion & ESO spring to mind off the top of my head, they limit nothing, Aion has boxes you can unlock with keys from a cash shop but you don't require them to play, i was also going to say TERA, but TERA limits the amount of dailies you can do a day etc... ESO you just get boosts basically for having a sub

    So your point is......

    Originally posted by laokoko
    "if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".

  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 16,532

    I said from the first day Smed tried pandering about cash shop gaming there was  only one positive.That is it allows a game that would normally not have the player base to look busier,attracting more players.

    Personally it is a poor reason to go cash shop,too many negatives.I don't want any free players in my game,it could ruin economy creates a worse global chat and you end up with players in guilds who really are not that interested and only there because it is free.I would rather know all the players i associate with are really there because they love the game and not because it is free.

    IMO the whole idea of cash shop gaming is to banter around a FALSE term "FREE".If you need to sell your product with the FREE title then your product needs a lot of help,simple as that.I just deleted 3 f2p titles off my computer,none of them held my interest past 2 days.It is extremely rare that a cash shop game holds my interest,matter of fact almost nothing has held my interest over the last 10 years.Since Wow came about game development and marketing changed a lot,i no longer like the design approach devs are using,everything is cheap and rushed.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • strawhat0981strawhat0981 Member UncommonPosts: 1,008
    Originally posted by Wizardry

    I said from the first day Smed tried pandering about cash shop gaming there was  only one positive.That is it allows a game that would normally not have the player base to look busier,attracting more players.

    Personally it is a poor reason to go cash shop,too many negatives.I don't want any free players in my game,it could ruin economy creates a worse global chat and you end up with players in guilds who really are not that interested and only there because it is free.I would rather know all the players i associate with are really there because they love the game and not because it is free.

    IMO the whole idea of cash shop gaming is to banter around a FALSE term "FREE".If you need to sell your product with the FREE title then your product needs a lot of help,simple as that.I just deleted 3 f2p titles off my computer,none of them held my interest past 2 days.It is extremely rare that a cash shop game holds my interest,matter of fact almost nothing has held my interest over the last 10 years.Since Wow came about game development and marketing changed a lot,i no longer like the design approach devs are using,everything is cheap and rushed.

    You lost me at Smed.

    Originally posted by laokoko
    "if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".

  • mbrodiembrodie Member RarePosts: 1,475
    Originally posted by strawhat0981
    Originally posted by mbrodie
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by zaberfangx
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by silhaku

      *snip* 

    10 year in and people still are surprised that "Free" to play games aren't actually free.  Boggles my freaking mind...

    10 years people do forget the meaning of free to play, get to play for free not free on everything.

    I know, i was making a roundabout remark on the fact that free to play games never were and never will be truly free. Just not sure what people expect.  Of course like they say, there is a sucker born every minute.

    which is wrong, there is plenty of F2P games where you are not forced to spend money to keep up....

     

    Aion & ESO spring to mind off the top of my head, they limit nothing, Aion has boxes you can unlock with keys from a cash shop but you don't require them to play, i was also going to say TERA, but TERA limits the amount of dailies you can do a day etc... ESO you just get boosts basically for having a sub

    So your point is......

    are you dense or trying to troll.. my point was made very clear in response to the post i was replying to.

     

    some games are complately free if you do not wish to pay for them, and still let you remain competitive and not hold you back from those who spend money.

  • NightHaveNNightHaveN Member UncommonPosts: 1,051

    According to their official info: 

    http://www.wildstar-online.com/en/news/2015-05-28-wildstar-is-going-free-to-play-heres-all-you-need-to-know/

    Is something like this:

    Free Signature
    Can Join 1 Circle Can Join 5 Circles
    Can Join Guild Can Join Guild
    Cannot Invite or Create Circle Can Invite or Create Circle
    Cannot Invite or Create Guild Can Invite or Create Guild

     

    See 2nd table in the link included.  There is no mention of joining guilds, because you can only (even this day) be part of one guild, like most MMO out there.  And since is not mentioned in the tables, is then not limited by being free.

     

    In terms of current content, they also mention it will be fully free.  For that I guess they mean Rift kind of unlimited free runs and not 3 weekly limited passes like Swtor does.

     

  • grimalgrimal Member UncommonPosts: 2,908
    Looks pretty good to me!  Can't wait!
  • strawhat0981strawhat0981 Member UncommonPosts: 1,008
    Originally posted by mbrodie
    Originally posted by strawhat0981
    Originally posted by mbrodie
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by zaberfangx
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by silhaku

      *snip* 

    10 year in and people still are surprised that "Free" to play games aren't actually free.  Boggles my freaking mind...

    10 years people do forget the meaning of free to play, get to play for free not free on everything.

    I know, i was making a roundabout remark on the fact that free to play games never were and never will be truly free. Just not sure what people expect.  Of course like they say, there is a sucker born every minute.

    which is wrong, there is plenty of F2P games where you are not forced to spend money to keep up....

     

    Aion & ESO spring to mind off the top of my head, they limit nothing, Aion has boxes you can unlock with keys from a cash shop but you don't require them to play, i was also going to say TERA, but TERA limits the amount of dailies you can do a day etc... ESO you just get boosts basically for having a sub

    So your point is......

    are you dense or trying to troll.. my point was made very clear in response to the post i was replying to.

     

    some games are complately free if you do not wish to pay for them, and still let you remain competitive and not hold you back from those who spend money.

    What about the three people I know who say different? Maybe, what you think you are saying is just inside of your head.

    Originally posted by laokoko
    "if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".

  • skeaserskeaser Member UncommonPosts: 3,969
    Originally posted by mbrodie
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by zaberfangx
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by silhaku

      *snip* 

    10 year in and people still are surprised that "Free" to play games aren't actually free.  Boggles my freaking mind...

    10 years people do forget the meaning of free to play, get to play for free not free on everything.

    I know, i was making a roundabout remark on the fact that free to play games never were and never will be truly free. Just not sure what people expect.  Of course like they say, there is a sucker born every minute.

    which is wrong, there is plenty of F2P games where you are not forced to spend money to keep up....

     

    Aion & ESO spring to mind off the top of my head, they limit nothing, Aion has boxes you can unlock with keys from a cash shop but you don't require them to play, i was also going to say TERA, but TERA limits the amount of dailies you can do a day etc... ESO you just get boosts basically for having a sub

    You'll either have to sub or buy DLC for ESO as it comes out. 

    Sig so that badges don't eat my posts.


  • reeereeereeereee Member UncommonPosts: 1,636
    Originally posted by skeaser
    Originally posted by mbrodie
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by zaberfangx
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by silhaku

      *snip* 

    10 year in and people still are surprised that "Free" to play games aren't actually free.  Boggles my freaking mind...

    10 years people do forget the meaning of free to play, get to play for free not free on everything.

    I know, i was making a roundabout remark on the fact that free to play games never were and never will be truly free. Just not sure what people expect.  Of course like they say, there is a sucker born every minute.

    which is wrong, there is plenty of F2P games where you are not forced to spend money to keep up....

     

    Aion & ESO spring to mind off the top of my head, they limit nothing, Aion has boxes you can unlock with keys from a cash shop but you don't require them to play, i was also going to say TERA, but TERA limits the amount of dailies you can do a day etc... ESO you just get boosts basically for having a sub

    You'll either have to sub or buy DLC for ESO as it comes out. 

    Or, you know, you could have mentioned that you still need to buy a box to access ESO.
  • HrimnirHrimnir Member RarePosts: 2,413
    Originally posted by mbrodie
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by zaberfangx
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by silhaku

      *snip* 

    10 year in and people still are surprised that "Free" to play games aren't actually free.  Boggles my freaking mind...

    10 years people do forget the meaning of free to play, get to play for free not free on everything.

    I know, i was making a roundabout remark on the fact that free to play games never were and never will be truly free. Just not sure what people expect.  Of course like they say, there is a sucker born every minute.

    which is wrong, there is plenty of F2P games where you are not forced to spend money to keep up....

     

    Aion & ESO spring to mind off the top of my head, they limit nothing, Aion has boxes you can unlock with keys from a cash shop but you don't require them to play, i was also going to say TERA, but TERA limits the amount of dailies you can do a day etc... ESO you just get boosts basically for having a sub

    Wrong, show me a F2P game that doesn't have something you can buy.

    The point is its not, by definition free.  There is some kind of monetization.  Now, whether that is pay 2 win or not is of course game dependant, and each persons opinion of P2W varies.  The OP of this article sounded like he was pissed that he couldnt do just about anything in the game without a "pay wall",  Which it boils down to is only the one person who creates a guild has to have a sub, that was his big "pay 2 win" issue.

    "The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."

    - Friedrich Nietzsche

  • observerobserver Member RarePosts: 3,685
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by mbrodie
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by zaberfangx
    Originally posted by Hrimnir
    Originally posted by silhaku

      *snip* 

    10 year in and people still are surprised that "Free" to play games aren't actually free.  Boggles my freaking mind...

    10 years people do forget the meaning of free to play, get to play for free not free on everything.

    I know, i was making a roundabout remark on the fact that free to play games never were and never will be truly free. Just not sure what people expect.  Of course like they say, there is a sucker born every minute.

    which is wrong, there is plenty of F2P games where you are not forced to spend money to keep up....

     

    Aion & ESO spring to mind off the top of my head, they limit nothing, Aion has boxes you can unlock with keys from a cash shop but you don't require them to play, i was also going to say TERA, but TERA limits the amount of dailies you can do a day etc... ESO you just get boosts basically for having a sub

    Wrong, show me a F2P game that doesn't have something you can buy.

    The point is its not, by definition free.  There is some kind of monetization.  Now, whether that is pay 2 win or not is of course game dependant, and each persons opinion of P2W varies.  The OP of this article sounded like he was pissed that he couldnt do just about anything in the game without a "pay wall",  Which it boils down to is only the one person who creates a guild has to have a sub, that was his big "pay 2 win" issue.

    I disagree.  F2P means free access to the servers.  That's what f2p has always meant, an alternative to the subscription model.

    However, access to certain gameplay features are always up for debate, and that's what the OP was discussing.

    In a way, mbrodie is correct, because not all f2p mmos require a payment or block access behind paywalls.  In this case, Wildstar seems to be using a paywall to block access to certain features.  In my opinion, it's not something to get upset about, unless you really want to create a guild.

    p.s. ESO isn't F2P.  It's B2P.

  • kenpokillerkenpokiller Member UncommonPosts: 321

    Wolfenstein: Enemy territory.

    F2P

     

    All the other with shops, monetization, DLC, membership, premium, boosters, skins, graphical overhauls, pets, emotes, insertbullshit here where you throw money at.

     

    = Not F2P

     

    I might aswell say Opensource = F2P

    Everything else mostly a joke.

    Sway all day, butterfly flaps all the way!

  • ButeoRegalisButeoRegalis Member UncommonPosts: 594
    Originally posted by silhaku

     

      Until I see you can't join a guild or do warplots on free accounts

    Then you, sir, are utterly blind. Or worse. None of this is true.

    Visit an eye doctor or cite your source.

    For the genuinely interested: 1) You can join a guild as a F2Per, you just cannot start a guild as a F2Per, or invite to the guild you are in. 2) All forms of play will be open to F2Pers, i.e. non of that SWTOR nonsense of having to buy a 2 week pass to raid, or play the galactic starfighter part, or any of that stuff.

     

    Details:

    http://www.wildstar-online.com/uk/news/2015-05-28-wildstar-is-going-free-to-play-heres-all-you-need-to-know/

    image

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