They could do what EQ did and have 2 types of PvE servers. You had the regular servers that you paid for, I think it was 15 at the time and then they had another server, I cant remember what it was labeled, I think legacy server or something, I cant remember exactly but I think it was around 25 dollars to play on it. From what I can remember, they were given more features such as quicker spawn rates on raid mobs or other stuff, unique items, etc. They had more incentives for that server which was cool. I never tried it as I just stuck with the regular servers. That would be interesting if they did that.
All I know is that if they update the animations in the game to be more modern like for todays standards in games, Ill pay whatever they set the price to. The graphics look alright but its more so about the gameplay and the world.
Make no mistake about it.. The devs would love 25,000 , 50,000 or 100,000 players. To think otherwise is silly. The one thing that would make sure that doesnt happen right from the get go is to charge more than $15 a month. Period. Believing themselves to be a niche game doesnt change anything.
Trying to put GM support and events behind a higher monthly fee has already been tried during EQ1s prime. It failed miserably. The end result wouldnt be any different now. No different than all of these FFA / Heavy PvP games that try to do the same thing over and over and over expecting things to be different than the previous failed attempt.
Do you want Pantheon to last more than 6 months post release? I do. Anymore than $15 a month will make it a struggle unless they keep only a couple people on the game. That means any new content ( if any ) would be raw with little polish .. It would just be bad for the game and for its players.
Go ahead and put a $25 monthly fee on Pantheon so you can all look back and pat yourselves on the back for killing the game. Then be sure to say you are welcome to do the devs once you wasted all their time and money building the game. Go ahead.
Better yet. Lets take Pantheon back to the days when online games were ' pay per hour '..
It has already been stated that raising monthly fees above the standard $15/month would involve serious market research prior to implementation.
If the monthly fee is higher, it won't be because VR is going into the deal blind. Likewise, a $15/month sub won't be a blind choice, it will be due to market research supporting your statement.
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do. Benjamin Franklin
I think a free client, robust trial, and $15 sub is the perfect combination for a game such as Pantheon.
I don't understand why the OP feels the need to be so vehement in his attacks on those that feel differently than he on the subject.
It's hard to have a conversation on the subject with that kind of hostility being thrown around from the start.
Ya, people just want to see the game survive. The people currently backing Pantheon on their forums are those willing to pay more, but I don't think they will increase the sub unless they have to. Suggesting they raise the sub for any other reason than survival is a huge mistake. I think if they can get by on $15 from a smaller playerbase, it will only be a matter of time before the playerbase grows.
It seems most over there want a fee that is more than $15 a month and at least $20 and some want even higher or much higher. .. SMH. I guess those players just want those on the forums to play the game? Some serious elitism / entitlement going on over there.. Or just plain ignorance. It is hard to distinguish the two. Probably the same people who thought the $50 a month EQ Premium Server was a good idea.. It wasnt.
Who wants to play a game where there are only 6,000 accounts because the fee is $25? With 6,000 accounts there MIGHT be 1,000 people on at a time IF that many. How is anyone supposed to get anything done with so few players?
IMO the fee should be LOWER than $15 a month and not higher to start. Just because that is the standard doesnt mean every Tom , Dick and Harry MMO needs to start there. Start at $9.99 a month to bring in a good amount of players and to polish content over the first year and then raise the fee to $12.99 or $14.99 if the quality of the game has improved. Those that started from the beginning are grandfathered in at $9.99 while new accounts would be whatever it was raised too.
I know Pantheon is marketed to a select audience but I do hope they get their wish and then a year later the game goes F2P because Subscriptions are dead, it would even more abundantly clear if a company actually charged more then $15.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
It seems most over there want a fee that is more than $15 a month and at least $20 and some want even higher or much higher. .. SMH. I guess those players just want those on the forums to play the game? Some serious elitism / entitlement going on over there.. Or just plain ignorance. It is hard to distinguish the two. Probably the same people who thought the $50 a month EQ Premium Server was a good idea.. It wasnt.
Who wants to play a game where there are only 6,000 accounts because the fee is $25? With 6,000 accounts there MIGHT be 1,000 people on at a time IF that many. How is anyone supposed to get anything done with so few players?
IMO the fee should be LOWER than $15 a month and not higher to start. Just because that is the standard doesnt mean every Tom , Dick and Harry MMO needs to start there. Start at $9.99 a month to bring in a good amount of players and to polish content over the first year and then raise the fee to $12.99 or $14.99 if the quality of the game has improved. Those that started from the beginning are grandfathered in at $9.99 while new accounts would be whatever it was raised too.
I know Pantheon is marketed to a select audience but I do hope they get their wish and then a year later the game goes F2P because Subscriptions are dead, it would even more abundantly clear if a company actually charged more then $15.
Lets just get this out of your head, F2P is not going to happen, it's been stated repeatedly. The whole point of this game is to get away from the plethora of utter crap on the market now and back to the "old school" ways. which means no cash shop. With no cash shop there is no F2P.
I'm okay with a $14.99 subscription fee per month.... but not a fan of $20.00 or higher! Maybe have a lifetime fee for those who plan on playing for a long time and would not need to pay a monthly fee?? I'd go for that!!
Proud MMORPG.com member since March 2004! Make PvE GREAT Again!
I think a free client, robust trial, and $15 sub is the perfect combination for a game such as Pantheon.
I think $40-$50 box/client fee, robust open beta (if that's what you meant by trial), and a $15 sub has always worked best for any MMO I ever subscribed to. They were the best (to me) MMOs made and had me playing passed at least a year (most were beyond 2 years).
It was the way back then...should never have changed.
"This may hurt a little, but it's something you'll get used to. Relax....."
Offer a life time fee of $300.00 or if they want to be creative, offer a weekend or one week fee.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Originally posted by Octagon7711 Offer a life time fee of $300.00 or if they want to be creative, offer a weekend or one week fee.
Might not be a bad idea, though $300 seems a bit low to me personally. Even at $15 a month for two years you're talking around $360. Not sure how a lifetime sub would be factored as I have no knowledge in that arena, however it would seem they would have severally lost out for both EQ and WoW if they offered them so low; seeing as both of those games are still up and running. Do you have any idea how those would be factored?
I want to give more to keep talented employes employed and happy with their compensation. I don't expect talented devs, artist, lore writers, etc to stick around for peanuts. I also don't want to see CEOs/managers making 10 times what the workers are making either. I also am aware that I really have no say as to where the money goes, however I do know I have the power of voting with my wallet and I do so often.
It seems most over there want a fee that is more than $15 a month and at least $20 and some want even higher or much higher. .. SMH. I guess those players just want those on the forums to play the game? Some serious elitism / entitlement going on over there.. Or just plain ignorance. It is hard to distinguish the two. Probably the same people who thought the $50 a month EQ Premium Server was a good idea.. It wasnt.
Who wants to play a game where there are only 6,000 accounts because the fee is $25? With 6,000 accounts there MIGHT be 1,000 people on at a time IF that many. How is anyone supposed to get anything done with so few players?
IMO the fee should be LOWER than $15 a month and not higher to start. Just because that is the standard doesnt mean every Tom , Dick and Harry MMO needs to start there. Start at $9.99 a month to bring in a good amount of players and to polish content over the first year and then raise the fee to $12.99 or $14.99 if the quality of the game has improved. Those that started from the beginning are grandfathered in at $9.99 while new accounts would be whatever it was raised too.
I know Pantheon is marketed to a select audience but I do hope they get their wish and then a year later the game goes F2P because Subscriptions are dead, it would even more abundantly clear if a company actually charged more then $15.
While I have been a long time proponent of F2P games, they do not fit all models. I also don't approve of the way they've been wielded in recent years. More often than not F2P is used as a cash grab for shallow games or those that have peaked as a sort of concession to allow players to keep playing casually. Recently its symbolized more of a white flag that developers wave when they can't keep up with content at the rate players consume it. It can be profitable, but no game that has a sustained or growing population will resort to F2P unless it fits their design and offers equal or higher profitability.
Thats the difference with Pantheon. The game is fundamentally different in that progression in Pantheon will be slower, harder, more meaningful and more varied, all by an order of magnitude. The rush to end game trend does not apply. Were talking about a process that will take months if not years, not weeks like the modern MMO. No one else is offering what they are creating, so barring any complications, F2P is neither a necessary or compatible payment model.
Anything above $15 would be a death sentence for this game. We are already moving away from the P2P model, let alone increasing the price! Just because people can afford it doesn't mean they are going to let you swindle them with open arms.
Netflix saves me hundreds of dollars a month in entertainment costs, doesn't mean I would ever pay them 100 a month
Anything above $15 would be a death sentence for this game. We are already moving away from the P2P model, let alone increasing the price! Just because people can afford it doesn't mean they are going to let you swindle them with open arms.
Netflix saves me hundreds of dollars a month in entertainment costs, doesn't mean I would ever pay them 100 a month
Understand?
Do you call it swindling when a restaurant charges you more for the same amount of food you buy at McDonalds too?
I have often said that I would gladly pay higher monthly fee if the game is good. A challenging and fun game that would keep me hooked for more than 1 or 2 months, I would have no problem paying up to 50$ a month. would still be my cheapest entertainement.
I'd like to see better deals for 3 months, 6 months and one year subs paid in advance, or a decrease in price as long as you stay subbed. Like, you start at 15 bucks and it goes down 1 every month, until it reaches 8-9. Then you only pay that as long as you stay subbed, if you stop paying the sub you start at 15 again. I think it would work better with F2P with a sub option games, like Tera, Lotro etc.
I know brad mquaid isn't good with financials and such but it would be a complete suicide to go higher than the established $15.
Hell, it would be a quick cash grab move instead because i don't see the game survive that long with a higher sub. Remember swtor, eso, and many more of the sub mmos? Ye, they had to accept reality. Also, I thought people here cared about a long and warm community. You won't have that when you are playing an empty world.
People are paying hundreds and thousands of dollars for Kickstarter pledges in search for a good mmo, so there's a market there for people that will pay a subscription fee if the game is good. It's only the I want it now, give it to me free crowd, that seem to scream the loudest about subscription fees. Subscription isn't dead as someone suggested, it's just been renamed and tagged onto B2P and F2P mmo's as an added feature for bonus items/features monthly.
I know brad mquaid isn't good with financials and such but it would be a complete suicide to go higher than the established $15.
Hell, it would be a quick cash grab move instead because i don't see the game survive that long with a higher sub. Remember swtor, eso, and many more of the sub mmos? Ye, they had to accept reality. Also, I thought people here cared about a long and warm community. You won't have that when you are playing an empty world.
Yea I remember them all, they were all so good that even free I don't play them ...
Based on the above video, the game is looking solid but I can't justify paying a sub more than WoW or FFXIV tbh. Especially after last year's sub games. But that's just me.
Anything above $15 would be a death sentence for this game. We are already moving away from the P2P model, let alone increasing the price! Just because people can afford it doesn't mean they are going to let you swindle them with open arms.
Netflix saves me hundreds of dollars a month in entertainment costs, doesn't mean I would ever pay them 100 a month
Understand?
Do you call it swindling when a restaurant charges you more for the same amount of food you buy at McDonalds too?
A restaurant is about quality over quantity. Where as McDonalds is purely convenience. I don't know how either play into what is being said except for you trying to make a point that doesn't exist.
Anything above $15 would be a death sentence for this game. We are already moving away from the P2P model, let alone increasing the price! Just because people can afford it doesn't mean they are going to let you swindle them with open arms.
Netflix saves me hundreds of dollars a month in entertainment costs, doesn't mean I would ever pay them 100 a month
Understand?
Do you call it swindling when a restaurant charges you more for the same amount of food you buy at McDonalds too?
A restaurant is about quality over quantity. Where as McDonalds is purely convenience. I don't know how either play into what is being said except for you trying to make a point that doesn't exist.
I thought it was pretty obvious I was suggesting that Pantheon will be offering a higher quality game...
I believe the bottom line that should be thought about is what is available now and what they want from the future of MMO-RPGs. Even if they hate Brad with a passion and they have any interest at all for a game of this nature, they should be trying to support it to help it succeed.
Without running around yelling the "sky is falling", the mmo-rpgs of today do not hold attention or satisfy a lot of people from the comments and the rise and fall of all the triple A titles I see today. It's like I see a huge title game get released one day and a few months to a year later it's getting shutdown or it's so empty that it might as well be shutdown.
I believe in order to see a change we need to support a little change due to the fact that what is out now obviously isn't working or everyone would be gaming instead of posting in these forums. From what I see and please correct me if I'm wrong; this is the only game giving us that opportunity currently.
I believe in order to see a change we need to support a little change due to the fact that what is out now obviously isn't working or everyone would be gaming instead of posting in these forums. From what I see and please correct me if I'm wrong; this is the only game giving us that opportunity currently.
Of the games currently in development, this is the only game offering what so many players are asking for.
I just hope it can deliver.
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do. Benjamin Franklin
Comments
They could do what EQ did and have 2 types of PvE servers. You had the regular servers that you paid for, I think it was 15 at the time and then they had another server, I cant remember what it was labeled, I think legacy server or something, I cant remember exactly but I think it was around 25 dollars to play on it. From what I can remember, they were given more features such as quicker spawn rates on raid mobs or other stuff, unique items, etc. They had more incentives for that server which was cool. I never tried it as I just stuck with the regular servers. That would be interesting if they did that.
All I know is that if they update the animations in the game to be more modern like for todays standards in games, Ill pay whatever they set the price to. The graphics look alright but its more so about the gameplay and the world.
Make no mistake about it.. The devs would love 25,000 , 50,000 or 100,000 players. To think otherwise is silly. The one thing that would make sure that doesnt happen right from the get go is to charge more than $15 a month. Period. Believing themselves to be a niche game doesnt change anything.
Trying to put GM support and events behind a higher monthly fee has already been tried during EQ1s prime. It failed miserably. The end result wouldnt be any different now. No different than all of these FFA / Heavy PvP games that try to do the same thing over and over and over expecting things to be different than the previous failed attempt.
Do you want Pantheon to last more than 6 months post release? I do. Anymore than $15 a month will make it a struggle unless they keep only a couple people on the game. That means any new content ( if any ) would be raw with little polish .. It would just be bad for the game and for its players.
Go ahead and put a $25 monthly fee on Pantheon so you can all look back and pat yourselves on the back for killing the game. Then be sure to say you are welcome to do the devs once you wasted all their time and money building the game. Go ahead.
Better yet. Lets take Pantheon back to the days when online games were ' pay per hour '..
It has already been stated that raising monthly fees above the standard $15/month would involve serious market research prior to implementation.
If the monthly fee is higher, it won't be because VR is going into the deal blind. Likewise, a $15/month sub won't be a blind choice, it will be due to market research supporting your statement.
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do.
Benjamin Franklin
I think a free client, robust trial, and $15 sub is the perfect combination for a game such as Pantheon.
I don't understand why the OP feels the need to be so vehement in his attacks on those that feel differently than he on the subject.
It's hard to have a conversation on the subject with that kind of hostility being thrown around from the start.
Ya, people just want to see the game survive. The people currently backing Pantheon on their forums are those willing to pay more, but I don't think they will increase the sub unless they have to. Suggesting they raise the sub for any other reason than survival is a huge mistake. I think if they can get by on $15 from a smaller playerbase, it will only be a matter of time before the playerbase grows.
I know Pantheon is marketed to a select audience but I do hope they get their wish and then a year later the game goes F2P because Subscriptions are dead, it would even more abundantly clear if a company actually charged more then $15.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
Lets just get this out of your head, F2P is not going to happen, it's been stated repeatedly. The whole point of this game is to get away from the plethora of utter crap on the market now and back to the "old school" ways. which means no cash shop. With no cash shop there is no F2P.
I'm okay with a $14.99 subscription fee per month.... but not a fan of $20.00 or higher! Maybe have a lifetime fee for those who plan on playing for a long time and would not need to pay a monthly fee?? I'd go for that!!
Proud MMORPG.com member since March 2004! Make PvE GREAT Again!
I think $40-$50 box/client fee, robust open beta (if that's what you meant by trial), and a $15 sub has always worked best for any MMO I ever subscribed to. They were the best (to me) MMOs made and had me playing passed at least a year (most were beyond 2 years).
It was the way back then...should never have changed.
"This may hurt a little, but it's something you'll get used to. Relax....."
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Might not be a bad idea, though $300 seems a bit low to me personally. Even at $15 a month for two years you're talking around $360. Not sure how a lifetime sub would be factored as I have no knowledge in that arena, however it would seem they would have severally lost out for both EQ and WoW if they offered them so low; seeing as both of those games are still up and running. Do you have any idea how those would be factored?
I want to give more to keep talented employes employed and happy with their compensation. I don't expect talented devs, artist, lore writers, etc to stick around for peanuts. I also don't want to see CEOs/managers making 10 times what the workers are making either. I also am aware that I really have no say as to where the money goes, however I do know I have the power of voting with my wallet and I do so often.
While I have been a long time proponent of F2P games, they do not fit all models. I also don't approve of the way they've been wielded in recent years. More often than not F2P is used as a cash grab for shallow games or those that have peaked as a sort of concession to allow players to keep playing casually. Recently its symbolized more of a white flag that developers wave when they can't keep up with content at the rate players consume it. It can be profitable, but no game that has a sustained or growing population will resort to F2P unless it fits their design and offers equal or higher profitability.
Thats the difference with Pantheon. The game is fundamentally different in that progression in Pantheon will be slower, harder, more meaningful and more varied, all by an order of magnitude. The rush to end game trend does not apply. Were talking about a process that will take months if not years, not weeks like the modern MMO. No one else is offering what they are creating, so barring any complications, F2P is neither a necessary or compatible payment model.
Anything above $15 would be a death sentence for this game. We are already moving away from the P2P model, let alone increasing the price! Just because people can afford it doesn't mean they are going to let you swindle them with open arms.
Netflix saves me hundreds of dollars a month in entertainment costs, doesn't mean I would ever pay them 100 a month
Understand?
Do you call it swindling when a restaurant charges you more for the same amount of food you buy at McDonalds too?
Well, I could probably tolerate up to 25€ per month - but if its higher than that, I'll have to bail.
I know brad mquaid isn't good with financials and such but it would be a complete suicide to go higher than the established $15.
Hell, it would be a quick cash grab move instead because i don't see the game survive that long with a higher sub. Remember swtor, eso, and many more of the sub mmos? Ye, they had to accept reality. Also, I thought people here cared about a long and warm community. You won't have that when you are playing an empty world.
People are paying hundreds and thousands of dollars for Kickstarter pledges in search for a good mmo, so there's a market there for people that will pay a subscription fee if the game is good. It's only the I want it now, give it to me free crowd, that seem to scream the loudest about subscription fees. Subscription isn't dead as someone suggested, it's just been renamed and tagged onto B2P and F2P mmo's as an added feature for bonus items/features monthly.
What happens when you log off your characters????.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFQhfhnjYMk
Dark Age of Camelot
Yea I remember them all, they were all so good that even free I don't play them ...
Based on the above video, the game is looking solid but I can't justify paying a sub more than WoW or FFXIV tbh. Especially after last year's sub games. But that's just me.
A restaurant is about quality over quantity. Where as McDonalds is purely convenience. I don't know how either play into what is being said except for you trying to make a point that doesn't exist.
I thought it was pretty obvious I was suggesting that Pantheon will be offering a higher quality game...
I believe the bottom line that should be thought about is what is available now and what they want from the future of MMO-RPGs. Even if they hate Brad with a passion and they have any interest at all for a game of this nature, they should be trying to support it to help it succeed.
Without running around yelling the "sky is falling", the mmo-rpgs of today do not hold attention or satisfy a lot of people from the comments and the rise and fall of all the triple A titles I see today. It's like I see a huge title game get released one day and a few months to a year later it's getting shutdown or it's so empty that it might as well be shutdown.
I believe in order to see a change we need to support a little change due to the fact that what is out now obviously isn't working or everyone would be gaming instead of posting in these forums. From what I see and please correct me if I'm wrong; this is the only game giving us that opportunity currently.
Of the games currently in development, this is the only game offering what so many players are asking for.
I just hope it can deliver.
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do.
Benjamin Franklin