"The short answer is: you cant. At least, not a game with the scope of Crowfall. Fortunately, that isnt our plan. We are limiting our scope of Crowfall in two major ways: first, were starting with the core module of the game, not the entire vision of the game, and second, we opted to make a game based primarily on player-interaction instead of linear content which is THE major cost for most MMOs."
basically early access of the entire vision. they will do the "core" first. then if/when they have enough money to continue development they will finish the game.
Originally posted by knightofblackvalorDoes it seem like this game isn't going to do well at all since there are already better pvp alternatives out there?
While I'm not a backer, the kickstarter wants a word with you....
Yeah I know right... 7000 plus backers and $669,000 already. This will fund in the next few days. It will be interesting to see what the stretch goals will be.
the stretch goals will just be more than just the "core module" at launch. wont they? this KS is said to only be developing 'the dregs' ruleset. 3 faction, 6-12 faction, and guild v guild aren't being funded by the 800k.
I think you're wrong on this. This is what they say about the KS:
"Our goal for this Kickstarter is to fund the core module of Crowfall.
How many games can you play with a standard deck of cards? Poker, Blackjack, Bridge – the variety is endless. Think of the core module like our baseline deck of cards. This is the foundation of the game, on which all the variant rules sets can be built.
Much of the core module work has already been done; we are looking to the community to help us finish it. Specifically, we will use these funds to build:
The Core Module, Character Creation, World, Combat, Economy, Eternal Kingdoms, Campaign Rules"
They even call out specifically what the funds will be used for. Granted, the wording could have been a bit better, but from what I can tell, the funds will be used to create everything they have listed in the Kickstarter project description. The Dregs are just a variant rules set.
you might be right. but under each of those bullet points they specifically list what that entails. under 'campaign rules' only 'the dregs' is listed. it even says what it is. FFA pvp.
Originally posted by killion81 Originally posted by muffins89Originally posted by killion81Originally posted by muffins89Originally posted by stevebombsquadOriginally posted by WolfhammerOriginally posted by knightofblackvalorDoes it seem like this game isn't going to do well at all since there are already better pvp alternatives out there?
While I'm not a backer, the kickstarter wants a word with you....Yeah I know right... 7000 plus backers and $669,000 already. This will fund in the next few days. It will be interesting to see what the stretch goals will be. the stretch goals will just be more than just the "core module" at launch. wont they? this KS is said to only be developing 'the dregs' ruleset. 3 faction, 6-12 faction, and guild v guild aren't being funded by the 800k.I think you're wrong on this. This is what they say about the KS:"Our goal for this Kickstarter is to fund the core module of Crowfall. How many games can you play with a standard deck of cards? Poker, Blackjack, Bridge the variety is endless. Think of the core module like our baseline deck of cards. This is the foundation of the game, on which all the variant rules sets can be built.Much of the core module work has already been done; we are looking to the community to help us finish it. Specifically, we will use these funds to build:The Core Module, Character Creation, World, Combat, Economy, Eternal Kingdoms, Campaign Rules"They even call out specifically what the funds will be used for. Granted, the wording could have been a bit better, but from what I can tell, the funds will be used to create everything they have listed in the Kickstarter project description. The Dregs are just a variant rules set.you might be right. but under each of those bullet points they specifically list what that entails. under 'campaign rules' only 'the dregs' is listed. it even says what it is. FFA pvp.
that's where they want it to end up. read the core module part. the part of the game being funded by this KS. it only lists ffa pvp. so, in the future after they get the ffa pvp done. they want to be able to add those other rulesets. but that's not what there working on with the 800k.
I mean it got over 50% of it's kickstarter in less than a day, it's already doing well.
As for the actual game, there are no other MMORPG PVP games that reset the world every so often to give players that new game landrush type of feeling so it has already carved out it's niche.
That's not true. There's mmos that have been doing it for almost a decade now. Its not a new concept. Don't confuse something new to you with something new.
Did the land completely change? Was it a completely different world with different NPCs and monsters? I didn't think so.
You forgot a very key part, Rules. If the rules keep changing, so do peoples strategies. You might find one way to win a campaign, but the same way won't work on another. THis will keep the content fresh.
An Example, if you're doing a raid, your guild find a way to beat the boss, in most games next time you rencounter the boss using the same strats you will down him, but with less hassle, then after a while it becomes second nature and just repetitive. What Crowfall is essentially doing is, every time you defeat and rencounter the boss, he acts very different from before, so the first strat won't work, your team is going to have to come up with a new way of winning.
Originally posted by JayFiveAlive What better PvP alternatives are there? What in particular is bad about Crowfall's PvP that you didn't like when you tried it? Do tell!
Well every single game i pop into Twitch is some sort of pvp,so ya that market is absolutely flooded right now.I would not use the term better ,i do enjoy watching for the entertainment of some streamers but i would not say the pvp in these games is good at all and why i'm watching and not interested in playing.
The little i have seen,there is nothing there that pops out and says play me,i have got MUCH better right now playing a much older FFXI.I do not see a single thing in Crowfall that would make me want to play it,that alone makes me feel like it is simply another same old same old.
I have been striving so badly for an ECO world,instead we have so many games giving us MEANINGLESS worlds,most of the structures are 2d models,again meaningless to the world.I want to see a world where you might kill that flock of sheep then there is no more sheep until next year,i want to see animals/creatures hunting their food chain,i want the world to come alive in a realistic sense.
I want combat to be strategy and calculated,i don't want a solo player running in twirling around 360 degrees taking out 5/6/7 mobs with ease,it looks silly/fake.I want the battles to seem challenging like a real battle should,i don't want to feel like i am fighting 5 Capybara's or rabbits.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Full/partial loot PvP can and has worked when gear isn't as powerful and is readily available from skilled craftsmen.
Worked just fine in UO.
I think it's "hard" in say EvE online because there is such a wealth gap between new and veteran players.
A newer player has zero incentive to risk their 500 million battleship in PvP because taking such a loss would cripple them, where as a veteran with billions of isk can write it off a lot easier.
UO didn't have this problem, for one because gear didn't have tiers, so there really wasn't any "high end" gear - it was all just gear.
And its common rarity made it fairly inexpensive for both noob and veteran to replace.
Sure, you had stuff like a +1 sword or silver weapons etc. but most would only risk using a +1 in PvP if they had a good supply of replacements stored in the bank.
That +1 may have helped you win a 1vs1, but we're talking maybe a 10% advantage, easily overcome by skill and tactics.
What is going to make this game Crowfall sink or swim is motivation and balance. How motivated are players going to be to work together, accept risk, and cooperate, and how balanced is it going to be?
Sure they talk about super-corps taking control of everything and the game becoming stale, but what prevents these titanic groups from just doing the same overpowering tactics each and every reset?
You can't control player's political alliances and desire for min/maxing - if a large enough group decides to work together to dominate the resource game, you can't "force" political upheaval and a fractioning of that group in order to establish balance.
Hopefully the really big/organized guilds are going to focus on the dregs - highest risk + highest reward as they appear to be essentially FFA, but through organization they can conquer.
Hopefully this leaves the Guild vs. Guild and Faction vs. Faction worlds more open to smaller, more balanced conflict and the resets actually create the diverse experience they are aiming for.
EvE has been trying to do this forever by making low sec the place for smaller corps to lay claim and engage in their smaller scale warfare and politics, while leaving null sec to the mega corp(s) to control.
Problem is the mega corps take over all of low sec too... hopefully the control mechanics in place only allow a single group, no matter its size, a limited amount of influence/control across the worlds.
Full/partial loot PvP can and has worked when gear isn't as powerful and is readily available from skilled craftsmen.
Worked just fine in UO.
I think it's "hard" in say EvE online because there is such a wealth gap between new and veteran players.
A newer player has zero incentive to risk their 500 million battleship in PvP because taking such a loss would cripple them, where as a veteran with billions of isk can write it off a lot easier.
UO didn't have this problem, for one because gear didn't have tiers, so there really wasn't any "high end" gear - it was all just gear.
And its common rarity made it fairly inexpensive for both noob and veteran to replace.
Sure, you had stuff like a +1 sword or silver weapons etc. but most would only risk using a +1 in PvP if they had a good supply of replacements stored in the bank.
That +1 may have helped you win a 1vs1, but we're talking maybe a 10% advantage, easily overcome by skill and tactics.
What is going to make this game Crowfall sink or swim is motivation and balance. How motivated are players going to be to work together, accept risk, and cooperate, and how balanced is it going to be?
Sure they talk about super-corps taking control of everything and the game becoming stale, but what prevents these titanic groups from just doing the same overpowering tactics each and every reset?
You can't control player's political alliances and desire for min/maxing - if a large enough group decides to work together to dominate the resource game, you can't "force" political upheaval and a fractioning of that group in order to establish balance.
Hopefully the really big/organized guilds are going to focus on the dregs - highest risk + highest reward as they appear to be essentially FFA, but through organization they can conquer.
Hopefully this leaves the Guild vs. Guild and Faction vs. Faction worlds more open to smaller, more balanced conflict and the resets actually create the diverse experience they are aiming for.
EvE has been trying to do this forever by making low sec the place for smaller corps to lay claim and engage in their smaller scale warfare and politics, while leaving null sec to the mega corp(s) to control.
Problem is the mega corps take over all of low sec too... hopefully the control mechanics in place only allow a single group, no matter its size, a limited amount of influence/control across the worlds.
limit the number of participants?
limit access to single campaign
set campaign rule to hinder "mega-corp" (resource waste, if you control too much/too few territory you gain less and less resources for instance so you have a peak at say 42% territory and it drops sharply either way so you WaNT to maintain that peak)
hopefully the control mechanics in place only allow a single group, no matter its size, a limited amount of influence/control across the worlds.
limit the number of participants?
limit access to single campaign
set campaign rule to hinder "mega-corp" (resource waste, if you control too much territory you gain less and less resources for instance so you have a peak at say 42% territory and it drops sharply either way so you WaNT to maintain that peak)
Well yeah, obviously there are "solutions" but what are they actually going to do?
You will also have the alternate viewpoint - why should the game limit or cap size and set limitations, if you're capable of growing and controlling it all and dominating why should the game stop you?
Should we not be rewarded for playing intelligently, forming alliances, and dominating? Why are you punishing success?
This game is a huge risk. Its not playing it safe and that always turns out one of two ways. Hand crash fail or really well. I think its too soon to call that but IMO I think it has a good chance of carving out its own space. Question is if they can they keep it. Seems they have made a tall order of 5 new worlds every 1-3 months. Seems like a lot of work for a niche game.
hopefully the control mechanics in place only allow a single group, no matter its size, a limited amount of influence/control across the worlds.
limit the number of participants?
limit access to single campaign
set campaign rule to hinder "mega-corp" (resource waste, if you control too much territory you gain less and less resources for instance so you have a peak at say 42% territory and it drops sharply either way so you WaNT to maintain that peak)
Well yeah, obviously there are "solutions" but what are they actually going to do?
You will also have the alternate viewpoint - why should the game limit or cap size and set limitations, if you're capable of growing and controlling it all and dominating why should the game stop you?
Should we not be rewarded for playing intelligently, forming alliances, and dominating? Why are you punishing success?
etc.
What are they going to do is up in the air
And they say theyll have various campaigns with various rules. One might be limited one might not be. Thats whats interests me the most as theyre not bound to one ruleset for the whole game like EvE, in the light of CF EvE might be considered like just one campaign with that specific ruleset.
Somewhat like Risk, where you draw a card that tells you your goal, but cards are not limited and your goals can be bound just by your imagination. Youre still playing Risk with its core rules, but your gameplay might change drastically depending on your goals. At least thats how i see what theyre aiming for.
Considering the game broke pass its 50% mark on Kickstarter, I think its going to do just fine.
The only issue Crowfall had was the money. People have showed ( and are showing) that they want the product. The dev team is good with good veterans that have made a name for themselves.
Originally posted by knightofblackvalor Does it seem like this game isn't going to do well at all since there are already better pvp alternatives out there?
Originally posted by knightofblackvalor Does it seem like this game isn't going to do well at all since there are already better pvp alternatives out there?
There are absolutely NO "better" alternatives to PVP out on the market. Currently PVE-Themepark is flooding the market. Most of which are failing left and right, and studios close due to this path that they've taken.
More diversity is ALWAYS good.
Please give examples of "better" titles out there that do pvp "better". Please reframe from listing ANY themepark MMOs that simply tacked a "pvp module" on later that doesn't fit at all with the game they designed. (ie: don't list WoW, RIFT, etc...these are themepark games with an emphasis on hand-holding, quest-driven, content).
-Bear
You can't even play Crowfall right now, so how can it be better than anything? So, actually, every single PvP MMO out right now is better..
But seriously, are we already calling CF the savior of PvP MMO's or something? Let's give it enough time to fail, can we please?
Originally posted by knightofblackvalor Does it seem like this game isn't going to do well at all since there are already better pvp alternatives out there?
Considering the game broke pass its 50% mark on Kickstarter, I think its going to do just fine.
The only issue Crowfall had was the money. People have showed ( and are showing) that they want the product. The dev team is good with good veterans that have made a name for themselves.
Because no game has ever gotten to it's kickstarter goal and failed right?
Considering the game broke pass its 50% mark on Kickstarter, I think its going to do just fine.
The only issue Crowfall had was the money. People have showed ( and are showing) that they want the product. The dev team is good with good veterans that have made a name for themselves.
Getting kickstarted means nothing. There was a report done that showed only 30% of all crowd funded games release. This is before you get to crowd funded MMOs, to date none have released.
Originally posted by knightofblackvalor Does it seem like this game isn't going to do well at all since there are already better pvp alternatives out there?
There are absolutely NO "better" alternatives to PVP out on the market. Currently PVE-Themepark is flooding the market. Most of which are failing left and right, and studios close due to this path that they've taken.
More diversity is ALWAYS good.
Please give examples of "better" titles out there that do pvp "better". Please reframe from listing ANY themepark MMOs that simply tacked a "pvp module" on later that doesn't fit at all with the game they designed. (ie: don't list WoW, RIFT, etc...these are themepark games with an emphasis on hand-holding, quest-driven, content).
-Bear
You can't even play Crowfall right now, so how can it be better than anything? So, actually, every single PvP MMO out right now is better..
But seriously, are we already calling CF the savior of PvP MMO's or something? Let's give it enough time to fail, can we please?
I call it "interesting enough idea worth giving a shot" its not like i have much better options to spend 30$ on right now ;P
Originally posted by knightofblackvalorDoes it seem like this game isn't going to do well at all since there are already better pvp alternatives out there?
While I'm not a backer, the kickstarter wants a word with you....
Yeah I know right... 7000 plus backers and $669,000 already. This will fund in the next few days. It will be interesting to see what the stretch goals will be.
the stretch goals will just be more than just the "core module" at launch. wont they? this KS is said to only be developing 'the dregs' ruleset. 3 faction, 6-12 faction, and guild v guild aren't being funded by the 800k.
I think you're wrong on this. This is what they say about the KS:"Our goal for this Kickstarter is to fund the core module of Crowfall. How many games can you play with a standard deck of cards? Poker, Blackjack, Bridge – the variety is endless. Think of the core module like our baseline deck of cards. This is the foundation of the game, on which all the variant rules sets can be built.Much of the core module work has already been done; we are looking to the community to help us finish it. Specifically, we will use these funds to build:The Core Module, Character Creation, World, Combat, Economy, Eternal Kingdoms, Campaign Rules"They even call out specifically what the funds will be used for. Granted, the wording could have been a bit better, but from what I can tell, the funds will be used to create everything they have listed in the Kickstarter project description. The Dregs are just a variant rules set.
you might be right. but under each of those bullet points they specifically list what that entails. under 'campaign rules' only 'the dregs' is listed. it even says what it is. FFA pvp.
that's where they want it to end up. read the core module part. the part of the game being funded by this KS. it only lists ffa pvp. so, in the future after they get the ffa pvp done. they want to be able to add those other rulesets. but that's not what there working on with the 800k.
I've been working on finding clarification for this. Have yet to get any, but I will update this thread when I do.
Originally posted by killion81 Originally posted by muffins89Originally posted by killion81Originally posted by muffins89Originally posted by killion81Originally posted by muffins89Originally posted by stevebombsquadOriginally posted by WolfhammerOriginally posted by knightofblackvalorDoes it seem like this game isn't going to do well at all since there are already better pvp alternatives out there?
While I'm not a backer, the kickstarter wants a word with you....Yeah I know right... 7000 plus backers and $669,000 already. This will fund in the next few days. It will be interesting to see what the stretch goals will be. the stretch goals will just be more than just the "core module" at launch. wont they? this KS is said to only be developing 'the dregs' ruleset. 3 faction, 6-12 faction, and guild v guild aren't being funded by the 800k.I think you're wrong on this. This is what they say about the KS:"Our goal for this Kickstarter is to fund the core module of Crowfall. How many games can you play with a standard deck of cards? Poker, Blackjack, Bridge the variety is endless. Think of the core module like our baseline deck of cards. This is the foundation of the game, on which all the variant rules sets can be built.Much of the core module work has already been done; we are looking to the community to help us finish it. Specifically, we will use these funds to build:The Core Module, Character Creation, World, Combat, Economy, Eternal Kingdoms, Campaign Rules"They even call out specifically what the funds will be used for. Granted, the wording could have been a bit better, but from what I can tell, the funds will be used to create everything they have listed in the Kickstarter project description. The Dregs are just a variant rules set.you might be right. but under each of those bullet points they specifically list what that entails. under 'campaign rules' only 'the dregs' is listed. it even says what it is. FFA pvp.It lists 5 different campaign rules sets in the project description (found at https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/crowfall/crowfall-throne-war-pc-mmo/description ). Scroll down to the "Changing the Rules" subsection.that's where they want it to end up. read the core module part. the part of the game being funded by this KS. it only lists ffa pvp. so, in the future after they get the ffa pvp done. they want to be able to add those other rulesets. but that's not what there working on with the 800k.
I've been working on finding clarification for this. Have yet to get any, but I will update this thread when I do.
it's either very misleading. or very confusing. maybe we could get a backer to ask them on the KS page for clarification.
Originally posted by knightofblackvalorDoes it seem like this game isn't going to do well at all since there are already better pvp alternatives out there?
While I'm not a backer, the kickstarter wants a word with you....
Yeah I know right... 7000 plus backers and $669,000 already. This will fund in the next few days. It will be interesting to see what the stretch goals will be.
the stretch goals will just be more than just the "core module" at launch. wont they? this KS is said to only be developing 'the dregs' ruleset. 3 faction, 6-12 faction, and guild v guild aren't being funded by the 800k.
I think you're wrong on this. This is what they say about the KS:"Our goal for this Kickstarter is to fund the core module of Crowfall. How many games can you play with a standard deck of cards? Poker, Blackjack, Bridge – the variety is endless. Think of the core module like our baseline deck of cards. This is the foundation of the game, on which all the variant rules sets can be built.Much of the core module work has already been done; we are looking to the community to help us finish it. Specifically, we will use these funds to build:The Core Module, Character Creation, World, Combat, Economy, Eternal Kingdoms, Campaign Rules"They even call out specifically what the funds will be used for. Granted, the wording could have been a bit better, but from what I can tell, the funds will be used to create everything they have listed in the Kickstarter project description. The Dregs are just a variant rules set.
you might be right. but under each of those bullet points they specifically list what that entails. under 'campaign rules' only 'the dregs' is listed. it even says what it is. FFA pvp.
that's where they want it to end up. read the core module part. the part of the game being funded by this KS. it only lists ffa pvp. so, in the future after they get the ffa pvp done. they want to be able to add those other rulesets. but that's not what there working on with the 800k.
I've been working on finding clarification for this. Have yet to get any, but I will update this thread when I do.
it's either very misleading. or very confusing. maybe we could get a backer to ask them on the KS page for clarification.
Here's a link to the thread on the official Crowfall forums:
Comments
Way too early for me to tell. Things can change a lot from then to now
I self identify as a monkey.
How can you make an MMO for 800k?
"The short answer is: you cant. At least, not a game with the scope of Crowfall. Fortunately, that isnt our plan. We are limiting our scope of Crowfall in two major ways: first, were starting with the core module of the game, not the entire vision of the game, and second, we opted to make a game based primarily on player-interaction instead of linear content which is THE major cost for most MMOs."
basically early access of the entire vision. they will do the "core" first. then if/when they have enough money to continue development they will finish the game.
It lists 5 different campaign rules sets in the project description (found at https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/crowfall/crowfall-throne-war-pc-mmo/description ). Scroll down to the "Changing the Rules" subsection.
Edit: I see what you mean. If that's all the KS includes, I agree that it's a shady way to present.
Yeah I know right... 7000 plus backers and $669,000 already. This will fund in the next few days. It will be interesting to see what the stretch goals will be.
the stretch goals will just be more than just the "core module" at launch. wont they? this KS is said to only be developing 'the dregs' ruleset. 3 faction, 6-12 faction, and guild v guild aren't being funded by the 800k.
I think you're wrong on this. This is what they say about the KS: "Our goal for this Kickstarter is to fund the core module of Crowfall. How many games can you play with a standard deck of cards? Poker, Blackjack, Bridge the variety is endless. Think of the core module like our baseline deck of cards. This is the foundation of the game, on which all the variant rules sets can be built. Much of the core module work has already been done; we are looking to the community to help us finish it. Specifically, we will use these funds to build: The Core Module, Character Creation, World, Combat, Economy, Eternal Kingdoms, Campaign Rules" They even call out specifically what the funds will be used for. Granted, the wording could have been a bit better, but from what I can tell, the funds will be used to create everything they have listed in the Kickstarter project description. The Dregs are just a variant rules set.
you might be right. but under each of those bullet points they specifically list what that entails. under 'campaign rules' only 'the dregs' is listed. it even says what it is. FFA pvp.
It lists 5 different campaign rules sets in the project description (found at https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/crowfall/crowfall-throne-war-pc-mmo/description ). Scroll down to the "Changing the Rules" subsection.
that's where they want it to end up. read the core module part. the part of the game being funded by this KS. it only lists ffa pvp. so, in the future after they get the ffa pvp done. they want to be able to add those other rulesets. but that's not what there working on with the 800k.
You forgot a very key part, Rules. If the rules keep changing, so do peoples strategies. You might find one way to win a campaign, but the same way won't work on another. THis will keep the content fresh.
An Example, if you're doing a raid, your guild find a way to beat the boss, in most games next time you rencounter the boss using the same strats you will down him, but with less hassle, then after a while it becomes second nature and just repetitive. What Crowfall is essentially doing is, every time you defeat and rencounter the boss, he acts very different from before, so the first strat won't work, your team is going to have to come up with a new way of winning.
Think that makes sense lol
Well every single game i pop into Twitch is some sort of pvp,so ya that market is absolutely flooded right now.I would not use the term better ,i do enjoy watching for the entertainment of some streamers but i would not say the pvp in these games is good at all and why i'm watching and not interested in playing.
The little i have seen,there is nothing there that pops out and says play me,i have got MUCH better right now playing a much older FFXI.I do not see a single thing in Crowfall that would make me want to play it,that alone makes me feel like it is simply another same old same old.
I have been striving so badly for an ECO world,instead we have so many games giving us MEANINGLESS worlds,most of the structures are 2d models,again meaningless to the world.I want to see a world where you might kill that flock of sheep then there is no more sheep until next year,i want to see animals/creatures hunting their food chain,i want the world to come alive in a realistic sense.
I want combat to be strategy and calculated,i don't want a solo player running in twirling around 360 degrees taking out 5/6/7 mobs with ease,it looks silly/fake.I want the battles to seem challenging like a real battle should,i don't want to feel like i am fighting 5 Capybara's or rabbits.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
twitch/action combat---------> HECK NO
wow/cartoon /low detail graphics----------> HECK NO
territory reset------------> HECK NO
I concur. It looks to me like a larger pimped out version of WoW's battlegrounds.
Full/partial loot PvP can and has worked when gear isn't as powerful and is readily available from skilled craftsmen.
Worked just fine in UO.
I think it's "hard" in say EvE online because there is such a wealth gap between new and veteran players.
A newer player has zero incentive to risk their 500 million battleship in PvP because taking such a loss would cripple them, where as a veteran with billions of isk can write it off a lot easier.
UO didn't have this problem, for one because gear didn't have tiers, so there really wasn't any "high end" gear - it was all just gear.
And its common rarity made it fairly inexpensive for both noob and veteran to replace.
Sure, you had stuff like a +1 sword or silver weapons etc. but most would only risk using a +1 in PvP if they had a good supply of replacements stored in the bank.
That +1 may have helped you win a 1vs1, but we're talking maybe a 10% advantage, easily overcome by skill and tactics.
What is going to make this game Crowfall sink or swim is motivation and balance. How motivated are players going to be to work together, accept risk, and cooperate, and how balanced is it going to be?
Sure they talk about super-corps taking control of everything and the game becoming stale, but what prevents these titanic groups from just doing the same overpowering tactics each and every reset?
You can't control player's political alliances and desire for min/maxing - if a large enough group decides to work together to dominate the resource game, you can't "force" political upheaval and a fractioning of that group in order to establish balance.
Hopefully the really big/organized guilds are going to focus on the dregs - highest risk + highest reward as they appear to be essentially FFA, but through organization they can conquer.
Hopefully this leaves the Guild vs. Guild and Faction vs. Faction worlds more open to smaller, more balanced conflict and the resets actually create the diverse experience they are aiming for.
EvE has been trying to do this forever by making low sec the place for smaller corps to lay claim and engage in their smaller scale warfare and politics, while leaving null sec to the mega corp(s) to control.
Problem is the mega corps take over all of low sec too... hopefully the control mechanics in place only allow a single group, no matter its size, a limited amount of influence/control across the worlds.
limit the number of participants?
limit access to single campaign
set campaign rule to hinder "mega-corp" (resource waste, if you control too much/too few territory you gain less and less resources for instance so you have a peak at say 42% territory and it drops sharply either way so you WaNT to maintain that peak)
Well yeah, obviously there are "solutions" but what are they actually going to do?
You will also have the alternate viewpoint - why should the game limit or cap size and set limitations, if you're capable of growing and controlling it all and dominating why should the game stop you?
Should we not be rewarded for playing intelligently, forming alliances, and dominating? Why are you punishing success?
etc.
What are they going to do is up in the air
And they say theyll have various campaigns with various rules. One might be limited one might not be. Thats whats interests me the most as theyre not bound to one ruleset for the whole game like EvE, in the light of CF EvE might be considered like just one campaign with that specific ruleset.
Somewhat like Risk, where you draw a card that tells you your goal, but cards are not limited and your goals can be bound just by your imagination. Youre still playing Risk with its core rules, but your gameplay might change drastically depending on your goals. At least thats how i see what theyre aiming for.
Considering the game broke pass its 50% mark on Kickstarter, I think its going to do just fine.
The only issue Crowfall had was the money. People have showed ( and are showing) that they want the product. The dev team is good with good veterans that have made a name for themselves.
Witty & Wicked
Game is almost fully funded in less than 3 days.
Seems like the game is doing great.
You can't even play Crowfall right now, so how can it be better than anything? So, actually, every single PvP MMO out right now is better..
But seriously, are we already calling CF the savior of PvP MMO's or something? Let's give it enough time to fail, can we please?
Exactly. lol
Haters gonna hate though.
Witty & Wicked
Because no game has ever gotten to it's kickstarter goal and failed right?
[mod edit]
Getting kickstarted means nothing. There was a report done that showed only 30% of all crowd funded games release. This is before you get to crowd funded MMOs, to date none have released.
I call it "interesting enough idea worth giving a shot" its not like i have much better options to spend 30$ on right now ;P
I've been working on finding clarification for this. Have yet to get any, but I will update this thread when I do.
Yeah I know right... 7000 plus backers and $669,000 already. This will fund in the next few days. It will be interesting to see what the stretch goals will be.
the stretch goals will just be more than just the "core module" at launch. wont they? this KS is said to only be developing 'the dregs' ruleset. 3 faction, 6-12 faction, and guild v guild aren't being funded by the 800k.
I think you're wrong on this. This is what they say about the KS: "Our goal for this Kickstarter is to fund the core module of Crowfall. How many games can you play with a standard deck of cards? Poker, Blackjack, Bridge the variety is endless. Think of the core module like our baseline deck of cards. This is the foundation of the game, on which all the variant rules sets can be built. Much of the core module work has already been done; we are looking to the community to help us finish it. Specifically, we will use these funds to build: The Core Module, Character Creation, World, Combat, Economy, Eternal Kingdoms, Campaign Rules" They even call out specifically what the funds will be used for. Granted, the wording could have been a bit better, but from what I can tell, the funds will be used to create everything they have listed in the Kickstarter project description. The Dregs are just a variant rules set.
you might be right. but under each of those bullet points they specifically list what that entails. under 'campaign rules' only 'the dregs' is listed. it even says what it is. FFA pvp.
It lists 5 different campaign rules sets in the project description (found at https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/crowfall/crowfall-throne-war-pc-mmo/description ). Scroll down to the "Changing the Rules" subsection.
that's where they want it to end up. read the core module part. the part of the game being funded by this KS. it only lists ffa pvp. so, in the future after they get the ffa pvp done. they want to be able to add those other rulesets. but that's not what there working on with the 800k.
I've been working on finding clarification for this. Have yet to get any, but I will update this thread when I do.
it's either very misleading. or very confusing. maybe we could get a backer to ask them on the KS page for clarification.
Here's a link to the thread on the official Crowfall forums:
http://community.crowfall.com/index.php?/topic/3101-question-about-the-scope-of-the-kickstarter-campaign/
Still no clear answer.
thanks for the link. it doesn't seem like anybody knows. hopefully the devs will notice the thread and give a response.
also apparently developing mounts is quite expensive. almost 1/2 the cost of developing the 'core'.