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AMD VS Intel, CPU, GPU & MB suggestions

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  • AthisarAthisar Member UncommonPosts: 666
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Athisar

    I haven't read through this one, but are we seriously suggesting one stick of RAM over two? While high RAM speeds (e.g. 2400MHz) make no perceptible difference, falling back to 1 channel definitely will.


     

    Yep, dead serious.

    Dual Channel is long lived myth. If you actually check some tests, the performance gain is negligable.

    Gaming and general purpose wise, it is relevant when using IGP only.

    I have checked. I'm sure if you take averages it might only be 5%, and in many cases it will be more or less 0, but when it does affect things it can be a lot more than that.

    http://www.legitreviews.com/images/reviews/1779/3dmark-channel-scaling.jpg

  • RidelynnRidelynn Member EpicPosts: 6,855


    Originally posted by Gdemami
    Originally posted by AthisarI haven't read through this one, but are we seriously suggesting one stick of RAM over two? While high RAM speeds (e.g. 2400MHz) make no perceptible difference, falling back to 1 channel definitely will.

    Yep, dead serious.

    Dual Channel is long lived myth. If you actually check some tests, the performance gain is negligable.

    Gaming and general purpose wise, it is relevant when using IGP only.


    I hate paying less for better performance

  • HulluckHulluck Member UncommonPosts: 830
    Originally posted by Quizzical
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Athisar

    I haven't read through this one, but are we seriously suggesting one stick of RAM over two? While high RAM speeds (e.g. 2400MHz) make no perceptible difference, falling back to 1 channel definitely will.


     

    Yep, dead serious.

    Dual Channel is long lived myth. If you actually check some tests, the performance gain is negligable.

    Gaming and general purpose wise, it is relevant when using IGP only.

    You have two choices:  A and B.  Option A both performs better and is cheaper.  Option B both performs worse and is more expensive.  Which do you choose?  Does it even matter how much more performance and how much cheaper?

    Common sense has left the building. Please step outside with your blasphemy as it is not wanted here. Seek your nearest rehabilitation office and talk to a counselor there and get help. Thank You, have a perfect day.

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 11,813


    Originally posted by Athisar

    I have checked. I'm sure if you take averages it might only be 5%, and in many cases it will be more or less 0, but when it does affect things it can be a lot more than that.http://www.legitreviews.com/images/reviews/1779/3dmark-channel-scaling.jpg

    You are looking at some arbitrary values. There is no implication.

    Sure, synthetic benchmarks will show you large curve in performance but you need to look at real aplications. After all, you are not going to play Futuremark, are you?

  • AthisarAthisar Member UncommonPosts: 666
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Athisar

    I have checked. I'm sure if you take averages it might only be 5%, and in many cases it will be more or less 0, but when it does affect things it can be a lot more than that.

     

    http://www.legitreviews.com/images/reviews/1779/3dmark-channel-scaling.jpg


     

    You are looking at some arbitrary values. There is no implication.

    Sure, synthetic benchmarks will show you large curve in performance but you need to look at real aplications. After all, you are not going to play Futuremark, are you?

    I wouldn't say physics CPU benchmark scores are arbitrary. Just because it goes against your opinion doesn't negate it.

    But real apps, like this?

    http://www.legitreviews.com/images/reviews/1779/x264-channel-scaling.jpg

  • HulluckHulluck Member UncommonPosts: 830
    Originally posted by Ridelynn

     


    Originally posted by Gdemami

    Originally posted by Athisar

     

    I haven't read through this one, but are we seriously suggesting one stick of RAM over two? While high RAM speeds (e.g. 2400MHz) make no perceptible difference, falling back to 1 channel definitely will.


     

    Yep, dead serious.

    Dual Channel is long lived myth. If you actually check some tests, the performance gain is negligable.

    Gaming and general purpose wise, it is relevant when using IGP only.


     

    I hate paying less for better performance

    SILENCE SPAWN OF SATAN!

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 11,813


    Originally posted by Athisar

    I wouldn't say physics CPU benchmark scores are arbitrary.

    They are. How much is score of 150 difference? 2 FPS? 0.4?


    Yes, the impact might be somewhat substantial if you do some specific task - like video editing, but we are building a gaming PC here.

  • AthisarAthisar Member UncommonPosts: 666
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Athisar

    I wouldn't say physics CPU benchmark scores are arbitrary.

     

    They are. How much is score of 150 difference? 2 FPS? 0.4?


    Yes, the impact might be somewhat substantial if you do some specific task - like video editing, but we are building a gaming PC here.

    Ok, so where it provides a noticeable benefit it doesn't count, and when it doesn't provide much of a benefit it does count? You're saying that a 0-20% performance improvement should be ignored when you can instead spend more and have nothing?

  • stevebombsquadstevebombsquad Member UncommonPosts: 884
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Cramit845

    I feel like I should prepare for purchasing one in the next 2-3 years, which makes myself feel, don't go balls to the wall ....      ..... yet...   Thoughts & opinions?

     

    DDR4 is non-factor. In regard to further upgrade, only relevant information is that next intel chips - Broadwell, will be using 97 chipsets and LGA1150 socket.

    Quick i5 rig:

    i5-4460
    Gigabyte H81
    HyperX 8GB module
    Antec 550W
    Seagate 1TB HDD
    PowerColor R290

    668.94 USD Total, no rebates included.

    Add case up to your likehood. Feel free to spent extra for 97 MB if further upgrade is your concern or w/e you wish to adjust to fit your preference and wallet.

    OP...this guy does not have a clue. Whatever you do, don't follow his advice. 

     

    James T. Kirk: All she's got isn't good enough! What else ya got?

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 11,813


    Originally posted by Athisar

    Ok, so where it provides a noticeable benefit it doesn't count, and when it doesn't provide much of a benefit it does count? You're saying that a 0-20% performance improvement should be ignored when you can instead spend more and have nothing?

    If the improvement is on tasks you are not going to perform...or at very, very occasinally at best, nope, no benefit to justify the price/choice there.

  • AthisarAthisar Member UncommonPosts: 666
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Athisar

    Ok, so where it provides a noticeable benefit it doesn't count, and when it doesn't provide much of a benefit it does count? You're saying that a 0-20% performance improvement should be ignored when you can instead spend more and have nothing?

     

    If the improvement is on tasks you are not going to perform...or at very, very occasinally at best, nope, no benefit to justify the price/choice there.

    Since it's cheaper to buy 2x4GB and have a 0-20% performance gain, you're saying it's not worth paying less to get better performance. You realise this makes absolutely no sense to anyone but you?

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 11,813


    Originally posted by Quizzical

    For starters, the power supply is Antec's low end, but doesn't come with a low end price tag.  The video card is refurbished, and thus out of stock and not likely to come back in stock for long.

    Feel free to suggest better PSU for the price, I just haven't seen something I would feel comfortable at the price range.

    Yeah, the card was in stock at the time I was putting it to gether. The card is refurbished, just "opened". I haven't noticed.

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 11,813


    Originally posted by Athisar

    Since it's cheaper to buy 2x4GB and have a 0-20% performance gain, you're saying it's not worth paying less to get better performance. You realise this makes absolutely no sense to anyone but you?

    It does not provide better performance, we already went through this...

    While you pay 10 USD less, you leave no room for later upgrade. It is up to each to decide whether they will need more memory later. Probably not, who knows.

    The thing is, the option is there and I would prefer to provide options rather than remove them.

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 11,813


    Originally posted by Quizzical

    You have two choices:  A and B.  Option A both performs better and is cheaper.

    And that is how the myth about dual channel started - stuffed with marketing until you believe it is true.

  • HulluckHulluck Member UncommonPosts: 830
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Quizzical

    For starters, the power supply is Antec's low end, but doesn't come with a low end price tag.  The video card is refurbished, and thus out of stock and not likely to come back in stock for long.

     

    Feel free to suggest better PSU for the price, I just haven't seen something I would feel comfortable at the price range.

    Yeah, the card was in stock at the time I was putting it to gether. The card is refurbished, just "opened". I haven't noticed.

    You got it all figured out. You've been shooting people down left and right with the stupidest arguments ,insults and bad reasoning. trolling. You want them to now work for you? You all of a sudden had an change of mind?  Open mind even. My last posts reflect how absurd your stances have been, maybe  bit over the top. I'm not trying to get someone to make a $600 purchase that they would regret though unlike you.  

    I dislike people like you. Your like the crappy salesman in Walmart flapping their gums talking people into horrible purchases. People have been telling you most of the thread how flawed your build was and you've done it in others. Now all of a sudden being open to advice?  

     

  • stevebombsquadstevebombsquad Member UncommonPosts: 884
    Originally posted by Hulluck
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Quizzical

    For starters, the power supply is Antec's low end, but doesn't come with a low end price tag.  The video card is refurbished, and thus out of stock and not likely to come back in stock for long.

     

    Feel free to suggest better PSU for the price, I just haven't seen something I would feel comfortable at the price range.

    Yeah, the card was in stock at the time I was putting it to gether. The card is refurbished, just "opened". I haven't noticed.

    You got it all figured out. You've been shooting people down left and right with the stupidest arguments ,insults and bad reasoning. trolling. You want them to now work for you? You all of a sudden had an change of mind?  Open mind even. My last posts reflect how absurd your stances have been, maybe  bit over the top. I'm not trying to get someone to make a $600 purchase that they would regret though unlike you.  

    I dislike people like you. Your like the crappy salesman in Walmart flapping their gums talking people into horrible purchases. People have been telling you most of the thread how flawed your build was and you've done it in others. Now all of a sudden being open to advice?  

     

    The only difference is that his build is bad. He can't seem to figure out that he is the only one that thinks it isn't. He reminds me of the blue-shirted Best Buy sales guy in the computers and tablets area trying to sell crap. Everyone knows what he is saying is bs.....

    James T. Kirk: All she's got isn't good enough! What else ya got?

  • HulluckHulluck Member UncommonPosts: 830
    Originally posted by stevebombsquad
    Originally posted by Hulluck
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Quizzical

    For starters, the power supply is Antec's low end, but doesn't come with a low end price tag.  The video card is refurbished, and thus out of stock and not likely to come back in stock for long.

     

    Feel free to suggest better PSU for the price, I just haven't seen something I would feel comfortable at the price range.

    Yeah, the card was in stock at the time I was putting it to gether. The card is refurbished, just "opened". I haven't noticed.

    You got it all figured out. You've been shooting people down left and right with the stupidest arguments ,insults and bad reasoning. trolling. You want them to now work for you? You all of a sudden had an change of mind?  Open mind even. My last posts reflect how absurd your stances have been, maybe  bit over the top. I'm not trying to get someone to make a $600 purchase that they would regret though unlike you.  

    I dislike people like you. Your like the crappy salesman in Walmart flapping their gums talking people into horrible purchases. People have been telling you most of the thread how flawed your build was and you've done it in others. Now all of a sudden being open to advice?  

     

    The only difference is that his build is bad. He can't seem to figure out that he is the only one that thinks it isn't. He reminds me of the blue-shirted Best Buy sales guy in the computers and tablets area trying to sell crap. Everyone knows what he is saying is bs.....

    Yeah thats a better comparison.   Recently dealt with that. I guess I don't understand why some people are intentionally as thick as a mule. Makes it worse that he seems knowledgeable and intentionally gives poor advice.  Feel sorry for anyone he helps build a PC if the recommendation is like that.  

  • holyneoholyneo Member UncommonPosts: 154

    I used to have a 955 AMD on a crosshair 3 motherboard for years.  I heard for long time not to worry about upgrading my motherboard/cpu, because I wouldn't see any large improvements.  The thread I made on other sites went back and forth between the cpu manu. and made my decision more difficult. 

    What it came down with me was best bang for my buck, because I knew as soon as I upgraded something better would come out.  So this is what I did.

    I got a I7 4770k and Asus Maximus VI Hero.  Now I have always owned AMD CPU my whole life(the 90's). So at the time I could get this system with 30-40 dollars different to what AMD had and used less power.

    I can tell you it was a huge difference from what I had.  I am not going into mass details, but things that was important to me I could really tell.  I then got a 128 ssd (for the OS) and things got even better.  It didn't break the bank as well.  I still used my 7970ghz. videocard, was able to use my ram and power supply as well from the old system.

    That's my 2 cents.

  • jdnewelljdnewell Member UncommonPosts: 2,237

    I think he is just trolling trying to get a response. I even reported him, not that it appears to do any good.

    The advice and reasoning are so bad it must be trolling. I am not even sure why Quiz even argues with him as even when proven wrong he just throws out insults.

    He will end up costing people money with the terrible advice. The mods really should do something.

  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 21,255
    Originally posted by jdnewell

    I think he is just trolling trying to get a response. I even reported him, not that it appears to do any good.

    The advice and reasoning are so bad it must be trolling. I am not even sure why Quiz even argues with him as even when proven wrong he just throws out insults.

    He will end up costing people money with the terrible advice. The mods really should do something.

    A lot of people genuinely are clueless about hardware.  Furthermore, it's entirely possible that the mods could be clueless about hardware and not realize that there's a clear technical right and wrong side here, not just a different of opinion.  As obviously terrible as Gdemami's hardware choices are, they're still better than more than a few prebuilt options that you'd find at Best Buy or Walmart.

  • DarkHighDarkHigh Member UncommonPosts: 149

    Hello OP,

     

     I just wanted to put my two cents in here. I have used every CPU you could imagine in the last few years and build with both AMD and Intel depending on the situation and budget. First rule of thumb if you budget is under $1000.00 for a whole build avoid Intel. The i7 is a beautiful processor but everyone here is right, it costs more to build with. I currently run an FX8150 and it runs great, my wife is running an FX6300 and it's just about equal if not a little faster than my 8150. If you are looking to build on a budget and dont have a CPU preference I would recommend an FX6300. At $99 the 6300 is a champ.

    PSU: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=7850414&CatId=2533

    MB: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1963472&CatId=7244

    CPU: http://www.amazon.com/AMD-FD6300WMHKBOX-FX-6300-Processor-Edition/dp/B009O7YORK/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1418486021&sr=8-1&keywords=fx+6300&pebp=1418486022642

    Memory: 16GB http://www.amazon.com/Kingston-HyperX-FURY-2x8GB-1866MHz/dp/B00J8E910Y/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1418486447&sr=8-1&keywords=Kingston+HyperX+Fury+Blue+16GB

                 OR: 8GB http://www.amazon.com/Kingston-HyperX-FURY-2x8GB-1866MHz/dp/B00J8E910Y/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1418486447&sr=8-1&keywords=Kingston+HyperX+Fury+Blue+16GB

    Video card: http://www.amazon.com/Sapphire-Version-PCI-Express-Graphics-11221-00-20G/dp/B00FLMKNE0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1418486245&sr=8-1&keywords=280x&pebp=1418486245932

    Hard Drive: 2x http://www.amazon.com/Kingston-Digital-2-5-Inch-SV300S37A-120G/dp/B00A1ZTZOG/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1418486284&sr=8-3&keywords=solid+state+drive RAID 0 Configuration (Backup often)

    Case: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00I0MKMG2/ref=ox_sc_act_title_3?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

    Addition case fans: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00F6S0XJO/ref=gno_cart_title_0?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

    Brings total to $949.02

  • jdnewelljdnewell Member UncommonPosts: 2,237
    Originally posted by Quizzical
    Originally posted by jdnewell

    I think he is just trolling trying to get a response. I even reported him, not that it appears to do any good.

    The advice and reasoning are so bad it must be trolling. I am not even sure why Quiz even argues with him as even when proven wrong he just throws out insults.

    He will end up costing people money with the terrible advice. The mods really should do something.

    A lot of people genuinely are clueless about hardware.  Furthermore, it's entirely possible that the mods could be clueless about hardware and not realize that there's a clear technical right and wrong side here, not just a different of opinion.  As obviously terrible as Gdemami's hardware choices are, they're still better than more than a few prebuilt options that you'd find at Best Buy or Walmart.

    Clueless most can handle. Being intentionally argumentative and insulting in every thread should be looked at by the site mods.

    Threads like this one and many others he derails make it difficult for people actually looking for sound advice to get it.

  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 21,255
    Originally posted by DarkHigh

    Hello OP,

     

     I just wanted to put my two cents in here. I have used every CPU you could imagine in the last few years and build with both AMD and Intel depending on the situation and budget. First rule of thumb if you budget is under $1000.00 for a whole build avoid Intel. The i7 is a beautiful processor but everyone here is right, it costs more to build with. I currently run an FX8150 and it runs great, my wife is running an FX6300 and it's just about equal if not a little faster than my 8150. If you are looking to build on a budget and dont have a CPU preference I would recommend an FX6300. At $99 the 6300 is a champ.

    PSU: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=7850414&CatId=2533

    MB: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1963472&CatId=7244

    CPU: http://www.amazon.com/AMD-FD6300WMHKBOX-FX-6300-Processor-Edition/dp/B009O7YORK/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1418486021&sr=8-1&keywords=fx+6300&pebp=1418486022642

    Memory: 16GB http://www.amazon.com/Kingston-HyperX-FURY-2x8GB-1866MHz/dp/B00J8E910Y/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1418486447&sr=8-1&keywords=Kingston+HyperX+Fury+Blue+16GB

                 OR: 8GB http://www.amazon.com/Kingston-HyperX-FURY-2x8GB-1866MHz/dp/B00J8E910Y/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1418486447&sr=8-1&keywords=Kingston+HyperX+Fury+Blue+16GB

    Video card: http://www.amazon.com/Sapphire-Version-PCI-Express-Graphics-11221-00-20G/dp/B00FLMKNE0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1418486245&sr=8-1&keywords=280x&pebp=1418486245932

    Hard Drive: 2x http://www.amazon.com/Kingston-Digital-2-5-Inch-SV300S37A-120G/dp/B00A1ZTZOG/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1418486284&sr=8-3&keywords=solid+state+drive RAID 0 Configuration (Backup often)

    Case: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00I0MKMG2/ref=ox_sc_act_title_3?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

    Addition case fans: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00F6S0XJO/ref=gno_cart_title_0?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

    Brings total to $949.02

    The power supply is a piece of junk, 16 GB of memory is overkill, and RAID 0 is a very, very bad idea for consumer use.  If you need more case fans than a case comes with, the solution is to pick a different case that comes with more fans, not to add $40 in case fans.

    -----

    The reason I haven't posted a build of my own is because the original poster isn't going to buy it yet.  The sensible thing to do is to come back when you're ready to buy parts and ask then.  Price will change in the meantime, and you want parts that are a good deal the day you buy, not that happened to be on sale weeks earlier and are overpriced when you buy.  An FX-8350 for $100 would be a great deal, but exactly the same CPU for $200 would be a terrible choice.

  • DarkHighDarkHigh Member UncommonPosts: 149
    power supply is fine have built with them several times over last few years never had one fail and output is exactly as advertised. raid 0 is a bit much i agree but gotta love that 6 second boot time. 
  • Cramit845Cramit845 Member UncommonPosts: 395

        Well, I am taking everyone's opinions into consideration into what I'm looking at.  Some of the things that Gdemami is saying I can kinda understand but others I don't get because it doesn't go with my experience in building pc's at home and professionally.

    1.)  I would go dual channel in this day and age.  No question

    2.)  I would get a MB with at least 4 DIMM slots for RAM.  I understand his MB only has 2, but I would only do a build like that if I was building a home theater box where space is an issue.

    3.)  The CPU choice seems unremarkable and not sure if I would necessarily spend the money for that, although still doing research on some of the suggested parts from this thread.

     

        At this point I am looking at parts suggestions.  Price is a factor because if I can find a build I really like, I may start purchasing it this week once Christmas shopping is done or I may wait if I am still undecided.  So post a build or not and just suggest specific parts, all of that is fine and much appreciated.

        I am terrible with hardware, currently, as stated above, this weekend is going to be my primary researching point.  I keep finding reasons to keep the build cheaper from my original estimated price tag merely because, like one of the above posters suggested, not having $1000+ to spend on an i7 makes me feel like I'm out of the intel price point.  Now that may not be true with an i5 so still playing with that idea, but haven't read anything stating that any of the other i5's are worth as much as the i5-4690(k) and that definitely pushes me to the brink of my original price tag.  This all makes AMD more attractive and I'm going to be spending the day looking at their processors and trying to get more of a handle on it all.  Hopefully I will also see if there are some other less expensive i5 models that are close to 4690 that may be worth it, which will also allow me to look at that one suggested by Gdemami.

     

    *Edit* - And as someone stated, my next upcoming game will be Albion Online, that is true.  However I want to build a rig that will hopefully at least be able to last till EQ:next comes out and hopefully be able to play that game at least on medium settings if not high.

         I actually already have access to landmark but because I currently have a dual core, I am currently under the minimum specifications.  However, that didn't stop me, but with color errors all over and hitching, it's frustrating and I would like to try it.  Not to mention a good portion of games are requiring quad-core these days so I want to be able to compete.  I enjoy FPS games as well, Heroes & Generals and APB:reloaded currently, but would love to be able to play those and others on higher end settings.  Just so you guys have a good feel of what it's going to be doing.  Alongside the rest I mentioned at the top of the post.

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