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Star Citizen hits 58 million $ in crowdfunding

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  • SeanalexSeanalex Member UncommonPosts: 45
    Originally posted by sgel
    Originally posted by Seanalex
    Originally posted by sgel
    Originally posted by Seanalex

    Squadron 42 is slated for the first 10 missions (Chapter 1) To be released early to mid 2015 with AC 2.0 being pushed along side it. 

    Chapter 1  of SQ42 has been pushed back to end of 2015 as CR stated yesterday

     

    Point 3: "Pay to Win"

    While you may be able to purchase your ships with cash right now in order to generate revenue for development by no means will these ships be purchasable post PU launch. 

    Ben has stated that they will consider selling ships post launch if the community wants them to and we all know what that means.

     

     

    And if you actively read the forums you would know that the community is whole heardedly against the Pay 2 Win model, and the major consensus is that the practice of selling ships after launch should not occur. 

    AC as it is now is P2W. I don't see many people complaining about that. In fact I see quite a few people asking all the time when the next ship sale is or when x variant will go on sale etc 

    Buying ships for real currency has become a cultural thing in SC.

    However I do know the majority of people aren't interested in buying anymore ships with real currency, but there's a lot of people who do on the forums.... and CIG likes to use forum voting for some of their choices.

    I honestly don't see AC as pay to win. You aren't winning anything, you have a better ship sure, but that by no means implies you will win. I own no AC flyable ships, so I use the trainer ships. I flew the F7C last night and it was fun, and I did well but that's because I am a pretty damn good sim pilot. But I did encounter somebody better in a 300i who beat me. I didn't lose because the 300i is a better ship, I lost because its pilot was superior in skill.

    Once I'm able to fly my Constellation Andromeda it probably wont change. If I lack dedicated gunners for my two manned turrets I will lose to anything more maneuverable than me. Again, I wont win because my ship is bigger and better, I will lose because I lacked the crew and skill to outfight my opponent.

    Played - EQ 1/2, WoW, SWG, SWTOR, GW 1/2 UO, STO, CO, DCUO, AO, Rift.

  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,229
    Originally posted by jcrg99

    Its curious how his marketing strategy always involve to put himself as some kind of "hero", as different from anyone else, etc. etc. Heh! Why people compare CR as a televangelist? Why?

    There is no feature beyond of the 20-23 million mark that would justify the need of 3 times this budget. No way. And how that fits with this speech that he needs much more people coming after release, so he really make the development advance further of that milestone, I have no idea.

    About the Guiness Book of Records, good luck trying to find in the registered record, the # of backers, which should be a record for crowdfunded games, even if you considered just the time of the original campaign... curiously, such record was not mentioned, just "the money". I wonder why.

    :D

    http://www.guinnessworldrecords.com/2015/preview/files/assets/basic-html/page17.html

    Maybe because none of the other 13 projects on this page mentions number of backers ? An editorial decision made by an entity outside of CIG's sphere of influence. Just sayin ...

     

    No new feature ... lemme see ...

     

    after the 23 mil mark:

    infinite procedurally generated universe.

    Developing new alien languages a la Klingon and Vulcan with the help of a linguist.

    Independent Arbitrators Guild.

    Web based known universe map  and stellar cartogaphy.

    Observist Guide (Galactipedia on steroids).

    More starter ships.

    Public (interstellar) transport.

     

    and before 23 mill mark:

    Janes Fighting Spaceships.

    player administration of space stations (capture the flag ... errr...space station)

    Battlecruisers

    Overclocking ship systems

    Cryosleep / Hibernation mode

    Big ships CCC

    Behind the scenes (movie length)

     

    And why CR is depicted as something special ? EVER talked to someone from PR ? An organisation needs a single face ...  call em Steve Jobs, call em Bill Gates ... its one of the oldest marketing tricks in the book.

     

    Have fun

  • sgelsgel Member EpicPosts: 2,197
    Originally posted by Seanalex
    Originally posted by sgel
    Originally posted by Seanalex
    Originally posted by sgel
    Originally posted by Seanalex

    Squadron 42 is slated for the first 10 missions (Chapter 1) To be released early to mid 2015 with AC 2.0 being pushed along side it. 

    Chapter 1  of SQ42 has been pushed back to end of 2015 as CR stated yesterday

     

    Point 3: "Pay to Win"

    While you may be able to purchase your ships with cash right now in order to generate revenue for development by no means will these ships be purchasable post PU launch. 

    Ben has stated that they will consider selling ships post launch if the community wants them to and we all know what that means.

     

     

    And if you actively read the forums you would know that the community is whole heardedly against the Pay 2 Win model, and the major consensus is that the practice of selling ships after launch should not occur. 

    AC as it is now is P2W. I don't see many people complaining about that. In fact I see quite a few people asking all the time when the next ship sale is or when x variant will go on sale etc 

    Buying ships for real currency has become a cultural thing in SC.

    However I do know the majority of people aren't interested in buying anymore ships with real currency, but there's a lot of people who do on the forums.... and CIG likes to use forum voting for some of their choices.

    I honestly don't see AC as pay to win. You aren't winning anything, you have a better ship sure, but that by no means implies you will win.

    I'll quote you a post someone made that said it much better than I could say it:

    For clarity, I see there being 2 interpretations of pay to win:

    1. Pay to compete
    2. Pay to progress

    SC is - imo firmly - applying option 1. You have to buy ships to compete in AC etc. Yes you can fly around in the basic ship but you're likely to lose.

    You're kidding yourself if you think there isn't an element of p2w. There are arguments stating that there is no winning in SC...so it can't be p2w. Yes, it can. "win" in this context is not an absolute, it is defined by the player and has a certain fluidity of meaning.

    People can state that you don't *have* to pay in order to get what you want (right now this of course is false). However I'd say that many players are keen to compete with others over a whole host of different aspects of a game. 

    What they have done is implement "pay for advantage". That cannot be denied.

    To my mind "advantage" is only a hairs breadth away from "win".

    ..Cake..

  • SeanalexSeanalex Member UncommonPosts: 45
    Originally posted by sgel
    Originally posted by Seanalex
    Originally posted by sgel
    Originally posted by Seanalex
    Originally posted by sgel
    Originally posted by Seanalex

    Squadron 42 is slated for the first 10 missions (Chapter 1) To be released early to mid 2015 with AC 2.0 being pushed along side it. 

    Chapter 1  of SQ42 has been pushed back to end of 2015 as CR stated yesterday

     

    Point 3: "Pay to Win"

    While you may be able to purchase your ships with cash right now in order to generate revenue for development by no means will these ships be purchasable post PU launch. 

    Ben has stated that they will consider selling ships post launch if the community wants them to and we all know what that means.

     

     

    And if you actively read the forums you would know that the community is whole heardedly against the Pay 2 Win model, and the major consensus is that the practice of selling ships after launch should not occur. 

    AC as it is now is P2W. I don't see many people complaining about that. In fact I see quite a few people asking all the time when the next ship sale is or when x variant will go on sale etc 

    Buying ships for real currency has become a cultural thing in SC.

    However I do know the majority of people aren't interested in buying anymore ships with real currency, but there's a lot of people who do on the forums.... and CIG likes to use forum voting for some of their choices.

    I honestly don't see AC as pay to win. You aren't winning anything, you have a better ship sure, but that by no means implies you will win.

    I'll quote you a post someone made that said it much better than I could say it:

    For clarity, I see there being 2 interpretations of pay to win:

    1. Pay to compete
    2. Pay to progress

    SC is - imo firmly - applying option 1. You have to buy ships to compete in AC etc. Yes you can fly around in the basic ship but you're likely to lose.

    You're kidding yourself if you think there isn't an element of p2w. There are arguments stating that there is no winning in SC...so it can't be p2w. Yes, it can. "win" in this context is not an absolute, it is defined by the player and has a certain fluidity of meaning.

    People can state that you don't *have* to pay in order to get what you want (right now this of course is false). However I'd say that many players are keen to compete with others over a whole host of different aspects of a game. 

    What they have done is implement "pay for advantage". That cannot be denied.

    To my mind "advantage" is only a hairs breadth away from "win".

    The problem is that while you may have "Advantage" in the AC It's simply for bragging rights at this time. These "Advantages" wont be purchasable with your wallet in the full release, and that's where things are important. I really don't want to argue the semantics of a pre-alpha tiny module compared to the entire breadth and scope of the final product.

    Played - EQ 1/2, WoW, SWG, SWTOR, GW 1/2 UO, STO, CO, DCUO, AO, Rift.

  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,229

    Winning AC PvP in an Aurora is like knife kills in shooter games ... very satisfying.

    You dont need to P2W in Arena Commander - just FLY better and SHOOT better ;-)

  • sgelsgel Member EpicPosts: 2,197
    Originally posted by Erillion

    You dont need to P2W in Arena Commander - just FLY better and SHOOT better ;-)

    Good luck doing that against an M50.

    AC isn't balanced right now.. even the devs has admitted it.

    Please don't try and pass it as a skill/aim problem.

    ..Cake..

  • sgelsgel Member EpicPosts: 2,197
    Originally posted by Seanalex
    Originally posted by sgel
    Originally posted by Seanalex
    Originally posted by sgel
    Originally posted by Seanalex
    Originally posted by sgel
    Originally posted by Seanalex

    Squadron 42 is slated for the first 10 missions (Chapter 1) To be released early to mid 2015 with AC 2.0 being pushed along side it. 

    Chapter 1  of SQ42 has been pushed back to end of 2015 as CR stated yesterday

     

    Point 3: "Pay to Win"

    While you may be able to purchase your ships with cash right now in order to generate revenue for development by no means will these ships be purchasable post PU launch. 

    Ben has stated that they will consider selling ships post launch if the community wants them to and we all know what that means.

     

     

    And if you actively read the forums you would know that the community is whole heardedly against the Pay 2 Win model, and the major consensus is that the practice of selling ships after launch should not occur. 

    AC as it is now is P2W. I don't see many people complaining about that. In fact I see quite a few people asking all the time when the next ship sale is or when x variant will go on sale etc 

    Buying ships for real currency has become a cultural thing in SC.

    However I do know the majority of people aren't interested in buying anymore ships with real currency, but there's a lot of people who do on the forums.... and CIG likes to use forum voting for some of their choices.

    I honestly don't see AC as pay to win. You aren't winning anything, you have a better ship sure, but that by no means implies you will win.

    I'll quote you a post someone made that said it much better than I could say it:

    For clarity, I see there being 2 interpretations of pay to win:

    1. Pay to compete
    2. Pay to progress

    SC is - imo firmly - applying option 1. You have to buy ships to compete in AC etc. Yes you can fly around in the basic ship but you're likely to lose.

    You're kidding yourself if you think there isn't an element of p2w. There are arguments stating that there is no winning in SC...so it can't be p2w. Yes, it can. "win" in this context is not an absolute, it is defined by the player and has a certain fluidity of meaning.

    People can state that you don't *have* to pay in order to get what you want (right now this of course is false). However I'd say that many players are keen to compete with others over a whole host of different aspects of a game. 

    What they have done is implement "pay for advantage". That cannot be denied.

    To my mind "advantage" is only a hairs breadth away from "win".

    The problem is that while you may have "Advantage" in the AC It's simply for bragging rights at this time. These "Advantages" wont be purchasable with your wallet in the full release, and that's where things are important. I really don't want to argue the semantics of a pre-alpha tiny module compared to the entire breadth and scope of the final product.

    Yes you will be able to purchase "advantages" in the final game. You'll be able to purchase in-game credits and possibly ships. Do you really think RSI will suddenly abandon their whole momentary philoshophy?

    ..Cake..

  • BigdaddyxBigdaddyx Member UncommonPosts: 2,039
    Looks like this crowd funding thing has really made many people hate this game even before it had a chance to go in playable beta. Which makes me wonder why only SC? it is not the only one using crowd funding.
  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,229
    Originally posted by sgel
    Good luck doing that against an M50.
    --> Been there, done that  (as a subscriber i can test any available ship i want)

    AC isn't balanced right now.. even the devs has admitted it.

    --> Agreed. New balance pass announced for end of next week.

    Please don't try and pass it as a skill/aim problem.

    --> A good pilot will most often win against a bad pilot, no matter the ships they are flying.

    --> You cant kill what you cant see/hit.

    --> Have fun

     

  • HrimnirHrimnir Member RarePosts: 2,413

    This thread is literally amazing.  Usually i don't read every post in a thread, but this one i have.   I gotta say i can't even wrap my head around the level of hatred the people posting against this game or chris roberts.  What is with all the hate.  I understand the EA hate, or the ubisoft hate, etc etc.  Those companies and people in those companies have actually done something bad against you.  So far this thread has amounted to a bunch of people spewing over a game that hasn't come out, because the company/ceo POSSSIBLY might not deliver on their promises.

    Why not wait until something concrete happens and then not only will you get to say "I told you so", but you'll have actual evidence for your claims.

    Until then, isn't your time better spent doing something else?

    "The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."

    - Friedrich Nietzsche

  • sgelsgel Member EpicPosts: 2,197
    Originally posted by Erillion
    Originally posted by sgel
    Good luck doing that against an M50.
    --> Been there, done that  (as a subscriber i can test any available ship i want)
    Are you saying that a good pilot in a aurora can consistently win against a good pilot in an M50 with current balancing? Also all pledgers can test any ships they want, not just subscribers. I think that ends in the next few days or so?

    --> A good pilot will most often win against a bad pilot, no matter the ships they are flying.

    What about two good pilots, one flying a aurora and the other flying an M50?

    --> You cant kill what you cant see/hit.

    I'm not sure why you would say that in a game where you can "turret". It's not very hard to not see your target with the fast turn rates.

     

    ..Cake..

  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,229
    Originally posted by sgel

    Yes you will be able to purchase "advantages" in the final game.

    You'll be able to purchase in-game credits and possibly ships. Do you really think RSI will suddenly abandon their whole momentary philoshophy?

    Source for the information ? [mod edit]

     

    The official position is :

    "At this time you can buy a variety of ship upgrades and decorative hangar items with UEC. These items have been selected because they will be available in this same ‘mail order’ fashion in the finished game. You can not purchase items which would not be available everywhere in the game universe, such as add on ships, or items which are not part of the Star Citizen universe, like t-shirts or game packages."

    https://robertsspaceindustries.com/faq/united-earth-credits

     

    [mod edit]

  • sgelsgel Member EpicPosts: 2,197
    Originally posted by Erillion
    Originally posted by sgel

    Yes you will be able to purchase "advantages" in the final game.

    You'll be able to purchase in-game credits and possibly ships. Do you really think RSI will suddenly abandon their whole momentary philoshophy?

    Source for the information ? 

    [mod edit]

    Ben mentioned it in an interview. He said they would consider selling ships if the community wanted it.

    As far as I know there hasn't been an official poll and neither will there be one for a very long time (since we're very far off release), so no idea where you saw people voting down the idea.

    I will dig up the quote if you make it worthwhile for the conversation and acknowledge you were wrong.

     

    ..Cake..

  • sgelsgel Member EpicPosts: 2,197
    [mod edit]

    ..Cake..

  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,229

    So .. i listened to the podcast ... are we hearing two different things ?

    When the listener asked him about in game advertising boards, he said  (paraphrased, not verbatim) 

    "... there were not many requests for buying ships with real world cash..",  

    "... we are thinking about allowing sale of ships in game with in game cash via ad boards at jump points ..." 

    ".. you can buy in game credits with real world money .."   -->  see my post earlier, no ships buyable that way according to   

                                                                                                                  current plans (with link and quote) , ship upgrades you can buy

     

    So ... WHERE did you hear him stating an official plan to sell ships in game for real world cash ??!?!

    [mod edit]

  • sgelsgel Member EpicPosts: 2,197
    Originally posted by Erillion

     

    So ... WHERE did you hear him stating an official plan to sell ships in game for real world cash ??!?!

    Please go back and read what I wrote. It shouldn't be too hard.

    ..Cake..

  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,229
    Originally posted by sgel
    Originally posted by Erillion

     

    So ... WHERE did you hear him stating an official plan to sell ships in game for real world cash ??!?!

    Please go back and read what I wrote. It shouldn't be too hard.

    He stated in the podcast the there was little interest from the community for that (".. not many requests ..") and that matches what i see on the SC forums ....

    [mod edit]

  • sgelsgel Member EpicPosts: 2,197
    Originally posted by Erillion
    Originally posted by sgel
    Originally posted by Erillion

     

    So ... WHERE did you hear him stating an official plan to sell ships in game for real world cash ??!?!

    Please go back and read what I wrote. It shouldn't be too hard.

    He stated in the podcast the there was little interest from the community for that (".. not many requests ..") and that matches what i see on the SC forums ....

    So ... your point is ? 

    If you're just going to twist words and ignore what people actually say, then there is not point conversing with you.

    READ what I wrote about the comment Ben made, then listen to what Ben says. You will find it's the same thing.

    ..Cake..

  • sgelsgel Member EpicPosts: 2,197
    Originally posted by Erillion
    Originally posted by sgel

    If you're just going to twist words and ignore what people actually say, then there is not point conversing with you.

    READ what I wrote about the comment Ben made, then listen to what Ben says. You will find it's the same thing.

    He says they consider it if the community wants it. And then he immediately says there where not many requests by the community for that. So the community does not want it. Which matches what I see on the SC forum.

    I listened to what Ben said.

    I saw what you typed.

    So ... your point is ?

     

    [mod edit]

    I'm not going to continue because this is getting embarrassing.

    If we can't agree to what you can actually hear, then one of us is lying.

    You told me I was making things up. I wasn't and the link is there to prove it.

    ..Cake..

  • JonBonJawaJonBonJawa Member UncommonPosts: 489
    Originally posted by Erillion
    Originally posted by sgel

    Yes you will be able to purchase "advantages" in the final game.

    You'll be able to purchase in-game credits and possibly ships. Do you really think RSI will suddenly abandon their whole momentary philoshophy?

    Source for the information ? 

    [mod edit]

    The official position is :

    "At this time you can buy a variety of ship upgrades and decorative hangar items with UEC. These items have been selected because they will be available in this same ‘mail order’ fashion in the finished game. You can not purchase items which would not be available everywhere in the game universe, such as add on ships, or items which are not part of the Star Citizen universe, like t-shirts or game packages."

    https://robertsspaceindustries.com/faq/united-earth-credits

     

    [mod edit]

    very true, very true.

    btw did you get the free 10.000 UEC too as extra surprise goodie for reaching the last stretch goal?

    Awesome, Got a poster from the ingame currency story voyager direct, plus .. the GREYCAT BUGGY.

    I guess some people don't realy grasp the concept of an ingame store, where you can buy stuff, with ingame credits, you will earn.. you guessed it.. ingame.

     

  • jcrg99jcrg99 Member UncommonPosts: 723
    Originally posted by Seanalex

    Sigh.. I didn't want to have to type a wall of text, but the vitriol and hatred in this thread is mind boggling.

     

    Point 1: Funding.

    During the initial Kickstarter campaign, which ran alongside their own sites crowd funding program CR Stated, clear as day that the money being raised was to show potential venture capitalist investors that there was interest in this genre, and this game. The minimum amount he needed was roughly $25,000,000 to create just Squadron 42 with publisher support (This doesn't include the expanded scope of just Squadron 42, which has expanded from I believe 20 Missions to 40 now). I see. So, you basically decided to end all the "vitriol and hatred in this thread" with false information, more deception. So, better than your own deceptive information, is the actual information to prove you wrong: 

    https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/cig/star-citizen
    https://robertsspaceindustries.com/funding-goals

     As you can see in the first link, the description of the game includes SQ 42 and a PU. The second link shows to you more clearly than described in that original description (that was the content/description of the main RSI website too in that time), that below the 6 million dollars mark was SQ 42 with all this missions + all the more meaningful additions that its going to be implemented on this game. For that content CR stated, when was targeting to get 20-23 million dollars, that his game would cost that. He mentioned, clear as a day, that all the additions made later are a-) not set in stone for the day 1; b-) unlocks... reveals, not "additions", in other words in respect to the backers making possible a new million mark, things are "revealed", not "added"... they would be made anyway. And he also made clear as day, that he would deliver the full game in 2 years IF and ONLY IF, the HIGHER stretch goals were achieved (And stretch goals does not add just money, they also added features, also meant that the game+Sg feature would be made in the same period). 

     

    Point 2: Release Dates.

    While deadlines were pushed back as things expanded Are they? So, the fact that when things are pushed back, such thing implies more time to sell ships seasonaly, exclusively acquired by real money, is just a happy coincidence? I am curious. Didn't CR said, clear as day, that the additions are not for the day 1? 

    Squadron 42 is slated for the first 10 missions (Chapter 1) To be released early to mid 2015 with AC 2.0 being pushed along side it. The social module is on the board for release in 2015. The end of 2015 marks the release of the Persistent Universe Alpha. We're talking Q1/2/3/4. Not exact dates, not exact months but fiscal quarters of the year. More deception or are you misinformed (I am dealing for a long time with most of these fans to have serious doubts about they been 'misinformed').  The first chapter of SQ42 is targeted for about the end of 2015. Erin Roberts also told that this is a "hope". Knowing CR estimates now, you should have learned that would be a surprise to see it before 2016. Despite all the "parallel" development - a tale - the team of Foundry 42 was split, where it's clear that the minor team is working on SQ42 and the majority working for "preparation for shows", and AC stuff (even they reports, when you look to them analytically, show a almost zero focus on SQ42, with 90% of talking about conceptualization, what we prepared for shows, etc). 2014 ended without almost zero use of Mocap Studio for example for SQ42 cinematics for example, just used for "ship comercials" in general. It's undeniable that SQ42 would make more difficult to CIG to "sell ships". It adds a level of competition to the interest of the backers in "buying more concepts", or "ships" for AC, while having all the SQ42 missions and stuff to "explore". In other words, it's clear as day, that as more they delay the SQ42 release, more time they will have again, to make more marketing to sell more ships seasonally. Or maybe its again, just another happy coincidence. You know. As more meaningful things are delayed, as more just 1% of the promised game is there, hampering  the in-game experience of people UNLESS they pay more and buy those ships exclusively by real money, so they actually start to have "some fun" earlier, as CR told that was objective (not just testing), more they make money. Lucky guy. It can be on purpose. He is just lucky. :D

            

    Point 3: "Pay to Win"

    While you may be able to purchase your ships with cash right now in order to generate revenue for development by no means will these ships be purchasable post PU launch. For the naysayers who claim "lifetime insurance means it will always be replaces" False, Insurance values are determined by the relative safety the system your ship was lost in. If you take your lifetime insurance ship into a Threat level 5 System your insurance will not cover the loss. That ship will be gone unless you paid a substantially higher premium to cover more dangerous situations. The only purchasable things post launch will be vanity items and a limited number of in game currency with purchase caps as to subsidize those who cannot play as much and thus have a lower in game stream of money. So.., basically the motto of the fans is: "if its good for the marketing, make it sound as set in stone and it cannot change, if its bad for the marketing, say that everything is subject to change". Yes. I have been noticing this common behavior. It's a pretty standard attitude of all people that defend this game. They almost seem like "trained".

    They even are already showing to be opened to the possibility to keep sales of ships after release. They already broke many promises for the sake of more money, so why they shouldn't break the promise for the sake of the most important thing that make them with all this money? Why? When its much easier to convince people by writing some poetry in some letters? 

    Unfortunately, at this case, it's hard to believe that they will stop to do what they have been doing, after getting used with the level of income that they have been, that they would dismiss this possibility to continue to sell ships after release, when they already are saying, from time to time, about rocks and papers/whatever, and throwing excuses. There is not really too much difference in selling 1000 ships earlier and none after release. The issue is there anyway. No reason to suddenly to stop to sell ships and "the issues is solved". Just for your selfish thoughts you want CR to dismiss people from their jobs!!! Don't be so bad!

    :D

    I am pretty sure, by analysing the behavior of both community and CR, that as soon as the PU is alive, some people will start to drop more arguments to show how "not pay to win" the pu is, more talking about rocks and scissors and papers, and some CR letters encouraging people of how selling ships has no impact in the game and how its good to keep all the employees, to keep things going "fast" as he has been doing, and "brought to earlier" (heh, I made a facepalm all the time that he says that is bringing things to  "earlier"), and keeping people in the job, and the community is so good that they should understand that it goes beyond the "game" needs, and blablabla (despite ending in a p2w party anyway, despite he already having 100 million dollars, with more than half of that still in his banking account, after all, even today those people is capable to say that "AC is not pay-to-win" with some seriously forced arguments, or say that despite been 3 times above the budget, "he still needs more money otherwise...").

    Then, all the people will have their "hearts touched" (seriously, I won't doubt, many are going to even cry, heh) by the CR "honest pretty" message, and after that, they will all jump in the throats of the naysayers/trolls that won't swallow that and will show their rage in the CIG forums about keeping ships been sold, all them swallowed by an avalanche of fans jumping in their throats and saying how "haters" and "ignorant" etc, they are, followed by a ban hammer of the moderators, in case you dare to reply them, showing the own earlier speech of CR, and how his attitude goes totally against with the idea that he sold to you and make you buy/support the game for that long time.

    They will call you them, selfish, ignorant, entitled and all the things that comes always, all the time that CR break a promise and make his letters to "justify" - quotes in purpose - which usually, such answers, if given in a meeting to a publisher, the publisher, not so easily deceived by poetry, would look to CR with the open mouth and would say: "Are you joking?". But for fanatic reasons, people accepts as the ultimate true. 

    Funny fact is that it just will serve to keep them making additional money for a while. Just to increase even more their profits. The PU will end dead soon anyway. And the reason is competition. Competition of other games. Competition of the OWN Game ... Private Servers, which I have no doubt, will take longer and longer and longer to be delivered, just adding this another happy coincidence that make this company to gather a little more profit meanwhile. Again, it probably will be just another coincidence. The guy that all the time transforms a train wreck situation in profit... by coincidence. Isn't he lucky? 

  • jcrg99jcrg99 Member UncommonPosts: 723
    Originally posted by sgel
    Originally posted by Erillion
    Originally posted by sgel

    If you're just going to twist words and ignore what people actually say, then there is not point conversing with you.

    READ what I wrote about the comment Ben made, then listen to what Ben says. You will find it's the same thing.

    He says they consider it if the community wants it. And then he immediately says there where not many requests by the community for that. So the community does not want it. Which matches what I see on the SC forum.

    I listened to what Ben said.

    I saw what you typed.

    So ... your point is ?

     

    [mod edit]

    I'm not going to continue because this is getting embarrassing.

    If we can't agree to what you can actually hear, then one of us is lying.

    You told me I was making things up. I wasn't and the link is there to prove it.

    Ben Lesnick confirmed that it would depend of a community choice so that they continue to sell ships after release. They are opened to that possibility. Not just in that interview. He actually posted that in some thread. Almost impossible to find now. But I remember.

    Obviously, this is a subject that they are not willing to discuss now, or bring it too much for the community's attention, because its not the right time to try to "convince" them. They have the intention to show, as more "game" be released, that the "pay-to-win" issues are not really an issue (even that they end to be, but they just needs more arguments in-game that they currently have today to add to their marketing campaign, always not faced by the "community" as a marketing campaign obviously, to convince them to vote "YES, CIG can continue to sell ships after release").

    In any case, if the wish of all these guys became true and "millions of people" came after release, or even a few thousands, the laters will be a huge majority stuck to a poor head start, making too much difficult to catch-up those Lords of the Universe and their armadas. CR won't need to make any additional effort to "convince", or even manipulate the poll.

    "Limited Credits" won't help too much those newbies and quickly will become obsolete for the new players, because they won't really make too much difference for them, and will make more difference for who already have their armadas, way ahead of anyone else, and their orgs too, and having the possibility to buy the credits too.

    It's not difficult to imagine, even without a single word of CR, if all this people REALLY came, for REAL, they voting in such poll that CR will put to the community (no doubt he will put, after all, "jobs will depend of that", but he wants to give the decision for his "so mature" community, heh), and electing to keep the ship sales going on. The huge majority will be the latest, after all, right?

    Heh.

  • jcrg99jcrg99 Member UncommonPosts: 723
    Originally posted by Erillion
    Originally posted by sgel

    Yes you will be able to purchase "advantages" in the final game.

    You'll be able to purchase in-game credits and possibly ships. Do you really think RSI will suddenly abandon their whole momentary philoshophy?

    Source for the information ? [mod edit]

    Ideas have been discussed ... and voted down overwhelmingly.  Forum community consensus that i have observed:          NO ships for cash in persistent universe.

    [mod edit]

     

    He used the word "possibly". Everything is subject to change, right?

    Or, maybe you can bring this ultimate quote of CR saying clearly that in no way, never ever, he will sell ships after release?

    Now, talking about "possibilities" chances are huge that they will sell ships after release, and a member of staff saying that it will depend of a community choice, almost like make you have a certainty that they will, because

    1, they can manipulate the poll,

    2, they can manipulate opinions and endoctrinate people along the time (and they have a long time for that),

    3, just a pretty letter touching in your heart as saying that "jobs depend on that and the PU continuing to grow 'quickly'" and half of the fans will forget their "selfish" wishes,

    4, if you believe in their numbers and this trend of success, more people will come after release and would not be difficult to imagine in what option that they would vote... majority wins, right?

    Individual deals do not matter if its to bring more people and more money to their cause. That has been their attitude and I do not see any reason that they would suddenly change because breaking the deal, breaking that promise that for you important, a decision maker to pledge, would be more important that the promises already broken that were decision makers for other people.

    Why would you think that you would be this special snow-flake that CR would refuse to break a promise that is important to you or a few between a huge majority of phantoms, when he had no problem to break other promises, when the matter is getting more and more money?

     

  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,229

    Ben was answering a question from one of the listeners, NOT making an official statement. He stated that ships sales would be a possibility, but also stated immediately afterwards that there were not many requests from the community to do that.

    So ... in game ship sales with out of game money ... NOT an official plan of RSI.

    At most you can buy ship upgrades with UE-Credits (and UEC can be bought with real world money up to a very limited degree ... 150.000 ... as one buggy costs  15 k UEC, i expect spaceship prices to be way higher than that .... so as you are limited to 150 k UEC you most probably wont have enough in game cash for a ship anyway as a Day 1 backer at game start).

    [mod edit]

  • jcrg99jcrg99 Member UncommonPosts: 723
    Originally posted by MoreOfTheSame
    I guess some people don't realy grasp the concept of an ingame store, where you can buy stuff, with ingame credits, you will earn.. you guessed it.. ingame.

     

    I guess that some people did not figure out the difference of a promise made of about 6 months waiting for a release to be able to "earn" ships and wait of 3 more years (seriously optimistic) for that instead.

    Like the "cosmetics" and "weapons" was what mattered more in this game, not the ships.

This discussion has been closed.