What lesson are developers going to learn from Destiny?

TheLizardbones

Destiny sold $325 million dollars worth of product in 5 days, and it's thought that they sold that product to 5 million people at an average price of $65.  This is not as good as Grand Theft Auto V, the best selling game ever, and not as good as an established franchise like Call of Duty, but it's respectable.

 

Especially in the realm of MMORPGs.  It is ridiculously successful in fact.  They are going to blow past their $500 million investment in the first month and be rolling in money over the coming year.  Developers are going to take notice of this, but what lessons are they going to learn?

 

Will it be that MMORPGs should be on consoles?  Will it be that Shooters are the future?  Could it be just that there needs to be single player content in MMORPGs and that whole shared world thing is a waste of time?  What will the lessons be?

 

Me personally, I have no idea.  There's no telling what they'll learn from this.

 

**

 

There is another thread along very similar lines here:

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/6467752#6467752

That one was posted first so check it out.

hunt55511

To me, it seems that what developers will learn from Destiny is the following:

1) Name recognition means a lot. Many of the problems Destiny has are simply being ignored "Because Bungie".

2) Incomplete games are okay if you promise to complete them...for a price.

3) Customer service means nothing as long as you have name recognition (Note: Day 3 of many people being stuck out of game, including myself, after the DDOS attack with absolutely no word from Bungie at all).

4) People like to grind. Really.

nariusseldon

Not to make MMOs?

evilized

hype a game

 

make billions

 

cut and run SUCKERS

laserit

Too early to call...

 

But I hope they learn what not to do

[Deleted User]

The user and all related content has been deleted.

OhhPaigey

Originally posted by evilized

hype a game

 

make billions

 

cut and run SUCKERS

OhhPaigey

Originally posted by Mtibbs1989
What did Bungie do wrong again? They said time and time again that their game was not an MMO and people still labeled it as one. It's even in their FAQ. People who were let down on this title are to blame, not the developer. However if the game it self isn't what was really offered, then that falls on Bungie.

If it isn't an MMO then that's even worse, the game is based on end game grinding for gear & rep, exactly like MMOs, developers said the game doesn't start until max level, where you raid and grind for gear, just like MMOs, you have to pay to play online, just like traditional MMOs.

The game is either a failed MMO because it has 0 trading 0 voice chat, current game modes hold a 3-6 player party, there's no trading, auction house, loading invites to groups take forever because it's not done in-game, there's proximity based voice chat in parties which is horrible.

Or the game is a failed non-MMO with a horrible short story designed to sell DLC later and with wanna be MMO elements.

Battlerock

Hopefully - they learn what not to do - if every game launched like that i would just quit. The game is mediocre yet presented as the best thing since sliced bread. It's a dissapointment.

[Deleted User]

The user and all related content has been deleted.

OhhPaigey

Originally posted by Mtibbs1989

Originally posted by OhhPaigey

Originally posted by Mtibbs1989
What did Bungie do wrong again? They said time and time again that their game was not an MMO and people still labeled it as one. It's even in their FAQ. People who were let down on this title are to blame, not the developer. However if the game it self isn't what was really offered, then that falls on Bungie.

If it isn't an MMO then that's even worse, the game is based on end game grinding for gear & rep, exactly like MMOs, developers said the game doesn't start until max level, where you raid and grind for gear, just like MMOs, you have to pay to play online, just like traditional MMOs.

The game is either a failed MMO because it has 0 trading 0 voice chat, current game modes hold a 3-6 player party, there's no trading, auction house, loading invites to groups take forever because it's not done in-game, there's proximity based voice chat in parties which is horrible.

Or the game is a failed non-MMO with a horrible short story designed to sell DLC later and with wanna be MMO elements.

What's so bad about grind again, Hack and Slash games follow this same strategy and they're not MMOs.

Nothing is wrong with grind, it's just the main recipe for MMOs.

Comparing this to hack and slash is completely different, you don't have raids in those, you aren't required to party up to do strike missions & raid to find gear, you don't have to pay per month for access to those strike and raid missions, a lot of hack and slash games are completely F2P now.

The difference between the two is one doesn't require a monthly fee, or require a team to play & get gear with.

Hack and slash games are done properly. Destiny wasn't.

Lurv

What have the devs learned?

 

Gamers are never happy and if you ask any gamer what game is the most perfect MMO for them, the real answer is none because gamers will always find something about a game that turns them off. Why can't people just enjoy the games or move on to another one?

Peer_Gynt

Originally posted by lizardbones

Destiny sold $325 million dollars worth of product in 5 days, and it's thought that they sold that product to 5 million people at an average price of $65.  This is not as good as Grand Theft Auto V, the best selling game ever, and not as good as an established franchise like Call of Duty, but it's respectable.

 

Especially in the realm of MMORPGs.  It is ridiculously successful in fact.  They are going to blow past their $500 million investment in the first month and be rolling in money over the coming year.  Developers are going to take notice of this, but what lessons are they going to learn?

 

Will it be that MMORPGs should be on consoles?  Will it be that Shooters are the future?  Could it be just that there needs to be single player content in MMORPGs and that whole shared world thing is a waste of time?  What will the lessons be?

 

Me personally, I have no idea.  There's no telling what they'll learn from this.

 

I think they'll learn you can throw any old shit in a box, slap on the name of a well known dev team, combine it with an advertizing blitz and push a ludicrous about of units sight unseen. I feel Destiny is an adequate game, just that, nothing special. I agree with Angry Joe that the game feels scanty as if content has intentionally been held back to sell at a later date. I fear that other developers will per usual only see the dollar signs surrounding this title and pull similar shenanigans and release games with even less content. Which sadly many gamers will buy without first doing proper research and be massively disappointed.

"Take the Hype Train to nowhere and I'll meet you at the station..."

MadFrenchie

As I've said in other threads, they'll learn:

Timing is everything. Market the shit outta a game with familiar names backing it in a console generation drought, and a solid game will sell like it reinvented the wheel.

Bresha

Originally posted by Peer_Gynt

Originally posted by lizardbones

Destiny sold $325 million dollars worth of product in 5 days, and it's thought that they sold that product to 5 million people at an average price of $65.  This is not as good as Grand Theft Auto V, the best selling game ever, and not as good as an established franchise like Call of Duty, but it's respectable.

 

Especially in the realm of MMORPGs.  It is ridiculously successful in fact.  They are going to blow past their $500 million investment in the first month and be rolling in money over the coming year.  Developers are going to take notice of this, but what lessons are they going to learn?

 

Will it be that MMORPGs should be on consoles?  Will it be that Shooters are the future?  Could it be just that there needs to be single player content in MMORPGs and that whole shared world thing is a waste of time?  What will the lessons be?

 

Me personally, I have no idea.  There's no telling what they'll learn from this.

 

I think they'll learn you can throw any old shit in a box, slap on the name of a well known dev team, combine it with an advertizing blitz and push a ludicrous about of units sight unseen. I feel Destiny is an adequate game, just that, nothing special. I agree with Angry Bob that the game feels scanty as if content has intentionally been held back to sell at a later date. I fear that other developers will per usual only see the dollar signs surrounding this title and pull similar shenanigans and release games with even less content. Which sadly many gamers will buy without first doing proper research and be massively disappointed.

"Take the Hype Train to nowhere and I'll meet you at the station..."

Well in Destiny's case,players werent really allowed to do any research because no review was allowed to be released until the day the game released.Which tells me that Bungie/Activision knew this game was going to catch flak and the only way they could make the most money possible was to build the hype and keep any negative talk about the product at bay until the money was in their bank.

FelixMajor

Originally posted by evilized

hype a game

 

make billions

 

cut and run SUCKERS

Yep!

Distopia

Originally posted by OhhPaigey

Originally posted by Mtibbs1989

Originally posted by OhhPaigey

Originally posted by Mtibbs1989
What did Bungie do wrong again? They said time and time again that their game was not an MMO and people still labeled it as one. It's even in their FAQ. People who were let down on this title are to blame, not the developer. However if the game it self isn't what was really offered, then that falls on Bungie.

If it isn't an MMO then that's even worse, the game is based on end game grinding for gear & rep, exactly like MMOs, developers said the game doesn't start until max level, where you raid and grind for gear, just like MMOs, you have to pay to play online, just like traditional MMOs.

The game is either a failed MMO because it has 0 trading 0 voice chat, current game modes hold a 3-6 player party, there's no trading, auction house, loading invites to groups take forever because it's not done in-game, there's proximity based voice chat in parties which is horrible.

Or the game is a failed non-MMO with a horrible short story designed to sell DLC later and with wanna be MMO elements.

What's so bad about grind again, Hack and Slash games follow this same strategy and they're not MMOs.

Nothing is wrong with grind, it's just the main recipe for MMOs.

Comparing this to hack and slash is completely different, you don't have raids in those, you aren't required to party up to do strike missions & raid to find gear, you don't have to pay per month for access to those strike and raid missions, a lot of hack and slash games are completely F2P now.

The difference between the two is one doesn't require a monthly fee, or require a team to play & get gear with.

Hack and slash games are done properly. Destiny wasn't.

When they say it's not an MMO I'd think what they meant was that it's not meant to be played on a massive scale, it's more co-op in nature.

Everything else is on the content delivery end of the similarity, which guides payment models, more so than how many people are on one server or show up on your screen..

They're just saying what MMO purists have for a long time, games like this aren't MMORPG's.

Maybe what this will teach Devs is that a game doesn't have to be an MMORPG to use MMORPG style content delivery/service models. As well as F2P isn't the only way to success.

 

 

nariusseldon

Originally posted by Distopia

Maybe what this will teach Devs is that a game doesn't have to be an MMORPG to use MMORPG style content delivery/service models. As well as F2P isn't the only way to success.

 

 

Destiny is not the first to do it though. D3 and PoE did that before.

iixviiiix

IMO , not shooter game become popular in future , but first person view combat .

At less in few next years.

Since all hardware companies develop "VR" headset , the game develop will catch up with it and make more First person view combat game in next few years .

cesmode8

I think that if there is one thing that developers can take away from this is that gamers love little bits of progression very frequently.  What I mean is that we like to see that the little crappy boots we picked up have a 2.6% increase in damage.  Nice.  Equipped!  Thats the sort of thing that keeps us going for a while.

Take diablo 3 for example.  Love it or hate it.  Play it or not, that game is wildly succesful.  Even if you have played it and hate it, or if you think Blizzard's dev on it is crap...15 million copies sold is 15 million copies sold.  Destiny's gear progression and Diablo's seem similar, and theres a connection to be made.  I think its the tiny increments in power per gear that we pick up.

I'll say that I just got done doing some D3, and theres nothing more satisfying than seeing 27% increase in damagefrom the 2 hander  I just picked up.

 

nariusseldon

Originally posted by cesmode8

I think that if there is one thing that developers can take away from this is that gamers love little bits of progression very frequently.  What I mean is that we like to see that the little crappy boots we picked up have a 2.6% increase in damage.  Nice.  Equipped!  Thats the sort of thing that keeps us going for a while.

Take diablo 3 for example.  Love it or hate it.  Play it or not, that game is wildly succesful.  Even if you have played it and hate it, or if you think Blizzard's dev on it is crap...15 million copies sold is 15 million copies sold.  Destiny's gear progression and Diablo's seem similar, and theres a connection to be made.  I think its the tiny increments in power per gear that we pick up.

I'll say that I just got done doing some D3, and theres nothing more satisfying than seeing 27% increase in damagefrom the 2 hander  I just picked up.

 

Actually D3 sold 20M copies already, and it is actually closer to MMOs than Destiny, and there are a lot MMOs can learn from it. Just for starters (aside from your point on upgrades):

- different game modes. Don't ask players to go through the same linear progression more than once. Once is fun, 3 times is a chore. Let them have choices of how to play.

- leader boards

- random dungeons

- physical effects in combats

- items with gameplay mechanics changes

.....

All of these things can be done in MMOs.

 

Bladestrom

It's interesting that you think Diablo 3 is great when it has scaling to specifically allow players to repeat all content isn't it.

Bladestrom

Ah but ah but ah but thats different cause you like it?

mmoguy43

Some aren't lessons to learn, just have to accept it.

Like:

1. A game being popular or not based on the developer name (+1)

2. Millions in advertising yields greater returns (because of #1)

3. A game by a developer well known for past games in X genre making another X genre game is going to sell.

4. DLC and F2P. Gamers saying, "shut up and take my money" mean it, so take it.

 

Games built to be played cooperatively with optional singleplayer is FAR better than singleplayer with a little bit of optional coop.

Scifi Helmets with hoods are cool.

 

 

I still haven't played it yet

Edli

They learned that throwing a crapload of money at marketing and building hype will pay off. Having a big name as a developer will help a lot too. 

Nevulus

Devs can learn both good & bad from the Destiny fiasco:

 

The Good:

• A game does not have to be massive to feel like a living breathing world. The instancing was well done and transparent as can be. 

 

The Bad:

• Publishers can force devs to break the story up into DLCs despite the fact that it causes the story to lose all sense of cohesion and the game will still sell.
• Marketing reigns supreme.