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Amazing article detailing the innovation of EQN and Storybricks

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  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 11,818


    Originally posted by lizardbones

    It is not scripts.  

    What else do you think it is?

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 11,818


    Originally posted by Markusrind

    unscripted Dark Elves patrolling a castle

    There is no such thing as unscripted NPC...

  • MarkusrindMarkusrind Member Posts: 359
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Markusrind

    unscripted Dark Elves patrolling a castle

     

    There is no such thing as unscripted NPC...

    By unscripted I mean it wasn't told specifically what to do, it chose (using it's pre-defined role, wants and needs) to patrol the castle walls, to use the teleporter and to make use of the power focus because those activities and actions fitted what the NPC wanted to do.

    It could have easily not patrolled the walls (had it been given a lazy trait), not used the teleporter (if it wasn't curious) and not used the power focus (if it didn't need to do so).

     

    Of course there would need to be a script that controls the animations and possible choices but the actual choice of activity is not pre-scripted.

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 11,818


    Originally posted by Markusrind

    By unscripted I mean it wasn't told specifically what to do
    ...
    Of course there would need to be a script that controls the animations and possible choices but the actual choice of activity is not pre-scripted.

    NPC only does what is specifically told to do...the choice is a result of condiditonal scripted behaviour.

    Game AI actions is basically just a script chain of If, And, Or conditions.


    Game AI is not the same as general meaning of AI aka "thinking machine". Those are two vastly different things.

  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Member CommonPosts: 10,910
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by lizardbones

    It is not scripts. 

     

     


     

    What else do you think it is?

     

    It is not a script.  A script requires a predefined end point that is hard coded into the script.  The script can have multiple end points, but they are all defined, and they are all hard coded into the script.  If a new element is added to the world, and that element interacts with the NPC and the NPC is scripted, then the element must be hard coded into the script.  If a new location is added, updated or removed from the world, the scripts must change to accommodate the change or the NPCs will not function.  StoryBricks doesn't require this.  StoryBricks is not "scripts".

     

    The system has been described on their site (for years), on the EQN site, on several other websites and described simplistically here.  If you want to know what it is, read the available material.

     

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 11,818


    Originally posted by lizardbones

    A script requires a predefined end point that is hard coded into the script. 
     


    StoryBricks are doing exactly the same.

    Just because you percieve script as something very simple - "do this", does not mean StoryBricks are any different. Just the chain is more complex and in fact it is always more complex even for "dumb" NPCs.

    It is still a script, like you say with multiple end-points, that is what StoryBricks do, they have multiple end points.

  • MarkusrindMarkusrind Member Posts: 359
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by lizardbones

     

    A script requires a predefined end point that is hard coded into the script. 
     


     

    StoryBricks are doing exactly the same.

    Just because you percieve script as something very simple - "do this", does not mean StoryBricks are any different. Just the chain is more complex and in fact it is always more complex even for "dumb" NPCs.

    It is still a script, like you say with multiple end-points, that is what StoryBricks do, they have multiple end points.

    Just to check.

    Are you basing your comments on the demo's shown, documentation released and Storybricks developer explanations of how the system works Or how you think it works from previous system?

  • RaellnRaelln Member Posts: 67
    Originally posted by lizardbones

     

     

    It is not scripts. 

     

    You can facepalm all you want - AI will always and forever (until computers gain sentience) be a script or set of scripts. Whether or not those scripts are embedded and/or invisible inside another module or application is irrelevant. At the end of the day, somewhere in that program - there is a script that dictates exactly how that AI will react to data it is fed.

  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer Member EpicPosts: 8,780

    References say the events are not scripted. But scripting is just a way of giving non compiled, pre-defined commands to a program. The question is whether or not these events 'boil down" to some form of intricate "elseif" type of decision making or not. Is this truly a revolutionary technology, or have they buried their own version of a scripting language in there somewhere?  Otherwise, If story bricks doesn't really produce anything better than what advanced scripting can do then it's all smoke and mirrors with marketing semantics.

     

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 11,818


    Originally posted by Markusrind

    Just to check.Are you basing your comments on the demo's shown, documentation released and Storybricks developer explanations of how the system works Or how you think it works from previous system?

    That is how game AI works and what devs talk about when they talk about StoryBricks. Always keep on mind that perception of a developer is very different from perception of the user - You.


    One of the most obvious obstacles is the dialogues and story. While there is somewhat a tech capable of automated writing it is still miles away from application of a scale we talk about here.

    So, if you have no automated story/dialogues, you gotta write them up yourself thus there goes your predefined end points.


  • RaellnRaelln Member Posts: 67
    Originally posted by Markusrind
    Originally posted by Raelln
     

    It's not a fire and forget type of action here. It's not merely "enable a Storybricks module and now all your NPCs act intelligently". 

    Are you sure?

    Reason I ask is that they showed both the macro demo of Storybricks in action and the micro using in game action. The macro showed a 'risk' like board to show the overall large scale of how storybricks works in the world and the in game demo showed unscripted Dark Elves patrolling a castle, using teleporter pads to change locations and using a well of power if they came across it.

    It certainly looked like you set-up your NPC and the world, let them go, and they go for it. They follow objectives, interact with the world dynamically and made choices based on their profiles.

    I would ask why you are certain what they showed as part of the demo and using in game footage isn't possible?

    I am sure. There would have to be some amount (likely not insignificant) of effort from the devs using Storybrick to custom tailor the different NPCs (factions, beasts, etc etc) to behave differently - that is, unless they think their players would be content with orcs behaving the exact same way dark elves would - or humans acting the same way gnomes would.

    From my time playing EQ1 - I can't imagine players being happy with High Elves acting the same way and making the same automated decisions that Dark Elves do.

    To make them act differently insinuates some level of customization from the devs. 

  • RaellnRaelln Member Posts: 67
    Originally posted by Markusrind
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Markusrind

    unscripted Dark Elves patrolling a castle

     

    There is no such thing as unscripted NPC...

    By unscripted I mean it wasn't told specifically what to do, it chose (using it's pre-defined role, wants and needs) to patrol the castle walls, to use the teleporter and to make use of the power focus because those activities and actions fitted what the NPC wanted to do.

    It could have easily not patrolled the walls (had it been given a lazy trait), not used the teleporter (if it wasn't curious) and not used the power focus (if it didn't need to do so).

     

    Of course there would need to be a script that controls the animations and possible choices but the actual choice of activity is not pre-scripted.

    ...but it was told specifically what to do by the default Storybrick's NPC script that was assigned to the Dark Elf. 

    For a NPC to just do something without a script would require the game to have sentience. At that point, I'd have to make the argument that it probably would no longer be a game and likely end up being a threat to the world.

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 27,475
    Originally posted by Raelln
    Originally posted by Markusrind
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Markusrind

    unscripted Dark Elves patrolling a castle

     

    There is no such thing as unscripted NPC...

    By unscripted I mean it wasn't told specifically what to do, it chose (using it's pre-defined role, wants and needs) to patrol the castle walls, to use the teleporter and to make use of the power focus because those activities and actions fitted what the NPC wanted to do.

    It could have easily not patrolled the walls (had it been given a lazy trait), not used the teleporter (if it wasn't curious) and not used the power focus (if it didn't need to do so).

     

    Of course there would need to be a script that controls the animations and possible choices but the actual choice of activity is not pre-scripted.

    ...but it was told specifically what to do by the default Storybrick's NPC script that was assigned to the Dark Elf. 

    For a NPC to just do something without a script would require the game to have sentience. At that point, I'd have to make the argument that it probably would no longer be a game and likely end up being a threat to the world.

    You guys are arguing over semantics.

    What they are trying to say when they say "it's unscripted" is that they weren't specifically given 5 things to do and they picked one of those 5 thigns and can only pick from 5 things. More likely than not they have a lot of choices and depending upon a variety of variables they pick from dozens and dozens.

    Of course they are limited to how many choices they are given as this isn't sci-fi AI. But it's not like, say, the skyrim creation kit where I set a path for some guard to patrol and they do that ad nauseum until they see the player and they attack.

    It's probably like "it's their turn to patrol (as opposed to their turn to do something else), they see the party, they react in several different ways due to what they 'see' which could be drink a potion for magic resistance if there is a mage, take cover, just use ranged from a better vantage point or even run away and get a suitable party to counter the player party. Note that I said "suitable party" and not "run away and grab the first npc's they find."

    I imagine that npc player choices are more along the lines of what goes into, say, a civilization game or some other 4X game.

     




  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 11,818

    Here is how Storybrick scripting works:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3b_3UGc7Es#t=100

    It is essentially a quest builder. Many devs use something like that. CCP use similar tool to generate NPC missions.

  • AzothAzoth Member UncommonPosts: 840
    Originally posted by Sovrath
    Originally posted by Raelln
    Originally posted by Markusrind
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Markusrind

    unscripted Dark Elves patrolling a castle

     

    There is no such thing as unscripted NPC...

    By unscripted I mean it wasn't told specifically what to do, it chose (using it's pre-defined role, wants and needs) to patrol the castle walls, to use the teleporter and to make use of the power focus because those activities and actions fitted what the NPC wanted to do.

    It could have easily not patrolled the walls (had it been given a lazy trait), not used the teleporter (if it wasn't curious) and not used the power focus (if it didn't need to do so).

     

    Of course there would need to be a script that controls the animations and possible choices but the actual choice of activity is not pre-scripted.

    ...but it was told specifically what to do by the default Storybrick's NPC script that was assigned to the Dark Elf. 

    For a NPC to just do something without a script would require the game to have sentience. At that point, I'd have to make the argument that it probably would no longer be a game and likely end up being a threat to the world.

    You guys are arguing over semantics.

    What they are trying to say when they say "it's unscripted" is that they weren't specifically given 5 things to do and they picked one of those 5 thigns and can only pick from 5 things. More likely than not they have a lot of choices and depending upon a variety of variables they pick from dozens and dozens.

    Of course they are limited to how many choices they are given as this isn't sci-fi AI. But it's not like, say, the skyrim creation kit where I set a path for some guard to patrol and they do that ad nauseum until they see the player and they attack.

    It's probably like "it's their turn to patrol (as opposed to their turn to do something else), they see the party, they react in several different ways due to what they 'see' which could be drink a potion for magic resistance if there is a mage, take cover, just use ranged from a better vantage point or even run away and get a suitable party to counter the player party. Note that I said "suitable party" and not "run away and grab the first npc's they find."

    I imagine that npc player choices are more along the lines of what goes into, say, a civilization game or some other 4X game.

     

    I don't think everyone in here sees it that way. Some people think that NPC will do stuff that is totally unexpected even by the people designing the AI.

  • ArchlyteArchlyte Member RarePosts: 1,405

    I just can't believe nobody is talking about how this feature will become the new favorite tool of the griefers. I think that the complexity of this element will meet the vandal player base as a violent explosion of bad behaviors.

    This game will come down for several hours every night to adjust issues of NPC herding, glitched orc tribes running in circles, etc. As soon as people figure out how to get these things to KOS against players they will create EVE like traps for PvE folks as well. Unless they adjust for that Open World PvP by proxy will be the rule. Every player could become a PvP pet class with mobs doing their work for them.  

     

     

    MMORPG players are often like Hobbits: They don't like Adventures
  • dandurindandurin Member UncommonPosts: 498

    As eager as I am to see what Storybricks is going to deliver, the promises are way too vague at this point.

     

    So I can "help the dryads" or "help the dark elves" and there are "no quests".  So what?  In the absence of quests, what exactly does "help the dryads" mean besides "Kill Dark Elves?"  If I could, for instance, reason out that planting trees in a certain pattern in a certain area would be a big benefit, that's cool.  If instead an NPC tells me it would be helpful, there's no innovation here.

     

    I get that each NPC is a faction unto himself, which has awesome potential in theory, but the devil is still in the details regarding the behavior choices my character has.  If it's just "NPC x wants a flower delivered to NPC y", does it really matter that there's no exclamation point over his head?

  • amx23amx23 Member Posts: 102
    Originally posted by dandurin

    As eager as I am to see what Storybricks is going to deliver, the promises are way too vague at this point.

     

    So I can "help the dryads" or "help the dark elves" and there are "no quests".  So what?  In the absence of quests, what exactly does "help the dryads" mean besides "Kill Dark Elves?"  If I could, for instance, reason out that planting trees in a certain pattern in a certain area would be a big benefit, that's cool.  If instead an NPC tells me it would be helpful, there's no innovation here.

     

    I get that each NPC is a faction unto himself, which has awesome potential in theory, but the devil is still in the details regarding the behavior choices my character has.  If it's just "NPC x wants a flower delivered to NPC y", does it really matter that there's no exclamation point over his head?

    "rebuild temples, help farmers with crops, open trade routes" are some of the examples in this article: http://massively.joystiq.com/2014/08/21/soe-live-2014-more-everquest-next-tidbits/

     

    ive heard in rallying calls you could help by "cutting down trees, erecting a wall, digging tunnels" found here in the 2013 keynote (when they get to the rallying calls): 

     

    You can also gain abilities from achievements show in the classes panel, i believe its drink 500 mugs of ale: 

  • amx23amx23 Member Posts: 102
    Originally posted by dandurin

    As eager as I am to see what Storybricks is going to deliver, the promises are way too vague at this point.

     

    So I can "help the dryads" or "help the dark elves" and there are "no quests".  So what?  In the absence of quests, what exactly does "help the dryads" mean besides "Kill Dark Elves?"  If I could, for instance, reason out that planting trees in a certain pattern in a certain area would be a big benefit, that's cool.  If instead an NPC tells me it would be helpful, there's no innovation here.

     

    I get that each NPC is a faction unto himself, which has awesome potential in theory, but the devil is still in the details regarding the behavior choices my character has.  If it's just "NPC x wants a flower delivered to NPC y", does it really matter that there's no exclamation point over his head?

     

    Excerpt taken from Maelydd's post:

    "I certainly got the impression that quests can come from all sorts of places. While there might be hubs of civilization they do not have set quests and there are no static NPC's (outside of the fact they will be living in the same town) or mobs (again outside the generalized area in which they might currently be inhabiting).

    The Rohsong seems to not only be a book recording your deeds but also the way to get suggestions for what there is to do in the world. During the Dev brunch we got to spend 2 hours chatting with the devs and the one on the table I sat on went into quite some depth about the way the Rohsong book worked and how quests in general worked.

    Any NPC you speak to could potentially have a quest for you to undertake. They might need materials gathered or their barn cleared of vermin or items delivered but they would only be available when needed so you wouldn't be able to clear the barn of vermin only for the next guy to come along to get the same quest as you just did it.

    Then, depending on your standing with individuals, organisations, guilds, races, political factions or any other individual/group there might be more open quests such as helping reduce banditry in the region or killing off a local population of Orcs that are harassing the area. Several people might be given the task of helping and it may take quite a long time for such an activity to be completed.

    Another really cool thing is that there is the potential for unique quests just for your character should a need arise and your 'standing', past activities, skillset meet their requirements. An individual or 'faction' may seek YOU out for a task/quest.

    One of the other nice things mentioned was that there are lots of possible ways to complete certain quests. For example, say you have to reduce the Orc population. You might just do that by killing Orcs or you might realise that Orcs love weath, especially Gold, and so could achive the same thing by either protecting travellers (making the Orcs decide to move on and find an easier place to target travellers) or even go so far as to mine out all the local deposits of gold (which again might make the Orcs move on to look for other places with gold).

    The Rohsong will also provide clues as to where you might find quests fitting your play style. So if you happened to be a predominantly nature based build favouring combat it would suggest area's in the world where nature was under attack. An example given in the Storybricks presentation was on the druid lands being attacked by the Dark Elves. If you followed the suggestion of the Rohsong then you would travel to the area and help the local Druids defend their lands. Enough players do that and the Dark Elves get driven back, not enough and the Dark Elves might eventually take over the Druid lands and drive them all away. It also means that players can come into conflict, both through combat and in other ways to determine what happens. Although the outcome is dependent on many factors, player intervention in the world will have a very dramatic impact on what cam take place in the world.

    I am sure more information about how it all works will come out in due course and there are some things that still have an embargo but from conversations and watching the presentations the future looks bright.

     

     
  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 27,475
    Originally posted by Azoth
     

    I don't think everyone in here sees it that way. Some people think that NPC will do stuff that is totally unexpected even by the people designing the AI.

    I suppose that means by what one "means" by unexpected.

    For instance, I don't think the AI is going to become sentient and start wondering about it's existence.

    However, in (I think it was) Oblvion, one of the npc's needed a weapon and ran "next door" to get one which surprised the developers.

    Now, I believe this was earlier in their development where their "radiant AI" actually did more than what it did during release.

    So "sure" the npc's might do some surprising things that the developers didn't foresee.

    But aren't looking at an AI that will truly "learn" from it's experiences like a human would.




  • AzothAzoth Member UncommonPosts: 840
    Originally posted by Sovrath
    Originally posted by Azoth
     

    I don't think everyone in here sees it that way. Some people think that NPC will do stuff that is totally unexpected even by the people designing the AI.

    I suppose that means by what one "means" by unexpected.

    For instance, I don't think the AI is going to become sentient and start wondering about it's existence.

    However, in (I think it was) Oblvion, one of the npc's needed a weapon and ran "next door" to get one which surprised the developers.

    Now, I believe this was earlier in their development where their "radiant AI" actually did more than what it did during release.

    So "sure" the npc's might do some surprising things that the developers didn't foresee.

    But aren't looking at an AI that will truly "learn" from it's experiences like a human would.

    I doubt it was a surprise to the person that did the coding. There might be nice outcomes, but it is all in the boundries of what is in the code.

    Orc have in his likes ''wealth''

    ways to acquire wealth might be stuff like : mine gold, kill and rob merchants, ask toll to cross a bridge, sell crafted items and on and on. But all the outcome have to be coded somewhere, if it's not coded, and orc won't go grab an NPC and ask a ransom to the king.

    Every possible paths must be written somewhere, sure you might not tell the orc exactly where to put down his settlement, but there are still parameters that make him choose a spot.

    In a coded program, there is nothing random.

  • MuntzMuntz Member UncommonPosts: 332
    Originally posted by Azoth
    Originally posted by Sovrath
    Originally posted by Azoth
     

    I don't think everyone in here sees it that way. Some people think that NPC will do stuff that is totally unexpected even by the people designing the AI.

    I suppose that means by what one "means" by unexpected.

    For instance, I don't think the AI is going to become sentient and start wondering about it's existence.

    However, in (I think it was) Oblvion, one of the npc's needed a weapon and ran "next door" to get one which surprised the developers.

    Now, I believe this was earlier in their development where their "radiant AI" actually did more than what it did during release.

    So "sure" the npc's might do some surprising things that the developers didn't foresee.

    But aren't looking at an AI that will truly "learn" from it's experiences like a human would.

    I doubt it was a surprise to the person that did the coding. There might be nice outcomes, but it is all in the boundries of what is in the code.

    Orc have in his likes ''wealth''

    ways to acquire wealth might be stuff like : mine gold, kill and rob merchants, ask toll to cross a bridge, sell crafted items and on and on. But all the outcome have to be coded somewhere, if it's not coded, and orc won't go grab an NPC and ask a ransom to the king.

    Every possible paths must be written somewhere, sure you might not tell the orc exactly where to put down his settlement, but there are still parameters that make him choose a spot.

    In a coded program, there is nothing random.

    Come now, unexpected happens in programming all the time typically we call them bugs. The more complext the program the greater number of bugs exist. It is far from a new concept for a programmer to pass a bug (unexpected behavior) off as a feature. If indeed they were suprised by the out come it is more then likely no one person was responsible for the code that made it happen. 

  • Mtibbs1989Mtibbs1989 Member UncommonPosts: 3,142
    Originally posted by Muntz
    Originally posted by Azoth
    Originally posted by Sovrath
    Originally posted by Azoth
     

    I don't think everyone in here sees it that way. Some people think that NPC will do stuff that is totally unexpected even by the people designing the AI.

    I suppose that means by what one "means" by unexpected.

    For instance, I don't think the AI is going to become sentient and start wondering about it's existence.

    However, in (I think it was) Oblvion, one of the npc's needed a weapon and ran "next door" to get one which surprised the developers.

    Now, I believe this was earlier in their development where their "radiant AI" actually did more than what it did during release.

    So "sure" the npc's might do some surprising things that the developers didn't foresee.

    But aren't looking at an AI that will truly "learn" from it's experiences like a human would.

    I doubt it was a surprise to the person that did the coding. There might be nice outcomes, but it is all in the boundries of what is in the code.

    Orc have in his likes ''wealth''

    ways to acquire wealth might be stuff like : mine gold, kill and rob merchants, ask toll to cross a bridge, sell crafted items and on and on. But all the outcome have to be coded somewhere, if it's not coded, and orc won't go grab an NPC and ask a ransom to the king.

    Every possible paths must be written somewhere, sure you might not tell the orc exactly where to put down his settlement, but there are still parameters that make him choose a spot.

    In a coded program, there is nothing random.

    Come now, unexpected happens in programming all the time typically we call them bugs. The more complext the program the greater number of bugs exist. It is far from a new concept for a programmer to pass a bug (unexpected behavior) off as a feature. If indeed they were suprised by the out come it is more then likely no one person was responsible for the code that made it happen. 

    Even bugs aren't random, you can easily reproduce bugs as long as you know how to reproduce them. Programming truly isn't random. If said orc goes to create a village there will be limited locations as to where that said village will be placed. otherwise you'll end up with some very... interesting issues.

    image

    Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
  • dandurindandurin Member UncommonPosts: 498
    Originally posted by amx23
    Originally posted by dandurin

    As eager as I am to see what Storybricks is going to deliver, the promises are way too vague at this point.

     

    So I can "help the dryads" or "help the dark elves" and there are "no quests".  So what?  In the absence of quests, what exactly does "help the dryads" mean besides "Kill Dark Elves?"  If I could, for instance, reason out that planting trees in a certain pattern in a certain area would be a big benefit, that's cool.  If instead an NPC tells me it would be helpful, there's no innovation here.

     

    I get that each NPC is a faction unto himself, which has awesome potential in theory, but the devil is still in the details regarding the behavior choices my character has.  If it's just "NPC x wants a flower delivered to NPC y", does it really matter that there's no exclamation point over his head?

     

    Excerpt taken from Maelydd's post:

    "I certainly got the impression that quests can come from all sorts of places. While there might be hubs of civilization they do not have set quests and there are no static NPC's (outside of the fact they will be living in the same town) or mobs (again outside the generalized area in which they might currently be inhabiting).

    The Rohsong seems to not only be a book recording your deeds but also the way to get suggestions for what there is to do in the world. During the Dev brunch we got to spend 2 hours chatting with the devs and the one on the table I sat on went into quite some depth about the way the Rohsong book worked and how quests in general worked.

    Any NPC you speak to could potentially have a quest for you to undertake. They might need materials gathered or their barn cleared of vermin or items delivered but they would only be available when needed so you wouldn't be able to clear the barn of vermin only for the next guy to come along to get the same quest as you just did it.

    Then, depending on your standing with individuals, organisations, guilds, races, political factions or any other individual/group there might be more open quests such as helping reduce banditry in the region or killing off a local population of Orcs that are harassing the area. Several people might be given the task of helping and it may take quite a long time for such an activity to be completed.

    Another really cool thing is that there is the potential for unique quests just for your character should a need arise and your 'standing', past activities, skillset meet their requirements. An individual or 'faction' may seek YOU out for a task/quest.

    One of the other nice things mentioned was that there are lots of possible ways to complete certain quests. For example, say you have to reduce the Orc population. You might just do that by killing Orcs or you might realise that Orcs love weath, especially Gold, and so could achive the same thing by either protecting travellers (making the Orcs decide to move on and find an easier place to target travellers) or even go so far as to mine out all the local deposits of gold (which again might make the Orcs move on to look for other places with gold).

    The Rohsong will also provide clues as to where you might find quests fitting your play style. So if you happened to be a predominantly nature based build favouring combat it would suggest area's in the world where nature was under attack. An example given in the Storybricks presentation was on the druid lands being attacked by the Dark Elves. If you followed the suggestion of the Rohsong then you would travel to the area and help the local Druids defend their lands. Enough players do that and the Dark Elves get driven back, not enough and the Dark Elves might eventually take over the Druid lands and drive them all away. It also means that players can come into conflict, both through combat and in other ways to determine what happens. Although the outcome is dependent on many factors, player intervention in the world will have a very dramatic impact on what cam take place in the world.

    I am sure more information about how it all works will come out in due course and there are some things that still have an embargo but from conversations and watching the presentations the future looks bright.

     

     

     

    I wish every post on mmorpg was as valuable as this one.

     

    I've sat through the garbled recordings of Doctor Bura to the point of face-desking, it's good to know someone was actually there and paying attention.

     

    It still raises more questions than it answers though.  If twenty independent players are asked to solve an NPC's big problem, and one of them does it in a subtle way, like posting a sign, while the others are ignoring the request or offline, how does the system know who gets credit?  (I suppose all requests having timeout values could help this somewhat)

     

    More importantly, since everything is based on a single simulated world rather than a phased world for each player, what happens when 1000 people have led their "lives of consequence" and then you show up and nothing's left to be done because the dark elf fortress has been destroyed?  I'm wondering if the previous 1000 lives weren't as "consequential" as they might have hoped.  There is so much pressure on the world simulator to avoid "local minima" as it were, ie boring equilibrium states that are tough to break out of.

     

    There's also the problem of regular group play.  Typically play groups deliberately maximize their diversity, both for group balance reasons and aesthetics.  This system seems to be actively punishing that behavior.

     

    Anyway, it's all exciting but we need more concrete examples if they expect buy-in from cynical veterans of hype.

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