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[Column] Guild Wars 2: Change is a Good Thing, Right?

SBFordSBFord Former Associate EditorMember LegendaryPosts: 33,126

For an MMO to be successful, it needs to constantly evolve in order to keep the interest of the players. ArenaNet has been changing Guild Wars 2 since its launch, but none of that will compare to the changes we’re about to witness! April seems to focus on players having an easier time playing the game, which I'm always for, but I still have a few concerns.

Read more of David North's Guild Wars 2: Change is a Good Thing, Right?

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I know it’s a game, but death really isn’t that big of a deal.


¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 


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Comments

  • Isthedevil_MonsantoIsthedevil_Monsanto Member Posts: 11
    I like these proposed changes, but I hope to see new skills down the road as well. Also, would really like them to knucklehead-proof the Keg Brawl mini-game by making it easier to identify which team you're on. Sometimes you lose track of the direction you've been going in with camera rotation. I realise it's easy to tell if you look behind you when you start out but sometimes you're thrown right into the action. The other day I participated in a game where both teams were going the wrong direction. LOL!
  • ScalplessScalpless Member UncommonPosts: 1,426

    Is the ability to mix armor types a confirmed feature? I don't think it is.

    Overall, the changes will probably be good, but I have no idea why they decided to nerf event rewards. They should be buffed and mob loot should be nerfed, not the other way around. After all, events were once supposed to be the main feature of GW2 and now they're just a decent leveling tool.

  • dasX82dasX82 Member UncommonPosts: 99

    "easier time playing the game" I never thought this game could have an easier time to play.

    Four words: more of the same

  • TekaelonTekaelon Member UncommonPosts: 604
    Thought I would never say this but GW2 is just to casual, nothing o strive for, and I am a very casual player.
  • Sk1ppeRSk1ppeR Member Posts: 511
    Unexperienced writer? You beg for traits but they will be adding over 20 new traits .... 
     
    Also they explained why they bumped the level of traits from 7 to 30. They are nerfing the maximum amount of points one can have. Its simply done because chunk of players never used a single trait point. The way its going to be is a lot more optimized and traits will be more notable. They realized that scaled up events like the jungle wurm won't force people to learn about the traits, so they revamped the system. How is that bad? 
  • Thessik_IrontailThessik_Irontail Member UncommonPosts: 76
    Originally posted by Tekaelon
    Thought I would never say this but GW2 is just to casual, nothing o strive for, and I am a very casual player.

    Exactly spot on with your criticism.

    GW2 is an example of how not to build an MMORPG, and for me as a player, what types of things to look out for when choosing whether to buy a new MMO or not. If its anything like GW2, then its a straight forward no for me.

    Old Everquest had it right from the start. Death needs to have meaning for players respect the world. Leveling needs to take a long time so that there is accomplishment and attachment and meaning, etc.

  • DJJazzyDJJazzy Member UncommonPosts: 2,053
    Originally posted by Thessik_Irontail
    Originally posted by Tekaelon
    Thought I would never say this but GW2 is just to casual, nothing o strive for, and I am a very casual player.

    Exactly spot on with your criticism.

    GW2 is an example of how not to build an MMORPG, and for me as a player, what types of things to look out for when choosing whether to buy a new MMO or not. If its anything like GW2, then its a straight forward no for me.

    Old Everquest had it right from the start. Death needs to have meaning for players respect the world. Leveling needs to take a long time so that there is accomplishment and attachment and meaning, etc.

    Get off my lawn!

  • fivorothfivoroth Member UncommonPosts: 3,916

    They need to make some significant changes for me to come back. A lot of those changes involve them changing their design philosophy such as introducing roles in dungeons (not just dps), introducing a more meaningful gear progression, allowing more flexibility around skill choices for your hotbar (akin to GW1, 8-10 skills no restrictions on skills you can have) and more horizonal progression systems. I cannot see them adding the first three because it goes against their design philosophy. Horizontal progression is something they can add though.

    I personally enjoy gear progression but for some reason I loved GW1. It's my most played MMO together with WoW. But GW2 was a complete turn off. Oddly enough all my GW1 buddies also hated GW2. I guess GW2 was made for MMO players rather than GW fans. 

    The whole GW2 experience feels shallow to me compared to GW1. 

    Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.

  • dontadowdontadow Member UncommonPosts: 1,005
    Errrr no.gw2 is exactly what you should do to make an mmo. That is provide a dearth punishment, reasonable time wasted , without stupid penalties only put in the game to make you pay longer (such as losing equipment or exborant accounts of money.
  • BeelzebobbieBeelzebobbie Member UncommonPosts: 430
    Originally posted by Thessik_Irontail
    Originally posted by Tekaelon
    Thought I would never say this but GW2 is just to casual, nothing o strive for, and I am a very casual player.

    Exactly spot on with your criticism.

    GW2 is an example of how not to build an MMORPG, and for me as a player, what types of things to look out for when choosing whether to buy a new MMO or not. If its anything like GW2, then its a straight forward no for me.

    Old Everquest had it right from the start. Death needs to have meaning for players respect the world. Leveling needs to take a long time so that there is accomplishment and attachment and meaning, etc.

    Well I feel like this, Gw2 is a casual game mainly but they are trying to add harder and harder stuff and thats good for the players who like that. I also see a change with the living story while it was easy in the beginning the events became harder in the end. I do think harder stuff will come but I don't think this game will ever be to hard. 

    I think Arenanet wants all people to be able to play everything and that thought is a good one but then they have to work hard to add new stuff all the time to keep players ocupied and have something to do.

    But the truth is this GW2 is a game for everyone mainly the casual player just like WOW, Swtor and most of the bigger mmos out there. Why is it like this? Because the main population that plays mmos want it like this. WOW crushed EQ why? because it was easier and more for the casual player and that attracted a bigger crowd then ever before. 

    This is why more hardcore games will never be as big as wow and all the other casual games out there. And a business needs money and they all want to be huge so they all make a game thats gonna be more of a "sure thing" and then keep the cash flowing in there direction.

    Sure there are exceptions like Eve which is in my book a tough game to play solo and just go and do your own business (I suck at it). 

    Now don't get me wrong I am a casual player and I love GW2 the way it is and I understand why people don't like it and I understand why they do. I love playing GW2 and when I want a bigger challenge then I try to do something like soloing a dungeon.

    I would like to see a game developer who will try to give all the hardcore gamers a game that they love cause you all deserve it.

    Peace out

  • fhnw1988fhnw1988 Member Posts: 64
    Originally posted by dontadow
    Errrr no.gw2 is exactly what you should do to make an mmo. That is provide a dearth punishment, reasonable time wasted , without stupid penalties only put in the game to make you pay longer (such as losing equipment or exborant accounts of money.

    I agree with all of that, just GW2 wasnt for me- where GW1 was my true love. 

  • BillMurphyBillMurphy Former Managing EditorMember LegendaryPosts: 4,565
    Originally posted by Scalpless

    Is the ability to mix armor types a confirmed feature? I don't think it is.

    Overall, the changes will probably be good, but I have no idea why they decided to nerf event rewards. They should be buffed and mob loot should be nerfed, not the other way around. After all, events were once supposed to be the main feature of GW2 and now they're just a decent leveling tool.

    No, I think Dave's talking about wearing town clothes into battle, which is confirmed.

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  • vahmosevahmose Member Posts: 8
    I maxed out a character at release then got bored with the game. The first few weeks of play were thrilling but after my initial burst of excitement I slowly found myself not having fun.  I've checked in every once in a while, and each time I enjoyed the game more and more. Now I play it more than any of my other MMOs. GW2 got a bad first impression for hardcore gamers but now I can't deny how much I enjoy it. Maybe I'm just turning soft haha.
  • AsamofAsamof Member UncommonPosts: 824
    Originally posted by Thessik_Irontail
    Originally posted by Tekaelon
    Thought I would never say this but GW2 is just to casual, nothing o strive for, and I am a very casual player.

    Exactly spot on with your criticism.

    GW2 is an example of how not to build an MMORPG, and for me as a player, what types of things to look out for when choosing whether to buy a new MMO or not. If its anything like GW2, then its a straight forward no for me.

    Old Everquest had it right from the start. Death needs to have meaning for players respect the world. Leveling needs to take a long time so that there is accomplishment and attachment and meaning, etc.

    Sadly nobody designs games like this anymore. What the new crowd wants is all about gaining several levels per kill while never being threatened by death ever.

  • jcsadonejcsadone Member UncommonPosts: 60

    "Guild Wars 2 Column: Change is a Good Thing, Right?" - nope.

    Good change is good thing, bad change is bad. I would say, I'm yet to see a really good change in GW2 (they had some minor goodies - like wallet). But it would be a lie, I don't care about GW2 enough to keep login in to the game. I still care enough to read forum and I have a good laugh after EVERY-SINGLE-UPDATE that Anet screw. Which is like, every LS update (and some unrelated)? Way more entertaining. My inner hater is really content with them XD (and I'm almost addicted to popcorn now :P )

  • eye_meye_m Member UncommonPosts: 3,317
    Originally posted by jcsadone

    "Guild Wars 2 Column: Change is a Good Thing, Right?" - nope.

    Good change is good thing, bad change is bad. I would say, I'm yet to see a really good change in GW2 (they had some minor goodies - like wallet). But it would be a lie, I don't care about GW2 enough to keep login in to the game. I still care enough to read forum and I have a good laugh after EVERY-SINGLE-UPDATE that Anet screw. Which is like, every LS update (and some unrelated)? Way more entertaining. My inner hater is really content with them XD (and I'm almost addicted to popcorn now :P )

    Sure glad you've found a game that you enjoy. It's so much better than if you were playing GW2 and not happy. Both sides win right!

    All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.

    I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.

    I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.

    I don't hate much, but I hate Apple© with a passion. If Steve Jobs was alive, I would punch him in the face.

  • Dreamo84Dreamo84 Member UncommonPosts: 3,713
    Originally posted by Asamof
    Originally posted by Thessik_Irontail
    Originally posted by Tekaelon
    Thought I would never say this but GW2 is just to casual, nothing o strive for, and I am a very casual player.

    Exactly spot on with your criticism.

    GW2 is an example of how not to build an MMORPG, and for me as a player, what types of things to look out for when choosing whether to buy a new MMO or not. If its anything like GW2, then its a straight forward no for me.

    Old Everquest had it right from the start. Death needs to have meaning for players respect the world. Leveling needs to take a long time so that there is accomplishment and attachment and meaning, etc.

    Sadly nobody designs games like this anymore. What the new crowd wants is all about gaining several levels per kill while never being threatened by death ever.

    Played ESO for 12 hours so far and damn I died like 6 times in this one public dungeon. And that was WITH a couple strangers I grouped up with. Granted we were two levels below the content but still refreshing to actually have some challenge and danger.

    image
  • BigdaddyxBigdaddyx Member UncommonPosts: 2,039
    Originally posted by Fendel84M
    Originally posted by Asamof
    Originally posted by Thessik_Irontail
    Originally posted by Tekaelon
    Thought I would never say this but GW2 is just to casual, nothing o strive for, and I am a very casual player.

    Exactly spot on with your criticism.

    GW2 is an example of how not to build an MMORPG, and for me as a player, what types of things to look out for when choosing whether to buy a new MMO or not. If its anything like GW2, then its a straight forward no for me.

    Old Everquest had it right from the start. Death needs to have meaning for players respect the world. Leveling needs to take a long time so that there is accomplishment and attachment and meaning, etc.

    Sadly nobody designs games like this anymore. What the new crowd wants is all about gaining several levels per kill while never being threatened by death ever.

    Played ESO for 12 hours so far and damn I died like 6 times in this one public dungeon. And that was WITH a couple strangers I grouped up with. Granted we were two levels below the content but still refreshing to actually have some challenge and danger.

    GW2 dungeons are also the same.

  • dontadowdontadow Member UncommonPosts: 1,005
    Says the person who has never played a GW2 dungeon. Having played them all, they are all quite challenging and you will die. I"ve run some dungeons multiple times and still had party wipes with the wrong tactics. 
  • flizzerflizzer Member RarePosts: 2,436
    I find GW2 IS THE WAY to build an MMO.  I expect we will see more MMOs along these lines given the sucess of GW2.  You may hate GW2 and I know many here do but the game has been successful.  Let's hope the changes prove popular among players.
  • jcsadonejcsadone Member UncommonPosts: 60
    Originally posted by eyelolled
    Originally posted by jcsadone

    "Guild Wars 2 Column: Change is a Good Thing, Right?" - nope.

    Good change is good thing, bad change is bad. I would say, I'm yet to see a really good change in GW2 (they had some minor goodies - like wallet). But it would be a lie, I don't care about GW2 enough to keep login in to the game. I still care enough to read forum and I have a good laugh after EVERY-SINGLE-UPDATE that Anet screw. Which is like, every LS update (and some unrelated)? Way more entertaining. My inner hater is really content with them XD (and I'm almost addicted to popcorn now :P )

    Sure glad you've found a game that you enjoy. It's so much better than if you were playing GW2 and not happy. Both sides win right!

    I know, right?  :D

  • jcsadonejcsadone Member UncommonPosts: 60
    Originally posted by flizzer
    I find GW2 IS THE WAY to build an MMO.  I expect we will see more MMOs along these lines given the sucess of GW2.  You may hate GW2 and I know many here do but the game has been successful.  Let's hope the changes prove popular among players.
     

    The problem with GW2 is that Anet made lot of changes to generic MMO vision and not all of them are good (I would say, that minority is). The bigger problem is, that Anet can't decide which is which - they are aiming at few antagonized crowds at the same time, and really not pleasing any of them. Their game need too much time investment to really work with casual players, but it's too blunt, too straightforward to please hardcore gamers. It's too elaborate for people who doesn't care about lore and it's shoving the stories into players face, while at the same time the stories are shallow and yet overdone, lore is too inconsistent (especially if You compare it to GW1) for most lore oriented players. Take trinity for example - healers are gone, something I was hoping for for years. Great! But it's just old system, the good old trinity without healer (or more accurate - with healer forced into any other class), they didn't create new system, they just damaged old one. As far as I know - I still hate old trinity model, but I'll take it above GW2 model any day of the week.

    It's not walking in the middle, between peoples expectations - it's failing to play for both teams at the same time.

    I agree with You, other companies will follow GW2 rout - and I count on it. In the core, in the premise GW2 is great game. Even several great games! I just hope that Anet could focus on one vision of their game and build on top of that, and stop screwing around saying sweet lies on top of loosening. You can't please everyone :P

  • Eir_SEir_S Member UncommonPosts: 4,623
    Originally posted by dontadow
    Says the person who has never played a GW2 dungeon. Having played them all, they are all quite challenging and you will die. I"ve run some dungeons multiple times and still had party wipes with the wrong tactics. 

    I'm not sure if he meant they're all the same or that they're the "same" ie: challenging like ESO dungeons.  Either way, the dungeons are not all the same in GW2.  Arah can be long and tedious, AC is short and depending on the path, awesome (ghostbusters themed boss for example), most bosses have as detailed mechanics as any WoW boss, etc.  If anyone says the dungeons are all the same because there's no trinity, well I'm not even going there.  I don't base MMO depth on a tired mechanic most people just happen to be used to.

  • Eir_SEir_S Member UncommonPosts: 4,623
    Originally posted by flizzer
    I find GW2 IS THE WAY to build an MMO.  I expect we will see more MMOs along these lines given the sucess of GW2.  You may hate GW2 and I know many here do but the game has been successful.  Let's hope the changes prove popular among players.
     

    I don't see a lot of people who hate it anymore.  Either out of boredom or a miraculous sudden maturity in the general populace, people seem to quietly disagree nowadays about how GW2 did or didn't blow them away.  I think there's hope for humanity.  Or at least the MMORPG forums. 

    And yes, regardless of what I or anyone thinks of the game, its features will be (and already are being) re-used in newer games, because apart from some odd decisions, a great many of ANet's systems just make sense.

  • daltaniousdaltanious Member UncommonPosts: 2,381
    Welcoming death penalty change. Death penalty should be at all removed, because it is in any game just one big ANNOYANCE that removes fun from game. 
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