What is happening to our mmo's ??? I am older for sure, I thought mmos would become more complex. I rember when we dreamed of being able to have sound coming from our computers. I rember when we used to dream of having pictures on our computers. I keep hopeing for more challenging play but I have to admit lately its seams the trend is dumer and dumer games.
5 attacks a potion slot and elite skill is going to get boaringly repetitive very fast.
Walking around spamming e thousands of times at boxes etc is going to hurt our hands.
EVERYTHING in the eso world is kinda washed out dul brown looking.
Zenimax, hun, if u make a dumbed down, simple, repetive, slow moving game and charge a monthly fee for and have a cash shop and charge 80 dollars for people to try it, it is not going to last in the mmo market.
The charcter models don't look sexy or strong and the armour looks horrable and bland.
Sounds like this isn't the game for you.
But I think many will disagree about the graphics and such, personally I think they are incredibly good, and I have heard that a lot from other people too. The pvp graphics are breathtakingly good, the first time you see a siege with trebuchets attacking a castle, prepare to have your jaw drop.
As far as ESO lasting in the MMO market, well, only time will tell. But you are overlooking the fact that they are casting a very wide net for this game. Console players alone could be a huge market which is untapped for MMOs. And while you don't like the 6 button per weapon hotkeys, many players like me feel just the opposite.
IMO the success of the game will all come down, like most games, to making sure its bug-free and playable on medium-level computers, and having good fun gameplay and a endgame that keeps you involved. If it does those things, it will be a huge hit. If it doesn't, it will be more of a niche game for comsole players and casual players who want to play an ES game with friends. Time will tell.
I personally liked it. But I find the dialog around this game to be interesting. I have heard people complain that it is not enough like the Elder Scrolls, which is crazy to me.
Then I hear people saying it is not really a MMO. Which is kind of crazy to me too.
I guess that is what the problem is, a lot of people have not accepted that this is a hybrid of sorts. I am very interested to see how that game pans out. I know this past beta really has me considering pre-ordering the game.
There is no rotation, you have 6 skills slotted + block, shield bash, lite attack, heavy attack, and dodge. You don't rotate, you actually have to choose which one to do in combat based on what the mobs do. Otherwise if you rotate you may be the one that gets shield bashed and stunned... just saying you also will run out of resources in 1-2 "rotations" if that's all you do. Unless you play an ES game its hard to understand try to react to combat if you are only familiar with rotation games.
Exactly right. In MMOs like WoW and SWTOR you just blast skills in a rotation until you eventually run out of power. ESO is totally different. The limiting factor isn't cooldowns - there are no cooldowns. The limiting factor is your power pools. You can only do a few skills until you run out of power. And when you run out, you are much weaker and vulnerable. So the 'strategy' isn't developing the ideal skill rotation like in those other games and playing quickbar whack-a-mole until the boss is dead. The strategy in ESO is choosing what skills to put on your quickbar, and then watching the battle and deciding which skills to use, and when. Also you need to observe the enemy to see when they are vulnerable, because then 'heavy' attacks will cause critical knock-down hits. Someone who is watching the battle and reacting wisely will be a far better player than someone trying to use their ideal rotation and not assessing the situation.
It's hard to understand how people see this "less is more" as a fun aspect. I played Guild Wars 1 and didn't like the restriction of skills there either.
Personally I don't want to change my build for each different action I make. Did I encounter more than 6 different situations in TESO PvP which favored a certain skill to be used? Yes. Did I yell for excitement when I was required to change my build in the middle of action in order to heal more effective a different kind of situation? No. So I'm supposed to be locked just for certain actions which I can do efficiently. What's the fun in that?
What about if one could only use just 2 skills in TESO? That would make the amount of these " interestings builds" even higher. Does that sound fun? How about just 1 skill? Enlighten me please.
Exactly!!!
I suspect most people are baddies because they cant cope with a full actionbar or theire just defending their favourite game regardless of its shortcommings.
And we havent even discussed the x platform aspect yet...overly miniscule UI and the amount of money+developer time that has to be set to making it work for consoles too. People dont understand that its ALWAYS a bad thing for both worlds. Look at Defiance and how that game went.
Yes, I'm a baddie and I cannot cope with a full action bar.
In fact it scares me so much that I am thinking about buying "My First Keyboard" with its fun, colorful keys to feel more at ease while playing video games and MMOs such as ESO.
I have heard the game is rated "Mature" too, which I think is rather distressing... I am sure I will be glad to have a reassuring visual anchor such as "My First Keyboard" while playing the game, to know I just have to look down, and that I can count on it to get a positive vibe when the violence on screen becomes intolerable.
Anyway, all of this to say that there aren't many games for us baddies... and before you ask, yes I have tried Hello Kitty Online, but I find keyboard turning too difficult, and also I found it hard to have to click on my cast bar to activate the three skills they have in game - "kissing", "hugging" and "eating raspberry muffins" - as I don't have the required dexterity to use short cuts yet... What's more they ask you to use the arrow keys to move (no click to move)... so I unsubbed!
So will you leave ESO alone please? Some of us baddies need a new home and I am sure there are plenty of other games out there for skilled players such as yourself (so you *really* don't need this one more game).
So it's safe to say that all the people moaning and hating on the game, bitching about sub fee and it's not worth that, I'll never play it etc etc .. WILL be logging in on all the future betas ?
By the love of GOD, I don't ever want ot go back to this mess lol, no thanks i'm fine with my 5 + 3 mouse attacks.
So you linked a picture from WoW in the TBC expansion where EVERYTHING is clutched up? This is clearly a UI that VERY few used so I call bs.
What is worse though, is the Zenimax team deliberately from scratch actually intending a measly, lackluster 5+1 actionbars.
I had one of the funniest time playing TBC back then and i rather have options in combat than this dumbed down system in ESO.
But most of you will first find out after a few months of gameplay because you dont understand what im talking about.
You've clearly never played as a healer in 25m raids in wow. This is a typical healer setup, though with a smaller screen than I used...
I raided vanilla wow + TBC on a hardcore level and none of our healers posted screenshots of a setup remotely like this.
The UI was often a discussion on our forums and a good healer always keep his screen
as clean as possible.
The UI on the right is called PartyManager and is completely redundant for mananging his buffs and on the left side you see him having the party frames enabled in XpearlParty frames which also is redundant since he has a raidframe already.
And look at the placement of everything...its stacked up so it so it perfectly blocks almost all sight.
So if you cannot fathom this screenshot as a noob troll attempt you *clearly* havent played alot of mmos at all.
By the love of GOD, I don't ever want ot go back to this mess lol, no thanks i'm fine with my 5 + 3 mouse attacks.
So you linked a picture from WoW in the TBC expansion where EVERYTHING is clutched up? This is clearly a UI that VERY few used so I call bs.
What is worse though, is the Zenimax team deliberately from scratch actually intending a measly, lackluster 5+1 actionbars.
I had one of the funniest time playing TBC back then and i rather have options in combat than this dumbed down system in ESO.
But most of you will first find out after a few months of gameplay because you dont understand what im talking about.
You've clearly never played as a healer in 25m raids in wow. This is a typical healer setup, though with a smaller screen than I used...
I raided vanilla wow + TBC on a hardcore level and none of our healers posted screenshots of a setup remotely like this.
The UI was often a discussion on our forums and a good healer always keep his screen
as clean as possible.
The UI on the right is called PartyManager and is completely redundant for mananging his buffs and on the left side you see him having the party frames enabled in XpearlParty frames which also is redundant since he has a raidframe already.
And look at the placement of everything...its stacked up so it so it perfectly blocks almost all sight.
So if you cannot fathom this screenshot as a noob troll attempt you *clearly* havent played alot of mmos at all.
Search paragon healer UI. it will look identical to this, they just have a bigger screen...and they are rated the best in the world.
As other people have said -- you have 12 active skills + real time light attacks, heavy attacks, blocking, and dodging. And let's face it, other mmos are merely about rotations. There's an optimal rotation for all your abilities, that you rinse and repeat over and over following their cooldowns. That is the real, boring, watered down shit. ESO, on the other hand, has decided that quality, planning, and timing are more important than mashing a large rotation of buttons or, god forbid, having utilities like Warlock Helper do it for you. To say ESO is dumbed down from WoW or some other easy mode MMO is laughable and borderline trolling.
[edit] I forgot to add, when each class has ten billion skills in a rotation, you end up with every single person having exactly the same skills in those classes, smashing the same buttons. That means every paladin is the same (or every two paladins once you throw in trait lines,) every warlock, every warrior, etc. There's no diversity, because if they wanted diversity, they'd have to create another ten billion skills for every class and allow each person to select x amount from them. It's not feasible if you want to have a build-your-own character system. I'll take that system + action heavy combat + no combat add-ons to do my job for me over my entire screen being filled up with useless, unimmersive shit. [/edit]
I played a couple of different healing specs in WoW and I can tell you my screen did look similar to that. I didn't use the bars on the left and right but I had a couple of healing grids on the left and I had my countdown timers on the right. I did keep the majority of that screen clear but the fact that I had about 50 buttons each with a situational purpose was ridiculous.
The charcter models don't look sexy or strong and the armour looks horrable and bland.
I don't know what you mean about character models, they are fine in my opinion and they look like they come from and Elder Scrolls game but ARMOR there is seriously nothing wrong with it.
You do not have to have GLOWING, SPARKLING and BULKY armor for example crap that's comes out of WoW.
Here is something I looked up really quick that took no effort to fined and I'm pretty sure there are worse ones out there.
BTW sorry if this isn't what you mean of wanting something more then what ESO is offering I just figured if it's bland to you then your coming from a game that's got some type of crazy cool looking stuff that would belong IN THAT GAME.
'I'd rather log into' a forum and complain about a game I won't be playing.....
Thanks for the heads up.
As to your colour blandness, I'd suggest a new video card. When running ESO on ultra, bland isn't a word that comes to mind. I'm even wondering if you might not be talking about Skyrim.
'I'd rather log into' a forum and complain about a game I won't be playing.....
Thanks for the heads up.
As to your colour blandness, I'd suggest a new video card. When running ESO on ultra, bland isn't a word that comes to mind. I'm even wondering if you might not be talking about Skyrim.
If it wasnt for us critical gamers challenging and questioning games where developers make mistakes you'd still be sitting and playing ColecoVision, kid.
Originally posted by Husvik What do you expect from a console port. /jk (kinda)
This is exactly why there's only 5 active skills at a time. The game has to be playable using a controller. Try navigating combat with a controller in a game like WoW, LotRO or SWTOR. Doesn't make for an enjoyable experience.
Originally posted by InfiniteStrife Originally posted by Torwalden'I'd rather log into' a forum and complain about a game I won't be playing.....Thanks for the heads up.As to your colour blandness, I'd suggest a new video card. When running ESO on ultra, bland isn't a word that comes to mind. I'm even wondering if you might not be talking about Skyrim.
If it wasnt for us critical gamers challenging and questioning games where developers make mistakes you'd still be sitting and playing ColecoVision, kid.
or maybe it's that the technology got better? nope, this guy thinks it's because of the whiners that games have gotten better over the years LMAO
thanks for the laugh though. by the way, how did whiners talk to or express their whinny opinions to video game developers before the internet so games could get better? just curious lol
people didn't start getting overly angry and whinny about games until very recently, within the last 10-15 years at best.
'I'd rather log into' a forum and complain about a game I won't be playing.....
Thanks for the heads up.
As to your colour blandness, I'd suggest a new video card. When running ESO on ultra, bland isn't a word that comes to mind. I'm even wondering if you might not be talking about Skyrim.
If it wasnt for us critical gamers challenging and questioning games where developers make mistakes you'd still be sitting and playing ColecoVision, kid.
And on the other hand, if it wasn't for critical gamers maybe WoW would still be worth playing.
Originally posted by TOWROK Originally posted by WarWitchThe charcter models don't look sexy or strong and the armour looks horrable and bland.
I don't know what you mean about character models, they are fine in my opinion and they look like they come from and Elder Scrolls game but ARMOR there is seriously nothing wrong with it.
You do not have to have GLOWING, SPARKLING and BULKY armor for example crap that's comes out of WoW.
Here is something I looked up really quick that took no effort to fined and I'm pretty sure there are worse ones out there.
BTW sorry if this isn't what you mean of wanting something more then what ESO is offering I just figured if it's bland to you then your coming from a game that's got some type of crazy cool looking stuff that would belong IN THAT GAME.
the models look pretty good compared to other mmo's and the armor does look painted on IMO but i would assume that has a lot to do with having mass amounts of people on the screen at once.
generally speaking, if someone is going to compare an MMO to the single player version and cry because the graphics or models are not as good then they are better off just playing the single player games.
Comments
Sounds like this isn't the game for you.
But I think many will disagree about the graphics and such, personally I think they are incredibly good, and I have heard that a lot from other people too. The pvp graphics are breathtakingly good, the first time you see a siege with trebuchets attacking a castle, prepare to have your jaw drop.
As far as ESO lasting in the MMO market, well, only time will tell. But you are overlooking the fact that they are casting a very wide net for this game. Console players alone could be a huge market which is untapped for MMOs. And while you don't like the 6 button per weapon hotkeys, many players like me feel just the opposite.
IMO the success of the game will all come down, like most games, to making sure its bug-free and playable on medium-level computers, and having good fun gameplay and a endgame that keeps you involved. If it does those things, it will be a huge hit. If it doesn't, it will be more of a niche game for comsole players and casual players who want to play an ES game with friends. Time will tell.
Elladan - ESO (AD)
Camring - SWTOR (Ebon Hawk)
Eol & Justinian - Rift (Faeblight)
Ceol and Duri - LotRO (Landroval)
Kili - WoW
Eol - Lineage 2
Camring - SWG
Justinian (Nimue), Camring - DAoC
Hmmm, interesting thread.
I personally liked it. But I find the dialog around this game to be interesting. I have heard people complain that it is not enough like the Elder Scrolls, which is crazy to me.
Then I hear people saying it is not really a MMO. Which is kind of crazy to me too.
I guess that is what the problem is, a lot of people have not accepted that this is a hybrid of sorts. I am very interested to see how that game pans out. I know this past beta really has me considering pre-ordering the game.
Exactly right. In MMOs like WoW and SWTOR you just blast skills in a rotation until you eventually run out of power. ESO is totally different. The limiting factor isn't cooldowns - there are no cooldowns. The limiting factor is your power pools. You can only do a few skills until you run out of power. And when you run out, you are much weaker and vulnerable. So the 'strategy' isn't developing the ideal skill rotation like in those other games and playing quickbar whack-a-mole until the boss is dead. The strategy in ESO is choosing what skills to put on your quickbar, and then watching the battle and deciding which skills to use, and when. Also you need to observe the enemy to see when they are vulnerable, because then 'heavy' attacks will cause critical knock-down hits. Someone who is watching the battle and reacting wisely will be a far better player than someone trying to use their ideal rotation and not assessing the situation.
Elladan - ESO (AD)
Camring - SWTOR (Ebon Hawk)
Eol & Justinian - Rift (Faeblight)
Ceol and Duri - LotRO (Landroval)
Kili - WoW
Eol - Lineage 2
Camring - SWG
Justinian (Nimue), Camring - DAoC
Yes, I'm a baddie and I cannot cope with a full action bar.
In fact it scares me so much that I am thinking about buying "My First Keyboard" with its fun, colorful keys to feel more at ease while playing video games and MMOs such as ESO.
I have heard the game is rated "Mature" too, which I think is rather distressing... I am sure I will be glad to have a reassuring visual anchor such as "My First Keyboard" while playing the game, to know I just have to look down, and that I can count on it to get a positive vibe when the violence on screen becomes intolerable.
Anyway, all of this to say that there aren't many games for us baddies... and before you ask, yes I have tried Hello Kitty Online, but I find keyboard turning too difficult, and also I found it hard to have to click on my cast bar to activate the three skills they have in game - "kissing", "hugging" and "eating raspberry muffins" - as I don't have the required dexterity to use short cuts yet... What's more they ask you to use the arrow keys to move (no click to move)... so I unsubbed!
So will you leave ESO alone please? Some of us baddies need a new home and I am sure there are plenty of other games out there for skilled players such as yourself (so you *really* don't need this one more game).
Q: how can you tell this is a pro gamer keyboard?
A: it doesn't have a MS Windows key! Lolz
and bitching about it all the while in the chat.
My 2 year old loves to read books. It's all what you teach them...
You've clearly never played as a healer in 25m raids in wow. This is a typical healer setup, though with a smaller screen than I used...
I raided vanilla wow + TBC on a hardcore level and none of our healers posted screenshots of a setup remotely like this.
The UI was often a discussion on our forums and a good healer always keep his screen
as clean as possible.
The UI on the right is called PartyManager and is completely redundant for mananging his buffs and on the left side you see him having the party frames enabled in XpearlParty frames which also is redundant since he has a raidframe already.
And look at the placement of everything...its stacked up so it so it perfectly blocks almost all sight.
So if you cannot fathom this screenshot as a noob troll attempt you *clearly* havent played alot of mmos at all.
Search paragon healer UI. it will look identical to this, they just have a bigger screen...and they are rated the best in the world.
As other people have said -- you have 12 active skills + real time light attacks, heavy attacks, blocking, and dodging. And let's face it, other mmos are merely about rotations. There's an optimal rotation for all your abilities, that you rinse and repeat over and over following their cooldowns. That is the real, boring, watered down shit. ESO, on the other hand, has decided that quality, planning, and timing are more important than mashing a large rotation of buttons or, god forbid, having utilities like Warlock Helper do it for you. To say ESO is dumbed down from WoW or some other easy mode MMO is laughable and borderline trolling.
[edit] I forgot to add, when each class has ten billion skills in a rotation, you end up with every single person having exactly the same skills in those classes, smashing the same buttons. That means every paladin is the same (or every two paladins once you throw in trait lines,) every warlock, every warrior, etc. There's no diversity, because if they wanted diversity, they'd have to create another ten billion skills for every class and allow each person to select x amount from them. It's not feasible if you want to have a build-your-own character system. I'll take that system + action heavy combat + no combat add-ons to do my job for me over my entire screen being filled up with useless, unimmersive shit. [/edit]
I don't know what you mean about character models, they are fine in my opinion and they look like they come from and Elder Scrolls game but ARMOR there is seriously nothing wrong with it.
You do not have to have GLOWING, SPARKLING and BULKY armor for example crap that's comes out of WoW.
http://static.mmo-champion.com/mmoc/images/news/2009/october/tier10_rogue_hd.jpg
Here is something I looked up really quick that took no effort to fined and I'm pretty sure there are worse ones out there.
BTW sorry if this isn't what you mean of wanting something more then what ESO is offering I just figured if it's bland to you then your coming from a game that's got some type of crazy cool looking stuff that would belong IN THAT GAME.
'I'd rather log into' a forum and complain about a game I won't be playing.....
Thanks for the heads up.
As to your colour blandness, I'd suggest a new video card. When running ESO on ultra, bland isn't a word that comes to mind. I'm even wondering if you might not be talking about Skyrim.
If it wasnt for us critical gamers challenging and questioning games where developers make mistakes you'd still be sitting and playing ColecoVision, kid.
This is exactly why there's only 5 active skills at a time. The game has to be playable using a controller. Try navigating combat with a controller in a game like WoW, LotRO or SWTOR. Doesn't make for an enjoyable experience.
or maybe it's that the technology got better? nope, this guy thinks it's because of the whiners that games have gotten better over the years LMAO
thanks for the laugh though. by the way, how did whiners talk to or express their whinny opinions to video game developers before the internet so games could get better? just curious lol
people didn't start getting overly angry and whinny about games until very recently, within the last 10-15 years at best.
And on the other hand, if it wasn't for critical gamers maybe WoW would still be worth playing.
(Just playing devil's advocate here.)
You do not have to have GLOWING, SPARKLING and BULKY armor for example crap that's comes out of WoW.
http://static.mmo-champion.com/mmoc/images/news/2009/october/tier10_rogue_hd.jpg
Here is something I looked up really quick that took no effort to fined and I'm pretty sure there are worse ones out there.
BTW sorry if this isn't what you mean of wanting something more then what ESO is offering I just figured if it's bland to you then your coming from a game that's got some type of crazy cool looking stuff that would belong IN THAT GAME.
the models look pretty good compared to other mmo's and the armor does look painted on IMO but i would assume that has a lot to do with having mass amounts of people on the screen at once.
generally speaking, if someone is going to compare an MMO to the single player version and cry because the graphics or models are not as good then they are better off just playing the single player games.