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(Perspective), WoW alone made 1.8B each year when it was above 10million subscribers..

BearKnightBearKnight Member CommonPosts: 461

Look, I hate WoW for being the easy-mode genre ruiner that it is more than the next guy, but I have to give perspective where it is required.

 

Blizzard was making 1.8Billion, with a B, with ONLY WoW each year when it was above 10million subscribers. We're not even talking about their horrendously done cash-grab cash-shop that they added either with all those $25 mounts, bags, etc etc.

Blizzard could, at one point, had easily been making 2.2Billion a year at one point.

 

So when you add up all the other older MMOs still running, EvE online, EQ, EQ2, Anarchy Online, DAOC, Asheron's Call (yea, it's still running), Ultima Online, etc etc. You get a clear picture that PayToPlay dwarfs the "F2P" market by a large majority.

 

Just recently it was "predicted", ie: GUESSED, that the F2P market will FINALLY reach 2.5B total by 2015. That kind of tells you how poorly it is doing in comparison when one title alone is making almost that much as of last year or so (I don't keep up with WoW's numbers, they really don't matter to me personally....just like how McDonalds serving hundreds of millions a year doesn't make them a provider of quality food).

 

As of Feb 7th, according to Google, of this year WoW was down to 9.6 million subscribers. That is $1.728 Billion yearly.....

 

So yea, there's that. :)

 

 

Maths:

10,000,000 x $15 = 150,000,000 * 12 = $1,800,000,000 / year

9,600,000 X $15 = 144,000,000 * 12 =  $1,728,000,000 / year

Comments

  • flizzerflizzer Member RarePosts: 2,455

    I've always been frustrated with my dislike of WoW. I know on this forum it is cool and hip to dislike WoW and to be a real gamer you have to disparage the game every chance you get.

     

    I simply dislike the cartoon art style.  The actual gameplay I am sure I would love since I am a casual type who really doesn't even like combat.  The easier things are , the more I can appreciate the world and story and such. So if it wasn't for the horrible look of the game, I probably would be a huge WoW supporter. 

     

    WoW will continue to make oodles of money for years to come, perhaps not like in the early days of the franchise.  I have no animosity against people who do like and play the game.  Hell, even people who claim to hate the game are often ex-WoW players who are simply tired of playing it. 

  • RoguewizRoguewiz Member UncommonPosts: 711

    You can't look at it from a dollar value standpoint.  You have to approach it from a percentage of games that are profitable standpoint.  Most games, at least the way they are now, can't maintain a P2P model for a long period of time due to various things ranging from the "money-man" saying they need to release it now, to failed promises at release.

    So, sure.  Blizzard was making $1.8 Billion a year.  That is one game out of hundreds.  It also has a huge fanboi following and has been around for quite a while.

    Take that into consideration, and then you realize that P2P isn't for every game.  Profits are profits.  If the game is profitable as F2P, so be it.

    Raquelis in various games
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  • djazzydjazzy Member Posts: 3,578
    Ok, they make a lot of money although I don't think you can use those numbers. Payment models are different in places like China than they are in the west.
  • josmmzjosmmz Member UncommonPosts: 6
    I dont play WOW  but  idk why ppl hate F2P when its done right  ......  then why dont u just  compare  WOW  vs others  subs games?  and why blizzard is aproaching this market with  Heartstone and WoW itself?
  • BearKnightBearKnight Member CommonPosts: 461
    Originally posted by Roguewiz

    You can't look at it from a dollar value standpoint.  You have to approach it from a percentage of games that are profitable standpoint.  Most games, at least the way they are now, can't maintain a P2P model for a long period of time due to various things ranging from the "money-man" saying they need to release it now, to failed promises at release.

    So, sure.  Blizzard was making $1.8 Billion a year.  That is one game out of hundreds.  It also has a huge fanboi following and has been around for quite a while.

    Take that into consideration, and then you realize that P2P isn't for every game.  Profits are profits.  If the game is profitable as F2P, so be it.

    Oh no I agree completely.

     

    One of the major problems with P2P is that the "suits", aka: publishers or producers, whom are pulling the strings can't lie anymore with a P2P title. 

     

    The ENTIRE reason the F2P-fad has taken off is because producers & publishers would LIE boldface to us in interviews and push their PR teams to drive hype-trains for their product to maximum levels so people get shafted by buying a product that is NOTHING like it was billed to be. 

     

    Hence F2P now so people can login to try to game before paying oodles and oodles of $$$ for the same crap they'd get for only $15/month.

     

    P2P is superior to F2P IF and only IF the product is worth the subscription. Most games aren't anymore because developers AND producers alike are completely devoid of a connection to what the market actually wants. 

     

    EQ:Next is one such example of that disconnect. Horribly art-style, GW2's action-based combat system, and "Free-To-Play" system designed to suck every dollar out of you from things you would normally get for FREE with a $15/month sub. 

     

    It's actually very sad when you think about it long-term.

  • BearKnightBearKnight Member CommonPosts: 461
    Originally posted by josmmz
    I dont play WOW  but  idk why ppl hate F2P when its done right  ......  then why dont u just  compare  WOW  vs others  subs games?  and why blizzard is aproaching this market with  Heartstone and WoW itself?

    I've yet to see a "F2P" model done "right". Every single one of them sells items to you that you'd normally be able to obtain in-game with normal effort. Even if you can obtain it they allow people to go the Pay-To-Win route by buying an item you'd normally work hard for.

     

    32slot bags in EQ2 anyone?

     

    Mounts? Yea, that's PayToWin if it is faster/better than your current mount and isn't just a new pretty graphic.

     

    Please give me one example of "F2P" done right.

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 32,084
    Originally posted by BearKnight

    Maths:

    10,000,000 x $15 = 150,000,000 * 12 = $1,800,000,000 / year

    9,600,000 X $15 = 144,000,000 * 12 =  $1,728,000,000 / year

    I don't think your "maths" are exactly correct.

    What actual percentage of those sub fees do they keep after taxes and other expenses?

     

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  • RoguewizRoguewiz Member UncommonPosts: 711

    Agreed, but worth is a matter of perspective.  Some of the hybrid models (things that are F2P with limitations, or Sub based), are still worthwhile with either model.

    EQ, EQ2, and DDO are prime examples.  I like all 3 games and would play (if my friends would), and would sub if they played.

    Raquelis in various games
    Played: Everything
    Playing: Nioh 2, Civ6
    Wants: The World
    Anticipating: Everquest Next Crowfall, Pantheon, Elden Ring

    Tank - Healer - Support: The REAL Trinity
  • VaporsVapors Member UncommonPosts: 407
    Originally posted by BearKnight

    Look, I hate WoW for being the easy-mode genre ruiner that it is more than the next guy, but I have to give perspective where it is required.

     

    Blizzard was making 1.8Billion, with a B, with ONLY WoW each year when it was above 10million subscribers. We're not even talking about their horrendously done cash-grab cash-shop that they added either with all those $25 mounts, bags, etc etc.

    Blizzard could, at one point, had easily been making 2.2Billion a year at one point.

     

    So when you add up all the other older MMOs still running, EvE online, EQ, EQ2, Anarchy Online, DAOC, Asheron's Call (yea, it's still running), Ultima Online, etc etc. You get a clear picture that PayToPlay dwarfs the "F2P" market by a large majority.

     

    Just recently it was "predicted", ie: GUESSED, that the F2P market will FINALLY reach 2.5B total by 2015. That kind of tells you how poorly it is doing in comparison when one title alone is making almost that much as of last year or so (I don't keep up with WoW's numbers, they really don't matter to me personally....just like how McDonalds serving hundreds of millions a year doesn't make them a provider of quality food).

     

    As of Feb 7th, according to Google, of this year WoW was down to 9.6 million subscribers. That is $1.728 Billion yearly.....

     

    So yea, there's that. :)

     

     

    Maths:

    10,000,000 x $15 = 150,000,000 * 12 = $1,800,000,000 / year

    9,600,000 X $15 = 144,000,000 * 12 =  $1,728,000,000 / year

    even if ur simple calculation is right, thats just a turnover, not a pure surplus. And look at the american oil companies doing over 250.000.000.000 turnovers hows that lol
  • josmmzjosmmz Member UncommonPosts: 6

    The fact  bags , xp potions  and costumes doesnt make it P2W.....

    I never spent a single dollar on games who focus on sell that and i still archive  everything  u just seens to whining without ever test it  and EQ2  was a fail everybody knows that sorry ur butthurt and even so they are removiing some restrictions for F2P cuz ppl are learning..

    Rift, Neverwinter, DDO (hard work but im close to lvl cap as 100% F2P), Path of exile, DCUO ( has a lot of content for free), i know about others from friends who has the same philosophy as me but i personally never try them. 

    i Maxed out this games as F2P without problem or grind  and if u check the NEWs  some games are removing some F2P restrictions   the market wants  costumes, xp potions, pets that doesnt do shit or maybe  get ur loot  for u.  thats the F2P  done right.

    Lets add  the biggest tittles around even  if not RPGMMO :  Dota 2, LoL, Smite, Team fortress, Planetsite 2, might and magic TCG, soon heartstone, infinity wars, etc. all theses u can play without even  asking urself wheere should i spent my money?

    BTW  many F2P tittles u could spent 5$ - 10$ a month and u get fancy stuffs if u like and wish  and it will be even cheaper that a subscription model

  • josmmzjosmmz Member UncommonPosts: 6

    The fact  bags , xp potions  and costumes doesnt make it P2W.....

    I never spent a single dollar on games who focus on sell that and i still archive  everything  u just seens to whining without ever test it  and EQ2  was a fail everybody knows that sorry ur butthurt and even so they are removiing some restrictions for F2P cuz ppl are learning..

    Rift, NeverwinterDDO (hard work but im close to lvl cap as 100% F2P), Path of exileDCUO ( has a lot of content for free), i know about others from friends who has the same philosophy as me but i personally never try them. 

    i Maxed out this games as F2P without problem or grind  and if u check the NEWs  some games are removing some F2P restrictions   the market wants  costumesxp potionspets that doesnt do shit or maybe  get ur loot  for u.  thats the F2P  done right.

    Lets add  the biggest tittles around even  if not RPGMMO :  Dota 2, LoL, Smite, Team fortress, Planetsite 2, might and magic TCG, soon heartstone, infinity wars, etc. all theses u can play without even  asking urself wheere should i spent my money?

    BTW  many F2P tittles u could spent 5$ - 10$ a month and u get fancy stuffs if u like and wish  and it will be even cheaper that a subscription model

  • NadiaNadia Member UncommonPosts: 11,798
    Originally posted by BearKnight

    Blizzard was making 1.8Billion, with a B, with ONLY WoW each year when it was above 10million subscribers. We're not even talking about their horrendously done cash-grab cash-shop that they added either with all those $25 mounts, bags, etc etc.

    related article

    http://venturebeat.com/2013/09/11/analyst-world-of-warcraft-revenues-drop-54-in-7-months/

    Superdata released a report that claims World of Warcraft generated around $93 million in total revenues in April.
    That’s a ton of cash, but it’s way down from the $204 million the MMO generated in September.
     
     
    I havent looked Blizzard financials so I don't how accurate the Superdata info is
  • BladestromBladestrom Member UncommonPosts: 5,001
    1.x billion profit a year and for that they give you 2.5 extra levels a year and a handful of raids and side quests. Mugsaywhat.

    rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar

    Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D

  • Ender4Ender4 Member UncommonPosts: 2,247


    EQ:Next is one such example of that disconnect. Horribly art-style, GW2's action-based combat system, and "Free-To-Play" system designed to suck every dollar out of you from things you would normally get for FREE with a $15/month sub.

    Huh?

    The art style is fine, like 50% of MMORPG released are more action based these days and they haven't really given any info about their pay system yet. I mean fine if you hate FTP but don't take a stab at a game that you haven't really seen any concrete info on yet doing it~.

    I won't pay a monthly fee to play a game unless it is by far the best thing out. GW2 pretty much has the right idea. If they are making money then that model will likely catch on. Buy to play, spend for fluff.

  • ThupliThupli Member RarePosts: 1,318
    Originally posted by BearKnight

    Look, I hate WoW for being the easy-mode genre ruiner that it is more than the next guy, but I have to give perspective where it is required.

     

    Blizzard was making 1.8Billion, with a B, with ONLY WoW each year when it was above 10million subscribers. We're not even talking about their horrendously done cash-grab cash-shop that they added either with all those $25 mounts, bags, etc etc.

    Blizzard could, at one point, had easily been making 2.2Billion a year at one point.

     

    So when you add up all the other older MMOs still running, EvE online, EQ, EQ2, Anarchy Online, DAOC, Asheron's Call (yea, it's still running), Ultima Online, etc etc. You get a clear picture that PayToPlay dwarfs the "F2P" market by a large majority.

     

    Just recently it was "predicted", ie: GUESSED, that the F2P market will FINALLY reach 2.5B total by 2015. That kind of tells you how poorly it is doing in comparison when one title alone is making almost that much as of last year or so (I don't keep up with WoW's numbers, they really don't matter to me personally....just like how McDonalds serving hundreds of millions a year doesn't make them a provider of quality food).

     

    As of Feb 7th, according to Google, of this year WoW was down to 9.6 million subscribers. That is $1.728 Billion yearly.....

     

    So yea, there's that. :)

     

     

    Maths:

    10,000,000 x $15 = 150,000,000 * 12 = $1,800,000,000 / year

    9,600,000 X $15 = 144,000,000 * 12 =  $1,728,000,000 / year

    Calculating how much they GROSS is vastly different than how much they NET.

     

    You don't know their expenses.  I'm sure their expenses are ridiculously high.

  • ThupliThupli Member RarePosts: 1,318
    Originally posted by BearKnight

    Please give me one example of "F2P" done right.

     

    I'm taking a break from GW2 right now, but IMO, that is F2P/B2P done right.  They really nailed it, IMO.  Lots of respect for ANET on that.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by Thupli
    Originally posted by BearKnight

    Please give me one example of "F2P" done right.

     

    I'm taking a break from GW2 right now, but IMO, that is F2P/B2P done right.  They really nailed it, IMO.  Lots of respect for ANET on that.

    marvel heroes .. fun 30 hours (took me 30, others may vary) of story content that needs no money to enjoy

    STO .. fun story content ... i am having fun and paying nothing.

    They are don "right" for me.

     

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