Originally posted by cheyane There were hardly any quests in the original Everquest it should have been called Evercamp.
I remember a promo video for EQ's 10th anniversary that stated that there were over 3000 items that had never been discovered by players. I wonder how many of those items were through quests that were never found.
Originally posted by cheyane There were hardly any quests in the original Everquest it should have been called Evercamp.
I remember a promo video for EQ's 10th anniversary that stated that there were over 3000 items that had never been discovered by players. I wonder how many of those items were through quests that were never found.
I heard something like that as well, and I think that is great. The game world should always have some mystery to it, stones left unturned, one more hidden cave or dungeon, etc...
There were a hell of a lot of quests in EQ. The catch was that you had to find them through exploration and dialogue, so most people never knew they existed. There were quests everywhere. Most people simply didn't do them, largely because the rewards weren't worth effort for most. Most of the early quests gave you a couple silver or some worthless trash item, etc.
So, the only quests people were commonly aware of were things like the Paw of Oppola, Ghoulbane, etc.(read: big ticket item quests).
Quest wont be the focal point. The will be something you do because you want lore or story. They wont be something you grind for levels.
or atleast I hope.
While I personally think quests will be many and varied I do feel that you are correct in that it is for lore and story but I also think you can use them to gain levels if one chose to. I also think there will be other avenues to progress your character just as reliably as questing. Which when boiled down is the true definition of a sandbox. Non-Linear gameplay.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
Originally posted by cheyane There were hardly any quests in the original Everquest it should have been called Evercamp.
I remember a promo video for EQ's 10th anniversary that stated that there were over 3000 items that had never been discovered by players. I wonder how many of those items were through quests that were never found.
That is so awesome if true. I really really hope EQN is as mysterious and indepth as the original. Sadly I never played the original.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
Originally posted by cheyane There were hardly any quests in the original Everquest it should have been called Evercamp.
I remember a promo video for EQ's 10th anniversary that stated that there were over 3000 items that had never been discovered by players. I wonder how many of those items were through quests that were never found.
That is so awesome if true. I really really hope EQN is as mysterious and indepth as the original. Sadly I never played the original.
There were a hell of a lot of quests in EQ. The catch was that you had to find them through exploration and dialogue, so most people never knew they existed. There were quests everywhere. Most people simply didn't do them, largely because the rewards weren't worth effort for most. Most of the early quests gave you a couple silver or some worthless trash item, etc.
So, the only quests people were commonly aware of were things like the Paw of Oppola, Ghoulbane, etc.(read: big ticket item quests).
The EQ quest system was awful.
It amounted to a tiny handful of people with tons of time on their hands spending months trying semi-random possibilities, then posting the results on spoiler sites. The other 99.999% of the people would then read these spoiler sites for the answers.
EQ2 still has some ridiculous quests like this, like "Words of Magic", "To Speak as a Dragon", and "Knights of the Round", where the solutions were clearly crowd-sourced, because you could literally spends years of random search trying to track down all the components even if you took all the hints seriously.
One of WoW's crushing blows to early EQ2 was a quest system that empowered the average player to avoid spoiler sites and still make progress at a reasonable rate without falling behind his play-group.
There were a hell of a lot of quests in EQ. The catch was that you had to find them through exploration and dialogue, so most people never knew they existed. There were quests everywhere. Most people simply didn't do them, largely because the rewards weren't worth effort for most. Most of the early quests gave you a couple silver or some worthless trash item, etc.
So, the only quests people were commonly aware of were things like the Paw of Oppola, Ghoulbane, etc.(read: big ticket item quests).
The EQ quest system was awful.
It was the first of its kind. And yet, it was a thousand times for immersive and fufilling than modern quest "systems". Quests should be grand adventures, not systemized led by the balls leveling gimmicks.
Sure, user-generated quests would be "sandboxy". Dev-generated quests would not be.
Since most people assume "quest" means what it means in basically every MMO out there, ie dev-generated, you should be clear if you mean to imply "user-generated quests".
Sandbox = User Generated Content.
Anything that allows players to create UGC is a sandbox. What the content is and how it's implemented doesn't matter.
SOE is using StoryBricks for EQN. That's a pretty good bet then we will have story creation tools involving quests. Then there's that whole panel for EQN at SOE live that going to talk about the exact same thing.
Really if people would just ask questions or do some digging to find out what we actually know about the game, all of these assumptions wouldn't be needed.
Sure, user-generated quests would be "sandboxy". Dev-generated quests would not be.
Since most people assume "quest" means what it means in basically every MMO out there, ie dev-generated, you should be clear if you mean to imply "user-generated quests".
Sandbox = User Generated Content.
Anything that allows players to create UGC is a sandbox. What the content is and how it's implemented doesn't matter.
SOE is using StoryBricks for EQN. That's a pretty good bet then we will have story creation tools involving quests. Then there's that whole panel for EQN at SOE live that going to talk about the exact same thing.
Really if people would just ask questions or do some digging to find out what we actually know about the game, all of these assumptions wouldn't be needed.
I've studied StoryBricks intensively.
I was responding to the actual thread as it exists, not some hypothetical thread about StoryBricks.
At this point we don't know whether StoryBricks will be used as a dev tool or exposed to players as part of a "Foundry" system.
If it's used in a foundry system, does that mean you can program open world NPCs? Or just NPC's in instances you design. The latter would be less sandboxy than the former (but better than nothing, eg EQ2 dungeon maker).
Originally posted by cheyane There were hardly any quests in the original Everquest it should have been called Evercamp.
I remember a promo video for EQ's 10th anniversary that stated that there were over 3000 items that had never been discovered by players. I wonder how many of those items were through quests that were never found.
The games needs and will have quests. Let's just hope they are not all strung together and hubbed together and are not grindy.
I like the old school EQ quests that just give hints about the quest's goal, no quest trackers, just a collection of stories and rumors and if you obtain certain items during your adventures and know who is looking for them you complete a quest.
Originally posted by mbd1968 If it's going to be sandbox and there will probably be no quests... how can they call it Everquest ??!!??
Who told you there are no quests in sandbox games? Asherons Cal is very much sandbox and loaded with quests but you dont know where the quests are to be found and even you talk with an npc and if you dont read carefully what he say you dont know you got a quest from him/her.
This game will be as they decide it will be ,I beleve the game will be very good but different from those early mmorpg's like ultima eq and ac. They need bigger audience.
Originally posted by cheyane There were hardly any quests in the original Everquest it should have been called Evercamp.
I remember a promo video for EQ's 10th anniversary that stated that there were over 3000 items that had never been discovered by players. I wonder how many of those items were through quests that were never found.
Conversely, you had Fippy Darkpaw...
Which was so popular they had to open a second server.
Or you could read what I actually wrote: "You can add quests to a sandbox, but the more of a focus they become, the less "sandboxy" the game becomes."
I'm not attempting to precisely identify a border between sandbox and themepark. Some games are less sandboxy than others. The more themepark elements are added to a game, the less sandboxy it becomes. A focus on dev-generated quests is one such element.
There is no link between dev generated quests, or a lack there of, and themepark vs sandbox mmorpg.
You can have them, they can be completely gone from the game. It would still be a sandbox if it met other criteria.
Comments
I hope so too...quests are just spoon fed canned content that makes for a very stale gaming experience.
which was the meaning behind the name in the first place.
I remember a promo video for EQ's 10th anniversary that stated that there were over 3000 items that had never been discovered by players. I wonder how many of those items were through quests that were never found.
There were a hell of a lot of quests in EQ. The catch was that you had to find them through exploration and dialogue, so most people never knew they existed. There were quests everywhere. Most people simply didn't do them, largely because the rewards weren't worth effort for most. Most of the early quests gave you a couple silver or some worthless trash item, etc.
So, the only quests people were commonly aware of were things like the Paw of Oppola, Ghoulbane, etc.(read: big ticket item quests).
While I personally think quests will be many and varied I do feel that you are correct in that it is for lore and story but I also think you can use them to gain levels if one chose to. I also think there will be other avenues to progress your character just as reliably as questing. Which when boiled down is the true definition of a sandbox. Non-Linear gameplay.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
That is so awesome if true. I really really hope EQN is as mysterious and indepth as the original. Sadly I never played the original.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=-ZCMcJ7yOww#t=114s
The EQ quest system was awful.
It amounted to a tiny handful of people with tons of time on their hands spending months trying semi-random possibilities, then posting the results on spoiler sites. The other 99.999% of the people would then read these spoiler sites for the answers.
EQ2 still has some ridiculous quests like this, like "Words of Magic", "To Speak as a Dragon", and "Knights of the Round", where the solutions were clearly crowd-sourced, because you could literally spends years of random search trying to track down all the components even if you took all the hints seriously.
One of WoW's crushing blows to early EQ2 was a quest system that empowered the average player to avoid spoiler sites and still make progress at a reasonable rate without falling behind his play-group.
It was the first of its kind. And yet, it was a thousand times for immersive and fufilling than modern quest "systems". Quests should be grand adventures, not systemized led by the balls leveling gimmicks.
Sandbox = User Generated Content.
Anything that allows players to create UGC is a sandbox. What the content is and how it's implemented doesn't matter.
SOE is using StoryBricks for EQN. That's a pretty good bet then we will have story creation tools involving quests. Then there's that whole panel for EQN at SOE live that going to talk about the exact same thing.
Really if people would just ask questions or do some digging to find out what we actually know about the game, all of these assumptions wouldn't be needed.
I've studied StoryBricks intensively.
I was responding to the actual thread as it exists, not some hypothetical thread about StoryBricks.
At this point we don't know whether StoryBricks will be used as a dev tool or exposed to players as part of a "Foundry" system.
If it's used in a foundry system, does that mean you can program open world NPCs? Or just NPC's in instances you design. The latter would be less sandboxy than the former (but better than nothing, eg EQ2 dungeon maker).
Conversely, you had Fippy Darkpaw...
All your sandbox are belong to us quests
The games needs and will have quests. Let's just hope they are not all strung together and hubbed together and are not grindy.
I like the old school EQ quests that just give hints about the quest's goal, no quest trackers, just a collection of stories and rumors and if you obtain certain items during your adventures and know who is looking for them you complete a quest.
Who told you there are no quests in sandbox games? Asherons Cal is very much sandbox and loaded with quests but you dont know where the quests are to be found and even you talk with an npc and if you dont read carefully what he say you dont know you got a quest from him/her.
This game will be as they decide it will be ,I beleve the game will be very good but different from those early mmorpg's like ultima eq and ac. They need bigger audience.
Which was so popular they had to open a second server.
There is no link between dev generated quests, or a lack there of, and themepark vs sandbox mmorpg.
You can have them, they can be completely gone from the game. It would still be a sandbox if it met other criteria.
Which is what I was trying to get across to you.
Legends of Kesmai, UO, EQ, AO, DAoC, AC, SB, RO, SWG, EVE, EQ2, CoH, GW, VG:SOH, WAR, Aion, DF, CO, MO, DN, Tera, SWTOR, RO2, DP, GW2, PS2, BnS, NW, FF:XIV, ESO, EQ:NL
So Op how about. renaming it to....
Never Quest
apologies if somebody beat me to that could not be arsed to sift through the other posts.