most of the current crop of MMO players have not and probably will not make it through the tutorial aspects of this game.
This is a real shame because there is a ton of potential in this game but it seems that most will never get to see it because the tutorial is "boring."
We see so many people on these forums clamoring for sandbox titles yet there is barely any support for this title. Why not? If you are so desperately seeking a sandbox experience, here's a great title to try. The best part is that it's free, you just need to invest some time and patience to learn the game.
Unfortunately, I think a lot of players enjoy the idea of a sandbox style game but so far it seems that most can't or won't even play one.
Well, you said it right there, the tutorial is boring.
This has nothing to do with sandboxes failing in the west. It does have to do with game companies not having a clue about making their games engaging at the start.
Why should any person assume that the rest of the game is good if the start, the part where the developers "have their audience" sucks?
Let you in on a secret......its up to the players to make the game engaging in a sandbox.
HAHAHAHAHA
Best....argument.....ever!
It's not the game that's bad, YOU ARE, for not making it the game you want it to be. So perfect!
Just because every car has similar features doesn't mean that Ferraris are copies of Model Ts. Progress requires failure and refining.
Just because some site tells you its a sandbox does not mean that it is. So what if you can learn skills from different classes? You have to essentially play *as that class* in order to use those skills, if even for a few moments. When you use a skill from a different class tree in combat you are locked out of all similar skills from different classes for a length of time so great that should you try any maneuver like that in PvP youd basically be dead before your next attack.
Age of Wushu is a theme park MMORPG with 30 day limits on most items procured through the cash shop in the game. Even the bag extensions have time limits.
You want to know why it doesnt work in the west?
Because westerners dont want to pay their hard earned money for limited time crap. They dont want to rent their outfit. Theyd rather pay more and own it.
As for your initial point, that Sandbox games dont work in the west.... uh....
Ultima Online was created in the west.
Darkfall was too.
EvE, yep, its a western title.
Asheron's Call... made in Boston!
Entropia Universe: Stockholm, baby!
I'll stop now.
Another "timed fashion" troll. If the item bags weren't so easy to obtain, you might have a point about them - but they are easy to get, so it's a silly complaint.
As for the styles, there are CLEAR matchups that you simply do not understand. Yes, my main set skills do far higher damage at a great efficiency. No, they aren't always the best choice.
Perhaps I'm teamed with a Shaolin who synergizes well with knock up. I'll use lotus palm. Or perhaps I need more lock down. Enter Eagle Claw. Or maybe people are kiting too dang much. Boom, Corrosion Palm. There are SO many options that have different synergies both in duels AND in teams.
As for set GCD, it's to prevent one man armies. The game forces you to hit huge synergies with others as opposed to doing it all yourself. However, I believe that later in the game there's a way of removing different set GCD.
Youre actually not saying anything different than what people do in a Theme Park game.
There is nothing Age of Wushu related that is Sandbox.
As for Timed Fashion Trolling... lol sorry no I quit AoW after a couple months of Beta because it basically was a rip-off. I havent posted anything on this game until today, when I saw your silly comparison and just had to read the thread. I wanted to tell you plainly that you're wrong. You're wrong on many levels.
That doesnt make my post a troll post. That makes my post one that tells you you're wrong. I really dont give a damn how you'll react. Im not even going to be logged into the site in another 5 minutes.
most of the current crop of MMO players have not and probably will not make it through the tutorial aspects of this game.
This is a real shame because there is a ton of potential in this game but it seems that most will never get to see it because the tutorial is "boring."
We see so many people on these forums clamoring for sandbox titles yet there is barely any support for this title. Why not? If you are so desperately seeking a sandbox experience, here's a great title to try. The best part is that it's free, you just need to invest some time and patience to learn the game.
Unfortunately, I think a lot of players enjoy the idea of a sandbox style game but so far it seems that most can't or won't even play one.
Well, you said it right there, the tutorial is boring.
This has nothing to do with sandboxes failing in the west. It does have to do with game companies not having a clue about making their games engaging at the start.
Why should any person assume that the rest of the game is good if the start, the part where the developers "have their audience" sucks?
You prove my point, thank you. You want instant gratification from your games which unfortunately doesn't usually happen with sandbox style games.
I've said it before and I'll say it again: games are played for entertainment and nothing more. It doesn't matter if it's a themepark or sandbox, if it's not fun, I'm not going to play it. I refuse to wade through hours of brain-numbingly boring tutorials to get to the fun. It's 2013; developers have the resources to make a tutorial interesting. It's a matter of ability.
This is not an issue of sandboxes not working in the west. This is a matter of poor design not working in the west.
Currently playing: GW2 (Maguuma), DAoC (Uthgard), & Aion Waiting For / Watching: TUG, CU, Black Desert, Archeage,Wildstar, and ESO.
most of the current crop of MMO players have not and probably will not make it through the tutorial aspects of this game.
This is a real shame because there is a ton of potential in this game but it seems that most will never get to see it because the tutorial is "boring."
We see so many people on these forums clamoring for sandbox titles yet there is barely any support for this title. Why not? If you are so desperately seeking a sandbox experience, here's a great title to try. The best part is that it's free, you just need to invest some time and patience to learn the game.
Unfortunately, I think a lot of players enjoy the idea of a sandbox style game but so far it seems that most can't or won't even play one.
Well, you said it right there, the tutorial is boring.
This has nothing to do with sandboxes failing in the west. It does have to do with game companies not having a clue about making their games engaging at the start.
Why should any person assume that the rest of the game is good if the start, the part where the developers "have their audience" sucks?
You prove my point, thank you. You want instant gratification from your games which unfortunately doesn't usually happen with sandbox style games.
I haven't played or followed AoW mostly for the same reason I haven't been paying attention to any new games- my gaming times already taken up by eve right now, but what stood out in the OP and in this exchange is whether or not the free to play crowd can really mix well with a sandbox game. They have been trained by developers to expect to be sucked into short term games quickly to try and get them spending right away, how much patience can you expect from them for tutorials and slow starting gameplay?
Also, I think its setting and advertising (or lack of advertising) are probably bigger issues than any design elements.
We see so many people on these forums clamoring for sandbox titles yet there is barely any support for this title. Why not? If you are so desperately seeking a sandbox experience, here's a great title to try. The best part is that it's free, you just need to invest some time and patience to learn the game.
Unfortunately, I think a lot of players enjoy the idea of a sandbox style game but so far it seems that most can't or won't even play one.
I believe I've stopped caring and 'being desperate'. More to the point why I will not play AoW.
Microtransactions, zoned, lore-aescethics
Sandbox and generally mmorpg's are not on my priority entertaiment list high enough anymore, to play a game that have so fundamental things I don't accept.
You are still missing the point. In a sandbox you are the one making that 15 hours of content, not watching it.
My point was speaking to the idea of instant gratification and allowing the content to draw you in.
Whether I'm "watching it" or whether the world and its game systems draw me in is not a concern to me. I don't require "instant gratification". But the game systems must draw me in. I wasn't drawn into Age of Wushu and as he said "the start is boring".
Which goes back to my first point.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
most of the current crop of MMO players have not and probably will not make it through the tutorial aspects of this game.
This is a real shame because there is a ton of potential in this game but it seems that most will never get to see it because the tutorial is "boring."
We see so many people on these forums clamoring for sandbox titles yet there is barely any support for this title. Why not? If you are so desperately seeking a sandbox experience, here's a great title to try. The best part is that it's free, you just need to invest some time and patience to learn the game.
Unfortunately, I think a lot of players enjoy the idea of a sandbox style game but so far it seems that most can't or won't even play one.
Well, you said it right there, the tutorial is boring.
This has nothing to do with sandboxes failing in the west. It does have to do with game companies not having a clue about making their games engaging at the start.
Why should any person assume that the rest of the game is good if the start, the part where the developers "have their audience" sucks?
You prove my point, thank you. You want instant gratification from your games which unfortunately doesn't usually happen with sandbox style games.
No I don't prove your point.
There is a difference between sitting down and playing a game and being slowly drawn into its world and game systems and sitting down to a lackluster game that, at the start, doesn't draw you in at all.
Have you ever watched Wagner's Ring Cycle? Well I have. All four opras take about 15 hours.
and I sat through every one. Is that instant gratification? Could you do it? Not many can. Why could I do it? Becuse it was good. Because the music and story draw you in and that particular perfromance had amazing singers.
Have you ever heard someone leave a long movie and say "wow, that movie was three hours, it didn't feel like it. Why? Because the movie did a good job at pacing, at engaging the viewer.
You might have also heard some people say "omg that movie was 2 hours and it was too long. Because the movie didnt do a good job.
You are still missing the point. In a sandbox you are the one making that 15 hours of content, not watching it.
HE isn't missing the point, you are. Read it again, and again, and again until you finally get to what he is trying to say. Then you will understand.
You guys keep saying the people or you the player are what make a sandbox, well that is half true. What the other half is missing is an engaging world that draws you in and provides you that other half of content you want.
Like he says, if the tutorial can't even draw you in to the game why should I expect the normal game to draw me in? See I used the word tutorial, what the guy was talking about before you brought this instant gratification crap that nobody was talking about.
most of the current crop of MMO players have not and probably will not make it through the tutorial aspects of this game.
This is a real shame because there is a ton of potential in this game but it seems that most will never get to see it because the tutorial is "boring."
We see so many people on these forums clamoring for sandbox titles yet there is barely any support for this title. Why not? If you are so desperately seeking a sandbox experience, here's a great title to try. The best part is that it's free, you just need to invest some time and patience to learn the game.
Unfortunately, I think a lot of players enjoy the idea of a sandbox style game but so far it seems that most can't or won't even play one.
Well, you said it right there, the tutorial is boring.
This has nothing to do with sandboxes failing in the west. It does have to do with game companies not having a clue about making their games engaging at the start.
Why should any person assume that the rest of the game is good if the start, the part where the developers "have their audience" sucks?
You prove my point, thank you. You want instant gratification from your games which unfortunately doesn't usually happen with sandbox style games.
No I don't prove your point.
There is a difference between sitting down and playing a game and being slowly drawn into its world and game systems and sitting down to a lackluster game that, at the start, doesn't draw you in at all.
Have you ever watched Wagner's Ring Cycle? Well I have. All four opras take about 15 hours.
and I sat through every one. Is that instant gratification? Could you do it? Not many can. Why could I do it? Becuse it was good. Because the music and story draw you in and that particular perfromance had amazing singers.
Have you ever heard someone leave a long movie and say "wow, that movie was three hours, it didn't feel like it. Why? Because the movie did a good job at pacing, at engaging the viewer.
You might have also heard some people say "omg that movie was 2 hours and it was too long. Because the movie didnt do a good job.
You are still missing the point. In a sandbox you are the one making that 15 hours of content, not watching it.
HE isn't missing the point, you are. Read it again, and again, and again until you finally get to what he is trying to say. Then you will understand.
You guys keep saying the people or you the player are what make a sandbox, well that is half true. What the other half is missing is an engaging world that draws you in and provides you that other half of content you want.
Like he says, if the tutorial can't even draw you in to the game why should I expect the normal game to draw me in? See I used the word tutorial, what the guy was talking about before you brought this instant gratification crap that nobody was talking about.
Perhaps rely on your fellow veteran MMO player that has experienced all of the high level content in the game to guide your decision that the world draws you in FAR more once you complete the tutorial?
most of the current crop of MMO players have not and probably will not make it through the tutorial aspects of this game.
This is a real shame because there is a ton of potential in this game but it seems that most will never get to see it because the tutorial is "boring."
We see so many people on these forums clamoring for sandbox titles yet there is barely any support for this title. Why not? If you are so desperately seeking a sandbox experience, here's a great title to try. The best part is that it's free, you just need to invest some time and patience to learn the game.
Unfortunately, I think a lot of players enjoy the idea of a sandbox style game but so far it seems that most can't or won't even play one.
Well, you said it right there, the tutorial is boring.
This has nothing to do with sandboxes failing in the west. It does have to do with game companies not having a clue about making their games engaging at the start.
Why should any person assume that the rest of the game is good if the start, the part where the developers "have their audience" sucks?
You prove my point, thank you. You want instant gratification from your games which unfortunately doesn't usually happen with sandbox style games.
No I don't prove your point.
There is a difference between sitting down and playing a game and being slowly drawn into its world and game systems and sitting down to a lackluster game that, at the start, doesn't draw you in at all.
Have you ever watched Wagner's Ring Cycle? Well I have. All four opras take about 15 hours.
and I sat through every one. Is that instant gratification? Could you do it? Not many can. Why could I do it? Becuse it was good. Because the music and story draw you in and that particular perfromance had amazing singers.
Have you ever heard someone leave a long movie and say "wow, that movie was three hours, it didn't feel like it. Why? Because the movie did a good job at pacing, at engaging the viewer.
You might have also heard some people say "omg that movie was 2 hours and it was too long. Because the movie didnt do a good job.
You are still missing the point. In a sandbox you are the one making that 15 hours of content, not watching it.
HE isn't missing the point, you are. Read it again, and again, and again until you finally get to what he is trying to say. Then you will understand.
You guys keep saying the people or you the player are what make a sandbox, well that is half true. What the other half is missing is an engaging world that draws you in and provides you that other half of content you want.
Like he says, if the tutorial can't even draw you in to the game why should I expect the normal game to draw me in? See I used the word tutorial, what the guy was talking about before you brought this instant gratification crap that nobody was talking about.
Perhaps rely on your fellow veteran MMO player that has experienced all of the high level content in the game to guide your decision that the world draws you in FAR more once you complete the tutorial?
Veteran....so cute.
I'm a pro...must be true I said it.
The game is crap, if you need people to try and convince you to play even the beginning (which should be the easiest part to get hooked) then you know it's not worth your time.
Just because every car has similar features doesn't mean that Ferraris are copies of Model Ts. Progress requires failure and refining.
Been around MMO's since Ultima (MUDs before that, D&D before that), so yeah - I think veteran is more than fitting for me. I've CB tested nearly every F2P game that ever reached any sort of western market (well over 100). Worked as a VGM and a private server tester (Acclaim and Rappelz, respectively). What else are you going to ask for?
I'm about as veteran as you get without being a true insider.
Your post is truly ironic, considering you indict me for not backing up my claim of "being an MMO veteran" (see above for that correction). Yet you offer not one example as to why this game is crap.
Typical MMORPG troll.
Also, I find endgame content far more engaging than the beginning 10% of a game. Always have.
Originally posted by Alamareth Oh, and the mouse inversion people don't know how to use computers. You can freaking do that with a 3rd party program, so WHY is it a complaint about the game. If it matters to you that much, you'll figure it out - I have faith in the MMO gamer's ability to figure these things out themselves.
Not really .. you can invert the mouse, but then when you go to use the actual cursor, it's still inverted. Even more unusable. Plus, why should I have to hunt down a third-party app just to do something that the devs should have taken 5 minutes to implement in the first place (check box, setting flag, and if/negation)? If they can't do something as simple as that (which every other game I've played in quite awhile has), what else can't they take the time for?
Anyhow, I did solve it: I moved on to other, more interesting games.
Originally posted by Alamareth Oh, and the mouse inversion people don't know how to use computers. You can freaking do that with a 3rd party program, so WHY is it a complaint about the game. If it matters to you that much, you'll figure it out - I have faith in the MMO gamer's ability to figure these things out themselves.
Not really .. you can invert the mouse, but then when you go to use the actual cursor, it's still inverted. Even more unusable. Plus, why should I have to hunt down a third-party app just to do something that the devs should have taken 5 minutes to implement in the first place (check box, setting flag, and if/negation)? If they can't do something as simple as that (which every other game I've played in quite awhile has), what else can't they take the time for?
Anyhow, I did solve it: I moved on to other, more interesting games.
Pure and straight facepalm. You do it because it matters to you.
If you seriously can't figure out how to do it properly, then you would have NEVER figured out this game.
The reason why the developers probably never did it is because they frankly don't care about your super small extremely loud minority. I don't either.
Been around MMO's since Ultima (MUDs before that, D&D before that), so yeah - I think veteran is more than fitting for me. I've CB tested nearly every F2P game that ever reached any sort of western market (well over 100). Worked as a VGM and a private server tester (Acclaim and Rappelz, respectively). What else are you going to ask for?
I'm about as veteran as you get without being a true insider.
Your post is truly ironic, considering you indict me for not backing up my claim of "being an MMO veteran" (see above for that correction). Yet you offer not one example as to why this game is crap.
Typical MMORPG troll.
My point being that, great you might have played a bunch of crap, I have as well. I've developed as well, and released and etc..again we're on the internet so making claims means nothing and I'm sure we're both unwilling to offer credentials so it's moot. Moving on...
The game itself is an example.
Poor UI, poor gameplay, horrid tutorial and beginning, the only good animations are in combat the game looks horrible outside of screen shots (seems dead and cardboard), limited action sets that pretend they offer depth when really it's just a clone of GW-style action sets, a true rental-style money-grab system, I could go on but I feel that's enough to validate my point.
Just because every car has similar features doesn't mean that Ferraris are copies of Model Ts. Progress requires failure and refining.
So many responses that continue to prove my point. It's not a bad thing that people want instant action and to be the hero on day one. I'm not trying to debate that point.
However, these are fundamental reasons why sandboxes won't work in the west anymore. If players want a truly open environment and game systems that will promote long-term, player driven content, there's going to be a learning curve which may not translate into super exciting game play right off the bat.
As the Original Poster of this thread, and someone who played SWG in the past, could you please indicate everything that is "Sandbox" about this game?
This is just a simply request, and you don't have to do it. But I've been playing since about the third day after official launch, and it no where meets my personal standard of what makes a proper Sandbox game.
I use Ultima Online as an example when looking at self proclaimed Sandbox games.
Due to frequent travel in my youth, English isn't something I consider my primary language (and thus I obtained quirky ways of writing). German and French were always easier for me despite my family being U.S. citizens for over a century. Spanish I learned as a requirement in school, Japanese and Korean I acquired for my youthful desire of anime and gaming (and also work now). I only debate in English to help me work with it (and limit things). In addition, I'm not smart enough to remain fluent in everything and typically need exposure to get in the groove of things again if I haven't heard it in a while. If you understand Mandarin, I know a little, but it has actually been a challenge and could use some help.
Also, I thoroughly enjoy debates and have accounts on over a dozen sites for this. If you wish to engage in such, please put effort in a post and provide sources -- I will then do the same with what I already wrote (if I didn't) as well as with my responses to your own. Expanding my information on a subject makes my stance either change or strengthen the next time I speak of it or write a thesis. Allow me to thank you sincerely for your time.
As a sandbox advocate, I have to say that AoW failed to grab me because of the bad combat. Maybe I didn't get far enough into the game, but I seem to remember that when I entered combat I had to tab my target and my movement actually became restricted! I was playing with a couple of friends and we chucked the game aside at that point.
The UI wasn't stellar either, and I felt the graphics were ok, but nothing spectacular. I also didn't see the sandbox element to it that much, but that's probably because I didn't play the game for all that long.
Sandbox alone cannot carry a game, I think this is why so many have asked for a AAA sandbox.
Like he says, if the tutorial can't even draw you in to the game why should I expect the normal game to draw me in? See I used the word tutorial, what the guy was talking about before you brought this instant gratification crap that nobody was talking about.
Thank you.
And that's part of another point "the blaming of the player".
It seems so easy to just say "you don't like this game because you want instant gratification" as opposed to "you don't like this game because it doesn't draw you in".
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Originally posted by Alamareth Oh, and the mouse inversion people don't know how to use computers. You can freaking do that with a 3rd party program, so WHY is it a complaint about the game. If it matters to you that much, you'll figure it out - I have faith in the MMO gamer's ability to figure these things out themselves.
Not really .. you can invert the mouse, but then when you go to use the actual cursor, it's still inverted. Even more unusable. Plus, why should I have to hunt down a third-party app just to do something that the devs should have taken 5 minutes to implement in the first place (check box, setting flag, and if/negation)? If they can't do something as simple as that (which every other game I've played in quite awhile has), what else can't they take the time for?
Anyhow, I did solve it: I moved on to other, more interesting games.
Pure and straight facepalm. You do it because it matters to you.
If you seriously can't figure out how to do it properly, then you would have NEVER figured out this game.
The reason why the developers probably never did it is because they frankly don't care about your super small extremely loud minority. I don't either.
If a car comes out without windshield wipers just because the makers decided (or forgot) to put them on it is still a flaw. Saying that you can fix it yourself by installing your own doesn't mean it's not a flaw. Not including something that's a simple and standard feature on anything after 2000 is just plain lazy and is a glaring example of the quality of this game.
Just because every car has similar features doesn't mean that Ferraris are copies of Model Ts. Progress requires failure and refining.
Been around MMO's since Ultima (MUDs before that, D&D before that), so yeah - I think veteran is more than fitting for me. I've CB tested nearly every F2P game that ever reached any sort of western market (well over 100). Worked as a VGM and a private server tester (Acclaim and Rappelz, respectively). What else are you going to ask for?
I'm about as veteran as you get without being a true insider.
Your post is truly ironic, considering you indict me for not backing up my claim of "being an MMO veteran" (see above for that correction). Yet you offer not one example as to why this game is crap.
Typical MMORPG troll.
My point being that, great you might have played a bunch of crap, I have as well. I've developed as well, and released and etc..again we're on the internet so making claims means nothing and I'm sure we're both unwilling to offer credentials so it's moot. Moving on...
The game itself is an example.
Poor UI, poor gameplay, horrid tutorial and beginning, the only good animations are in combat the game looks horrible outside of screen shots (seems dead and cardboard), limited action sets that pretend they offer depth when really it's just a clone of GW-style action sets, a true rental-style money-grab system, I could go on but I feel that's enough to validate my point.
Laundry list of your "usual" complaints, most of which have NOTHING to do with AoW. If you played this game at all, you could not have possibly passed the first internal.
Limited action sets? Da fuq? I have 7 skill sets, will have 9 soon - I use ALL of them.
GW combat and AoW combat aren't even remotely comparable.
Graphics are nice, not the best - but the environments are extremely well made. It's one of the most consistently praised things about the game, yet you claim its "dead and cardboard". Sorry sir, most of the thinking world disagrees with you.
Poor UI is fair. I don't love it, but it's not so bad that it actively limits my gameplay. The only issue is that I only have quick access to 5 skill sets. Not enough for me.
This game is simply not a very good game. Myself and three other friends all played this game for several weeks be before giving up. All of us played sandbox titles previously, such as UO, SWG and EvE. AoW in no way compares to any of those. It is a bunch of linear grinds designed to make people get frustrated and use the cash shop, on top of the things other people already mentioned. It is not a fun game. It is not really a complex game. It is a lot of farming and mob grinding dressing up a typical Asian grinder, doing the same dailies over and over and over. Plus there are tons of bots, and gold spammers, which are never dealt with. This is more a "part-time job" for S.Korean and Taiwanese teenagers to sell some virtual items/currency and make some pocket money (which is legal in those places, and there are few part time jobs as compared to many Western countries). And all of THAT is why this game is not doing well in the West: the West is not its target audience.
Originally posted by Alamareth Oh, and the mouse inversion people don't know how to use computers. You can freaking do that with a 3rd party program, so WHY is it a complaint about the game. If it matters to you that much, you'll figure it out - I have faith in the MMO gamer's ability to figure these things out themselves.
Not really .. you can invert the mouse, but then when you go to use the actual cursor, it's still inverted. Even more unusable. Plus, why should I have to hunt down a third-party app just to do something that the devs should have taken 5 minutes to implement in the first place (check box, setting flag, and if/negation)? If they can't do something as simple as that (which every other game I've played in quite awhile has), what else can't they take the time for?
Anyhow, I did solve it: I moved on to other, more interesting games.
Pure and straight facepalm. You do it because it matters to you.
If you seriously can't figure out how to do it properly, then you would have NEVER figured out this game.
The reason why the developers probably never did it is because they frankly don't care about your super small extremely loud minority. I don't either.
If a car comes out without windshield wipers just because the makers decided (or forgot) to put them on it is still a flaw. Saying that you can fix it yourself by installing your own doesn't mean it's not a flaw. Not including something that's a simple and standard feature on anything after 2000 is just plain lazy and is a glaring example of the quality of this game.
I can't fix a car windshield in 2 minutes. Time versus difficulty of implementation. To fix mouse inversion is:
So many responses that continue to prove my point. It's not a bad thing that people want instant action and to be the hero on day one. I'm not trying to debate that point.
However, these are fundamental reasons why sandboxes won't work in the west anymore. If players want a truly open environment and game systems that will promote long-term, player driven content, there's going to be a learning curve which may not translate into super exciting game play right off the bat.
Name ONE SINGLE player-driven piece of content in this game.......I'll gladly wait to hear this.
Just because every car has similar features doesn't mean that Ferraris are copies of Model Ts. Progress requires failure and refining.
Comments
HAHAHAHAHA
Best....argument.....ever!
It's not the game that's bad, YOU ARE, for not making it the game you want it to be. So perfect!
Just because every car has similar features doesn't mean that Ferraris are copies of Model Ts. Progress requires failure and refining.
Another "timed fashion" troll. If the item bags weren't so easy to obtain, you might have a point about them - but they are easy to get, so it's a silly complaint.
As for the styles, there are CLEAR matchups that you simply do not understand. Yes, my main set skills do far higher damage at a great efficiency. No, they aren't always the best choice.
Perhaps I'm teamed with a Shaolin who synergizes well with knock up. I'll use lotus palm. Or perhaps I need more lock down. Enter Eagle Claw. Or maybe people are kiting too dang much. Boom, Corrosion Palm. There are SO many options that have different synergies both in duels AND in teams.
As for set GCD, it's to prevent one man armies. The game forces you to hit huge synergies with others as opposed to doing it all yourself. However, I believe that later in the game there's a way of removing different set GCD.
Youre actually not saying anything different than what people do in a Theme Park game.
There is nothing Age of Wushu related that is Sandbox.
As for Timed Fashion Trolling... lol sorry no I quit AoW after a couple months of Beta because it basically was a rip-off. I havent posted anything on this game until today, when I saw your silly comparison and just had to read the thread. I wanted to tell you plainly that you're wrong. You're wrong on many levels.
That doesnt make my post a troll post. That makes my post one that tells you you're wrong. I really dont give a damn how you'll react. Im not even going to be logged into the site in another 5 minutes.
Have a nice day.
Laudanum - Romance. Revenge. Revolution.
Crappy, petty people breed and raise crappy, petty kids.
I've said it before and I'll say it again: games are played for entertainment and nothing more. It doesn't matter if it's a themepark or sandbox, if it's not fun, I'm not going to play it. I refuse to wade through hours of brain-numbingly boring tutorials to get to the fun. It's 2013; developers have the resources to make a tutorial interesting. It's a matter of ability.
This is not an issue of sandboxes not working in the west. This is a matter of poor design not working in the west.
Currently playing: GW2 (Maguuma), DAoC (Uthgard), & Aion
Waiting For / Watching: TUG, CU, Black Desert, Archeage,Wildstar, and ESO.
I haven't played or followed AoW mostly for the same reason I haven't been paying attention to any new games- my gaming times already taken up by eve right now, but what stood out in the OP and in this exchange is whether or not the free to play crowd can really mix well with a sandbox game. They have been trained by developers to expect to be sucked into short term games quickly to try and get them spending right away, how much patience can you expect from them for tutorials and slow starting gameplay?
Also, I think its setting and advertising (or lack of advertising) are probably bigger issues than any design elements.
I believe I've stopped caring and 'being desperate'.
More to the point why I will not play AoW.
Microtransactions, zoned, lore-aescethics
Sandbox and generally mmorpg's are not on my priority entertaiment list high enough anymore, to play a game that have so fundamental things I don't accept.
My point was speaking to the idea of instant gratification and allowing the content to draw you in.
Whether I'm "watching it" or whether the world and its game systems draw me in is not a concern to me. I don't require "instant gratification". But the game systems must draw me in. I wasn't drawn into Age of Wushu and as he said "the start is boring".
Which goes back to my first point.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
HE isn't missing the point, you are. Read it again, and again, and again until you finally get to what he is trying to say. Then you will understand.
You guys keep saying the people or you the player are what make a sandbox, well that is half true. What the other half is missing is an engaging world that draws you in and provides you that other half of content you want.
Like he says, if the tutorial can't even draw you in to the game why should I expect the normal game to draw me in? See I used the word tutorial, what the guy was talking about before you brought this instant gratification crap that nobody was talking about.
Perhaps rely on your fellow veteran MMO player that has experienced all of the high level content in the game to guide your decision that the world draws you in FAR more once you complete the tutorial?
Veteran....so cute.
I'm a pro...must be true I said it.
The game is crap, if you need people to try and convince you to play even the beginning (which should be the easiest part to get hooked) then you know it's not worth your time.
Just because every car has similar features doesn't mean that Ferraris are copies of Model Ts. Progress requires failure and refining.
Been around MMO's since Ultima (MUDs before that, D&D before that), so yeah - I think veteran is more than fitting for me. I've CB tested nearly every F2P game that ever reached any sort of western market (well over 100). Worked as a VGM and a private server tester (Acclaim and Rappelz, respectively). What else are you going to ask for?
I'm about as veteran as you get without being a true insider.
Your post is truly ironic, considering you indict me for not backing up my claim of "being an MMO veteran" (see above for that correction). Yet you offer not one example as to why this game is crap.
Typical MMORPG troll.
Also, I find endgame content far more engaging than the beginning 10% of a game. Always have.
Not really .. you can invert the mouse, but then when you go to use the actual cursor, it's still inverted. Even more unusable. Plus, why should I have to hunt down a third-party app just to do something that the devs should have taken 5 minutes to implement in the first place (check box, setting flag, and if/negation)? If they can't do something as simple as that (which every other game I've played in quite awhile has), what else can't they take the time for?
Anyhow, I did solve it: I moved on to other, more interesting games.
Pure and straight facepalm. You do it because it matters to you.
If you seriously can't figure out how to do it properly, then you would have NEVER figured out this game.
The reason why the developers probably never did it is because they frankly don't care about your super small extremely loud minority. I don't either.
My point being that, great you might have played a bunch of crap, I have as well. I've developed as well, and released and etc..again we're on the internet so making claims means nothing and I'm sure we're both unwilling to offer credentials so it's moot. Moving on...
The game itself is an example.
Poor UI, poor gameplay, horrid tutorial and beginning, the only good animations are in combat the game looks horrible outside of screen shots (seems dead and cardboard), limited action sets that pretend they offer depth when really it's just a clone of GW-style action sets, a true rental-style money-grab system, I could go on but I feel that's enough to validate my point.
Just because every car has similar features doesn't mean that Ferraris are copies of Model Ts. Progress requires failure and refining.
So many responses that continue to prove my point. It's not a bad thing that people want instant action and to be the hero on day one. I'm not trying to debate that point.
However, these are fundamental reasons why sandboxes won't work in the west anymore. If players want a truly open environment and game systems that will promote long-term, player driven content, there's going to be a learning curve which may not translate into super exciting game play right off the bat.
As the Original Poster of this thread, and someone who played SWG in the past, could you please indicate everything that is "Sandbox" about this game?
This is just a simply request, and you don't have to do it. But I've been playing since about the third day after official launch, and it no where meets my personal standard of what makes a proper Sandbox game.
I use Ultima Online as an example when looking at self proclaimed Sandbox games.
As a sandbox advocate, I have to say that AoW failed to grab me because of the bad combat. Maybe I didn't get far enough into the game, but I seem to remember that when I entered combat I had to tab my target and my movement actually became restricted! I was playing with a couple of friends and we chucked the game aside at that point.
The UI wasn't stellar either, and I felt the graphics were ok, but nothing spectacular. I also didn't see the sandbox element to it that much, but that's probably because I didn't play the game for all that long.
Sandbox alone cannot carry a game, I think this is why so many have asked for a AAA sandbox.
Survivor of the great MMORPG Famine of 2011
AoW: A Great Example of Why EASTERN Sandbox Titles Don't Work in the West
Fixed that for you.
The Deep Web is sca-ry.
Thank you.
And that's part of another point "the blaming of the player".
It seems so easy to just say "you don't like this game because you want instant gratification" as opposed to "you don't like this game because it doesn't draw you in".
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
If a car comes out without windshield wipers just because the makers decided (or forgot) to put them on it is still a flaw. Saying that you can fix it yourself by installing your own doesn't mean it's not a flaw. Not including something that's a simple and standard feature on anything after 2000 is just plain lazy and is a glaring example of the quality of this game.
Just because every car has similar features doesn't mean that Ferraris are copies of Model Ts. Progress requires failure and refining.
Laundry list of your "usual" complaints, most of which have NOTHING to do with AoW. If you played this game at all, you could not have possibly passed the first internal.
Limited action sets? Da fuq? I have 7 skill sets, will have 9 soon - I use ALL of them.
GW combat and AoW combat aren't even remotely comparable.
Graphics are nice, not the best - but the environments are extremely well made. It's one of the most consistently praised things about the game, yet you claim its "dead and cardboard". Sorry sir, most of the thinking world disagrees with you.
Poor UI is fair. I don't love it, but it's not so bad that it actively limits my gameplay. The only issue is that I only have quick access to 5 skill sets. Not enough for me.
I can't fix a car windshield in 2 minutes. Time versus difficulty of implementation. To fix mouse inversion is:
A) Easy
Your comparison is meaningless.
Name ONE SINGLE player-driven piece of content in this game.......I'll gladly wait to hear this.
Just because every car has similar features doesn't mean that Ferraris are copies of Model Ts. Progress requires failure and refining.
