Can you build a custom keep where there is no entrance to the lord room?

meddyck

Seems like that could be a problem....

Edany

Ask MJ.

Mortify

Who says there's a lord room?

Who says there's even a lord? :P

There is no spoon.

Edany

I would also like to see someone build a structure with no doors so that they can't get in or out of it themselves. That would be fantastic, then I could just burn the piece of shit down with them inside of it... good times...

Rictis

Originally posted by meddyck
Seems like that could be a problem....

You can add that to your long list of questions that will not be answered anytime soon. Maybe after MJ has breakfest tomorrow he will feel like throwing us a bone.

darkbalth

I think the most fun will be building labryniths and placeing traps inside them and a tower in the middle where you watch people die trying to get to you.

meddyck

Originally posted by Mortify

Who says there's a lord room?

Who says there's even a lord? :P

There is no spoon.

If there's no lord room or lord, then enemies will just always burn down your buildings from the outside and it will never be possible to defend them against a larger force. Just like razing towers in DAOC, if the attackers find any resistance, they'll just do the easy thing and knock the building down out from under you. If that's all this is going to turn out to be, what is the point? I'd rather have pre-defined, pre-built keeps in that case with gates, lord rooms, and lords.

Foggye

Originally posted by darkbalth
I think the most fun will be building labryniths and placeing traps inside them and a tower in the middle where you watch people die trying to get to you.

I was just thinking about that.  Fighting in a huge Hedge Maze as a stealther.

Taldier

Originally posted by Edany
I would also like to see someone build a structure with no doors so that they can't get in or out of it themselves. That would be fantastic, then I could just burn the piece of shit down with them inside of it... good times...

^^^ Pretty much this

 

Why would someone build a castle they couldnt get in or out of?  How would they defend it?

 

How is a "lord room" meaningful here?  And if any given room was blocked off, why wouldnt you deconstruct the wall?  This isnt going to just be a copy of DAOC.

Taldier

Originally posted by meddyck

If there's no lord room or lord, then enemies will just always burn down your buildings from the outside and it will never be possible to defend them against a larger force. Just like razing towers in DAOC, if the attackers find any resistance, they'll just do the easy thing and knock the building down out from under you. If that's all this is going to turn out to be, what is the point? I'd rather have pre-defined, pre-built keeps in that case with gates, lord rooms, and lords.

You seem pretty sure considering you dont actually know yet what it will take to destroy a structure.  And defenders will have walls to fight from and their own traps and siege weapons to repel enemies.

 

There are multiple ways to balance a system to allow smaller groups of skilled players to fight off superior numbers.  Everything does not have to exactly copy the exact same tactics that you used in DAOC.

Rictis

Originally posted by Taldier

Originally posted by meddyck

If there's no lord room or lord, then enemies will just always burn down your buildings from the outside and it will never be possible to defend them against a larger force. Just like razing towers in DAOC, if the attackers find any resistance, they'll just do the easy thing and knock the building down out from under you. If that's all this is going to turn out to be, what is the point? I'd rather have pre-defined, pre-built keeps in that case with gates, lord rooms, and lords.

You seem pretty sure considering you dont actually know yet what it will take to destroy a structure.  And defenders will have walls to fight from and their own traps and siege weapons to repel enemies.

 

There are multiple ways to balance a system to allow smaller groups of skilled players to fight off superior numbers.  Everything does not have to exactly copy the exact same tactics that you used in DAOC.

Not to mention you don't even know what will be destructable. I assume though that MJ will likely go the route of WAR, where only the main gate will be destructable. It will save them time and money to make everything else static. When you start adding large destructable objects it tends to take away from your budget and adds time for bugs/glitches. Also even if they allow custom keeps there are going to be restrictions in place otherwise I see people taking advantage of it.

redcapp

You're taking a new concept and putting it into the context of an entirely separate game.  Question doesn't make sense.

Rocketeer

Originally posted by Wakygreek

Originally posted by Taldier

Originally posted by meddyck

If there's no lord room or lord, then enemies will just always burn down your buildings from the outside and it will never be possible to defend them against a larger force. Just like razing towers in DAOC, if the attackers find any resistance, they'll just do the easy thing and knock the building down out from under you. If that's all this is going to turn out to be, what is the point? I'd rather have pre-defined, pre-built keeps in that case with gates, lord rooms, and lords.

You seem pretty sure considering you dont actually know yet what it will take to destroy a structure.  And defenders will have walls to fight from and their own traps and siege weapons to repel enemies.

 

There are multiple ways to balance a system to allow smaller groups of skilled players to fight off superior numbers.  Everything does not have to exactly copy the exact same tactics that you used in DAOC.

Not to mention you don't even know what will be destructable. I assume though that MJ will likely go the route of WAR, where only the main gate will be destructable. It will save them time and money to make everything else static. When you start adding large destructable objects it tends to take away from your budget and adds time for bugs/glitches. Also even if they allow custom keeps there are going to be restrictions in place otherwise I see people taking advantage of it.

Nah, if you go to the effort of using cells as construction units it would be silly not taking advantage of physics effects for the entire structure. Also i wouldn't be terribly surprised if stone and iron materials don't burn if you hold a torch on them. Otherwise people could torch mountain ranges, which would probably be awkward.

Also the maze/trap/tower thing sounds good on paper, until you notice there are crafters crawling all over the outskirts of your structure deconstructing your walls and using the materials to build statues who give you the finger in the direction of your tower. Probably won't feel very clever then.

Aeodo

Originally posted by Wakygreek

I assume though that MJ will likely go the route of WAR, where only the main gate will be destructable.

Watch update #22.

Tuktz

I know what you're driving at.

 

I'm curious to see the territorial control gameplay mechanics as well.

 

Also how control over access to the depths is regulated.

Rictis

Originally posted by Rocketeer

Originally posted by Wakygreek

Originally posted by Taldier

Originally posted by meddyck

If there's no lord room or lord, then enemies will just always burn down your buildings from the outside and it will never be possible to defend them against a larger force. Just like razing towers in DAOC, if the attackers find any resistance, they'll just do the easy thing and knock the building down out from under you. If that's all this is going to turn out to be, what is the point? I'd rather have pre-defined, pre-built keeps in that case with gates, lord rooms, and lords.

You seem pretty sure considering you dont actually know yet what it will take to destroy a structure.  And defenders will have walls to fight from and their own traps and siege weapons to repel enemies.

 

There are multiple ways to balance a system to allow smaller groups of skilled players to fight off superior numbers.  Everything does not have to exactly copy the exact same tactics that you used in DAOC.

Not to mention you don't even know what will be destructable. I assume though that MJ will likely go the route of WAR, where only the main gate will be destructable. It will save them time and money to make everything else static. When you start adding large destructable objects it tends to take away from your budget and adds time for bugs/glitches. Also even if they allow custom keeps there are going to be restrictions in place otherwise I see people taking advantage of it.

Nah, if you go to the effort of using cells as construction units it would be silly not taking advantage of physics effects for the entire structure. Also i wouldn't be terribly surprised if stone and iron materials don't burn if you hold a torch on them. Otherwise people could torch mountain ranges, which would probably be awkward.

Also the maze/trap/tower thing sounds good on paper, until you notice there are crafters crawling all over the outskirts of your structure deconstructing your walls and using the materials to build statues who give you the finger in the direction of your tower. Probably won't feel very clever then.

Even if you took advantage of the physics effects, I still see problems when adding fully destructable objects the size of keeps in a game where they are already planning on including a bunch of players on screen. I think there is going to be an FPS hit regardless, even worse if people abuse it as you said and start building a watch tower right next to your keep and just zipline using a reduced fall spell or something to fall over your keep wall. I am waiting to see what they say but there will need to be some sort of restriction, free roam is generally not allowed because players find ways to abuse it.

Taldier

Originally posted by Wakygreek

Even if you took advantage of the physics effects, I still see problems when adding fully destructable objects the size of keeps in a game where they are already planning on including a bunch of players on screen. I think there is going to be an FPS hit regardless, even worse if people abuse it as you said and start building a watch tower right next to your keep and just zipline using a reduced fall spell or something to fall over your keep wall. I am waiting to see what they say but there will need to be some sort of restriction, free roam is generally not allowed because players find ways to abuse it.

I actually dont see any reason why that shouldnt be possible.

 

The building isnt going to be instantaneous.  Its not even going to be like minecraft where you just start throwing down blocks.  Assuming it was allowed, it would take some time to build a tower like that outside your wall.

 

If a bunch of crafters can just hang out beside your wall building something while you rain down fire on them from above without being blasted into little piles of dust... then they've sort of earned their incredibly elaborate way over your walls dont you think?

Rocketeer

Originally posted by Wakygreek

Originally posted by Rocketeer

Originally posted by Wakygreek

Originally posted by Taldier

Originally posted by meddyck

If there's no lord room or lord, then enemies will just always burn down your buildings from the outside and it will never be possible to defend them against a larger force. Just like razing towers in DAOC, if the attackers find any resistance, they'll just do the easy thing and knock the building down out from under you. If that's all this is going to turn out to be, what is the point? I'd rather have pre-defined, pre-built keeps in that case with gates, lord rooms, and lords.

You seem pretty sure considering you dont actually know yet what it will take to destroy a structure.  And defenders will have walls to fight from and their own traps and siege weapons to repel enemies.

 

There are multiple ways to balance a system to allow smaller groups of skilled players to fight off superior numbers.  Everything does not have to exactly copy the exact same tactics that you used in DAOC.

Not to mention you don't even know what will be destructable. I assume though that MJ will likely go the route of WAR, where only the main gate will be destructable. It will save them time and money to make everything else static. When you start adding large destructable objects it tends to take away from your budget and adds time for bugs/glitches. Also even if they allow custom keeps there are going to be restrictions in place otherwise I see people taking advantage of it.

Nah, if you go to the effort of using cells as construction units it would be silly not taking advantage of physics effects for the entire structure. Also i wouldn't be terribly surprised if stone and iron materials don't burn if you hold a torch on them. Otherwise people could torch mountain ranges, which would probably be awkward.

Also the maze/trap/tower thing sounds good on paper, until you notice there are crafters crawling all over the outskirts of your structure deconstructing your walls and using the materials to build statues who give you the finger in the direction of your tower. Probably won't feel very clever then.

Even if you took advantage of the physics effects, I still see problems when adding fully destructable objects the size of keeps in a game where they are already planning on including a bunch of players on screen. I think there is going to be an FPS hit regardless, even worse if people abuse it as you said and start building a watch tower right next to your keep and just zipline using a reduced fall spell or something to fall over your keep wall. I am waiting to see what they say but there will need to be some sort of restriction, free roam is generally not allowed because players find ways to abuse it.

Building space is based on plots. If someone wants to build or help you on a plot in use by you he needs your permission. Im pretty sure there will be some kind of min distance between plots.

Fully destructible objects won't affect FPS much, you do that once on the server and on each client. Unlike player movement it doesn't have to be synced, the server can simply tell the client that xy happens to object z. The problem with lots of players is wholly different since they are moving/acting independently from each other and you have to inform every client about every single action of each of them.

A wall breaking down would be more like a weather change, just a short information from server to clients and they will render it.

collekt

Originally posted by Wakygreek

Originally posted by meddyck
Seems like that could be a problem....

You can add that to your long list of questions that will not be answered anytime soon. Maybe after MJ has breakfest tomorrow he will feel like throwing us a bone.

LOL really? MJ is extremely active when it comes to staying in contact with fans/backers and answering questions. He comes to these forums and answers questions, he is very active in the backer comments on the KS page, and he and Andrew both answer questions in their livestreams.. when is the last time you saw a game developer that was so committed to interacting with the players?