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Middle Earth Online goes *****

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  • Originally posted by paradyme

    And where the hell is Turbine getting the money to produce 2 insanly gigantic indepth with decades of history worlds, last share holder report i seen they had secured 24 million dollars from investors and most of that was going towards buying out the rights to there games from MS.
    And last i heard WoW and EQ2 both ran up tabs upwards of 100 million dollars for production, and Turbine expects to put out 2 worth while games based on dinesty(spelling?) franchises on pocket change?
    ::::29::::::31::


     EQ2 cost 25 million to make.

     WoW is of the same generation as EQ2. Thus an educated guess for the costs of WoW is between 20 million to 25 million.

     Turbine still has AC1 which cost roughly 5 million to make. It makes enough true profit to support iself, as well as keep AC2 on lifesupport. Based on what I have read in Buisness 2.0 Magazine (which broke down how much EQ2, SWG, and other MMORPGs cost) it is very possible the profits from AC1 could be used by Turbine to keep either MEO or DDO on lifesupport.... but unlikely both.

     The investors Turbine got, know nothing about games. They are hardcore moneymen, and suits and ties. Someone somewhere 'sold' them on the idea that MMORPGs are magical money machines. They think it is easy to make an EQ clone. As soon as they see MEO and DDO fail, they might even make Turbine go bankrupt! 

  • OwynOwyn Member Posts: 337

    I also heard 25-30 million for EQ2. My understanding is that it way more than doubled the most expensive MMO previously made. Don't forget, DAOC was made for ~$4 million.

    Also worth noting that Turbine already has a AAA engine in their AC2 engine. It compares pretty happily to EQ2; not as good, but certainly as good at the levels currently renderable by most machines. That saves them tons of dev money.

    ALSO remember that Turbine has pushed back MEO's launch til sometime in 2006, and that could go later. This gives D&DO (their stronger license, IMHO) first billing. It also gives the movie industry a bit more time to get going with the Hobbit movie.

    Short version: Turbine has the money to dev two games at once. It has the two strongest fantasy licenses in the western world - each of which with the potential to draw hundreds of thousands of brand new players into playing MMORPGs. If Turbine does not make MEO, someone else will, and will then compete with them using that license. Isn't it better to own the competition than to have to fight the competition? ;)

    Owyn
    Commander, Defenders of Order
    http://www.defendersoforder.com

  • stav1stav1 Member Posts: 282

    Its only a good idea spending millions acquiring popular licenses if you've done the analysis on the potential subscriber base. EA obviously do this in the sports game field only because they know people will be buying the endlessly similar football, basketball etc game from year to year.

    I'm not sure how many existing mmorpg players will play MEO - i certainly won't having read about the stale PvE world with no innovations. Will it attract payers who are new to the mmorpg genre? hard to say but i have a feeling it'll be more matrix online than SWG in terms of subscribers.

  • marca1marca1 Member Posts: 57

    In one way this is very good news, the big players (Sony, Vivendi, Microsoft etc, etc) are complete pussies/capitalists (it's the same thing) all they are interested in is making (your) money - quickly.

    The quicker the better and that means they couldn't give a f*c* about the game experience or trying to balance the difficult areas of a game to make it a decent game. All they think is LotR = massive box office sales = make crap game quickly = massive game box sales = happy Corporation = ripped off customer.

    This should ring *great big f*c* off* bells in your heads, you're being taken for idiots who'll buy anything with a licence or franchise - that's what the corporates think of you, all of you = idiots that can easily be robbed of your hard earned cash. A nice marketing campaign, good graphics & nothing else - that's all they need to do to make a fotrtune.

    So what's the good news...the independent developers, I find it staggering but all of the innovation in this industry is coming from tiny little developers with next to no investment. The developers of titles such as Guild Wars, Dark & Light, Roma Victor - deserve (and need) your support, your cash, your good will - just to survive. You guys should be backing these games with everything and turning your back on the multi-national trillionaire's that want nothing more than all your cash for the smallest outlay possible.

    I'm thinking of starting a campaign to back the indies and mmorpg.com should do more to stop all the bull posting that goes on in this forum from the corporates - they employ people to post in forums such as these to hype their game - you can spot them in this thread quite easily. I know this happens because I used to hire teams to do it for one of the biggest publsihers (mentioned above) - so please, ignore these commercial posts.

    Guys it's up to you, all you seem to do is whinge about how bad all the games are - DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. STOP buying or supporting games from the big publishers, START supporting the indies and in a very short space of time you'll notice that even the corporates will start listening to you and making the games you want. For now they think you're complete dicks that will take anything you're given (believe me I've been in top-level meetings that would make you sick if you knew how these corporations talk & think about their client base)

    OK, that was a good rant, but I'm serious - why are all of you taking all this crap all of the time? It's time to do something about it - SUPPORT THE INDIES - SCREW THE CORPORATIONS

    -Marca

    SUPPORT THE INDIES - SCREW THE CORPORATIONS

  • ianubisiianubisi Member Posts: 4,201


    Originally posted by marca1
    OK, that was a good rant

    No, it actually wasn't.

  • stav1stav1 Member Posts: 282



    Originally posted by marca1

    In one way this is very good news, the big players (Sony, Vivendi, Microsoft etc, etc) are complete pussies/capitalists (it's the same thing) all they are interested in is making (your) money - quickly.
    The quicker the better and that means they couldn't give a f*c* about the game experience or trying to balance the difficult areas of a game to make it a decent game. All they think is LotR = massive box office sales = make crap game quickly = massive game box sales = happy Corporation = ripped off customer.
    This should ring *great big f*c* off* bells in your heads, you're being taken for idiots who'll buy anything with a licence or franchise - that's what the corporates think of you, all of you = idiots that can easily be robbed of your hard earned cash. A nice marketing campaign, good graphics & nothing else - that's all they need to do to make a fotrtune.
    So what's the good news...the independent developers, I find it staggering but all of the innovation in this industry is coming from tiny little developers with next to no investment. The developers of titles such as Guild Wars, Dark & Light, Roma Victor - deserve (and need) your support, your cash, your good will - just to survive. You guys should be backing these games with everything and turning your back on the multi-national trillionaire's that want nothing more than all your cash for the smallest outlay possible.
    I'm thinking of starting a campaign to back the indies and mmorpg.com should do more to stop all the bull posting that goes on in this forum from the corporates - they employ people to post in forums such as these to hype their game - you can spot them in this thread quite easily. I know this happens because I used to hire teams to do it for one of the biggest publsihers (mentioned above) - so please, ignore these commercial posts.
    Guys it's up to you, all you seem to do is whinge about how bad all the games are - DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. STOP buying or supporting games from the big publishers, START supporting the indies and in a very short space of time you'll notice that even the corporates will start listening to you and making the games you want. For now they think you're complete dicks that will take anything you're given (believe me I've been in top-level meetings that would make you sick if you knew how these corporations talk & think about their client base)
    OK, that was a good rant, but I'm serious - why are all of you taking all this crap all of the time? It's time to do something about it - SUPPORT THE INDIES - SCREW THE CORPORATIONS
    -Marca
    SUPPORT THE INDIES - SCREW THE CORPORATIONS


    Spot on.

    The current state of the mmorpg market is just another reflection of how stupid the average person really is.

    I for one will be holding out for the games you mention. But might play a little bit of SWG in the meantime - apologies for that.

    Also quite honestly i do not understand why mmorpg.com and other sites don't publicise the more innovative games a bit more. Innovative games can only be good for the industry as a whole. And it wouldn't stop them taking cash from the big players for ads etc. I mean Mmorpg.com doesn't even have a forum for Roma Victor!!

  • OwynOwyn Member Posts: 337

    I am surprised that you are surprised.

    In what industry does the indie NOT drive innovation? The only industries I can think of where bigger businesses drive innovation are those with such a high bar to entry that there are no indies present. It's pretty much universal: indies win through targeting niches, innovating new ideas, and superior service. Big business win by, well, being big, using the ideas the indies innovated, and having more marketing dollars.

    Owyn
    Commander, Defenders of Order
    http://www.defendersoforder.com

  • paradymeparadyme Member Posts: 238


    Originally posted by marca1
    So what's the good news...the independent developers, I find it staggering but all of the innovation in this industry is coming from tiny little developers with next to no investment. The developers of titles such as Guild Wars, Dark & Light, Roma Victor - deserve (and need) your support, your cash, your good will - just to survive. You guys should be backing these games with everything and turning your back on the multi-national trillionaire's that want nothing more than all your cash for the smallest outlay possible.

    Actually Guild Wars is Published by NCSoft and is prolly the only one on that list that is gonna make a splash.

  • JackdogJackdog Member UncommonPosts: 6,321



    Originally posted by Owyn

    I am surprised that you are surprised.
    In what industry does the indie NOT drive innovation? The only industries I can think of where bigger businesses drive innovation are those with such a high bar to entry that there are no indies present. It's pretty much universal: indies win through targeting niches, innovating new ideas, and superior service. Big business win by, well, being big, using the ideas the indies innovated, and having more marketing dollars.


    That is precisely why I pay a lot more attention to games like Mourning, Dark and Light, Darkfall, and PotBS than I do to the big houses.

    All of these smaller companies  might have their problems and 3/4 of the time their games are horrible but you can never tell when a gem might be created.

    I miss DAoC

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