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All Hail Shadowbane

rdrpappyrdrpappy Member Posts: 325
 The best pvp game ever, the banes were better than DAoC, there was little to no questing, the character building was as in-depth as you could hope for. City building, crafting, politics, betrayal, it was revolutionary.

The pvp was brutal, there was no such thing as ganking, because the game was made of the 100% pure gank built right in, zergs at your walls. Remake that title better running, looking and with a bit more depth and that might catch on with the larger audience.

Comments

  • tank017tank017 Member Posts: 2,192

    ehh

     

    Id choose vanilla DAOC any day over Shadowbane.

  • rdrpappyrdrpappy Member Posts: 325
    I would not, but I did really like DAoC, a close second.
  • VladamyreVladamyre Member UncommonPosts: 223
    Dark Age of Camelot was the best pvp game ever made, and will probably be the best pvp game ever made.

    In a world of sharp knives, you would be a spoon.

  • Pratt2112Pratt2112 Member UncommonPosts: 1,636

    Shadowbane would do about as well as any other open PvP MMO is doing. Not that great.

    Why? Not because "Open PvP" is inherently bad, but because of a certain kind of person it attracts, which is the type who play solely to try and harass as many other new players as they can. They log in, they harass as many people as they can, they log out. That's their "fun". They don't progress, they don't siege, they don't do anything else you noted in your description. They don't even like real PvP and will run or log out the moment anyone they can't "pwn" in two hits approaches.

    As much as I enjoyed Shadowbane, I remember players priding themselves on how many newbies they could chase out of the game. I remember them trying to trick new players into leaving the starting/safe areas and then ganking them when they got there.

    Then, just like every other open PvP MMO to come since, they wonder why more people aren't playing and their game is slowly dying right before their eyes. The irony is, they'd blame it on the very people they joyously ran out of the game "being carebears".

    Until that kind of player "goes away" (which won't happen), or the open PvP community at large recognizes acknowledges and deals with that kind of player for what they are and the kind of damage they can do to a MMO over time, open FFA PvP MMOs will never be more than an extreme niche.

     

  • rdrpappyrdrpappy Member Posts: 325
    Naa I considered it heavily, I'm sure the Bane was better than the Dark Aged Old Cameltoe, I thought DAoC had alot more depth though.
  • rdrpappyrdrpappy Member Posts: 325
    Originally posted by TangentPoint

    Shadowbane would do about as well as any other open PvP MMO is doing. Not that great.

    Why? Not because "Open PvP" is inherently bad, but because of a certain kind of person it attracts, which is the type who play solely to try and harass as many other new players as they can. They log in, they harass as many people as they can, they log out. That's their "fun". They don't progress, they don't siege they don't do anything else you noted in your description.

    As much as I enjoyed Shadowbane, I remember players priding themselves on how many newbies they could chase out of the game. I remember them trying to trick new players into leaving the starting/safe areas and then ganking them when they got there.

    Then, just like every other open PvP MMO to come since, they wonder why more people aren't playing and their game is slowly dying right before their eyes. The irony is, they'd blame it on the very people they joyously ran out of the game "being carebears".

    Until that kind of player "goes away" (which won't happen), or the open PvP community at large recognizes that type of player for what they are and for the damage they can do to a game's population over time, that kind of MMO will never transcend being an extreme niche of the genre.

     

     

     

     I agree with you 100% on the harassment, but it did really steer people into the safety of groups, and in a modernized version those things could be solved, adjusted and or tweaked to work.

  • VladamyreVladamyre Member UncommonPosts: 223
    Originally posted by rdrpappy
    Naa I considered it heavily, I'm sure the Bane was better than the Dark Aged Old Cameltoe, I thought DAoC had alot more depth though.

    Well consider this.

     

    Shadowbane:03/25/03 to 07/01/09 R.I.P.

     

    Dark Age of Camelot: 10/10/01 to...well its still going.

     

    Sorry, the obvious choice on which game is better is DAoC. The game is still breathing. 

     

    In a world of sharp knives, you would be a spoon.

  • cronius77cronius77 Member UncommonPosts: 1,634
    Originally posted by rdrpappy
    I would not, but I did really like DAoC, a close second.

    i seriously think you are either dilusional about shadowbane or just have the ability to forget how bad shadowbane was at release. They lost about 75% of their population within the first two months and it wasnt because of ganking as there was absolutely very little ganking in shadowbane.

    I lead a guild called clan of the dragon in shadowbane with over 250 members on morning server and i played it hardcore til they merged the servers. We had our city destroyed because of a bane bug and ninja 4 am raids when buildings that were supposed to be protected were still destroyed and guards didnt do a thing except wander on a set path aimlessly.  I have many bitter feelings about shadowbane to this day over some of the garbage wolfpack studios threw at their playerbase.

    Im not knocking the pvp though it was fun and the system itself was great if it worked but as i recall many classes were grossy out of balance like templar nukes hitting for 75% of your life and channelers flying straight up in the air on melee and then owning them with a couple of nukes and melee couldnt do crap. Not sure how you can even say that shadowbane had better pvp then daoc. Maybe the system to destroy guild cities , but with all the duping and bugs that sucked to.

  • Pratt2112Pratt2112 Member UncommonPosts: 1,636
    Originally posted by rdrpappy
    Originally posted by TangentPoint

    Shadowbane would do about as well as any other open PvP MMO is doing. Not that great.

    Why? Not because "Open PvP" is inherently bad, but because of a certain kind of person it attracts, which is the type who play solely to try and harass as many other new players as they can. They log in, they harass as many people as they can, they log out. That's their "fun". They don't progress, they don't siege they don't do anything else you noted in your description.

    As much as I enjoyed Shadowbane, I remember players priding themselves on how many newbies they could chase out of the game. I remember them trying to trick new players into leaving the starting/safe areas and then ganking them when they got there.

    Then, just like every other open PvP MMO to come since, they wonder why more people aren't playing and their game is slowly dying right before their eyes. The irony is, they'd blame it on the very people they joyously ran out of the game "being carebears".

    Until that kind of player "goes away" (which won't happen), or the open PvP community at large recognizes that type of player for what they are and for the damage they can do to a game's population over time, that kind of MMO will never transcend being an extreme niche of the genre.

     

     

     

     I agree with you 100% on the harassment, but it did really steer people into the safety of groups, and in a modernized version those things could be solved, adjusted and or tweaked to work.

    Problem is, as a new player, you didn't have that "safety", unless you got lucky and a guild took you in early on.  As I recall, especially later in the game, people were wary of inviting new people for fear they were "plants" or spies for enemy guilds.

    Something that people tend to forget when they're more advanced and have a guild at their back is that new players come into the game not necessarily knowing anyone or anything. So, saying "well they just need to seek the protection of a guild" is easier said than done. 

    There was a period of time early on in Lineage 2 where I think their player-base did it right. They would help out new players and show them the ropes, while driving off griefers/gankers. Not for long. Just enough to get them familiar with the game, and maybe get them out of the newbie area (where griefers/gankers mostly hung out) and into some better gear, etc.

    That bit of effort from the elder player base made a huge difference in L2's population back then. More new players actually hung around and continued playing, where they would otherwise have been run off in frustration at some douche-bag 1-shotting them every time they left town.

    And when you're talking about a PvP MMO, the more players you have the better.

    All that said, I would like to see Shadowbane itself resurrected in fully supported form. The character development system in that game alone was amazing.

     

  • rdrpappyrdrpappy Member Posts: 325
    Originally posted by cronius77
    Originally posted by rdrpappy
    I would not, but I did really like DAoC, a close second.

    i seriously think you are either dilusional about shadowbane or just have the ability to forget how bad shadowbane was at release. They lost about 75% of their population within the first two months and it wasnt because of ganking as there was absolutely very little ganking in shadowbane.

    I lead a guild called clan of the dragon in shadowbane with over 250 members on morning server and i played it hardcore til they merged the servers. We had our city destroyed because of a bane bug and ninja 4 am raids when buildings that were supposed to be protected were still destroyed and guards didnt do a thing except wander on a set path aimlessly.  I have many bitter feelings about shadowbane to this day over some of the garbage wolfpack studios threw at their playerbase.

    Im not knocking the pvp though it was fun and the system itself was great if it worked but as i recall many classes were grossy out of balance like templar nukes hitting for 75% of your life and channelers flying straight up in the air on melee and then owning them with a couple of nukes and melee couldnt do crap. Not sure how you can even say that shadowbane had better pvp then daoc. Maybe the system to destroy guild cities , but with all the duping and bugs that sucked to.

     That's what I'm saying, in a remake those issues that plagued it would be addressed. You know in a shiny new version with no bugs and new goodies that original core idea would work.

    And you would be there running another guild.

  • wormedwormed Member UncommonPosts: 470

    http://shadowbaneemulator.com/

    Currently in closed beta.

  • VladamyreVladamyre Member UncommonPosts: 223
    Originally posted by rdrpappy
    Originally posted by cronius77
    Originally posted by rdrpappy
    I would not, but I did really like DAoC, a close second.

    i seriously think you are either dilusional about shadowbane or just have the ability to forget how bad shadowbane was at release. They lost about 75% of their population within the first two months and it wasnt because of ganking as there was absolutely very little ganking in shadowbane.

    I lead a guild called clan of the dragon in shadowbane with over 250 members on morning server and i played it hardcore til they merged the servers. We had our city destroyed because of a bane bug and ninja 4 am raids when buildings that were supposed to be protected were still destroyed and guards didnt do a thing except wander on a set path aimlessly.  I have many bitter feelings about shadowbane to this day over some of the garbage wolfpack studios threw at their playerbase.

    Im not knocking the pvp though it was fun and the system itself was great if it worked but as i recall many classes were grossy out of balance like templar nukes hitting for 75% of your life and channelers flying straight up in the air on melee and then owning them with a couple of nukes and melee couldnt do crap. Not sure how you can even say that shadowbane had better pvp then daoc. Maybe the system to destroy guild cities , but with all the duping and bugs that sucked to.

     That's what I'm saying, in a remake those issues that plagued it would be addressed. You know in a shiny new version with no bugs and new goodies that original core idea would work.

    And you would be there running another guild.

    The same could be said of remaking DAoC, or making a sequal, but it won't happen for either game. Its a shame too, I'd love to go back to the beginning of DAoC, it was the most fun I ever had in an mmo.

    In a world of sharp knives, you would be a spoon.

  • paroxysmparoxysm Member Posts: 437

    Shadowbane was better in idea/concept than actual play in a lot of things.  The diversity of class building was a nice change.  The whole siege, mines/resources, player built buildings/castles, and player built and player ran shops was awesome in idea as well.  At the same time, it was a horribly running and horribly buggy game.  Besides that, the rune control was a bit of a pita and the zerg wins design were bad as well.  The pvp was brutal, but it had the exact intended impact wanted on the game.  It also changed a lot after launch.  The event system and team were scrapped.

    It definitely was not perfect or even close, but it did have some great ideas that could use some tweeking. 

    Sadly, a remake would probably come with new state of the art graphics and perfect trees and grass that only tip top computers could seem to handle due to a bad engine.  And, you'd never see the huge battles as it would either be phazed, instanced, or crash at will.  Though, I'm not sure how you'd make a worse engine than the original Shadowbane's.

  • rdrpappyrdrpappy Member Posts: 325
    Yes a remade DAoC would be great also, I just really like the runes, stat adjusting, racial traits and so on the Bane had.
  • cronius77cronius77 Member UncommonPosts: 1,634
    Originally posted by rdrpappy
    Originally posted by cronius77
    Originally posted by rdrpappy
    I would not, but I did really like DAoC, a close second.

    i seriously think you are either dilusional about shadowbane or just have the ability to forget how bad shadowbane was at release. They lost about 75% of their population within the first two months and it wasnt because of ganking as there was absolutely very little ganking in shadowbane.

    I lead a guild called clan of the dragon in shadowbane with over 250 members on morning server and i played it hardcore til they merged the servers. We had our city destroyed because of a bane bug and ninja 4 am raids when buildings that were supposed to be protected were still destroyed and guards didnt do a thing except wander on a set path aimlessly.  I have many bitter feelings about shadowbane to this day over some of the garbage wolfpack studios threw at their playerbase.

    Im not knocking the pvp though it was fun and the system itself was great if it worked but as i recall many classes were grossy out of balance like templar nukes hitting for 75% of your life and channelers flying straight up in the air on melee and then owning them with a couple of nukes and melee couldnt do crap. Not sure how you can even say that shadowbane had better pvp then daoc. Maybe the system to destroy guild cities , but with all the duping and bugs that sucked to.

     That's what I'm saying, in a remake those issues that plagued it would be addressed. You know in a shiny new version with no bugs and new goodies that original core idea would work.

    And you would be there running another guild.

    no ill be in Guild Wars 2 where i can actually trust the dev studio behind the game . Wolfpack studios was complete garbage and doesnt deserve credit for being a studio with the crap they allowed. Also there is no need for a remake go play shadowbane emu just google it there is a player base for it already.

  • TrionicusTrionicus Member UncommonPosts: 498
    Originally posted by Vladamyre
    Dark Age of Camelot was the best pvp game ever made, and will probably be the best pvp game ever made.

    I have to agree about the first part and I hope to all the gods, new and old, that it won't be the best ever made. I'm still optimistic that developers will come out with something just as good or better than DAoC PVP.

  • VladamyreVladamyre Member UncommonPosts: 223
    Originally posted by cronius77
    Originally posted by rdrpappy
    Originally posted by cronius77
    Originally posted by rdrpappy
    I would not, but I did really like DAoC, a close second.

    i seriously think you are either dilusional about shadowbane or just have the ability to forget how bad shadowbane was at release. They lost about 75% of their population within the first two months and it wasnt because of ganking as there was absolutely very little ganking in shadowbane.

    I lead a guild called clan of the dragon in shadowbane with over 250 members on morning server and i played it hardcore til they merged the servers. We had our city destroyed because of a bane bug and ninja 4 am raids when buildings that were supposed to be protected were still destroyed and guards didnt do a thing except wander on a set path aimlessly.  I have many bitter feelings about shadowbane to this day over some of the garbage wolfpack studios threw at their playerbase.

    Im not knocking the pvp though it was fun and the system itself was great if it worked but as i recall many classes were grossy out of balance like templar nukes hitting for 75% of your life and channelers flying straight up in the air on melee and then owning them with a couple of nukes and melee couldnt do crap. Not sure how you can even say that shadowbane had better pvp then daoc. Maybe the system to destroy guild cities , but with all the duping and bugs that sucked to.

     That's what I'm saying, in a remake those issues that plagued it would be addressed. You know in a shiny new version with no bugs and new goodies that original core idea would work.

    And you would be there running another guild.

    no ill be in Guild Wars 2 where i can actually trust the dev studio behind the game . Wolfpack studios was complete garbage and doesnt deserve credit for being a studio with the crap they allowed. Also there is no need for a remake go play shadowbane emu just google it there is a player base for it already.

    I'll be in GW2 as well. Can't wait for the 3 day early access. They have a free DAoC server at www.uthgard.com.

    In a world of sharp knives, you would be a spoon.

  • cronius77cronius77 Member UncommonPosts: 1,634
    i think most of the old hardcore pvp crowd like myself just matured and got older and now i still love pvp but i prefer to just log in , enjoy the few hours online i have and then log back out. Shadowbane while hardcore at its core , i do not think would have a huge following nowadays with how the current playerbases are. Everyone that pvps except a few want arena and scanario based pvp or DAOC casual pvp. There are a few hardcore open world pvp players left on this site but its few and far between. Every full loot pvp game that releases like dark fall mortal etc are considered by majority of us as train wreck games , shadowbane had way worse bugs then darkfall for sure. So i highly even doubt a shadowbane clone would survive in this day and age of mmorpgs. Back then we had EQ DAOC UO AO and AC . There was not many titles to choose from and therefore us pvpers wanted to play shadowbane because it was different. Now there is WAY to many mmorpgs to flood the market for pvp and pve alike.
  • TruthXHurtsTruthXHurts Member UncommonPosts: 1,555
    Originally posted by TangentPoint

    Shadowbane would do about as well as any other open PvP MMO is doing. Not that great.

    Why? Not because "Open PvP" is inherently bad, but because of a certain kind of person it attracts, which is the type who play solely to try and harass as many other new players as they can. They log in, they harass as many people as they can, they log out. That's their "fun". They don't progress, they don't siege, they don't do anything else you noted in your description. They don't even like real PvP and will run or log out the moment anyone they can't "pwn" in two hits approaches.

    As much as I enjoyed Shadowbane, I remember players priding themselves on how many newbies they could chase out of the game. I remember them trying to trick new players into leaving the starting/safe areas and then ganking them when they got there.

    Then, just like every other open PvP MMO to come since, they wonder why more people aren't playing and their game is slowly dying right before their eyes. The irony is, they'd blame it on the very people they joyously ran out of the game "being carebears".

    Until that kind of player "goes away" (which won't happen), or the open PvP community at large recognizes acknowledges and deals with that kind of player for what they are and the kind of damage they can do to a MMO over time, open FFA PvP MMOs will never be more than an extreme niche.

     

    Those kind of people are in EVERY game. You just seem to notice it more in FFA PVP. Think of all the idiots who try to train, scam, or just generally annoy their fellow players in the PVE games.

    "I am not in a server with Gankers...THEY ARE IN A SERVER WITH ME!!!"

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