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Combat done wrong
vaeiou
Member Posts: 39
Compared to Guild Wars 2 combat, I can only say that the combat in TSW leaves much to be desired. For example, take a look at this footage of a hammer warrior. If you look at it objectively and disregard the music and PvP scenario, you can tell that: not only are the animations better in Guild Wars 2, but the sounds and effects deliver impact whereas TSW is sorely lacking in these departments.
What are your thoughts?
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systems are obviously differn't as GW2 is much more fast paced.. but overall I'd love TSW to improve how weapons react to the enviornment more and like how you see in GW2 that hammer really "feels" like it has some big weight behind it unlike in TSW
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
TSW is less cartoony, but after feedback from the open beta they will add some more effects and such. The effects from GW2 combat would look just outright silly in the realistic graphics used in TSW, so I just hope they don't add too much effects. In mass battles all that shiny stuff just gets in the way.
In other words, I am all for adding functional effects - for instance to show that a patch of ground is on fire, or frost on a character to show she is frozen, or blood dripping to show a bleed effect. I am not for just adding a bunch of glittery effects that obstruct my view of what's happening.
Btw, nice of you to come over from the GW2 forums to tell us that TSW combat is all wrong.
I agree. And the crazy thing is, the combat system in GW2 leaves very much to be desired in terms of animations and weight regarding attacks. Yet it's still much better than TSW's.
So after watching that video, I'll say that the animations look very poor.
If your going to use a gold standard for combat, use Tera. GW2 combat is mediocre at best.
First of all, the team is currently heavily working on the animations and effects. The closed beta client shows these efforts allready.
Second... if I want to have fast paced combat where I feel the impact etc then I'm going to play a shooter or beat-em-up.
The combat in TSW is slower paced by design and I like it this way in a MMO.
There's been a patch OP... Things are different. A lot different.
edit - wtf that video is 2 minutes into the game and old....
I can't stand watching his videos anymore, he has become so negative it's unreal.
Anyway I do agree the combat looks less than great, nothing carries a weight and the enemies don't seem to react well to being smashed in the face by something.
I will still be trying the game though because it is not level based and has the skill wheel instead of classes, for me the combat isn't everything.
+1, particularly the part I underlined- I choose different genres based on what I'm looking to play as well. No game will be everything to everyone despite how much publishers want it. This "the MMO I like is better than the MMO you like" back and forth is silly- different games have different strengths and therefore some players will like different games more than others.
It's not slower paced as it is repetitive. Spamming builders and inevitably your finisher is really kind of mindless, but all you're allowed to do with a single deck.
Every combat-system works this "repetitive" way if you look closely. It doesn't matter if your rotation consists of 2 or 10 skills, you'll allways use skill after skill in a very specific rotation to get the best result. A shooter actually only uses a single skill you spam over and over again and a modern beat-em-up has some moves you need to built up aswell to access your finisher.
In addition, how much of the skills and templates have you seen so far in TSW? You'll be actually surprised how much more then only two skills you'll need later in the game... just sayin.
Well the thing is that there is definitely a rotation. You only have 7 active skills, two of which are finishers, at least one a builder, so that leaves you with 4 "free skills". One of those 4 skills will be an elite skill with a cooldown of sorts, so it's more like 3 truly free situational skills that you have.
It's definitely more complex and meaningful than something like Diablo 3, but if you compare it to WoW, Rift etc. it falls a bit short assuming you're confined to one deck at a time.
I'm talking strictly about the combat itself once you've selected a deck, the skill customization is second to none.
I've played alot of MMOs, and I've never used more then some ten skills actually. 1-5 as my main rotation and then maybe another 5 depending on the situation. The rest of the skills is just wasted efforts imho, as you rarely use them, atleast I've never used them, neither in WoW, nor in any other typical MMO like it.
No offense, but if you only ever used that many buttons in WoW, you probably weren't doing any PvP. It's true that in PvE WoW was luckluster, but it made up for it in PvP.
Take the mage. The one button PvE wonder who had 12+ buttons worth in arena.
The basic problem is not only the rotation, but CC effects, breaks etc.
You just can't do much with only 7 buttons.
I agree TSW's combat is far from perfect.
What attracts me to TSW is the ambiance and general feel of the entire game. The skill system, quests and lore, and the crafting are great aspects of this game. Not to mention that when I play, I kind of feel like I'm adventuring in a H.P. Lovecraft story.
Ok so since I have been playing TERA and experiencing some of the most amazing combat I have ever seen in an MMO I will not be able to enjoy TSW? I have been watching and waiting for TSW for damn near 3 years now. Damn. Actually I am so engrossed with TERA right now I don't even care if another MMO comes out at all. But Damn I sure was wanting to play TSW. Guess time will tell.
My thoughts are that an idling GW2 fanboi did not have anything better to do than to start a thread hyping up GW2 and talking down TSW. TSW combat is fine for me.
Anyway bringing up GW2 seems to detroy any valid claim you had. In Gw2 everything is over the top magic. Even the initial weapon skills for swords / bow are no where near "realistic fitting". glowy weapon trails, sparking lightning and airslashing all the way. A Warrior with bow is a mage, difference is, he holds a bow to shot his fireballs.
There are so much sparkles and flares for even simple martial physical classes i still wonder how the hell people even decide between classes. Because choosing between a 2hand warrior or guardian is just like choosing between a brown/yellowish sparkle effect instead of a blue one. Both are close range magic throwers with a sword instead of a wand.
I still wonder too how do you claim GW2 has a better "hit impact" feel for it either. The average attack range for "melee" is like what 5 meters? People stand clearly appart of each other air slashing with numbers poping over their heads. This is because of the lack of animation lock.
They can't make melee really melee either when no one is locked during an attack animation, the network latency would make it a horrid guessing game. Everyone is on the move during combat animations, so between "hit" and "swing" both end up staying 6 meters appart. The opposite player / npc may have a light *clunk* idication of being hit while being visually out of hit range, but so does TSW. It's no where better than TSW.
Unless you like pretty magic sparkly attacks, but why complain about guns in TSW in the first place?
Note: I have GW2 PrePAID and will play it. TSW i'm a grand master since the first beta. I'm all for better hit indications and visual fitting weapon (guns) skills in TSW, but bringing up GW2 isn't helping at all.
You must be kidding. GW2's combat is much better, if only for being more dynamic thanks to being able to move during attacks instead of being rooted in place by TERA's purpotedly "action combat".
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OMG I laughed my ass off when I saw biscuit's video. He's so right about how terrible the voice acting is.
The combat looks terrible. I can't stand any game with tab targetting, auto-attacks, and no friendly fire. Guns that shoot magic bullets is just lame... why didnt they use real weapons and have magic just be one of the options?
I like the skill tree concept but otherwise same old wow-clone combat just reskinned.
This game is going to fail in the long run. They might make their money back in the first 3 months but after that I predict a dead game.
If they took this game concept and made a sandbox it could have be so awesome...
TO each his own.
I thought the voice acting and questing experience in the game were top notch.
While the combat is on the classic side It was still enjoyable and I loved the open ended class system.
I may revisit TSW later on but overall I felt it was a good, solid game.
Playing: Nothing
Looking forward to: Nothing
*Facepalm*
BTW, do people actually pay atention to TB. Really? WOW, sad.
Anyway, i guess players forget that this was the starter area. Almost all mmo's have boring combat and not to hard in their beginning. Regarding the whole "generic abilities, builld-build-build-finisher, stand still combat", again, starter area.
Martin already said in a post that the inner wheel will have more standart skills to not confuse and overwhelm new players. The outer wheel is suppose to have pets, shield, dodges, etc. I don't believe that in later areas, especially after Solom Island, dungeons and pvp, that that style of gameplay will be possible to survive. Players will just die.
After all, TERA's combat is praised all the way (i agree btw), but wasn't evryone compaing about how in the first 20 levels, both the combat and the mobs where extremely static and boring. Yeah.
Now, does this mean that combat will get alot better later on? I don't know and i don't claim to, but i do hope so. I do agree that animations, sounds, etc are very lacking, specially pistols, but the v0.9 patch is suppose to have fixed it. Again, i don't know for sure but i hope so.
He's entertaining but a smart person takes his opinion as an opinion and not a fact.
Playing: Nothing
Looking forward to: Nothing
If you ask me it seems that some of the GW2 fanbois feel threatened by TSW.
yes, dodging and realistic physics would be silly in a modern game.
You're happy with characters that move like stiff manequins.
I never try to comnpare thi sgame to GW, it doesn't even reach the rift/tor levels. At minimum, that was what i was hoping.
The phsyics ofthis game is just not there. This game will be worth 50 +15 a month only to those who like solving rigid non impacting puzzles in game. "classic" i guess they call it.