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Anet taking your money before cash shop is done.

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  • BeansnBreadBeansnBread Member EpicPosts: 6,894

    Originally posted by BadSpock

    Originally posted by colddog04


    Originally posted by st4t1ck

    There wouldnt be a public beta if no one pre-purchased. so you will get your information only from the people this thread calls "foolish".  and the info you get will be the same you got from the press betas more then likly with maybe a little more. i dont see them opening all there game for the beta at all.  need to keep some secrets

    False. There is no relationship between an open BETA and pre-purchase. On top of that, all beta weekends are void of the NDA from this point forward.

    Why am I even responding to you? You are spouting insanity.

    There is no public/open beta.

    Public/Open beta means anyone can simply download the client and play for free.

    GW2 is only doing closed betas... that just happen to be NDA free.

    To get into the closed betas, you either have to pre-purchase or be given a key by Anet or get a key from a site like MMORPG.com that was/is given a set of keys by Arena.net.

    Let me put it another way:

     

    I was wrong.

     

  • TardcoreTardcore Member Posts: 2,325

    Originally posted by Thane

    and why again do you bother about MY money again? ^^

    First in answer to the OPs insinuations. Judging by the way A-net has handled the cash shop in GW1, I feel the one in GW2 has a good likelyhood of being as benign. However, not being a fortune teller I can only say that is just my opinion. And just because I think it probably won't be a problem, does not mean I feel that people should stop discussing the topic until we find out exactly what the cash shop will be.

    That said, I still feel it is always a bad idea to give any kind of business your money before you really get a chance to see all the details of whatever product they are selling.

    The reason for this segues into Thane's question, or rather strawman argument. We don't care what you do with your money, as its your money to do with what you like, feel free to set fire to it if that's your preference. However as MMO players we are concered about other gamers continuing to buy these games on faith. As if the game turns out to suck, the company has alreay been rewarded for making a lackluster product, so there is a very good chance game companies will continue with this cycle of not very good games, because they have no real reason to try harder.

     

    image

    "Gypsies, tramps, and thieves, we were called by the Admin of the site . . . "

  • drbaltazardrbaltazar Member UncommonPosts: 7,856

    true!i was on towellie stream when gw2 pre-paid lunched!and gamer were like this!

    please arenanet stop refusing my money !i just want this transaction to go throu!PLEASE!

    so i highly doubt it was gw2 taking your money lol!probably more the other way around!

  • Loke666Loke666 Member EpicPosts: 21,441

    Originally posted by atticusbc

    except there's not going to be an open beta, so tough luck i guess. on the other hand, there will be tons of information coming out of the next beta. there wouldn't be nearly as much info if some of us didn't prepurchase, so instead of thinking of as idiots, think of us as explorers, daring to tread unseen ground so you don't have to.

    What do you mean? Anets boss Mike O´Brian stated that there was going to be a weekend where everyone can try the game just before launch. That was like 2 years though but I never heard anyone taking that back.

    "Beta" might not be the right word for it though, but it is basically a chanse to try the game out for people who are unsure,

  • TwoThreeFourTwoThreeFour Member UncommonPosts: 2,155

    Originally posted by grimm6th

    People trying to convince other not to buy the game...

    Well, I don't believe most people here are acting out of anything other than self interest, so those of you actively telling us what we shouldn't want, could you please tell us you you think we should want or just go away?

     

    Those of you who are dissapointed in the idea of GW2 having a cash shop at all, I think you need to look carefully at the game mechanics of GW2.  This isn't a gear driven game, and there won't be items that you can get from the cash shop that are better than in dungeons, or rare drops, or crafting, or PvP.  This isn't a level grind game, and your level won't effect your ability to play competitive PvP.  Levels take roughly the same amount of time to get starting after the initial leveling phase.  Anet has saaid that they are aiming for around an hour to an hour and a half per level if you are playing the game normally.  People will likely find ways to rush through the game, but for what?  End game is the WHOLE game.  People who don't want XP boosts or Karma boosts won't feel limited in what they can do per day.  GW2 doesn't utilize the diminishing returns system that other games have (they have a daily achievement reward system, but that is a topic for another time).  The real value of these boosts, is that you can level even if you don't really have all theat much time to play (People with jobs, people in college, people with families).  Considering the gem system, even if you don't spend money, you can still farm gold, trade gold to player for gems, and then use the cash shop.  Those of you worried about the ability to buy gold effecting WvW through people buying influence points, the other player could have spent his money on influence points...as a whole nothing is gained...buying gold doesn't create money.  Additionally, all 3 sides of a WvWvW battle have lots of people, I would guess that the number of people buying influence points would be, on average, equal for each server...It doesn't really make sense to assume otherwise.

     

    Those of you worried about the final products quality, and why should you pay for the game before you see any info about the game (there is an NDA), please get your head out of the sand.  Watch some gameplay vidoes, they have been around for nearly 2 years.  A good number of us have played the game at conventions.  Press was allowed to talk about pretty much everything (except the cash shop, which is under NDA because it is unfinished, still being worked on, being made bettter, blah blah blah.)  You could ask us questions about the game (but you should look to see if the question has been asked before...seriously.)

     

     

    Regarding P2W in general I quote myself:

    "

    To know whether or not it is "P2W", the competitions of interest need to be defined. 

     

    For many people, PvP is the only competition of interest.  Structured PvP is definitely not P2W since it  puts every participant on an equal ground skill, gear and traitwise. As for World vs World: we know that there are certain buffs that can be gained through buying influence through gold, which can be gained through item mall currency; however, we do not know how hard or easy it will be for guilds to grind to gain the same buffs. If it is a matter of weeks or even months of grind required to catch-up to the spenders, and the difference if buff-power is significant, then it can be considered to be pay-to-win.

     

    Nevertheless, for many people, PvP is not the only competition of interest.  The are other types of competitions which may interest people: PvE-related competitions, vanity, wealth, crafting, etc.

     

    For vanity and wealth: depending on the form of those competitions, they are definitely pay-to-win.

    "

     

    As for the "average" and "influence-buyers per server": while there is certainly an average, you don't know how spread the population will be around that average; it may be very a large spread, or a very narrow one. 

     

    As for the press: they are extremely unreliable, just remember Massively's Game of the Year award which they gave to SWTOR last year.

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 11,687


    Originally posted by Tardcore

    We don't care what you do with your money, as its your money to do with what you like, feel free to set fire to it if that's your preference. However as MMO players we are concered about other gamers continuing to buy these games on faith.  

    You do not care what I do with my money but you care what games I pay for? Please make up your mind whether you care or not. You just cannot say that you do not care what I do but have concerns about what I am doing...

    If people keep spending money on "not very good games", they are probably not as much "not very good games" and there is probably quite a few people who find them worthy enough to spend money on...


    Your paragraph will start making a lot more sense as soon as you replace genralizations such as "we" with "I" :


    Originally posted by Tardcore
    "As if the game turns out NOT MY LIKEHOOD, the company has alreay been rewarded for making a PRODUCT I DO NOT LIKE, so there is a very good chance game companies will continue with this cycle of GAMES I DO NOT LIKE", because they have no real reason to try TO MAKE GAMES I WANT."

    There must not be a game for everyone.

  • ThorbrandThorbrand Member Posts: 1,198

    No CS is ever complete and they are ever changing entities dependant on the customers needs. I have never seen a CS game where you seen everything before release and this is no different.

  • MephsterMephster Member Posts: 1,188

    Fans pre-purchased, I don't see a problem with that since Guild Wars fans know ArenaNet doesn't fail. We been playing Guild Wars for so many years now we know what we're getting with ArenaNet. There is no con here.

    Grim Dawn, the next great action rpg!

    http://www.grimdawn.com/

  • TwoThreeFourTwoThreeFour Member UncommonPosts: 2,155

    Originally posted by Gdemami

     




    Originally posted by Tardcore



    We don't care what you do with your money, as its your money to do with what you like, feel free to set fire to it if that's your preference. However as MMO players we are concered about other gamers continuing to buy these games on faith.  




     

    You do not care what I do with my money but you care what games I pay for? Please make up your mind whether you care or not. You just cannot say that you do not care what I do but have concerns about what I am doing...

    If people keep spending money on "not very good games", they are probably not as much "not very good games" and there is probably quite a few people who find them worthy enough to spend money on...



    Your paragraph will start making a lot more sense as soon as you replace genralizations such as "we" with "I" :

     




    Originally posted by Tardcore

    "As if the game turns out NOT MY LIKEHOOD, the company has alreay been rewarded for making a PRODUCT I DO NOT LIKE, so there is a very good chance game companies will continue with this cycle of GAMES I DO NOT LIKE", because they have no real reason to try TO MAKE GAMES I WANT."



     

     

    There must not be a game for everyone.

    Do you really want to try to argue that "popularity" implies "quality"?

  • TwoThreeFourTwoThreeFour Member UncommonPosts: 2,155

    Originally posted by Mephster

    Fans pre-purchased, I don't see a problem with that since Guild Wars fans know ArenaNet doesn't fail. We been playing Guild Wars for so many years now we know what we're getting with ArenaNet. There is no con here.

    If you know what you are getting, then answer me this:

    A. How many hours will it take for an average guild to, through grind, reach the buff bonuses which influence buyers will theoretically buy quickly?

     

    B.  How large or how small percent of the GW2 population will have significant lag-issues in large-scale World vs World battles?

     

    C. How many non-repetitive PvE hours can an average consumer expect?

  • rungardrungard Member Posts: 1,035

    Lets look at it this way:

    PTW guy buys all the PTW items and looks really cool!

    this is the first guy i target in pvp and avoid in pve.

     

    problem solved.

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

  • LucioonLucioon Member UncommonPosts: 818

    Originally posted by Ceridith

    Originally posted by Adalwulff

    Originally posted by Ceridith

    I find it amusing that concerns over the uncertainty of the cash shop and the possible inclusion of P2W are met with such vitriol.

    The worry over the cash shop is legitimate, yet it seems that blind faith and a wasteful consumeristic stance -- "it's my money I'll do what I want with it" -- trumps reality.

    Personally I'm cautiously looking forward to this game. The cash shop is the one thing that can drag this game down... so I'm taking the sane approach and not throwing my money at ANet until I'm satisfied with the final condition of the game.

     

    What reality are you referring? It must be your own special one, because we dont even know whats all in the CS. There is no reason at all to think they will suddenly put P2W items in there.

    Yet you say this is a reality, and expect other people to stop what they are doing.

    Thats some amazing logic you have there.  image

    The reality that most of the people drooling over this game are convinced that it's going to be amazing and have no flaws, yet the game is still under NDA and the state of several things, including the cash shop and it's contents, are still up in the air.

    I'm not saying that ANet will put P2W in, or that GW2 will suck. What I am saying is that no one will know for certain until the game is released. Yet despite that, there are several people who have not only convinced themselves that the game will be the best thing ever, but are going out of their way to outright attack anyone who doesn't feel the same way as they do.

    I believe that most are actually extremely skeptical when dealing with GW2. Because the mechanics they are introducing is extremely different than whats out there.

    But lets compare it to TSW

    TSW have a release date set for June I believe and GW2 does not. yet we have more answers for GW2 than TSW. More Beta coverage regarding all the new features, mechanics and how they work. The only true concern many have in regards to GW2 isn't how the combat will work, what skill sets are available, or whats Dynamic Event, but rather is just on the Cash Shop and whats included in them.

    But in regards to TSW, I was only able to find Pax east 2012 demo footages, with alot more speculation than answers.

    The same with SWTOR when it was announced and Pre-ordered was allowed, More Questions, and Speculations than actual game play footages and answers.

    GW2 really surprised me with Actual Dungeon crawls, Actual Dynamic Event chains and actually shows Players Playing the game.

    Can't really compare it to Tera mainly because it already out in Korea, but comparing to other in development MMO, GW2 really does stand on its own.

    If you are really concerned with setting up an Precedent and allowing Developers take players money, go to TSW forums, and you will see that there are players actually signing up for Life Time subscriptions without any solid information on whats included in the game and what will be offered.

    In regards to GW2, without any actual thing to win against, since everyone in the same server are fighting against a common goal, Cash Shops have no affect on Me and My game play, therefore, with an informed research and Beta footages, I find the Combat refreshing, the Quest system new and exciting, and the Structure PVP setting a wonderful addition. Therefore I pay for the game knowing that these are already in the game ready for play.

    Will GW2 have flaws and bugs that needs to be fixed, will it have balance issues, will the game lag, probably it will, but I bought it knowing that all those are a possibility. And without a subscription, the decision was made with actual thought not impulse.

    Life is a Maze, so make sure you bring your GPS incase you get lost in it.

  • Skarecrow7Skarecrow7 Member UncommonPosts: 339

    Oh Boy.. ANOTHER cash shop thread. We havnt had one of these in hours!

    image

  • TwoThreeFourTwoThreeFour Member UncommonPosts: 2,155

    Originally posted by rungard

    Lets look at it this way:

    PTW guy buys all the PTW items and looks really cool!

    this is the first guy i target in pvp and avoid in pve.

     

    problem solved.

     

    Which problems precisely? It certainly doesn't solve the problem for the people who participate in different forms of wealth, vanity or crafting competitions.

  • LucioonLucioon Member UncommonPosts: 818

    Originally posted by TwoThreeFour

    Originally posted by Mephster

    Fans pre-purchased, I don't see a problem with that since Guild Wars fans know ArenaNet doesn't fail. We been playing Guild Wars for so many years now we know what we're getting with ArenaNet. There is no con here.

    If you know what you are getting, then answer me this:

    A. How many hours will it take for an average guild to, through grind, reach the buff bonuses which influence buyers will theoretically buy quickly?

     

    B.  How large or how small percent of the GW2 population will have significant lag-issues in large-scale World vs World battles?

     

    C. How many non-repetitive PvE hours can an average consumer expect?

    Those are extremely Valid Concerns for You as a Gamer, for me the Amount of hours to reach Buff Bonuses aren't important to me.

    2. Lag Issues will be addressed with the vast amount of Weekend Beta players, it will be the first test of their server power, then we will know how many people can be in W v W .

    3. How many Non-Repetitive Hours can an Average Consumer expect in SWTOR, RIFT, AOC....etc I am not sure they can accurately give an estimate. Because with the story mode and dynamic events and their new mechanic of Downscale your level to appropriate zones. Actually means that if you are level 80 and you came back to level 20 zone, you can experience a new chain after hours of grinding that you did.

    Remember GW2 doesn't treat the Early Zones like what other MMO treat them. They are not stepping stones to End Game, your End Game starts immediately after you log in.

    Many might fight that intriguing ( i do ) Many might get turn off by it, because they needed a carrot on a stick.

    If you get bored with LOL, DOTA then you might not enjoy your stay that much( LOL and DOTA has no end game )

    You have your concerns, many do, thats why they wait for the First Weekend Beta to have a valid Review without the NDA.

    For others, its an Non Issue, therefore we Pre-Purchase.

    You have the right  to vote with your wallet and be a smart consumer, others can be a smart consumer and know exactly the features of the game that is enough for them.

    Because some might just wait till more Crafting Information are given, Some are waiting for more Gear Stain availability.

    Those two are as valid as your own concerns, but each to its own.

     

    Life is a Maze, so make sure you bring your GPS incase you get lost in it.

  • AmanaAmana Moderator UncommonPosts: 3,912

    Essentially a duplicate topic. http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/346600/Its-a-Trap.html

    Locking this.

     

    To give feedback on moderation, contact mikeb@mmorpg.com

This discussion has been closed.