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Another F2P game goes pay to win - LOTR

2

Comments

  • ShivamShivam Member Posts: 465

    Originally posted by DKLond

    I find it deliciously ironic that a game based on a book that's 100% about the dangers of corruption - has steadily been corrupted.

    This has been obvious from the day they went F2P.

    Now, there should be no doubt - even for those blinded by faith in Turbine.

    Some people live in their own little world. Gaming is a business. Call it corruption or greed but they gotto make money and considering the tough economic times everyone has the right to be corrupt and pull all stops to survive and take care of their families. I run a small company so i know, do i give a damn about what idealistics like you think? nope.

    You must not lose faith in humanity. Humanity is an ocean; if a few drops of the ocean are dirty, the ocean does not become dirty -- Mahatma Gandhi

    image

  • DKLondDKLond Member RarePosts: 2,273

    Originally posted by Shivam

    Originally posted by DKLond

    I find it deliciously ironic that a game based on a book that's 100% about the dangers of corruption - has steadily been corrupted.

    This has been obvious from the day they went F2P.

    Now, there should be no doubt - even for those blinded by faith in Turbine.

    Some people live in their own little world. Gaming is a business. Call it corruption or greed but they gotto make money and considering the tough economic times everyone has the right to be corrupt and pull all stops to survive and take care of their families. I run a small company so i know, do i give a damn about what idealistics like you think? nope.

     You think I - as a paying customer - care about the reason you choose to lie and corrupt yourself?

    No, I just want to play a game that's worth what I invest.

    LOTRO is no longer that.

  • TorlukTorluk Member Posts: 162

    Originally posted by Shivam

    Originally posted by DKLond

    I find it deliciously ironic that a game based on a book that's 100% about the dangers of corruption - has steadily been corrupted.

    This has been obvious from the day they went F2P.

    Now, there should be no doubt - even for those blinded by faith in Turbine.

    Some people live in their own little world. Gaming is a business. Call it corruption or greed but they gotto make money and considering the tough economic times everyone has the right to be corrupt and pull all stops to survive and take care of their families. I run a small company so i know, do i give a damn about what idealistics like you think? nope.

    Actually I think DKLond hits the nail on the head, +1 and someone give that guy a cookie.

    "...they gotto make money..."  you are skipping a step in economic theory here.  What needs to be done is to make a valuable service or product and then, naturally, a profit will be generated.

    Companies don't exist to make profits, the role they play in society is to provide goods and services that we could not all provide for ourselves if we were living subsistence lifestyles.  The companies that produce good products will generate profits and survive, the ones that create pieces of shit will shrivel and die.

    Well, that is the way it is supposed to work anyway but if you take a look at the real world you quickly begin to realise the small print on the great capitalistic dream that nobody talks about.  Capitalism only works in an economy of small businesses.  Once corporations that are worth billions start popping up things start to get hazy.

    Just sowing ideas, hoping they will grow.

  • Matticus75Matticus75 Member UncommonPosts: 396

    Call me stupid, but who gets into competiton to "be better than thou" with real money in a game??!!

     

     

    Wait, I answered that question...................RL (I really consider it a joke, more than a game though)

  • oubersoubers Member UncommonPosts: 855

    lolz...when will people see that F2P is an illusion :p

    hehe

     

    image
  • ShivamShivam Member Posts: 465

    Originally posted by DKLond

    Originally posted by Shivam


    Originally posted by DKLond

    I find it deliciously ironic that a game based on a book that's 100% about the dangers of corruption - has steadily been corrupted.

    This has been obvious from the day they went F2P.

    Now, there should be no doubt - even for those blinded by faith in Turbine.

    Some people live in their own little world. Gaming is a business. Call it corruption or greed but they gotto make money and considering the tough economic times everyone has the right to be corrupt and pull all stops to survive and take care of their families. I run a small company so i know, do i give a damn about what idealistics like you think? nope.

     You think I - as a paying customer - care about the reason you choose to lie and corrupt yourself?

    No, I just want to play a game that's worth what I invest.

    LOTRO is no longer that.

    It is quite obvious that you don't care. By the way i was using the words that you chose.. 'corrupt'. Even though i see no corruption just a usual way of conducting business. You want to see what corruption really means then visit India and Pakistan. You would know what the world really stands for.

    You must live a very sheltered life if this is what you think what corruption really is.

    You must not lose faith in humanity. Humanity is an ocean; if a few drops of the ocean are dirty, the ocean does not become dirty -- Mahatma Gandhi

    image

  • spaceportspaceport Member Posts: 405

    I don't care about this game, i haven't even read the thread, only the title.

     

    But let me guess, it's pay 2 win now, and there are fanboys defending it.

     

    Grow up people, you can still like a game without having to defend everything, it's what NORMAL people do in life!

     

    Try to form a REAL opinion, it's not like anyone cares about what we say on this forums anyway, be honest.

     

    whats

    the

    point

    image
    "Esport with tournaments is for hardcore pvp'rs that want to be competitive. Openworld PVP with ganking and griefing is for casuals that just wants their pvp mixed with pve from time to time."
    otacu

  • ShivamShivam Member Posts: 465

    Originally posted by spaceport

    I don't care about this game, i haven't even read the thread, only the title.

     

    But let me guess, it's pay 2 win now, and there are fanboys defending it.

     

    Grow up people, you can still like a game without having to defend everything, it's what NORMAL people do in life!

     

    Try to form a REAL opinion, it's not like anyone cares about what we say on this forums anyway, be honest.

     

    whats

    the

    point

    If only you knew what the word 'irony' means.

    You must not lose faith in humanity. Humanity is an ocean; if a few drops of the ocean are dirty, the ocean does not become dirty -- Mahatma Gandhi

    image

  • spaceportspaceport Member Posts: 405

    Originally posted by Shivam

    Originally posted by spaceport

    I don't care about this game, i haven't even read the thread, only the title.

     

    But let me guess, it's pay 2 win now, and there are fanboys defending it.

     

    Grow up people, you can still like a game without having to defend everything, it's what NORMAL people do in life!

     

    Try to form a REAL opinion, it's not like anyone cares about what we say on this forums anyway, be honest.

     

    whats

    the

    point

    If only you knew what the word 'irony' means.

    Gonna buy some leet swords with cash, and then grind some huttball, homeboy?

    image
    "Esport with tournaments is for hardcore pvp'rs that want to be competitive. Openworld PVP with ganking and griefing is for casuals that just wants their pvp mixed with pve from time to time."
    otacu

  • ShivamShivam Member Posts: 465

    Originally posted by spaceport

    Originally posted by Shivam


    Originally posted by spaceport

    I don't care about this game, i haven't even read the thread, only the title.

     

    But let me guess, it's pay 2 win now, and there are fanboys defending it.

     

    Grow up people, you can still like a game without having to defend everything, it's what NORMAL people do in life!

     

    Try to form a REAL opinion, it's not like anyone cares about what we say on this forums anyway, be honest.

     

    whats

    the

    point

    If only you knew what the word 'irony' means.

    Gonna buy some leet swords with cash, and then grind some huttball, homeboy?

    lol....you really ruined the wisdom you were tryind to spread in last post. I don't even play LOTRO, haven't for one year now. But yeah 'irony' google it.

    You must not lose faith in humanity. Humanity is an ocean; if a few drops of the ocean are dirty, the ocean does not become dirty -- Mahatma Gandhi

    image

  • DKLondDKLond Member RarePosts: 2,273

    Originally posted by Shivam

    Originally posted by DKLond

    Originally posted by Shivam

    Originally posted by DKLond

    I find it deliciously ironic that a game based on a book that's 100% about the dangers of corruption - has steadily been corrupted.

    This has been obvious from the day they went F2P.

    Now, there should be no doubt - even for those blinded by faith in Turbine.

    Some people live in their own little world. Gaming is a business. Call it corruption or greed but they gotto make money and considering the tough economic times everyone has the right to be corrupt and pull all stops to survive and take care of their families. I run a small company so i know, do i give a damn about what idealistics like you think? nope.

     You think I - as a paying customer - care about the reason you choose to lie and corrupt yourself?

    No, I just want to play a game that's worth what I invest.

    LOTRO is no longer that.

    It is quite obvious that you don't care. By the way i was using the words that you chose.. 'corrupt'. Even though i see no corruption just a usual way of conducting business. You want to see what corruption really means then visit India and Pakistan. You would know what the world really stands for.

    You must live a very sheltered life if this is what you think what corruption really is.

     Corruption is a very simple concept. It's a about integrity, morals and honesty.

    In this case, Turbine lied about not bringing items with stats into the item shop.

    I guess because you have a business that you find tough, everyone who lies and changes their policies do so because they need to survive.

    Right?

    Sorry, but it doesn't quite work for me. Either you keep your promise, or you're a liar. Since they benefit from their lies - it's corruption. Pure and simple.

    Every corrupt person will have a reason they corrupted themselves. It's still corruption, though.

  • ShivamShivam Member Posts: 465

    Originally posted by DKLond

    Originally posted by Shivam


    Originally posted by DKLond


    Originally posted by Shivam


    Originally posted by DKLond

    I find it deliciously ironic that a game based on a book that's 100% about the dangers of corruption - has steadily been corrupted.

    This has been obvious from the day they went F2P.

    Now, there should be no doubt - even for those blinded by faith in Turbine.

    Some people live in their own little world. Gaming is a business. Call it corruption or greed but they gotto make money and considering the tough economic times everyone has the right to be corrupt and pull all stops to survive and take care of their families. I run a small company so i know, do i give a damn about what idealistics like you think? nope.

     You think I - as a paying customer - care about the reason you choose to lie and corrupt yourself?

    No, I just want to play a game that's worth what I invest.

    LOTRO is no longer that.

    It is quite obvious that you don't care. By the way i was using the words that you chose.. 'corrupt'. Even though i see no corruption just a usual way of conducting business. You want to see what corruption really means then visit India and Pakistan. You would know what the world really stands for.

    You must live a very sheltered life if this is what you think what corruption really is.

     Corruption is a very simple concept. It's a about integrity, morals and honesty.

    In this case, Turbine lied about not bringing items with stats into the item shop.

    I guess because you have a business that you find tough, everyone who lies and changes their policies do so because they need to survive.

    Right?

    Sorry, but it doesn't quite work for me. Either you keep your promise, or you're a liar. Since they benefit from their lies - it's corruption. Pure and simple.

    Every corrupt person will have a reason they corrupted themselves. It's still corruption, though.

    That is called survival. Unless they are not hurting anyone emotionally or physically i wouldn't worry about it. Real corruption changes lives and effects people emotionally in a big way and if you are that emotionally invested ina video game where it becomes your personality and life then that is whole another issue and i wouldn't like to get into that.

    Although i wonder how many times you have been able to keep all the promises you made to others in life.

    You must not lose faith in humanity. Humanity is an ocean; if a few drops of the ocean are dirty, the ocean does not become dirty -- Mahatma Gandhi

    image

  • DredphyreDredphyre Member Posts: 601

    Originally posted by banditoa

    it's newbie levelling gear. basically, at low levels, if you don't pick a crafting profession to make your own armor then you have a hard time getting any decent defense. no newbies have the amount of silver/gold required to pay the insane AH prices on crafting mats or equipment, and you're lucky to find skirmish vendor equips tailored to your needs unless you're a guardian, minstrel, or hunter.

     

    it's convenience, which they have ALWAYS sold in the cash shop. this is further proven by the fact that it has a run speed buff on it. almost no equipment buffs your move speed. this armor exists to make the early levels a little more about just getting things done and progressing in the game, rather than spending loads of time farming mats or replaying skirmishes in order to gear up.

     

    if that's not enough for you, turbine have stated that this is the intention of the cash shop armor. they're not stupid. the LOTR playerbase is much smaller than it used to be, and they won't do something to alienate the players they have left.

     

    the 'pay to win' notion is also completely ridiculous when referring to LOTR. paying to win at what? lotro is a PvE game. too many people who don't know what they're looking at are overreacting to something they dont understand in a game they don't play.

    This is really a tortured excuse for Turbine's crimes here.  Here's another solution for the problem you pose: better gear offered as rewards for quests.  Problem solved.

    And yes, I'm a Lifer. This is still bogus.

  • spaceportspaceport Member Posts: 405

    Originally posted by Shivam

    Originally posted by spaceport


    Originally posted by Shivam


    Originally posted by spaceport

    I don't care about this game, i haven't even read the thread, only the title.

     

    But let me guess, it's pay 2 win now, and there are fanboys defending it.

     

    Grow up people, you can still like a game without having to defend everything, it's what NORMAL people do in life!

     

    Try to form a REAL opinion, it's not like anyone cares about what we say on this forums anyway, be honest.

     

    whats

    the

    point

    If only you knew what the word 'irony' means.

    Gonna buy some leet swords with cash, and then grind some huttball, homeboy?

    lol....you really ruined the wisdom you were tryind to spread in last post. I don't even play LOTRO, haven't for one year now. But yeah 'irony' google it.

     NEUTRAL BALLLL, LET'S GOOOOO BERSERK

    Don't you worry, im sure there are going to be cool stuff for you to buy when SWTOR goes f2p :)

    image
    "Esport with tournaments is for hardcore pvp'rs that want to be competitive. Openworld PVP with ganking and griefing is for casuals that just wants their pvp mixed with pve from time to time."
    otacu

  • stayontargetstayontarget Member RarePosts: 6,519

    Why people love f2p is beyond me,  this sort of stuff always happens.

    Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...

  • warmaster670warmaster670 Member Posts: 1,384

    Pay to win what? PVE? who gives a crap, if someone wants to waste tehre money to make there little stats better (which isnt even needed, ive been using armour i got at the start of moria and im 65) then more power to them.

    Apparently stating the truth in my sig is "trolling"
    Sig typo fixed thanks to an observant stragen001.

  • DredphyreDredphyre Member Posts: 601

    Originally posted by Shivam

    Originally posted by DKLond

    I find it deliciously ironic that a game based on a book that's 100% about the dangers of corruption - has steadily been corrupted.

    This has been obvious from the day they went F2P.

    Now, there should be no doubt - even for those blinded by faith in Turbine.

    Some people live in their own little world. Gaming is a business. Call it corruption or greed but they gotto make money and considering the tough economic times everyone has the right to be corrupt and pull all stops to survive and take care of their families. I run a small company so i know, do i give a damn about what idealistics like you think? nope.

    Wow...just wow.....'everyone has a right to be corrupt'? Really? No, really?  And you run a small business? Please, tell me your business so I can avoid it.  What is this effing world coming to....

    If one can't run a business without being corrupt, maybe one should get out of the business.

  • Methos12Methos12 Member UncommonPosts: 1,244

    Originally posted by warmaster670

    Pay to win what? PVE? who gives a crap, if someone wants to waste tehre money to make there little stats better (which isnt even needed, ive been using armour i got at the start of moria and im 65) then more power to them.

    On one side this is true, but on the other it raises a valid question - why would someone take you in a group over someone else who's buffed himself up through cash shop? Math is math, after all.

    Civilized men are more discourteous than savages because they know they can be impolite without having their skulls split, as a general thing.
  • ShivamShivam Member Posts: 465

    Originally posted by spaceport

     NEUTRAL BALLLL, LET'S GOOOOO BERSERK

    Don't you worry, im sure there are going to be cool stuff for you to buy when SWTOR goes f2p :)

    Nothing is F2P..there is no such things as F2P. Even if SWTOR goes F2P (lol) i would still stick to 15 bucks a month. That is still best bang for my buck. 

    You must not lose faith in humanity. Humanity is an ocean; if a few drops of the ocean are dirty, the ocean does not become dirty -- Mahatma Gandhi

    image

  • ShivamShivam Member Posts: 465

    Originally posted by Dredphyre

    Originally posted by Shivam


    Originally posted by DKLond

    I find it deliciously ironic that a game based on a book that's 100% about the dangers of corruption - has steadily been corrupted.

    This has been obvious from the day they went F2P.

    Now, there should be no doubt - even for those blinded by faith in Turbine.

    Some people live in their own little world. Gaming is a business. Call it corruption or greed but they gotto make money and considering the tough economic times everyone has the right to be corrupt and pull all stops to survive and take care of their families. I run a small company so i know, do i give a damn about what idealistics like you think? nope.

    Wow...just wow.....'everyone has a right to be corrupt'? Really? No, really?  And you run a small business? Please, tell me your business so I can avoid it.  What is this effing world coming to....

    If one can't run a business without being corrupt, maybe one should get out of the business.

     ehh? he called it corrupt not me. All i said was that if this what is considered  corruption than every company has right to be corrupt. Even though i see no corruption or lies but usual business practise. If all corruption in world would be to same level as Turbine this world would be much better place to live in.

    You people get so emotional while punching your key board that you don't even bother to read.

    You must not lose faith in humanity. Humanity is an ocean; if a few drops of the ocean are dirty, the ocean does not become dirty -- Mahatma Gandhi

    image

  • DKLondDKLond Member RarePosts: 2,273

    Originally posted by Shivam

    Originally posted by DKLond

    Originally posted by Shivam

    Originally posted by DKLond

    Originally posted by Shivam

    Originally posted by DKLond

    I find it deliciously ironic that a game based on a book that's 100% about the dangers of corruption - has steadily been corrupted.

    This has been obvious from the day they went F2P.

    Now, there should be no doubt - even for those blinded by faith in Turbine.

    Some people live in their own little world. Gaming is a business. Call it corruption or greed but they gotto make money and considering the tough economic times everyone has the right to be corrupt and pull all stops to survive and take care of their families. I run a small company so i know, do i give a damn about what idealistics like you think? nope.

     You think I - as a paying customer - care about the reason you choose to lie and corrupt yourself?

    No, I just want to play a game that's worth what I invest.

    LOTRO is no longer that.

    It is quite obvious that you don't care. By the way i was using the words that you chose.. 'corrupt'. Even though i see no corruption just a usual way of conducting business. You want to see what corruption really means then visit India and Pakistan. You would know what the world really stands for.

    You must live a very sheltered life if this is what you think what corruption really is.

     Corruption is a very simple concept. It's a about integrity, morals and honesty.

    In this case, Turbine lied about not bringing items with stats into the item shop.

    I guess because you have a business that you find tough, everyone who lies and changes their policies do so because they need to survive.

    Right?

    Sorry, but it doesn't quite work for me. Either you keep your promise, or you're a liar. Since they benefit from their lies - it's corruption. Pure and simple.

    Every corrupt person will have a reason they corrupted themselves. It's still corruption, though.

    That is called survival. Unless they are not hurting anyone emotionally or physically i wouldn't worry about it. Real corruption changes lives and effects people emotionally in a big way and if you are that emotionally invested ina video game where it becomes your personality and life then that is whole another issue and i wouldn't like to get into that.

    Although i wonder how many times you have been able to keep all the promises you made to others in life.

    Your attitude is why the world looks like it does.

    No one is "hurting" anyone - they're just adding to ever more layers of corruption and greed and calling it survival.

    As the wise person stated a few posts before this, capitalism is a nice idea that doesn't survive humanity. Especially not when people like you are so abundant.

    I have broken promises - but the key is to be accountable. To pretend it's "ok" because I needed to survive is dishonest and pathetic.

    This whole "survival" angle on every business squeezing that extra drop when they don't need it, isn't convincing. It's just another excuse to be greedy.

  • ShivamShivam Member Posts: 465

    Originally posted by DKLond

    Originally posted by Shivam


    Originally posted by DKLond


    Originally posted by Shivam


    Originally posted by DKLond


    Originally posted by Shivam


    Originally posted by DKLond

    I find it deliciously ironic that a game based on a book that's 100% about the dangers of corruption - has steadily been corrupted.

    This has been obvious from the day they went F2P.

    Now, there should be no doubt - even for those blinded by faith in Turbine.

    Some people live in their own little world. Gaming is a business. Call it corruption or greed but they gotto make money and considering the tough economic times everyone has the right to be corrupt and pull all stops to survive and take care of their families. I run a small company so i know, do i give a damn about what idealistics like you think? nope.

     You think I - as a paying customer - care about the reason you choose to lie and corrupt yourself?

    No, I just want to play a game that's worth what I invest.

    LOTRO is no longer that.

    It is quite obvious that you don't care. By the way i was using the words that you chose.. 'corrupt'. Even though i see no corruption just a usual way of conducting business. You want to see what corruption really means then visit India and Pakistan. You would know what the world really stands for.

    You must live a very sheltered life if this is what you think what corruption really is.

     Corruption is a very simple concept. It's a about integrity, morals and honesty.

    In this case, Turbine lied about not bringing items with stats into the item shop.

    I guess because you have a business that you find tough, everyone who lies and changes their policies do so because they need to survive.

    Right?

    Sorry, but it doesn't quite work for me. Either you keep your promise, or you're a liar. Since they benefit from their lies - it's corruption. Pure and simple.

    Every corrupt person will have a reason they corrupted themselves. It's still corruption, though.

    That is called survival. Unless they are not hurting anyone emotionally or physically i wouldn't worry about it. Real corruption changes lives and effects people emotionally in a big way and if you are that emotionally invested ina video game where it becomes your personality and life then that is whole another issue and i wouldn't like to get into that.

    Although i wonder how many times you have been able to keep all the promises you made to others in life.

    Your attitude is why the world looks like it does.

    No one is "hurting" anyone - they're just adding to ever more layers of corruption and greed and calling it survival.

    As the wise person stated a few posts before this, capitalism is a nice idea that doesn't survive humanity. Especially not when people like you are so abundant.

    I have broken promises - but the key is to be accountable. To pretend it's "ok" because I needed to survive is dishonest and pathetic.

    This whole "survival" angle on every business squeezing that extra drop when they don't need it, isn't convincing. It's just another excuse to be greedy.

    You mean people like me who don't judge others without first having a look in the mirror? okie!

    Step out of that room of yours dude..i  hardly doubt you even know what the state the world really is in, if all your comparisons come from a freakin video game.

    You must not lose faith in humanity. Humanity is an ocean; if a few drops of the ocean are dirty, the ocean does not become dirty -- Mahatma Gandhi

    image

  • DKLondDKLond Member RarePosts: 2,273

    You mean people like me who don't judge others without first having a look in the mirror? okie!

    Step out of that room of yours dude..i  hardly doubt you even know what the state the world really is in, if all your comparisons come from a freakin video game.

     Oh, so you're not "judging" by stating - as a fact - that Turbine is doing what they do to survive, and nothing more. You're not "judging" me when you state - over and over - that I don't know what the world looks like and I need to step out of my room?

    I'm not "judging" you - I'm going by what you're telling me. You're saying lying and being corrupt is "ok" - because it's not AS corrupt as what you consider real corruption.

    Oh, and I DO look myself in the mirror every day. I was raised with love and I learned that money isn't everything. In fact, I learned by looking around that most people are wasting away chasing something that - even if they get it - will never make them happy. They're so obsessed with chasing this "survival" thing called money - that they don't much care what happens to the people that get in the way when they're doing business.

    I'm sorry, but corruption is a very easy concept to grasp - and Turbine has PROVEN themselves corrupt here - regardless of any fantasy scenario of them starving. What LEVEL of corruption you want to call it, is your business. But it's 100% flat-out corruption.

    About your whole "video" game argument - we're on a VIDEO GAME website. We're talking about a VIDEO GAME - and we're talking about the VIDEO GAME INDUSTRY. 

  • oubersoubers Member UncommonPosts: 855

    realy offtopic......admins better close it then imho :p

     

    image
  • ReaperUkReaperUk Member UncommonPosts: 746

    As others have already pointed out, LotRO is primarily a PvE game. How can you pay to win in a PvE game? Pay to win what? The other thing I can't understand is how people are defending the out of date P2P model. Turbine has shown the way with the fremium payment model, turning around a failing game like Dungeons and Dragons and in turn, making an already successful game, LotRO into an even more successful one. After five years on the market, not only has LotRO not had to close or merge any servers, they  actually had to add more to cope with the increase in player numbers.

    More and more games are changing to the freemium model because it has been shown to work. P2P is on its way out and newly released games like SWTOR and up and coming games such as The Secret World will have hard decisions to make in the coming year if they are to have a long term player base.

    I'm sure we will see a huge drop in numbers playing SWTOR when the first sub becomes due in a couple of days time and the following months will see a steady decline, At some stage, conversion to some kind of freemium model will become inevitable.

    The bottom line is that less and less people will be willing to pay monthly subsriptions in the future, when there will be so many games that won't require them.

     

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