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The Locking of Thread Conversations...

IkedaIkeda Member RarePosts: 2,751

Just curious if anyone has noticed that constructive threads that are spawning interesting back and forth are being locked?  In particular, lately it is from people who have issues with the recent ToR launch.  Whether you like it or hate it, CONSTRUCTIVE feedback is essential.  

When people discuss items that are bugged or have issues, THAT is the purpose of this site.  Instead, you have mods locking threads.  Don't lock the thread, remove the comments that go against the Code of Conduct.  

MikeB has already stepped in multiple times over this over-zealous modding and I'm finding that the commuity has become ridiculous as a result.  You ban someone, they create a 1 post account and come back to continue flame wars.  FFS, can't we all be atleast remotely mature in our discussions?

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Comments

  • niceguy3978niceguy3978 Member UncommonPosts: 2,020

    Originally posted by Ikeda

    Just curious if anyone has noticed that constructive threads that are spawning interesting back and forth are being locked?  In particular, lately it is from people who have issues with the recent ToR launch.  Whether you like it or hate it, CONSTRUCTIVE feedback is essential.  

    When people discuss items that are bugged or have issues, THAT is the purpose of this site.  Instead, you have mods locking threads.  Don't lock the thread, remove the comments that go against the Code of Conduct.  

    MikeB has already stepped in multiple times over this over-zealous modding and I'm finding that the commuity has become ridiculous as a result.  You ban someone, they create a 1 post account and come back to continue flame wars.  FFS, can't we all be atleast remotely mature in our discussions?

    I agree with this.  If people are flaiming/baiting don't lock the thread, remove the idiots.  Its like closing the playground because one kid kicked another in the shin.

    Edit:  there have been a few threads where the sole purpose seemed to be to "stir the pot" for no other reason than to just be a jerk.  

  • EverSkellyEverSkelly Member UncommonPosts: 341

    They just deleted 2 threads where negative opinion about swtor was expressed and then locked the third thread.

    They never do it with a positive swtor threads.

  • niceguy3978niceguy3978 Member UncommonPosts: 2,020

    One other thing I would like to see is that redundent threads get merged.  Do we really need 5 threads on the "dead" world?  While I tend to agree with the argument that the world feels sterile, I don't think we need as many threads on it as we have.  Same with a lot of the other complaints and compliments, if there's already a thread on the topic, why do people think their opinion is so much better that it deserves a new thread?  Or they are just to lazy to find out if it already has a thread.  Or it is a mixture of both.

     

  • JarazarJarazar Member Posts: 231

    Originally posted by EverSkelly

    They just deleted 2 threads where negative opinion about swtor was expressed and then locked the third thread.

    They never do it with a positive swtor threads.

    It seems that people cannot be civil in very many SWTOR threads. And, I agree with you guys about dealing with individuals rather than locking threads. I can't wait until GW2 is launched so this war between SWTOR and GW2 ceases. Why can't people like their game and leave others alone.

     

    image

  • mastersomratmastersomrat Member UncommonPosts: 373

    Same thing happened with a SWG vs. SWToR thread and if not mistaken, it was Mike that locked that thread as well.  Thing is, their wasn't anything meane being said in that thread.  Simply, that  most peeps wished SWG wasn'y closed so SWToR would prosper.  I'm beginning to think SWToR is channeling funds to MMORPG...lol

  • erictlewiserictlewis Member UncommonPosts: 3,021

    It is called trolling several of those threads were created by folks who are using fake accounts.  Yea that's right they set up an account today to troll and post all that negative stuff so that their real account does not take a hit.

    I call it cowardice,  some think they are being smart.  All I hope is that the mods who are working for this site find all the real accounts and deals with them accordingly.

    I have no problem with negative stuff about star wars,  but I have a problem with somebody who is well known on this site creating a fake account to do it with and hind behind that like a scared troll.

    I for one am glad that the mods are doing this,  quite frankly the pvp on this site dealing with star wars has taken this site to a new low.  I almost feel like were in mos eisley cantina.

     

  • PilnkplonkPilnkplonk Member Posts: 1,532

    Originally posted by mastersomrat

    Same thing happened with a SWG vs. SWToR thread and if not mistaken, it was Mike that locked that thread as well.  Thing is, their wasn't anything meane being said in that thread.  Simply, that  most peeps wished SWG wasn'y closed so SWToR would prosper.  I'm beginning to think SWToR is channeling funds to MMORPG...lol

    No! That cannot be! We all know game sites live on rarified air of academic imparitality and utter objectivity. Just like today's journalism in general.

    Heretic!

  • DLangleyDLangley Member Posts: 1,407

    Hey guys, if you would like to give feedback on moderation - please contact [email protected] and give your input.

     

    Thanks!

  • PilnkplonkPilnkplonk Member Posts: 1,532

    Originally posted by Clerigo

    Edit: http://www.mmorpg.com/disclaimers.cfm#conduct

    Read!

    as far as this thread is concerned, only this might be relevant

    "Using the Post Report Tool as a Method of Contacting the Moderators


    • The post report tool is not intended to be used as a way for users to communicate with Moderators. If you have an issue with a warning or ban, please email [email protected]."

    however, the op is not using the thread "as a method of contanting the moderators" but simply comenting on moderating policies. I see no issue here.


     


    And besides, now that you dug that up, the only "penalties" listed by infractions are personal warnings and bans.


    Hmm...


     


    Then it seems that thread locking is completely under discretion of individual mods. I'm not sure I like that. In fact, I'm sure I don't like that. At all.

  • IkedaIkeda Member RarePosts: 2,751

    No,

    I am not going after the mods.  Nor am I going to post specific moderation decisions as that would go against the CoC.  Specifically, I typically and reasonably agree with quite a few of the moderators decision.  

    As DLangley commented in here, I am debating sending an email to MikeB.  However, PRIOR to doing so, I'm asking people their opinions.  This is, after all, a forum.

    My MAIN concern though is that we are locking threads unreasonably.  Yes, threads get side tracked.  A simple "Hey get this thread on track or else" message typically pulls people back in.  Instead, no warning and locked.  So NOW people go and create yet another thread with similar information as the original thread and it continues.  

    It is my OPINION that we should punish the offended users in a thread and not the thread.  It is also my opinion that duplicate threads should be compiled and blatant flaming threads punished.  Constructive threads should not be included as quite a few of us are talking in a mature manner.

  • UbermehUbermeh Member Posts: 92

    Originally posted by Ubermeh

    Originally posted by Pilnkplonk


    Originally posted by Clerigo

    Edit: http://www.mmorpg.com/disclaimers.cfm#conduct

    Read!

    as far as this thread is concerned, only this might be relevant

    "Using the Post Report Tool as a Method of Contacting the Moderators


    • The post report tool is not intended to be used as a way for users to communicate with Moderators. If you have an issue with a warning or ban, please email [email protected]."

    however, the op is not using the thread "as a method of contanting the moderators" but simply comenting on moderating policies. I see no issue here.

    Everyone should contact MMORPG if they are concerned about the inordinate amount of locked threads.

    Well, I would contact the site but keep getting this error.


    MMORPG.COM has just experienced an error


    The details for this error are:


    • Details: An exception occured while performing the captcha cfimage action. coldfusion.image.ImageWriter$ImageWritingException: An exception occurred while trying to write the image. The error occurred on line 253.

    • Template: /contactus.cfm

    To report this error please copy the information above into an email addressed to:

    meddle at mmorpg.com.



     

    Please refresh the page or use the back button to return to the site.

  • PilnkplonkPilnkplonk Member Posts: 1,532

    Originally posted by Ikeda

    No,

    I am not going after the mods.  Nor am I going to post specific moderation decisions as that would go against the CoC.  Specifically, I typically and reasonably agree with quite a few of the moderators decision.  

    As DLangley commented in here, I am debating sending an email to MikeB.  However, PRIOR to doing so, I'm asking people their opinions.  This is, after all, a forum.

    My MAIN concern though is that we are locking threads unreasonably.  Yes, threads get side tracked.  A simple "Hey get this thread on track or else" message typically pulls people back in.  Instead, no warning and locked.  So NOW people go and create yet another thread with similar information as the original thread and it continues.  

    It is my OPINION that we should punish the offended users in a thread and not the thread.  It is also my opinion that duplicate threads should be compiled and blatant flaming threads punished.  Constructive threads should not be included as quite a few of us are talking in a mature manner.

    I have a new suggestion!

    I love a heated, no-holds-barred "deconstructive" discussion ocassionally. And I'm sure I'm not alone. What  would you all say if mmorpg.com created a new thread category called "The Pile" or something for flaming, trolling, sidetracked or whatever threads and instead of locking them, they just move them over there so us rabid trolls can have a ball?

    Whaddaya say?

  • TealaTeala Member RarePosts: 7,627

    Originally posted by Pilnkplonk

    Originally posted by Ikeda

    No,

    I am not going after the mods.  Nor am I going to post specific moderation decisions as that would go against the CoC.  Specifically, I typically and reasonably agree with quite a few of the moderators decision.  

    As DLangley commented in here, I am debating sending an email to MikeB.  However, PRIOR to doing so, I'm asking people their opinions.  This is, after all, a forum.

    My MAIN concern though is that we are locking threads unreasonably.  Yes, threads get side tracked.  A simple "Hey get this thread on track or else" message typically pulls people back in.  Instead, no warning and locked.  So NOW people go and create yet another thread with similar information as the original thread and it continues.  

    It is my OPINION that we should punish the offended users in a thread and not the thread.  It is also my opinion that duplicate threads should be compiled and blatant flaming threads punished.  Constructive threads should not be included as quite a few of us are talking in a mature manner.

    I have a new suggestion!

    I love a heated, no-holds-barred "deconstructive" discussion ocassionally. And I'm sure I'm not alone. What  would you all say if mmorpg.com created a new thread category called "The Pile" or something for flaming, trolling, sidetracked or whatever threads and instead of locking them, they just move them over there so us rabid trolls can have a ball?

    Whaddaya say?

    Because people would abuse it and it would degenarate into the kind of forum nobody would like...it would be like the old off-topic News forum.  It would turn into that and people would be posting all sorts of bad pictures, graphics, you name it...and that is just wrong.

  • OmaliOmali MMO Business CorrespondentMember UncommonPosts: 1,172

    Originally posted by EverSkelly

    They just deleted 2 threads where negative opinion about swtor was expressed and then locked the third thread.

    They never do it with a positive swtor threads.

    It's a lot more difficult to be offensively positive than it is offensively negative. There is a fine line between trolling and offering constructive negative feedback, and a lot of users here don't seem to understand the difference.

    Check out my monthly column on MMORPG.com.

    image

  • TealaTeala Member RarePosts: 7,627

    Originally posted by Ikeda

    No,

    I am not going after the mods.  Nor am I going to post specific moderation decisions as that would go against the CoC.  Specifically, I typically and reasonably agree with quite a few of the moderators decision.  

    As DLangley commented in here, I am debating sending an email to MikeB.  However, PRIOR to doing so, I'm asking people their opinions.  This is, after all, a forum.

    My MAIN concern though is that we are locking threads unreasonably.  Yes, threads get side tracked.  A simple "Hey get this thread on track or else" message typically pulls people back in.  Instead, no warning and locked.  So NOW people go and create yet another thread with similar information as the original thread and it continues.  

    It is my OPINION that we should punish the offended users in a thread and not the thread.  It is also my opinion that duplicate threads should be compiled and blatant flaming threads punished.  Constructive threads should not be included as quite a few of us are talking in a mature manner.

    The problem with this is that some people on these boards think that a negative comment(criticism) with constructive  suggestion is still trolling and hating on a game.   If anyone knows this...it's me.   For instance...I make a comment that the worlds in SW:ToR are stagnate and lifeless.  No background sounds like birds chirping, or critters making noises or even critters like birds of butterflies, and I think Bioware needs ot address this and add more life to the game and instead of taking my comment(with the suggesstion on how to fix it) people see  it as a negative post and then instead of commenting on the topic of the dead lifeless worlds..they attack you and call you a troll or a hater.   It happens all the time.  Watch.

  • PilnkplonkPilnkplonk Member Posts: 1,532

    Originally posted by Teala

    Originally posted by Pilnkplonk


    Originally posted by Ikeda

    No,

    I am not going after the mods.  Nor am I going to post specific moderation decisions as that would go against the CoC.  Specifically, I typically and reasonably agree with quite a few of the moderators decision.  

    As DLangley commented in here, I am debating sending an email to MikeB.  However, PRIOR to doing so, I'm asking people their opinions.  This is, after all, a forum.

    My MAIN concern though is that we are locking threads unreasonably.  Yes, threads get side tracked.  A simple "Hey get this thread on track or else" message typically pulls people back in.  Instead, no warning and locked.  So NOW people go and create yet another thread with similar information as the original thread and it continues.  

    It is my OPINION that we should punish the offended users in a thread and not the thread.  It is also my opinion that duplicate threads should be compiled and blatant flaming threads punished.  Constructive threads should not be included as quite a few of us are talking in a mature manner.

    I have a new suggestion!

    I love a heated, no-holds-barred "deconstructive" discussion ocassionally. And I'm sure I'm not alone. What  would you all say if mmorpg.com created a new thread category called "The Pile" or something for flaming, trolling, sidetracked or whatever threads and instead of locking them, they just move them over there so us rabid trolls can have a ball?

    Whaddaya say?

    Because people would abuse it and it would degenarate into the kind of forum nobody would like...it would be like the old off-topic News forum.  It would turn into that and people would be posting all sorts of bad pictures, graphics, you name it...and that is just wrong.

    Nah, I'm not talking about bannable offenses, they should stay moderated as always. What I'm thinking of is more like those "soft" cases with name calling (without racial or sexist slurs ofc) and threads that got sidetracked or too flamey or outright criticism without the obligartory "constructive" caveat... That kind of thing.

    If they keep banhammering spammers, porn merchants, outright freaks etc I'll be happy. The threads I'm talking about are those in the soft, iffy zone between the spick-and-spam clean ones and outright crap, in short - those that usually get locked.

  • TealaTeala Member RarePosts: 7,627

    Originally posted by Pilnkplonk

    Originally posted by Teala


    Originally posted by Pilnkplonk


    Originally posted by Ikeda

    No,

    I am not going after the mods.  Nor am I going to post specific moderation decisions as that would go against the CoC.  Specifically, I typically and reasonably agree with quite a few of the moderators decision.  

    As DLangley commented in here, I am debating sending an email to MikeB.  However, PRIOR to doing so, I'm asking people their opinions.  This is, after all, a forum.

    My MAIN concern though is that we are locking threads unreasonably.  Yes, threads get side tracked.  A simple "Hey get this thread on track or else" message typically pulls people back in.  Instead, no warning and locked.  So NOW people go and create yet another thread with similar information as the original thread and it continues.  

    It is my OPINION that we should punish the offended users in a thread and not the thread.  It is also my opinion that duplicate threads should be compiled and blatant flaming threads punished.  Constructive threads should not be included as quite a few of us are talking in a mature manner.

    I have a new suggestion!

    I love a heated, no-holds-barred "deconstructive" discussion ocassionally. And I'm sure I'm not alone. What  would you all say if mmorpg.com created a new thread category called "The Pile" or something for flaming, trolling, sidetracked or whatever threads and instead of locking them, they just move them over there so us rabid trolls can have a ball?

    Whaddaya say?

    Because people would abuse it and it would degenarate into the kind of forum nobody would like...it would be like the old off-topic News forum.  It would turn into that and people would be posting all sorts of bad pictures, graphics, you name it...and that is just wrong.

    Nah, I'm not talking about bannable offenses, that should stay moderated as always. What I'm thinking of is more like those "soft" cases with name calling (without racial or sexist slurs ofc) and threads that got sidetracked or too flamey or outright criticism without the obligartory "constructive" caveat... That kind of thing.

    If they keep banhammering spammers, porn merchants, outright freaks etc I'll be happy. The threads I'm talking about are those in the soft, iffy zone between the spick-and-spam clean ones and outright crap, in short - those that usually get locked.



    Like the one earlier where the one guy kept taking it off topic and pointing fingers instead of addressing the topic.  All the mods have to do is ban those people.    Unfortunately that doesn't seem to happen enough around here.   We can discuss the good and bad about games, people need to stop thinking these games are the geese that laid the golden egg, because they are not, they have faults, some glaring, and we as gamers should be on he butts of developers about this stuff.  Not saying anything never gets anything fixed.

  • DannyGloverDannyGlover Member Posts: 1,277

    It gets all screwed up when people stop discussing games and start discussing the people who play them.

    I sit on a man's back, choking him and making him carry me, and yet assure myself and others that I am very sorry for him and wish to ease his lot by all possible means - except by getting off his back.

  • niceguy3978niceguy3978 Member UncommonPosts: 2,020

    Originally posted by Teala

    Originally posted by Pilnkplonk


    Originally posted by Ikeda

    No,

    I am not going after the mods.  Nor am I going to post specific moderation decisions as that would go against the CoC.  Specifically, I typically and reasonably agree with quite a few of the moderators decision.  

    As DLangley commented in here, I am debating sending an email to MikeB.  However, PRIOR to doing so, I'm asking people their opinions.  This is, after all, a forum.

    My MAIN concern though is that we are locking threads unreasonably.  Yes, threads get side tracked.  A simple "Hey get this thread on track or else" message typically pulls people back in.  Instead, no warning and locked.  So NOW people go and create yet another thread with similar information as the original thread and it continues.  

    It is my OPINION that we should punish the offended users in a thread and not the thread.  It is also my opinion that duplicate threads should be compiled and blatant flaming threads punished.  Constructive threads should not be included as quite a few of us are talking in a mature manner.

    I have a new suggestion!

    I love a heated, no-holds-barred "deconstructive" discussion ocassionally. And I'm sure I'm not alone. What  would you all say if mmorpg.com created a new thread category called "The Pile" or something for flaming, trolling, sidetracked or whatever threads and instead of locking them, they just move them over there so us rabid trolls can have a ball?

    Whaddaya say?

    Because people would abuse it and it would degenarate into the kind of forum nobody would like...it would be like the old off-topic News forum.  It would turn into that and people would be posting all sorts of bad pictures, graphics, you name it...and that is just wrong.

    I wouldn't have a problem with it if, and only if, the thread didn't show up on the updates section on the front page.  If people wanted to post on a "pile" thread, then they would have to seek out a thread on the topic of interest.

  • erictlewiserictlewis Member UncommonPosts: 3,021

    All I have to add is this entire star wars forum has devolved into name calling and trolling.   There is hardly any  thread now that has not devolved into name calling.

    Quite frankly its gotten old,  I don't understand all the hate that this game has caused, and all the pvp that is going on.

    I sent mikeb and email asking them to start doing stuff to folks who are taking these forums as an ability to personally attack folks who disagree with them.   It is one thing to post negative thoughts about a game, is quite another thing to use it as a personal luanch paud to call folks names, and pernally attack them, and have the conversation devovle into 3rd grade antics and that is what has happened over the past few months. Its become I hate this and if you dont agree name calling insues.

    It is just not the swtor forums it has spread, and honestly until the mods actually start getting the offenders and punishing them, and handing out ban hammers honestly this has been happening for months and were just really past the point of even being civil with each other any more.

     

     

     

  • JimmacJimmac Member UncommonPosts: 1,667

    Sending an message to the mods might help to get your individual case overturned, but it certainly won't get the mods to stop over moderating. If they haven't realized by now that they overmoderate so badly that they kill good discussions before the good discussions even happen, then they probably never will.

    Bottom line: send a message and you may get unbanned, but sending a message won't stop the overmoderation in general. That's why threads like this are needed...to keep reminding them how poorly of a job they do at moderation, until they finally understand they are causing more harm than good.

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 37,027

    I have to agree, the moderators would be better served by removing offending posts/posters and leaving the threads alone.  It gets to be a slippery slope when mods are allowed to close/lock/delete threads as this is based on their personal whim and just IMO is done far too often.

    While appealing the locks sometimes works, on many occasions the locks are permitted to stand (deletions can't be recovered after the fact regardless) and over all it stifles discussion on the forums, which I never like see happen.

    There is no bad discussion as far as I'm concerned and if a thread contains a topic I'm not interested in or going down a road I don't care for, I just ignore it and move on. 

    Unfortunately, others can't seem to do this and take it upon themselves to shut it down in the name of troll hunting.

    Only trouble is, trolls only exist in fantasy realms, but can't seem to get people to realize it.

    What most people call trolling, I call discussion.

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  • MikeBMikeB Community ManagerAdministrator RarePosts: 6,540

    Originally posted by Ikeda

    No,

    I am not going after the mods.  Nor am I going to post specific moderation decisions as that would go against the CoC.  Specifically, I typically and reasonably agree with quite a few of the moderators decision.  

    As DLangley commented in here, I am debating sending an email to MikeB.  However, PRIOR to doing so, I'm asking people their opinions.  This is, after all, a forum.

    My MAIN concern though is that we are locking threads unreasonably.  Yes, threads get side tracked.  A simple "Hey get this thread on track or else" message typically pulls people back in.  Instead, no warning and locked.  So NOW people go and create yet another thread with similar information as the original thread and it continues.  

    It is my OPINION that we should punish the offended users in a thread and not the thread.  It is also my opinion that duplicate threads should be compiled and blatant flaming threads punished.  Constructive threads should not be included as quite a few of us are talking in a mature manner.

    Without specifics, it's hard to really address your concerns. Please go ahead and e-mail me some links so I can take a closer look.

    In general, assuming the thread isn't in blatant violation of our RoC to begin with, we will often post a public warning in the thread if it is getting out of hand/off-topic, and if after trying to clean the thread up the thread continues to get hairy we'll go ahead and lock it up. This is simply standard practice on most forums.

    Michael "MikeB" Bitton
    Community Manager
    Twitter: @eMikeB

  • MikeBMikeB Community ManagerAdministrator RarePosts: 6,540

    Originally posted by Kyleran

    I have to agree, the moderators would be better served by removing offending posts/posters and leaving the threads alone.  It gets to be a slippery slope when mods are allowed to close/lock/delete threads as this is based on their personal whim and just IMO is done far too often.

    While appealing the locks sometimes works, on many occasions the locks are permitted to stand (deletions can't be recovered after the fact regardless) and over all it stifles discussion on the forums, which I never like see happen.

    There is no bad discussion as far as I'm concerned and if a thread contains a topic I'm not interested in or going down a road I don't care for, I just ignore it and move on. 

    Unfortunately, others can't seem to do this and take it upon themselves to shut it down in the name of troll hunting.

    Only trouble is, trolls only exist in fantasy realms, but can't seem to get people to realize it.

    What most people call trolling, I call discussion.

    We do remove posts from threads. Threads are generally only locked if they've gone too far off course/into the deep end.  Also, deletions CAN be recovered.

    We do not lock on personal whim. Locks are done for a reason as I explained in the response above.

    Michael "MikeB" Bitton
    Community Manager
    Twitter: @eMikeB

This discussion has been closed.