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MMORPG's "Most Innovative" Award?

VhalnVhaln Member Posts: 3,159

I'd post this in reply to the main news thread, but it'd just get buried in the TOR vs GW2 bickering.  Anyhow, from the news story about MMORPG.com's Pax 2011 awards..

 

"Explorers will climb the highest peaks, soldiers will fight the good fight, scientists will delve into the lore and mystery of the world, and settlers will build on and farm the land."

 

And just got me wondering, is it me, or does that sound awfully sandbox-like?  When I saw the look of the game, I just assumed 100% themepark, but is there a chance that's not the case at all?

When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.

Comments

  • PaithanPaithan Member Posts: 377

    I can completely understand why people wonder what made this game get the reward.

    But then again so little is known about this game on the otherhand most of the people Ive heard thinking game X should have won it based that on being a fan of that game. Not really because that game really is more innovated.. or not.

    But I do admit, and this is based on the little we know about this.. it is refreshing to see a game using Dreamworks movie like graphics. And at the very least the game DOES look like fun.

    So in  the mean time Im dieing to find more information even if it was to find out what is so innovative about it.

  • VhalnVhaln Member Posts: 3,159

    The part I quoted does sound new to me, and maybe even deserving of the reward, but I'll be pretty disappointed if it turns out to mean that explorers will kill mobs with telescopes and sextants, while farmers kill mobs with pitchforks and fertilizer spray.

    When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.

  • waynejr2waynejr2 Member EpicPosts: 7,768

    Originally posted by Vhaln

    I'd post this in reply to the main news thread, but it'd just get buried in the TOR vs GW2 bickering.  Anyhow, from the news story about MMORPG.com's Pax 2011 awards..

     

    "Explorers will climb the highest peaks, soldiers will fight the good fight, scientists will delve into the lore and mystery of the world, and settlers will build on and farm the land."

     

    And just got me wondering, is it me, or does that sound awfully sandbox-like?  When I saw the look of the game, I just assumed 100% themepark, but is there a chance that's not the case at all?

     It sounds to me like a person who likes sandbox and is very desperate for a new sandbox game, sees a feature, latches onto it in a very desperate way and rushes to declare it a sandbox feature.  That's what it sounds like.

     

    You should think of it like this:  In a character builder, you get to pick your hair color and style.  This is a game play setting.

    It's not a new idea.  It was talked about for years on bioware forums as something they might have for one of their games but never was fully developed.  One problem is the playerbase bitching about respecs.

    http://www.youhaventlived.com/qblog/2010/QBlog190810A.html  

    Epic Music:   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1

    https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1

    Kyleran:  "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."

    John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."

    FreddyNoNose:  "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."

    LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"




  • just1opinionjust1opinion Member UncommonPosts: 4,641

    Is there any in game footage from PAX on this?  I mean....all I have seen is some CGI footage from a trailer.  Hard to judge ANYthing from just THAT.  I totally would like to know why it got this award, so....if anyone finds any in game footage they want to post....I'd sure be interested.  I haven't Googled for it or YouTubed for it, so I guess I haven't tried very hard to find any, but....if anyone knows of some off the top of their head or whatever....please post it.

     

    Found one:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwcKx6k_5FQ

     

    It's kind of a space western, more or less.  I do see some innovative ideas in the video.  Should prove interesting.

    President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club

  • CeridithCeridith Member UncommonPosts: 2,980

    Originally posted by waynejr2

    Originally posted by Vhaln

    I'd post this in reply to the main news thread, but it'd just get buried in the TOR vs GW2 bickering.  Anyhow, from the news story about MMORPG.com's Pax 2011 awards..

     

    "Explorers will climb the highest peaks, soldiers will fight the good fight, scientists will delve into the lore and mystery of the world, and settlers will build on and farm the land."

     

    And just got me wondering, is it me, or does that sound awfully sandbox-like?  When I saw the look of the game, I just assumed 100% themepark, but is there a chance that's not the case at all?

     It sounds to me like a person who likes sandbox and is very desperate for a new sandbox game, sees a feature, latches onto it in a very desperate way and rushes to declare it a sandbox feature.  That's what it sounds like.

     

    You should think of it like this:  In a character builder, you get to pick your hair color and style.  This is a game play setting.

    It's not a new idea.  It was talked about for years on bioware forums as something they might have for one of their games but never was fully developed.  One problem is the playerbase bitching about respecs.

    If they follow through on what they're discussing, it will make the game more sandboxy, but not necessarily a sandbox.

    Offering fully fleshed out gameplay options that are as in-depth and equally developed and content filled as combat, is somethign rarely offered in modern MMOs. The last big name MMOs that did this were SWG, and before that Ultima Online. There are a lot of people who have been aching for a game that offers more than just fighting as something to spend time in the game doing.

    Of course as I said, it all depends on how well the developers follow through on what they're talking about.

    As for respecs... most games don't let you respec your class.

  • VhalnVhaln Member Posts: 3,159

    Originally posted by waynejr2

     It sounds to me like a person who likes sandbox and is very desperate for a new sandbox game, sees a feature, latches onto it in a very desperate way and rushes to declare it a sandbox feature.  That's what it sounds like.

     

    You should think of it like this:  In a character builder, you get to pick your hair color and style.  This is a game play setting.

    It's not a new idea.  It was talked about for years on bioware forums as something they might have for one of their games but never was fully developed.  One problem is the playerbase bitching about respecs.

     

    You sound like one of these people who are hostile to the very idea of sandbox related discussion.  Are you saying that the farmer, explorer, scientist thing is just a difference in appearance, like a hairstyle?  Or roughly that insignificant to the rest of the gameplay?  And that one would be wrong to be disappointed by that?

    When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.

  • JimmacJimmac Member UncommonPosts: 1,667

    Originally posted by Vhaln

    I'd post this in reply to the main news thread, but it'd just get buried in the TOR vs GW2 bickering.  Anyhow, from the news story about MMORPG.com's Pax 2011 awards. 

    "Explorers will climb the highest peaks, soldiers will fight the good fight, scientists will delve into the lore and mystery of the world, and settlers will build on and farm the land."

    And just got me wondering, is it me, or does that sound awfully sandbox-like?  When I saw the look of the game, I just assumed 100% themepark, but is there a chance that's not the case at all?

    Every single gaming company says this sort of stuff about their game. How many times have you heard, "You can do anything" in reference to a mmorpg? It's never even remotely true, yet they keep saying it.

  • waynejr2waynejr2 Member EpicPosts: 7,768

    Originally posted by Ceridith

    Originally posted by waynejr2

    Originally posted by Vhaln

    I'd post this in reply to the main news thread, but it'd just get buried in the TOR vs GW2 bickering.  Anyhow, from the news story about MMORPG.com's Pax 2011 awards..

     

    "Explorers will climb the highest peaks, soldiers will fight the good fight, scientists will delve into the lore and mystery of the world, and settlers will build on and farm the land."

     

    And just got me wondering, is it me, or does that sound awfully sandbox-like?  When I saw the look of the game, I just assumed 100% themepark, but is there a chance that's not the case at all?

     It sounds to me like a person who likes sandbox and is very desperate for a new sandbox game, sees a feature, latches onto it in a very desperate way and rushes to declare it a sandbox feature.  That's what it sounds like.

     

    You should think of it like this:  In a character builder, you get to pick your hair color and style.  This is a game play setting.

    It's not a new idea.  It was talked about for years on bioware forums as something they might have for one of their games but never was fully developed.  One problem is the playerbase bitching about respecs.

    If they follow through on what they're discussing, it will make the game more sandboxy, but not necessarily a sandbox.

    Offering fully fleshed out gameplay options that are as in-depth and equally developed and content filled as combat, is somethign rarely offered in modern MMOs. The last big name MMOs that did this were SWG, and before that Ultima Online. There are a lot of people who have been aching for a game that offers more than just fighting as something to spend time in the game doing.

    Of course as I said, it all depends on how well the developers follow through on what they're talking about.

    As for respecs... most games don't let you respec your class.

     People project things onto it.  Stop being so desperate to find a sandbox game.  In worst case, it could be a complex way to choose your class.

    It could be a way to pick your class through a design approach which tells what the future of your character will hold.  You start as a mage apprentice and make choices like:  Primary: Fire based Magic, Secondary: Summoning Magic, teritiary: Ice Based Magic.  Afterwards you go through a series of advetures which gets to pickup skills in those three.  This is where the respec complaining can come in.

    It can be more creative than that.  Add life quests and options for political scenarios and stories and horrible deaths/injuries and now you have an RPG. 

    http://www.youhaventlived.com/qblog/2010/QBlog190810A.html  

    Epic Music:   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1

    https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1

    Kyleran:  "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."

    John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."

    FreddyNoNose:  "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."

    LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"




  • CeridithCeridith Member UncommonPosts: 2,980

    Originally posted by waynejr2

    Originally posted by Ceridith


    Originally posted by waynejr2


    Originally posted by Vhaln

    I'd post this in reply to the main news thread, but it'd just get buried in the TOR vs GW2 bickering.  Anyhow, from the news story about MMORPG.com's Pax 2011 awards..

     

    "Explorers will climb the highest peaks, soldiers will fight the good fight, scientists will delve into the lore and mystery of the world, and settlers will build on and farm the land."

     

    And just got me wondering, is it me, or does that sound awfully sandbox-like?  When I saw the look of the game, I just assumed 100% themepark, but is there a chance that's not the case at all?

     It sounds to me like a person who likes sandbox and is very desperate for a new sandbox game, sees a feature, latches onto it in a very desperate way and rushes to declare it a sandbox feature.  That's what it sounds like.

     

    You should think of it like this:  In a character builder, you get to pick your hair color and style.  This is a game play setting.

    It's not a new idea.  It was talked about for years on bioware forums as something they might have for one of their games but never was fully developed.  One problem is the playerbase bitching about respecs.

    If they follow through on what they're discussing, it will make the game more sandboxy, but not necessarily a sandbox.

    Offering fully fleshed out gameplay options that are as in-depth and equally developed and content filled as combat, is somethign rarely offered in modern MMOs. The last big name MMOs that did this were SWG, and before that Ultima Online. There are a lot of people who have been aching for a game that offers more than just fighting as something to spend time in the game doing.

    Of course as I said, it all depends on how well the developers follow through on what they're talking about.

    As for respecs... most games don't let you respec your class.

     People project things onto it.  Stop being so desperate to find a sandbox game.  In worst case, it could be a complex way to choose your class.

    It could be a way to pick your class through a design approach which tells what the future of your character will hold.  You start as a mage apprentice and make choices like:  Primary: Fire based Magic, Secondary: Summoning Magic, teritiary: Ice Based Magic.  Afterwards you go through a series of advetures which gets to pickup skills in those three.  This is where the respec complaining can come in.

    It can be more creative than that.  Add life quests and options for political scenarios and stories and horrible deaths/injuries and now you have an RPG. 

    Why do you constantly repeat for others to stop being desperate to find a sandbox game? I don't see what's wrong with people who express interest in game features that make a game more sandboxy.

    I've not seen anyone here say that the game will be one way or another, simply giving their perception of what they think the devs are aiming for based on what the devs have said they're gonig for. Specifically, in that the devs they want to provide players with fully developed gameplay avenues that aren't just combat centric.

    How that exactly ends up we don't know, and no one is claiming to know, so please lay off the negativity a bit.

  • Loke666Loke666 Member EpicPosts: 21,441

    Originally posted by Ceridith

    Why do you constantly repeat for others to stop being desperate to find a sandbox game? I don't see what's wrong with people who express interest in game features that make a game more sandboxy.

    I've not seen anyone here say that the game will be one way or another, simply giving their perception of what they think the devs are aiming for based on what the devs have said they're gonig for. Specifically, in that the devs they want to provide players with fully developed gameplay avenues that aren't just combat centric.

    How that exactly ends up we don't know, and no one is claiming to know, so please lay off the negativity a bit.

    While my experince tells me: "Sandbox MMO games are like communism, sounds great in theory but never really works out practically" I still agree with you (yeah, I am cynical).

    Eve is still the closest thing to a working sandbox I seen and it is 8 years old now. That doesn't mean that you can't make a great sandbox game and far from all people agree with me anyways.

    The more varied MMOs we get the better, more to select our personal favorites from. I have to admit that I hope CCPs "World of darkness online" finally will brake the mold and prove the sandbox concept actually can get many players.

    I really know little about this game and are looking forward to learn more about while MMORPG.com considered it so innovative.

    Sandbox games work great in single player games and they should work great as MMOs as well, but UO, Eve and pre-CU SWG are so far the only examples that passed the "100K players for more than a few months line".

  • mesmerisemesmerise Member UncommonPosts: 200

    Originally posted by just1opinion

    Is there any in game footage from PAX on this?  I mean....all I have seen is some CGI footage from a trailer.  Hard to judge ANYthing from just THAT.  I totally would like to know why it got this award, so....if anyone finds any in game footage they want to post....I'd sure be interested.  I haven't Googled for it or YouTubed for it, so I guess I haven't tried very hard to find any, but....if anyone knows of some off the top of their head or whatever....please post it.

     

    Found one:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwcKx6k_5FQ

     

    It's kind of a space western, more or less.  I do see some innovative ideas in the video.  Should prove interesting.

    I agree I thought that the very beginning of the trailer reminded me of like a western (like an animated-fantasy Firefly, maybe not), particularly the cinematic of the guy with two guns and the duster.  Here is another video that was posted in another thread: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uiOseZt_dDo&feature=feedlik .  It shows the first 37 minutes of the ESPer class with the Path of the Explorer.

    image
  • Zap-RoboZap-Robo Member UncommonPosts: 233

    Originally posted by mesmerise

    Originally posted by just1opinion

    Is there any in game footage from PAX on this?  I mean....all I have seen is some CGI footage from a trailer.  Hard to judge ANYthing from just THAT.  I totally would like to know why it got this award, so....if anyone finds any in game footage they want to post....I'd sure be interested.  I haven't Googled for it or YouTubed for it, so I guess I haven't tried very hard to find any, but....if anyone knows of some off the top of their head or whatever....please post it.

     

    Found one:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwcKx6k_5FQ

     

    It's kind of a space western, more or less.  I do see some innovative ideas in the video.  Should prove interesting.

    I agree I thought that the very beginning of the trailer reminded me of like a western (like an animated-fantasy Firefly, maybe not), particularly the cinematic of the guy with two guns and the duster.  Here is another video that was posted in another thread: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uiOseZt_dDo&feature=feedlik .  It shows the first 37 minutes of the ESPer class with the Path of the Explorer.

    The best footage/presentation I've found so far (and believe me, as staff at Wildstar Central I've seen a lot!) is here....

    http://wildstar-central.com/index.php?media/carbine-studios-presentation-part-1.49/

    http://wildstar-central.com/index.php?media/carbine-studios-presentation-part-2.50/

    http://wildstar-central.com/index.php?media/carbine-studios-presentation-part-3.51/

    http://wildstar-central.com/index.php?media/carbine-studios-presentation-part-4.52/

    http://wildstar-central.com/index.php?media/carbine-studios-presentation-part-5.53/

    ... it shows how Carbine are structuring quest areas, how the four Paths work and then some gameplay footage showing the Esper and Gunslinger Classes as well as examples of the Explorer and Soldier Paths.

    It's a must-watch set of videos!

    --
    Admin @ http://wildstar-central.com/
    ZapRobo (PlanetSide 2) | Zap-Robo (The Secret World)
    @Master Zaprobo (City of Heroes) | Zaphod@Zap-Robo (Star Trek Online)

  • GameDevJakeGameDevJake Member Posts: 27

    From how i understand it all, there are two different systems: Classes and Paths

    Classes are: Warrior, Esper, Spellslinger, [Forgot]

    Paths are: Explorer, Soldier, Scientist, and Settler

    Classes function the same way classes always have, but the Paths system is sort of a profession/class hybrid that then tailors youre gaming experience to whatever you chose.

       EX: You choose the Warrior class because you want good survivabilty and you like getting up close and personal. You have that, no matter your Path. You then choose Explorer because even though during combat you may be up close and taking damage, but most of the time you are off traversing the land, not necessarily grinding.

    Summary:

    Class is how you fight.

    Path is how you play.

    image

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