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Elin race censored/westernized.

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  • itchmonitchmon Member RarePosts: 1,994

    i'm not one to come out in favour of censorship very often but the original elin models do, to my western eye, look like sexualized kids and i'm glad they're made a lil less perv-ish.

    RIP Ribbitribbitt you are missed, kid.

    Currently Playing EVE, ESO

    Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed.

    Dwight D Eisenhower

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    Henry Rollins

  • YamotaYamota Member UncommonPosts: 6,593

    Originally posted by Rabenwolf

    They should get rid of the race entirely. Genericly over anime styled characters are utterly nausiating. Thats just my opinion though and one of the reseasons I find little enjoyment in many of the Korean designed mmorpgs.

    image

  • MajinashMajinash Member Posts: 1,320

    Originally posted by Sovrath

    Originally posted by Wolfenpride

    http://www.tera-online.com/forums/showthread.php?s=7ab4862bcce10a9afb0cbaada4fe4285&t=15162

     

    No bare legs, no purchase.

    Yeah, I have to agree with the others, That first picture that was posted above looks like a sexualized child.

     

    This is only a good thing.

    Doesn't seem any different than the female dwarf model from Lineage2.  And while honestly I don't see this as a bad thing, I'm always worried by censorship.

    Everything creates huge amounts of negativity on the internet, that's what the internet is for: Negativity, porn and lolcats.

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 29,935

    Originally posted by nblitz

    Originally posted by Sovrath


    Originally posted by Alders

    Shit like this freaks me out more than some pants on a virtual character:

     

    I think the West has bigger issues than some cartoons from the east.

    ew that's horrible!

    It's a screen capture from Little Miss Sunshine :) Solid movie, imo.

    lol, I own that movie! I didn't recognize the girl in the center as being Abigail Breslin.

  • GrayGhost79GrayGhost79 Member UncommonPosts: 4,775

    Originally posted by Robsolf

    Originally posted by jadedlevir


    Originally posted by Robsolf


    Originally posted by Robokapp

    so killing a little girl is ok, seeing her knees isn't. It all makes sense now...

    Bingo.  PotD.  Our western culture just flat out amazes me, sometimes.

    You can let your 10 year old kid watch violent stuff on TV all day and he'll be just fine.  But one of JJ's boobies pops out during the Superbowl?  "OH THE HORROR!!!  MY CHILD WILL BE SCARRED FOR LIFE!!!"

    Ya, but what can the tera producers do about that? Thats why it doesn't make any sense for people to be upset at the game and the company, whether it makes sense or not, killing a ten year old girl is not taboo( actually it might be lol... idk), but  her wearing a thong is.

    But then again, their was probably more complaints about the slutty adult females in the game then about the slutty ten year females....which is odd in itself.

    At the end of the day, I don't care. It will be a great game, and can't wait for the release. If them adding tights to the girls running around in underwear makes you not try the game...well thats just stupid. They can cover up the high elves huge breast that move on their own for whatever reason, or change he castanics ramdom spell casting animation, and would it really add or substract anything from the game?

    But like i said before, I think it's a great change. It looked stupid as hell before. Just wearing a plate chest piece and underwear bottoms... what kind of magical panties are those?

    Oddly though... someone above made the logical argument that Elin shouldn't have bare legs, as that's impractical for their profession; being in combat all the time.  Yet, until now, I've never seen anyone seriously make that point regarding your typical full grown woman looking race with massive cans strapped up in a tiny chainmail bikini...

    A person dislikes the bare legs on an Elin because they seem them as children, and so therefore I think that person shouldn't want them in the game in the first place.  OR a person sees them as another race of beings, and doesn't see a problem with either.

    But that they accept one but not the other, I think is very, very... off... 

    I'd have to say you haven't read many threads then lol. This disucssion comes up just about every time a new game launches lol. Bood sizes are critiqued as well the armor adorning female players constantly. 

     

    As far as the acceptance thing, some middle ground has to be struck or otherwise you end up with the imovable object meets the unstoppable force type scenario. A stalemate usually means no game at all, comming to some middle ground on the matter is the best that anyone can hope for really. 

     

    I personally do not like seeing children as a playable thing in a game nor do I like them being something I must kill in a game. Fortunately the games that tend to depict them make death comical as well as the violence. When death and violence lead only to a temporary effect that has no real impact on the character violence and death itself are seen as insignifficant things. 

     

    It's easy to downplay violence and death in video games and most developers do when they target a younger audience or anticipate a majority being young which is why we end up with games that either depict no gore or over the top unrealistic gore. Death is always a meaningless thing as you simply get back up or respawn negating that it is indeed death. 

     

    Realistic gore and violence as well as perma death goes a long way towards making a game with kids in it not cool. 

    Whats done to violence in video games is the same thing that was done to the Elin when they clothed them. 

     

    It's toned down to prevent such emotions or feelings which may be deemed inappropriate. Doing so actually increases the number of players willing to play the game giving you a larger community as well as generating additional revenue for the parent company. 

    Making people uncomfortable has the opposite effect. 

     

    In any case the bottom line is this, they weren't forced to change the look of the Elin. They chose to for w/e reason. If it were for the rating, then thats on them it was their choice. 

    If it was done to avoid controversy, again it was their choice. 

    If it was done because they felt it would be better received in the west, well again it was their choice. 

     

    No one forced them to change it, it's actually not that big of an issue for most I don't think. So may frown upon the way the Elin looked, but no one actually put a gun to anyones head and made them change it. The publisher or developer decided to increase the size of it's potential player base and it's revenue, thats what it boils down to. They could go with the higher rating, deal with the controversy like AoC (Take the lumps and move on), or care a little less about how the game is received in the West. They chose not to. 

  • TreekodarTreekodar Member Posts: 524

    It doesn't look like a sexualized child, hell it doesn't even look like a child. It looks like a mannequin. If they were going to create a loli-race they could at least have done it right..

    They shouldn't have censored the race because a race like that should never have been in the game at all. Yeah, I dislike Ecchi, sue me.

    Eleanor Rigby.

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 29,935

    Originally posted by GrayGhost79

     

    As far as the acceptance thing, some middle ground has to be struck or otherwise you end up with the imovable object meets the unstoppable force type scenario. A stalemate usually means no game at all, comming to some middle ground on the matter is the best that anyone can hope for really. 

    etc

    Excellent post!

  • AldersAlders Member RarePosts: 2,197

    Originally posted by nblitz

    Originally posted by Sovrath


    Originally posted by Alders

    Shit like this freaks me out more than some pants on a virtual character:

     

    I think the West has bigger issues than some cartoons from the east.

    ew that's horrible!

    It's a screen capture from Little Miss Sunshine :) Solid movie, imo.

     

    Oh it's a fantastic movie, but the entire concept of little girl pageants really disturbs me.

  • LadyAlibiLadyAlibi Member UncommonPosts: 297

    It doesn't look sexualized at all to me in the first picture, but  if they have concerns about how the Western market will receive it (and a lot of the responses here seem to suggest they are right), then they are doing the right thing. I guess we live in an age where everyone thinks there's a crazed pedophile under every rock, and better safe than sorry. 

     

    It seems a little detached from reality to me to worry about this in a video game when Mother Nature stuck me with a C-cup... character model... when I was 12 years old. I was a little self-conscious about it, but it certainly didn't keep me out of a bathing suit or keep me from going to the community pool. It's just a shame I didn't have someone there to put more clothes on me to make me more decent for public viewing. I never did have a single perv hit on me though. (... Not until I was about 17. LOL)

     

    Are the ears coming back? I like ears.

  • PreponerancePreponerance Member Posts: 295

    However I don't agree with it on the internet since everyone is anonymous and people do cruel crap just for the shock value.

  • NelothNeloth Member Posts: 249

    Originally posted by Sovrath

    Originally posted by nblitz


    Originally posted by Sovrath


    Originally posted by Alders

    Shit like this freaks me out more than some pants on a virtual character:

     

    I think the West has bigger issues than some cartoons from the east.

    ew that's horrible!

    It's a screen capture from Little Miss Sunshine :) Solid movie, imo.

    lol, I own that movie! I didn't recognize the girl in the center as being Abigail Breslin.

    Jisus man, the animated girls something with cat ears is too bad so they have to censor it but this shit is ok? Hypocrisy at it's best.

  • LoktofeitLoktofeit Member RarePosts: 14,247

    Originally posted by Wolfenpride

    Originally posted by Erstok

    Know what that's called in America when you act on an impulse to touch little kids from watching and playing this degenerative crap like this? Called 15 years in a prison cell with your new boyfriend Bubba.

    Save you money and time just get off the internet and go outside. Fresh air might do you some good.

     Kind of like how I impusively run over hookers on my way downtown and beat homeless people because of degenerative american games?

    That would explain a lot I suppose. I also start fist fights with cops.

    You know, I wondered why lately when I go to the boardwalk I feel compelled to beat up a cop, take his tonfa and then just start running up and down the beach beating old men and fat ladies until cash popped out of them. The cash never seems to pop out so I know that it wasn't a rewards motivator thing, but now I realize that it's just learned behaviour from too many hours playing Vice City with my brother.

    But, all that is rather moot right now as, thanks to Meowhead, just minutes ago I had this fleeting, disturbing and extremely hilarious mental image of cartoon train sex run through my mind... and I know it will be there to haunt me all weekend. I will never be able to look at the E or the F the same way ever again.

    There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
    "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre

  • stayontargetstayontarget Member RarePosts: 6,517

    You know if you really don't like it you could always CENSOR yourself and not play the game.   Way too many double standards in the west when it comes to things like this.

    Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...

  • Loke666Loke666 Member EpicPosts: 21,441

    Originally posted by stayontarget

    You know if you really don't like it you could always CENSOR yourself and not play the game.   Way too many double standards in the west when it comes to things like this.

    That is not censorship at all. It is still a sound advice, vote with your wallet, but censorship is when the goverment decides what you should see and not see.

    That you decides it is wonderful news and a good idea.

  • mmogawdmmogawd Member Posts: 732

    Originally posted by Sovrath

    Originally posted by Robokapp

    the number of molested virtual girls is indeed alarming and the virtual rights community should never stand for this.

     

    /facepalm

    Duly noted, you have no problem seeing sexualized little girls. Not everyone in every place shares your open mindedness on this topic and for the most part feel that children (or anything representing a child) never be sexualized.

    I'm more concerned about those who look at those images and automatically equate them to little children...  kind of disturbing, actually.

  • jadedlevirjadedlevir Member Posts: 628

    Originally posted by mmogawd

    Originally posted by Sovrath


    Originally posted by Robokapp

    the number of molested virtual girls is indeed alarming and the virtual rights community should never stand for this.

     

    /facepalm

    Duly noted, you have no problem seeing sexualized little girls. Not everyone in every place shares your open mindedness on this topic and for the most part feel that children (or anything representing a child) never be sexualized.

    I'm more concerned about those who look at those images and automatically equate them to little children...  kind of disturbing, actually.

    Oh come on, how do those not look like little children... Everyone trying to justify the concept says that they aren't children, and stuff like this, but come on. Thats like saying that high elves don't look like big breast blonde adults, it is what it is.

    I don't really see whats the big deal is either way, and having armour that actually makes sense seems better to me, instead of just running around without pants on.

  • stayontargetstayontarget Member RarePosts: 6,517

    Originally posted by jadedlevir

    Originally posted by mmogawd

    Originally posted by Sovrath

    Originally posted by Robokapp

    the number of molested virtual girls is indeed alarming and the virtual rights community should never stand for this.

     

    /facepalm

    Duly noted, you have no problem seeing sexualized little girls. Not everyone in every place shares your open mindedness on this topic and for the most part feel that children (or anything representing a child) never be sexualized.

    I'm more concerned about those who look at those images and automatically equate them to little children...  kind of disturbing, actually.

    Oh come on, how do those not look like little children... Everyone trying to justify the concept says that they aren't children, and stuff like this, but come on. Thats like saying that high elves don't look like big breast blonde adults, it is what it is.

    I don't really see whats the big deal is either way, and having armour that actually makes sense seems better to me, instead of just running around without pants on.

     You know I was with you all the way on this until the end....nothing in games makes sense.

    Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...

  • jadedlevirjadedlevir Member Posts: 628

    Originally posted by stayontarget

    Originally posted by jadedlevir


    Originally posted by mmogawd


    Originally posted by Sovrath


    Originally posted by Robokapp

    the number of molested virtual girls is indeed alarming and the virtual rights community should never stand for this.

     

    /facepalm

    Duly noted, you have no problem seeing sexualized little girls. Not everyone in every place shares your open mindedness on this topic and for the most part feel that children (or anything representing a child) never be sexualized.

    I'm more concerned about those who look at those images and automatically equate them to little children...  kind of disturbing, actually.

    Oh come on, how do those not look like little children... Everyone trying to justify the concept says that they aren't children, and stuff like this, but come on. Thats like saying that high elves don't look like big breast blonde adults, it is what it is.

    I don't really see whats the big deal is either way, and having armour that actually makes sense seems better to me, instead of just running around without pants on.

     You know I was with you all the way on this until the end....nothing in games makes sense.

    Lol i know this, but i mean how are those even armour sets if they just didn't even have pants at all. At least put some knee pads or something. I just thought a lot of those pantsless armour sets were stupid in the first place.

  • stayontargetstayontarget Member RarePosts: 6,517

    Originally posted by jadedlevir

    Originally posted by stayontarget

    Originally posted by jadedlevir

    Originally posted by mmogawd

    Originally posted by Sovrath

    Originally posted by Robokapp

    the number of molested virtual girls is indeed alarming and the virtual rights community should never stand for this.

     

    /facepalm

    Duly noted, you have no problem seeing sexualized little girls. Not everyone in every place shares your open mindedness on this topic and for the most part feel that children (or anything representing a child) never be sexualized.

    I'm more concerned about those who look at those images and automatically equate them to little children...  kind of disturbing, actually.

    Oh come on, how do those not look like little children... Everyone trying to justify the concept says that they aren't children, and stuff like this, but come on. Thats like saying that high elves don't look like big breast blonde adults, it is what it is.

    I don't really see whats the big deal is either way, and having armour that actually makes sense seems better to me, instead of just running around without pants on.

     You know I was with you all the way on this until the end....nothing in games makes sense.

    Lol i know this, but i mean how are those even armour sets if they just didn't even have pants at all. At least put some knee pads or something. I just thought a lot of those pantsless armour sets were stupid in the first place.

     so is shooting fireballs from your fingers.  Being a Dev and creating a world with its own set of rules is "god like".

    Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...

  • gaeanprayergaeanprayer Member UncommonPosts: 2,341

    Mmmkay so...I'm not 100% sure where I stand on this subject, honestly. On one hand, you guys are arguing over pixels. I don't really give care what pixels look like, they're not real, and plenty of scientific study has already proven that something like this doesn't increase the urge, or likelihood, that someone's going to go out and do pedo things with a child. I can also understand people's fears over censorship, not just because of this, but because scenarios like this come on the heels of the government being overly sensitive to stuff like this lately (like the guy that got in legal trouble for owning Yami No Matsuei manga)

    On the other hand, yes, that looks like a little girl. And it's a tad much. Or well, technically, it's not enough. She should be wearing more. So, I don't mind the change in armor, but as a mere digital image of someone that does not, never has and never will exist, I wouldn't have really cared if she kept the prior outfit either.

    I guess in the end I have to wonder if it's really such a big deal? Was it a big deal that, what equates to moving drawing, was underclothed? No. Was it a big deal that they decided to give her what amounts to armored stockings? Also no.

    Moving on.

    "Forums aren't for intelligent discussion; they're for blow-hards with unwavering opinions."

  • WSIMikeWSIMike Member Posts: 5,564

    Personally, I think the change is for the better, and not only because of the "sexualization" issue.

    Though, looking at the pictures earlier in this thread... yeah... kinda creepy.

    At the end of the day, I think it just *looks* better to see a character that looks at least somewhat adequately armored, than to see them running around barely covered.

    Even in Lineage 2, with Dark Elf females (who are almost universally half-naked in even the heaviest armor), I think they look far better with fully covered legs, than when wearing metal panties that barely cover anything.

    For example... here's the armor set my DE wore in L2.

    Basically metal panties. I wore that set because it gave the most useful bonuses to my class (Bladedancer) and playstyle.

    I would have *preferred* to wear something like this at the same armor grade:

    It just looks much more "robust" and, even though there's still skin showing, I'm at least more *covered* and better protected. I also like the look of the armor better :-p.

    So yeah... I dunno. I prefer the new look just because it actually looks more like something I could imagine a character going out and fighting in.

     

     

    "If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road,
    and the cash shop selling asphalt..."
    - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops

    image

  • OtakunOtakun Member UncommonPosts: 867

    One of the main points that people are mad about the censorship issue is cause EME lied but no point in going into it cause most of you wont care but it's one of the adding cases of EME lying to the public which is bad signs for any comapny. Also, I don't know if this was brought up in this thread but the censorship frogster pic from earlier is a fake from a guy on tera-online. There are no officially edited pics out yet.

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 29,935

    Originally posted by Neloth

    Originally posted by Sovrath


     

    lol, I own that movie! I didn't recognize the girl in the center as being Abigail Breslin.

    Jisus man, the animated girls something with cat ears is too bad so they have to censor it but this shit is ok? Hypocrisy at it's best.

    I don't think you understand.

    The movie is not about how awesome it is to watch little girls paraded about being adults.

    If you look at the girl in the center, she is pretty average for a little girl and NOT made up like some adult where all the others are clearly posing and looking far older than their ages. That will give you a clue right there.

    As I said earlier it's context and how the images are used. Quite frankly I suggest you go rent the movie, it's actually very good.

    As far as this thread goes, it's about context. In my previous post I mentioned seeing some paintings at MOMA that were essentially young early teen girls posed and presented as adult women. They were amazing paintings and as I said they stirred emotions on one side of the fence or the other. Very controversial.

    I would say that the screen shot included in this thread was far more tame than those paintings.

    so what's the issue?

    Well, I'm not sure. As I indicated maybe I have a double standard when something is presented as Art and as a means to stir thought/create conversation compared to  just having what appears to be a young girl(ish) being who is blurring the lines between child and sexulized adult "just because".

    I'm never against controversial images or subjects if they create conversation and knock us a bit out of our comfort zone.

    I AM against creating images that explore children as sex objects "just because". There is a fine line between Art and Kiddie Porn (not saying this game is presenting Kiddie Porn) or Art and any subject that is ripe for exploitation and I think it's up to us to find that line in ourselves.

  • bygeorgebygeorge Member UncommonPosts: 104

    Originally posted by Otakun

    One of the main points that people are mad about the censorship issue is cause EME lied but no point in going into it cause most of you wont care but it's one of the adding cases of EME lying to the public which is bad signs for any comapny. Also, I don't know if this was brought up in this thread but the censorship frogster pic from earlier is a fake from a guy on tera-online. There are no officially edited pics out yet.

    I am not sure where you saw someone from EnMasse lying about the Elin changes, I have found them to be pretty straightforward about the changes. Earlier they did say that they did not plan on changing the Elin, but that has since changed.

  • RemyVorenderRemyVorender Member RarePosts: 3,920

    Much better. That girl is like 7 years old. I may actually look into this game again. If I want to look at whores, I'll use other venues. I don't need that in my MMOs.

    Joined - July 2004

This discussion has been closed.