Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

POLL: Political system run by players: potential problems ahead?

vega151vega151 Member Posts: 57

TERA has been on top of my list for almost a year now and I recently caught up on the informations available on it (didn’t visit forums for a couple of weeks).


 


What I recently learned shocked me: the game will have a politic system run by… PLAYERS???


 


From what I understood each region will be able to elect a Vanarch (mayor) and both continent will elect an Exarch (King). Those people will be able to change the tax rates and what they are used for (their guild hall, their own profit, whatever etc…), change the spawn rate of mobs per region, change NPCs location, etc etc etc…


 


That thing makes me VERY suspicious of the game now, and seems like some others too are in the same boat as me maybe?… My position regarding giving too much power to the players in a game is that usually it doesn’t turn out good… But this is going WAY overboard… Is it me or we have a lot of potential for troubles here?


 


Again from what I understood the Vanarchs / Exarchs are elected through a region wide / server wide vote, but is also determined by different factors, including PVP achievements (or something like that) and WEALTH. Yes wealth. As in how much cash you have or something like that? Errr excuse me but did someone actually thought about the scenario that gold farmers (and people buying gold) might end up getting the power if it’s related to the in-game cash? Especially if En Masse is ending up running the game like NCSoft did for Aion….


 


And even without the gold farmers: what about the potential problem of ‘’rigged’’ elections organized by allied guilds / group of people banding together that will put some elitist jerk on the throne and eventually end up controlling the whole game because they will outnumber the rest of the population? Might sound like I’m pushing it a bit here but that could still be a reality no?… They will raise taxes through the roof, place NPCs where they see fit and just plain turn the system to THEIR advantage without caring for anyone else…


 


Anyway so far I’m very suspicious of that system… What do you guys think?


 


I always said it, I will always say it and it’s been proven many, MANY time: give too much power to the players and you will end up with troubles…

«1

Comments

  • deniterdeniter Member RarePosts: 1,392

    I voted 'probably won't be a problem', but I can't see why this would become a problem; this is how it works in real life as well. Why worry about it if this happens in a game?

  • pixeldogmeatpixeldogmeat Member Posts: 441

    you want to know how bad a system like that works? Go try face of mankind.

    You get a group of assholes that kill newbies for no reason, who are trying to figure out what the fck they're supposed to be doing.

    PLAY WURM ONLINE!! www.wurmonline.com

  • Butch808Butch808 Member UncommonPosts: 360

    Originally posted by pixeldogmeat

    you want to know how bad a system like that works? Go try face of mankind.

    You get a group of assholes that kill newbies for no reason, who are trying to figure out what the fck they're supposed to be doing.

    err no, people kill newb players in face of mankind because it's an open pvp game and has nothing to do with this thread, back ontopic: i don't think it's a problem maybe this game isn't for you.

  • nerovipus32nerovipus32 Member Posts: 2,735

    because of that you get a group of people who kill the people killing newbs which builds a player run community where players make the rules.

  • pixeldogmeatpixeldogmeat Member Posts: 441

    honestly, I read up on FOM, and they made it seem like as long as you kept your nose clean there was no reason for the police dudes to come after you. Who was I being stabbed in the back by? Police dudes! I hadn't even chatted with anyone yet, they literally patrol the hallways killing anyone that isn't a police dude.

    Absolutely no regulation whatsoever allows the l33t d3wds to do whatever they please.

    PLAY WURM ONLINE!! www.wurmonline.com

  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Member CommonPosts: 10,910


    Originally posted by nerovipus32
    because of that you get a group of people who kill the people killing newbs which builds a player run community where players make the rules.


    That's a FFA PvP thing, not a player run government thing. Nothing to do with taxes or npc locations, etc.

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • nerovipus32nerovipus32 Member Posts: 2,735

    Originally posted by pixeldogmeat

    honestly, I read up on FOM, and they made it seem like as long as you kept your nose clean there was no reason for the police dudes to come after you. Who was I being stabbed in the back by? Police dudes! I hadn't even chatted with anyone yet, they literally patrol the hallways killing anyone that isn't a police dude.

    Absolutely no regulation whatsoever allows the l33t d3wds to do whatever they please.

    did you maybe stop to think that the faction you picked was at war with another faction and thats why they were killing you?

  • nerovipus32nerovipus32 Member Posts: 2,735

    Originally posted by lizardbones

     




    Originally posted by nerovipus32

    because of that you get a group of people who kill the people killing newbs which builds a player run community where players make the rules.








    That's a FFA PvP thing, not a player run government thing. Nothing to do with taxes or npc locations, etc.

    Thats how it works in lineage 2 and tera will be the same.

  • salamander13salamander13 Member Posts: 100

    Originally posted by vega151 guilds / group of people banding together that will put some elitist jerk on the throne and eventually end up controlling the whole game because they will outnumber the rest of the population?

    So wait, let me get this straight, your afraid that a majority of people are going to get to gether and get some one that they want elected if this game has elections???

  • nerovipus32nerovipus32 Member Posts: 2,735

    Originally posted by salamander13

    Originally posted by vega151 guilds / group of people banding together that will put some elitist jerk on the throne and eventually end up controlling the whole game because they will outnumber the rest of the population?

    So wait, let me get this straight, your afraid that a majority of people are going to get to gether and get some one that they want elected if this game has elections???

    you can overthrow the king thats the beauty of it.

  • AristidesAristides Member Posts: 172

    I think the potential is exceptionally interesting.  The trick is to have something worthwhile in-game for those governing players to manage, without giving them the potential to damage the core infrastructure systems the game requires to operate.

    In the negative example being chewed over, I'd say that if the system in FoM permits a cadre of players dominating the server to actually damage the game's ability to welcome new players, their system is out of balance.  That example does not mean that the general case of player-governing games is bad, it means developers need to be careful what powers they grant, and community managers need to stay cognizant of what is going on in-game if they want their product to remain successful.

    And remember, the definition of success for a business is "profitable".  Just because you hate a product's gameplay or community does not mean its operators don't consider it a success despite whatever happened to you when you were playing it.  Majority rule can be a serious bummer for the minority.

     

    edit:typos

  • ClanRSClanRS Member UncommonPosts: 64

    Honestly the monarch and mayors will be more dependant of the players than vice versa. Since that is their role. They can make a great difference, but players will always have the option to revolt or revoke given that you find enough people who think alike.

    I don't see this happening or becoming a problem. If it does, their reign will be short-lived.

    What we will see is loads of propaganda being spread. So an option to unlist this chatbar or whatever it's going to be, would be mandatory! :D

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 30,103

    It's not a problem because if that's the game then "that's the game".

    I think many people are too used to games that try to make things equal.

    There are games that deem it "ok" to allow players to create whatever type of game world they want, for good or for bad.

    It's not for everyone but it does make things interesting for those who can buy into this type of game.

    In lineage 2 players who owned castles could set their tax rates high or low. If players didn't like it they could remove them from their castle if they had the strength to do it.

    I see nothign wrong with this.

  • ryuga81ryuga81 Member UncommonPosts: 351


    Originally posted by vega151

    I always said it, I will always say it and it’s been proven many, MANY time: give too much power to the players and you will end up with troubles…

    Any system in which the "power" over ingame things comes from some forced game mechanics is terribly bad. Unless there are viable means to change things when they go in the wrong direction, well, i can see a lot of flaws there.

    A "territory control system" works well enough as long as it gives everyone the same "tools". On Eve, whoever mantains the military control of certain installations in a system is the system's owner. Associations of players (corporations, alliances...) shape regions and empires based on their own military power and (mostly) alliances. And for the most part, it works decently.

    On the other hand, allowing anyone to take power in an arbitrary area by some obscure voting mechanism no one has any real control over and with absolutely no chance to contest or defy the outcome might be a very, very bad idea.

    Let's see what do they have in mind...

  • SomnicideSomnicide Member Posts: 67

    Originally posted by ryuga81

    Any system in which the "power" over ingame things comes from some forced game mechanics is terribly bad. Unless there are viable means to change things when they go in the wrong direction, well, i can see a lot of flaws there.

    A "territory control system" works well enough as long as it gives everyone the same "tools". On Eve, whoever mantains the military control of certain installations in a system is the system's owner. Associations of players (corporations, alliances...) shape regions and empires based on their own military power and (mostly) alliances. And for the most part, it works decently.

    On the other hand, allowing anyone to take power in an arbitrary area by some obscure voting mechanism no one has any real control over and with absolutely no chance to contest or defy the outcome might be a very, very bad idea.

    Its not an obscure voting mechanism that no one has control over that isnt contestable.

    There's a council of lords (Vanarchs) in each kingdom that are elected through either voting or pvp. To become a king (Exarch), you have to first be a Vanarch. All of the king's 'actions' that allow him to change game rules require a certain amount of medals. These medals can only be received by specific guild quests or by recommendation from a Vanarch. Effectively making it very hard to execute any actions without the backing of the council (which of course, require the backing of the community to stay in office). And if the entire kingdom is corrupt, well....you can overthrow them for a reason.

    There are checks and balances just like in a regular government system. There is also the possibility of corruption like in a regular system, but with that possibility comes the ability to remove said corruption. It's all about how the player community handles it.

    Sup.

  • sungodrasungodra Member Posts: 1,376

    This "political system" Is one of the few things that caught my attention about this game.. I played nexus kingdom of winds back in the late 90's and they too had a political system, and a very strong RP community. I liked the idea and I think it will probably work out well in TERA.

     

    Although for years there was this curropt judge in nexus, hopefully the political figures in TERA will not have the ability to put you in jail and make you stand a trial , like the curropt judges of nexus.

    image


    "When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"

  • sungodrasungodra Member Posts: 1,376

    Originally posted by salamander13

    Originally posted by vega151 guilds / group of people banding together that will put some elitist jerk on the throne and eventually end up controlling the whole game because they will outnumber the rest of the population?

    So wait, let me get this straight, your afraid that a majority of people are going to get to gether and get some one that they want elected if this game has elections???

     I hope you are joking, because that is what exactly is going to happen in this game with these elections. Although, I don't see a problem with it.   This is how all elections work , even in real life elections.

    image


    "When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"

  • MalevilMalevil Member Posts: 468

    Honestly this one of things that i dont like about this game. Politics sucks, no matter where and i can definitely live without them in game.

  • bansanbansan Member Posts: 367

    As others have alluded to, this is part of the human condition.  I think they expect these kinds of things to happen, or else why put it in the game.  Look at what is happening in Egypt right now.  I don't really want to experience what is happening there, but what if something like that happens "naturally" in TERA?  That would be a cool simulation.

    Of course, are they going to have mechanisms in the game where we can overthrow the gold farmer mucking things up?  Is there going to be a "god" on the payroll to monitor things like this?

    This can become a great social simulation, but it can go bad easily.

  • stayontargetstayontarget Member RarePosts: 6,519

    I love drama, and if they can pull the whole server into it somehow then it could be very interesting.

    Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...

  • LoktofeitLoktofeit Member RarePosts: 14,247

    Lineage 2, EVE Online, Puzzle Pirates and several other MMOs have features like this. Each MMO seems to take a unique approach to it, so I am looking forward to the direction TERA goes with it.

    There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
    "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre

  • VryheidVryheid Member Posts: 469

    Face of Mankind had a political system entirely run by players- including elected leaders- and it was absolutely pointless and added nothing to the game. Guilds are fine, faction officials are fine, but having a few players decide the fate of everyone else trying to play the game is just silly.

    That being said, if this is implemented I'm definitely running for King or whatnot. :-P

  • sungodrasungodra Member Posts: 1,376

    Originally posted by bansan

    As others have alluded to, this is part of the human condition.  I think they expect these kinds of things to happen, or else why put it in the game.  Look at what is happening in Egypt right now.  I don't really want to experience what is happening there, but what if something like that happens "naturally" in TERA?  That would be a cool simulation.

    Of course, are they going to have mechanisms in the game where we can overthrow the gold farmer mucking things up?  Is there going to be a "god" on the payroll to monitor things like this?

    This can become a great social simulation, but it can go bad easily.

     Actually it is just an online game, so the difference would, people would not be getting hurt or killed in real life, just their online pixels. Which makes this very fun, and tbh I wasn't sure if I was going to buy this game or not, but after reading what you just posted and enticing the idea of an in the streets Riot and over throw of the government this sounds like exactly the kind of game I would be interested in.

     

    So thumbs up to the guys working on TERA.

    image


    "When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"

  • TorgenTorgen Member UncommonPosts: 158

    My post is a bit offtopic and I don't know which poll option to chose, but I have never heared of this political system before. It just sounds really cool. I always wanted to play an mmorpg with political conflicts, dictators, humanists etc.. and did I get it right that you can also start a revolution and become king without being elected? Or is it just possible to vote someone out of his political function and start a new election? Would be really cool if you can give me a link to an article which describes the political system or tell me s.th. more about it (PMs are also welcome) :)

    If the political system works out I will definately buy this game although I always said that the artdesign is a no-go for me. I just hope that ingame ideologies (like conservatives vs. liberals in the real world) evolve and make the political live more authentic. It would be really uncool if people only fight for political power because their guild and allies get benefits from it. I want fanatics, philantropists and the likes ;)

     

    woahh... you guys really hyped me. Now I don't know whether to curse or fall on my knees and thank you ;)

  • salamander13salamander13 Member Posts: 100

    Originally posted by sungodra

    Originally posted by salamander13


    Originally posted by vega151 guilds / group of people banding together that will put some elitist jerk on the throne and eventually end up controlling the whole game because they will outnumber the rest of the population?

    So wait, let me get this straight, your afraid that a majority of people are going to get to gether and get some one that they want elected if this game has elections???

     I hope you are joking, because that is what exactly is going to happen in this game with these elections. Although, I don't see a problem with it.   This is how all elections work , even in real life elections.

    Of course that is whats going to happen. I was pointing out the sillyness of the OP stating that Elections will just get the person with the most votes Elected....

Sign In or Register to comment.