6 years later, WoW has removed stats and dumbed down ammo requirements. Not that it's a bad thing, it makes it more accessible like most said. I was expecting them to add some features most MMO's have today, those being housing, better crafting, appearance slots, etc instead of removing things though.
Playing - EVE, Wurm
Retired - Final Fantasy XI, Anarchy Online, Mabinogi
6 years later, WoW has removed stats and dumbed down ammo requirements. Not that it's a bad thing, it makes it more accessible like most said. I was expecting them to add some features most MMO's have today, those being housing, better crafting, appearance slots, etc instead of removing things though.
I couldnt agree with you more. Not having housing and appearance slots is inexcusable. Housing especially. Not a difficult thing to implement, but it seems blizzard wants ppl to spend time in their redesigned cities. The other issue is they dont have a tabard tab. Again, very simple to do, instead everyone has to bank it, which if you have a lot takes up a tremendous amount of space. Just dont get it...
Well i have played wow since luanch and prolly will stop playing once rift and swtor come out both games look really good and wow just keeps failing to deliver ever since wotlk luanched imo.
Originally posted by monarc333 Originally posted by AlysenMinase 6 years later, WoW has removed stats and dumbed down ammo requirements. Not that it's a bad thing, it makes it more accessible like most said. I was expecting them to add some features most MMO's have today, those being housing, better crafting, appearance slots, etc instead of removing things though.
I couldnt agree with you more. Not having housing and appearance slots is inexcusable. Housing especially. Not a difficult thing to implement, but it seems blizzard wants ppl to spend time in their redesigned cities. The other issue is they dont have a tabard tab. Again, very simple to do, instead everyone has to bank it, which if you have a lot takes up a tremendous amount of space. Just dont get it...
Instead of asking why they wouldn't do something, ask why they would. They've mentioned on the forums discussing player housing, but dismissing it. They do indeed want everyone out in the cities, not walled off in their little houses. As for the armor, they want people to wear the specific armor sets they've created so people can see you've gotten to Tier 10 or Tier 11, etc. They don't want people running around in Level 1 White armor having Tier 10 Level 80 stats; they want people to be identifiable by appearance. They haven't overlooked these things, they've made a deliberate design choice.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
6 years later, WoW has removed stats and dumbed down ammo requirements. Not that it's a bad thing, it makes it more accessible like most said. I was expecting them to add some features most MMO's have today, those being housing, better crafting, appearance slots, etc instead of removing things though.
I couldnt agree with you more. Not having housing and appearance slots is inexcusable. Housing especially. Not a difficult thing to implement, but it seems blizzard wants ppl to spend time in their redesigned cities. The other issue is they dont have a tabard tab. Again, very simple to do, instead everyone has to bank it, which if you have a lot takes up a tremendous amount of space. Just dont get it...
Instead of asking why they wouldn't do something, ask why they would. They've mentioned on the forums discussing player housing, but dismissing it. They do indeed want everyone out in the cities, not walled off in their little houses. As for the armor, they want people to wear the specific armor sets they've created so people can see you've gotten to Tier 10 or Tier 11, etc. They don't want people running around in Level 1 White armor having Tier 10 Level 80 stats; they want people to be identifiable by appearance. They haven't overlooked these things, they've made a deliberate design choice.
I understand your point. I've also seen the threads rom blizzard expressing why they dont want housing. I'm speaking for myself, and what I want in the game. Regarding the armor I get that too. However I play on a RP server where appearance slots are a wanted commodity. I know that not everyone plays on an RP server, or even likes the thought of RP, but for the thousands of us who do, it would be a great feature to have. Again just expressing my desires.
Instead of asking why they wouldn't do something, ask why they would. They've mentioned on the forums discussing player housing, but dismissing it. They do indeed want everyone out in the cities, not walled off in their little houses. As for the armor, they want people to wear the specific armor sets they've created so people can see you've gotten to Tier 10 or Tier 11, etc. They don't want people running around in Level 1 White armor having Tier 10 Level 80 stats; they want people to be identifiable by appearance. They haven't overlooked these things, they've made a deliberate design choice.
In any MMO with an appearance slot, you can right click someone and examine there real equipment. Also, player housing won't make the cities barren. Your thinking of guild houses. Player housing will reduce the population slightly in cities, but not gamebreaking. Even if it does, what influence does it have on the game? They can easily make it so you can still chat in the towns general and trade channels even when inside your home.
Playing - EVE, Wurm
Retired - Final Fantasy XI, Anarchy Online, Mabinogi
Lets race sometime. I'll give you a 6 year head start. Then we can see how long it takes me to catch up.
Too true. Too true. Everyone expects every new game to launch with all the goodies that WoW has now; not the stuff WoW had 6 years ago. I remember when I first started WoW, shortly after the first anniversary, the servers crashed 2 to 3 times a week. Any crash in any game now at launch is considered a sign of failure.
Blizzard spent over 5 years making vanilla WoW and another 6 getting to where it is now. People refuse to give other devs leway to let their games mature.
Again, if this is true, how come all the other MMOs that were release at about the same time as WoW; or even slightly before it, haven't succeeded?
I know what you're saying. There are many factors.
Imagine if all that effort that went into building EQ2 were instead reinvested in EQ. A graphic overhaul, a quest system, class revamps, etc. It probably would have stood a better chance of competing. People resist change and like what they are familiar with. That is part of the reason WoW has maintained an audience like it has.
Luck - Their time to market was the perfect storm. MMOG's were just starting to get into the mainstream. There wasn't much competition. Its the perfect gateway MMOG.
Many MMO's have had dominance. UO dominated all others during its time. EQ dominated all other during its time. Someday soon another MMO will have dominance. Six years is a long time though.
Herd mentality - If you didn't know anything about MMOG's but wanted to play one you would buy WoW and be done with it.
6 years later, WoW has removed stats and dumbed down ammo requirements. Not that it's a bad thing, it makes it more accessible like most said. I was expecting them to add some features most MMO's have today, those being housing, better crafting, appearance slots, etc instead of removing things though.
I couldnt agree with you more. Not having housing and appearance slots is inexcusable. Housing especially. Not a difficult thing to implement, but it seems blizzard wants ppl to spend time in their redesigned cities. The other issue is they dont have a tabard tab. Again, very simple to do, instead everyone has to bank it, which if you have a lot takes up a tremendous amount of space. Just dont get it...
Instead of asking why they wouldn't do something, ask why they would. They've mentioned on the forums discussing player housing, but dismissing it. They do indeed want everyone out in the cities, not walled off in their little houses. As for the armor, they want people to wear the specific armor sets they've created so people can see you've gotten to Tier 10 or Tier 11, etc. They don't want people running around in Level 1 White armor having Tier 10 Level 80 stats; they want people to be identifiable by appearance. They haven't overlooked these things, they've made a deliberate design choice.
So basically you say there ideology is do what they want , have no consideration of individual wishes all should conform to there standard , cause in all we all are easily pleased with what they want , cause there is no competition out there.
We should all wear the same resctricted clothings , wear use the same restricted talents , and all do everything there way .
I am really raving for SWTOR cause atleast it brings choices , instead of linear 6 year the same crap with empty promises.
Still no guild halls , why ? we invested those resources into random dungeons . we are working on it .
And dont forget Quit if you dont find it fun , well last year for me , and i am counting , this is not about demonising the game.
Its simply stating that they are right , people are indeed simple minded .
And people wonder whats wrong with the world today .
Lets race sometime. I'll give you a 6 year head start. Then we can see how long it takes me to catch up.
Everquest was out six years when wow released and that didn't seem to affect its success one bit. Wow actually took about half of everquests population in the first year of release.
Any game can release and do well as long as it does two things.
1) Be entertaining.
2) Have enough content to captivate the bulk of players until additional content can be added.
Having 6 years of content doesn't really matter if people only focus on a small percentage of it. An mmo is only as good as its latest expansion.
Hate or not, as mentiond before 95% of the mmos out today are craptastic with all sorts of ugly fees attatched to it. I'm convinved the majority of mmo developers are not even gamers at heart.
Instead of asking why they wouldn't do something, ask why they would. They've mentioned on the forums discussing player housing, but dismissing it. They do indeed want everyone out in the cities, not walled off in their little houses. As for the armor, they want people to wear the specific armor sets they've created so people can see you've gotten to Tier 10 or Tier 11, etc. They don't want people running around in Level 1 White armor having Tier 10 Level 80 stats; they want people to be identifiable by appearance. They haven't overlooked these things, they've made a deliberate design choice.
I don't buy that, they don't mind instancing stuff otherwise. I think they don't consider it worth the money to add it. Some players want it but many don't care and it is a lot of money to make a good housing system. My guess is that they rather make one in their next MMO instead, it is cheaper to have one from the start than to add stuff like that later. The alternative would be a crappy cheap system and that is counter productive.
I agree with you that dress armor should not work in PvP but they could really add it in PvE at least. It is not a big thing, works fine in EQ2. In PvP it sucks so just have the function but disabled it in battlegrounds, arenas and on PvP servers (and when you get PvP flagged). In games like Guildwars you can choose functions like "hide in PvP" for the dress gear, it is easy enough.
Blizzard allready had a huge fanbase before WoW even got released so blizzard had millions allready ready to buy the game, they made WoW easy so a 10 year old could learn the ropes within minutes, and they made the game light graphic wise so even the oldest computer could handle it.
dosent take a rocket sientist to figure out the outcome.
Wow wasn't that easy at launch. And the main reason why Wow did so well while EQ2 who released at the same time did so bad were none of those reasons. Wows biggest advantage were superior programming.
EQ2 were really bad and buggy at launch, Wow were just slightly buggy and that is what won the day. It also had a lot more content, it had been 7 years in production and had several times the budget of any MMO at the time. Add that Wows first lead developer was Strain and the second Kaplan and you get the picture (even if 3 million Blizz fans helped a lot as well).
Most MMOs have few if any good programmers, Blizzard have several. Besides Blizzard is Arenanet and Bioware the only ones in the genre that have really good programmers, and you can't make a huge game without them. If EQ2 would have had superior programming and Wows would have sucked EQ2 would have been the large game today instead.
So, after 6 long years, WoW is still the best and most popular MMO out there. Why is that? Why haven't other MMOs been able to capture WoW's polish and fun factor?
Discuss you thoughts on the matter.
McDonalds is still 'not' the best lunch I've had in 6-years, but it's popular for a reason. Just as WoW can be considered to 'not' be the best mmorpg available in the last 6 years, but it too is popular for a reason.
Everyone is going to judge 'best' and 'popular' differently, and use the words within different context.
I dont happen to think WoW is the best mmorpg in 6 years, maybe they are as popular as they are because the others are really that bad, or because Blizzard really took EverQuest to another level, then re-invested in main-stream marketing, had timing behind them, was ridiculed as much as it was popularized, which gives some frequent mainstream press.
Hm, topic about WoW, again, hmm. Lets see, whats probably most given WoW amazing side what we all cant find there? Oh I know! I've been told, sooooooo many times, WoW has... prepare for it its BIG... SO, WOW HAS 12+ milion players! Try to beat that!
Ye realy guys? Thats your argument? Go to hell. Everyone knows why ppl play WoW, they have friends here or they just play it so long that they dont wanna lvl anything else cause its similar at some point for em (sometimes its totaly different just looks similar - but who cares, right?). Tried WoW, did 80, quited, horrible community, lower lvls PvP - about twinks, high lvl PvP, about getting better players to your team (almost always one side is winning lot more than other), PvE - grind, grind and grind comes again. Crafting.. hmm, maybe.
Dungeons? 5-man - if you are not equipped so you can run it rly fast as hell you are shit, remember that. And Raids? I realy didnt like the idea of dungeon where bosses are so close together. Just so "grindy". You just need to grind some stuff by doing dungeons to get better equipment so you can grind other items from "better" dungeons to get better equipment. WoW!
I kinda regret I didnt try WoW when it came out, I think WoW could be realy good game before, just original WoW, BC - maybe, but Wotlk just pissed me of so hard.. One thing where WoW is amazing, you can solo your character to haven, but team stuff - grind so you can grind more.
Played: Lineage 2,Guild Wars 1 and 2, Age of Conan, Ragnarok Online, LOTRO, World of Warcraft, League of Legends, EvE online Tried: KAL Online, Face of Mankind, ROSE online Playing: CS:GO
Lets race sometime. I'll give you a 6 year head start. Then we can see how long it takes me to catch up.
Too true. Too true. Everyone expects every new game to launch with all the goodies that WoW has now; not the stuff WoW had 6 years ago. I remember when I first started WoW, shortly after the first anniversary, the servers crashed 2 to 3 times a week. Any crash in any game now at launch is considered a sign of failure.
Blizzard spent over 5 years making vanilla WoW and another 6 getting to where it is now. People refuse to give other devs leway to let their games mature.
I actually played in beta, but was caught up in CoH at the time, so didn't really play WoW regularly until about 8 months after Vanilla launch. I definitely don't recall "...servers crashed 2 to 3 times a week..." at any point. I call shenanigans on this. Not that the servers were perfect, but 2 to 3 times a month would be more accurate.
Blizzard did indeed spend over 5 years making WoW initially. However, it's not like the other gaming companies have been cranking out their games in a few months. Warhammer Online was acquired by Mythic in May 2005 (i.e. Climax Online had already started development) and released it over 3 years later. Development on Age of Conan started more than 3 years prior to release (they released screen shots early in 2005). Aion more than 3 years (previewed in 2006 E3 Expo). Lord of the Rings Online has it's original work as far back as 1998 with Sierra On-Line with various twists and turns resulting in a 2007 release.
Whether you like Blizzard or not, you should face the facts that they have a good bead on how to make engaging games that appeal to the masses. 12 million subscriptions does not mean a superior game...it just means that it is a popular game. As I've mentioned before, WoW is the McDonalds of the gaming world...it will never be mistaken for the best quality game / food, but it works well enough for the majority of the people to be the largest out there.
Hm, topic about WoW, again, hmm. Lets see, whats probably most given WoW amazing side what we all cant find there? Oh I know! I've been told, sooooooo many times, WoW has... prepare for it its BIG... SO, WOW HAS 12+ milion players! Try to beat that!
Ye realy guys? Thats your argument? Go to hell. Everyone knows why ppl play WoW, they have friends here or they just play it so long that they dont wanna lvl anything else cause its similar at some point for em (sometimes its totaly different just looks similar - but who cares, right?). Tried WoW, did 80, quited, horrible community, lower lvls PvP - about twinks, high lvl PvP, about getting better players to your team (almost always one side is winning lot more than other), PvE - grind, grind and grind comes again. Crafting.. hmm, maybe.
Dungeons? 5-man - if you are not equipped so you can run it rly fast as hell you are shit, remember that. And Raids? I realy didnt like the idea of dungeon where bosses are so close together. Just so "grindy". You just need to grind some stuff by doing dungeons to get better equipment so you can grind other items from "better" dungeons to get better equipment. WoW!
I kinda regret I didnt try WoW when it came out, I think WoW could be realy good game before, just original WoW, BC - maybe, but Wotlk just pissed me of so hard.. One thing where WoW is amazing, you can solo your character to haven, but team stuff - grind so you can grind more.
Originally posted by drake_hound Originally posted by lizardbones
Originally posted by monarc333
Originally posted by AlysenMinase 6 years later, WoW has removed stats and dumbed down ammo requirements. Not that it's a bad thing, it makes it more accessible like most said. I was expecting them to add some features most MMO's have today, those being housing, better crafting, appearance slots, etc instead of removing things though.
I couldnt agree with you more. Not having housing and appearance slots is inexcusable. Housing especially. Not a difficult thing to implement, but it seems blizzard wants ppl to spend time in their redesigned cities. The other issue is they dont have a tabard tab. Again, very simple to do, instead everyone has to bank it, which if you have a lot takes up a tremendous amount of space. Just dont get it...
Instead of asking why they wouldn't do something, ask why they would. They've mentioned on the forums discussing player housing, but dismissing it. They do indeed want everyone out in the cities, not walled off in their little houses. As for the armor, they want people to wear the specific armor sets they've created so people can see you've gotten to Tier 10 or Tier 11, etc. They don't want people running around in Level 1 White armor having Tier 10 Level 80 stats; they want people to be identifiable by appearance. They haven't overlooked these things, they've made a deliberate design choice. So basically you say there ideology is do what they want , have no consideration of individual wishes all should conform to there standard , cause in all we all are easily pleased with what they want , cause there is no competition out there. We should all wear the same resctricted clothings , wear use the same restricted talents , and all do everything there way . I am really raving for SWTOR cause atleast it brings choices , instead of linear 6 year the same crap with empty promises. Still no guild halls , why ? we invested those resources into random dungeons . we are working on it . And dont forget Quit if you dont find it fun , well last year for me , and i am counting , this is not about demonising the game. Its simply stating that they are right , people are indeed simple minded . And people wonder whats wrong with the world today .
In short, yes. They do what they want with their game. However, they base what they want on what they believe is the best overall for the game. It may be the right choice and it may be the wrong choice. It's hard to say they've made the wrong choices so far since they are sitting on billions of dollars. That doesn't mean everyone will like WoW or that everyone will play WoW. It just means they aren't stupid...they know what they are doing and it's making money by giving a very large number of people a good experience playing their game.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
So, after 6 long years, WoW is still the best and most popular MMO out there. Why is that? Why haven't other MMOs been able to capture WoW's polish and fun factor?
Discuss you thoughts on the matter.
I wonder how many of these threads we will have all read after about 10 years. We're already pushing over 100, I'm sure.
First of all....I will agree with you that WoW is ONE OF the most popular MMOs (some of the other hugely popular MMOs that have a crap ton of subs are not Western MMOs and you never hear about them). HOWEVER.....when it comes to declaring WoW the "best" anything......that is purely subjective.
You've heard this a million times:
McDonald's certainly does NOT make the "best" hamburger. I would say maybe IN and OUT does or maybe Steak and Shake, or maybe Backyard Burgers, OR.....maybe some gourmet restaurant most of us have never HEARD of, but McDonald's sells a whole LOT of their CHEAP, greasy, unhealthy, warmed up burgers, and bothers to keep track of how many they sell, but....I guarantee you they're not winning any award for the best quality hamburger.
The reason McDonald's gets used as a comparison is because it's the most obvious. There are myriads of other comparisons that can be made, but since the OP is obviously a big WoW FAN.....I won't bother. Because no matter what I say, it won't make a difference anyway. He's already sold on the cheap price, the high fat content, the health risk, and the popularity (as though that made it all okay).
Personally....I don't think there are ANY "great" MMOs right now. But there are some great IDEAS for MMOs coming up. Maybe we'll see what I consider to be a great MMO over the course of the next couple of years. I can only hope.
For five years....WoW was a good MMO for me and my family. They were new to MMOs. It was a good training tool. I just hope it hasn't ruined them for MMOs that actually require engaging your brain prior to playing, because I have a feeling that some of the upcoming MMOs might require a bit more "awareness" than what they've gotten used to, but.....time will tell. I think WoW was a good starter MMO for them....kind of like starting out with training wheels.
In my opinion, EQ2 is still better than WoW, but SoE keeps WoWifying it more and more and that it detracting from it's original status. It's never been as popular as WoW for multiple reasons....it's not OMFGSOGODDAMNEASY. The crafting requires more than pushing one button. (I think WoW players are notoriously lazy.) It also has great player housing and guild halls, which after all this time....WoW still doesn't have. ROFL But whatever.....WoW is AWESOME and THE BEST. /rolls eyes
And before you slam me for honestly stating my opinion......you ASKED for it in the OP. Right now.....there ARE no "awesome" MMOs. There are a few good ones, and one overly popular aging gorilla that holds on to it's standing because it's pretty much the ONLY MMO that has a marketing department that kicks ass. I think I will say that WoW has the best marketing dept. I'll give 'em that.
6 years later and they still don't have player or guild housing..
6 years later and they still don't have some type of woodworking profession..
6 years later and they still have a 1/2 baked economy
6 years later and they still haven't added any new "starting" classes..
6 years later and they still have the socially annoying ID system for raiding
6 years later and they are finally adding their twist to game ideas already released (aka guild leveling)
6 years later and the game becomes easier and easier..
6 years later most of the original devs are gone.. hmmm
I can't argue with most of this. And a lot of those things play into why I, personally, do not consider WoW the "best" at anything other than MARKETING. They have MARKETED their asses off and that is part of the popularity factor.
You could be the best <fill in the blank with ANYTHING> in the entire universe and if you don't have marketing.....no one will know you exist.
Whether you like Blizzard or not, you should face the facts that they have a good bead on how to make engaging games that appeal to the masses. 12 million subscriptions does not mean a superior game...it just means that it is a popular game. As I've mentioned before, WoW is the McDonalds of the gaming world...it will never be mistaken for the best quality game / food, but it works well enough for the majority of the people to be the largest out there.
So then what are these other high quality games that make WoW look like McDonalds?
I would love to hear about these games that have such high quality it makes wow look like fast food.
I can't argue with most of this. And a lot of those things play into why I, personally, do not consider WoW the "best" at anything other than MARKETING. They have MARKETED their asses off and that is part of the popularity factor.
You could be the best in the entire universe and if you don't have marketing.....no one will know you exist.
Marketing will only get people to try a game. It will not get them to keep subscribing or spread positive word of mouth to their friends and family.
Other games have had plenty of marketing and yet they continue to close servers, change revenue models and lose population.
Whether you like Blizzard or not, you should face the facts that they have a good bead on how to make engaging games that appeal to the masses. 12 million subscriptions does not mean a superior game...it just means that it is a popular game. As I've mentioned before, WoW is the McDonalds of the gaming world...it will never be mistaken for the best quality game / food, but it works well enough for the majority of the people to be the largest out there.
So then what are these other high quality games that make WoW look like McDonalds?
I would love to hear about these games that have such high quality it makes wow look like fast food.
You apparently didn't read my diatribe. I know it was long. But I flat out stated that, in my opinion, there ARE no "awesome" MMOs out right now. NONE. NADA. ZILCH.
Comments
6 years later, WoW has removed stats and dumbed down ammo requirements. Not that it's a bad thing, it makes it more accessible like most said. I was expecting them to add some features most MMO's have today, those being housing, better crafting, appearance slots, etc instead of removing things though.
Playing - EVE, Wurm
Retired - Final Fantasy XI, Anarchy Online, Mabinogi
Waiting - ArcheAge, Salem
I couldnt agree with you more. Not having housing and appearance slots is inexcusable. Housing especially. Not a difficult thing to implement, but it seems blizzard wants ppl to spend time in their redesigned cities. The other issue is they dont have a tabard tab. Again, very simple to do, instead everyone has to bank it, which if you have a lot takes up a tremendous amount of space. Just dont get it...
Well i have played wow since luanch and prolly will stop playing once rift and swtor come out both games look really good and wow just keeps failing to deliver ever since wotlk luanched imo.
Instead of asking why they wouldn't do something, ask why they would. They've mentioned on the forums discussing player housing, but dismissing it. They do indeed want everyone out in the cities, not walled off in their little houses. As for the armor, they want people to wear the specific armor sets they've created so people can see you've gotten to Tier 10 or Tier 11, etc. They don't want people running around in Level 1 White armor having Tier 10 Level 80 stats; they want people to be identifiable by appearance. They haven't overlooked these things, they've made a deliberate design choice.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
Just logged it and got my achievement.
Remember Old School Ultima Online
I understand your point. I've also seen the threads rom blizzard expressing why they dont want housing. I'm speaking for myself, and what I want in the game. Regarding the armor I get that too. However I play on a RP server where appearance slots are a wanted commodity. I know that not everyone plays on an RP server, or even likes the thought of RP, but for the thousands of us who do, it would be a great feature to have. Again just expressing my desires.
In any MMO with an appearance slot, you can right click someone and examine there real equipment. Also, player housing won't make the cities barren. Your thinking of guild houses. Player housing will reduce the population slightly in cities, but not gamebreaking. Even if it does, what influence does it have on the game? They can easily make it so you can still chat in the towns general and trade channels even when inside your home.
Playing - EVE, Wurm
Retired - Final Fantasy XI, Anarchy Online, Mabinogi
Waiting - ArcheAge, Salem
I know what you're saying. There are many factors.
Imagine if all that effort that went into building EQ2 were instead reinvested in EQ. A graphic overhaul, a quest system, class revamps, etc. It probably would have stood a better chance of competing. People resist change and like what they are familiar with. That is part of the reason WoW has maintained an audience like it has.
Luck - Their time to market was the perfect storm. MMOG's were just starting to get into the mainstream. There wasn't much competition. Its the perfect gateway MMOG.
Many MMO's have had dominance. UO dominated all others during its time. EQ dominated all other during its time. Someday soon another MMO will have dominance. Six years is a long time though.
Herd mentality - If you didn't know anything about MMOG's but wanted to play one you would buy WoW and be done with it.
So basically you say there ideology is do what they want , have no consideration of individual wishes all should conform to there standard , cause in all we all are easily pleased with what they want , cause there is no competition out there.
We should all wear the same resctricted clothings , wear use the same restricted talents , and all do everything there way .
I am really raving for SWTOR cause atleast it brings choices , instead of linear 6 year the same crap with empty promises.
Still no guild halls , why ? we invested those resources into random dungeons . we are working on it .
And dont forget Quit if you dont find it fun , well last year for me , and i am counting , this is not about demonising the game.
Its simply stating that they are right , people are indeed simple minded .
And people wonder whats wrong with the world today .
Everquest was out six years when wow released and that didn't seem to affect its success one bit. Wow actually took about half of everquests population in the first year of release.
Any game can release and do well as long as it does two things.
1) Be entertaining.
2) Have enough content to captivate the bulk of players until additional content can be added.
Having 6 years of content doesn't really matter if people only focus on a small percentage of it. An mmo is only as good as its latest expansion.
Hate or not, as mentiond before 95% of the mmos out today are craptastic with all sorts of ugly fees attatched to it. I'm convinved the majority of mmo developers are not even gamers at heart.
I don't buy that, they don't mind instancing stuff otherwise. I think they don't consider it worth the money to add it. Some players want it but many don't care and it is a lot of money to make a good housing system. My guess is that they rather make one in their next MMO instead, it is cheaper to have one from the start than to add stuff like that later. The alternative would be a crappy cheap system and that is counter productive.
I agree with you that dress armor should not work in PvP but they could really add it in PvE at least. It is not a big thing, works fine in EQ2. In PvP it sucks so just have the function but disabled it in battlegrounds, arenas and on PvP servers (and when you get PvP flagged). In games like Guildwars you can choose functions like "hide in PvP" for the dress gear, it is easy enough.
6 years later and they still don't have player or guild housing..
6 years later and they still don't have some type of woodworking profession..
6 years later and they still have a 1/2 baked economy
6 years later and they still haven't added any new "starting" classes..
6 years later and they still have the socially annoying ID system for raiding
6 years later and they are finally adding their twist to game ideas already released (aka guild leveling)
6 years later and the game becomes easier and easier..
6 years later most of the original devs are gone.. hmmm
Wow wasn't that easy at launch. And the main reason why Wow did so well while EQ2 who released at the same time did so bad were none of those reasons. Wows biggest advantage were superior programming.
EQ2 were really bad and buggy at launch, Wow were just slightly buggy and that is what won the day. It also had a lot more content, it had been 7 years in production and had several times the budget of any MMO at the time. Add that Wows first lead developer was Strain and the second Kaplan and you get the picture (even if 3 million Blizz fans helped a lot as well).
Most MMOs have few if any good programmers, Blizzard have several. Besides Blizzard is Arenanet and Bioware the only ones in the genre that have really good programmers, and you can't make a huge game without them. If EQ2 would have had superior programming and Wows would have sucked EQ2 would have been the large game today instead.
McDonalds is still 'not' the best lunch I've had in 6-years, but it's popular for a reason. Just as WoW can be considered to 'not' be the best mmorpg available in the last 6 years, but it too is popular for a reason.
Everyone is going to judge 'best' and 'popular' differently, and use the words within different context.
I dont happen to think WoW is the best mmorpg in 6 years, maybe they are as popular as they are because the others are really that bad, or because Blizzard really took EverQuest to another level, then re-invested in main-stream marketing, had timing behind them, was ridiculed as much as it was popularized, which gives some frequent mainstream press.
Hm, topic about WoW, again, hmm. Lets see, whats probably most given WoW amazing side what we all cant find there? Oh I know! I've been told, sooooooo many times, WoW has... prepare for it its BIG... SO, WOW HAS 12+ milion players! Try to beat that!
Ye realy guys? Thats your argument? Go to hell. Everyone knows why ppl play WoW, they have friends here or they just play it so long that they dont wanna lvl anything else cause its similar at some point for em (sometimes its totaly different just looks similar - but who cares, right?). Tried WoW, did 80, quited, horrible community, lower lvls PvP - about twinks, high lvl PvP, about getting better players to your team (almost always one side is winning lot more than other), PvE - grind, grind and grind comes again. Crafting.. hmm, maybe.
Dungeons? 5-man - if you are not equipped so you can run it rly fast as hell you are shit, remember that. And Raids? I realy didnt like the idea of dungeon where bosses are so close together. Just so "grindy". You just need to grind some stuff by doing dungeons to get better equipment so you can grind other items from "better" dungeons to get better equipment. WoW!
I kinda regret I didnt try WoW when it came out, I think WoW could be realy good game before, just original WoW, BC - maybe, but Wotlk just pissed me of so hard.. One thing where WoW is amazing, you can solo your character to haven, but team stuff - grind so you can grind more.
Played: Lineage 2,Guild Wars 1 and 2, Age of Conan, Ragnarok Online, LOTRO, World of Warcraft, League of Legends, EvE online
Tried: KAL Online, Face of Mankind, ROSE online
Playing: CS:GO
I actually played in beta, but was caught up in CoH at the time, so didn't really play WoW regularly until about 8 months after Vanilla launch. I definitely don't recall "...servers crashed 2 to 3 times a week..." at any point. I call shenanigans on this. Not that the servers were perfect, but 2 to 3 times a month would be more accurate.
Blizzard did indeed spend over 5 years making WoW initially. However, it's not like the other gaming companies have been cranking out their games in a few months. Warhammer Online was acquired by Mythic in May 2005 (i.e. Climax Online had already started development) and released it over 3 years later. Development on Age of Conan started more than 3 years prior to release (they released screen shots early in 2005). Aion more than 3 years (previewed in 2006 E3 Expo). Lord of the Rings Online has it's original work as far back as 1998 with Sierra On-Line with various twists and turns resulting in a 2007 release.
Whether you like Blizzard or not, you should face the facts that they have a good bead on how to make engaging games that appeal to the masses. 12 million subscriptions does not mean a superior game...it just means that it is a popular game. As I've mentioned before, WoW is the McDonalds of the gaming world...it will never be mistaken for the best quality game / food, but it works well enough for the majority of the people to be the largest out there.
this is a guy that sums up wow perfectly!
I couldnt agree with you more. Not having housing and appearance slots is inexcusable. Housing especially. Not a difficult thing to implement, but it seems blizzard wants ppl to spend time in their redesigned cities. The other issue is they dont have a tabard tab. Again, very simple to do, instead everyone has to bank it, which if you have a lot takes up a tremendous amount of space. Just dont get it...
Instead of asking why they wouldn't do something, ask why they would. They've mentioned on the forums discussing player housing, but dismissing it. They do indeed want everyone out in the cities, not walled off in their little houses. As for the armor, they want people to wear the specific armor sets they've created so people can see you've gotten to Tier 10 or Tier 11, etc. They don't want people running around in Level 1 White armor having Tier 10 Level 80 stats; they want people to be identifiable by appearance. They haven't overlooked these things, they've made a deliberate design choice.
So basically you say there ideology is do what they want , have no consideration of individual wishes all should conform to there standard , cause in all we all are easily pleased with what they want , cause there is no competition out there.
We should all wear the same resctricted clothings , wear use the same restricted talents , and all do everything there way .
I am really raving for SWTOR cause atleast it brings choices , instead of linear 6 year the same crap with empty promises.
Still no guild halls , why ? we invested those resources into random dungeons . we are working on it .
And dont forget Quit if you dont find it fun , well last year for me , and i am counting , this is not about demonising the game.
Its simply stating that they are right , people are indeed simple minded .
And people wonder whats wrong with the world today .
In short, yes. They do what they want with their game. However, they base what they want on what they believe is the best overall for the game. It may be the right choice and it may be the wrong choice. It's hard to say they've made the wrong choices so far since they are sitting on billions of dollars. That doesn't mean everyone will like WoW or that everyone will play WoW. It just means they aren't stupid...they know what they are doing and it's making money by giving a very large number of people a good experience playing their game.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
I wonder how many of these threads we will have all read after about 10 years. We're already pushing over 100, I'm sure.
First of all....I will agree with you that WoW is ONE OF the most popular MMOs (some of the other hugely popular MMOs that have a crap ton of subs are not Western MMOs and you never hear about them). HOWEVER.....when it comes to declaring WoW the "best" anything......that is purely subjective.
You've heard this a million times:
McDonald's certainly does NOT make the "best" hamburger. I would say maybe IN and OUT does or maybe Steak and Shake, or maybe Backyard Burgers, OR.....maybe some gourmet restaurant most of us have never HEARD of, but McDonald's sells a whole LOT of their CHEAP, greasy, unhealthy, warmed up burgers, and bothers to keep track of how many they sell, but....I guarantee you they're not winning any award for the best quality hamburger.
The reason McDonald's gets used as a comparison is because it's the most obvious. There are myriads of other comparisons that can be made, but since the OP is obviously a big WoW FAN.....I won't bother. Because no matter what I say, it won't make a difference anyway. He's already sold on the cheap price, the high fat content, the health risk, and the popularity (as though that made it all okay).
Personally....I don't think there are ANY "great" MMOs right now. But there are some great IDEAS for MMOs coming up. Maybe we'll see what I consider to be a great MMO over the course of the next couple of years. I can only hope.
For five years....WoW was a good MMO for me and my family. They were new to MMOs. It was a good training tool. I just hope it hasn't ruined them for MMOs that actually require engaging your brain prior to playing, because I have a feeling that some of the upcoming MMOs might require a bit more "awareness" than what they've gotten used to, but.....time will tell. I think WoW was a good starter MMO for them....kind of like starting out with training wheels.
In my opinion, EQ2 is still better than WoW, but SoE keeps WoWifying it more and more and that it detracting from it's original status. It's never been as popular as WoW for multiple reasons....it's not OMFGSOGODDAMNEASY. The crafting requires more than pushing one button. (I think WoW players are notoriously lazy.) It also has great player housing and guild halls, which after all this time....WoW still doesn't have. ROFL But whatever.....WoW is AWESOME and THE BEST. /rolls eyes
And before you slam me for honestly stating my opinion......you ASKED for it in the OP. Right now.....there ARE no "awesome" MMOs. There are a few good ones, and one overly popular aging gorilla that holds on to it's standing because it's pretty much the ONLY MMO that has a marketing department that kicks ass. I think I will say that WoW has the best marketing dept. I'll give 'em that.
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club
I can't argue with most of this. And a lot of those things play into why I, personally, do not consider WoW the "best" at anything other than MARKETING. They have MARKETED their asses off and that is part of the popularity factor.
You could be the best <fill in the blank with ANYTHING> in the entire universe and if you don't have marketing.....no one will know you exist.
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club
So then what are these other high quality games that make WoW look like McDonalds?
I would love to hear about these games that have such high quality it makes wow look like fast food.
Marketing will only get people to try a game. It will not get them to keep subscribing or spread positive word of mouth to their friends and family.
Other games have had plenty of marketing and yet they continue to close servers, change revenue models and lose population.
Good games sell themselves.
You apparently didn't read my diatribe. I know it was long. But I flat out stated that, in my opinion, there ARE no "awesome" MMOs out right now. NONE. NADA. ZILCH.
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club