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Deeds? A horrible grind? or a reason to do stuff?

I love deeds, the entire mechanic is like a throwback to the old mob hunting days. Honestly it's my favorite feature, when I enter a area I can't wait to stumble on more deeds, I explore everything, kill everything and hunt for every single quest giver. I think it's genius how the system is tied to everything an how it gives players incentive to do everything. However some people don't like it. Some people consider it an annoying, boring grind that your forced to do for traits. So what do you think of the deeds system?

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Comments

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 30,966

    I like them but I'm also one who likes killing mobs.

    I find it very relaxing.

    Many times I will look at an area and just fight my way through it. Loved moria because of that.

    The trick is to do them when you want and not feel obliged to finish every last one. There seems to be a breed of gamer who is a bit obsessive compulsive when it comes to finishing content.

    If it's a compulsion I can understand but that's going to get very dicey as one is going to feel compelled to sit there and finish every last one.

    My favorite was a troll one that was in a dungeon in the dwarven area. They were elites and I essentially waited until I was 60 to do them.

    It was still hard but I enjoyed the challenge. I even had a lower lvl player join me for a few of them.

    I tend to like going into areas that I can fight my way out but where it's possible to get overwhelmed.

    There's an orc area in north downs where I fougth my way through to a mini boss that was slightly too hard for me. Doing an orc deed while traversing somewhat dangerous territory can be enjoyable.

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  • NicoliNicoli Member Posts: 1,312

    I like it with the trait system, I especially like the fact that you can view the set rewards so you can see if you really want to spend time leveling up a deed. If they didn't show the rewards ahead of time... I'd hate the system, I've never been a big fan of doing stuff for the .00000X% of something dropping or something happening worthwhile.

  • xBludxxBludx Member Posts: 376

    Originally posted by Sovrath

    I like them but I'm also one who likes killing mobs.

    I find it very relaxing.

    I understand what you are saying here. I see you play a Guardian, too.

    Usually, I play an ffa pvp game. But there are times when I don't want to be paranoid and I just want to kill stuff and grind. In fact, I love to do it slowly, so I prefer a tank class. Most people don't have the patience (call it stupidity if you want to be cruel) to do that. I love the heavy armor, high survival classes for that kind of stuff. It makes getting overwhelmed more doable.

    I had some fun clearing out low level mobs last night with my Dwarf Guard. Got to level 8! Woohoo!

    It was all free fun, too, so can't go wrong with that.

  • mCalvertmCalvert Member CommonPosts: 1,283

    I hate deeds. Its just grind. However, I have no issue with a getting recognized for doing something unique that you werent even working towards, like eating 1000 lembas gets you a cake eater deed and title. Or maybe falling off a cliff and breaking your bones 1000 times.

  • elockeelocke Member UncommonPosts: 4,335

    Depends on the class and how many I have to kill.  On my hunter, grinding the deeds out was cake.  On my minstrel?  Hell no.  All depends on how fun combat is with that particular class.

    sometimes, I wish the quests you got would coincide with the deed grinds more.  For example, killing boars in most of the zones...tons of quests but no deed for it?  

    Also, I wish they would offer other options for the deeds, considering you only slot 5 and they are maxed at rank 10, that leaves a ton of deeds just sitting there.  They should incorporate them into the game more, maybe allow you to put unused ones on your soldiers in skirmishes or apply them in some way to legendary items.

  • TUX426TUX426 Member Posts: 1,907

    I like em. They're completely optional and they allow people to be rewarded (Traits, titles, etc) for taking the time to complete them and it beats randomly killing crap to pass the time. 

  • ariestearieste Member UncommonPosts: 3,309

    At first I thought these were a grind.  My reaction was "OMG, I need to stay here and kill 120 wargs to get the trait i need? BORING!"

     

    After actually learning to play the game, I realized a few things about deeds:

    1.  You don't ever "NEED" to do one.  Just because you have a deed for 120 elite trolls, doesn't mean you should drop your life and try to complete it.

     

    2.  You end up killing mobs anyways.  Half the deeds in the game you'll complete automatically as long as you do other stuff in the zone.   Some take a little extra work and a few take A LOT of extra work.  So maybe avoid those.

     

    3.  Mobs are easier to find when you aren't looking for them.  Like i said above, chances are, quests will send you to some of the best spawn spots for farming the mobs you need for deeds.  Even if you don't do the deed there and then, these are good to note for later.

     

    4. Deeds help break-up the day.  Sure, if you have an exciting questline, you don't want to stop to kill 30 wolves. But if you've been running around for ages and or just don't have a lot of time - you always have the option of killing stuff for 30 minutes in one spot and having it be productive since you get a deed done.

     

    5.  Other people want deeds done too!   Seriously, did you think that everyone soloes 200 Elite trolls between quests?  No.  Chances are people need them and it's another reason to group.  I've had tons of fun on a couploe of hunting parties that just involved mass slaughter of things for deeds.  Another reason to have fun is always welcome :)

     

    So in conclusion - deeds are a grind if you make them a grind.  If you do them on your own terms, they're a great part of the game and I consider them an excellent alternative progression mechanic.

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  • choujiofkonochoujiofkono Member Posts: 852

         I agree.  A  lot of the little things in the game are there just for some feedback on what you've been doing.  During your journey you may not be aware that you have slaughtered 500 trolls, but the game is aware and it rewards you for your time.  I like the feedback.  I don't even pay attention to them other than when they ding. 

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  • RobsolfRobsolf Member RarePosts: 4,606

    Originally posted by Rockgod99

    I love deeds, the entire mechanic is like a throwback to the old mob hunting days. Honestly it's my favorite feature, when I enter a area I can't wait to stumble on more deeds, I explore everything, kill everything and hunt for every single quest giver. I think it's genius how the system is tied to everything an how it gives players incentive to do everything. However some people don't like it. Some people consider it an annoying, boring grind that your forced to do for traits. So what do you think of the deeds system?

    Depends on how I look at it.

    As a system of advancement, it's not my favorite.

    As a system of rewards, I think it's terrific.

    in other words, if I look at it like, "I need to focus on killing X wolves to get Y deed so I can move on", it becomes a grind.  If I finish the quests in the area, look at my deeds and see I'm in reaching distance of the deed, then I can do it gladly.  And usually, that's the way it turns out, unless I already dinged it through questing or skirms.

    Some, like the crawler deed in the Trollshaws, are kinda lame, since you're a good ways away from finishing the deed once you're done with the area.  I suppose if you keep a mind to kill every one you come across while questing, that may not be the case.

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 30,966

    Originally posted by xBludx

    Originally posted by Sovrath

    I like them but I'm also one who likes killing mobs.

    I find it very relaxing.

    I understand what you are saying here. I see you play a Guardian, too.

    Usually, I play an ffa pvp game. But there are times when I don't want to be paranoid and I just want to kill stuff and grind. In fact, I love to do it slowly, so I prefer a tank class. Most people don't have the patience (call it stupidity if you want to be cruel) to do that. I love the heavy armor, high survival classes for that kind of stuff. It makes getting overwhelmed more doable.

    I had some fun clearing out low level mobs last night with my Dwarf Guard. Got to level 8! Woohoo!

    It was all free fun, too, so can't go wrong with that.

    Usually I play damage dealers or mages but for this game, at the time, champion just didn't do it for me. The feel of the guardian works better for me.

    I have found some very fun times when I was swamped with mobs and was able to end the fight with a pile of bodies around me. That is why I enjoy the guardian ; )

    I know what you mean about ffa pvp and being paranoid. In the end that type of play got to me. I don't find it enjoyable anymore.

    I think Arieste has it right though. One doesn't have to grind trolls if one doesn't want to. Heck, I'm still finishing deeds on my 65 way after the level I got them.

    I really do think that players should just play and do what they like and eventually certain things will just get done. Or, if one wants to take an evening, pour themselves a glass of wine (or drink of choice) and just listen to good music and "take care of business' then that is also an option.

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  • trancejeremytrancejeremy Member UncommonPosts: 1,222

    The thing is though, in later regions the requirements are crazy. It goes from like 60 for the first one and 120 for the second in the starter regions to 120 and even 150 (in Angmar) for the first one and 240 and 300 for the second.

    And at the same time, mobs take longer to kill. When you start, mobs have basically 1/4 the morale you do. By the 50s, it's somewhere between 1/2 and 1/1. (At 64, most mobs my level have more morale than I do).

    So you go from something that you can mostly do in the course of doing all the quests in an area, to something you need to deliberately do for hours. Nothing but.

    Certain classes have it easier as well. A hunter, at least up to where I've played on (40) can drop a single mob before it reaches him (or at most require a couple whacks). So it's a lot easier for a hunter to do these deeds because they can set up in a middle of a group, take them one at a time, the move on.

    Melee centric characters need to either run up to each mob, or pull them. But with a melee chracter pulls, you've got to wait for them to run, then beat them down once they get there (as opposed to the hunter doing it, where they drop dead at your feet). So it's like 2-3x as long for melee characters to do it.

    And the rewards for doing them seem to be factored into the assumed character progression of the game. People say "Blah blah blah, virtues are worthless." Sure, if you pick the right ones, you can basically get up to 2000 melee defense. That's like carrying an extra heavy shield. That doesn't matter? Right, right.

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  • ariestearieste Member UncommonPosts: 3,309

    Originally posted by trancejeremy

    And the rewards for doing them seem to be factored into the assumed character progression of the game. People say "Blah blah blah, virtues are worthless." Sure, if you pick the right ones, you can basically get up to 2000 melee defense. That's like carrying an extra heavy shield. That doesn't matter? Right, right.

    But ask yourself, of the 10 ranks for the 2000 melee defence virtue, how many require 300 angmar mobs?  1? 2?  And what happens if you skip those and only get 8 ranks... you'll still get 1600, which is the majority of the benefit.

     

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not looking forward to having to kill 500 angmar mobs for a virtue.  At the same time, I'm level 47, haven't done any grinding, just started angmar and most of my virtues are already at rank 6.  I figure by the time I'm 65, most of them will be level 7 minimum.  The other ones?  Well, it's kinda nice to know that if you put in the time, you can reach a special level in those virtues that others may not have done.  Plus, I expect that later zones have instances that you end up running over and over where you slaughter at least SOME of these mobs.

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  • itchmonitchmon Member RarePosts: 1,999

    i like them a lot as well and i do consider lotr the best theme park mmo hands-down.

     

    i dont think there's much they do wrong, although i'm only level 3ish so maybe when i get higher level i'll find something to complain about.

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  • SuperXero89SuperXero89 Member UncommonPosts: 2,551

    I don't understand the concept of the deed system.  Seems exactly like WoW's talent trees yet instead of getting points to put into a tree every time you level, you're forced to grind hundreds of the same mobs until you finish a deed to get the trait.

  • RocketeerRocketeer Member UncommonPosts: 1,303

    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    I don't understand the concept of the deed system.  Seems exactly like WoW's talent trees yet instead of getting points to put into a tree every time you level, you're forced to grind hundreds of the same mobs until you finish a deed to get the trait.

    They are nothing like WoWs talent trees at all, because they do not affect your talents/abilities. They are alot like the WoW achievement system, just with rewards(and you get virtues for them, not traits). The thing similar to WoWs talent trees are the traits(which you get by using one of your skills x amount of times), and the thing similar to glyphs are the legendary weapons(which are more random and grindy, but also more powerful).

  • SuperXero89SuperXero89 Member UncommonPosts: 2,551

    Originally posted by Rocketeer

    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    I don't understand the concept of the deed system.  Seems exactly like WoW's talent trees yet instead of getting points to put into a tree every time you level, you're forced to grind hundreds of the same mobs until you finish a deed to get the trait.

    They are nothing like WoWs talent trees at all, because they do not affect your talents/abilities. They are alot like the WoW achievement system, just with rewards(and you get virtues for them, not traits). The thing similar to WoWs talent trees are the traits(which you get by using one of your skills x amount of times), and the thing similar to glyphs are the legendary weapons(which are more random and grindy, but also more powerful).

    So the deeds themselves are nothing like the talent trees, but the rewards are. Deeds/traits whatever you want to call them, I think it's a needless grind. Not sure why Turbine didn't decide to include simple talent trees instead of making you kill 300 orcs for +3 intelligence or making you use your quick shot skill 900 times for increased damage.

    It would have been one thing if these rewards were merely optional, making them nice bonuses for completing certain tasks, but as usually when you adopt a system like this, the min/maxers of the community make such things absolutely essential for the progression of your character.

  • RocketeerRocketeer Member UncommonPosts: 1,303

    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    Originally posted by Rocketeer


    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    I don't understand the concept of the deed system.  Seems exactly like WoW's talent trees yet instead of getting points to put into a tree every time you level, you're forced to grind hundreds of the same mobs until you finish a deed to get the trait.

    They are nothing like WoWs talent trees at all, because they do not affect your talents/abilities. They are alot like the WoW achievement system, just with rewards(and you get virtues for them, not traits). The thing similar to WoWs talent trees are the traits(which you get by using one of your skills x amount of times), and the thing similar to glyphs are the legendary weapons(which are more random and grindy, but also more powerful).

    So the deeds themselves are nothing like the talent trees, but the rewards are. Deeds/traits whatever you want to call them, I think it's a needless grind. Not sure why Turbine didn't decide to include simple talent trees instead of making you kill 300 orcs for +3 intelligence or making you use your quick shot skill 900 times for increased damage.

    It would have been one thing if these rewards were merely optional, making them nice bonuses for completing certain tasks, but as usually when you adopt a system like this, the min/maxers of the community make such things absolutely essential for the progression of your character.

    Lets explain it a little:

    Traits are like talent trees, you get to pick and choose which "talents" you want to slot and you get boni for slotting more in the same "tree". Like in WoW the "deeper" talents require a higher level. These include normal traits and legendary traits, the latter being divided again into so called capstones(require being skilled deep into their "tree") and normal legendaries available regardless of which tree your in. These are often % modifiers that affect you regardless of caps.

    Virtues are something else. They are fixed amounts of stats, which means they do not scale at all and are counted towards caps not ontop of them. For example if your a tank and you are already at the 50% mitigation limit of armor due to your awesome gear than slotting a +armor virtues does exactly nothing for you. These are not % modifiers, they are static like your racial starting attributes in WoW.

    Deeds are simply the term for stuff you need to do to get some sort of achievement. This can be a title, a virtue or a trait. Titles and virtues are deeds related to the world around you regardless of your level, i.e. killing goblins in Ered Luin or visiting ruins in bree. Traits are deeds related to yourself and limited by level, i.e. using your ability x y amount of times regardless of where you are. Since you can hardly level up without using your abilities this is a nonissue.

  • UW1975UW1975 Member Posts: 183

    Originally posted by trancejeremy

    A Sure, if you pick the right ones, you can basically get up to 2000 melee defense. That's like carrying an extra heavy shield. That doesn't matter? Right, right.

    Virtues do matter, but here honestly you are mixing two things. NO virtues  gives you 2000 Armor, (max is +450 Empathy) So it is no way as having another heavy shield, especially for a tank class.You probably are mixing the +2000 Resistance rating of certain virtues, which can be effective, but not that much.

    This being said, Virtues can be a grind, but there are tons of ways to get them. I like them as it gives a meaning also for high level characters to go back to lower zones and it gives a reason to help low level kinnies.

    It is a nice achievement, but as for many aspects of LOTRO, it is important to tackle them in the right way.

  • jaxsundanejaxsundane Member Posts: 2,776

    Originally posted by Rockgod99

    I love deeds, the entire mechanic is like a throwback to the old mob hunting days. Honestly it's my favorite feature, when I enter a area I can't wait to stumble on more deeds, I explore everything, kill everything and hunt for every single quest giver. I think it's genius how the system is tied to everything an how it gives players incentive to do everything. However some people don't like it. Some people consider it an annoying, boring grind that your forced to do for traits. So what do you think of the deeds system?

     I think of the deed system as more good than bad but can admit when it comes down to having to do a deed you just feel like you need and you are far off from the goal it can be kind of a chore. 

    In general though the game does a good job of pacing you through many of them until the later stages of the game when I admittedly don't worry about most of them myself.  What I noticed is many of the later slayer deeds (which is when they really start to annoy) are often attached to traits I don't consider to be critical and rarely use so I have a habit of not worrying about them, luckily the it seems alot of the more universal traits are opened up with simply traits like the quest completion deeds and such.

    I can't state enough that if you are trying to do them simply to gain access to the traits and are unlucky enough it can seem a pretty lame grind but even that sometimes can be alleviated, like with racial traits I will sometimes quest until I am able to access say Emnity of the wargs II then I'll head back to lone lands and sweep through the area near the Forsaken Inn usually takes thirty minutes. 

    but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 41,541

    Originally posted by Rockgod99

    I love deeds, the entire mechanic is like a throwback to the old mob hunting days. Honestly it's my favorite feature, when I enter a area I can't wait to stumble on more deeds, I explore everything, kill everything and hunt for every single quest giver. I think it's genius how the system is tied to everything an how it gives players incentive to do everything. However some people don't like it. Some people consider it an annoying, boring grind that your forced to do for traits. So what do you think of the deeds system?

    This would be me.  A heroic adventurer like myself does not need a time out to kill 250 goblins or whatever.

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  • bansanbansan Member Posts: 367

    Originally posted by Rockgod99

    I love deeds, the entire mechanic is like a throwback to the old mob hunting days. Honestly it's my favorite feature, when I enter a area I can't wait to stumble on more deeds, I explore everything, kill everything and hunt for every single quest giver. I think it's genius how the system is tied to everything an how it gives players incentive to do everything. However some people don't like it. Some people consider it an annoying, boring grind that your forced to do for traits. So what do you think of the deeds system?

    I'm a 2fer or 3fer sort of person.  When I find those deeds that coincide with 1 or 2 quests, plus you get a title, plus you get trait upgrades, PLUS you get turbine points...I get high.  It's wonderful when all the stars align and I get 2 or 3 things done at the same time.

    With that said, getting to the higher areas where you have to kill more than 400 mobs for a deed, I can feel the grind.  I just move on if I feel that.

  • jaxsundanejaxsundane Member Posts: 2,776

    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    Originally posted by Rocketeer

    Originally posted by SuperXero89

    I don't understand the concept of the deed system.  Seems exactly like WoW's talent trees yet instead of getting points to put into a tree every time you level, you're forced to grind hundreds of the same mobs until you finish a deed to get the trait.

    They are nothing like WoWs talent trees at all, because they do not affect your talents/abilities. They are alot like the WoW achievement system, just with rewards(and you get virtues for them, not traits). The thing similar to WoWs talent trees are the traits(which you get by using one of your skills x amount of times), and the thing similar to glyphs are the legendary weapons(which are more random and grindy, but also more powerful).

    So the deeds themselves are nothing like the talent trees, but the rewards are. Deeds/traits whatever you want to call them, I think it's a needless grind. Not sure why Turbine didn't decide to include simple talent trees instead of making you kill 300 orcs for +3 intelligence or making you use your quick shot skill 900 times for increased damage.

    It would have been one thing if these rewards were merely optional, making them nice bonuses for completing certain tasks, but as usually when you adopt a system like this, the min/maxers of the community make such things absolutely essential for the progression of your character.

     In all honesty though this is not a very big problem at all in LOTRO, I've never seen anyone left out simply because they didn't have the right virtues in play, now I will admit that if you have a particular class trait set up then you may find people unwilling to group with you for the really high level stuff but even that isn't something I have seen alot of, people in LOTRO seem to worry alot more about whether you have radiance gear or not (if they haven't changed it yet).

    I think LOTRO virtue/trait system is light years ahead of WOW's talent trees, as a matter of fact it was one of the things that once I got used to it it became impossible for me to play WOW because it was so simplistic.

    but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 30,966

    Originally posted by Kyleran

    Originally posted by Rockgod99

    I love deeds, the entire mechanic is like a throwback to the old mob hunting days. Honestly it's my favorite feature, when I enter a area I can't wait to stumble on more deeds, I explore everything, kill everything and hunt for every single quest giver. I think it's genius how the system is tied to everything an how it gives players incentive to do everything. However some people don't like it. Some people consider it an annoying, boring grind that your forced to do for traits. So what do you think of the deeds system?

    This would be me.  A heroic adventurer like myself does not need a time out to kill 250 goblins or whatever.

    You see, that's not the way I look at it. Being a heroic adventurer "and all" as well.

    The way I look at it is:

    "Lucille, God gave me a gift. I kill goblins well. I kill goblins very well."

    And I would then proceed to march my way across whatever camp, town, dungeon, field, bar, etc, where there are goblins and obliterate each and every one in the name of all that was good in middle earth.

    Reason being ...

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  • just2duhjust2duh Member Posts: 1,290

     Hi, I am a deed hunter, is there some sort of support group for such a thing? lol

     But really, I see them more as a reason to go out and explore the world.

     I've spent most of my time playing just going around exploring all the different areas, taking in the scenery, and of course killing stuff along the way to keep safe :P Just doing that has earned me a lot of deeds and more TP than I require (at current level anyways), it first just started as me simply checking out the world, but it's become my main focus whenever I do get around to playing it now.

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