Putting Superman into a tier tree, is taking the Super out of him.
I don't care about that. I care about making my character like regular Superman and not ICE SUPERMAN!
The bottom line is that characters have to be balanced, so there will be limits in what you can create. Many superheroes have varying levels of super strength, that's why they put it in the iconic power pool so that anyone can select it. It doesn't come close to making for a separate set of it's own. There is no way that they would make any players in an MMO invulnerable. It would be too unbalanced. I think they chose Ice because it offered ice breath and maybe some armor and fire resistance ability. Everything else could be from the Iconic Powers pool and weapons abilities.
I think you are blowing it way out of proportion. They didn't make him "Ice Superman". It's just game mechanics. We have seen many videos of Superman, in game, and not once was he covered in ice. You should probably wait until you see it in game before you make a big fuss. They simply stated that they felt that he best fit into that category. Super Strength was already in the Iconic pool, as was the eye lasers...and who knows what else. They felt that Ice was the best choice for the rest.
Originally posted by skullkid128
I know that, but how can there not be a "strong and tough" set? Are there a bunch of strong and tough powers in the other tree? What if I want to make a dude like Hulk? He doesn't have ice powers.
Because, strong and tough don't make for a set. I think you are stuck in a CoH mindframe. Those are just 2 abilities, and Super Strength is already part of the Iconic Powers pool. For all I know, Tough could be too. This isn't City of Heroes, where your power set controls your attack moves. Different attacks would already come from your weapon choice, most likely Brawling. There's nothing to base a separate " strength" set around. Besides, The Hulk doesn't have Ice Breath, Superman does. Another set may work better for the hulk. Keep in mind that you don't have to buy a bunch of ice powers. You can spend all your points on Iconic powers, and weapon abilites. Also keep in mind that you spend points to upgrade powers, not just buy new ones. You can spread them out over many options or beef up a smaller set of abilities.
From everything I have seen, there is a far greater ability to customize your character than what you can do in CoH, or CO. It's pointless to discuss the rationality behind them choosing Ice. We have no idea what powers that they actually use from the Ice set.
Using the fire set won't get you any closer to being superman unless they have an iconic Ice Breath power, in that situation it could go either way as long as one of the fire powers is heat beams.
If you truly wanted to be more of a superman character, you'd only use the ice breath power, the heat vision power, and the powers that go along with the flight power pool. The rest would be handled around the combo system and using your strength to utilize the environment around you. It makes sense to me.
My point is that Superman has far more flexibility with his other powers than his ice breath. It's crazy to make him an Ice guy. To me that signals a certainly lack of options in the power system (and they keep saying they'll have to release certain power sets after launch, which seems to confirm that).
Given how close it is to launch, how there isn't much information out there when you think about it, and how they make these bonehead power decisions (likely because they are rushed), I don't think the game is going to be that polished. It isn't that I won't be able to make a Superman analogue, it is that the bizarre Superman decision they've made is just another data point indicating things aren't looking that good.
And all this talk about OH it's SO overpowered ot have this or that Well riddle me this then if Superman is the end all beat all and Wonder Woman is right behind him how come they got the complete HELL beat outta them in the cinematic? *slaps the devs around with a wet stinky trout* Use your imagination and stop trying to place DC Superheroes in a particular category when they're mixed breeds
Pretty clear you've watched Superman Returns and the Lynda Carter Wonder Woman series from the 70s and now consider yourself an expert on the subject.
1) Wonder Woman is absolutely nowhere near Superman in both Strength, Speed, and Invulnerability (she isn't for starters, a missile absolutely could kill her). She also doesn't have heat vision, freeze breath, or pretty much anything else Supes does. Supes could crush her like an insect if he was so inclined. Hell in her new origins bullets can kill her if she doesn't deflect them. So her loosing to Lex in a battlesuit is not totally out of the question.
2) To make Superman weak they used the same old copout since the beginning...Kryptonite.
So ya, take it from somebody that actually reads the DC Comics when I say stop pretending that you do. You could never balance a game around Superman. He's the Mary Sue of the comics universe. In fact every Superman game I've played (which is all of them) has had him be completely and utterly depowered from where he normally is in the DC Universe. That's the ONLY way he works.
So ya, take it from somebody that actually reads the DC Comics when I say stop pretending that you do. You could never balance a game around Superman. He's the Mary Sue of the comics universe. In fact every Superman game I've played (which is all of them) has had him be completely and utterly depowered from where he normally is in the DC Universe. That's the ONLY way he works.
Some of the best Superman stories focus on ethical questions and/or the fact he can't be everywhere at once. It would be easy enough to apply some of these concepts to a game (with some equally powered enemies here and there). Heck, part of the reason Superman takes a big beating half the time is that he has to be very careful so he doesn't hurt anyone...hmm...THAT would be a pretty interesting basis for a Superman game, I think.
I thought the baseline story for the game was that brainiac was siphoning off the primary DC characters super powers/exabytes/midichlorians or whatever and Luthor somehow spread them over the world. That is how the players are getting their super powers.
It doesn't explain how the ice power set best represents superman, but it could explain diminished powers of the primary heroes.
Using the fire set won't get you any closer to being superman unless they have an iconic Ice Breath power, in that situation it could go either way as long as one of the fire powers is heat beams.
If you truly wanted to be more of a superman character, you'd only use the ice breath power, the heat vision power, and the powers that go along with the flight power pool. The rest would be handled around the combo system and using your strength to utilize the environment around you. It makes sense to me.
My point is that Superman has far more flexibility with his other powers than his ice breath. It's crazy to make him an Ice guy. To me that signals a certainly lack of options in the power system (and they keep saying they'll have to release certain power sets after launch, which seems to confirm that).
Given how close it is to launch, how there isn't much information out there when you think about it, and how they make these bonehead power decisions (likely because they are rushed), I don't think the game is going to be that polished. It isn't that I won't be able to make a Superman analogue, it is that the bizarre Superman decision they've made is just another data point indicating things aren't looking that good.
I don't really see it that way. First, you get 8 powers only, not other action bars, and you are only allowed a single iconic power on your action bar. That sounds like a decent way to balance out the power sets, but no you won't have the ultimate amount of flexibility with your powers because there will always be something you choose not to do in favor of something else. Cutting out some powers doesn't really bother me. Look at CO and CoH, both of them have added powers after launch. With CO they had tons of powers on launch, but they were all the same, even some of the ones in the same power pool were the same. Its not all about the variety but the quality.
I don't know what information they haven't released yet. I have a good grasp on what the game entails. I've seen the combat, I know the power list, I know what the world is like, some of the alerts, and the PvP options. I'll most likely be in beta by the end of the month, so I'll have a good chance to test it and help them squash the rest of those bugs.
The superman decision doesn't seem like that big of a deal to me in the scope of things. People were making superman characters on CoH and they didn't get even remotely close to the same power set. They would be a melee and invulnerability tanker which was very limited if you were trying to be superman. In CO you could make more of a superman character, but again, the range of powers that would go along with it aren't varied enough so that everything you do would be considered a supermanesque power.
I haven't read everything everyone has wrote but I thought I'd give my input. It is a balance issue on the technical side of things, Superman has 2(3 if you count leaping) travel powers. He also is invlunerable, super strong, heat vision, ice breath, even sometimes has a super kiss of hypnotisim.. Anyways imagine a world where everyone could do all of that from the start.. it would make the game totally unbalanced. It is just like them not letting people be a Green Lantern or the Spectre.. etc It is a balance issue.
I saw someone write you don't mess with the JLA member's power sets. They aren't messing with their power sets. Batman, Wonder Woman, Superman, GL, Martian Manhunter, Firestorm, Green Arrow, Black Canary, Hawkman, Zatanna, etc etc etc.... as NPCs still have all of their powers. They still have all of their abilities. You don't.. you aren't them..
From a storyline perspective we don't need several 100 kryptonians running around, it is nice for Clark and Kara and Kara (E2) being the only ones around, it gives them an unique quality. Maybe later on they will offer alien races where you can be a Thanagarian, Daxamite, Kryptonian, what ever.. Right now that isn't the case, just like they said they may do a space based expansion that would allow for a character to get a GL ring for a limited time or even do a special month long even where stuff is happening and every hero gets a ring for all month.
Anyways I am tired of people complaining about how they can't be a clone of this hero or that hero, you aren't suppose to be those heroes, be your own hero.. be your own character...
My point is that Superman has far more flexibility with his other powers than his ice breath. It's crazy to make him an Ice guy. To me that signals a certainly lack of options in the power system (and they keep saying they'll have to release certain power sets after launch, which seems to confirm that).
Given how close it is to launch, how there isn't much information out there when you think about it, and how they make these bonehead power decisions (likely because they are rushed), I don't think the game is going to be that polished. It isn't that I won't be able to make a Superman analogue, it is that the bizarre Superman decision they've made is just another data point indicating things aren't looking that good.
Explain to us how that, in any way, indicates a lack of options in the power system. You acknowledge having little information on the game, but jump to wild speculation on the meaning of a single design decision. You have no idea how the system works. The fact is, they have other sets to select powers from other than just the power set. You have no idea what powers they actually use from any of the other sets, or what powers are available in them. He could only be using only one or two abilities from ice and the rest are coming from the Iconic Set or the Weapon set. I think that actually indicates greater options, not fewer. You aren't locked into certain abilites just because you pick a certain power set.
Superman doesn't have a set. He has assorted abilities. He is super strong, he is tough, he flies, he has x-ray vision and eye lasers and a frost breath. There is nothing there to create a sparate set, but that stuff is covered in other sets. Mostly the Iconic set, which makes sense, since he's an iconic character.
Btw, there is TONS of information out there, you just have to look for it. There are hours and hours of video, and a bunch of demo write ups.
I am in closed beta now and I am not sure if NDA has lifted or not so I am not going to go into much detail. But the reason you cant be Superman is because there is a Superman.
If you watch the trailer of the game Lex Luther kills the Justice League in the near future, including Superman. When this happens Braniac makes his move to take over the planet and captures Lex. Lex eventually escapes bringing with him these bug like things (forget the name) that he stole from braniac. Lex time travels to the past to warn justice league of what may happen if they dont react. At the same time, Lex releases those bug like things, almost like nanobites, into the earths atmosphere. When they come in contact with a human being they gain super powers. Now thats the start of the story...
Now for where you come in. You choose to be a villain or Hero, then you choose your mentor. Your mentor, whether hes/she is Superman, Lex, or one of the other icons will be your boss and will lead you through the main story line. For your powers because you cant be Superman (let me emphasize again, Hes your boss and can only have one Superman for story/Lore purposes), you get as your main ability type, Brawling. Its the first skill tree you get access to. Since Superman fights mostly with his hands and his powers second that makes sense. Now the ice is your secondary power you get, however I should mention you dont have to stick with that. You can go into the customization and choose another power type while creating your character. I chose Fire. There is other powers you can choose but I dont have the game open in front of me to list them. Levels 1-9 you will be focusing on adding skill/power points into the first two trees as you gain through leveling. This can give you things like grappling, knock backs, super sonic flight (you get basic flight at lvl 1 unless you chose different travel power), and much more. Level 10 is when you start gaining points for the iconic powers.
So yes, you cant be Superman or Lex, you arent met too. But, you are part of his team in helping him take out Braniac and all the other baddies out there. i hope that clears a little of why you cant make an exact copy of your favorite Super Hero or Villain.
Explain to us how that, in any way, indicates a lack of options in the power system. You acknowledge having little information on the game, but jump to wild speculation on the meaning of a single design decision. You have no idea how the system works. The fact is, they have other sets to select powers from other than just the power set. You have no idea what powers they actually use from any of the other sets, or what powers are available in them. He could only be using only one or two abilities from ice and the rest are coming from the Iconic Set or the Weapon set. I think that actually indicates greater options, not fewer. You aren't locked into certain abilites just because you pick a certain power set.
Superman doesn't have a set. He has assorted abilities. He is super strong, he is tough, he flies, he has x-ray vision and eye lasers and a frost breath. There is nothing there to create a sparate set, but that stuff is covered in other sets. Mostly the Iconic set, which makes sense, since he's an iconic character.
Btw, there is TONS of information out there, you just have to look for it. There are hours and hours of video, and a bunch of demo write ups.
Yeah, they implement Superman in a ridiculous way, making him an ice-based character, then they also don't really release much information about the game means something is wrong with me.
And no, there's NOT much information out there. There are bits and pieces here and there, but when you get down to it, not a lot of info. They didn't have much info out there when we thought the game was a month or less from release, and they haven't shown much more since they delayed the game. Bleh, times like this, it is obvious why Warhammer, STO, and AoC had so many box sales.
Using the fire set won't get you any closer to being superman unless they have an iconic Ice Breath power, in that situation it could go either way as long as one of the fire powers is heat beams.
If you truly wanted to be more of a superman character, you'd only use the ice breath power, the heat vision power, and the powers that go along with the flight power pool. The rest would be handled around the combo system and using your strength to utilize the environment around you. It makes sense to me.
My point is that Superman has far more flexibility with his other powers than his ice breath. It's crazy to make him an Ice guy. To me that signals a certainly lack of options in the power system (and they keep saying they'll have to release certain power sets after launch, which seems to confirm that).
Given how close it is to launch, how there isn't much information out there when you think about it, and how they make these bonehead power decisions (likely because they are rushed), I don't think the game is going to be that polished. It isn't that I won't be able to make a Superman analogue, it is that the bizarre Superman decision they've made is just another data point indicating things aren't looking that good.
I don't really see it that way. First, you get 8 powers only, not other action bars, and you are only allowed a single iconic power on your action bar. That sounds like a decent way to balance out the power sets, but no you won't have the ultimate amount of flexibility with your powers because there will always be something you choose not to do in favor of something else. Cutting out some powers doesn't really bother me. Look at CO and CoH, both of them have added powers after launch. With CO they had tons of powers on launch, but they were all the same, even some of the ones in the same power pool were the same. Its not all about the variety but the quality.
I don't know what information they haven't released yet. I have a good grasp on what the game entails. I've seen the combat, I know the power list, I know what the world is like, some of the alerts, and the PvP options. I'll most likely be in beta by the end of the month, so I'll have a good chance to test it and help them squash the rest of those bugs.
The superman decision doesn't seem like that big of a deal to me in the scope of things. People were making superman characters on CoH and they didn't get even remotely close to the same power set. They would be a melee and invulnerability tanker which was very limited if you were trying to be superman. In CO you could make more of a superman character, but again, the range of powers that would go along with it aren't varied enough so that everything you do would be considered a supermanesque power.
Superman, while more versatile than many DC characters is still pretty one dimesional, aside fire eyebeam and frost breath he is basically a superstrong brawler with a lot of defense.
NDA has not been lifted so I'll be very brief ... never judge a book by its cover. There may not be a ton of info out there about the overall dynamics of the game, but what this game has to offer is very appealing on a customization level. Anyone in beta would easily agree with me. As for your super man concerns .. you can get very close, and you dont have to spend skill points on the ice power set, unless there is a power you want in that set and have to follow the tree line down to get it, but even then you dont have to load any power into your action bar that you don't see as a fit into what you have envisioned for your toon.
With all these other MMO's "Extremely Overhyping" there game, I think when this game is finally released you'll come to appreciate the phrase ~ "Sometimes less is more."
NDA has not been lifted so I'll be very brief ... never judge a book by its cover. There may not be a ton of info out there about the overall dynamics of the game, but what this game has to offer is very appealing on a customization level. Anyone in beta would easily agree with me.
Sounds like what people said about STO more or less.
NDA has not been lifted so I'll be very brief ... never judge a book by its cover. There may not be a ton of info out there about the overall dynamics of the game, but what this game has to offer is very appealing on a customization level. Anyone in beta would easily agree with me.
Sounds like what people said about STO more or less.
Unlike the STO beta, DCUO is actually fun. And that's all that matters in the end.
NDA has not been lifted so I'll be very brief ... never judge a book by its cover. There may not be a ton of info out there about the overall dynamics of the game, but what this game has to offer is very appealing on a customization level. Anyone in beta would easily agree with me.
Sounds like what people said about STO more or less.
Unlike the STO beta, DCUO is actually fun. And that's all that matters in the end.
Tons of people were saying that about the STO beta, so I'm maintaining my skepticism.
NDA has not been lifted so I'll be very brief ... never judge a book by its cover. There may not be a ton of info out there about the overall dynamics of the game, but what this game has to offer is very appealing on a customization level. Anyone in beta would easily agree with me.
Sounds like what people said about STO more or less.
Unlike the STO beta, DCUO is actually fun. And that's all that matters in the end.
Tons of people were saying that about the STO beta, so I'm maintaining my skepticism.
But then again thats like comparing apples to oranges. Two different IPs. But I do understand being cautious since most of the recent mmos that released the past couple years have not been that good. But I can tell you since I am in beta, and if you are a fan of DC or just a fan of super heroes period, there is some fun to be had. Lets hope the fun factor is still there by Feb 2011 when they release.
NDA has not been lifted so I'll be very brief ... never judge a book by its cover. There may not be a ton of info out there about the overall dynamics of the game, but what this game has to offer is very appealing on a customization level. Anyone in beta would easily agree with me.
Sounds like what people said about STO more or less.
Unlike the STO beta, DCUO is actually fun. And that's all that matters in the end.
Tons of people were saying that about the STO beta, so I'm maintaining my skepticism.
But then again thats like comparing apples to oranges. Two different IPs. But I do understand being cautious since most of the recent mmos that released the past couple years have not been that good. But I can tell you since I am in beta, and if you are a fan of DC or just a fan of super heroes period, there is some fun to be had. Lets hope the fun factor is still there by Feb 2011 when they release.
The IP is irrelevent. It's about hype, information release, and how even bad games can seem good with limited exposure (and of course even awful games have their fans)*.
*To a point, I don't think anyone liked Superman "64" for instance.
NDA has not been lifted so I'll be very brief ... never judge a book by its cover. There may not be a ton of info out there about the overall dynamics of the game, but what this game has to offer is very appealing on a customization level. Anyone in beta would easily agree with me.
Sounds like what people said about STO more or less.
Unlike the STO beta, DCUO is actually fun. And that's all that matters in the end.
Tons of people were saying that about the STO beta, so I'm maintaining my skepticism.
I all remember from the STO beta and launch discussion was a lot of lukewarm comments. I don't remember people saying fun or sounding excited about it. My friend gave me that "Eh..." face when I asked how beta was going for him /shrug.
NDA has not been lifted so I'll be very brief ... never judge a book by its cover. There may not be a ton of info out there about the overall dynamics of the game, but what this game has to offer is very appealing on a customization level. Anyone in beta would easily agree with me.
Sounds like what people said about STO more or less.
Unlike the STO beta, DCUO is actually fun. And that's all that matters in the end.
Tons of people were saying that about the STO beta, so I'm maintaining my skepticism.
I all remember from the STO beta and launch discussion was a lot of lukewarm comments. I don't remember people saying fun or sounding excited about it. My friend gave me that "Eh..." face when I asked how beta was going for him /shrug.
That's not how it was on these forums. I was there. There were many very vocal supporters of the game.
NDA has not been lifted so I'll be very brief ... never judge a book by its cover. There may not be a ton of info out there about the overall dynamics of the game, but what this game has to offer is very appealing on a customization level. Anyone in beta would easily agree with me.
Sounds like what people said about STO more or less.
Unlike the STO beta, DCUO is actually fun. And that's all that matters in the end.
Tons of people were saying that about the STO beta, so I'm maintaining my skepticism.
I all remember from the STO beta and launch discussion was a lot of lukewarm comments. I don't remember people saying fun or sounding excited about it. My friend gave me that "Eh..." face when I asked how beta was going for him /shrug.
That's not how it was on these forums. I was there. There were many very vocal supporters of the game.
I only ever come here to tread the NDA line and read the typical MMORPG posts to amuse myself. MMORPG forum goers are not known for their uhhhh....subjective views.
Plus, it's Star Trek . A MMO of one of the biggest, longest, oldest IP franchise in the media world. It should be a given that no matter where you went, there would be a handful sounding too ecstatic about the game. Star Trek fans...they really are everywhere you know.
NDA has not been lifted so I'll be very brief ... never judge a book by its cover. There may not be a ton of info out there about the overall dynamics of the game, but what this game has to offer is very appealing on a customization level. Anyone in beta would easily agree with me.
Sounds like what people said about STO more or less.
Unlike the STO beta, DCUO is actually fun. And that's all that matters in the end.
Tons of people were saying that about the STO beta, so I'm maintaining my skepticism.
I all remember from the STO beta and launch discussion was a lot of lukewarm comments. I don't remember people saying fun or sounding excited about it. My friend gave me that "Eh..." face when I asked how beta was going for him /shrug.
That's not how it was on these forums. I was there. There were many very vocal supporters of the game.
I only ever come here to tread the NDA line and read the typical MMORPG posts to amuse myself. MMORPG forum goers are not known for their uhhhh....subjective views.
Plus, it's Star Trek . A MMO of one of the biggest, longest, oldest IP franchise in the media world. It should be a given that no matter where you went, there would be a handful sounding too ecstatic about the game. Star Trek fans...they really are everywhere you know.
You do realize that Superman (and hence the DCU) is even older with a larger fanbase, right? He's perhaps the most recognizable figure whether fictional or not worldwide.
You do realize that Superman (and hence the DCU) is even older with a larger fanbase, right? He's perhaps the most recognizable figure whether fictional or not worldwide.
Well, I suppose that is arguable.
But I still stand by my initial position. Treading the NDA line once again...DCUO is just a much more fun game to play overall. What I've noticed from comments here and various other boards is one very similar word used every other post...
The only thing I will say is if you like MMORPG's then try it before you buy it so you will know what you are getting. It's an action game, not an MMORPG. That's not a bad thing, just know what you are getting.
"You have interesting cases like Superman," Cao explained, "where beyond his immunity to everything, the heat vision and the cold breath and the superstrength, and the flight, how do you translate that?" The answer is they don't. "We don't one-for-one translate that because we have the game systems involved, but we do make him an ice-based character, because then he's able to freeze things." Superman's heat vision appears as an "iconic" power, which players can earn over time. It's also included with the Superman character playable in a certain mode. The "real" DC heroes and villains can also be seen wandering the world, and frequently pairing up with players in missions.
What the heck? Ice-based character? There's not a super-strength or invulnerability set? What?
Comments
The bottom line is that characters have to be balanced, so there will be limits in what you can create. Many superheroes have varying levels of super strength, that's why they put it in the iconic power pool so that anyone can select it. It doesn't come close to making for a separate set of it's own. There is no way that they would make any players in an MMO invulnerable. It would be too unbalanced. I think they chose Ice because it offered ice breath and maybe some armor and fire resistance ability. Everything else could be from the Iconic Powers pool and weapons abilities.
I think you are blowing it way out of proportion. They didn't make him "Ice Superman". It's just game mechanics. We have seen many videos of Superman, in game, and not once was he covered in ice. You should probably wait until you see it in game before you make a big fuss. They simply stated that they felt that he best fit into that category. Super Strength was already in the Iconic pool, as was the eye lasers...and who knows what else. They felt that Ice was the best choice for the rest.
Because, strong and tough don't make for a set. I think you are stuck in a CoH mindframe. Those are just 2 abilities, and Super Strength is already part of the Iconic Powers pool. For all I know, Tough could be too. This isn't City of Heroes, where your power set controls your attack moves. Different attacks would already come from your weapon choice, most likely Brawling. There's nothing to base a separate " strength" set around. Besides, The Hulk doesn't have Ice Breath, Superman does. Another set may work better for the hulk. Keep in mind that you don't have to buy a bunch of ice powers. You can spend all your points on Iconic powers, and weapon abilites. Also keep in mind that you spend points to upgrade powers, not just buy new ones. You can spread them out over many options or beef up a smaller set of abilities.
From everything I have seen, there is a far greater ability to customize your character than what you can do in CoH, or CO. It's pointless to discuss the rationality behind them choosing Ice. We have no idea what powers that they actually use from the Ice set.
My point is that Superman has far more flexibility with his other powers than his ice breath. It's crazy to make him an Ice guy. To me that signals a certainly lack of options in the power system (and they keep saying they'll have to release certain power sets after launch, which seems to confirm that).
Given how close it is to launch, how there isn't much information out there when you think about it, and how they make these bonehead power decisions (likely because they are rushed), I don't think the game is going to be that polished. It isn't that I won't be able to make a Superman analogue, it is that the bizarre Superman decision they've made is just another data point indicating things aren't looking that good.
Pretty clear you've watched Superman Returns and the Lynda Carter Wonder Woman series from the 70s and now consider yourself an expert on the subject.
1) Wonder Woman is absolutely nowhere near Superman in both Strength, Speed, and Invulnerability (she isn't for starters, a missile absolutely could kill her). She also doesn't have heat vision, freeze breath, or pretty much anything else Supes does. Supes could crush her like an insect if he was so inclined. Hell in her new origins bullets can kill her if she doesn't deflect them. So her loosing to Lex in a battlesuit is not totally out of the question.
2) To make Superman weak they used the same old copout since the beginning...Kryptonite.
So ya, take it from somebody that actually reads the DC Comics when I say stop pretending that you do. You could never balance a game around Superman. He's the Mary Sue of the comics universe. In fact every Superman game I've played (which is all of them) has had him be completely and utterly depowered from where he normally is in the DC Universe. That's the ONLY way he works.
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Some of the best Superman stories focus on ethical questions and/or the fact he can't be everywhere at once. It would be easy enough to apply some of these concepts to a game (with some equally powered enemies here and there). Heck, part of the reason Superman takes a big beating half the time is that he has to be very careful so he doesn't hurt anyone...hmm...THAT would be a pretty interesting basis for a Superman game, I think.
I thought the baseline story for the game was that brainiac was siphoning off the primary DC characters super powers/exabytes/midichlorians or whatever and Luthor somehow spread them over the world. That is how the players are getting their super powers.
It doesn't explain how the ice power set best represents superman, but it could explain diminished powers of the primary heroes.
I don't really see it that way. First, you get 8 powers only, not other action bars, and you are only allowed a single iconic power on your action bar. That sounds like a decent way to balance out the power sets, but no you won't have the ultimate amount of flexibility with your powers because there will always be something you choose not to do in favor of something else. Cutting out some powers doesn't really bother me. Look at CO and CoH, both of them have added powers after launch. With CO they had tons of powers on launch, but they were all the same, even some of the ones in the same power pool were the same. Its not all about the variety but the quality.
I don't know what information they haven't released yet. I have a good grasp on what the game entails. I've seen the combat, I know the power list, I know what the world is like, some of the alerts, and the PvP options. I'll most likely be in beta by the end of the month, so I'll have a good chance to test it and help them squash the rest of those bugs.
The superman decision doesn't seem like that big of a deal to me in the scope of things. People were making superman characters on CoH and they didn't get even remotely close to the same power set. They would be a melee and invulnerability tanker which was very limited if you were trying to be superman. In CO you could make more of a superman character, but again, the range of powers that would go along with it aren't varied enough so that everything you do would be considered a supermanesque power.
Hello,
I haven't read everything everyone has wrote but I thought I'd give my input. It is a balance issue on the technical side of things, Superman has 2(3 if you count leaping) travel powers. He also is invlunerable, super strong, heat vision, ice breath, even sometimes has a super kiss of hypnotisim.. Anyways imagine a world where everyone could do all of that from the start.. it would make the game totally unbalanced. It is just like them not letting people be a Green Lantern or the Spectre.. etc It is a balance issue.
I saw someone write you don't mess with the JLA member's power sets. They aren't messing with their power sets. Batman, Wonder Woman, Superman, GL, Martian Manhunter, Firestorm, Green Arrow, Black Canary, Hawkman, Zatanna, etc etc etc.... as NPCs still have all of their powers. They still have all of their abilities. You don't.. you aren't them..
From a storyline perspective we don't need several 100 kryptonians running around, it is nice for Clark and Kara and Kara (E2) being the only ones around, it gives them an unique quality. Maybe later on they will offer alien races where you can be a Thanagarian, Daxamite, Kryptonian, what ever.. Right now that isn't the case, just like they said they may do a space based expansion that would allow for a character to get a GL ring for a limited time or even do a special month long even where stuff is happening and every hero gets a ring for all month.
Anyways I am tired of people complaining about how they can't be a clone of this hero or that hero, you aren't suppose to be those heroes, be your own hero.. be your own character...
Explain to us how that, in any way, indicates a lack of options in the power system. You acknowledge having little information on the game, but jump to wild speculation on the meaning of a single design decision. You have no idea how the system works. The fact is, they have other sets to select powers from other than just the power set. You have no idea what powers they actually use from any of the other sets, or what powers are available in them. He could only be using only one or two abilities from ice and the rest are coming from the Iconic Set or the Weapon set. I think that actually indicates greater options, not fewer. You aren't locked into certain abilites just because you pick a certain power set.
Superman doesn't have a set. He has assorted abilities. He is super strong, he is tough, he flies, he has x-ray vision and eye lasers and a frost breath. There is nothing there to create a sparate set, but that stuff is covered in other sets. Mostly the Iconic set, which makes sense, since he's an iconic character.
Btw, there is TONS of information out there, you just have to look for it. There are hours and hours of video, and a bunch of demo write ups.
I am in closed beta now and I am not sure if NDA has lifted or not so I am not going to go into much detail. But the reason you cant be Superman is because there is a Superman.
If you watch the trailer of the game Lex Luther kills the Justice League in the near future, including Superman. When this happens Braniac makes his move to take over the planet and captures Lex. Lex eventually escapes bringing with him these bug like things (forget the name) that he stole from braniac. Lex time travels to the past to warn justice league of what may happen if they dont react. At the same time, Lex releases those bug like things, almost like nanobites, into the earths atmosphere. When they come in contact with a human being they gain super powers. Now thats the start of the story...
Now for where you come in. You choose to be a villain or Hero, then you choose your mentor. Your mentor, whether hes/she is Superman, Lex, or one of the other icons will be your boss and will lead you through the main story line. For your powers because you cant be Superman (let me emphasize again, Hes your boss and can only have one Superman for story/Lore purposes), you get as your main ability type, Brawling. Its the first skill tree you get access to. Since Superman fights mostly with his hands and his powers second that makes sense. Now the ice is your secondary power you get, however I should mention you dont have to stick with that. You can go into the customization and choose another power type while creating your character. I chose Fire. There is other powers you can choose but I dont have the game open in front of me to list them. Levels 1-9 you will be focusing on adding skill/power points into the first two trees as you gain through leveling. This can give you things like grappling, knock backs, super sonic flight (you get basic flight at lvl 1 unless you chose different travel power), and much more. Level 10 is when you start gaining points for the iconic powers.
So yes, you cant be Superman or Lex, you arent met too. But, you are part of his team in helping him take out Braniac and all the other baddies out there. i hope that clears a little of why you cant make an exact copy of your favorite Super Hero or Villain.
Yeah, they implement Superman in a ridiculous way, making him an ice-based character, then they also don't really release much information about the game means something is wrong with me.
And no, there's NOT much information out there. There are bits and pieces here and there, but when you get down to it, not a lot of info. They didn't have much info out there when we thought the game was a month or less from release, and they haven't shown much more since they delayed the game. Bleh, times like this, it is obvious why Warhammer, STO, and AoC had so many box sales.
Superman, while more versatile than many DC characters is still pretty one dimesional, aside fire eyebeam and frost breath he is basically a superstrong brawler with a lot of defense.
NDA has not been lifted so I'll be very brief ... never judge a book by its cover. There may not be a ton of info out there about the overall dynamics of the game, but what this game has to offer is very appealing on a customization level. Anyone in beta would easily agree with me. As for your super man concerns .. you can get very close, and you dont have to spend skill points on the ice power set, unless there is a power you want in that set and have to follow the tree line down to get it, but even then you dont have to load any power into your action bar that you don't see as a fit into what you have envisioned for your toon.
With all these other MMO's "Extremely Overhyping" there game, I think when this game is finally released you'll come to appreciate the phrase ~ "Sometimes less is more."
Sounds like what people said about STO more or less.
Unlike the STO beta, DCUO is actually fun. And that's all that matters in the end.
Tons of people were saying that about the STO beta, so I'm maintaining my skepticism.
But then again thats like comparing apples to oranges. Two different IPs. But I do understand being cautious since most of the recent mmos that released the past couple years have not been that good. But I can tell you since I am in beta, and if you are a fan of DC or just a fan of super heroes period, there is some fun to be had. Lets hope the fun factor is still there by Feb 2011 when they release.
lets hope for a xmas release suprise
The IP is irrelevent. It's about hype, information release, and how even bad games can seem good with limited exposure (and of course even awful games have their fans)*.
*To a point, I don't think anyone liked Superman "64" for instance.
I all remember from the STO beta and launch discussion was a lot of lukewarm comments. I don't remember people saying fun or sounding excited about it. My friend gave me that "Eh..." face when I asked how beta was going for him /shrug.
That's not how it was on these forums. I was there. There were many very vocal supporters of the game.
I only ever come here to tread the NDA line and read the typical MMORPG posts to amuse myself. MMORPG forum goers are not known for their uhhhh....subjective views.
Plus, it's Star Trek . A MMO of one of the biggest, longest, oldest IP franchise in the media world. It should be a given that no matter where you went, there would be a handful sounding too ecstatic about the game. Star Trek fans...they really are everywhere you know.
You do realize that Superman (and hence the DCU) is even older with a larger fanbase, right? He's perhaps the most recognizable figure whether fictional or not worldwide.
Well, I suppose that is arguable.
But I still stand by my initial position. Treading the NDA line once again...DCUO is just a much more fun game to play overall. What I've noticed from comments here and various other boards is one very similar word used every other post...
Fun.
The only thing I will say is if you like MMORPG's then try it before you buy it so you will know what you are getting. It's an action game, not an MMORPG. That's not a bad thing, just know what you are getting.
aw....