I bunny hop, and I'm even more likely to do it around people whom I know it irritates and in games full of people who look down on it.
Seriously, lighten up people.
After watching the video, that sort of thing "does" annoy me in PvP. I mean, we're playing MMORPGs not Unreal Tournament. Winning a battle should mean you know how to play your class and have better equipment more than it should mean you make your character impossible to hit.
I think you hit the point on the head here. PvP in MMO's is a joke. There is no skill in the "you win because you have the shiny weapon" scenario. They put PvP in MMO's so they can tack on the catchphrase "PvP" on the box, not because it's actually a sport. Unreal Tourney was fun because it set up each team with the same chance to win and took skill and planning to beat your opponent.
What makes it worse is with item shops they now sell the advantage in a convenient micropayment. That sounds like tons O' fun. No.
Jumping is an important part of a games immersion and can be abused like anything else in a game. The same as camping out and "farming" a rare drop is ridiculous to gain an advantage in PvP but tons of people find that behavior acceptable as well for some reason.
PVP in MMOS. Or we just talking WoW?. WoW is a Gear Over Skill game. As for comparing something like... Dark age of Camelot. It is more based on Skill. Gear helps a lot, but skill is the main motive.
Anyway. in most cases. Gear is skill?. Or just someone who knows how to listen to directions in PVE.
Bunny hopping to me is unrealistic, would you in real life bounce your way around in a dangerous area? No, because you'd be too tired if/when you do encounter something nasty to do anything about it and you'd probably have knackered knees/ankles to boot, and you'd probably attract the attention of something you didn't actually want to meet, or a good sniper would time your hops and headshot you.
For me it reduces the immersion watching an unrealistic mechanic being used because it gives an "advantage" in pvp. Just because our characters are all energiser bunnies with no fatigue doesn't make it right, now if it was explainable with "magic boots of hopping like a frog" i might be able to accept it, as long as that's all the movement that could be done while wearing the boots.
Edit: apologies, it was paragraphed but it seems to have lost some of the formatting.
I don't mind bunny hopping in MMOs, but I hate it in FPSs. I don't hate that people do it so much as I hate the crowd that thinks it's the greatest skill you can have and if you strafe and use a machine gun you are just 'spraying and praying'. If people would learn to play 'the right way', and I hate saying that because there is no real 'right way', but still, if people would play the game and take the time to develop actual skills they wouldn't need to rely on a gimmic move like bunny hopping.
Not even gonna read through the replies on this post.
My answer is: who the fuck cares? To people that do: are you really so much of a nerd that you feel bunny hopping around in MMO's hinders your quality of play? That it doesn't "fit with the lore of the game"? Are you telling me that if those games were real life those 'people' couldn't continually jump if they wanted to?
Gah the stupidity on these forums still ceases to amaze me sometimes...
I bunny hop, and I'm even more likely to do it around people whom I know it irritates and in games full of people who look down on it.
Seriously, lighten up people.
After watching the video, that sort of thing "does" annoy me in PvP. I mean, we're playing MMORPGs not Unreal Tournament. Winning a battle should mean you know how to play your class and have better equipment more than it should mean you make your character impossible to hit.
Some people play games where classes don't exist, gear is a factor but not the only factor, and player skill is what matters more than anything. Just sayin' bro.
I sometimes bunny hop in game but I sometimes randomly do dumb shit like that in real life for a few seconds. But just imagine if in the real world people were always jumping around like in the game. I personally think it would be quite odd to see people constantly jumping around.
I sometimes bunny hop in game but I sometimes randomly do dumb shit like that in real life for a few seconds. But just imagine if in the real world people were always jumping around like in the game. I personally think it would be quite odd to see people constantly jumping around.
That simply has to do with your problem , not the bunny hoppers probolem .
That you diverse yourself enrich yourself too much in a world , thats fine .
But also dont expect all to obey and play according to your rules , you are not center of the universe.
But this also applies to the bunny hoppers .
Seriously lighten up , you are there to listen to somebody tell a story , RP a act , if you get irritated cause of strangers bunny hopping , thats your problem .
Your irritation is a case whats common nowadays , rather then correct yourself by ignoring them , or taking actions against the offenders , you rather be irritated .
Yeah I think it looks really bad to say the least. That's why I perfer games that have a more realist jump (LotRO) or no jumping at all (FFXI/GW.) It just so happens those are three of the most immersive games imo.
While I understand that it is hard to make a "realism" argument against bunny hopping while you are shooting fireballs and such, but there has to be a valid "silly" argument.
Count me in with the camp that says its just impossible to talk realism when we're talking about people shooting fireballs, getting heals, getting rezzes, running back to battle 2 minutes after death, making a horse appear from nowhere, getting speed buffs or any buffs, etc ad infinitum.
Gotta do better than that if you want me to be convinced that bunny-hopping makes a game, that is played succesfully by 7 year olds, silly.
While I understand that it is hard to make a "realism" argument against bunny hopping while you are shooting fireballs and such, but there has to be a valid "silly" argument.
Count me in with the camp that says its just impossible to talk realism when we're talking about people shooting fireballs, getting heals, getting rezzes, running back to battle 2 minutes after death, making a horse appear from nowhere, getting speed buffs or any buffs, etc ad infinitum.
Gotta do better than that if you want me to be convinced that bunny-hopping makes a game, that is played succesfully by 7 year olds, silly.
This is a failed argument though. It is not stating that bunny hopping is not unrealistic nor silly. It is attempting to use a false syllogism to make bunny hopping okay, when the logic behind the argument does not work.
Fireballs, heals, resurrection, buffs, etc... all those things that decry reality - are an accepted part of that fantasy.
The argument one would attempt to make would be about being able to carry everything around while fighting for hours on end - that breaks the reality that is not normally part of the fantasy from a literature/film aspect.
However, this falls into the simple category of adding additional wrongs does not make it right. Bunny hopping is stupid. Being able to fight hours on end is stupid. No encumbrance, fatigue, etc... are all stupid.
Does one really want to make the argument that bunny hopping is okay because there are other bad mechanics in the game? All you are doing is adding another bad mechanic... that in of itself... seems rather silly.
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
While I understand that it is hard to make a "realism" argument against bunny hopping while you are shooting fireballs and such, but there has to be a valid "silly" argument.
Count me in with the camp that says its just impossible to talk realism when we're talking about people shooting fireballs, getting heals, getting rezzes, running back to battle 2 minutes after death, making a horse appear from nowhere, getting speed buffs or any buffs, etc ad infinitum.
Gotta do better than that if you want me to be convinced that bunny-hopping makes a game, that is played succesfully by 7 year olds, silly.
This is a failed argument though. It is not stating that bunny hopping is not unrealistic nor silly. It is attempting to use a false syllogism to make bunny hopping okay, when the logic behind the argument does not work.
Fireballs, heals, resurrection, buffs, etc... all those things that decry reality - are an accepted part of that fantasy.
The argument one would attempt to make would be about being able to carry everything around while fighting for hours on end - that breaks the reality that is not normally part of the fantasy from a literature/film aspect.
However, this falls into the simple category of adding additional wrongs does not make it right. Bunny hopping is stupid. Being able to fight hours on end is stupid. No encumbrance, fatigue, etc... are all stupid.
Does one really want to make the argument that bunny hopping is okay because there are other bad mechanics in the game? All you are doing is adding another bad mechanic... that in of itself... seems rather silly.
I'll make the argument that bunny hopping is ok because my opinion is that it's a GOOD mechanic. That way me and that other guy can both base our arguments on personal opinion and everyone wins. Yay!
It does make a lot of aspects of darkfall pretty redundant if players can just bunnyhop like this. I don't have these skills, but I wouldn't want them to remove it completely, but it would be cool if you could only jump a certain number of times within a certain time period so people could bunny hop a short distance, but not 1/2 way across Agon so a mount could in theory catch up to them, but they could still make quick escapes to heal or hide.
Yes, to the OP. Bunny hopping to me is unrealistic, would you in real life bounce your way around in a dangerous area? No, because you'd be too tired if/when you do encounter something nasty to do anything about it and you'd probably have knackered knees/ankles to boot, and you'd probably attract the attention of something you didn't actually want to meet, or a good sniper would time your hops and headshot you. For me it reduces the immersion watching an unrealistic mechanic being used because it gives an "advantage" in pvp. Just because our characters are all energiser bunnies with no fatigue doesn't make it right, now if it was explainable with "magic boots of hopping like a frog" i might be able to accept it, as long as that's all the movement that could be done while wearing the boots. Edit: apologies, it was paragraphed but it seems to have lost some of the formatting.
Unless a realistic MMO. (which--- I doub't exist. period, if anything near realistic 5% of all mmo's).
Then Who cares. 'DOOD HES BUNNY HOPPING. SO GAY, AND UNREALSTIC.. MUST BE WHY HE ROLLED GOBLIN"
I <jump> can’t <jump> see <jump> anything <jump> wrong <jump> with <jump> it <jump> myself.
Maybe that will give you an idea of how annoying it can be.
RP is the last thing players think about when playing a MMO these days, sad but true. Stick to a RP server they don’t do this sort of nonsense so much.
Not saying it shouldn't be in some MMO's I mean if you wanna have a fantasy game where people ride motorcyles and rainbow unicorns while playing electric guitars (with no electricity) while bunnyhopping that's fine. These games don't put much focus on their lore/realism or whatever you want to call it, that doesn't mean their bad it just means their focus is somewhere else.
But when I look for a game I look for a virtual world they've built up with lore in universe rules, I want a world to lose myself in. Something that reaches in and breaks that illusion and puts me firmly back into reality is a deal breaker for me, more than a few games I've stopped playing for those reasons. For example imagine watching a terminator movie and the main characters running away from a terminator then all of a sudden the terminator starts bunny hopping along after them..... I could see more than a few people just stopping the movie there (others would rotflol).
There can still be jumping as long as it fits in with the lore and makes sense. Say a acrobat doing flips and cartwheels and summersaults around you would be awesome in my opinion. A plate armoured paladin doing the same thing doesn't go down as well.
One of the problems I see is jumping isn't really worked into the games properly it's just something tacked on cause people want to get up on boxes and not having it in is considered bad. What I'd like to see is a game with jumping actually built in as a proper mechanic which is extremely hard to find... though some fluro orange ninja's seem to be good at it. There are hundreds of ways you could include mechanics around jumping so it flows well with other parts of the game or combat but it needs to be built into the core of the mechanics (like strafing) not added in at the end as another move your character can do.
Oh hey, this is like when people took the word "ganking" and made it synonamous with PKing, even though someone that PK's isn't necessarily ganking (ganking means to do it with far greater numbers btw you fucking WoW retards).
Someone actually thinks bunny hopping is simply running around jumping constantly? That's funny, cause it's not. Bunny hopping is timed jumping that increases momentum. It is unique to certain FPS games and has nothing to do with jumping for the sake of jumping.
Who cares though, right? You WoWheads never cared for what terms meant in the first place. You just change something from one definition (that makes sense) to another (that doesn't)!
...Like MMORPG.
_________________________________ "Fixed it. Because that wall of text attacked me, killed me and looted my body..." -George "sniperg" Light
Oh hey, this is like when people took the word "ganking" and made it synonamous with PKing, even though someone that PK's isn't necessarily ganking (ganking means to do it with far greater numbers btw you fucking WoW retards).
Actually, in Darkfall, Gank is a skill. It levels as you use it. It's when you finish off an enemy and send him/her back to his/her bindstone so you can take everything he'she had. But I agree with the WoW retard part. Just sayin' bro.
Oh hey, this is like when people took the word "ganking" and made it synonamous with PKing, even though someone that PK's isn't necessarily ganking (ganking means to do it with far greater numbers btw you fucking WoW retards).
Someone actually thinks bunny hopping is simply running around jumping constantly? That's funny, cause it's not. Bunny hopping is timed jumping that increases momentum. It is unique to certain FPS games and has nothing to do with jumping for the sake of jumping.
Who cares though, right? You WoWheads never cared for what terms meant in the first place. You just change something from one definition (that makes sense) to another (that doesn't)!
...Like MMORPG.
Kind of what he said...
Furthermore, I havn't played any MMO in which repetitive jumping had any use. I also havn't noticed a lot of players that constantly did it within the MMOs I played. So for me there is really no issue....
Not even gonna read through the replies on this post.
My answer is: who the fuck cares? To people that do: are you really so much of a nerd that you feel bunny hopping around in MMO's hinders your quality of play? That it doesn't "fit with the lore of the game"? Are you telling me that if those games were real life those 'people' couldn't continually jump if they wanted to?
Gah the stupidity on these forums still ceases to amaze me sometimes...
No the point is that if it were real life, those people likely *wouldn't* be in the first place.
Someone made a point earlier that if you sat in a mall and watched people, you see all forms of behavior. They're right. An ex-girlfriend of mine used to work in a mall and so I spent a good amount of time there, watching people. I even saw people jumping around a lot from time to time... none of them looked over the age of 6. Most everyone else walked, like normal human beings. Occasionally someone was running. I'm sure there's something to that.
As for your last statement... A difference of opinion does not = "stupidity". Claming it does, however, does = ignorance.
Just sayin'.
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
Oh hey, this is like when people took the word "ganking" and made it synonamous with PKing, even though someone that PK's isn't necessarily ganking (ganking means to do it with far greater numbers btw you fucking WoW retards).
Someone actually thinks bunny hopping is simply running around jumping constantly? That's funny, cause it's not. Bunny hopping is timed jumping that increases momentum. It is unique to certain FPS games and has nothing to do with jumping for the sake of jumping.
Who cares though, right? You WoWheads never cared for what terms meant in the first place. You just change something from one definition (that makes sense) to another (that doesn't)!
...Like MMORPG.
Well, maybe you can.... you know... deal with your rage over the "heinous mis-use" of such a sacred term for the sake of conversation and just, you know... address it in the context it's being used in this thread?
I mean seriously... getting all bent out of shape and raging at an entire population of players, referring to them as "retards" over the use of a term that is meaningless outside the context of a video game and is, reallly, a pretty ridiculous term to begin with is pretty absurd itself.
Maybe you should save that indignity and anger for something that actually matters. Just sayin'
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
Comments
PVP in MMOS. Or we just talking WoW?. WoW is a Gear Over Skill game. As for comparing something like... Dark age of Camelot. It is more based on Skill. Gear helps a lot, but skill is the main motive.
Anyway. in most cases. Gear is skill?. Or just someone who knows how to listen to directions in PVE.
Its debatable really.
Bunny hopping to me is unrealistic, would you in real life bounce your way around in a dangerous area? No, because you'd be too tired if/when you do encounter something nasty to do anything about it and you'd probably have knackered knees/ankles to boot, and you'd probably attract the attention of something you didn't actually want to meet, or a good sniper would time your hops and headshot you.
For me it reduces the immersion watching an unrealistic mechanic being used because it gives an "advantage" in pvp. Just because our characters are all energiser bunnies with no fatigue doesn't make it right, now if it was explainable with "magic boots of hopping like a frog" i might be able to accept it, as long as that's all the movement that could be done while wearing the boots.
Edit: apologies, it was paragraphed but it seems to have lost some of the formatting.
F2P/P2P excellent thread.
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/282517/F2P-An-Engineers-perspective.html
I don't mind bunny hopping in MMOs, but I hate it in FPSs. I don't hate that people do it so much as I hate the crowd that thinks it's the greatest skill you can have and if you strafe and use a machine gun you are just 'spraying and praying'. If people would learn to play 'the right way', and I hate saying that because there is no real 'right way', but still, if people would play the game and take the time to develop actual skills they wouldn't need to rely on a gimmic move like bunny hopping.
yes
As always, it depends. Generally speaking, no not in an mmo. Although it is retarded in a fps.
Not even gonna read through the replies on this post.
My answer is: who the fuck cares? To people that do: are you really so much of a nerd that you feel bunny hopping around in MMO's hinders your quality of play? That it doesn't "fit with the lore of the game"? Are you telling me that if those games were real life those 'people' couldn't continually jump if they wanted to?
Gah the stupidity on these forums still ceases to amaze me sometimes...
This is silly so you explain the RP in MMORPG , but then in your poll you set MMO .
Sorry this is a selfdefeating threat .
So no bunny hopping doesn´t make MMO silly , its normal for MMO to have a lot of bunny hoppers .
I can´t imagine a mmo where i can´t jump , fly mount but have to walk .
RP stands for Roleplay , but what the heck is roleplay nowadays ?
A normal person acting like a jerk is roleplay .
A kid that acts so l33t but hasn´t gotten any experience at all in Real Life is roleplaying .
Sorry RP stands nowadays for a ugly word , but half the idiots bashing it are Roleplaying !.
Sorry the universal roleplay already changed to beavis and butthead roleplay that people so adore .
Some people play games where classes don't exist, gear is a factor but not the only factor, and player skill is what matters more than anything. Just sayin' bro.
I sometimes bunny hop in game but I sometimes randomly do dumb shit like that in real life for a few seconds. But just imagine if in the real world people were always jumping around like in the game. I personally think it would be quite odd to see people constantly jumping around.
That simply has to do with your problem , not the bunny hoppers probolem .
That you diverse yourself enrich yourself too much in a world , thats fine .
But also dont expect all to obey and play according to your rules , you are not center of the universe.
But this also applies to the bunny hoppers .
Seriously lighten up , you are there to listen to somebody tell a story , RP a act , if you get irritated cause of strangers bunny hopping , thats your problem .
Your irritation is a case whats common nowadays , rather then correct yourself by ignoring them , or taking actions against the offenders , you rather be irritated .
Yeah I think it looks really bad to say the least. That's why I perfer games that have a more realist jump (LotRO) or no jumping at all (FFXI/GW.) It just so happens those are three of the most immersive games imo.
Count me in with the camp that says its just impossible to talk realism when we're talking about people shooting fireballs, getting heals, getting rezzes, running back to battle 2 minutes after death, making a horse appear from nowhere, getting speed buffs or any buffs, etc ad infinitum.
Gotta do better than that if you want me to be convinced that bunny-hopping makes a game, that is played succesfully by 7 year olds, silly.
This is a failed argument though. It is not stating that bunny hopping is not unrealistic nor silly. It is attempting to use a false syllogism to make bunny hopping okay, when the logic behind the argument does not work.
Fireballs, heals, resurrection, buffs, etc... all those things that decry reality - are an accepted part of that fantasy.
The argument one would attempt to make would be about being able to carry everything around while fighting for hours on end - that breaks the reality that is not normally part of the fantasy from a literature/film aspect.
However, this falls into the simple category of adding additional wrongs does not make it right. Bunny hopping is stupid. Being able to fight hours on end is stupid. No encumbrance, fatigue, etc... are all stupid.
Does one really want to make the argument that bunny hopping is okay because there are other bad mechanics in the game? All you are doing is adding another bad mechanic... that in of itself... seems rather silly.
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
Explorer: 87%, Killer: 67%, Achiever: 27%, Socializer: 20%
I'll make the argument that bunny hopping is ok because my opinion is that it's a GOOD mechanic. That way me and that other guy can both base our arguments on personal opinion and everyone wins. Yay!
What do you think Virus, is bunny hopping ok?
It does make a lot of aspects of darkfall pretty redundant if players can just bunnyhop like this. I don't have these skills, but I wouldn't want them to remove it completely, but it would be cool if you could only jump a certain number of times within a certain time period so people could bunny hop a short distance, but not 1/2 way across Agon so a mount could in theory catch up to them, but they could still make quick escapes to heal or hide.
Unless a realistic MMO. (which--- I doub't exist. period, if anything near realistic 5% of all mmo's).
Then Who cares. 'DOOD HES BUNNY HOPPING. SO GAY, AND UNREALSTIC.. MUST BE WHY HE ROLLED GOBLIN"
I <jump> can’t <jump> see <jump> anything <jump> wrong <jump> with <jump> it <jump> myself.
Maybe that will give you an idea of how annoying it can be.
RP is the last thing players think about when playing a MMO these days, sad but true. Stick to a RP server they don’t do this sort of nonsense so much.
I never understood this...
In most of the games I have seen you can jump just for the sake of jumping. There is no need to whatsoever.
On the other hand, fireballs or endless fighting are desirable and meaningful features.
yes.
Not saying it shouldn't be in some MMO's I mean if you wanna have a fantasy game where people ride motorcyles and rainbow unicorns while playing electric guitars (with no electricity) while bunnyhopping that's fine. These games don't put much focus on their lore/realism or whatever you want to call it, that doesn't mean their bad it just means their focus is somewhere else.
But when I look for a game I look for a virtual world they've built up with lore in universe rules, I want a world to lose myself in. Something that reaches in and breaks that illusion and puts me firmly back into reality is a deal breaker for me, more than a few games I've stopped playing for those reasons. For example imagine watching a terminator movie and the main characters running away from a terminator then all of a sudden the terminator starts bunny hopping along after them..... I could see more than a few people just stopping the movie there (others would rotflol).
There can still be jumping as long as it fits in with the lore and makes sense. Say a acrobat doing flips and cartwheels and summersaults around you would be awesome in my opinion. A plate armoured paladin doing the same thing doesn't go down as well.
One of the problems I see is jumping isn't really worked into the games properly it's just something tacked on cause people want to get up on boxes and not having it in is considered bad. What I'd like to see is a game with jumping actually built in as a proper mechanic which is extremely hard to find... though some fluro orange ninja's seem to be good at it. There are hundreds of ways you could include mechanics around jumping so it flows well with other parts of the game or combat but it needs to be built into the core of the mechanics (like strafing) not added in at the end as another move your character can do.
Into the breach meatbags
Oh hey, this is like when people took the word "ganking" and made it synonamous with PKing, even though someone that PK's isn't necessarily ganking (ganking means to do it with far greater numbers btw you fucking WoW retards).
Someone actually thinks bunny hopping is simply running around jumping constantly? That's funny, cause it's not. Bunny hopping is timed jumping that increases momentum. It is unique to certain FPS games and has nothing to do with jumping for the sake of jumping.
Who cares though, right? You WoWheads never cared for what terms meant in the first place. You just change something from one definition (that makes sense) to another (that doesn't)!
...Like MMORPG.
_________________________________
"Fixed it. Because that wall of text attacked me, killed me and looted my body..."
-George "sniperg" Light
Actually, in Darkfall, Gank is a skill. It levels as you use it. It's when you finish off an enemy and send him/her back to his/her bindstone so you can take everything he'she had. But I agree with the WoW retard part. Just sayin' bro.
Kind of what he said...
Furthermore, I havn't played any MMO in which repetitive jumping had any use. I also havn't noticed a lot of players that constantly did it within the MMOs I played. So for me there is really no issue....
No the point is that if it were real life, those people likely *wouldn't* be in the first place.
Someone made a point earlier that if you sat in a mall and watched people, you see all forms of behavior. They're right. An ex-girlfriend of mine used to work in a mall and so I spent a good amount of time there, watching people. I even saw people jumping around a lot from time to time... none of them looked over the age of 6. Most everyone else walked, like normal human beings. Occasionally someone was running. I'm sure there's something to that.
As for your last statement... A difference of opinion does not = "stupidity". Claming it does, however, does = ignorance.
Just sayin'.
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
Well, maybe you can.... you know... deal with your rage over the "heinous mis-use" of such a sacred term for the sake of conversation and just, you know... address it in the context it's being used in this thread?
I mean seriously... getting all bent out of shape and raging at an entire population of players, referring to them as "retards" over the use of a term that is meaningless outside the context of a video game and is, reallly, a pretty ridiculous term to begin with is pretty absurd itself.
Maybe you should save that indignity and anger for something that actually matters. Just sayin'
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops