I love Fallen Earth, it reminds me a lot of SWG and it's kind of a throw back game that is very immersive. That said, it's missing one of the largest parts of a true sandbox, and that is a functional player economy where people are dependent on other people. Why they made such an elaborate and detailed crafting system and then allowed complete player self-sufficiency is beyond me.
Everyone can craft everything, and as a result there is really no economy to speak of. It's too bad, because if they fixed that and added some housing/social spaces it would be the premier sandbox on the market right now aside from EVE.
One thing that keeps it from being sandbox is that it is linear. You move from newb zone to zone 3 as you level. You move from crap gear to high gear as you level. You move from low end skills to better skills as you level. There no point in ever going back.
Compare that to the game that defines sandbox, EVE, and youll see the opposite. Everything moves parallell. Veterans spend just as much time in frigates in safe space, as do noobs. They mine the same things. They fight noobs and vets a like.
exploring is pointless unless you enjoy vast areas of - - - - - nothing
crafting requires no skill and everyone can make the exact same item
this is definitely not a world to live in as the focus has turned completely toward PVP
and don't forget the cash shop - as lame as it is you cannot earn the items "in-game"
I like that everything in game can be crafted (except for horses I suppose lol). and to be honest I have never seen a MMO where crafting required "skill"
as for the exploring, its a wasteland...I would find it odd if it was full of stuff. I like the fact a lot of it is open desert. lets be honest it would kill the vibe if you took the part of the world this game is set in, made it a wasteland as the devs did and then fill it with sight seeing goodies. Plus it makes it all the more better when your just out walking and come across something. I dunno, just my feelings on the subject.
I haven't experienced PVP or the cash shop yet so I can't speak to either of those.
but again, all matters of opinion I suppose.
Get into the tradeskill Nature and you will be able to "craft" horses.
Agree with exploring, I really enjoy it.
PVP is a option, something I enjoy due it being a option.
The cashshop has 2 items, oh noessss. A wasteland dog with 4 item slots and goggles that you will outgrow at lvl 10, only thing is you will be able to use the goggle's at lvl 6 I think instead of the regular ingame crafted goggles that can be used at lvl 10.
I am amazed by people who speak about the cash shop being a gamebreaker in the way Gatheris speaks about it.
Playing since release ( and slightly before in beta) and still am enjoying it.
i think for some people a cash shop of anykind is a gamebreaker. just look in the CoH forums there is a guy in there who rage quit the game after years because they offered a pack of emotes. got news for them though. every AAA mmorpg on the market right now has a cash shop of some kind,(except for maybe eve?) and you better get used to it cause that's something that isn't going away.
The quests gives "attributes points". So I felt forced to do them. Unless you want to have a character with 30% less attribute compare to other people.
you can get ap points from nearly everything. hell i leveled when I walked into a town for the first time and got ap's.
What he was getting at is that there is a large chunk of AP that can only be gotten from certain missions. . so if you just play through normally, someone who went and did them all, which everyone seems to think they need to, will have an "advantage" over you.
The sell for this game for some was end -game PvP so for them they need to get those points which means doing a tonne of low level quests or "grinding" AP missions. I think that getting AP from certain quests is one of the worst design decisions of the game. Personally I don't care if I keep up with everyone but if everyone grinds the AP and grinds the faction wheel etc and you are into competitive PvP you are going to feel you need to.
Ah ok, I get what he means then. I'm more of a PVE guy so that kind of stuff usually doesn't occur to me. I suppose for those guys that might pose a problem, but I don't see it being different from any games pvp reqs. By that I mean, while i'm not a pvp'er I feel like whatever the system the game has the goal will be to boost your combat and defense as high as possible whether it be ap's, certain armor pieces only obtained in certain dungeons, etc etc
Ya all I mean is you don't have to quest. But you'll be less powerful than the other people. So that push most people to do all the AP missions. Which is quite opposite to when you say you don't need to quest.
And even as a PvE character I did all the ap mission. So I can do well in PvE, have high social to make money, and be a crafter at the same time.
That dont' bother me though, since I enjoy doing the quests. And almost all my guildmates enjoy doing the quests anyway.
Sometimes this site frustrates me with how people like to slam down the opinions of others. On the other hand, I like seeing these different extreme views and opinions on the same subject. You do learn a lot of the good and the bad about a game once you get through them all.
One negative I heard in one of these posts that I hadn't heard before was that everyone can make everything, so the economy suffers. I have to agree, but just in my limited time in the game I've learned that you can't level up and make everything while still being the best in combat. However, it's easy enough to create an alt to do this. So, I guess this is probably somewhat true, but not completely since you do have to specialize to be able to be the best crafter.
I completely disagree though with the comment that Fallen Earth crafting is just like WoW crafting, I think it's much better in Fallen Earth. I'll admit though that I have much more experience with it in WoW at this point having a number of level 80s with maxed crafting skills.
It is not a bad game it was just too much for my old computer. I really don't care if it sandbox or not as in my opinion a sandbox game is only fun until you add other players. Maybe I am pessimistic but the thought of players having complete freedom seems like a griefers paradise where the people whole play several hours everyday will dominate and there will be nothing left for anyone else to do. Sandboxes only work if you assume most of the community will be made up of decent individuals when in fact the majority of the community are future inmates.
I like that everything in game can be crafted (except for horses I suppose lol). and to be honest I have never seen a MMO where crafting required "skill"
Try playing Vanguard : SoH even if its just for the free month. You can get the full game for $1 on Ebay and that includes the free month so it's a fairly cheap way for you to experience a mmo with a crafting system that actually takes skill O_o! Oh my!
I played FE when it first came out for about 6 months and I am doing the free thing now to check out the new. There is much more content then there was then. I will most likely resub my old account but have a problem. When I left, I gave all my items and cash to the clan and now I will enter FE as a naked lvl28 with no money and only a horse to ride back to do all the missions I missed until I get re-equiped. The deal is that in FE it will not take long as the crafting system allows for such...errors.
I do think they can do more with pvp and even more with abilities to make houses and such. Just think how things would be if they would introduce flying mounts or an open PvP server. It would be nice to have a crafting specialty but not sure if that would make things...unbalanced overall. Just a thought.
So if you decide to do the free thing and see a naked rider out harvesting, give him a break, he is old and has to is having a ball.
Fallen Earth is too much of a quest stacking hybrid for me.
I like more freedom and less linear gameplay in my MMOs.
All I did in FE was quest stack and progressivly quest hub hop.
Also when i was playing you could repair all your gear making the need for the crafters market way too themepark for me.
The thing about crafting and the economy is, in the lower levels you really don't see it take shape. Once you reach max level you start to see it.. The idea behind the game originally is that there was supposed to be 150 levels in all as the game expands. Early on you see that having a crafter alt is great to make weapons, gear, and ammunition, but to max crafting it takes some.. dedication to say the least, and those items are much sought after and can only be crafted.
Yeah it "feels" like a sandbox game at first, but in truth it isnt one by any stretch of the imagination. The game world is big and open but really its as static as any other themepark game on the market. Nothing you do matters in the "gameworld" and I found that players tended to ignore each other as there wasnt any real incentive to interact. I thought the use of stats to increase would make it all more interesting at first but it rapidly became a real chore for me.
No danger. No excitement. Oh this npc wants me to kill 10 bandits. Why is that? Will it matter? Do I really have to? Is there something else to do? I could just ignore his quest and wander off but then I'm just ignoring the game so whats the point in that?........especially considering that there are more npcs waiting down the road who also want me to kill 10 bandits......or 10 snakes.....or 10 whatevers. Oh I can dig up some carrots I suppose and make a salad. Yeah this is what real gaming is all about. Hmmm.
All the while players are everywhere, running back and forth between npcs and the designated killing/harvesting hotspots like an army of mindless cloned sheep and completely ignoring each other as they focus on the only thing they can change - leveling up their own characters. It's not the players fault though. They were just playing the game the way it has been designed. It just seemed so drab to me, having a game where each player reads/plays their own copy of the story while watching others run around doing the same. I thought Fallen Earth was going to be really interesting as its developers seemed to have a vision for something different and new and yet to me it actually seemed even more boring than other straightforward mmos. I got no sense at all that I was in a harsh land where various factions were in conflict with each other.
The crafting system was also incredibly dull. I have no idea why some people thought it was good. No variety to it whatsoever. Get blueprint. Collect required items. Click create. Wait for item to appear. Repeat. Level up crafting skill. Move onto next object in the list. Repeat. Why am I doing this? Who cares what items I can make? I'm in a static lifeless world which I cant have any impact on and no one gives a crap about each other so why am I crafting stuff that everyone else can make anyway?
I played Fallen Earth for a few weeks and found it sort of interesting for half that time, but after that it just became painfully boring to log in and plod my way through it. All I could see was a loooooong and boring journey through an arid desert of a game. After that I just let my months free (?!) play expire. Maybe there was something amazing and awe inspiring way off in the distance but I just couldnt muster the interest to wade through the boring grind to find out. From what I have read of peoples reports the game doesnt really change that much.......but then these mmos never do. What you do at the beginning is pretty much what you will be doing all the way through. Fallen Earth seriously turned my brain off. I felt like someone had poured cement into my soul lol. Yep the world of Fallen Earth is indeed a harsh wasteland. It certainly sucked the life out of me.
But yeah I really dont think this is the sandbox game so many people have been waiting for (probably because it isnt one), but at least some people like it. Each to their own I guess.
Haha, good read bud. I agree on many points. The crafting system alone in FE was a big letdown for me. Get recipe---gather---click button---wait---how exciting lol. FE for me made other MMOs look good due to its lack of uniqueness.
Hopefully they work on FE because until the bland combat and forced repetitve questing is fixed I won't be touching FE with a 10 foot pole..
This game is actually fantastic, its come a long way since launch. I think it really is what a lot of players are looking for, and I did get that SWG feel when I first started.
Oh boy.. the never-ending arguement over the Sandbox to Theme Park game. The problem is, nothing fits in just black or white.. there are many shades of grey.
The most sandbox-like game I have ever come across is EVE Online. (unless you count Second Life which allows you to do anything you can within the confines of the programming) You can do anything... go anywhere.. you have a chance at killing a guy with 3 years experience when you only have 3 months of experience. You can build your own stations, form massive battles that change the dynamics... you can con people for in-game currency with no retribution from the "GM's". Moving forward is not based on how much time you put in or how many boss dungeons you get through. Almost everything is made by players. The point is, it's non-linear in every aspect.
The most theme-park game I've ever played would have to have been Tabula Rasa. There is one static direction to go in the game. You progress from map A to map B to map C.. etc. Quests are the only viable way to level up. Everyone is a fighter, you cannot "progress" through crafting, trading... or anything other than killing and questing. Killing would take you endless hours.. so questing is the only way. Quests are limited. A to B is how it works. This is extremely linear.
Now.. FE can fall somwhere in between here. Yes, you need XP to progress but... that can be done through gathering/crafting/killing/questing and such. No, you cannot just plop down your own house or guild town in the middle of the desert. (Think of a base in EVE). The structure of the game is such that you progress from one zone to the next, much like Tabula Rasa.
For me... in my own definition of "grey"... the game is a themepark with sandbox elements such as crafting. Otherwise you go from map A to map B.
Oh boy.. the never-ending arguement over the Sandbox to Theme Park game. The problem is, nothing fits in just black or white.. there are many shades of grey.
The most sandbox-like game I have ever come across is EVE Online. (unless you count Second Life which allows you to do anything you can within the confines of the programming) You can do anything... go anywhere.. you have a chance at killing a guy with 3 years experience when you only have 3 months of experience. You can build your own stations, form massive battles that change the dynamics... you can con people for in-game currency with no retribution from the "GM's". Moving forward is not based on how much time you put in or how many boss dungeons you get through. Almost everything is made by players. The point is, it's non-linear in every aspect.
The most theme-park game I've ever played would have to have been Tabula Rasa. There is one static direction to go in the game. You progress from map A to map B to map C.. etc. Quests are the only viable way to level up. Everyone is a fighter, you cannot "progress" through crafting, trading... or anything other than killing and questing. Killing would take you endless hours.. so questing is the only way. Quests are limited. A to B is how it works. This is extremely linear.
Now.. FE can fall somwhere in between here. Yes, you need XP to progress but... that can be done through gathering/crafting/killing/questing and such. No, you cannot just plop down your own house or guild town in the middle of the desert. (Think of a base in EVE). The structure of the game is such that you progress from one zone to the next, much like Tabula Rasa.
For me... in my own definition of "grey"... the game is a themepark with sandbox elements such as crafting. Otherwise you go from map A to map B.
This is a rational response. Please take notes drooling ideologues.
"Never met a pack of humans that were any different. Look at the idiots that get elected every couple of years. You really consider those guys more mature than us? The only difference between us and them is, when they gank some noobs and take their stuff, the noobs actually die." - Madimorga
The quests gives "attributes points". So I felt forced to do them. Unless you want to have a character with 30% less attribute compare to other people.
I'm not quite sure what you're getting at here... you're not happy because there was a quest that actually gave you something?
I think what he's getting at is the thread implies that this game is a sandbox and though it has questing it doesn't make you feel like you have to do the quests to keep pace, but if the quests give attribute points (like every themepark gives exp) then it isn't any different than what's already out there.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
I think it's probably fair to say the game has some sandboxy elements, but can not really be classified as a sandbox per se.
First off, there is the fact that you must do quests in order to get a good chunk of your ap. Second, many people also feel compelled to do the faction wheel to get even more ap.
Crafting is ok. People make more of it than what there is though. Take a look at precu SWG with the ability to experiment and create unique goods, then have an npc vendor to place in your own store that you placed and decorated with your goods. Not only was crafting indepth, but even resource gathering, quality and the numerous stats that recources had played a part in the end product. It was very deep. Also take a look at Ryzom's crafting system, which was also rather indepth.
An open world does not mean it is sandbox. Many mmos have open world and are not sandboxes, WOW and Vanguard being two games with large worlds immediately come to mind.
Also, Fallen Earth has levels requirements in it with regards to clothing, armor, etc, which to my mind is not sandboxy.
Fallen Earth is a good game. I merely make a few comparisons to point out why it is not really a sandbox. The fact that is has a very bland, boring color pallete which basically consists of varying degrees of brown is not particularly appealing. If you defend all the brown by saying it's the appocalypse, well then if everything is brown and died then all the animals and humans would have died too.
Visually, while I think the graphics are ok the color is just very boring...except for the occasional sunset/sunrise pic that people like to post. So no, it is not the sandbox that I have been clamoring for.
Originally posted by TerranahThe fact that is has a very bland, boring color pallete which basically consists of varying degrees of brown is not particularly appealing. If you defend all the brown by saying it's the appocalypse, well then if everything is brown and died then all the animals and humans would have died too.
Visually, while I think the graphics are ok the color is just very boring...except for the occasional sunset/sunrise pic that people like to post. So no, it is not the sandbox that I have been clamoring for.
It takes place around the Grand Canyon... which is, actually, very brown.. So in that respect, they're being faithful to the real place.
Originally posted by TerranahThe fact that is has a very bland, boring color pallete which basically consists of varying degrees of brown is not particularly appealing. If you defend all the brown by saying it's the appocalypse, well then if everything is brown and died then all the animals and humans would have died too.
Visually, while I think the graphics are ok the color is just very boring...except for the occasional sunset/sunrise pic that people like to post. So no, it is not the sandbox that I have been clamoring for.
It takes place around the Grand Canyon... which is, actually, very brown.. So in that respect, they're being faithful to the real place.
And they actually used the real topography of the region to build their world. I thought that was pretty cool.
I think FE is a very solid game and improving with each patch. The only beef i have is the system funnels you into basically three builds (melee, pistol, rifle) for combat. For a game that pushes skills, you'd think you'd be able to specialize on one type but at least be able to be proficient on other forms. As it is right now, you are a one trick pony which seems a bit restrictive.
Fallen Earth is an awesome game. I really love it. But no, it is not the sandbox we have been waiting for. Eve is much closer to that than this game is. You still cant make permanent changes to the world in the way you can with Eve.
But as far as character development goes, yeah, it is very flexible and open ended.
exploring is pointless unless you enjoy vast areas of - - - - - nothing
crafting requires no skill and everyone can make the exact same item
this is definitely not a world to live in as the focus has turned completely toward PVP
and don't forget the cash shop - as lame as it is you cannot earn the items "in-game"
I like that everything in game can be crafted (except for horses I suppose lol). and to be honest I have never seen a MMO where crafting required "skill"
as for the exploring, its a wasteland...I would find it odd if it was full of stuff. I like the fact a lot of it is open desert. lets be honest it would kill the vibe if you took the part of the world this game is set in, made it a wasteland as the devs did and then fill it with sight seeing goodies. Plus it makes it all the more better when your just out walking and come across something. I dunno, just my feelings on the subject.
I haven't experienced PVP or the cash shop yet so I can't speak to either of those.
but again, all matters of opinion I suppose.
First, I don't like the use of the word "skill", specifically player skill, when talking about MMORPGs. It's usually used as a term that means the player's manipulation of the mouse and keyboard in a manner "more efficiently" than others. That only applies to FPS type games in my mind.
That said, the crafting system in EQ2 (at least around launch) required some player skill because it was a whack a mole mini-game.
Fallen Earth is a good game, but it is not the sandbox I really wanted to play in. I liked the wide open spaces that you could wander around in. Unlike another who has posted in this thread, wandering around and "doing nothing" is in fact doing something: Exploring. To explore does not mean that you are guaranteed to find something at constant intervals as they seem to suggest. There should be things to find, yes, but not such that it is something you can count on as a standardized content.
As far as FE's crafting, it's ok but sandbox crafting to me is more in line with early SWG PreNGE crafting. All players shouldn't be able to make all things and there most certainly should be varying levels of quality between Player A's crafted rifle and Player B's based on the skill level they have, the experimentation they applied (and experimenting should allow for varying effects on the item) andon the relative stats on the raw materials used to make the item.
As an example of the resources bit take a look at the current resources in SWG via the SWGcraft website. Notice the first group is "Chemicals" and under it the first subgroup is "Fiberplast". Under it is a list the fiberplast type chemicals in the game currently. Resources only last so long and they may never spawn again or if they do they may have different stats. Various items can be made with a given Fiberplast and the quality of the item will scale based on the stats of the Fiberplast used. So there is the idea that you can make Item Z with Fiberplast X, but Fiberplast Y has better stats for this particular item so you might want to use it instead.
Scrolling down more you see 2 other subgroups (Known Liquid pertochem Fuel and Lubricating Oil) Resources from those groups could be used in place of Fiberplast X and Y from the above example to may Z item, but their subgroups may be an inferior alternate compared to the Fiberplast subgroup and thus will make a really inferior Z item.
The idea, though, is that multiple raw resources can be used to make the same thing and that grant different results. With the above example again, sure Known Liquid pertochem Fuel and Lubricating Oil subgroups may grant an overall inferior Z item, but one or both may allow you to make a Z item that is really good in a single stat that the Fiberplast resources can't compete with. So it's not alwyas just a case of "using the best".
That type of crafting system takes some "Mental Skill" in that you have to think about your overall goal before clicking buttons to make. The majority of AAA games today do not offer that when it comes to crafting. Sadly, Fallen Earth doesn't either.
The combination of not having a deep enough (though deeper than most offerings today) and meaningful (meaning a system that not everyone can just pick up) crafting system as well as no housing make it hard for me to go along with your belief that this is the sandbox everyone has been clamoring for. It's clser than the vast majority of games offered lately but in my view falls short just short of the mark. Oh, and housing would have been nice. Housing, to be, is a huge part of the Sandbox DNA.
"Many nights, my friend... Many nights I've put a blade to your throat while you were sleeping. Glad I never killed you, Steve. You're alright..."
This game's setting, the wide open world with seemless caves and dungeons and whatnot, the mostly modern real technology gear (at least that we can use), the slightly futurist post-apoc feel, the ability to build your character like you want... That stuff was great..
I just wasn't a big fan of the theme-park questing (level x, go to place y, do quests z, rince and repeat) and the lack of ability to really be part of the world, other than the pvp outpost things..
The same world, with a Ryzom like AI, and maybe a SWG like housing system, that would have been really awesome.. oh well
While I would not go as far as call Fallen Earth a true sandbox mmo I think it is the perfect game from people who are not into the most hardcore of hardcore games and want something more than a theme park game can offer. The best thing about the game is the ambitious devs who keep of updating it on a pretty regular basis.
Comments
I love Fallen Earth, it reminds me a lot of SWG and it's kind of a throw back game that is very immersive. That said, it's missing one of the largest parts of a true sandbox, and that is a functional player economy where people are dependent on other people. Why they made such an elaborate and detailed crafting system and then allowed complete player self-sufficiency is beyond me.
Everyone can craft everything, and as a result there is really no economy to speak of. It's too bad, because if they fixed that and added some housing/social spaces it would be the premier sandbox on the market right now aside from EVE.
One thing that keeps it from being sandbox is that it is linear. You move from newb zone to zone 3 as you level. You move from crap gear to high gear as you level. You move from low end skills to better skills as you level. There no point in ever going back.
Compare that to the game that defines sandbox, EVE, and youll see the opposite. Everything moves parallell. Veterans spend just as much time in frigates in safe space, as do noobs. They mine the same things. They fight noobs and vets a like.
i think for some people a cash shop of anykind is a gamebreaker. just look in the CoH forums there is a guy in there who rage quit the game after years because they offered a pack of emotes. got news for them though. every AAA mmorpg on the market right now has a cash shop of some kind,(except for maybe eve?) and you better get used to it cause that's something that isn't going away.
Ya all I mean is you don't have to quest. But you'll be less powerful than the other people. So that push most people to do all the AP missions. Which is quite opposite to when you say you don't need to quest.
And even as a PvE character I did all the ap mission. So I can do well in PvE, have high social to make money, and be a crafter at the same time.
That dont' bother me though, since I enjoy doing the quests. And almost all my guildmates enjoy doing the quests anyway.
Sometimes this site frustrates me with how people like to slam down the opinions of others. On the other hand, I like seeing these different extreme views and opinions on the same subject. You do learn a lot of the good and the bad about a game once you get through them all.
One negative I heard in one of these posts that I hadn't heard before was that everyone can make everything, so the economy suffers. I have to agree, but just in my limited time in the game I've learned that you can't level up and make everything while still being the best in combat. However, it's easy enough to create an alt to do this. So, I guess this is probably somewhat true, but not completely since you do have to specialize to be able to be the best crafter.
I completely disagree though with the comment that Fallen Earth crafting is just like WoW crafting, I think it's much better in Fallen Earth. I'll admit though that I have much more experience with it in WoW at this point having a number of level 80s with maxed crafting skills.
Fallen Earth is too much of a quest stacking hybrid for me.
I like more freedom and less linear gameplay in my MMOs.
All I did in FE was quest stack and progressivly quest hub hop.
Also when i was playing you could repair all your gear making the need for the crafters market way too themepark for me.
Playing: Rift, LotRO
Waiting on: GW2, BP
It is not a bad game it was just too much for my old computer. I really don't care if it sandbox or not as in my opinion a sandbox game is only fun until you add other players. Maybe I am pessimistic but the thought of players having complete freedom seems like a griefers paradise where the people whole play several hours everyday will dominate and there will be nothing left for anyone else to do. Sandboxes only work if you assume most of the community will be made up of decent individuals when in fact the majority of the community are future inmates.
Try playing Vanguard : SoH even if its just for the free month. You can get the full game for $1 on Ebay and that includes the free month so it's a fairly cheap way for you to experience a mmo with a crafting system that actually takes skill O_o! Oh my!
I played FE when it first came out for about 6 months and I am doing the free thing now to check out the new. There is much more content then there was then. I will most likely resub my old account but have a problem. When I left, I gave all my items and cash to the clan and now I will enter FE as a naked lvl28 with no money and only a horse to ride back to do all the missions I missed until I get re-equiped. The deal is that in FE it will not take long as the crafting system allows for such...errors.
I do think they can do more with pvp and even more with abilities to make houses and such. Just think how things would be if they would introduce flying mounts or an open PvP server. It would be nice to have a crafting specialty but not sure if that would make things...unbalanced overall. Just a thought.
So if you decide to do the free thing and see a naked rider out harvesting, give him a break, he is old and has to is having a ball.
The thing about crafting and the economy is, in the lower levels you really don't see it take shape. Once you reach max level you start to see it.. The idea behind the game originally is that there was supposed to be 150 levels in all as the game expands. Early on you see that having a crafter alt is great to make weapons, gear, and ammunition, but to max crafting it takes some.. dedication to say the least, and those items are much sought after and can only be crafted.
Haha, good read bud. I agree on many points. The crafting system alone in FE was a big letdown for me. Get recipe---gather---click button---wait---how exciting lol. FE for me made other MMOs look good due to its lack of uniqueness.
Hopefully they work on FE because until the bland combat and forced repetitve questing is fixed I won't be touching FE with a 10 foot pole..
"I play Tera for the gameplay"
Agreed. Great review! Dont waste time on FE, it's going nowhere!
This game is actually fantastic, its come a long way since launch. I think it really is what a lot of players are looking for, and I did get that SWG feel when I first started.
Oh boy.. the never-ending arguement over the Sandbox to Theme Park game. The problem is, nothing fits in just black or white.. there are many shades of grey.
The most sandbox-like game I have ever come across is EVE Online. (unless you count Second Life which allows you to do anything you can within the confines of the programming) You can do anything... go anywhere.. you have a chance at killing a guy with 3 years experience when you only have 3 months of experience. You can build your own stations, form massive battles that change the dynamics... you can con people for in-game currency with no retribution from the "GM's". Moving forward is not based on how much time you put in or how many boss dungeons you get through. Almost everything is made by players. The point is, it's non-linear in every aspect.
The most theme-park game I've ever played would have to have been Tabula Rasa. There is one static direction to go in the game. You progress from map A to map B to map C.. etc. Quests are the only viable way to level up. Everyone is a fighter, you cannot "progress" through crafting, trading... or anything other than killing and questing. Killing would take you endless hours.. so questing is the only way. Quests are limited. A to B is how it works. This is extremely linear.
Now.. FE can fall somwhere in between here. Yes, you need XP to progress but... that can be done through gathering/crafting/killing/questing and such. No, you cannot just plop down your own house or guild town in the middle of the desert. (Think of a base in EVE). The structure of the game is such that you progress from one zone to the next, much like Tabula Rasa.
For me... in my own definition of "grey"... the game is a themepark with sandbox elements such as crafting. Otherwise you go from map A to map B.
Having endless seas of sand in a game does not make it a sandbox.
This is a rational response. Please take notes drooling ideologues.
"Never met a pack of humans that were any different. Look at the idiots that get elected every couple of years. You really consider those guys more mature than us? The only difference between us and them is, when they gank some noobs and take their stuff, the noobs actually die." - Madimorga
I think what he's getting at is the thread implies that this game is a sandbox and though it has questing it doesn't make you feel like you have to do the quests to keep pace, but if the quests give attribute points (like every themepark gives exp) then it isn't any different than what's already out there.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
If they dealt with the quest AP issue and actually gave player something to do with purpose in "end game", I'd probably start playing again.
Until then, I'm not wasting anymore time or money on the game.
I think it's probably fair to say the game has some sandboxy elements, but can not really be classified as a sandbox per se.
First off, there is the fact that you must do quests in order to get a good chunk of your ap. Second, many people also feel compelled to do the faction wheel to get even more ap.
Crafting is ok. People make more of it than what there is though. Take a look at precu SWG with the ability to experiment and create unique goods, then have an npc vendor to place in your own store that you placed and decorated with your goods. Not only was crafting indepth, but even resource gathering, quality and the numerous stats that recources had played a part in the end product. It was very deep. Also take a look at Ryzom's crafting system, which was also rather indepth.
An open world does not mean it is sandbox. Many mmos have open world and are not sandboxes, WOW and Vanguard being two games with large worlds immediately come to mind.
Also, Fallen Earth has levels requirements in it with regards to clothing, armor, etc, which to my mind is not sandboxy.
Fallen Earth is a good game. I merely make a few comparisons to point out why it is not really a sandbox. The fact that is has a very bland, boring color pallete which basically consists of varying degrees of brown is not particularly appealing. If you defend all the brown by saying it's the appocalypse, well then if everything is brown and died then all the animals and humans would have died too.
Visually, while I think the graphics are ok the color is just very boring...except for the occasional sunset/sunrise pic that people like to post. So no, it is not the sandbox that I have been clamoring for.
It takes place around the Grand Canyon... which is, actually, very brown.. So in that respect, they're being faithful to the real place.
Besides the pic below, here's a whole Google Search's worth of pictures..
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
And they actually used the real topography of the region to build their world. I thought that was pretty cool.
I think FE is a very solid game and improving with each patch. The only beef i have is the system funnels you into basically three builds (melee, pistol, rifle) for combat. For a game that pushes skills, you'd think you'd be able to specialize on one type but at least be able to be proficient on other forms. As it is right now, you are a one trick pony which seems a bit restrictive.
Fallen Earth is an awesome game. I really love it. But no, it is not the sandbox we have been waiting for. Eve is much closer to that than this game is. You still cant make permanent changes to the world in the way you can with Eve.
But as far as character development goes, yeah, it is very flexible and open ended.
First, I don't like the use of the word "skill", specifically player skill, when talking about MMORPGs. It's usually used as a term that means the player's manipulation of the mouse and keyboard in a manner "more efficiently" than others. That only applies to FPS type games in my mind.
That said, the crafting system in EQ2 (at least around launch) required some player skill because it was a whack a mole mini-game.
Fallen Earth is a good game, but it is not the sandbox I really wanted to play in. I liked the wide open spaces that you could wander around in. Unlike another who has posted in this thread, wandering around and "doing nothing" is in fact doing something: Exploring. To explore does not mean that you are guaranteed to find something at constant intervals as they seem to suggest. There should be things to find, yes, but not such that it is something you can count on as a standardized content.
As far as FE's crafting, it's ok but sandbox crafting to me is more in line with early SWG PreNGE crafting. All players shouldn't be able to make all things and there most certainly should be varying levels of quality between Player A's crafted rifle and Player B's based on the skill level they have, the experimentation they applied (and experimenting should allow for varying effects on the item) andon the relative stats on the raw materials used to make the item.
As an example of the resources bit take a look at the current resources in SWG via the SWGcraft website. Notice the first group is "Chemicals" and under it the first subgroup is "Fiberplast". Under it is a list the fiberplast type chemicals in the game currently. Resources only last so long and they may never spawn again or if they do they may have different stats. Various items can be made with a given Fiberplast and the quality of the item will scale based on the stats of the Fiberplast used. So there is the idea that you can make Item Z with Fiberplast X, but Fiberplast Y has better stats for this particular item so you might want to use it instead.
Scrolling down more you see 2 other subgroups (Known Liquid pertochem Fuel and Lubricating Oil) Resources from those groups could be used in place of Fiberplast X and Y from the above example to may Z item, but their subgroups may be an inferior alternate compared to the Fiberplast subgroup and thus will make a really inferior Z item.
The idea, though, is that multiple raw resources can be used to make the same thing and that grant different results. With the above example again, sure Known Liquid pertochem Fuel and Lubricating Oil subgroups may grant an overall inferior Z item, but one or both may allow you to make a Z item that is really good in a single stat that the Fiberplast resources can't compete with. So it's not alwyas just a case of "using the best".
That type of crafting system takes some "Mental Skill" in that you have to think about your overall goal before clicking buttons to make. The majority of AAA games today do not offer that when it comes to crafting. Sadly, Fallen Earth doesn't either.
The combination of not having a deep enough (though deeper than most offerings today) and meaningful (meaning a system that not everyone can just pick up) crafting system as well as no housing make it hard for me to go along with your belief that this is the sandbox everyone has been clamoring for. It's clser than the vast majority of games offered lately but in my view falls short just short of the mark. Oh, and housing would have been nice. Housing, to be, is a huge part of the Sandbox DNA.
"Many nights, my friend... Many nights I've put a blade to your throat while you were sleeping. Glad I never killed you, Steve. You're alright..."
Chavez y Chavez
This game's setting, the wide open world with seemless caves and dungeons and whatnot, the mostly modern real technology gear (at least that we can use), the slightly futurist post-apoc feel, the ability to build your character like you want... That stuff was great..
I just wasn't a big fan of the theme-park questing (level x, go to place y, do quests z, rince and repeat) and the lack of ability to really be part of the world, other than the pvp outpost things..
The same world, with a Ryzom like AI, and maybe a SWG like housing system, that would have been really awesome.. oh well
While I would not go as far as call Fallen Earth a true sandbox mmo I think it is the perfect game from people who are not into the most hardcore of hardcore games and want something more than a theme park game can offer. The best thing about the game is the ambitious devs who keep of updating it on a pretty regular basis.