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New rules in IRC channel

TuxideTuxide Member UncommonPosts: 213

Hello everyone! I am here to inform people that PlaneShift has recently updated its rules on what can and cannot be discussed in the #planeshift channel on Freenode. As of today, here is the new topic for the OFFICIAL IRC fan channel:


*** Topic on #planeshift is: PlaneShift: A Free 3D MMORPG .:. http://planeshift.it .:. Report bugs at http://hydlaaplaza.com/flyspray/ .:. Discussions about competing projects are not allowed in here. | tail chopping hour

The new part here is that talking about any project that the PlaneShift director considers himself to be competing against is completely forbidden. So, what does this mean exactly? Well, it means you are free to talk about other games such as World of Warcraft or EVE, but mentioning other, lesser-known, open game projects will lead to a ban. This goes regardless of how much of their assets PlaneShift is actually using, how mature the project is, whether they are using the PlaneShift engine, or how the director defines the word "competing". Here are some examples of projects that should never be mentioned in that channel, ever:


Peragro Tempus—A virtual world where people can travel across different time periods


Tempest in the Aether—A Victorian Steampunk world being made by former PlaneShift developers and leaders using the PlaneShift engine


Trinity Reign—A medieval fantasy world being worked on by a nice group of people


___________________


So remember, if you're ever going into the #planeshift channel on Freenode, then don't ever mention any projects like these and you'll do fine, else the banhammer will be upon you!

Comments

  • LinksuniusLinksunius Member Posts: 2

    Interesting. Seems the director of Planeshift is more interested in harassing fans then actually developing a game. He seems to spend all day on Wikipedia being incivil and trying to push his weight so to speak there. Perhaps Planeshift should take a new direction and get a new director? Facism is dead and isn't going to attract players.

  • UtMoonUtMoon Member Posts: 99

    What he means by 'competing' projects are those projects that might draw 'his' (yes, he has called them HIS) volunteer contributors away from planeshift. Actually, the term he used was 'stealing'.

     

    So, the line should be read as "No talking about projects that might steal MY volunteers away."

    I changed my mind. PlaneShift is not worth the time.

  • m183ym183y Member Posts: 3

    One thing I am interesting after the last few months... Now that a large portion of the team is gone, it is basically up to Talad to sink or swim on his own. I guess we will see what happens. Tuxide, I was going to say you forgot www.radakan.org, but now the domain doesn't seem to work for me, at least. Moon, nothing happened to Radakan, did it? On a completely unrelated note I just finally got a copy of Planescape: Torment. Yay! My distraction level is guaranteed for the winter and I don't need to go in PlaneShift.

  • UtMoonUtMoon Member Posts: 99

    I don't recall what Radakan is or was. Don't remember the name at all, actually.

     

    I changed my mind. PlaneShift is not worth the time.

  • TuxideTuxide Member UncommonPosts: 213


    Originally posted by m183y
    Tuxide, I was going to say you forgot www.radakan.org, but now the domain doesn't seem to work for me, at least. Moon, nothing happened to Radakan, did it?
    I found a cached version of the website and it's still listed on SourceForge, and it looks like a single-player RPG. I'm only considering multiplayer RPGs here.

    I suppose what will ultimately matter is if you go into the #planeshift channel on Freenode and get banned for discussing it.

  • ChuckiSpuxChuckiSpux Member Posts: 44

    Hi all,
     
    As someone who worked on PlaneShift, and now on Tempest in the Aether (and worked on both at the same time for quite a few months) all I can say is that this rule sickens me. The director is more than happy to use the Open Source licence and ideals to make his project look good, but has no understanding nor care for the Open Source and what it stands for.
     



    [21:20] <@Talad>; [10:46] <Vakachehk> I won't be suprised if TA gets more art and coding done in a year than PS has in 10
    [21:21] <@Talad>; Vakachehk: advertizing competitor projects is not allowed in here
    [21:21] <@Talad>; and anyway about 5 months passed and they didn't write a single line of code
    [21:21] <@Talad>; just that you know
    [21:24] <@Talad>; that's a failed project, like all spin offs created by hate
    [21:24] <@Talad>; a project should be created by vision, not by hate
    [21:26] <Millian|facepalm> wot?
    [21:33] <Xoel|Banhammah> Technically, isn't saying NO DISCUSSING COMPETITORS a bit hateful?
    [21:34] <Xoel|Banhammah> And I wouldn't say that TA was created by hate, it was created by "Oh damn, I got nothing to do, might as well make my own game project."
    [21:41] <@Talad>; it's not hateful is a rule
    [21:41] <@Talad>; this channel is dedicated to PS
    [21:41] <@Talad>; and to its development
    [21:42] <@Talad>; phrases meant to discredit PS are not well accepted
    [21:43] <@Talad>; plus TA was created in secrecy and backstabbing PS
    [21:43] <@Talad>; and it's officially a PS blacklisted project
    [21:43] <Xoel|Banhammah> One could argue that if there was more acceptance, then talking about TA wouldn't bring up things seen as discrediting to PS.
    [21:44] <Xoel|Banhammah> "PS blacklisted"... that sounds worse than what that poor GM said to me about "all players must enjoy PlaneShift"
    [21:44] <@Talad>; there will be no acceptance of a project made of people that insulted PS and its members multiple times
    [21:44] <@Talad>; of people that spammed dozens of sites with falsity just to discredit us
    [21:45] <@Talad>; and I'm speaking of Tuxide to start with
    [21:45] <Xoel|Banhammah> I don't see the sanity in "blacklisting" a project that half your own devs (some of them no longer a part of PS) work on.
    [21:45] <@Talad>; I'm just waiting TA to get also Link in their ranks
    [21:45] <@Talad>; the list of devs on TA is a joke
    [21:45] <@Talad>; nearly none of them is working on it for real
    [21:46] <@Talad>; but anyway when they will have a great game I guess we will hear about it on?
    [21:46] <@Talad>; *no?
    [21:46] <Xoel|Banhammah> And yet all of them are registered on the TA Waves. And forums.
    [21:46] <@Talad>; oh yes, registering is a pretty big development effort :)
    [21:46] <@Talad>; not sure if a game can be made with people registrations
    [21:47] <@Talad>; but it's possible
    [21:47] <Xoel|Banhammah> and on the waves somewhere they all accepted the roles that they were voted into.
    [21:47] <@Talad>; that list was mae just to attract more people out of falsity
    [21:47] <@Talad>; which is the usual way that project works
    [21:47] <@Talad>; I have no issues with that Xoel, just don't advertize it here
    [21:48] <@Talad>; that's the rule of this channel
    [21:48] <@Talad>; like it or not
    [21:48] <Xoel|Banhammah> You speak of it as if you know it through and through. Pretty bad way to talk about a whole list of people who have worked on your own project for a cumulative period of decades.
    [21:48] <@Talad>; I know it VERY well Xoel
    [21:48] <@Talad>; even too much to my likings
    [21:49] <@Talad>; and to me it's forgotten now
    [21:49] <@Talad>; go its own way
    [21:49] <@Talad>; don't bring it up because as said it's blacklisted
    [21:49] <@Talad>; I've explained multiple times the why
    [21:49] <Xoel|Banhammah> I just don't get how you can "blacklist" a project... last I checked people play games for fun, not social control.
    [21:50] <@Talad>; [11:44] <@Talad>; there will be no acceptance of a project made of people that insulted PS and its members multiple times
    [21:50] <@Talad>; [11:45] <@Talad>; of people that spammed dozens of sites with falsity just to discredit us
    [21:50] <@Talad>; that's the reason why
    [21:50] <@Talad>; well, one of the reasons
    [21:50] <Xoel|Banhammah> So because one guy (Tuxide) does some admin work and hosting for them, the whole project is blacklisted?
    [21:51] <@Talad>; I'm not going to rediscuss it
    [21:51] <@Talad>; also you resigned as prospet
    [21:51] <@Talad>; *prospect
    [21:51] <@Talad>; so I don't feel I should spend any energy to re-explain it all to you
    [21:51] <@Talad>; there are plenty of very strong reasons
    [21:51] <@Talad>; and they should just be ashamed
    [21:52] * arpu ([email protected]) has joined #planeshift
    [21:52] <Xoel|Banhammah> Well, can you get someone at Freenode to remove my hostmask? No one answered when I was in #freenode
    [21:52] <@Talad>; will be processed
    [21:54] <Xoel|Banhammah> And I think for someone to blacklist another project and enforce such rules, a detailed explanation is the least the community deserves. Especially when they play and test your game for free. That's just my opinion however.
    [21:54] <@Talad>; the community prefers me to spend time on developing the game
    [21:55] <@Talad>; and not in silly drama
    [21:55] <@Talad>; that discussion is completed and gone, months ago
    [21:55] <@Talad>; there is no need to reopen it
    [21:56] * Keella ([email protected]) has joined #planeshift
    [21:57] <Xoel|Banhammah> Well, I personally feel that there are alot of players who would like evidence on the reasons for blacklisting, but again, that's my opinion. It can't be tested with the socially controlling bans on any mention of this project, and therefore the playerbase cannot be sampled, polled, and given what they want or don't want.
    [22:00] <@Talad>; my opinion is that none cares about a non existing project
    [22:00] <@Talad>; when they will have a game up and running, and they will have actually contributed something not stolen from us to the community, then we will maybe discuss it again
    [22:00] <@Talad>; but as said given the way they act, I don't want to have anything to do with them
    [22:01] <Xoel|Banhammah> How is anything "stolen" your engine is OSS... can't be stolen if it's given for free...
    [22:01] <@Talad>; it's the PS engine
    [22:01] <@Talad>; made for PS
    [22:02] <Xoel|Banhammah> So then why is it Open Source if there's no will or intent to share?
    [22:02] <@Talad>; if they want a game, they should make one
    [22:03] <Xoel|Banhammah> Well, the leader was making one. Then he got fired. Funny that.
    [22:03] <@Talad>; right was fired for his behaviour
    [22:03] <@Talad>; now is the lead of that project
    [22:04] <@Talad>; making a mmorpg is harder than you think
    [22:04] <Xoel|Banhammah> well, he needed something to fill his time.
    [22:04] <@Talad>; starting a spin off is just dumb
    [22:05] <@Talad>; yes, and to drain time of others into a project that will be most likely a failure
    [22:05] <Xoel|Banhammah> Realistically, what else could you expect him to do after being fired from something he liked doing so much?
    [22:05] <@Talad>; I really don't care about this question
    [22:06] <@Talad>; he doesn't exist anymore in my universe
    [22:06] <@Talad>; we have enough to do to make PS 0.6
    [22:06] <@Talad>; which will be another big hit
    [22:06] <Xoel|Banhammah> Will it fail to work on the same amount of players computers as 0.5 did?
     

    Here you can see the director enforcing the rule, attempting to justify it's use, and then deciding that his opinions are worth more than his game community who would like to know the reasons for this. He also blatantly calls the Tempest in the Aether team thieves for choosing to use the PlaneShift Open Source engine, despite the fact that it's Open Source, and all of them put countless hours into developing PlaneShift before the split from PlaneShift and creation of Tempest in the Aether.
     
    At Tempest in the Aether, all contributors are encouraged to work together as a team, to foster and help others learn more about game development (as it's a learning curve for us all) and we encourage harmony with all other projects. The director of PlaneShift calls us sneaky liars because we did not tell him about our project to begin with, we had felt this was necessary until we had something to show for ourselves, the existence of the project was leaked to him and our reasoning was proved correct. 
     
    It's sad that he speaks so lowly of hundreds of people from different teams who all put alot of work into his game. I personally spent almost a year developing the only map to be added to PlaneShift in twice as long. While a part of his team I staunchly supported the game and team, but upon the creation of Tempest in the Aether and the ensuing events I decided there were better projects available for me to work on.
  • ChuckiSpuxChuckiSpux Member Posts: 44

    Here's what happened when the director found this thread:



    [10:31] * Haraun_ ([email protected]) Quit ( Quit: You Sir Are Not RP In The Slightest )
    [10:31] <Mishka> yo drey
    [10:31] <@Talad>; cool
    [10:32] <@Talad>; seems it's not possible to do a discussion in here without the usual trolls to report it
    [10:32] <@Talad>; http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/30/view/forums/thread/291222/page/1#3790748
    [10:32] <@Talad>; that's the beauty of being open to discussions
    [10:33] <Xoel|work> "open to discussions"....
    [10:33] <@Talad>; who is ChuckiSpux ?
    [10:33] <Xoel|work> I think the real question is, who isn't ChuckiSpux.
    [10:34] <@Talad>; well, I guess it's you or Vakachehk
    [10:34] <Mishka> "Facism is dead and isn't going to attract players." <== wow, that's serious
    [10:34] <Xoel|work> Guessing or assuming is not a smart tactic in life.
    [10:35] <@Talad>; I'm asking in fact
    [10:35] <@Talad>; but seems someone is too scared to tell who he is
    [10:36] <Xoel|work> Besides, "ChuckiSpux" said he worked on PlaneShift, Vakachehk never worked on PlaneShift. "ChuckiSpux" said he works on TA. It could be any of the many many devs you lost to TA.
    [10:36] <@Talad>; Mishka: you know Tuxide and Link ?
    [10:36] <Mishka> Not too much
    [10:36] <Xoel|work> Anyway, gotta run to work and do a shift.
    [10:36] <Dohmo> Yeah, that facist Talad even posted the link here so you couldn't read it.
    [10:36] <@Talad>; Xoel|work: nice to see you joined the liars band
    [10:36] <@Talad>; same stile
    [10:36] <@Talad>; *style
    [10:37] * DAudioLink ([email protected]) has joined #planeshift
    [10:37] <@Talad>; now you are in the best team ever, Link , Tuxide and you!
    [10:37] <@Talad>; very cool
    [10:37] <@Talad>; congratulations
    [10:37] <Dohmo> Silly stuff people post...facist indeed.. :O
    [10:37] <Xoel|work> Yeah, I noticed Link's been lurking, he never talks though.
    [10:37] <@Talad>; well, I guess I will talk less as well
    [10:38] <@Talad>; to avoid giving the haters like you some food
    [10:38] * Talad sets mode +b *!*@planeshift/prospect/Xoel for #planeshift
    [10:38] * DAudioLink ([email protected]) Quit ( Client Quit )
    [10:38] ->> Xoel|work was kicked from #planeshift by Talad([email protected]/director/Talad) Reason (go hate in another place, thanks.)
    [10:38] <Dohmo> Good job, Talad.
    [10:38] == DAudioLink [[email protected]] has joined #planeshift
    [10:39] == Aljuvialle [[email protected]] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
    [10:39] <@Talad>; he was praising me 3 weeks ago
    [10:39] <@Talad>; got his char having Talad as god
    [10:39] <Tucos> not really that good of a job
    [10:39] <@Talad>; and telling everyone how good we were
    [10:39] <Dohmo> I know he was.
    [10:39] <@Talad>; then Vakachehk got banned, and he started to hate PS and us
    [10:39] <@Talad>; that's silly
    [10:39] <Mishka> he's convinced of his reaons
    [10:39] <@Talad>; 3 weeks, complete turn back
    [10:39] <Mishka> and stubborn
    [10:39] <Mishka> veeeery stubborn
    [10:40] <DAudioLink> Mishka!!!!
    [10:40] <@Talad>; well, he may be convinced, but such a turnback is just ridiculous
    [10:40] <@Talad>; anyway I guess we had 2 historical haters before
    [10:40] <@Talad>; we may have 3 now
    [10:40] * DAudioLink hugs Mishka and then jumps into a lurker cave
    [10:40] <@Talad>; considering we had around 700.000 people trying PS, it's a pretty low percentage :)
    [10:40] <Mishka> I'm jumping too, DAudioLink?
    [10:41] <DJDAL> Only if you lurk
    [10:41] <Dohmo> They'll come and they'll go. I don't get the effort put into it.
    [10:42] == DJDAL has changed nick to DAL|Desktop
    [10:44] == Venalan [[email protected]/gamemaster/venalan] has joined #planeshift
    [10:44] == mode/#planeshift [+v Venalan] by ChanServ
    [10:49] <Vakachehk> Because my ban was very unreasonable as it has no statement in the Planeshift rules, and all that we could find about it is IC punishments which we told GMs we would want it to go IC but they disagreed, and refused to.
    [10:50] <@Talad>; Vakachehk, and is that a reason to then hate the game?
    [10:50] <@Talad>; and spam forums with trolling posts?
    [10:51] <Tucos> of course
    [10:51] <Vakachehk> No, but they are not trolling post we sent in a complaint to HaniX about Ingles response and we got "I back Ingles up" so last place is Complaints Department



    And later...

    [11:15] <@Talad>; also I will say that the people who don't like PS should not sit in this channel
    [11:15] <@Talad>; this channel is a "fan" channel
    [11:15] <@Talad>; made for people who want to support our game and our development
    [11:16] <@Talad>; should not a place where devs have to avoid becuase then trolls will go and post things all over out of context.
    [11:16] <@RlyDontKnow>; I love how you say such things out of nowhere :D
    [11:16] <@Talad>; *should not be a place devs have to avoid becuase then trolls will go and post things all over out of context.
    [11:16] <@Talad>; it's referred to the above discussion
    [11:16] <@Talad>; just half an hour ago
    [11:18] == ravna [[email protected]/program/associate/Ravna] has quit [Quit: Sayonara]
    [11:20] <@RlyDontKnow>; Vakachehk: complaint department was clearly not the last place to go to
    [11:20] <@RlyDontKnow>; we have 3 directos, so you don't have to stop at the gm team leader if it was soooooo unreasonable
    [11:20] <Vakachehk> 3?
    [11:20] <@RlyDontKnow>; and in any case complaint department is *never* even to be considered
    [11:21] <Vakachehk> Then why have a complaints department?
    [11:21] <@RlyDontKnow>; we don't have a public place to announce or bans - be reasonable enough to not cry about yours then and just accept it like everyone else
    [11:21] <@RlyDontKnow>; *our
    [11:21] <Vakachehk> I will not just accept it
    [11:22] <Vakachehk> It was unreasonable, far to long ban time, not dealt with correctly
    [11:22] <@RlyDontKnow>; did you see vvally cry that much? he was banned for a *lot* less
    [11:22] <Vakachehk> so why on earth should I have to do everything right if they cant?
    [11:23] <@RlyDontKnow>; the ban is definetely understandable
    [11:23] <@RlyDontKnow>; if you didn't even recognized what you did wrong, yet, it's definetely too short
    [11:23] <Vakachehk> no it isn't.
    [11:23] == neXyon [[email protected]] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
    [11:24] <Vakachehk> If I wanted to grieve people then why the heck would I be so dumb as to do it on the same IP address, pick up off the floor and not closets, bother RPing a bad alt??
    [11:25] <Vakachehk> obviously I am not dumb and I was wanting it to be RPed and that is why I didn't just delete the character
    [11:26] <@RlyDontKnow>; it's been discussed enough by now, hasn't it? just leave it be
    [11:26] <Vakachehk> But no GMs are to unreasonable to even let me be unban to do my event that I had to cancel
    [11:27] <@RlyDontKnow>; really... just accept the ban
    [11:28] <Vakachehk> No because obviously, this won't be dealt with for future players
    [11:29] <@RlyDontKnow>; well, cry as much as you want then, but don't wonder if you get a forum ban in the end as well o_O
    [11:29] <@RlyDontKnow>; pretty much everything about it has already been said at least twice on the forum
    [11:30] <Vakachehk> 1) Ingles never discussed whether my actions were IC or not, they assumed they weren't. 2) Ingles banned me without even letting me say my side of the story. I bet Vally was discussed. 3) I went to HaniX and the same thing.
    [11:30] <@Talad>; Vakachehk: the discussion on this event has been very deep
    [11:30] <@Talad>; we took the action needed, by restoring the items, and setting the ban
    [11:31] <@Talad>; the ban will expire in ... 10 days now?
    [11:31] <Vakachehk> 4) I go on IRC they tell me to stay calm, Ingles had to sart the first smart comment
    [11:31] <Vakachehk> 29th of September I believe
    [11:31] <@Talad>; all the point you wrote now are known, and public on the forums
    [11:31] <@Talad>; so we know what you think
    [11:31] <@Talad>; and you know what we think
    [11:31] <@Talad>; that has been the decision
    [11:31] <Mishka> Vakachehk, cut it off. You'll get to nowhere.
    [11:32] <@Talad>; you can play again in 10 days
    [11:32] <@Talad>; I understand can be though to wait, but please just wait those days
    [11:32] <Mishka> And sincerely, I thought I was safe and away from all this here…
    [11:33] <Vakachehk> 5) There is nothing -nothing- about robbing GHs, the only thing I have read is in the Octarchy Decree and something Ingles said about on guild forums which was IC also. SO why was my actions dealt with ICly?
    [11:33] <Vakachehk> And that is what I am doing Talad
    [11:33] <@Talad>; good, then we are ok.
    [11:34] <@Talad>; "There is nothing -nothing- about robbing GHs"
    [11:34] <@Talad>; wrong
    [11:34] <@Talad>; there are a lot of policies in making the game fun for others
    [11:34] <Vakachehk> But, I would heavily say do not ban someone for robbing a GHs if you have not writen rules about it
    [11:34] <@Talad>; and not ruining it for others
    [11:34] <@Talad>; we considered that act to be into that category
    [11:34] <@Talad>; because dozens of people collected those items with care and dedication
    [11:35] <@Talad>; and got robbed
    [11:35] <Vakachehk> robbed ICly
    [11:35] <@Talad>; so we considered it to be "spoiling their game experience"
    [11:35] <Vakachehk> so should of been dealt with ICly
    [11:35] <@Talad>; yes, even IC
    [11:35] <@Talad>; could, not should
    [11:35] <Vakachehk> but it wasn't it was dealt with OOCly
    [11:36] <Vakachehk> no should
    [11:36] <@Talad>; then IC-OOC is a different discussion
    [11:36] <@Talad>; as said that's the decision taken and the reasons
    [11:36] <@Talad>; you may disagree
    [11:36] <@Talad>; but still that's it
    [11:36] <Vakachehk> When I came on IRC after my ban I told them my full story and how it was IC but no
    [11:38] <@RlyDontKnow>; Vakachehk: seriously... it's even part of the tutorial
    [11:38] <@RlyDontKnow>; there's nothing wrong with being a baddie ingame, but don't do stuff just to make others mad
    [11:38] <@RlyDontKnow>; and cleaning out a gh clearly is
    [11:38] <Vakachehk> That is what a baddy does isn't it?
    [11:39] <@RlyDontKnow>; cause you're such a known baddie?
    [11:39] <Vakachehk> baddies do*
    [11:39] <Vakachehk> Vieg is
    [11:39] <Vakachehk> Vakachehk had nothing to do with it
    [11:40] <Dohmo> Then Vakachehk shouldn't talk about it so much if he has nothing to do with it.
    [11:40] <Vakachehk> Vakachehk + Vieg = same OOC person
    [11:40] <@RlyDontKnow>; how long do you have that alt
    [11:40] <@RlyDontKnow>; ?
    [11:40] <Vakachehk> 6 months
    [11:41] <Vakachehk> Tessra/Teshia, Glaciusor, Chessire, Sangwa, Dannae, Roberet and all The Dark Empire members know me
    [11:42] <Vakachehk> I had robbed Stashka (Think that's his name) dunno if he knows me though
    [11:42] <Vakachehk> Enonel/Fesso knows me
    [11:42] <Mishka> Feso
    [11:42] <Mishka> And add Kaharro :P
    [11:42] <Mishka> XD
    [11:42] <Vakachehk> a lot of people know Vieg as bad and Keig as the innocent menki :P
    [11:42] <Vakachehk> Kaharro?
    [11:43] <Mishka> Mish knows Keig
    [11:43] <Mishka> Jecewie's bf
    [11:43] <Mishka> Jece is my alt
    [11:43] <Vakachehk> The name sounds familiar
    [11:43] <Mishka> which one? Jece or Kah?
    [11:43] <Vakachehk> ohh yes I think she's the one Xoel told me about
    [11:43] <Vakachehk> Kah
    [11:43] <Mishka> ?
    [11:44] <Mishka> he told you about who? I'm lost
    [11:44] <Vakachehk> Kaharro sounds like a person who accused Akaiddo of telling a GM to make a rogue more powerful to kill them
    [11:44] <Vakachehk> But probably isn't them
    [11:45] <Mishka> Kaharro = Enonel
    [11:45] <Vakachehk> ok no
    [11:46] == niklasboelter [[email protected]/supporter/student/niklasboelter] has quit [Quit: Leaving...]
    [11:49] == Talad has changed nick to Talad|ZzZ


    A PlaneShift forum account was also banned for linking this in their signature (The director's username on wikipedia).

    Note that I nor any of the people who so far have posted here have a major hate on PlaneShift as the director claims, but rather on his leadership style and treatment and abuse of the OpenSource licence and ideals. Our issue is with him, not the game team as he claims. As I have stated before, many members of the PlaneShift development team work on Tempest in the Aether too, a fact that the director repeatedly calls a lie.

    He also seems to confuse In-Character and Out-Of-Character (which are used alot in the PlaneShift role-playing server). He thought that because a character in the game worshipped the in-game god "Talad" (whom he named himself after) the player therefore worshipped him, or at least thought highly of him. He therefore thinks he is this god?

    In one respect he is right. Until three weeks ago when I left PlaneShift I had not spoken out publically against him. However, that is because PlaneShift has an exclusive clause in their licencing/non-disclosure-agreement saying that lower level developers are not to argue with higher level developers in public.... and as it has been made obvious, arguing with him in any way shape or form leads to a quick booting from the community.

    As a final note: He says that there are two, now three "historical haters". He leaves out a long list of developers who left PlaneShift and created/joined the "blacklisted projects" because of issues with him. Most of these people don't have any problems with the PlaneShift project, but with Talad himself.

    To Talad, I know you're watching this thread, I'm still in your channel. You'll never find me, until you ban them all. ;)

  • TaladTalad PlaneShift DeveloperMember UncommonPosts: 80

    The PlaneShift team denies all these false claims and is focused on building the game more than answering to those trolling kids. If you want to see what PlaneShift is, play the game, meet the devs, and you will have a different view.

    Come to play or enhance our game PlaneShift!
  • TaladTalad PlaneShift DeveloperMember UncommonPosts: 80

    Just to clarify ChuckiSpux was a prospect (and not a developer) which praised the game, myself, the devs for long time, then after this brother was banned from the game for stealing a big amount of objects from guildhouses, started to be a hater of the game. This turnback happened in about 3 weeks, without me doing absolutely nothing about it. It's sad and really shows you how people can turn their side on a project for totally personal reasons unrelated to the development team.

    Come to play or enhance our game PlaneShift!
  • ChuckiSpuxChuckiSpux Member Posts: 44

    Originally posted by Talad

    The PlaneShift team denies all these false claims and is focused on building the game more than answering to those trolling kids. If you want to see what PlaneShift is, play the game, meet the devs, and you will have a different view.

    Are you denying that you said all the things I quoted?

    Are you denying the claim that PlaneShift has the exact line in it's IRC channel, stating that speaking about "competitor projects" is not allowed?

    Are you denying that you have also made it an unspoken forum rule at PlaneShift's forums http://hydlaaplaza.com/smf/ , with this as my evidence? 

    Also, would you deny that this PM is in breach of PlaneShift's own forum policies which state that a user will first be warned, and if they do not adhere to the warning the signature will be changed forcibly (mine was changed forcibly, no warning as the policy states, let alone my signature did not breach the forum rules)?

     

    Also would you please stop claiming that "the team" is the target of my "attacks". I've made it clear you're the problem. As I said rather recently, PlaneShift could do with a good PR team to clean up all of these messes you make. Or they could simply get a better leader who doesn't try to sweep problems under the carpet in a blind dash to get the game "finished".

     

    Finally, as I stated before, and since the director cannot read, my brother being banned was the last straw. Until I left the team I was bound by the terms of the NDA licence PlaneShift has, forcing their developers to all agree to the public views of the director. Let me also note that my brother has a mental disability, intended for his actions to be interpreted as that of an in-character thief, and was told by the PlaneShift Game Master team that what he did was intentionally griefing other players, which brought upon him a serious amount of distress. I have discussed this with many Game Masters and come to a peace with them over that, as myself and the Game Masters agree that whilst the action was not intentionally griefing, a strong message needed to be sent to other players that such an action hurt other players and needed to be prevented from happening again.

  • eyeswideopeneyeswideopen Member Posts: 2,414

    [21:44] <@Talad>; of people that spammed dozens of sites with falsity just to discredit us

    [21:45] <@Talad>; and I'm speaking of Tuxide to start with

     

    So Tuxide, what did you do to offend Glorious Leader? I remember when you were the one defending the guy for the longest time.

    -Letting Derek Smart work on your game is like letting Osama bin Laden work in the White House. Something will burn.-
    -And on the 8th day, man created God.-

  • UtMoonUtMoon Member Posts: 99

    I believe he told Talad to start being more civil, and things just went downhill from there.

     

    As per posting dishonest things, the only one I have seen doing that is Talad himself.  A log was posted over at LGT of him firing a follow director and being completely unreasonable, which Talad called a lie. Later in the PlaneShift  IRC channel, he admitted that he did not even read the log, so did not know if it was true or false (I have the log of him admitting he lied, but there has been enough log posting in this thread for now). His defense? Well, it should never have been leaked. I guess that means it should not count?

     

    In his own prospect channel, he lied about the reason the other director was fired, slandered him, and threatened to fire anyone who stood up of him. I have seen that log as well.

     

    As a note about those 700,000 players who have tried the game and only a few turning into haters being a good turn out... I would say that out of 700,000 ACCOUNTS (many many people made more than one account) created, my best guess is that less than 3000 players play the game in a week, most of them being people who try the game for less than an hour, then move on. My guess is based on a data mine of the server a few years back when Talad bragged about having 340,000 accounts created. If the same trends continued, the projected numbers would be as follows:

     

    About 700,000 accounts created.

     

    Accounts never used: 220,000  (Yes, that is about 1/3 never used)

     

    Characters used less than an hour: 280,000

     

    Characters used more than 10 hours: 30,000 (remember, 4 characters can be made on each account)

     

    If we crunch the numbers, and give the benefit of the doubt and say on average that each person created two characters (so 140,000 players for the 280k number), that means that 360,000 people never played the game more than an hour, if at all. The rest drop off well before 10 hours. Given how easy it is to log 10 hours on a game, ESPECIALLY an MMO based on grinding, those are pretty dismal numbers. planeshift looks to be the ultimate revolving door MMO. If Talad wants to call me a liar, troll, or whatever like he is fond of doing to anyone who does not agree with him, then ask him to poll the database again to get the true numbers and post them somewhere. My guess on what his answer will be? Something like “I don’t have the time to waste on haters.”

     

    His typical responses seem to follow this pattern:

     

    Indignation.

    Accusation of lies.

    Calling everyone trolls or malcontents.

    Threats.

    When all that fails, childish attacks and name calling when cornered.

     

    I am also going to assume he is going to try to assassinate my character and say I can't be trusted since I worked for him for over a year without signing his precious NDA. I then retracted my original work a year after I quit when I saw his true colors and total disrespect of the Open Source community. The main reason I quit is because he has created an unhealthy work environment full of paranoia and draconian control. I would like to see someone on the team come forth and say that that has changed, but one of the rules of the NDA is to NEVER talk about what goes on in the team, especially if it is bad.

    I changed my mind. PlaneShift is not worth the time.

  • ChuckiSpuxChuckiSpux Member Posts: 44

    Oh UtMoon, how I loathe, hate and absolutely adore you at the same time ;)

  • TuxideTuxide Member UncommonPosts: 213


    Originally posted by eyeswideopen
    [21:44] <@Talad>; of people that spammed dozens of sites with falsity just to discredit us
    [21:45] <@Talad>; and I'm speaking of Tuxide to start with
     
    So Tuxide, what did you do to offend Glorious Leader? I remember when you were the one defending the guy for the longest time.

    I'm not too sure I follow you here; I don't consider defending an MMORPG to be the same as defending the conduct of its director. Seriously, who the hell would defend a game director who goes to various forums and websites covering his own game and trolls the snot out of them? I particularly find comments like this recent one from the PlaneShift Director to be quite entertaining:


    [...] You have serious problems man, really really serious problems. [...] You have a hole in your head instead of a brain. And yes, you read it right, that's what I said. Now go and ask your big daddy admins to ban me, like a small girl crying for being subtracted his toy. [...]

    I know I said before that if PlaneShift promoted uncivil behavior then I couldn't find the time to deal with it then, but now fortunately I'm finding plenty of it to address this issue myself. One of the things we all need to understand here is that not everyone is going to like us. Not everyone has to either. This is just one of the many things that you have to be willing to accept when you make an MMORPG and it amasses 700,000 or whatever registered accounts.


    Originally posted by Talad
    The PlaneShift team denies all these false claims...

    Somebody please go into the #planeshift channel on Freenode and post on this thread what the channel topic is so I can correct the OP if it is wrong.

  • ChuckiSpuxChuckiSpux Member Posts: 44

    The topic is still the same, but now " | tail chopping hour" has been added to the end.

    I'm not even going to ask what that means.

  • TuxideTuxide Member UncommonPosts: 213

    No idea, but I edited the OP anyways for accuracy.

  • UtMoonUtMoon Member Posts: 99

    Screenshot from a few hours ago. Nick info blacked out to protect the user from any vindictive actions.

    I changed my mind. PlaneShift is not worth the time.

  • LhaaLhaa Member Posts: 4

    It probably means Planeshift will have even less players and developers when all the tails are chopped. ;)

     

    Ah, so much fun in this thread, excuse me if I don't spend much time here writing, I really have much better things to do than discrediting a half-game, specially when its own author does it so well himself. Also I'm done warning people about the ongoings in PS since I've done over and over and in 80% of the cases people still got involved and had to feel the smack in their own face, then give me the point (yes ChuckiSpux, that's for you too ;), so I'll just let people get smacked from now on. I don't care anymore. But you gave me a good time so thought I'd say hello.

     

    In regard to the account numbers... besides the data UtM posted which is probably quit accurate, in my 4 years playing Planeshift I have had six active accounts I've used often. Same goes for plenty other roleplayers since you don't always want to kill and delete a character when you create a new one. Chances are half of the players who have been around a while have at least 2-3 accounts if not many more. A question thrown to the wind anyway, since i've never tried myself and I don't know if this is possible. Any of you ever tried to actually delete an IG account?

     

    As for Ingles' behavior, here you have a good example of his ways: http://outlaws.myfreeforum.org/about1255.html

    In this thread, he even registered in our forums only to come support his GM alias with another name, now that's definitely the attitude I'd have if I had nothing to hide or to be ashamed of. ;)

     

    So Talad, I guess it doesn't feel good to not be able to delete mine and other posts here? After you deleted one of my FULL accounts, including posts where I was congratulating people, or just giving a heads up, it must be a great feeling of impotence to see how people do come here to say what you actually don't let them say in your forums, isn't it? I'm very, very disappointed to not see my name in your list of haters, for somebody who had 3 accounts banned from your forums this is quite the insult. You're rude. :P

    The PlaneShift team denies all these false claims and is focused on building the game more than answering to those trolling kids. If you want to see what PlaneShift is, play the game, meet the devs, and you will have a different view.

    You really need a PR agent before you're the only dev and player left. People do expect arguments in response, if you don't have any it's smarter to stay quiet rather than making an evidence that you don't have them.

    Those 3-4 (300-400 in fact) haters are actually all people that once loved Planeshift, and that have turned against it mostly due to your own fault. You'd be better thinking what are you doing wrong than trying to shut them up, so that even if those remain there won't be many more in the future.

    And as you see I'm not hiding in random aliases like your team members do, join my forums anytime. o/

     

    EDIT: Fixed the link, these forums are weird to me yet. :P

    The Planeshift setting open for players: The Mind's Eye Library.

    More info here: http://outlaws.myfreeforum.org/about1359.html

  • TuxideTuxide Member UncommonPosts: 213

    Dang what's up with all these people attacking GMs, nobody cares about them. Players tend to be more interested in the feuds coming from the developers than they do in even the content or features of the games they work on, or GM drama. In my opinion, the game director himself has been the most entertaining part of the game lately.

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