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WAR 2 factions more likely now that.
Jetrpg
Member UncommonPosts: 2,347
Well my brother spoted something today
From the main site under game info this is a quote:
"Side with the forces of Order, or the vile hosts of Destruction, in a war that will unlock ancient secrets, reveal dark purposes, and determine the fate of the Sargos Sector."
Oh no two sides. I really hope this is not the case but there it is my friends make of it what you will. (There is hope this is a general comment about imp vs chaos, but it looks bad).
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
Comments
there is about 50 threads with this from the moment the trailer was launched at E3, just sayin
But the trailer doesn't say that.
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
No, but everybody else did.
They need to do ALOT of work on this game. If they half ass the graphics / combat system people are going to stay away because they already have a negative few from the current WAR mmo. Even though its made by a different developer, having the name warhammer will make people remember how much @55 this one sucked. If Dark Millennium has the tab to target then press 1 - 2 -3 combat and cartoon network graphics, might as well label it dead before it even launches.
lol, side with the forces of order, or the forces of destruction...
Sounds exactly like the 2 sides in Warhammer Online...exactly like them in fact...
I wonder if they will include the same races as well? And the same promisingly awesome game that turns out to be total crap?
I am entitled to my opinions, misspellings, and grammatical errors.
The forces of Order and Destruction are GW, not just randomly picked and happen to be exactly like Warhammer Online. That's their thing.
Regardless, even if there are 2 factions, hopefully there will be inner-Faction fighting as nobody can get along in Warhammer 40k.
yeah thast why this bit of info is so scary i feel that war40k needs more than 2 sides to be good. You need somethign that balances side pop imblaences and makes the game more chaotic and exciting.
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
Look, they are going with the two side set-up because it works. There are a lot of reasons for it. First, it helps with population balance. We all know that basically everyone will want to be a space marine or their chaos brothers. Lets say that each race was separate, are orcs or eldar or whoever else going to be able to compete with the probable hoard of space marines? Its not just space marines either, any groups could be more or less popular, and having 6 sections of community rather than 2 can make that a whole lot more obvious.
Secondly, each group has to be balanced against all other groups. If everyone is separate, then orcs need to be able to do everything that spacemarines can, who have to be comparable to chaos. By grouping sides together, maybe only the IG have to have a sniping class on the side of order. Maybe the heaviest tanks belong to one group in a faction, the rest are more offensive. By grouping them together, you have a larger number of niche classes you can create. Its unreasonable to have 12 spacemarine classes, but 12 classes on order? That is likely.
Also, not every game can be WoW, its quite likely that, even if successful, DMO will have at max 1mil users. As time goes on, that number may lower, and that is only made worse by a large number of factions. If 100,000 people are on a server, and divided into two groups, 50k a pop isn't bad. Its likely you'll find people on your side to play with. If you had 6 factions, thats ~16.6k per side. Chances of you being able to find your raid group or whatever just went down by a lot.
I don't think you'll see more than 2 or 3 factions in any MMOs, it just doesn't make any sense from a game design standpoint. The developer's responsibility is first and foremost to make a good game. Making it fit the lore is important, but not as important as basic game design stuff. Don't go saying 2 factions will ruin the game, when almost every MMO around has two. Are there exceptions? Yes, but few and far between. I think age of camalot and FFXI had three each. I think face of mankind and fallen earth have six each, but how well is that really working for them?
Yes but the website came online at the same time the trailer was realeased. So most people saw it.
Order and Destruction division is a GW thing? I don't think so.
I'm an old school WH40k tabletop player. Rogue Trader & 2nd edition. But I still catch up on alot of the background ("fluff"). In following about 23 years of WH40k "fluff" I have never, ever, ever even heard of the mention of Games Workshop using the terms "Order and Destruction" in categorizing its many factions. Because they constantly fight each other. Humans, Orks, Tau, Eldar, Necrons, Tyranids, Dark Eldar, etc. They fight each other constantly. There may be short lived alliances but those tend to end badly.
A while back when the trailer came out and people were discussing it, I was concerned the game would go the simplistic route of WAR by neatly dumping everyone into 2 factions, which was absolutely wrong with the background. I was hoping to hear otherwise, but I my gut feeling was it was still going that route.
The rest of the game better be d**n amazing with a great storyline and backdrop. Because they're already in a negative light.
"I have only two out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold." (First Lieutenant Clifton B. Cates, US Marine Corps, Soissons, 19 July 1918)
mm!i do hope the op is wrong.because yes you can say there are about two faction in war but god there is a lot of war in same faction good vs good bad bad good vs bad etc.i mean its so deep and complex i do hope dev didnt dum down warhammer story .(that would be bad)
I also hope they do not dumb down and twist the lore so that it ends up only two sides like Warhammer Online. That was one my biggest issues in that game was the Greenskins, Chaos and Dark Elves all hand in hand getting along perfect, uhh yeah right. Greenskins don't even all band together and Chaos has it's 4 major Gods whose followers all fight each other too :P
There is no reason they should have to dumb this down to 2 factions and ruin it. I am sure they can use their brains and come up with some setup that works to allow a lot more chaos and a lot more battle to occur than one side having the bigger zerg and winning.
Wow... I wonder who's bright idea it was to make another Warhammer MMO using the same 2 faction RVR that Mythic used in WAR. It worked out real well the first time right? Seeing as how many people think the lack of a third faction is one of the primary reasons that game is failing, I would have hoped these guys would listen and go 3 factions FFS...
I guess this will just be another failed Warhammer MMO afterall...
But it does, it so totally does. You just need to listen for the secret voices hidden in the music.....listen REALLY HARD .. I promise you will hear them.
Sound crazy? Maybe it is, but not half as crazy as people deciding the entire fate of a video game from one sentence and a short teaser trailer.
"Gypsies, tramps, and thieves, we were called by the Admin of the site . . . "
OP is right to post the EXACT QUOTE. It's the big nail into the coffin for a lot of people sceptical about the WAR + 2 Factions.
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
To sum, I have to disagree and would elect to go for 5-factions: Space Marines, Orks, Chaos Marines, Eldar, Tyranids.
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
But they didn't say or mention it.
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
The Order vs Destruction doesn't have to be reflected in the War. Look at the Horus Heresy. It's a pretty good example of Order vs Destruction.
And the fact that they're naming them "order vs destruction" only further proves my point as if it were a mythic, I doubt Vigil would be allowed to coin the term, just as if another gaming company came along and claimed Alliance vs Horde, Blizz would be all over their asses.
But if it were property of games workshop, who is looking over development like a hawk after Warhammer Online, then it would be perfectly acceptable to coin the same term and was probably enforced by Games Workshop.
Follow the lowest common denominator between the 2 games. Games Workshop. Thats why they're naming them Order vs Destruction. Because GW said so.
It would have been fine if the only playable factions were the Imperium and Chaos, but that is not so. If you look at the trailer, game perspectives are shown from playing as Imperium, Chaos, Orks. Going so far as to show vehicle gameplay for the Imperium and Orks. Just from the trailer alone, you are dealing with 3 factions. And none of those 3 would ever, EVER align with each other, no matter what.
Where ever the idea came from to dilute the WH40k setting in this game to 2 factions and use the very same "Order and Destruction" language (taken from their own website) from the utter failure of WAR needs to get their head examined. The very last thing they need is to follow WAR's example like a Lemming.
Just because Games Workshop is supposedly overseeing this title doesn't mean things will be pretty well. The track record of Warhammer / Warhammer 40k games outside the tabletop is very spotty.
"I have only two out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold." (First Lieutenant Clifton B. Cates, US Marine Corps, Soissons, 19 July 1918)
I am not bothered at all by the two factions really, even if they may not be 100% to the lore, the fact is that they can excuse this by making "virtual" conflicts within the same "faction" on quests etc.. On another note Warhammer did not fail because of the two factions, I dont really understand what ppl are on about, WAR failed because of how keeps were designed, of a badly coded engine with glitchy animations, massive lag on skills, with sorcerers running around with their aoe animations stuck to their feet, with poor endgame content and badly designed dungeons.
3 or 4 factions as ppl want will be a nightmare to balance, if 2 factions are hard as hell already , lets put some more in, there wont be enough content, imbalances will happen a lot more early on, then you will have 2 popular factions and then a 3rd or a 4th with a minority of players that cannot compete because they just dont have enough players.
Now in my opinion let them do the 2 factions, and let them do what lacked in WAR which was a proper war going on, I remember once or twice we had a keep siege that lasted about 5h that is what I expected of WAR and I could even forgive the other stuff, but these moments soon disappeared as ppl did not find any use in actually holding onto the keeps. If they make this right and have proper territorial control then thats all I ask really.
WAR done right within the 40k lore.
Multiple factions just does NOT work on its own, it will be even more watered down the number of ppl and the imbalances, then you are also gimping down the classes as they need to be homogenized for each faction, or end up with a lack of certain things with ppl whining that X faction has advantage then everyone goes to that one.
The ONLY way multiple factions would work would be to have mechanics to allow factions to cooperate to achieve a certain goal in order to counter any imbalances that will certainly happen, and this goes back to the fact that is just better to have 2 factions at war.
So they making the same misstake as Mythic? Another great IP down the drain...
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Using ‘Order and Destruction’ is picking terms that will make sense to everyone, not just WH40k fans. So that’s just good advertising.
But it raises the issue, what has primacy; WH40k lore or dumbed down concepts so everyone understands them without having to know a smidgen about the WH40k universe?
If ‘Order and Destruction’ is used in a promo video thats fine. Used on their website its getting worse, if it is used in game that’s fatal. The idea of a Space Marine thinking he represents a philosophical concept like Order is laughable, it is for the Emperor and the Empire.
If these guys did a Roman Empire MMO would they call the Roman side ‘Order’ and the Goths ‘Destructon’? Don’t dumb it down!
Most ppl are just not that much into the WH40k lore that they care about it, like I said, quests and the story line within these factions can still reflect on their allegiance and their "views" on other races within itself.
In the same manner one could argue that WoW is not faithfull to the Lore which isnt in many cases, yet that doesnt stop it having faction inner conflicts and other lore bits that reflect upon how the lore actually is, this also does not make it a game less enjoyable, WH40k it might be less enjoyable for the hardcore fans of the IP that want it some other way but for most gamers coming in it will be a familiar setting on a different IP with different and refreshing mechanics ( hopefully!).
But just like in WoW the truth of the matter is most gamers once they get into the game they couldnt care less about the lore and focus on guild vs guild conflicts and ladders, most gamers will also only glimpse at the lore and quest text and just enjoy the mechanics on its own and that becomes the game after a while you will only see a small minority in any MMO a few months after release saying "ohh god guys how can X have killed Y in such event".
Depends on how they approach it, hopefully will make it right this time around and put the right effort into making the war mechanics work all the way.
"The person who experiences greatness must have a feeling for the myth he is in."
As long as they don't do the races like Warhammer Online did nothing is stopping them from having pvp between everyone and the factions for pve purposes.