I loved TR and would hop back on that in a second if it reopened. I can only hope RG will think about it, but might be better to just work on a new idea and use what he learned from TR.
And to anyone that questions why people think he's talented, he is credited with creating the term MMORPG in 1997 with Ultima Online. That was the start of it all, not counting MUDs. Too many people inaccurately think it started with Everquest in 1999. So the fact that he helped create the genre means something to the MMO vets that know the history.
Hate to burst your bubble, but Neverwinter Nights back in 1991 was the first real graphical mmorpg, while Meridian 59 was the first mmorpg with a 3D world similar to EQ and everything that's come after it back in 1995.
Hate to burst your bubble, but the phrase was never used prior to Ultima Online. Neverwinter Nights and Meridian 59 were either called graphical MUDs, online roleplaying games, or multiplayer roleplaying games at best. I am well aware Ultima Online wasn't the "first" MMORPG. Nonetheless, Richard Garriott created the term.
Urgh, I hate this. The guy burned tens of millions of dollars out of NCSoft creating a complete failure, and then somehow fully expects to get tens of millions more.
I'm no fan of NCSoft, but Garriot is a complete slime ball.
NCSoft is appealing so no, he didn't "one shot" the Death Star. He still has a ways to go.
No, NCsoft is looking at appealing. Chances are 9 out of 10 they cut there losses now, instead of risking a bigger loss due to a higher reward. Think about it, HUGE company with high priced lawyer TEAMS out the ass, and they lost to one man and his one legal team. If NCsoft had a leg to stand on, they would have won in the first place. No, they found out that the crap they could get away with in a Korean court bought and paid for doesn't fly outside their little hole in the wall.
No way in the world they "cut their losses" at 28 million. This sum will be reduced, and they will tie it up in court.
BTW, just because you win a case for 28 million doesn't mean you see it. Lawyers are usually paid 60%. Then Uncle Same takes his 40% cut. So roughly, he is looking at pocketing 5 or 6 million. Still not too shabby.
I agree.
Your percentages are a bit high however...
No company rolls over for millions of dollars.
They do if the potential is much worse. Look at the various mega corps consent agreements with the Do"J" that on the high end amount to hundreds of millions of dollars. NCsoft might be wise to just write this off and move on. But given their past history, I doubt they are wise.
NCSoft is appealing so no, he didn't "one shot" the Death Star. He still has a ways to go.
No, NCsoft is looking at appealing. Chances are 9 out of 10 they cut there losses now, instead of risking a bigger loss due to a higher reward. Think about it, HUGE company with high priced lawyer TEAMS out the ass, and they lost to one man and his one legal team. If NCsoft had a leg to stand on, they would have won in the first place. No, they found out that the crap they could get away with in a Korean court bought and paid for doesn't fly outside their little hole in the wall.
No way in the world they "cut their losses" at 28 million. This sum will be reduced, and they will tie it up in court.
BTW, just because you win a case for 28 million doesn't mean you see it. Lawyers are usually paid 60%. Then Uncle Same takes his 40% cut. So roughly, he is looking at pocketing 5 or 6 million. Still not too shabby.
I agree.
Your percentages are a bit high however...
No company rolls over for millions of dollars.
They do if the potential is much worse. Look at the various mega corps consent agreements with the Do"J" that on the high end amount to hundreds of millions of dollars. NCsoft might be wise to just write this off and move on. But given their past history, I doubt they are wise.
I seriously doubt the acountants didn't consider the possibility of losing this lawsuit ( and for the full $ 47 million at that ) so there will be a budget taking that into account . If they appeal this verdict they stand a serious chance of losing that appeal and mr Garriott being awarded the original amount of that $47 million . It's obvious his evidence was pretty convincing and the fact NCsoft fired the person responsible for dealing with RG and his resignation is an admission of guilt for any judge or juror .
While I always thought RG was a bit too pretentious with the whole "Lord British" thing, I do think he has made some pretty good games with the Ultima games and Tabula Rasa was a decent game and fairly unique for it's time, being an MMORPG shooter when there weren't really any MMORPG shooters at that time.
A stellar idea is for him to take that money and get started on Ultima Online 2, because he has to know that people want it. Afully 3D realized Ultima Online game would be cool, because I hated the look and art of the original Ultima Online. Or he could remake Tabula Rasa as a f2p and it would probably do well.
While I always thought RG was a bit too pretentious with the whole "Lord British" thing, I do think he has made some pretty good games with the Ultima games and Tabula Rasa was a decent game and fairly unique for it's time, being an MMORPG shooter when there weren't really any MMORPG shooters at that time.
A stellar idea is for him to take that money and get started on Ultima Online 2, because he has to know that people want it. Afully 3D realized Ultima Online game would be cool, because I hated the look and art of the original Ultima Online. Or he could remake Tabula Rasa as a f2p and it would probably do well.
Word has it that he is working on something like a Ultima Online but designed to work out of your web-browser. He's showed great interest in picking up the Ultima License but I imagine EA is never going to let that happen, no matter how much money he tosses at them to try and aquire it. So I imagine a UO like game but in a different setting with different characters..
Whatever he decides to make he has said that he's going back to his rpg roots.
I'm sure there's room for him at Activision...*wicked grin*
Activision couldn't afford to hire him or give him the rights he would want. RG is anything but hurting for money. The guys made enough money that he's set for life and wouldn't ever have to work ageain if he choose to do so.
Needless to say he's already founded a new company thats gearing up to ride another wave of success on the social gaming markets.
welcome to america where nobody loses and even is you suck or make a crappy product you win or get rewarded. if he had brought this to trial in england he would have lost.
welcome to america where nobody loses and even is you suck or make a crappy product you win or get rewarded. if he had brought this to trial in england he would have lost.
Nobody loses? It seems that NCsoft lost (at least this round). If they are wise, they would simply write it off and move on. But I doubt they are wise. As for the English legal system, it has its own shall we say "issues"... Hardly surprising when one examines some of the basic principles so revererd within that system. But how you can say he would have lost without understanding the evidence, and the context within which it has been presented puzzles me.
While I always thought RG was a bit too pretentious with the whole "Lord British" thing, I do think he has made some pretty good games with the Ultima games and Tabula Rasa was a decent game and fairly unique for it's time, being an MMORPG shooter when there weren't really any MMORPG shooters at that time. A stellar idea is for him to take that money and get started on Ultima Online 2, because he has to know that people want it. Afully 3D realized Ultima Online game would be cool, because I hated the look and art of the original Ultima Online. Or he could remake Tabula Rasa as a f2p and it would probably do well.
Word has it that he is working on something like a Ultima Online but designed to work out of your web-browser. He's showed great interest in picking up the Ultima License but I imagine EA is never going to let that happen, no matter how much money he tosses at them to try and aquire it. So I imagine a UO like game but in a different setting with different characters..
Whatever he decides to make he has said that he's going back to his rpg roots.
I think the Lord British thing actually worked quite well in 80s to early 90s gaming. By UO though the image had worn thin and the Ultima series was more or less dead as a franchise. RG is a clever guy so he sells on Origin, and EA who realize fast that they bought a bunch of hot air cancel most of their projects. EQ launches and that finshes off UO, turning it into the retro game it is today. Tabula Rasa is RGs attempt to rebuild himself using his space interest, but the game fails, and RG who is good at business contract law picks up a large payout for it. Really I think RG should just retire, but sadly browser gaming sounds like it may sadly be his direction in gaming over next years.
On the Game: Yes, it was fun. However, it was an MMORPG with less content than a single player RPG! That's what killed it. Imagine if WoW had launched with only five zones and you'll get an idea how little content TR had.
On Richard: He had a $120 million budget for TR. It started out as a Fantasy title and a lot of money and manhours went into that concept. Then, he decides to make it a space game, trashes all the previous work and rushes out an MMO with 10% of the minimum content needed for a successful MMO launch. In short, IMO, he showed himself completely incompetent as an MMO designer, wasted $120 million of NCSoft's money and led to the destruction of all the US based NCSoft development teams. I hope no one is dumb enough to invest in any future MMO products with him at the helm!
On NCSoft: Poor management all around. Where was the oversite to prevent Richard from squandering $120+ million? How could they be dumb enough to sever their relationship with Richard in a way that would open them up to losing this lawsuit? Then, making all US based developers the scapegoats for their poor management takes the cake. They retreat back to Korea. Then they start to realize that they still need the Western market to be truly successful, but they have so neutered their Western operations that they have no ability to develop for the Western Audience.
On the lawsuit: I'm no lawyer and the public details are sparse anyway. I will say that it's pretty obvious that Richard would have a huge advantage in a TEXAS Jury decided suit over a Korean company that on top of being foreign, also cut the jobs of a lot of people in the US, many from Texas. I hate to see him get that amount of money in spite of his apparently unfathomable incompetence.
While I don't think that Richard Garriott has got it as a game designer anymore, he was not totally responsible for the mess that was Tabula Rasa. The game went through a number of iterations, some of them the fault of Garriott's micromanaging style and changing concepts, along with his general inability to get things out under budget and on time. But NCSoft pulled the control from Garriott and put a couple of other guys in as managers. This ended up leading to all sorts of conflicting ideas, and a not fully coherent game. Too many cooks, and all. Interestingly, some of the work on the original Tabula Rasa that was superceded, ended up showing up in Aion.
However NCSoft did try to screw him over with the firing/resignation. Or perhaps they just happened to pick the worst time and way for the parting..... No.
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
Never played Rasa, and dont care about it. Now that Garriott has this behind him, he should get back to what he did best and work on another Ultima game (no more MMOs please)
I think the Lord British thing actually worked quite well in 80s to early 90s gaming. By UO though the image had worn thin and the Ultima series was more or less dead as a franchise. RG is a clever guy so he sells on Origin, and EA who realize fast that they bought a bunch of hot air cancel most of their projects. EQ launches and that finshes off UO, turning it into the retro game it is today. Tabula Rasa is RGs attempt to rebuild himself using his space interest, but the game fails, and RG who is good at business contract law picks up a large payout for it. Really I think RG should just retire, but sadly browser gaming sounds like it may sadly be his direction in gaming over next years.
In all fairness Ultima Online is the longest running MMO on the market, so I wouldn't really say it was a dead license when EA purchased it. They had somewhere around 250,000 players. All said and done it was a very successful project, especially when considering what was invested.
On Richard: He had a $120 million budget for TR. It started out as a Fantasy title and a lot of money and manhours went into that concept. Then, he decides to make it a space game, trashes all the previous work and rushes out an MMO with 10% of the minimum content needed for a successful MMO launch. In short, IMO, he showed himself completely incompetent as an MMO designer, wasted $120 million of NCSoft's money and led to the destruction of all the US based NCSoft development teams. I hope no one is dumb enough to invest in any future MMO products with him at the helm!
On NCSoft: Poor management all around. Where was the oversite to prevent Richard from squandering $120+ million? How could they be dumb enough to sever their relationship with Richard in a way that would open them up to losing this lawsuit? Then, making all US based developers the scapegoats for their poor management takes the cake. They retreat back to Korea. Then they start to realize that they still need the Western market to be truly successful, but they have so neutered their Western operations that they have no ability to develop for the Western Audience.
I think your two points bring up an interesting conflict.
Do we really think richard garriot had enough authority to take a $120 million project and scrap millions of dollars worth of work to drastically change the game without NCSoft having any say in what was happening with their project? Not to mention RG has his roots in swords and magic style gaming, not first person alien shooters.
A change of that scale so late in development suggests that this was a mandate from the leadership of the company. Not to mention that tabula rasa fit most of NCSofts game design of most of their games.
I don't think TR will ever be reopened - either as f2p or otherwise - though and will in all eternity remain on a shelf ,collecting dust. Worst of it is NCsoft tried to pacify us with the "lemon" which is called Aion when they closed TR. Even with all the issues TR was about 20 times better than Aion .
qft
Retired : Daoc , Warhammer , WoW , Lotro , Tabula Rasa , Everquest 2 , Aion, Eve , AoC , SW:Tor ( failwars ), Planetside 2 Waiting : Star Citizen Playing : Star Citizen FPS : Overwatch
Lord British can go back into the hole he crawled out of. Developing games and releasing them just so he can profit, close the servers...taking their money and running...Dumping it on other smaller projects and then claim that NCSOFT stole money..
oh well, He isn't the first and he won't be the last either...
Lord British can go back into the hole he crawled out of. Developing games and releasing them just so he can profit, close the servers...taking their money and running...Dumping it on other smaller projects and then claim that NCSOFT stole money..
oh well, He isn't the first and he won't be the last either...
Games are made to make a profit... It was NCsoft that closed down the TR servers, not RG. NCsoft has now axed four games, I'd say thats a pattern.
Lord British can go back into the hole he crawled out of. Developing games and releasing them just so he can profit, close the servers...taking their money and running...Dumping it on other smaller projects and then claim that NCSOFT stole money..
oh well, He isn't the first and he won't be the last either...
Games are made to make a profit... It was NCsoft that closed down the TR servers, not RG. NCsoft has now axed four games, I'd say thats a pattern.
I'd also add that since Garriott was awarded $28 million I don't think it's fair to say he "claimed" anything as it seems he's proved what ever he claimed lol.
What's crazy is that people has made 100 posts on a dead game. I know there was flaws to that game, but it really looks like people are missing it in some ways!
Maybe with the recent launches, we realize that TR was a better game we thought at the time and with a little bit more work and patience it could had turned into something great!
Comments
Hate to burst your bubble, but the phrase was never used prior to Ultima Online. Neverwinter Nights and Meridian 59 were either called graphical MUDs, online roleplaying games, or multiplayer roleplaying games at best. I am well aware Ultima Online wasn't the "first" MMORPG. Nonetheless, Richard Garriott created the term.
Isle of Kesmai FTW....
And 1200 baud modems lol
Urgh, I hate this. The guy burned tens of millions of dollars out of NCSoft creating a complete failure, and then somehow fully expects to get tens of millions more.
I'm no fan of NCSoft, but Garriot is a complete slime ball.
They do if the potential is much worse. Look at the various mega corps consent agreements with the Do"J" that on the high end amount to hundreds of millions of dollars. NCsoft might be wise to just write this off and move on. But given their past history, I doubt they are wise.
I seriously doubt the acountants didn't consider the possibility of losing this lawsuit ( and for the full $ 47 million at that ) so there will be a budget taking that into account . If they appeal this verdict they stand a serious chance of losing that appeal and mr Garriott being awarded the original amount of that $47 million . It's obvious his evidence was pretty convincing and the fact NCsoft fired the person responsible for dealing with RG and his resignation is an admission of guilt for any judge or juror .
While I always thought RG was a bit too pretentious with the whole "Lord British" thing, I do think he has made some pretty good games with the Ultima games and Tabula Rasa was a decent game and fairly unique for it's time, being an MMORPG shooter when there weren't really any MMORPG shooters at that time.
A stellar idea is for him to take that money and get started on Ultima Online 2, because he has to know that people want it. Afully 3D realized Ultima Online game would be cool, because I hated the look and art of the original Ultima Online. Or he could remake Tabula Rasa as a f2p and it would probably do well.
Word has it that he is working on something like a Ultima Online but designed to work out of your web-browser. He's showed great interest in picking up the Ultima License but I imagine EA is never going to let that happen, no matter how much money he tosses at them to try and aquire it. So I imagine a UO like game but in a different setting with different characters..
Whatever he decides to make he has said that he's going back to his rpg roots.
I'm sure there's room for him at Activision...*wicked grin*
Activision couldn't afford to hire him or give him the rights he would want. RG is anything but hurting for money. The guys made enough money that he's set for life and wouldn't ever have to work ageain if he choose to do so.
Needless to say he's already founded a new company thats gearing up to ride another wave of success on the social gaming markets.
welcome to america where nobody loses and even is you suck or make a crappy product you win or get rewarded. if he had brought this to trial in england he would have lost.
so say we all
Nobody loses? It seems that NCsoft lost (at least this round). If they are wise, they would simply write it off and move on. But I doubt they are wise. As for the English legal system, it has its own shall we say "issues"... Hardly surprising when one examines some of the basic principles so revererd within that system. But how you can say he would have lost without understanding the evidence, and the context within which it has been presented puzzles me.
Word has it that he is working on something like a Ultima Online but designed to work out of your web-browser. He's showed great interest in picking up the Ultima License but I imagine EA is never going to let that happen, no matter how much money he tosses at them to try and aquire it. So I imagine a UO like game but in a different setting with different characters..
Whatever he decides to make he has said that he's going back to his rpg roots.
I think the Lord British thing actually worked quite well in 80s to early 90s gaming. By UO though the image had worn thin and the Ultima series was more or less dead as a franchise. RG is a clever guy so he sells on Origin, and EA who realize fast that they bought a bunch of hot air cancel most of their projects. EQ launches and that finshes off UO, turning it into the retro game it is today. Tabula Rasa is RGs attempt to rebuild himself using his space interest, but the game fails, and RG who is good at business contract law picks up a large payout for it. Really I think RG should just retire, but sadly browser gaming sounds like it may sadly be his direction in gaming over next years.On the Game: Yes, it was fun. However, it was an MMORPG with less content than a single player RPG! That's what killed it. Imagine if WoW had launched with only five zones and you'll get an idea how little content TR had.
On Richard: He had a $120 million budget for TR. It started out as a Fantasy title and a lot of money and manhours went into that concept. Then, he decides to make it a space game, trashes all the previous work and rushes out an MMO with 10% of the minimum content needed for a successful MMO launch. In short, IMO, he showed himself completely incompetent as an MMO designer, wasted $120 million of NCSoft's money and led to the destruction of all the US based NCSoft development teams. I hope no one is dumb enough to invest in any future MMO products with him at the helm!
On NCSoft: Poor management all around. Where was the oversite to prevent Richard from squandering $120+ million? How could they be dumb enough to sever their relationship with Richard in a way that would open them up to losing this lawsuit? Then, making all US based developers the scapegoats for their poor management takes the cake. They retreat back to Korea. Then they start to realize that they still need the Western market to be truly successful, but they have so neutered their Western operations that they have no ability to develop for the Western Audience.
On the lawsuit: I'm no lawyer and the public details are sparse anyway. I will say that it's pretty obvious that Richard would have a huge advantage in a TEXAS Jury decided suit over a Korean company that on top of being foreign, also cut the jobs of a lot of people in the US, many from Texas. I hate to see him get that amount of money in spite of his apparently unfathomable incompetence.
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
While I don't think that Richard Garriott has got it as a game designer anymore, he was not totally responsible for the mess that was Tabula Rasa. The game went through a number of iterations, some of them the fault of Garriott's micromanaging style and changing concepts, along with his general inability to get things out under budget and on time. But NCSoft pulled the control from Garriott and put a couple of other guys in as managers. This ended up leading to all sorts of conflicting ideas, and a not fully coherent game. Too many cooks, and all. Interestingly, some of the work on the original Tabula Rasa that was superceded, ended up showing up in Aion.
However NCSoft did try to screw him over with the firing/resignation. Or perhaps they just happened to pick the worst time and way for the parting..... No.
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
That game wasn't so great. Then again, just shooting lasers and aliens wasn't my thing. It got really boring really fast
He should take that cash and make a decent game. Or rather fund a decent game.
Never played Rasa, and dont care about it. Now that Garriott has this behind him, he should get back to what he did best and work on another Ultima game (no more MMOs please)
In all fairness Ultima Online is the longest running MMO on the market, so I wouldn't really say it was a dead license when EA purchased it. They had somewhere around 250,000 players. All said and done it was a very successful project, especially when considering what was invested.
I think your two points bring up an interesting conflict.
Do we really think richard garriot had enough authority to take a $120 million project and scrap millions of dollars worth of work to drastically change the game without NCSoft having any say in what was happening with their project? Not to mention RG has his roots in swords and magic style gaming, not first person alien shooters.
A change of that scale so late in development suggests that this was a mandate from the leadership of the company. Not to mention that tabula rasa fit most of NCSofts game design of most of their games.
qft
Retired : Daoc , Warhammer , WoW , Lotro , Tabula Rasa
, Everquest 2 , Aion, Eve , AoC , SW:Tor ( failwars ), Planetside 2
Waiting : Star Citizen
Playing : Star Citizen
FPS : Overwatch
Yt chan : https://www.youtube.com/user/raine187
Lord British can go back into the hole he crawled out of. Developing games and releasing them just so he can profit, close the servers...taking their money and running...Dumping it on other smaller projects and then claim that NCSOFT stole money..
oh well, He isn't the first and he won't be the last either...
Games are made to make a profit... It was NCsoft that closed down the TR servers, not RG. NCsoft has now axed four games, I'd say thats a pattern.
I'd also add that since Garriott was awarded $28 million I don't think it's fair to say he "claimed" anything as it seems he's proved what ever he claimed lol.
Tabula Rasa, Auto Assault, Exteel and Dungeon Runners?
I never really took the time to put that together. Good point.
What's crazy is that people has made 100 posts on a dead game. I know there was flaws to that game, but it really looks like people are missing it in some ways!
Maybe with the recent launches, we realize that TR was a better game we thought at the time and with a little bit more work and patience it could had turned into something great!
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