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The Truth About Factions in Fallen Earth and Request for Comments/Opinions
sanskrit
Member UncommonPosts: 95
Fallen Earth is a small independently developed and published game with a small population.
Fallen Earth advertises a faction system as a core aspect of the game, specifically a six faction system (envision a wheel) whereby each faction has two allied factions, two enemy factions, and one nemesis/archenemy faction, depending on how the faction in question is situated on the wheel. Sounds interesting, right?
Well truth is that two large zerg clans, due to raw number power and influence in the game and with the devs, have completely subverted this highly touted faction system at the expense of the clans who try to function legitimately within the faction system. There has been no help from the devs, who seem to have somewhat compromised objectivity, at least where one, and maybe both, of the zerg clans is concerned.
One zerg clan is just your typical MMO zerg, cited for exploiting but let off with a warning by the devs (public handslap), setting up smurf clans, always looking for angles, growing its membership indiscriminately and hugely, that sort of thing. There's one or some of those in every game. These types of clans make great "bad guys" and are fun to humiliate in larger games, population allowing.
The other zerg clan is constantly waging a forum war to rationalize its playstyle, asking that the faction system be removed entirely for its benefit, and makes thread after thread lobbying the devs for help for its "zerginess", and individual help for its characters via nerf calling, etc. This clan at first glance appears very helpful to the game, doing lots of work on the test server, etc., but as one becomes familiar with their ingame activities and forum tactics, it becomes apparent that they are mostly just interested in helping themselves and maintaining their zerg, and have no true concern for the health of the overall game whatsoever.
In larger games, no problemo, business as usual. Lots of spare population about to break the zerg or at least fight against it until it collapses internally as they all seem to eventually do. In smaller games, like FE, the endgame social dynamic has been reduced to a very few healthy "too big" clans and a multitude of clans unable to stay afloat or struggling. Recruiting members in tiny MMOs is a zero sum game, one clan's gain is another's loss. Add to that human nature dictates that the average players end up trying to go with the zergs, maybe even rolling alts and leaving their small struggling clans to do so. Since WoW, everyone seems to want to go with the biggest rather than attempt to maintain an identity.
What is shaping up is that if one wants to play Fallen Earth endgame, one must join one of the zergs or at least befriend them. Eh, not such a big deal either, don't like it, vote with your feet, unsubscribe, and go play something else.
Recently, though, after the release of a large content patch, the issue has come to a head. The two large zergs have allied together and blockaded the hot new pvp zone, either charging a toll to enter the zone, or just zerg-killing any who try to come in. They defend this as "roleplaying" extortionists, or as preventing someone else from taking the zone over.
If you were a player who didn't want to play another same old zerg v zerg game, and thought that the devs had been dishonest about the true nature of the faction system they claim anchors the game, but really liked certain aspects of the game, what would you do? The limited population prevents any meaningful retaliation. Would you:
1. Just unsubscribe and move on, look for another game where the devs are more honest about the true nature of their game mechanics as opposed to falsely advertising a faction system that really doesn't exist in any meaningful way?
2. Hang out and hope for them to take the faction system they advertise seriously?
3. Give in and just zerg up with the rest of them?
Another question I wanted to ask for feedback on is that some players of FE take the position that "zerg = success" and that success should be rewarded ingame. My position is that it's harder not to form a zerg than to form one, past a certain critical mass, and that zerging is not good gameplay, especially in tiny games. But I admit I could be wrong in this.
By zerg, incidentally, I mean growing the clan roster as large as possible and using raw numbers to dominate the game world.
I have some respect for lots of the posters here, and wanted to open this topic up for discussion.
Finally, for those who see Fallen Earth boxes or ads or free trial offers and are attracted to the faction system, please read the above and be forewarned. The only meaningful high level pvp in Fallen Earth is based on membership in large zerg clans and has nothing whatsoever to do with any faction system, the faction system is being treated as completely irrelevant by the devs, despite its prominence in their copy, If you like games that revolve strictly around zerging, FE may be a good choice, if not, avoid the game, at least in its current state.
Comments
The pvp mechanics of this game have been seriously flawed since day 1 and zone 1. Arena/cropped zone pvp and meaningless faction design.
What are your thoughts on zerging in MMOs? Has been in all pvp games since the genre originated. Is it preventable by devs? Should it be prevented? Do you think social engineering of clan size by MMO designers is warranted? or too much restriction on players?
Some games address it with limited population pvp zones and boot everyone not in one of the pvp parties from the zone. This seems to work.
One other thing I wanted to add to the OP, Fallen Earth is not a FFA pvp game, you can't just hunt the zergers down individually, you have to face them as a mass in designated pvp zones.
Zymurgeist, what makes you say so? Care to elaborate? DId you play FE and experience what I am describing in the OP?
Its preventable. But not when mechanics enable meaningless factions and consequence-less game-play.
Sad to hear about the state of an otherwise very promising game. Glad on the fact that I didnt invest more time beyond the trial as the faction mechanic was one of the main draws for me. I dislike zerging on both sides. It defeats any or all possible competition that comes from PvP. Makes it feel like a cheap winner or a disgruntled loser.
I have switched sides when one grew to big and the fun dropped for me. There will never be a perfect balance, but when you reach a point when both clans are basically stonewalling everyone else in their gameplay then it comes time to simply leave. I wouldn't waste my time with such gutteral trash that feel they must impose themselves upon the rest of the player population. And that goes double for Devs that allow it to happen. So yes I would unscribe and move on.
Couldn't agree more.
I can't stand to hear about this kind of trash going on under the guise of "meta-game" or "roleplaying". Such a shame, because while I didn't maintain my sub to FE, the game definitely showed promise and it stayed on my drive for a while in hopes that some things would be changed for the better. Pretty glad I moved on, now.
"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it."
George Bernard Shaw
What is a cynic? A man who knows the price of everything and the value of nothing.
Oscar Wilde
But have you guys ever played a quasi sandbox MMO that didn't have zerging? I mean, up to a certain point, zerging is just good clan recruiting and given the high attrition rates of MMO clans, it's hard to tell when enough is enough.
Now in the cases mentioned in the OP, they both know they are too big, and are zerging purposefully, even continuing to grow, so not talking about them specifically.
Is using raw numbers to achieve undue advantage in an mmo the responsibility of the devs to remedy, or of the players? My personal feeling is that it is primarily the clan leaders' responsibility, but the clan leaders in question claim they are just playing the game the devs give them.
Finally, does "zerg = success" in mmos? I don't think so, but others seem to. Thoughts?
I think the statement that the devs are closely linked with the larger pvp clans certainly has some merit to it
Zerging in FE is detrimental to everyone else not involved only becasue, you said it, FE is a very small game with a small comunity.
Sure, I can vote with my wallet and move on, but where do I find a game like FE? I have no desire to join the flock (zerg), and when devs lend an ear to the major vocal clans instead on focusing on making the factions meaningful, my only option is to move on for a while and hope the devs pull heads out of a*** before the game collapses.
So am I to gather that this is a game that starts PvE and ends with a broken PvP endgame environment? I'm a PvE type and tolerate PvP as needed, but given how much I've enjoyed the game so far (relatively new) it's disappointing to hear that it degenerated--once again--in to a borked PvP environment at the end.
On the other hand, if the PvE ride prior to endgame is long and fun, I will keep at it.....
Current MMOs: Rift, GW2, Defiance
Blog: http://realmsofchirak.blogspot.com (old school tabletop gaming and more)
The endgame pvp system is currently set up to benefit only large clans. So if you are the type who comes into a game looking to join the biggest clan possible and ride their coattails, FE is an option, though I would question that gaming mentality as being kind of weak, perfect for WoW kiddies and the ilk. You will have exactly -four- options. Two of these clans are ruining endgame for all where pvp is concerned, are a bit too involved in the game (very obviously the entirety of their lives), as well as ruining lots of other aspects of FE via self-interested toadying of the devs. In a larger FFA game this would be no problem, in FE it is crippling. There are 0 small, -healthy- pvp oriented clans.
As far as PvE, there are severe redundancy/grinding problems in upper end PvE content. Once you are level-capped, there is not much PvE content that doesn't involve extremes of repetition.
I will be checking back into the game in a few months to see if the team can remedy these issues. There is talent on the FE dev team, will be interesting to see if and how (particularly how fast) they address the faction and other issues. My disappointment over the last month has been that I've had several gaming buddies from all over interested in what I'm playing, and unfortunately couldn't recommend they start up FE in its current state. I'm going to tread very carefully before spending significant time in small, independent MMOs going forward, the potential for self-interested, immature player groups to "wreck" this size of game is just too much of a risk.
I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
~Albert Einstein
While some would find that engaging and fun, others much rather rage about zergs on a message board. For the onlooker, either path is entertaining to watch.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
I understand and sympathize with those who rage, so long as they are raging because infiltration and disruption are not compatible with their style of gameplay. If they are raging because they were too stupid to think of this time-honored method, I have no pity for them at all. So long as the devs give free rein to infiltration and disruption (and they'd better, or they'll have shat in their own sandbox) this method is probably the best way to weaken these large, openly recruiting groups of players. Organize some like-minded players, roll up some alts, and get to work spreading mistrust, poison rumors, and confusion.
Edited to add: Keep it IN GAME. Spreading rumors about, for example, the real life romantic shenanigans of other players probably won't be tolerated by even the most tolerant GMs, and shouldn't be.
I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
~Albert Einstein
Damn, I like the way you think.
Please tell me you play EVE!
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
I did try Eve, actually, but I'm trying my best at the moment to save money for a computer upgrade (I lagged some even playing Eve, and other than Eve, the only thing my system will run are games of about that age, WoW (and I'm bored of WoW) and some f2p games. So I'm suffering through a Summer of f2p in hopes of acquiring a video card, motherboard, and processor that won't choke in chorus every time I try a game like Fallen Earth (which I'm very much looking forward to playing, zerg or no zerg).
To me, if a game lets people be jerks, that's fine and can even be fun, so long as some form of retaliation is possible. The current Fallen Earth zerg situation sounds like the complex, underhanded sort of fun that gives depth to pvp.
I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
~Albert Einstein
I do agree with the infiltrate and disrupt idea. I played Eve and was driven out because of the groups that created blockades and impossible for independents to play the game.
However, I don't understand why the devs don't use zerging to their advantage. Zerging is well known and obviously happens - so why try to have the game prevent it. Why not create it as part of the game. For example in large unclean societies disease and sickness would become a significant problem. Why not have diseases or plaques that start within groups as they reach a certain size. The cure could be having to leave the clan and live somewhere else - otherwise you gradually weaken so even a noob on a trial account can take you out.
This zerging is a perfect example of what is likely to happen in a FE post-apocoplypse type of environment. The question is do the devs have the creativity to allow the game to work through it.
This is a great opportunity for someone like a "Road Warrior" to come out of no where and rescue the helpless small clans that are attempting to defend themselves. Can you imagine being granted "Road Warrior" status as an independent and being required to identify and help a smaller clan or lose your status.
I just started Sector 3 today, so when will I start to see the impact of these two large clans? So far, I've been playing the game as a solo experience and I am not in a clan. Most of the time, I've done the quests in S1 and S2 with hardly anybody else even around.
I should start off by saying this sounds unfair. I personally would not play a game that did this... but upon further review, I think the PvP system is far more successful than we realize. It sounds like something that could happen in RL in the same "post-apocalyptic" situation. Gangs taking control and treating the rest of the population unfairly.
I'm not advocating this type of game play but in all honesty, this sounds kind of cool (I can say that because I'm not a part of it). It would almost be unfair if the developers did step in to correct the problem in this case because in real life you would not have access to a "greater authority" to snap their fingers and correct the unjust. It could disrupt the community already created and take the life out of the game.
If I was a developer I would use this opportunity to create a "hero" system and bestow upon some worthy player temporary "boss/elite mode" to attack these players like Mad Max in some crazy movie. I know not many people would be in favor of this but at least I would weaken the larger factions to some degree.