Originally posted by Wraithone Oh come on! BoB was bad, but never anything as bad as the Goonies. They have their sticky fingers in just about every dirty trick, exploit and scam in the galaxy. The first and third are only to be expected, but the second should not be tolerated.
Don't pretend any of those entities was better than the other. It just makes you look stupid.
Another reason I will not play eve besides I dont like the skills system.
The exploits in eve are nothing compared to the exploits available in most MMO's and to their credit CCP are very quick to plug exploits. I certainly wouldnt make a buying decision based on exploitation, lol.
WRONG
EVE has FULL LOSS when you die. Yea insurance can pay for a cheap ship, but NOT any fittings, or T2/T3 faction.
Oh come on! BoB was bad, but never anything as bad as the Goonies. They have their sticky fingers in just about every dirty trick, exploit and scam in the galaxy. The first and third are only to be expected, but the second should not be tolerated.
Don't pretend any of those entities was better than the other. It just makes you look stupid.
"Better" in what sense? At dirty tricks, exploits and scams? Thats the Goonies, obviously. No pretense required, just a knowledge of history.
Another reason I will not play eve besides I dont like the skills system.
The exploits in eve are nothing compared to the exploits available in most MMO's and to their credit CCP are very quick to plug exploits. I certainly wouldnt make a buying decision based on exploitation, lol.
WRONG
EVE has FULL LOSS when you die. Yea insurance can pay for a cheap ship, but NOT any fittings, or T2/T3 faction.
Exploits are MASSIVE when full loss is a factor.
Exactly. Insurance pays at best for the cost of the mats for a T1 ship. Mods usually cost much more than the ship itself. T2 and T3... Losing those and their mods can get pricy fast.
Oh come on! BoB was bad, but never anything as bad as the Goonies. They have their sticky fingers in just about every dirty trick, exploit and scam in the galaxy. The first and third are only to be expected, but the second should not be tolerated.
Don't pretend any of those entities was better than the other. It just makes you look stupid.
uummm isn't that what you tried to do in your post by saying BoB was far worse than any of the others?
Please continue to pay your monthly fee.. working as intended.
So true.
People use macro bots to mine all the time because that's half the game and mining sucks! They try to mine as much isk as possible so they can afford to play the "real Eve game".
"It's a sandbox, they provide only the tools to create your own adventure." Even if the adventure is completely exploited. LoL
The sad part is alot of these people using exploits and bots and cheats in Eve are long time subscribers that degenerate into using these so they can "have fun".
"I'm not cheap I'm incredibly subconsciously financially optimized" "The worst part of censorship is ------------------"
"Better" in what sense? At dirty tricks, exploits and scams? Thats the Goonies, obviously. No pretense required, just a knowledge of history.
Last i checked goons didn't use dev contacts to upgrade their region / spawn bpos / intimidate gms into doing what they want.
So yes, you're making yourself look incredibly stupid right now. Good job.
Originally posted by Typhado
uummm isn't that what you tried to do in your post by saying BoB was far worse than any of the others?
No, they're both horrible. As i was saying. But i will call people out if they try to rewrite history.
You keep using that word... "I don't think it means, what you think it means". ^^ Its always amusing to watch Goonie agiprop at work. Your above is taken chapter and verse from their usual talking points. The usual mixture of bitterness and arrogance that seems to define them. Yes, both groups ARE horrible. But I can't seem to remember BoB playing out of game psych ops games on holiday weekends, directed at CCP. Which of course badly flopped because CCP handled the attack much faster and more professionally than the Goonies expected. That too is history.
It’s a little harder to feel safe in space at the moment, knowing that the now-confirmed (and quickly becoming widespread) exploit allowing players to delay their appearance in local chat could leave you popped or podded without requiring the usual navigational error on your part. The exploit seemed at first to only be known (or at least used) by relatively few players, but needless to say, many, after hearing it exists and watching videos (part 1 | part 2) of it in use, have now managed to replicate the feat.
“A nasty exploit has raised its ugly head in EVE Online this week, allowing players to prevent themselves from showing up in the local chat channel. Unless you’re in a wormhole system, this channel is meant to show a list of every pilot in the system and must update instantly when a player jumps in… If a pilot were able to somehow hide himself from the local channel, he could sneak up on unsuspecting victims without them knowing he’s there.”
“The possibility of an exploit came to light on Monday when EVE player “SuperTight5″ tried desperately to reconcile his death with what he knew of the game mechanics. Three pilots from Pandemic Legion alliance showed up in the local channel list only three seconds before appearing beside SuperTight5’s ship and engaging him… Theories from forum-users on what might have happened included delayed packets, desynch or network issues causing the appearance of the pilot in local to be delayed.”
In the course of the thread, which has now reached over 30 pages, it came to light that a large number of Russian players had also been attacked by the same group of three pilots. Offenders “The Monkeysphere”, “Goose Hypocrisy” and “lol internets” have been recorded as killing over 150 billion ISK’s worth of ships together and a look at their killboard details suggests a lot of those kills have been suspicious. Targeting lone Russian pilots hunting NPCs or mining in nullsec, they’ve somehow managed to catch hundreds of pilots off-guard and suffered minimal losses.
Another theory proposed in the thread was that the three pilots were targeting mostly macro-ratters and macro-miners, which also rely on local to cue them to get to safety.
In their own investigation organised on an off-site Russian forum, pilots from eve-ru.com discovered an exploit that the offending pilots may have used. They claimed to be able to consistently replicate a defect which causes pilots not to appear in the local channel and have produced screenshots of it in action. There have also been videos taken of the supposed exploit being used. CCP have yet to comment on the issue but given the high-profile thread, it’s certain that they’re aware of it. Whether the three pilots named above have been abusing the exploit isn’t certain but at this stage there’s no doubt that the exploit exists. Earlier tonight, EVE player “huhuhu” gave a practical demonstration of the exploit in use on the EVE test server in front of a large audience, putting to rest theories that the exploit wasn’t real.
With all the attention it's getting, I think everyone's right to assume that CCP will get on this quickly. Anything that completely takes away the competetive aspect of what is (in my opinion) the game's most important feature (PVP), is something I'm sure they'll recognize right away and take seriously.
It is kind of ironic and amusing to see all these outraged russians saying that Monkeysphere must be exploiting, since that is the only way one could possibly catch their macro-ratters wait no that's not what I meant err.....
CCP DEFEND MY BOTS FROM BAD WRONG EXPLOIT BOAT VIOLENCE PLEASE NOW! UNFAIR!
It is kind of ironic and amusing to see all these outraged russians saying that Monkeysphere must be exploiting, since that is the only way one could possibly catch their macro-ratters wait no that's not what I meant err.....
CCP DEFEND MY BOTS FROM BAD WRONG EXPLOIT BOAT VIOLENCE PLEASE NOW! UNFAIR!
It is really ironic... But local has been the same for everyone for years. Since it looks like some exploit has been discovered, it should be dealt with officially quickly. Eve's death penalty is bad enough, without adding things like this into the mix. As for "safe" don't count on that outside of dock. Not to mention most of us would look just as(if not more so) silly if we tried to speak Russian ^^
It’s a little harder to feel safe in space at the moment, knowing that the now-confirmed (and quickly becoming widespread) exploit allowing players to delay their appearance in local chat
With all the attention it's getting, I think everyone's right to assume that CCP will get on this quickly.
I had to LOL at this........I never feel safe in EVE, and last thing I want to see is an empty local. I don't play EVE to be alone!
The bottom line is supertight5 needs to publicly state he is not in anyway associated with macro's!
Please continue to pay your monthly fee.. working as intended.
So true.
People use macro bots to mine all the time because that's half the game and mining sucks! They try to mine as much isk as possible so they can afford to play the "real Eve game".
"It's a sandbox, they provide only the tools to create your own adventure." Even if the adventure is completely exploited. LoL
The sad part is alot of these people using exploits and bots and cheats in Eve are long time subscribers that degenerate into using these so they can "have fun".
You obviously know nothing about the game then. The only people who use macros to mine are the gold farmers because it's easily done in relative safety of high sec. Anyone who knows the game knows that you do no mine to make money, you chain belt rats or you play the market. The macros being used are belt ratting macros, not mining macros. Maybe if you tried playing the game rather than mine you wouldn't come off as some biiter person who thought Eve was WoW in space. Never once have I ever had to mine in game for cash and that's going back to day one, 2003 character and still mining skill level 2 since that was there when I made my character. Yes mining sucks, but it is not half the game, hell I wouldnt even call mining 10% of the game because of how easy it is to get minerals from recycled loot.
Bottom line though is this, ANY exploit used by ANY player in this or any other game should be perma banned, doesn't matter if the exploit is used for good or bad purposes. Justifying the use of an exploit because you say its a macroer is selfish at best, who are you judge who is using a macro or not ? Sure you might have a very strong hunch and you might even be 100% right but convicting based on hunches is just as unacceptable as macro farming and exploit abuse.
If there is proof of an exploit then send the details to CCP and let them recreate it and it will be fixed, all this forum trolling and calling people cheats and shit is old and stupid.
I wonder how many of the top raiding guilds in WoW has GM or game dev help when it comes to getting Worlds Firsts on bosses ? It always amazed me how the top guilds learned some obscure fight mechanics so quickly. I am not tlaking about the guilds that have the benefit of how to videos either, I am talking about those that walk into brand new raid dungeon and within a couple of days they know all the fight mechanics. Yeah yeah yeah, I know they get in on the beta tests and learn the fights there but how do they get into the beta tests so easily ? They get in because they are the top guilds and why are they the top guilds ? Because they have the advantage of being in beta for the new dungeons. See what i'm getting at here ?
It’s a little harder to feel safe in space at the moment, knowing that the now-confirmed (and quickly becoming widespread) exploit allowing players to delay their appearance in local chat
With all the attention it's getting, I think everyone's right to assume that CCP will get on this quickly.
I had to LOL at this........I never feel safe in EVE, and last thing I want to see is an empty local. I don't play EVE to be alone!
The bottom line is supertight5 needs to publicly state he is not in anyway associated with macro's!
I am in the boat that would love to see the removal of local in 0.0. I know what you mean by playing with other people and not alone but be honest here, when was the last time you went wandering around 0.0 checking local to find people to chat or play together with ? Local is used for scouting purposes and nothing more, remove local chat and make proper scouts with scan probing skills much more valuable in 0.0.
This has the same benefits and risks to everyone. Sure the gank squad can sneak into your quiet little ratting system without you knowing it but at the same time you could have a cloaked scout on the gate and see them come through giving you plenty of time to get to a safe spot. The gank squad has no idea that your scout is there or even if you are there unless you are probed out but your scout would have seen the scout come into system as well. I don't see the lack of local chat in wormhole space keeping players out of there in fear of being ganked.
Supertight5 can publicly state anything he wants, it won't make him any more credible in a world of online anonymity and nicknames. If he does indeed know how the exploit is done (if there is an exploit at all) then he should send it to CCP so that they can reproduce and fix it. Going on the test server with a bunch of mob mentality people proves nothing, he can fool them with smoke and mirror tricks and get those people worked up and forum posting so easily.
It is kind of ironic and amusing to see all these outraged russians saying that Monkeysphere must be exploiting, since that is the only way one could possibly catch their macro-ratters wait no that's not what I meant err.....
CCP DEFEND MY BOTS FROM BAD WRONG EXPLOIT BOAT VIOLENCE PLEASE NOW! UNFAIR!
It is really ironic... But local has been the same for everyone for years. Since it looks like some exploit has been discovered, it should be dealt with officially quickly. Eve's death penalty is bad enough, without adding things like this into the mix. As for "safe" don't count on that outside of dock. Not to mention most of us would look just as(if not more so) silly if we tried to speak Russian ^^
The macrobots have been exploiting local for their advantage, meaning they can buy more and bigger and better ships to fight against those who dont exploit and cheat like they do. It's at least as bad as what Monkeysphere is alledged to have done, if only because they do it on a vastly greater scale.
I look forward to the day when CCP decides that they can and will detect macros, and sweep through through them in an "Unholy Rage II" campaign. I predict that within a month, we'd see a major shift of power in 0.0. And that's to say nothing of empire.
I look forward to the day when CCP decides that they can and will detect macros, and sweep through through them in an "Unholy Rage II" campaign. I predict that within a month, we'd see a major shift of power in 0.0. And that's to say nothing of empire.
Understatement of the year, sir.
Drone region alliances would have about half of their leadership banned, most of their "members" too. The Regions would be even more empty than normal..
I look forward to the day when CCP decides that they can and will detect macros, and sweep through through them in an "Unholy Rage II" campaign. I predict that within a month, we'd see a major shift of power in 0.0. And that's to say nothing of empire.
Understatement of the year, sir.
Drone region alliances would have about half of their leadership banned, most of their "members" too. The Regions would be even more empty than normal..
What a delicious prospect that would be...
And not just in the drone regions, either. Venal, Stain, Fountain, to name only 3 of the most notorious hives.
And speaking as someone who has spent way to much time shooting POS lately, I really want to see ice product prices rise. Burn the ice macros. Burn them all...
I've been saying that they should just remove all ice belts from empire and boost ice yield. Then hammer down macros in 0.0 as there won't be as many. That would do wonders both to mining and have a huge impact on rmt. Since they'd have to organize in corps you can banhammer a lot of them in one strike.
Also yeah, venal. Although i found geminate to be worse by now. I haven't been to fountain for years, but i roamed some of the southern regions and tenerifis was full of suspiciously attentive raven pilots..
They should just remove local all together, and replace it with something completely different in high traffic empire areas.
Which would be? Local serves various purposes, which I suspect is by design. Given how pro ganker most of CCP tends to be, I'm surprised that they haven't done something already.
Originally posted by qazyman They should just remove local all together, and replace it with something completely different in high traffic empire areas.
Unless it gets replaced by a functional equivalent allowing people to make sure a system is free of hostiles, the only thing that would do is make 0.0 even more undesirable for any industrial related activity.
If anything, the ability for entities to create small havens of relative safety should be enhanced to make it possible for 0.0 entities to be independent from empire. Currently most of production is done in empire since it's way too easy to disrupt them in 0.0 and empire is completely risk free. Making 0.0 even more unattractive would just result in another exodus.
I've been saying that they should just remove all ice belts from empire and boost ice yield. Then hammer down macros in 0.0 as there won't be as many. That would do wonders both to mining and have a huge impact on rmt. Since they'd have to organize in corps you can banhammer a lot of them in one strike.
Also yeah, venal. Although i found geminate to be worse by now. I haven't been to fountain for years, but i roamed some of the southern regions and tenerifis was full of suspiciously attentive raven pilots..
Comments
Don't pretend any of those entities was better than the other. It just makes you look stupid.
WRONG
EVE has FULL LOSS when you die. Yea insurance can pay for a cheap ship, but NOT any fittings, or T2/T3 faction.
Exploits are MASSIVE when full loss is a factor.
"Better" in what sense? At dirty tricks, exploits and scams? Thats the Goonies, obviously. No pretense required, just a knowledge of history.
Exactly. Insurance pays at best for the cost of the mats for a T1 ship. Mods usually cost much more than the ship itself. T2 and T3... Losing those and their mods can get pricy fast.
uummm isn't that what you tried to do in your post by saying BoB was far worse than any of the others?
Into the breach meatbags
Please continue to pay your monthly fee.. working as intended.
So true.
People use macro bots to mine all the time because that's half the game and mining sucks! They try to mine as much isk as possible so they can afford to play the "real Eve game".
"It's a sandbox, they provide only the tools to create your own adventure." Even if the adventure is completely exploited. LoL
The sad part is alot of these people using exploits and bots and cheats in Eve are long time subscribers that degenerate into using these so they can "have fun".
"I'm not cheap I'm incredibly subconsciously financially optimized"
"The worst part of censorship is ------------------"
So is this an "EVE" exploit? Is Monkeysphere the next Kugutsumen? Hats off to PL either way
Last i checked goons didn't use dev contacts to upgrade their region / spawn bpos / intimidate gms into doing what they want.
So yes, you're making yourself look incredibly stupid right now. Good job.
No, they're both horrible. As i was saying. But i will call people out if they try to rewrite history.
You keep using that word... "I don't think it means, what you think it means". ^^ Its always amusing to watch Goonie agiprop at work. Your above is taken chapter and verse from their usual talking points. The usual mixture of bitterness and arrogance that seems to define them. Yes, both groups ARE horrible. But I can't seem to remember BoB playing out of game psych ops games on holiday weekends, directed at CCP. Which of course badly flopped because CCP handled the attack much faster and more professionally than the Goonies expected. That too is history.
I'm in fleet with Molle right now.
The devs are sending us hookers for early morning blowjobs. It's awesome.
Give me liberty or give me lasers
It’s a little harder to feel safe in space at the moment, knowing that the now-confirmed (and quickly becoming widespread) exploit allowing players to delay their appearance in local chat could leave you popped or podded without requiring the usual navigational error on your part. The exploit seemed at first to only be known (or at least used) by relatively few players, but needless to say, many, after hearing it exists and watching videos (part 1 | part 2) of it in use, have now managed to replicate the feat.
excerpts from the article at massively.com:
With all the attention it's getting, I think everyone's right to assume that CCP will get on this quickly. Anything that completely takes away the competetive aspect of what is (in my opinion) the game's most important feature (PVP), is something I'm sure they'll recognize right away and take seriously.
It is kind of ironic and amusing to see all these outraged russians saying that Monkeysphere must be exploiting, since that is the only way one could possibly catch their macro-ratters wait no that's not what I meant err.....
CCP DEFEND MY BOTS FROM BAD WRONG EXPLOIT BOAT VIOLENCE PLEASE NOW! UNFAIR!
Give me liberty or give me lasers
It is really ironic... But local has been the same for everyone for years. Since it looks like some exploit has been discovered, it should be dealt with officially quickly. Eve's death penalty is bad enough, without adding things like this into the mix. As for "safe" don't count on that outside of dock. Not to mention most of us would look just as(if not more so) silly if we tried to speak Russian ^^
I had to LOL at this........I never feel safe in EVE, and last thing I want to see is an empty local. I don't play EVE to be alone!
The bottom line is supertight5 needs to publicly state he is not in anyway associated with macro's!
You obviously know nothing about the game then. The only people who use macros to mine are the gold farmers because it's easily done in relative safety of high sec. Anyone who knows the game knows that you do no mine to make money, you chain belt rats or you play the market. The macros being used are belt ratting macros, not mining macros. Maybe if you tried playing the game rather than mine you wouldn't come off as some biiter person who thought Eve was WoW in space. Never once have I ever had to mine in game for cash and that's going back to day one, 2003 character and still mining skill level 2 since that was there when I made my character. Yes mining sucks, but it is not half the game, hell I wouldnt even call mining 10% of the game because of how easy it is to get minerals from recycled loot.
Bottom line though is this, ANY exploit used by ANY player in this or any other game should be perma banned, doesn't matter if the exploit is used for good or bad purposes. Justifying the use of an exploit because you say its a macroer is selfish at best, who are you judge who is using a macro or not ? Sure you might have a very strong hunch and you might even be 100% right but convicting based on hunches is just as unacceptable as macro farming and exploit abuse.
If there is proof of an exploit then send the details to CCP and let them recreate it and it will be fixed, all this forum trolling and calling people cheats and shit is old and stupid.
I wonder how many of the top raiding guilds in WoW has GM or game dev help when it comes to getting Worlds Firsts on bosses ? It always amazed me how the top guilds learned some obscure fight mechanics so quickly. I am not tlaking about the guilds that have the benefit of how to videos either, I am talking about those that walk into brand new raid dungeon and within a couple of days they know all the fight mechanics. Yeah yeah yeah, I know they get in on the beta tests and learn the fights there but how do they get into the beta tests so easily ? They get in because they are the top guilds and why are they the top guilds ? Because they have the advantage of being in beta for the new dungeons. See what i'm getting at here ?
I am in the boat that would love to see the removal of local in 0.0. I know what you mean by playing with other people and not alone but be honest here, when was the last time you went wandering around 0.0 checking local to find people to chat or play together with ? Local is used for scouting purposes and nothing more, remove local chat and make proper scouts with scan probing skills much more valuable in 0.0.
This has the same benefits and risks to everyone. Sure the gank squad can sneak into your quiet little ratting system without you knowing it but at the same time you could have a cloaked scout on the gate and see them come through giving you plenty of time to get to a safe spot. The gank squad has no idea that your scout is there or even if you are there unless you are probed out but your scout would have seen the scout come into system as well. I don't see the lack of local chat in wormhole space keeping players out of there in fear of being ganked.
Supertight5 can publicly state anything he wants, it won't make him any more credible in a world of online anonymity and nicknames. If he does indeed know how the exploit is done (if there is an exploit at all) then he should send it to CCP so that they can reproduce and fix it. Going on the test server with a bunch of mob mentality people proves nothing, he can fool them with smoke and mirror tricks and get those people worked up and forum posting so easily.
The macrobots have been exploiting local for their advantage, meaning they can buy more and bigger and better ships to fight against those who dont exploit and cheat like they do. It's at least as bad as what Monkeysphere is alledged to have done, if only because they do it on a vastly greater scale.
I look forward to the day when CCP decides that they can and will detect macros, and sweep through through them in an "Unholy Rage II" campaign. I predict that within a month, we'd see a major shift of power in 0.0. And that's to say nothing of empire.
Give me liberty or give me lasers
Understatement of the year, sir.
Drone region alliances would have about half of their leadership banned, most of their "members" too. The Regions would be even more empty than normal..
What a delicious prospect that would be...
And not just in the drone regions, either. Venal, Stain, Fountain, to name only 3 of the most notorious hives.
And speaking as someone who has spent way to much time shooting POS lately, I really want to see ice product prices rise. Burn the ice macros. Burn them all...
Give me liberty or give me lasers
I've been saying that they should just remove all ice belts from empire and boost ice yield. Then hammer down macros in 0.0 as there won't be as many. That would do wonders both to mining and have a huge impact on rmt. Since they'd have to organize in corps you can banhammer a lot of them in one strike.
Also yeah, venal. Although i found geminate to be worse by now. I haven't been to fountain for years, but i roamed some of the southern regions and tenerifis was full of suspiciously attentive raven pilots..
They should just remove local all together, and replace it with something completely different in high traffic empire areas.
Which would be? Local serves various purposes, which I suspect is by design. Given how pro ganker most of CCP tends to be, I'm surprised that they haven't done something already.
Unless it gets replaced by a functional equivalent allowing people to make sure a system is free of hostiles, the only thing that would do is make 0.0 even more undesirable for any industrial related activity.
If anything, the ability for entities to create small havens of relative safety should be enhanced to make it possible for 0.0 entities to be independent from empire. Currently most of production is done in empire since it's way too easy to disrupt them in 0.0 and empire is completely risk free. Making 0.0 even more unattractive would just result in another exodus.
Time to start a campaign to put a little pressure on CCP,
Give me liberty or give me lasers