This is only my humble opinion but I don't think the majority of gamers care if it's sandbox.themepark,a hybrid of the two or whatever label you try to stick on MMOs.They only care that is fun,engaging and worth their sub money.
This is only my humble opinion but I don't think the majority of gamers care if it's sandbox.themepark,a hybrid of the two or whatever label you try to stick on MMOs.They only care that is fun,engaging and worth their sub money.
Several points, of which knowing about has become important in anticipating how I feel about a title:
1. Is it heavily instanced whereby I feel like a rat in a box.
2. Is there a death penalty to which I feel as though I'm not playing an arcade game or fps without meaningful consequences.
3. Is there a dynamic pve world in which computer controlled pixels aren't tethered to a leash and just huddled around an encampment time after time.
4. Is there enough skill breadth and challenges with being a jack of all trades whereby I'm not going to pigeon-holed down the same path as everyone else, just feeling like a cloned character.
5. Aside from depth and breadth of a dynamic pve environment, will it be enriched with depth and breadth of a player-driven ecosystem.
6. Will I be able to build structures, equipment, tools, items, whereby the player-base and their craftings are more prevalent, sought after, and valued versus a pistol dropping off a rat.
7. Will there be great breadth, depth, tools, and networks for player-driven resourcing, crafting, and merchandising to place the player-base at the core of the economic system of game-play as opposed to an npc.
There's more, but as time passes and more games deliver less and less, and more themepark rudimentary products such as STO, and other games in 2009 try to sell a bill-of-goods, as opposed to a worthy product, my expectations dont dwindle, but become more fine-tuned.
this game is so themepark it makes me want to puke. why does cant everyone be a force user that has the choices to take on these rolls. even switch sides. if you wanted to be a republic whatever with force abilities you should be able to switch to sith inquisitor if you want. a major theme in starwars is switching sides. falling from the light mainly, but also switching back again. why not in this game. and whats with the obsession with story. I hate it when a game force syou to do quests. that was the worst thing about the other games. they would have been awsome if every feature was unolocked from the start. the forced missions broke the entire game for me. i hate that bioware is the company that makes the new starwars mmo. whats your ideas about this.
Why do people have to bitch and moan and label everything.
Either it will be a good game or it won't, until you know just stfu and wait.
FFS I hate these kinds of posts.
And fyi, as soon as I read "forced mission" I fucking face-palmed so hard I have a hand print on my face.
Playing: *sigh* back to WoW -------- Waiting for: SW:TOR, APB, WoD --------- Played and loved: Eve and WoW -------- Played and hated: WoW:WotLK, Warhammer, every single F2P
this game is so themepark it makes me want to puke. why does cant everyone be a force user that has the choices to take on these rolls. even switch sides. if you wanted to be a republic whatever with force abilities you should be able to switch to sith inquisitor if you want. a major theme in starwars is switching sides. falling from the light mainly, but also switching back again. why not in this game. and whats with the obsession with story. I hate it when a game force syou to do quests. that was the worst thing about the other games. they would have been awsome if every feature was unolocked from the start. the forced missions broke the entire game for me. i hate that bioware is the company that makes the new starwars mmo. whats your ideas about this.
Because theme park is where the money is at.
Bioware has only ever made linear story based games, heavily focused on the single player game.
This MMO is going to be exactly that. It's all they know how to do. Granted, this won't really be an MMO, but it'll make money, and people will probably try to copy it, and even though the MMO market kind of died with WoW, we can say goodbye to it forever if this game succeeds.
If theme parks is where the money is at how come every release since WOW has fell flat? Player base disappearing after 1-3 months? If they are so profitable why am I Not playing them?
Originally posted by firefly2003 If theme parks is where the money is at how come every release since WOW has fell flat? Player base disappearing after 1-3 months? If they are so profitable why am I Not playing them?
So you say that every MMO released since WoW couldn't make make enough mony to be profitable?
I am wondering how it is possible they are still running...
This is only my humble opinion but I don't think the majority of gamers care if it's sandbox.themepark,a hybrid of the two or whatever label you try to stick on MMOs.They only care that is fun,engaging and worth their sub money.
Fun and engaging for about 1-3 months just like AOC, Tabula Rasa, WAR, STO, Champions and so on then they will all be back here waiting for the next shiny wannabe cause the game wasn't fun.. just like all the rest.
Wouldn't it be more sensible, generally speaking, to reserve judgement until the game has actually launched and players who are not journalists have had some hands-on with it?
I heard a lot of things about STO that I didn't care for, that skewed my perception of the game towards the negative, and that really made me think that the possibility of my spending any amount of cash on the game - especially $50-60 was slim to none, but I reserved final judgement on it until I got my hands on a ten day trial key after launch and actually played the game. Then I decided that it really wasn't worth much more than ten days and it certainly wasn't worth my money. But at least I did the game the courtesy of waiting for it to launch and getting my hands on it before making a judgement call based on speculation prior to launch.
What is published prior to launch, even if stated by BioWare and Lucasarts, is subject to change right up until the day the box is on the shelves, so it may be worth considering that what they say now may not be what is seen when the game launches...so getting upset about it is a waste of effort.
"You are obviously confusing a mature rating with actual maturity." -Asherman
Maybe MMO is not your genre, go play Modern Warfare...or something you can be all twitchy...and rank up all night. This is seriously getting tired. -Ranyr
This is only my humble opinion but I don't think the majority of gamers care if it's sandbox.themepark,a hybrid of the two or whatever label you try to stick on MMOs.They only care that is fun,engaging and worth their sub money.
Fun and engaging for about 1-3 months just like AOC, Tabula Rasa, WAR, STO, Champions and so on then they will all be back here waiting for the next shiny wannabe cause the game wasn't fun.. just like all the rest.
. . .and PotBS, CrimeCraft, Global Agenda too . . . it has been a pathetic run for this market for the last couple years, not including Indie Studios.
Striving for Silver Stars since Gold is so effeminate.
Honestly, it's funny seeing so many people complaining about Theme Park over Sandbox. The only reason people do this is because of how bad developers make these "Theme-Park" MMORPG. The thing is, Bioware tends to be just a 'bit' (underexagguration here) better at "Theme-park" RPGs then your average developer. Considering they've made 7 of 10 of the best RPGs of all time via average ratings.
Not sure I'm going to play this or not.. I'm still on the fence, because of my recent experience with BioWare's latest game Dragon Age.. Yes, the game is fun, and even challenging at times.. BUT, there have been a few times so far that the storyline doesn't work or is flawed. I just finished up the part of choosing the dwarf king, and the storyline is logically bugged.. Maybe cause I chose a different path at the last minute that game wasn't prepared to deal with.. /shrug
In any case it gives me a sour taste of what is to come. Being that so much of TOR is toted as a "choose your path" story game, what happens when story bugs takes place? Is there anyway of correcting it, without major downtime or problems. Last thing any of us want to do is delete a toon and start over because of a storyline flaw..
BTW BioWare devs if you read this.. get better BETA testers then Dragon Age, because the flaw I ran into should of NEVER have happened if it was tested correctly
this game is so themepark it makes me want to puke. why does cant everyone be a force user that has the choices to take on these rolls. even switch sides. if you wanted to be a republic whatever with force abilities you should be able to switch to sith inquisitor if you want. a major theme in starwars is switching sides. falling from the light mainly, but also switching back again. why not in this game. and whats with the obsession with story. I hate it when a game force syou to do quests. that was the worst thing about the other games. they would have been awsome if every feature was unolocked from the start. the forced missions broke the entire game for me. i hate that bioware is the company that makes the new starwars mmo. whats your ideas about this.
Wait, wait, wait.... How do you know this? Have you been playing this unreleased-not-even-in-beta game behind our backs?
What is it with SWG Veterans and their love for beating dead horses? SW:TOR is going to be a questbased MMO, we all know that now so get over it.
Interesting how I've actually read and experienced, following AoC, PotBS, WAR, Aion, that players aren't clamoring for more PvE, but since SWTOR is going to be a more pve-centric story-based mmo, with the ability to make choices that affect my character, I've been wondering about this. And it's been posed by a piece at TTH www.tentonhammer.com/node/81438
We saw a two man instance where each got to make a decision, but what about 5 man instances, or raids? Will each member of the party get to make a choice, or only a lucky few? How will PUGs work? Can some asshat in my PUG screw up the story for my character?
Striving for Silver Stars since Gold is so effeminate.
What is it with SWG Veterans and their love for beating dead horses? SW:TOR is going to be a questbased MMO, we all know that now so get over it.
Interesting how I've actually read and experienced, following AoC, PotBS, WAR, Aion, that players aren't clamoring for more PvE, but since SWTOR is going to be a more pve-centric story-based mmo, with the ability to make choices that affect my character, I've been wondering about this. And it's been posed by a piece at TTH www.tentonhammer.com/node/81438
We saw a two man instance where each got to make a decision, but what about 5 man instances, or raids? Will each member of the party get to make a choice, or only a lucky few? How will PUGs work? Can some asshat in my PUG screw up the story for my character?
I would not expect a Sandbox game from Bioware to come out. They are known and praisdd for their storylines so, I would think they would stick to their strengths.
My take on why? Seriously, everything that has come out in the last few years has been a themepark ride. Chalk it up to those players who do not understand the original concept of MMORPG's and what they were supposed to be. Games are now catering to the lowest common denominator and developers are wondering why there is no retention.
People who like games on rails and end games are not inclined to stick around once they finish them.
Say hello, To the things you've left behind. They are more a part of your life now that you can't touch them.
What is it with SWG Veterans and their love for beating dead horses? SW:TOR is going to be a questbased MMO, we all know that now so get over it.
Interesting how I've actually read and experienced, following AoC, PotBS, WAR, Aion, that players aren't clamoring for more PvE, but since SWTOR is going to be a more pve-centric story-based mmo, with the ability to make choices that affect my character, I've been wondering about this. And it's been posed by a piece at TTH www.tentonhammer.com/node/81438
We saw a two man instance where each got to make a decision, but what about 5 man instances, or raids? Will each member of the party get to make a choice, or only a lucky few? How will PUGs work? Can some asshat in my PUG screw up the story for my character?
I think that everyone makes their decision but, regardless of what decision actually gets played out, people will get light or dark points for what they chose, not for what was actually decided. That I could live with.
If you stand VERY still, and close your eyes, after a minute you can actually FEEL the universe revolving around PvP.
What is it with SWG Veterans and their love for beating dead horses? SW:TOR is going to be a questbased MMO, we all know that now so get over it.
Interesting how I've actually read and experienced, following AoC, PotBS, WAR, Aion, that players aren't clamoring for more PvE, but since SWTOR is going to be a more pve-centric story-based mmo, with the ability to make choices that affect my character, I've been wondering about this. And it's been posed by a piece at TTH www.tentonhammer.com/node/81438
We saw a two man instance where each got to make a decision, but what about 5 man instances, or raids? Will each member of the party get to make a choice, or only a lucky few? How will PUGs work? Can some asshat in my PUG screw up the story for my character?
I dont know why you quoted me. Im just telling you what we know for fact about SW:TOR. Its going to be questbased. Im not interested in defending/attacking the devs for their choice.
What is it with SWG Veterans and their love for beating dead horses? SW:TOR is going to be a questbased MMO, we all know that now so get over it.
Interesting how I've actually read and experienced, following AoC, PotBS, WAR, Aion, that players aren't clamoring for more PvE, but since SWTOR is going to be a more pve-centric story-based mmo, with the ability to make choices that affect my character, I've been wondering about this. And it's been posed by a piece at TTH www.tentonhammer.com/node/81438
We saw a two man instance where each got to make a decision, but what about 5 man instances, or raids? Will each member of the party get to make a choice, or only a lucky few? How will PUGs work? Can some asshat in my PUG screw up the story for my character?
I think that everyone makes their decision but, regardless of what decision actually gets played out, people will get light or dark points for what they chose, not for what was actually decided. That I could live with.
Well the Interview is pretty straight forward ... when you do YOUR Story-Mission , even if you have others with you , only YOU get to make choices that effect it. When your doing a normal World-Quest its all about the dice rolling ... they even hint at the ability to address the other players during the Dialog.
This is only my humble opinion but I don't think the majority of gamers care if it's sandbox.themepark,a hybrid of the two or whatever label you try to stick on MMOs.They only care that is fun,engaging and worth their sub money.
Fun and engaging for about 1-3 months just like AOC, Tabula Rasa, WAR, STO, Champions and so on then they will all be back here waiting for the next shiny wannabe cause the game wasn't fun.. just like all the rest.
Right...because waving the magic sandbox wand would of made those games mega successful WoW beaters.All thosee games had technical and post launch direction issues and/or was released too early.A great game is a great game no matter what it's label.It may not be a genre or game mechanic style that you personally like but that does not equal bad game.
im sooo going to bring this thread up when you all find out this game is heavily instanced and put on rails.
lets see what excuses you all come up with then.
Maybe they wont' care?
I loved doom through doom 3 and I can safely say that those games were on rails. Had a blast though.
I value instnacing as a great way to tell a story so that you can concentrate on the drama at hand while your buddies aren't running by saying "heya Matic" or dancing in between you and the person you are talking to, or dueling next to you.
As long as the game can deliver a good value and is well done I don't think the fans will really care.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Comments
This is only my humble opinion but I don't think the majority of gamers care if it's sandbox.themepark,a hybrid of the two or whatever label you try to stick on MMOs.They only care that is fun,engaging and worth their sub money.
Several points, of which knowing about has become important in anticipating how I feel about a title:
1. Is it heavily instanced whereby I feel like a rat in a box.
2. Is there a death penalty to which I feel as though I'm not playing an arcade game or fps without meaningful consequences.
3. Is there a dynamic pve world in which computer controlled pixels aren't tethered to a leash and just huddled around an encampment time after time.
4. Is there enough skill breadth and challenges with being a jack of all trades whereby I'm not going to pigeon-holed down the same path as everyone else, just feeling like a cloned character.
5. Aside from depth and breadth of a dynamic pve environment, will it be enriched with depth and breadth of a player-driven ecosystem.
6. Will I be able to build structures, equipment, tools, items, whereby the player-base and their craftings are more prevalent, sought after, and valued versus a pistol dropping off a rat.
7. Will there be great breadth, depth, tools, and networks for player-driven resourcing, crafting, and merchandising to place the player-base at the core of the economic system of game-play as opposed to an npc.
There's more, but as time passes and more games deliver less and less, and more themepark rudimentary products such as STO, and other games in 2009 try to sell a bill-of-goods, as opposed to a worthy product, my expectations dont dwindle, but become more fine-tuned.
Star Wars doesn't seem to me like a setting for a sandbox MMO. We've Fallen Earth, EVE and Mortal Online for that.
Why do people have to bitch and moan and label everything.
Either it will be a good game or it won't, until you know just stfu and wait.
FFS I hate these kinds of posts.
And fyi, as soon as I read "forced mission" I fucking face-palmed so hard I have a hand print on my face.
Playing: *sigh* back to WoW
--------
Waiting for: SW:TOR, APB, WoD
---------
Played and loved: Eve and WoW
--------
Played and hated: WoW:WotLK, Warhammer, every single F2P
Because theme park is where the money is at.
Bioware has only ever made linear story based games, heavily focused on the single player game.
This MMO is going to be exactly that. It's all they know how to do. Granted, this won't really be an MMO, but it'll make money, and people will probably try to copy it, and even though the MMO market kind of died with WoW, we can say goodbye to it forever if this game succeeds.
If theme parks is where the money is at how come every release since WOW has fell flat? Player base disappearing after 1-3 months? If they are so profitable why am I Not playing them?
So you say that every MMO released since WoW couldn't make make enough mony to be profitable?
I am wondering how it is possible they are still running...
Fun and engaging for about 1-3 months just like AOC, Tabula Rasa, WAR, STO, Champions and so on then they will all be back here waiting for the next shiny wannabe cause the game wasn't fun.. just like all the rest.
The game's about a year out from launch.
Wouldn't it be more sensible, generally speaking, to reserve judgement until the game has actually launched and players who are not journalists have had some hands-on with it?
I heard a lot of things about STO that I didn't care for, that skewed my perception of the game towards the negative, and that really made me think that the possibility of my spending any amount of cash on the game - especially $50-60 was slim to none, but I reserved final judgement on it until I got my hands on a ten day trial key after launch and actually played the game. Then I decided that it really wasn't worth much more than ten days and it certainly wasn't worth my money. But at least I did the game the courtesy of waiting for it to launch and getting my hands on it before making a judgement call based on speculation prior to launch.
What is published prior to launch, even if stated by BioWare and Lucasarts, is subject to change right up until the day the box is on the shelves, so it may be worth considering that what they say now may not be what is seen when the game launches...so getting upset about it is a waste of effort.
Firebrand Art
"You are obviously confusing a mature rating with actual maturity." -Asherman
Maybe MMO is not your genre, go play Modern Warfare...or something you can be all twitchy...and rank up all night. This is seriously getting tired. -Ranyr
Fun and engaging for about 1-3 months just like AOC, Tabula Rasa, WAR, STO, Champions and so on then they will all be back here waiting for the next shiny wannabe cause the game wasn't fun.. just like all the rest.
. . .and PotBS, CrimeCraft, Global Agenda too . . . it has been a pathetic run for this market for the last couple years, not including Indie Studios.
Striving for Silver Stars since Gold is so effeminate.
Honestly, it's funny seeing so many people complaining about Theme Park over Sandbox. The only reason people do this is because of how bad developers make these "Theme-Park" MMORPG. The thing is, Bioware tends to be just a 'bit' (underexagguration here) better at "Theme-park" RPGs then your average developer. Considering they've made 7 of 10 of the best RPGs of all time via average ratings.
Not sure I'm going to play this or not.. I'm still on the fence, because of my recent experience with BioWare's latest game Dragon Age.. Yes, the game is fun, and even challenging at times.. BUT, there have been a few times so far that the storyline doesn't work or is flawed. I just finished up the part of choosing the dwarf king, and the storyline is logically bugged.. Maybe cause I chose a different path at the last minute that game wasn't prepared to deal with.. /shrug
In any case it gives me a sour taste of what is to come. Being that so much of TOR is toted as a "choose your path" story game, what happens when story bugs takes place? Is there anyway of correcting it, without major downtime or problems. Last thing any of us want to do is delete a toon and start over because of a storyline flaw..
BTW BioWare devs if you read this.. get better BETA testers then Dragon Age, because the flaw I ran into should of NEVER have happened if it was tested correctly
Wait, wait, wait.... How do you know this? Have you been playing this unreleased-not-even-in-beta game behind our backs?
What is it with SWG Veterans and their love for beating dead horses? SW:TOR is going to be a questbased MMO, we all know that now so get over it.
Interesting how I've actually read and experienced, following AoC, PotBS, WAR, Aion, that players aren't clamoring for more PvE, but since SWTOR is going to be a more pve-centric story-based mmo, with the ability to make choices that affect my character, I've been wondering about this. And it's been posed by a piece at TTH www.tentonhammer.com/node/81438
We saw a two man instance where each got to make a decision, but what about 5 man instances, or raids? Will each member of the party get to make a choice, or only a lucky few? How will PUGs work? Can some asshat in my PUG screw up the story for my character?
Striving for Silver Stars since Gold is so effeminate.
Interesting how I've actually read and experienced, following AoC, PotBS, WAR, Aion, that players aren't clamoring for more PvE, but since SWTOR is going to be a more pve-centric story-based mmo, with the ability to make choices that affect my character, I've been wondering about this. And it's been posed by a piece at TTH www.tentonhammer.com/node/81438
We saw a two man instance where each got to make a decision, but what about 5 man instances, or raids? Will each member of the party get to make a choice, or only a lucky few? How will PUGs work? Can some asshat in my PUG screw up the story for my character?
Read this darthhater.com/2010/03/15/interview-story-time-with-daniel-erickson/#comments ... on the 2nd page is the answer to your question.
Yeah. There are just not enough sandbox fans out there these days.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
I would not expect a Sandbox game from Bioware to come out. They are known and praisdd for their storylines so, I would think they would stick to their strengths.
My take on why? Seriously, everything that has come out in the last few years has been a themepark ride. Chalk it up to those players who do not understand the original concept of MMORPG's and what they were supposed to be. Games are now catering to the lowest common denominator and developers are wondering why there is no retention.
People who like games on rails and end games are not inclined to stick around once they finish them.
Say hello, To the things you've left behind. They are more a part of your life now that you can't touch them.
Interesting how I've actually read and experienced, following AoC, PotBS, WAR, Aion, that players aren't clamoring for more PvE, but since SWTOR is going to be a more pve-centric story-based mmo, with the ability to make choices that affect my character, I've been wondering about this. And it's been posed by a piece at TTH www.tentonhammer.com/node/81438
We saw a two man instance where each got to make a decision, but what about 5 man instances, or raids? Will each member of the party get to make a choice, or only a lucky few? How will PUGs work? Can some asshat in my PUG screw up the story for my character?
Read this darthhater.com/2010/03/15/interview-story-time-with-daniel-erickson/#comments ... on the 2nd page is the answer to your question.
I think that everyone makes their decision but, regardless of what decision actually gets played out, people will get light or dark points for what they chose, not for what was actually decided. That I could live with.
If you stand VERY still, and close your eyes, after a minute you can actually FEEL the universe revolving around PvP.
Interesting how I've actually read and experienced, following AoC, PotBS, WAR, Aion, that players aren't clamoring for more PvE, but since SWTOR is going to be a more pve-centric story-based mmo, with the ability to make choices that affect my character, I've been wondering about this. And it's been posed by a piece at TTH www.tentonhammer.com/node/81438
We saw a two man instance where each got to make a decision, but what about 5 man instances, or raids? Will each member of the party get to make a choice, or only a lucky few? How will PUGs work? Can some asshat in my PUG screw up the story for my character?
I dont know why you quoted me. Im just telling you what we know for fact about SW:TOR. Its going to be questbased. Im not interested in defending/attacking the devs for their choice.
Interesting how I've actually read and experienced, following AoC, PotBS, WAR, Aion, that players aren't clamoring for more PvE, but since SWTOR is going to be a more pve-centric story-based mmo, with the ability to make choices that affect my character, I've been wondering about this. And it's been posed by a piece at TTH www.tentonhammer.com/node/81438
We saw a two man instance where each got to make a decision, but what about 5 man instances, or raids? Will each member of the party get to make a choice, or only a lucky few? How will PUGs work? Can some asshat in my PUG screw up the story for my character?
Read this darthhater.com/2010/03/15/interview-story-time-with-daniel-erickson/#comments ... on the 2nd page is the answer to your question.
I think that everyone makes their decision but, regardless of what decision actually gets played out, people will get light or dark points for what they chose, not for what was actually decided. That I could live with.
Well the Interview is pretty straight forward ... when you do YOUR Story-Mission , even if you have others with you , only YOU get to make choices that effect it. When your doing a normal World-Quest its all about the dice rolling ... they even hint at the ability to address the other players during the Dialog.
Fun and engaging for about 1-3 months just like AOC, Tabula Rasa, WAR, STO, Champions and so on then they will all be back here waiting for the next shiny wannabe cause the game wasn't fun.. just like all the rest.
Right...because waving the magic sandbox wand would of made those games mega successful WoW beaters.All thosee games had technical and post launch direction issues and/or was released too early.A great game is a great game no matter what it's label.It may not be a genre or game mechanic style that you personally like but that does not equal bad game.
im sooo going to bring this thread up when you all find out this game is heavily instanced and put on rails.
lets see what excuses you all come up with then.
the Evil Raider that outgears you and makes you cry for welfare epics on the forums.
Maybe they wont' care?
I loved doom through doom 3 and I can safely say that those games were on rails. Had a blast though.
I value instnacing as a great way to tell a story so that you can concentrate on the drama at hand while your buddies aren't running by saying "heya Matic" or dancing in between you and the person you are talking to, or dueling next to you.
As long as the game can deliver a good value and is well done I don't think the fans will really care.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Considering the vast majority of gamers enjoy themeparks I hightly doubt any of them will care.