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Cryptic now claims the skill cap they tacked on was "intended feature"
Die_Scream
Member Posts: 1,785
You can see a couple dev responses here.
Yep, they now claim it was intended all along. What do you guys think?
Comments
I see 1 reply from the community rep. I see no mention of the phrase "intended all along". I see reference to the cap being "intended" as in "not a bug or a mistake or there by chance" but deliberately put into place. It was in answer to the OP who was being a douche and trying to suggest that they had confirmed the cap to be a bug
I may have missed a later reply, but i scanned all pages in the thread.
You do know ALL MMOs have a max level when they release right?
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I have a soap box and I am not afraid to use it.
The idea behind it is pretty simple. They have artificial ceiling. They release new content. The new content has a difficulty appropiate for the artificial ceiling cause thats where the target group for the content is at.
Its actually pretty simple and logical. I was a bit shocked there ever has been talk about not having this. I dont see how mmos without a levelcap can work, some people level literally 10x as fast as others, without a ceiling you can never make content that walks the fine line between hard and trivial.
I do agree with the capped system, it's better for the game... BUT, I do not agree with them changing from uncapped to capped late in beta without properly testing all the underlying systems, it is a big core change to the game affecting many things. The whole skill map as it is now makes no sense at all since it was designed around the concept of unlimited skill points.
I would have gone along with it too if they had actually planned for it. But they did not and just threw it in at the last second. one of the many blunders that sent this game down the road it is going.
This will no doubt come as a surprise to the peeps on the forums that have quotes and links to quotes of the devs saying otherwise before the last minute change.
What I saw was a guy digging up the past, and seemingly getting banned for it. I'd assume that's why they banned him. The response I read from the rep however, did not say it was intended all along, it said it's intended to be in-game at present. The guy was saying the cap was a bug.
Why did you come to your conclusion? As I don't see anything to take my thoughts in that direction.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
He's not the first former member of the CDF (Cryptic Defense Forces) to be banned from the forums in the last week, and no doubt will not be the last.
The CDF thats classic. If i did not get banned and quit i would have like to use that in my sig.
The CDF thats classic. If i did not get banned and quit i would have like to use that in my sig.
Hehe thanks. Trying to cut down on the fanboi/fanbot. This title seemed appropriate.
It is obviously not intended as the skills themselves, and the way you consume them, are clearly are designed for a system that offers unlimited SPs. Example - there are skills for each tier of ship - this makes sense in a game with unlimited SPs as you spend points making you better in that long range sci ship since it is beneficial as you work through that tier. However, once you are on to the next tier those points are wasted in a system with limited SPs available. Weapon skills also expose this circumstance. Phasers and disrupters are in a different tier of skills than are Tetryon and Plasma, so you can increase your phaser/disruptor skills are a substantial 'discount' in SP cost verse tetryon/plasma weapons. That discount increases exponentially for the remaining weapon types each tier past that, two more if I recall correctly ending up with something like triple the cost of the most expensive verse the least expensive and these are weapons with no innate additional strength just different secondary attributes but balanced otherwise (i.e. phaser does same dmg as tetryon, phaser has proc to disable a sub system and tetryon has proc to do shld dmg). There are more examples too.
The short of it is that all through the skill tree you can see built in obsolescence to entire blocks of skills simply due to the change from no skill point cap to a skill point cap. It is obvious and really beyond argument and it is in need of a complete overhaul or a substantial portion of the skills trees are useless and pointless.
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Achiever 60.00%, Socializer 53.00%, Killer 47.00%, Explorer 40.00%
Intel Core i7 Quad, Intel X58 SLi, 6G Corsair XMS DDR3, Intel X-25 SSD, 3 WD Velociraptor SATA SuperTrak SAS EX8650 Array, OCZ 1250W PS, GTX 295, xFi, 32" 1080p LCD
It is obviously not intended as the skills themselves, and the way you consume them, are clearly are designed for a system that offers unlimited SPs. Example - there are skills for each tier of ship - this makes sense in a game with unlimited SPs as you spend points making you better in that long range sci ship since it is beneficial as you work through that tier. However, once you are on to the next tier those points are wasted in a system with limited SPs available. Weapon skills also expose this circumstance. Phasers and disrupters are in a different tier of skills than are Tetryon and Plasma, so you can increase your phaser/disruptor skills are a substantial 'discount' in SP cost verse tetryon/plasma weapons. That discount increases exponentially for the remaining weapon types each tier past that, two more if I recall correctly ending up with something like triple the cost of the most expensive verse the least expensive and these are weapons with no innate additional strength just different secondary attributes but balanced otherwise (i.e. phaser does same dmg as tetryon, phaser has proc to disable a sub system and tetryon has proc to do shld dmg). There are more examples too.
The short of it is that all through the skill tree you can see built in obsolescence to entire blocks of skills simply due to the change from no skill point cap to a skill point cap. It is obvious and really beyond argument and it is in need of a complete overhaul or a substantial portion of the skills trees are useless and pointless.
As much as I enjoy it when Smithy and I are at each other throats... I'm gonna have to say he hit nail pretty well square on the noggin. This is a pretty dead on explanation of why the skill system at this point has a lot of problems.
Active: WoW
Semi-retired: STO
Fully retired: UO, EQ, AC, SWG, FFXI, DDO:EU, PoTBS, AoC, EvE
Tried: EQ2, Tabula Rasa, Auto-Assault, Isteria, LotRO, Wizard 101
Looking forward to: Star Citizen
Very well put Smith, I agree entirely and have noticed this myself.
They really should have just stuck to there guns and stayed with a system that had no cap, instead of haphazardly tacking on a skill point cap and calling it a day.
It is obviously not intended as the skills themselves, and the way you consume them, are clearly are designed for a system that offers unlimited SPs. Example - there are skills for each tier of ship - this makes sense in a game with unlimited SPs as you spend points making you better in that long range sci ship since it is beneficial as you work through that tier. However, once you are on to the next tier those points are wasted in a system with limited SPs available. Weapon skills also expose this circumstance. Phasers and disrupters are in a different tier of skills than are Tetryon and Plasma, so you can increase your phaser/disruptor skills are a substantial 'discount' in SP cost verse tetryon/plasma weapons. That discount increases exponentially for the remaining weapon types each tier past that, two more if I recall correctly ending up with something like triple the cost of the most expensive verse the least expensive and these are weapons with no innate additional strength just different secondary attributes but balanced otherwise (i.e. phaser does same dmg as tetryon, phaser has proc to disable a sub system and tetryon has proc to do shld dmg). There are more examples too.
The short of it is that all through the skill tree you can see built in obsolescence to entire blocks of skills simply due to the change from no skill point cap to a skill point cap. It is obvious and really beyond argument and it is in need of a complete overhaul or a substantial portion of the skills trees are useless and pointless.
As much as I enjoy it when Smithy and I are at each other throats... I'm gonna have to say he hit nail pretty well square on the noggin. This is a pretty dead on explanation of why the skill system at this point has a lot of problems.
which is all well and good, and correct as anyone in game can see. but this has nothing to do with the OP, who tried and failed to start yet another mud slinging contest.
It is obviously not intended as the skills themselves, and the way you consume them, are clearly are designed for a system that offers unlimited SPs. Example - there are skills for each tier of ship - this makes sense in a game with unlimited SPs as you spend points making you better in that long range sci ship since it is beneficial as you work through that tier. However, once you are on to the next tier those points are wasted in a system with limited SPs available. Weapon skills also expose this circumstance. Phasers and disrupters are in a different tier of skills than are Tetryon and Plasma, so you can increase your phaser/disruptor skills are a substantial 'discount' in SP cost verse tetryon/plasma weapons. That discount increases exponentially for the remaining weapon types each tier past that, two more if I recall correctly ending up with something like triple the cost of the most expensive verse the least expensive and these are weapons with no innate additional strength just different secondary attributes but balanced otherwise (i.e. phaser does same dmg as tetryon, phaser has proc to disable a sub system and tetryon has proc to do shld dmg). There are more examples too.
The short of it is that all through the skill tree you can see built in obsolescence to entire blocks of skills simply due to the change from no skill point cap to a skill point cap. It is obvious and really beyond argument and it is in need of a complete overhaul or a substantial portion of the skills trees are useless and pointless.
As much as I enjoy it when Smithy and I are at each other throats... I'm gonna have to say he hit nail pretty well square on the noggin. This is a pretty dead on explanation of why the skill system at this point has a lot of problems.
which is all well and good, and correct as anyone in game can see. but this has nothing to do with the OP, who tried and failed to start yet another mud slinging contest.
It is obviously not intended as the skills themselves, and the way you consume them, are clearly are designed for a system that offers unlimited SPs. Example - there are skills for each tier of ship - this makes sense in a game with unlimited SPs as you spend points making you better in that long range sci ship since it is beneficial as you work through that tier. However, once you are on to the next tier those points are wasted in a system with limited SPs available. Weapon skills also expose this circumstance. Phasers and disrupters are in a different tier of skills than are Tetryon and Plasma, so you can increase your phaser/disruptor skills are a substantial 'discount' in SP cost verse tetryon/plasma weapons. That discount increases exponentially for the remaining weapon types each tier past that, two more if I recall correctly ending up with something like triple the cost of the most expensive verse the least expensive and these are weapons with no innate additional strength just different secondary attributes but balanced otherwise (i.e. phaser does same dmg as tetryon, phaser has proc to disable a sub system and tetryon has proc to do shld dmg). There are more examples too.
The short of it is that all through the skill tree you can see built in obsolescence to entire blocks of skills simply due to the change from no skill point cap to a skill point cap. It is obvious and really beyond argument and it is in need of a complete overhaul or a substantial portion of the skills trees are useless and pointless.
As much as I enjoy it when Smithy and I are at each other throats... I'm gonna have to say he hit nail pretty well square on the noggin. This is a pretty dead on explanation of why the skill system at this point has a lot of problems.
which is all well and good, and correct as anyone in game can see. but this has nothing to do with the OP, who tried and failed to start yet another mud slinging contest.
I did no such thing there defensive guy. Do you play STO? In any case, Cryptic doesn't need my help to have mud slung at them, as evidenced.
which is all well and good, and correct as anyone in game can see. but this has nothing to do with the OP, who tried and failed to start yet another mud slinging contest.
I don't think the OP was mud slinging - he was commenting on the topic de jor which is Cryptic's game development and management issues. IN this skill thing you see just about everything Cryptic does that messes up their games. The change, the angering of fans, the denial or any mistake or even change. I mean if they really believed it was wrong with no skill point cap then stand by that call, and put in the work to make it right (i.e. fixing the things like I described above). Instead, they make a half baked change despite the hype of no skill cap right up to live and then they try to act like it was not a change but intended all along. It is just ridiculous and the attitude and mismanagement that is behind such actions is exactly the reason both Champion's and STO are troubled games with frustrated fans.
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Achiever 60.00%, Socializer 53.00%, Killer 47.00%, Explorer 40.00%
Intel Core i7 Quad, Intel X58 SLi, 6G Corsair XMS DDR3, Intel X-25 SSD, 3 WD Velociraptor SATA SuperTrak SAS EX8650 Array, OCZ 1250W PS, GTX 295, xFi, 32" 1080p LCD
They did the same with CO. They dropped an ill-thought out mega nerf into the game on release day, even though there wasn't enough content to support the nerf.
People complain because we were literally running out of missions to play. The CDF came out in force to claim this was an intended thing, just as the STO division of the CDF is.
Cryptic love and hate aside, this is just what happens when games get 2 years of development time instead of 4 or more. Heck, even with 4 to 5 years of development games go live with unseen issues, ill conceived systems, and unintended elements - having just two years there is simply no way to flesh out the things that need to be fleshed out, even in a more simplistic game like Cryptic puts out.
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Achiever 60.00%, Socializer 53.00%, Killer 47.00%, Explorer 40.00%
Intel Core i7 Quad, Intel X58 SLi, 6G Corsair XMS DDR3, Intel X-25 SSD, 3 WD Velociraptor SATA SuperTrak SAS EX8650 Array, OCZ 1250W PS, GTX 295, xFi, 32" 1080p LCD
Not EvE
Agreed. And Cryptic is now onto their next 2 year MMO now that STO is out the door. Can't blame them really. There are many people who will keep buying them. They are selling single player games with a premium box cost (for the first 3 weeks
) and a subscription. As long as they turn a little profit pushing the games out the door with as little investment into the game as possible, while charging full price, they make money.
Seems a better idea to take the time and make a long lasting MMO but its apparently profitable for them.
Cryptic are like a no-name brand MMO company. Yet they charge same as the professional MMO studios.
which is all well and good, and correct as anyone in game can see. but this has nothing to do with the OP, who tried and failed to start yet another mud slinging contest.
I don't think the OP was mud slinging - he was commenting on the topic de jor which is Cryptic's game development and management issues. IN this skill thing you see just about everything Cryptic does that messes up their games. The change, the angering of fans, the denial or any mistake or even change. I mean if they really believed it was wrong with no skill point cap then stand by that call, and put in the work to make it right (i.e. fixing the things like I described above). Instead, they make a half baked change despite the hype of no skill cap right up to live and then they try to act like it was not a change but intended all along. It is just ridiculous and the attitude and mismanagement that is behind such actions is exactly the reason both Champion's and STO are troubled games with frustrated fans.
You mean like this?
"Liquidisim: The starship skills such as Heavy Escort, do those carry thru to higher level ships such as fleet escort. If they apply only to t3 ships, then there is no point in having those skills come endgame.
There is hardly no point, though these skills currently become less useful in the endgame. However, we are in the process of changing this. All ship skills will grant some bonus to the ship above it. So an Assault Cruiser will benefit from Starship Captain, Cruiser Captain, Heavy Cruiser Captain, Exploration Cruiser Captain and Assault Cruiser Captain, but it will get the most benefit from Assault Cruiser Captain Skill. So if you want to maximize your Assault Cruiser, you will need all those skills. Note, the Assault Cruiser will not gain any benefit from the Star Cruiser Captain skill and vice-versa. The bonuses only affect ships upwards along the tree, not laterally."
http://www.startrekonline.com/node/1158
Not EvE
difference given the time required to train all the skills going is perhaps longer than the time the game has been live there is not need for an artificial ceiling.
Not EvE
Not true, EVE has a finite set of skills and once you learn them all you are capped. The difference however is that EVE STOPS uber leveling due to a system set in real time. However to believe that it does not have a cap is crap. The cap is just harder to reach.
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I have a soap box and I am not afraid to use it.
Not EvE
Not true, EVE has a finite set of skills and once you learn them all you are capped. The difference however is that EVE STOPS uber leveling due to a system set in real time. However to believe that it does not have a cap is crap. The cap is just harder to reach.
The original, announced model was level 50 for level cap, BUT no skill point cap. When they cut max level to 45 because they didn't have enough content and capped the skill points, they didn't bother to redo the skill system to reflect this change. THAT is what people are upset about as much as anything.