what is death penalty now in WAR?

galliard1981

i quit because pvp was totally meaningless. but the truth is, i liked Warhammer a lot and would return instantly when there was at least 1 server with more adrenaline. any changes now or in future planned?

next thing that disturbed me was insane unbalance (weak mages and WH, overpowered BW, Herder, Chosen and WE). how is in this area?

 

galliard1981

one small bump if you folks dont mind. i really would like to get answer without registering into WAR forum. does nobody here plays anymore?

is there any chance that WAR is or will be more challenging? 

Pheace

Unless you explain what you felt was meaningless and what you expect to be changed it's hard to answer anything really.

 

Far as I know Death penalty hasn't changed, and for the US at least, the ORvR servers (which sound more to your liking) have all been closed due to lack of population.

iZakaroN

Such commercial games never go more challenging but mostly opposite...

DillingerEP

Originally posted by galliard1981


i quit because pvp was totally meaningless. but the truth is, i liked Warhammer a lot and would return instantly when there was at least 1 server with more adrenaline. any changes now or in future planned?
next thing that disturbed me was insane unbalance (weak mages and WH, overpowered BW, Herder, Chosen and WE). how is in this area?
 

 

If you felt the PvP was meaningless because of a weak death penatly. Sadly for you, it's still the same ol slap on the wrist. They did a few more server merges, and are now down to 4 core server's. With the last two remaing  Oceanic server's being merged into them. Populations on them are solid, and it's easy to get some big groups going.... but for now anyways.

Theres still job imbalances, but that's something that won't be perfected.. especially with Mythic's track record. They nerfed job's, and buffed job's. They toned down the insane amount of CC as well. Some job's still need some loving, but any job in this game can be good.. if played right. 

Some other thing's they have done with the game is, release the Land of the Dead, introduced the free ulimited T1 trial, and the new starting zone expierence. Where all the races start in the Chaos/Empire zone.. to get more people playing together. (You can still choose to play in the race specific zones if you wish). They have removed the fortress keep's and put in the new underdog system for T4. Underdog system is where if one side is getting stomped on. The system makes it easier for them to lock down zones and makes it harder for the domiant side to lock them.

They also made a pretty big performance improvement in the game. But it's still not 100%, but heck of a lot better then what it was. They did some pretty positive thing's with the game, but with some of it it's all because they had to.. and not because they wanted to. At the end of the day it still feel's like the same ol game as before.

galliard1981

Thank you for replies, all 3 of you. Especially last one was full of information.

PvP in this game had so much potential but without death penalty it just doesnt pump any adrenaline. I was killing and killing enemies and felt no satisfaction from it.

Same story for Age of Conan. In AoC however, i was the victim, ganked without mercy. And i more often wanted to die than not, for teleport respawn reasons. That just sucked. No feeling, no adventure. 

Again thanks for replies and i consider this thread closed. I found some dpenalty mmo anyways but its not as immersive as warhammer. Tome was great rpg thing.

scuubeedoo

I was playing a Archmage in WAR (and shaman a bit later on) and it always felt more like playing a necromancer than an actual healer :S

Some personal thoughts:

- Healing was always so weak in WAR that adding a decent death penalty on top of that would be an overkill.

- The whole renown points system was a system that was growing up with deaths. You get killed by someone, he takes some renown points, then he kills you and you get some back. If you didn't die originally you would get less when you later killed him...

- So we have a system that feeds itself and grows with deaths, and healers are actually a parasite into it cause they make people live a bit longer

- But healers are sometimes good cause they raise people so you get to kill them again and again without waiting them to travel all the way from the resurrect point...

- Now we see the reason why healing sucked but ressing was uber fast...

- Every healing's class rank4 untrained morale was AOE ressurect... Most of the trained rank4 morales for healers in the original patch were crap...

Frobner

There is still alot of things Mythic needs to do with this game.  CC is still used alot and the famous Magus pull + CC and pile dmg always works. 

The last patch is bringing sorceress and Bright Wizards back to insane lvl of dmg.  I went through 4 scenarios today where a 2 SCs were doing 220-250K while the next dmg dealer did 50K.

There is now a growing use of speedhacks in WAR.  It give huge advantage and when a whole WB has it the oposition just stands CCed while the rest of the group moves in and AOEs the hell out of them.

galliard1981

i cannot agree scubee, i think the opposite, that healers are overpowered. i could never kill any healer with dps class (WH). i heard that right now its even worse.

 

Spaceweed10

Originally posted by scuubeedoo


I was playing a Archmage in WAR (and shaman a bit later on) and it always felt more like playing a necromancer than an actual healer :S
Some personal thoughts:
- Healing was always so weak in WAR that adding a decent death penalty on top of that would be an overkill.
- The whole renown points system was a system that was growing up with deaths. You get killed by someone, he takes some renown points, then he kills you and you get some back. If you didn't die originally you would get less when you later killed him...
- So we have a system that feeds itself and grows with deaths, and healers are actually a parasite into it cause they make people live a bit longer
- But healers are sometimes good cause they raise people so you get to kill them again and again without waiting them to travel all the way from the resurrect point...
- Now we see the reason why healing sucked but ressing was uber fast...
- Every healing's class rank4 untrained morale was AOE ressurect... Most of the trained rank4 morales for healers in the original patch were crap...

 

Healers UP?

You clearly do not know how to play this game.

DillingerEP

Originally posted by Frobner


There is still alot of things Mythic needs to do with this game.  CC is still used alot and the famous Magus pull + CC and pile dmg always works. 
The last patch is bringing sorceress and Bright Wizards back to insane lvl of dmg.  I went through 4 scenarios today where a 2 SCs were doing 220-250K while the next dmg dealer did 50K.
There is now a growing use of speedhacks in WAR.  It give huge advantage and when a whole WB has it the oposition just stands CCed while the rest of the group moves in and AOEs the hell out of them.

 

Premade bomb group's are still a issue with T4 RvR, especially of course in scenario's. PUG group's 99% of the time will get competely smashed into the ground vs bomb group's. And i agree need's to be worked on... newer player's will be highly turned off on this. Especially if they don't know a lot of people yet, and can't have acess to well oiled premades.

With the speedhack's i've seen it but most the time it's that stupid tailsman (Odjira) you can get... that gives you a chance to gain %60 movement speed when someone hit's you. I've seen more out of LOS hack's then anything.. it's so awesome having a Bright Wizard bomb you through a wall :P

godseek3r

If the DP was more severe, people wouldn't PvP because they don't want to lose their stuff.

galliard1981

this is not a thread if DP in WAR is ok, but since somebody made this offtop i must respond

In every PvP game DP is good. Gives you more fun from playing. The problem is to make DP not to harsh so ppl dont ragequit. Permadeath works great in diablo where u can lvl your char in 2-3 days, but it would suck in grindy mmos (most of them, to be precise)

But.....there are other ideas, already implemented or not touched. Lets take a closer look

Full loot/random item drop - meaningless, since items are useless for the opposing side

Corpserun - i think worth rethinking

Stat lowered for amount of time

Exp loss

My idea for perfect death penalty in WAR is both realistic and balanced (i believe):

You dont respawn, but u can resurrect in the same place after lets say 5 minutes. This would mean almost permadeath in scenarios. Of course you can be ressed or healed sooner. After regaining consiousness or control, your stats are lowered. That would reflect that your character took serious beating. Stats can be regained via killing mobs or return after some fixed amount of time. Or you can get cured for gold at npc.

And there is lets say 0.0001% for permadeath. Your character is a hero afterall and heroes dont die easily, but nevertheless....this happens. The story would be better with some of characters dying for good.

Discuss if you wish, athough its offtop now.

Yamota

Permadeath would never, ever work in MMORPGs. That is a simple fact and proven by the fact that there are no MMORPGs with perma death. Very few people want to see their character deleted against their will, simple as that.

That being said I think WARs death penalty is way, WAY too weak. It is a war after all and in a war it should hurt when you lose encounters. So at the very least there should be higher gold cost when dying, coupled with longer duration stat loss which can be worked off by killing mobs/players.

That way death hurts, but is not devestating. However I fear the WoW disease has spread to most other MMORPGs and now days almost all MMORPGs have next to no death penalty, making the outcome of a PvP encounter somewhat pointless.

DillingerEP

A real death penalty wouldn't work in Warhammer anyway's. It's to easy to die in this game, with it's Team Deathmatch First Person Shooter mentality behind it. It's not like theres a consequence to it.. if the other side beating the shit out of your side. Your feeding them more exp, renown, more crests/gear , and VP's to win zones (T4 take your city)... that may be weak to a good deal of people... oh well. People were really looking for something they were never going to find in War's PvP.