Probably because all they ever talk about is single player/small group stories.
Sure they say it's going to have everything else other mmos have, but how many other games say they will have things and it turns out they meant have retarded cousin versions of the things they are talking about.
I don't doubt that there will be some pvp and raids in it. Its whether or not they take backseat to the soloing and story is whats worrying me.
Everything I know and have seen right now points to this game sucking balls. If they actually release some info not about a single-player quest, I'll be happy. Info being actual info, not just saying it exists.
It's because us the realistic gamers that have been playing MMOs for a decade have developed a good ability to read between the lines of the BS that game devs are serving to us.
The typical fanbois don't have this ability and that's why we have arguments on forums.
But lets just see the facts:
- The material shown so far STRONGLY suggests it's a SPRPG disquised as a MMO.
- We have claims from Bioware devs saying the game will have all the usual MMO features but they refuse to tell us the very esential core features that should have been announced years before a game hits Alpha.
All this while people are already talking about BETA and 2010 release?
Really?
Think about this.
If Bioware have good ideas about the game' s core features they would have been talking about it by now, just like they like to yapp about all the SP features like story and voiceovers.
There is no logic what-so-ever in keeping the core features of your game "secret" when at same time you are trying to hype the game and can't stop yapping about features that are irrelevant to the genre , like VOs.
VOs are extras, bonus little features on top of your core features and mechanics.
The days when most of us blindly believed devs about everything they promise are over.
Only the silly fanbois still fall for it, most of us has been hassled out of our money way too many times.
Bioware or not I will not believe anything until they show it to me.
So far the game is a SPRPG that shamelesly tries to pass as a MMO.
It's up to Bioware to prove me wrong and that's the atitude that everyone should have, instead of being a blind fanboi always hoping for the best, easy to manipulate and take advantage of.
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
Is it because we haven't seen anything massive yet? Or because people think doing the main story is all there is to the game?
They've announced that there will be massive PvP fights and raids, as well as endgame when you complete the story. Why are people still calling it a single player oriented MMO?
I think alot of it has to do with the fact that Bioware is known for making single player rpgs so some assume they will be doing the same here. Bioware needs to show group play in order for people to think otherwise. Some still stand by "seeing is believing" which I do not blame them.
Is it because we haven't seen anything massive yet? Or because people think doing the main story is all there is to the game?
They've announced that there will be massive PvP fights and raids, as well as endgame when you complete the story. Why are people still calling it a single player oriented MMO?
I think they have also said that if they are ready to reveal somethng, then you can trust that it isn't BS.
Thank goodness the devs will tell us when they aren't BSing us.
/sarcasm
Devs lie, and they don't tell us when they are lying.
Perhaps, or maybe you're thinking of another MMO company. I’m sure devs lie (all of us do), are misinformed, a little too hopeful at times, premature with their statements, but that has nothing to do with what I’m referring to. What I am referring to is the fact that they (BioWare) have taken the stance of not showing, or revealing anything unless it's positively going to be in the game and work.
This pisses people off because people always want to know more, but this means that unlike SOE they aren't gonna bullshit us into believing things like space, vehicles, houses ect are gonna be there day one because they haven’t said they are.To me that's integrity.
That being said, I can understand your distrust and hostility towards most MMO companies, their teams ect.
When BW starts giving solid details or videos of large group content and large scale PvP I will believe it is something other than what they have led us to believe. Saying a game has raids and PvP doesn't give us a whole lot of details. 10-man instancing could be their definition of raiding, 5vs5 battlegrounds could be their definition of PvP. Without those details people are going to be speculating and since all they have focused on is the standard single-player RPG features, thats where the speculation leads.
I hope for 40+ man raids and 100vs100 open world pvp battles but all I know is 2 people grouped together is a grouping experience and I'll have to turn voice overs off so it doesnt bother me when Im on vent.
i used to laugh at stupidity, nowadays it just makes me realize how many dumb people are actually in the world. All anyone knows about this game is everything you have been told, Not what you "think" will be in the game. Maybe you'll pick up on extra stuff in the game play vids but thats it. Get it through your head that you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. If you want to pass something off as information with no proof what so ever then you need to add this at the end of your topic. "This is all just my opinion and in no way a proven fact." It makes you neither right or wrong. If you want facts, i suggest you GOOGLE IT.
Read the official FAQ + dev vids/blogs, it will be sure to be informative. Story arch in focus, player interaction takes the backseat. Dark times have come for the social player, now screwed we all are....
Is it because we haven't seen anything massive yet? Or because people think doing the main story is all there is to the game?
They've announced that there will be massive PvP fights and raids, as well as endgame when you complete the story. Why are people still calling it a single player oriented MMO?
Usually "single player oriented" is used to described the pre-end game portion of an MMORPG.
It's not really relevant that the game has raids in the end.
WoW for example is considered a single player oriented game, or solo friendly, NOT because it doesn't have raids at the end which are of course forced grouping, but because the pre-end game portion of the game can easily be solo'ed all the way through.
It's solo friendly or single player oriented if you can solo easily all the way through the levels or skills. I believe rough estimates are that only less than 20% of a player base for any particular MMORPG actually plays the "end game" for any significant amount of time. So the pre-end game portion of the game is much more important than the "end game".
I think this game will look a lot like a solo friendly game, since you get NPC party members, and quests will probably scale so you can do them solo. The majority of the player base will probably be off in instances doing their quests solo, and group once in a while, till they get to the end game, then quit or roll an alt.
Even so, might still be fun, because KOTOR was a lot of fun even if it was a single player game.
What WOW did you play World at War? Becaues the WOW that I played (World of Warcraft) was full of group content way before you got close to the end game. I mean hell before I hit level freaking 30 their were already 5 or 6 grp instances that I could run with others. If you want to sit here and say how those could be soled at a low level go for it, but you would be dead wrong.
I think you would have been better off using a game like Champions Online as an example of a grp oriented MMO.
solo games are usually considered games you can easily solo to level cap, just as easily or almost as easily as grouping.
It's really irrelevant that there are instances that you CAN do with groups if you want to.
From everything i hae read on this game, I can't see how this is a single player based game, it has all the roots for a very fun and inivative structure to it, I'm sure there will be plenty to do with friends, just got to wait and see what Bioware will give us, good thing about Bioware is they know how to make their customers happy... so we shall see
I will wait and see what this game truly holds. I'm a huge Star Wars fan, but am anti themepark mmo. I'm guessing it will be a heavily instanced game with some kind of battleground area for the pvp. As I said, I'm guessing. If I'm right, I won't be touching this game with a 10 foot pole.
Is it because we haven't seen anything massive yet? Or because people think doing the main story is all there is to the game?
They've announced that there will be massive PvP fights and raids, as well as endgame when you complete the story. Why are people still calling it a single player oriented MMO?
Because they (most of the community) fail to digest all information about the game before they pass judgement and throw their uneducated opinion around as fact. They (BW/LA) said during E3 that the player's story is about 10% of the game. But no one takes the time to find/read that. Basicly, ignorance is their issue.
I love how you pretty much hit the nail on the head, then the poster right after you provides an example lol.
Why do I write, create, fantasize, dream and daydream about other worlds? Because I hate what humanity does with this one.
I would have to say that most people see it is a single player game as a result of what they've seen to date. Other than 2 players doing some early level missions there hasn't been a great deal of focus on the mulitplayer aspects. I figure Bioware has focused their marketing, to date, on aspects of the game that differentiate their product from other MMO offerings. I'm pretty sure that the game will have the standard MMO offerings. Bioware just isn't focusing on marketing those aspects... yet.
I would have to say that most people see it is a single player game as a result of what they've seen to date. Other than 2 players doing some early level missions there hasn't been a great deal of focus on the mulitplayer aspects. I figure Bioware has focused their marketing, to date, on aspects of the game that differentiate their product from other MMO offerings. I'm pretty sure that the game will have the standard MMO offerings. Bioware just isn't focusing on marketing those aspects... yet.
agreed, and - with only two classes per faction revealed - would be kinda hard to show anything more than a duo running around...
I think the people saying it is heavily solo focused are using more logic than the fanboys saying it isn't. At least those saying it's a single player game are going on what has been shown. Those saying it isn't have nothing to base that on other than obscure dev references and hope.
The burden of proof falls on those who say somethign exists. If heavy/standard mmo multiplayer exists? Show it to me. A dev saying it exists does not mean it actually does. For all we know, them saying the standard mmo stuff exists means that there is one room where you can socialize, one 6v6 battleground, and 5 items you can craft. There needs to be actual examples. Screenshots, videos, detailed game systems, etc. AOC devs said there game would have meaningful lag free pvp, with minimal zoning. We all know how that turned out to be a lie.
As of right now. It's a single player game with the option to play with a few more people. It will remain that until they show otherwise.
It will probably be single playerish until you hit the lvl cap and then, hopefully, more sandboxish aftewards.....just speculation though....or a dream!
It will probably be single playerish until you hit the lvl cap and then, hopefully, more sandboxish aftewards.....just speculation though....or a dream!
Hehe, sadly that sounds a lot like most MMOs these days. Everyone solos to max level and then groups up for end-game content.
I think the people saying it is heavily solo focused are using more logic than the fanboys saying it isn't. At least those saying it's a single player game are going on what has been shown. Those saying it isn't have nothing to base that on other than obscure dev references and hope.
The burden of proof falls on those who say somethign exists. If heavy/standard mmo multiplayer exists? Show it to me. A dev saying it exists does not mean it actually does. For all we know, them saying the standard mmo stuff exists means that there is one room where you can socialize, one 6v6 battleground, and 5 items you can craft. There needs to be actual examples. Screenshots, videos, detailed game systems, etc. AOC devs said there game would have meaningful lag free pvp, with minimal zoning. We all know how that turned out to be a lie.
As of right now. It's a single player game with the option to play with a few more people. It will remain that until they show otherwise.
LOL, only in your closed mind. The rest of us learned how to read, digest information, and come up with logical conclusions. Obviously a talent you are lacking. Never fear, someone will come along soon enough to spoon feed you the homer simpson version so you can get it. One of the most ignorant posts I have read outside the official boards.
If you want a new idea, go read an old book.
In order to be insulted, I must first value your opinion.
I think the people saying it is heavily solo focused are using more logic than the fanboys saying it isn't. At least those saying it's a single player game are going on what has been shown. Those saying it isn't have nothing to base that on other than obscure dev references and hope.
The burden of proof falls on those who say somethign exists. If heavy/standard mmo multiplayer exists? Show it to me. A dev saying it exists does not mean it actually does. For all we know, them saying the standard mmo stuff exists means that there is one room where you can socialize, one 6v6 battleground, and 5 items you can craft. There needs to be actual examples. Screenshots, videos, detailed game systems, etc. AOC devs said there game would have meaningful lag free pvp, with minimal zoning. We all know how that turned out to be a lie.
As of right now. It's a single player game with the option to play with a few more people. It will remain that until they show otherwise.
I've never seen a MMO where the developers put out videos of large raids, crafting, PvP and people socializings so early. That's something the players usual discuss/record during non NDA beta and release. I could be wrong though. So with no other information other then word of mouth from BioWare on this game being an MMO or not, It is a MMO currently, feel free to judge when you have proper counter arguements. Even though I doubt this will be considered valid, for you, can you even name a game BioWare labeled incorrectly?
I think the people saying it is heavily solo focused are using more logic than the fanboys saying it isn't. At least those saying it's a single player game are going on what has been shown. Those saying it isn't have nothing to base that on other than obscure dev references and hope.
The burden of proof falls on those who say somethign exists. If heavy/standard mmo multiplayer exists? Show it to me. A dev saying it exists does not mean it actually does. For all we know, them saying the standard mmo stuff exists means that there is one room where you can socialize, one 6v6 battleground, and 5 items you can craft. There needs to be actual examples. Screenshots, videos, detailed game systems, etc. AOC devs said there game would have meaningful lag free pvp, with minimal zoning. We all know how that turned out to be a lie.
As of right now. It's a single player game with the option to play with a few more people. It will remain that until they show otherwise.
LOL, only in your closed mind. The rest of us learned how to read, digest information, and come up with logical conclusions. Obviously a talent you are lacking. Never fear, someone will come along soon enough to spoon feed you the homer simpson version so you can get it. One of the most ignorant posts I have read outside the official boards.
No one literally believes it's going to be a single player game. We are exagerrating to get our point across. We do however believe that the game will be heavily heavily solo based where 90% of things can be done without a group at all. Which is terrible for an mmo in my opinion.
They've spent all this time telling us about solo ventures and/or two man groups. They'll randomly throw out "Oh yea, we have the other stuff to, but let's get back to the solo quests and story."
That suggests to me that actual massively multiplayer content is in the back of their minds. An afterthought.
I hope I'm wrong, I really do, but until they actually detail the massively multiplayer portions of this game I'll remain a skeptic.
I've never seen a MMO where the developers put out videos of large raids, crafting, PvP and people socializings so early. That's something the players usual discuss/record during non NDA beta and release. I could be wrong though.
No, you're quite correct. It's just many in the MMORPG community have an incredibly capcity to completely forget past examples of what the MMORPG industry has done.
Every time videos and initial details of a new game are released, there are those who expect every single detailed to be revealed, all the graphics to look perfect and every mechanic to be already balanced even before the beta is announced.
For example, I've seen posts on other forums with eople saying that the Trooper looked overpowered in the PAX video. It is that hard to remember this is an alpha character in a demo video? Is is that hard to remember that things *ALWAYS* change in MMORPGs during development?
We've seen this before. We'll see it again. It would nice if those in the community jumping to conclusions about any game could try to remember that for once.
Comments
Probably because all they ever talk about is single player/small group stories.
Sure they say it's going to have everything else other mmos have, but how many other games say they will have things and it turns out they meant have retarded cousin versions of the things they are talking about.
I don't doubt that there will be some pvp and raids in it. Its whether or not they take backseat to the soloing and story is whats worrying me.
Everything I know and have seen right now points to this game sucking balls. If they actually release some info not about a single-player quest, I'll be happy. Info being actual info, not just saying it exists.
The Official God FAQ
It's because us the realistic gamers that have been playing MMOs for a decade have developed a good ability to read between the lines of the BS that game devs are serving to us.
The typical fanbois don't have this ability and that's why we have arguments on forums.
But lets just see the facts:
- The material shown so far STRONGLY suggests it's a SPRPG disquised as a MMO.
- We have claims from Bioware devs saying the game will have all the usual MMO features but they refuse to tell us the very esential core features that should have been announced years before a game hits Alpha.
All this while people are already talking about BETA and 2010 release?
Really?
Think about this.
If Bioware have good ideas about the game' s core features they would have been talking about it by now, just like they like to yapp about all the SP features like story and voiceovers.
There is no logic what-so-ever in keeping the core features of your game "secret" when at same time you are trying to hype the game and can't stop yapping about features that are irrelevant to the genre , like VOs.
VOs are extras, bonus little features on top of your core features and mechanics.
The days when most of us blindly believed devs about everything they promise are over.
Only the silly fanbois still fall for it, most of us has been hassled out of our money way too many times.
Bioware or not I will not believe anything until they show it to me.
So far the game is a SPRPG that shamelesly tries to pass as a MMO.
It's up to Bioware to prove me wrong and that's the atitude that everyone should have, instead of being a blind fanboi always hoping for the best, easy to manipulate and take advantage of.
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
To answer your first question:
Because it is.
I think alot of it has to do with the fact that Bioware is known for making single player rpgs so some assume they will be doing the same here. Bioware needs to show group play in order for people to think otherwise. Some still stand by "seeing is believing" which I do not blame them.
To answer your first question:
Because it is.
Cool story, bro.
Any reason why, or are you just trolling?
Thank goodness the devs will tell us when they aren't BSing us.
/sarcasm
Devs lie, and they don't tell us when they are lying.
Perhaps, or maybe you're thinking of another MMO company. I’m sure devs lie (all of us do), are misinformed, a little too hopeful at times, premature with their statements, but that has nothing to do with what I’m referring to. What I am referring to is the fact that they (BioWare) have taken the stance of not showing, or revealing anything unless it's positively going to be in the game and work.
This pisses people off because people always want to know more, but this means that unlike SOE they aren't gonna bullshit us into believing things like space, vehicles, houses ect are gonna be there day one because they haven’t said they are.To me that's integrity.
That being said, I can understand your distrust and hostility towards most MMO companies, their teams ect.
BioWare is entitling us not to reveal anything unless it's 100% going to be in the release product.
As said above, I can understand the hostility towards this. Most companies don't really follow this, but so far BioWare have delivered,
When BW starts giving solid details or videos of large group content and large scale PvP I will believe it is something other than what they have led us to believe. Saying a game has raids and PvP doesn't give us a whole lot of details. 10-man instancing could be their definition of raiding, 5vs5 battlegrounds could be their definition of PvP. Without those details people are going to be speculating and since all they have focused on is the standard single-player RPG features, thats where the speculation leads.
I hope for 40+ man raids and 100vs100 open world pvp battles but all I know is 2 people grouped together is a grouping experience and I'll have to turn voice overs off so it doesnt bother me when Im on vent.
i used to laugh at stupidity, nowadays it just makes me realize how many dumb people are actually in the world. All anyone knows about this game is everything you have been told, Not what you "think" will be in the game. Maybe you'll pick up on extra stuff in the game play vids but thats it. Get it through your head that you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. If you want to pass something off as information with no proof what so ever then you need to add this at the end of your topic. "This is all just my opinion and in no way a proven fact." It makes you neither right or wrong. If you want facts, i suggest you GOOGLE IT.
Read the official FAQ + dev vids/blogs, it will be sure to be informative. Story arch in focus, player interaction takes the backseat. Dark times have come for the social player, now screwed we all are....
Usually "single player oriented" is used to described the pre-end game portion of an MMORPG.
It's not really relevant that the game has raids in the end.
WoW for example is considered a single player oriented game, or solo friendly, NOT because it doesn't have raids at the end which are of course forced grouping, but because the pre-end game portion of the game can easily be solo'ed all the way through.
It's solo friendly or single player oriented if you can solo easily all the way through the levels or skills. I believe rough estimates are that only less than 20% of a player base for any particular MMORPG actually plays the "end game" for any significant amount of time. So the pre-end game portion of the game is much more important than the "end game".
I think this game will look a lot like a solo friendly game, since you get NPC party members, and quests will probably scale so you can do them solo. The majority of the player base will probably be off in instances doing their quests solo, and group once in a while, till they get to the end game, then quit or roll an alt.
Even so, might still be fun, because KOTOR was a lot of fun even if it was a single player game.
What WOW did you play World at War? Becaues the WOW that I played (World of Warcraft) was full of group content way before you got close to the end game. I mean hell before I hit level freaking 30 their were already 5 or 6 grp instances that I could run with others. If you want to sit here and say how those could be soled at a low level go for it, but you would be dead wrong.
I think you would have been better off using a game like Champions Online as an example of a grp oriented MMO.
solo games are usually considered games you can easily solo to level cap, just as easily or almost as easily as grouping.
It's really irrelevant that there are instances that you CAN do with groups if you want to.
From everything i hae read on this game, I can't see how this is a single player based game, it has all the roots for a very fun and inivative structure to it, I'm sure there will be plenty to do with friends, just got to wait and see what Bioware will give us, good thing about Bioware is they know how to make their customers happy... so we shall see
I will wait and see what this game truly holds. I'm a huge Star Wars fan, but am anti themepark mmo. I'm guessing it will be a heavily instanced game with some kind of battleground area for the pvp. As I said, I'm guessing. If I'm right, I won't be touching this game with a 10 foot pole.
http://www.gamespot.com/pc/rpg/starwarstheoldrepublic/news.html?sid=6228707&om_act=convert&om_clk=newsfeatures&tag=newsfeatures;title;2
After reading that I threw up a little in my mouth.
Because they (most of the community) fail to digest all information about the game before they pass judgement and throw their uneducated opinion around as fact. They (BW/LA) said during E3 that the player's story is about 10% of the game. But no one takes the time to find/read that. Basicly, ignorance is their issue.
I love how you pretty much hit the nail on the head, then the poster right after you provides an example lol.
BOYCOTTING EA / ORIGIN going forward.
I would have to say that most people see it is a single player game as a result of what they've seen to date. Other than 2 players doing some early level missions there hasn't been a great deal of focus on the mulitplayer aspects. I figure Bioware has focused their marketing, to date, on aspects of the game that differentiate their product from other MMO offerings. I'm pretty sure that the game will have the standard MMO offerings. Bioware just isn't focusing on marketing those aspects... yet.
agreed, and - with only two classes per faction revealed - would be kinda hard to show anything more than a duo running around...
I think the people saying it is heavily solo focused are using more logic than the fanboys saying it isn't. At least those saying it's a single player game are going on what has been shown. Those saying it isn't have nothing to base that on other than obscure dev references and hope.
The burden of proof falls on those who say somethign exists. If heavy/standard mmo multiplayer exists? Show it to me. A dev saying it exists does not mean it actually does. For all we know, them saying the standard mmo stuff exists means that there is one room where you can socialize, one 6v6 battleground, and 5 items you can craft. There needs to be actual examples. Screenshots, videos, detailed game systems, etc. AOC devs said there game would have meaningful lag free pvp, with minimal zoning. We all know how that turned out to be a lie.
As of right now. It's a single player game with the option to play with a few more people. It will remain that until they show otherwise.
The Official God FAQ
It will probably be single playerish until you hit the lvl cap and then, hopefully, more sandboxish aftewards.....just speculation though....or a dream!
Hehe, sadly that sounds a lot like most MMOs these days. Everyone solos to max level and then groups up for end-game content.
LOL, only in your closed mind. The rest of us learned how to read, digest information, and come up with logical conclusions. Obviously a talent you are lacking. Never fear, someone will come along soon enough to spoon feed you the homer simpson version so you can get it. One of the most ignorant posts I have read outside the official boards.
If you want a new idea, go read an old book.
In order to be insulted, I must first value your opinion.
I've never seen a MMO where the developers put out videos of large raids, crafting, PvP and people socializings so early. That's something the players usual discuss/record during non NDA beta and release. I could be wrong though. So with no other information other then word of mouth from BioWare on this game being an MMO or not, It is a MMO currently, feel free to judge when you have proper counter arguements. Even though I doubt this will be considered valid, for you, can you even name a game BioWare labeled incorrectly?
LOL, only in your closed mind. The rest of us learned how to read, digest information, and come up with logical conclusions. Obviously a talent you are lacking. Never fear, someone will come along soon enough to spoon feed you the homer simpson version so you can get it. One of the most ignorant posts I have read outside the official boards.
No one literally believes it's going to be a single player game. We are exagerrating to get our point across. We do however believe that the game will be heavily heavily solo based where 90% of things can be done without a group at all. Which is terrible for an mmo in my opinion.
They've spent all this time telling us about solo ventures and/or two man groups. They'll randomly throw out "Oh yea, we have the other stuff to, but let's get back to the solo quests and story."
That suggests to me that actual massively multiplayer content is in the back of their minds. An afterthought.
I hope I'm wrong, I really do, but until they actually detail the massively multiplayer portions of this game I'll remain a skeptic.
The Official God FAQ
I've never seen a MMO where the developers put out videos of large raids, crafting, PvP and people socializings so early. That's something the players usual discuss/record during non NDA beta and release. I could be wrong though.
No, you're quite correct. It's just many in the MMORPG community have an incredibly capcity to completely forget past examples of what the MMORPG industry has done.
Every time videos and initial details of a new game are released, there are those who expect every single detailed to be revealed, all the graphics to look perfect and every mechanic to be already balanced even before the beta is announced.
For example, I've seen posts on other forums with eople saying that the Trooper looked overpowered in the PAX video. It is that hard to remember this is an alpha character in a demo video? Is is that hard to remember that things *ALWAYS* change in MMORPGs during development?
We've seen this before. We'll see it again. It would nice if those in the community jumping to conclusions about any game could try to remember that for once.