I played vanguard on release day and though it was a great concept for an mmo, but it was buggy and very unpolished. I've been back when they gave out the free play time to vets but i never syayed long. I just cant commit to a game that has so little resources going towards improving the game. Then i saw this video and it turned me off ever trying vanguard again, He is basically saying vanguard is dead in the water. I wont pay a subscribtion to a game thats funding development for new Soe titles.
I went and listened to the YouTube link you included.
Silius made two mentions of resources. In the first minute or so when he was talking about AA's, he said that the development was going to be somewhat slowed by the resources on the team. Later on when discussing a re-launch and talking about how SOE is a business and they allot resources based on what product is making money, unfortuantely Vanguard is not making as much money as say a game like Free Realms. He did mention that SOE did spend money for banner ads when IOD was released.
I think your stament that "He (Silius) is bascially saying vangaurd is dead in the water" is a poor interpretation of the interview.
None of this is really new news. Yes the team would like more resources, but right now its not going to happen. In fact SOE just announced a 5% cut in all their resources.
If you play games based on the resources, then I would suggest you try out Free Realms
Silius says a lot of scary things in that interview. Most of which just reinforce how little resources the game has which is really a shame.
The biggest indicator is at the end of video 2 (6:19) when the interviewer asks him to sum up things and siliua says "Ya know we're gonna be here... (pause).., ya know as long as we can" and then seems to get mentally distracted after that.
We are going to be here as long as we can? That is a very strong indication of bad times when the lead designer says something like that.
You can take a lot of things from that interview including a lot of very positive and exciting plans as well. They need more resources, there is no doubt about it. A game this big and complex requires more than what they have to grow at a pace to keep up with the playerbase's consumption of new content. But I don't think they need a ton more in terms of developers. Sure it would be great to double the size of the team, but in reality, just one more good developer could make a huge difference in getting the planned content out quicker.
They didnt even mention the damn game at SOE fanfaire. What does that tell you?
The game is dead, SOE is not investing anymore cash into it, and I agree with you it absolutely should be a F2P game since no more development is going into it.
If Sony were to come out with an expansion and relaunch Vanguard they would do extreamly well in box sales and subs. It surprises me they do not see this at Sony.
" Life Liberty and the Pursuit of Those Who Would Threaten It " MAGA
If Sony were to come out with an expansion and relaunch Vanguard they would do extreamly well in box sales and subs. It surprises me they do not see this at Sony.
An expansion and new boxes on the shelves is far to big an investment for soe to make in this game. I'm not sure what might lead you to believe this game would do extremely well in box sales a second time around, but vanguard is a failing game that is only getting smaller. Don't get me wrong, I think the game is filled with potential, but as things stand now it cannot even grow itself with a free trial. Maybe the game would grow some, but not enough to justify the expenses you are suggesting.
I wish it were not the truth and that a relaunch might somehow change the games course, but that is the reality of the situation. Games that have a total of less tham 2-3,000 concurrent online players do not get expansions, new boxes in stores and relaunches. This game is lucky to be alive right now.
Sony Entertainment has deep pockets and with the right Devs could if they wanted too come out with as good a game as Blizzard did. Why they don't is what im not understanding.
" Life Liberty and the Pursuit of Those Who Would Threaten It " MAGA
You can take a lot of things from that interview including a lot of very positive and exciting plans as well. They need more resources, there is no doubt about it. A game this big and complex requires more than what they have to grow at a pace to keep up with the playerbase's consumption of new content. But I don't think they need a ton more in terms of developers. Sure it would be great to double the size of the team, but in reality, just one more good developer could make a huge difference in getting the planned content out quicker.
I heard a few decent things like the last part of content for level 51-55. AA's that look to be "endless" and maybe some work on the diplomacy line which is the biggest news I recall. Beyond that there wasn't much exciting in the future.
What I also heard about the exciting plans was that AA would have abilities that "people didn't want", but would "grind" out some AA when they were "bored" just to get something new. At one point he says diplomacy is something that sets vanguard apart from other mmos, but later calls it "half finished" and little more than a grind (2 years later even). The whole "fending for ourselves" was unnerving as well. Not exactly the most reassuring things coming from the mouth of the lead designer. Not to mention the interviewer is obviously a huge fan and he had to prop silius up a few times when he was going astray.
I don't really have any feelings about silius one way or another, but I actually felt bad for him in that interview. The impression I got from him was a broken man talking about a broken dream.
What I do not understand about SOE is the way they acquire games and the games they acquire.
They always cull the heard for a game that was bugged or had a weak developement team. Take the game and invest all kinds of money into taking it from weak to mediocre and then sit it aside and meh.
WTF? Why do this? I do not undersand it at all.
Say hello, To the things you've left behind. They are more a part of your life now that you can't touch them.
Sony Entertainment has deep pockets and with the right Devs could if they wanted too come out with as good a game as Blizzard did. Why they don't is what im not understanding.
Soe is cutting staff, so I doubt their pockets are as deep as you think they are. Their entire mmo subscriber base has drastically shrank over the last several years.
The problem stems from management and flows down into development. The culture of soe is not based on creating great games and servicing their customers. It is about rushing out whatever product they think will make the most money and revamping anything at any time in an effort to make a few more bucks. It is just a company that has lost touch with what its customers want.
When was the last time you heard john smedely talk about games being fun. I mean really sit down in an interview and talk about game mechanics and what makes games good? All he ever talks about is microtransactions, revenue streams and anything related to money. That is the driving force behind this company right now and the results are what they are.
Sony Entertainment has deep pockets and with the right Devs could if they wanted too come out with as good a game as Blizzard did. Why they don't is what im not understanding.
Soe is cutting staff, so I doubt their pockets are as deep as you think they are. Their entire mmo subscriber base has drastically shrank over the last several years.
The problem stems from management and flows down into development. The culture of soe is not based on creating great games and servicing their customers. It is about rushing out whatever product they think will make the most money and revamping anything at any time in an effort to make a few more bucks. It is just a company that has lost touch with what its customers want.
When was the last time you heard john smedely talk about games being fun. I mean really sit down in an interview and talk about game mechanics and what makes games good? All he ever talks about is microtransactions, revenue streams and anything related to money. That is the driving force behind this company right now and the results are what they are.
SOE destroys anything they touch or is it they get damaged goods that already are destroyed and market them. I affirm EQ only being successful due to lack of competition. WoW kicked butt so hard on boring, grindfest EQ that the server combine happened right after WoW's launch. EQ catered to the lifeless gamer, a miniscule population that this game targetted, what a huge mistake to target what amounts to a miniscule number of people.
Congrats on giving this game a try, sorry it didn't come through for you.
looks like its back to GW for the 4th time in a couple of years......god i cant wait for GW 2.
Don't worry, you'll be back. You'll hanker after the beautiful skies, clear air and grand vistas of Telon You'll remember the quirky music. You'll remember what it felt like to be immersed in just wandering around. You'll remember the odd, grand dungeons and absorbing battles.
And then you'll re-sub for a bit, and then get frustrated again, and go back to your "old standby".
I've done this about 3 times now. Each time, on returning, the game seems slightly improved, a bit more polished and stable (although there are still some gameplay and cosmetic bugs, there seem to be few game-breakers now). I'm not hugely optimistic it's ever going to improve drastically and get the final spit and polish it deserves, but I do carry a torch for the game, and wish it well, and enjoy it when I enjoy it.
I still believe, if SOE wanted to put more money into Vanguard... they wouldn't. They know Vanguard would be even more better then their own EQ2... and knowing SOE. They wouldn't want their flagship being outdone, under their own roof.
Oh well.. i don't like SOE, but i atleast give then some kind of respect.. for coming along and keeping Vanguard alive. Even though in the process they hurt the game bad, by pushing for a way to early release date. Vanguard will still remain one of my favorite MMO's.. wish it was treated better.
If Sony were to come out with an expansion and relaunch Vanguard they would do extreamly well in box sales and subs. It surprises me they do not see this at Sony.
I read this and just roared with laughter, This game flopped hard and DESERVEDLY! Old EQ1 game play, pshtt, no one wants it. No one wants that FORCED group crap. Broken classes are why certain people can't get groups and Brad was well known for that, except almost always his precious Necro. I am ready to post a big HAHA when this game gets cancelled and it is well on the way to that.
If Sony were to come out with an expansion and relaunch Vanguard they would do extreamly well in box sales and subs. It surprises me they do not see this at Sony.
I read this and just roared with laughter, This game flopped hard and DESERVEDLY! Old EQ1 game play, pshtt, no one wants it. No one wants that FORCED group crap. Broken classes are why certain people can't get groups and Brad was well known for that, except almost always his precious Necro. I am ready to post a big HAHA when this game gets cancelled and it is well on the way to that.
Too bad you do not try it again and find out for yourself this is the best kept seceret in the mmo market. Yes it will not be for everyone but what game is, yes it had its problems and a small staff are working on them. Sony is right behind Blizzard when it comes to the mmo market and if they choose to could do alot for or to Vangaurd. One day the Bean Counters will wake up.
" Life Liberty and the Pursuit of Those Who Would Threaten It " MAGA
Too bad you do not try it again and find out for yourself this is the best kept seceret in the mmo market. Yes it will not be for everyone but what game is, yes it had its problems and a small staff are working on them. Sony is right behind Blizzard when it comes to the mmo market and if they choose to could do alot for or to Vangaurd. One day the Bean Counters will wake up.
Wrong. Anyone who says this game would do well in a relaunch is deluded. Honestly, it just isn't that good... in ANY area! I played and actually payed one month for this game. A fact which I regret. Don't give us this crap about "it has improved alot" when it still sucks. My experience is only few months old (less than 6) and I don't see it succeeding. Investing more money to this game is like shooting yourself in the leg. Best to put your money on something with actual promise than something that is trying desperately to ressurrect something that the world has already moved on from.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been-Wayne Gretzky
Too bad you do not try it again and find out for yourself this is the best kept seceret in the mmo market. Yes it will not be for everyone but what game is, yes it had its problems and a small staff are working on them. Sony is right behind Blizzard when it comes to the mmo market and if they choose to could do alot for or to Vangaurd. One day the Bean Counters will wake up.
Wrong. Anyone who says this game would do well in a relaunch is deluded. Honestly, it just isn't that good... in ANY area! I played and actually payed one month for this game. A fact which I regret. Don't give us this crap about "it has improved alot" when it still sucks. My experience is only few months old (less than 6) and I don't see it succeeding. Investing more money to this game is like shooting yourself in the leg. Best to put your money on something with actual promise than something that is trying desperately to ressurrect something that the world has already moved on from.
Sorry you feel that way, best of luck finding a game you like.
" Life Liberty and the Pursuit of Those Who Would Threaten It " MAGA
I leveled a necromancer to 27 adventuring 15 crafting and 15 diplomacy, but i just cant stand this game anymore.
A warning to new players life after the noob island can be frustrating to say this least.
Grouping has been hell for me. Either you get vetern alts that leave after 15 minutes if the group is not up to there usual lvl 50+ raid organizational standards or you cant find a soul to group with.
This game is amazing but the lack of grouping, attitudes of veterns (pretensious to say the least), and horribly small dev team is unfortunantly crippling and i shall cancel my account tonight.
looks like its back to GW for the 4th time in a couple of years......god i cant wait for GW 2.
I've said this before: Vanguard is one of the best games that no one is playing. The OP's concerns are part of the problem. When the game first launched, it was pure SH-T. But it isn't that game any more. It still doesn't have WoW polish but it is decent.
It's just that there isn't much of a community left, because everyone left. Since Vanguard has a smaller population, some of the people you will encounter are the "hard-core" attitudes. With a larger population, the social aspect will return...if only the owners would advertise to bring those people in.
I still believe, if SOE wanted to put more money into Vanguard... they wouldn't. They know Vanguard would be even more better then their own EQ2... and knowing SOE. They wouldn't want their flagship being outdone, under their own roof. Oh well.. i don't like SOE, but i atleast give then some kind of respect.. for coming along and keeping Vanguard alive. Even though in the process they hurt the game bad, by pushing for a way to early release date. Vanguard will still remain one of my favorite MMO's.. wish it was treated better.
I think there is some truth in your words. Vanguard has some features that make it potentially a better game than eq2 (despite its problems). Many of the basic building blocks of vanguard are better than eq2 in comparison.
The problem is if soe were to invest in vanguard they seriously risk siphoning players away from eq2 and eq which will have a very negative effect on those games. Spending money to fix one game just to possilby ruin 2 doesn't make much financial sense for soe which I think is the reason they have never been serious about the future of this game. A healthy competitive vanguard just is not in the best interest of soe and never has been. It might have the chance of increasing soes overall subscriber base IF they could attract people who are not currently subscribers, but that is a very heavy gamble with their last 2 games that have any decent population.
However, everything about a failed and crippled vanguard works in their best interest. It costs them almost nothing to leave it on life support in comparison to fixing it and it doesn't threaten either of their other fantasy based games. It was even a minor pr win since some people keep saying they saved the game and how much it has been fixed.
I still believe, if SOE wanted to put more money into Vanguard... they wouldn't. They know Vanguard would be even more better then their own EQ2... and knowing SOE. They wouldn't want their flagship being outdone, under their own roof. Oh well.. i don't like SOE, but i atleast give then some kind of respect.. for coming along and keeping Vanguard alive. Even though in the process they hurt the game bad, by pushing for a way to early release date. Vanguard will still remain one of my favorite MMO's.. wish it was treated better.
I think there is some truth in your words. Vanguard has some features that make it potentially a better game than eq2 (despite its problems). Many of the basic building blocks of vanguard are better than eq2 in comparison.
The problem is if soe were to invest in vanguard they seriously risk siphoning players away from eq2 and eq which will have a very negative effect on those games. Spending money to fix one game just to possilby ruin 2 doesn't make much financial sense for soe which I think is the reason they have never been serious about the future of this game. A healthy competitive vanguard just is not in the best interest of soe and never has been. It might have the chance of increasing soes overall subscriber base IF they could attract people who are not currently subscribers, but that is a very heavy gamble with their last 2 games that have any decent population.
However, everything about a failed and crippled vanguard works in their best interest. It costs them almost nothing to leave it on life support in comparison to fixing it and it doesn't threaten either of their other fantasy based games. It was even a minor pr win since some people keep saying they saved the game and how much it has been fixed.
I think they bought the rights to Vanguard because they saw the threat. And the price was right.
" Life Liberty and the Pursuit of Those Who Would Threaten It " MAGA
I still believe, if SOE wanted to put more money into Vanguard... they wouldn't. They know Vanguard would be even more better then their own EQ2... and knowing SOE. They wouldn't want their flagship being outdone, under their own roof. Oh well.. i don't like SOE, but i atleast give then some kind of respect.. for coming along and keeping Vanguard alive. Even though in the process they hurt the game bad, by pushing for a way to early release date. Vanguard will still remain one of my favorite MMO's.. wish it was treated better.
I think there is some truth in your words. Vanguard has some features that make it potentially a better game than eq2 (despite its problems). Many of the basic building blocks of vanguard are better than eq2 in comparison.
The problem is if soe were to invest in vanguard they seriously risk siphoning players away from eq2 and eq which will have a very negative effect on those games. Spending money to fix one game just to possilby ruin 2 doesn't make much financial sense for soe which I think is the reason they have never been serious about the future of this game. A healthy competitive vanguard just is not in the best interest of soe and never has been. It might have the chance of increasing soes overall subscriber base IF they could attract people who are not currently subscribers, but that is a very heavy gamble with their last 2 games that have any decent population.
However, everything about a failed and crippled vanguard works in their best interest. It costs them almost nothing to leave it on life support in comparison to fixing it and it doesn't threaten either of their other fantasy based games. It was even a minor pr win since some people keep saying they saved the game and how much it has been fixed.
This is going to sound cynical, but they may not have given this issue as much thought as we have. It's possible that somewhere out there in SOE land, some 3-piece suit said "let's add another widget to our stables and sell station pass. Just pick something, anything..."
This is going to sound cynical, but they may not have given this issue as much thought as we have. It's possible that somewhere out there in SOE land, some 3-piece suit said "let's add another widget to our stables and sell station pass. Just pick something, anything..."
That is possible, but soe didn't go out to find a game to buy in this situation. Sigil came crawling to soe in search of funds to keep vanguard from getting canceled by microsoft.
Soe had all the bargaining power in the aragement and their benefit of a failed vanguard was much better than if vanguard had released as a success.
This is going to sound cynical, but they may not have given this issue as much thought as we have. It's possible that somewhere out there in SOE land, some 3-piece suit said "let's add another widget to our stables and sell station pass. Just pick something, anything..."
That is possible, but soe didn't go out to find a game to buy in this situation. Sigil came crawling to soe in search of funds to keep vanguard from getting canceled by microsoft.
Soe had all the bargaining power in the aragement and their benefit of a failed vanguard was much better than if vanguard had released as a success.
Yeah this is what i think happened too. I think SoE thought we can get a stake in VG and a sweet deal. If the game takes of I'm sure they stood to make lots of money and had great terms. If the game dies MS wouldn't want it so SoE would likely be the only stakeholder that might pick up the game for pennies. So for the investment SoE very likely aquired a game, ability to cherry pick the devs, and a revenue stream. Albeit probably not much but I'd bet SoE is making VG stay in the plus side and not letting it bleed.
So when sigil came to SoE desparate for an out, SoE was in a win win situation.
And finally like others have said perhaps they saw VG as a threat and didn't want to put a lot of money into it.
Comments
I went and listened to the YouTube link you included.
Silius made two mentions of resources. In the first minute or so when he was talking about AA's, he said that the development was going to be somewhat slowed by the resources on the team. Later on when discussing a re-launch and talking about how SOE is a business and they allot resources based on what product is making money, unfortuantely Vanguard is not making as much money as say a game like Free Realms. He did mention that SOE did spend money for banner ads when IOD was released.
I think your stament that "He (Silius) is bascially saying vangaurd is dead in the water" is a poor interpretation of the interview.
None of this is really new news. Yes the team would like more resources, but right now its not going to happen. In fact SOE just announced a 5% cut in all their resources.
http://www.massively.com/2009/07/17/breaking-news-sony-online-entertainment-lays-off-41-full-time-w/
If you play games based on the resources, then I would suggest you try out Free Realms
Silius says a lot of scary things in that interview. Most of which just reinforce how little resources the game has which is really a shame.
The biggest indicator is at the end of video 2 (6:19) when the interviewer asks him to sum up things and siliua says "Ya know we're gonna be here... (pause).., ya know as long as we can" and then seems to get mentally distracted after that.
We are going to be here as long as we can? That is a very strong indication of bad times when the lead designer says something like that.
You can take a lot of things from that interview including a lot of very positive and exciting plans as well. They need more resources, there is no doubt about it. A game this big and complex requires more than what they have to grow at a pace to keep up with the playerbase's consumption of new content. But I don't think they need a ton more in terms of developers. Sure it would be great to double the size of the team, but in reality, just one more good developer could make a huge difference in getting the planned content out quicker.
They didnt even mention the damn game at SOE fanfaire. What does that tell you?
The game is dead, SOE is not investing anymore cash into it, and I agree with you it absolutely should be a F2P game since no more development is going into it.
If Sony were to come out with an expansion and relaunch Vanguard they would do extreamly well in box sales and subs. It surprises me they do not see this at Sony.
MAGA
An expansion and new boxes on the shelves is far to big an investment for soe to make in this game. I'm not sure what might lead you to believe this game would do extremely well in box sales a second time around, but vanguard is a failing game that is only getting smaller. Don't get me wrong, I think the game is filled with potential, but as things stand now it cannot even grow itself with a free trial. Maybe the game would grow some, but not enough to justify the expenses you are suggesting.
I wish it were not the truth and that a relaunch might somehow change the games course, but that is the reality of the situation. Games that have a total of less tham 2-3,000 concurrent online players do not get expansions, new boxes in stores and relaunches. This game is lucky to be alive right now.
Sony Entertainment has deep pockets and with the right Devs could if they wanted too come out with as good a game as Blizzard did. Why they don't is what im not understanding.
MAGA
I heard a few decent things like the last part of content for level 51-55. AA's that look to be "endless" and maybe some work on the diplomacy line which is the biggest news I recall. Beyond that there wasn't much exciting in the future.
What I also heard about the exciting plans was that AA would have abilities that "people didn't want", but would "grind" out some AA when they were "bored" just to get something new. At one point he says diplomacy is something that sets vanguard apart from other mmos, but later calls it "half finished" and little more than a grind (2 years later even). The whole "fending for ourselves" was unnerving as well. Not exactly the most reassuring things coming from the mouth of the lead designer. Not to mention the interviewer is obviously a huge fan and he had to prop silius up a few times when he was going astray.
I don't really have any feelings about silius one way or another, but I actually felt bad for him in that interview. The impression I got from him was a broken man talking about a broken dream.
What I do not understand about SOE is the way they acquire games and the games they acquire.
They always cull the heard for a game that was bugged or had a weak developement team. Take the game and invest all kinds of money into taking it from weak to mediocre and then sit it aside and meh.
WTF? Why do this? I do not undersand it at all.
Say hello, To the things you've left behind. They are more a part of your life now that you can't touch them.
Soe is cutting staff, so I doubt their pockets are as deep as you think they are. Their entire mmo subscriber base has drastically shrank over the last several years.
The problem stems from management and flows down into development. The culture of soe is not based on creating great games and servicing their customers. It is about rushing out whatever product they think will make the most money and revamping anything at any time in an effort to make a few more bucks. It is just a company that has lost touch with what its customers want.
When was the last time you heard john smedely talk about games being fun. I mean really sit down in an interview and talk about game mechanics and what makes games good? All he ever talks about is microtransactions, revenue streams and anything related to money. That is the driving force behind this company right now and the results are what they are.
Soe is cutting staff, so I doubt their pockets are as deep as you think they are. Their entire mmo subscriber base has drastically shrank over the last several years.
The problem stems from management and flows down into development. The culture of soe is not based on creating great games and servicing their customers. It is about rushing out whatever product they think will make the most money and revamping anything at any time in an effort to make a few more bucks. It is just a company that has lost touch with what its customers want.
When was the last time you heard john smedely talk about games being fun. I mean really sit down in an interview and talk about game mechanics and what makes games good? All he ever talks about is microtransactions, revenue streams and anything related to money. That is the driving force behind this company right now and the results are what they are.
SOE destroys anything they touch or is it they get damaged goods that already are destroyed and market them. I affirm EQ only being successful due to lack of competition. WoW kicked butt so hard on boring, grindfest EQ that the server combine happened right after WoW's launch. EQ catered to the lifeless gamer, a miniscule population that this game targetted, what a huge mistake to target what amounts to a miniscule number of people.
Congrats on giving this game a try, sorry it didn't come through for you.
Don't worry, you'll be back. You'll hanker after the beautiful skies, clear air and grand vistas of Telon
You'll remember the quirky music. You'll remember what it felt like to be immersed in just wandering around. You'll remember the odd, grand dungeons and absorbing battles.
And then you'll re-sub for a bit, and then get frustrated again, and go back to your "old standby".
I've done this about 3 times now. Each time, on returning, the game seems slightly improved, a bit more polished and stable (although there are still some gameplay and cosmetic bugs, there seem to be few game-breakers now). I'm not hugely optimistic it's ever going to improve drastically and get the final spit and polish it deserves, but I do carry a torch for the game, and wish it well, and enjoy it when I enjoy it.
I still believe, if SOE wanted to put more money into Vanguard... they wouldn't. They know Vanguard would be even more better then their own EQ2... and knowing SOE. They wouldn't want their flagship being outdone, under their own roof.
Oh well.. i don't like SOE, but i atleast give then some kind of respect.. for coming along and keeping Vanguard alive. Even though in the process they hurt the game bad, by pushing for a way to early release date. Vanguard will still remain one of my favorite MMO's.. wish it was treated better.
I read this and just roared with laughter, This game flopped hard and DESERVEDLY! Old EQ1 game play, pshtt, no one wants it. No one wants that FORCED group crap. Broken classes are why certain people can't get groups and Brad was well known for that, except almost always his precious Necro. I am ready to post a big HAHA when this game gets cancelled and it is well on the way to that.
I read this and just roared with laughter, This game flopped hard and DESERVEDLY! Old EQ1 game play, pshtt, no one wants it. No one wants that FORCED group crap. Broken classes are why certain people can't get groups and Brad was well known for that, except almost always his precious Necro. I am ready to post a big HAHA when this game gets cancelled and it is well on the way to that.
Too bad you do not try it again and find out for yourself this is the best kept seceret in the mmo market. Yes it will not be for everyone but what game is, yes it had its problems and a small staff are working on them. Sony is right behind Blizzard when it comes to the mmo market and if they choose to could do alot for or to Vangaurd. One day the Bean Counters will wake up.
MAGA
Wrong. Anyone who says this game would do well in a relaunch is deluded. Honestly, it just isn't that good... in ANY area! I played and actually payed one month for this game. A fact which I regret. Don't give us this crap about "it has improved alot" when it still sucks. My experience is only few months old (less than 6) and I don't see it succeeding. Investing more money to this game is like shooting yourself in the leg. Best to put your money on something with actual promise than something that is trying desperately to ressurrect something that the world has already moved on from.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky
Wrong. Anyone who says this game would do well in a relaunch is deluded. Honestly, it just isn't that good... in ANY area! I played and actually payed one month for this game. A fact which I regret. Don't give us this crap about "it has improved alot" when it still sucks. My experience is only few months old (less than 6) and I don't see it succeeding. Investing more money to this game is like shooting yourself in the leg. Best to put your money on something with actual promise than something that is trying desperately to ressurrect something that the world has already moved on from.
Sorry you feel that way, best of luck finding a game you like.
MAGA
I've said this before: Vanguard is one of the best games that no one is playing. The OP's concerns are part of the problem. When the game first launched, it was pure SH-T. But it isn't that game any more. It still doesn't have WoW polish but it is decent.
It's just that there isn't much of a community left, because everyone left. Since Vanguard has a smaller population, some of the people you will encounter are the "hard-core" attitudes. With a larger population, the social aspect will return...if only the owners would advertise to bring those people in.
I think there is some truth in your words. Vanguard has some features that make it potentially a better game than eq2 (despite its problems). Many of the basic building blocks of vanguard are better than eq2 in comparison.
The problem is if soe were to invest in vanguard they seriously risk siphoning players away from eq2 and eq which will have a very negative effect on those games. Spending money to fix one game just to possilby ruin 2 doesn't make much financial sense for soe which I think is the reason they have never been serious about the future of this game. A healthy competitive vanguard just is not in the best interest of soe and never has been. It might have the chance of increasing soes overall subscriber base IF they could attract people who are not currently subscribers, but that is a very heavy gamble with their last 2 games that have any decent population.
However, everything about a failed and crippled vanguard works in their best interest. It costs them almost nothing to leave it on life support in comparison to fixing it and it doesn't threaten either of their other fantasy based games. It was even a minor pr win since some people keep saying they saved the game and how much it has been fixed.
I think there is some truth in your words. Vanguard has some features that make it potentially a better game than eq2 (despite its problems). Many of the basic building blocks of vanguard are better than eq2 in comparison.
The problem is if soe were to invest in vanguard they seriously risk siphoning players away from eq2 and eq which will have a very negative effect on those games. Spending money to fix one game just to possilby ruin 2 doesn't make much financial sense for soe which I think is the reason they have never been serious about the future of this game. A healthy competitive vanguard just is not in the best interest of soe and never has been. It might have the chance of increasing soes overall subscriber base IF they could attract people who are not currently subscribers, but that is a very heavy gamble with their last 2 games that have any decent population.
However, everything about a failed and crippled vanguard works in their best interest. It costs them almost nothing to leave it on life support in comparison to fixing it and it doesn't threaten either of their other fantasy based games. It was even a minor pr win since some people keep saying they saved the game and how much it has been fixed.
I think they bought the rights to Vanguard because they saw the threat. And the price was right.
MAGA
I think there is some truth in your words. Vanguard has some features that make it potentially a better game than eq2 (despite its problems). Many of the basic building blocks of vanguard are better than eq2 in comparison.
The problem is if soe were to invest in vanguard they seriously risk siphoning players away from eq2 and eq which will have a very negative effect on those games. Spending money to fix one game just to possilby ruin 2 doesn't make much financial sense for soe which I think is the reason they have never been serious about the future of this game. A healthy competitive vanguard just is not in the best interest of soe and never has been. It might have the chance of increasing soes overall subscriber base IF they could attract people who are not currently subscribers, but that is a very heavy gamble with their last 2 games that have any decent population.
However, everything about a failed and crippled vanguard works in their best interest. It costs them almost nothing to leave it on life support in comparison to fixing it and it doesn't threaten either of their other fantasy based games. It was even a minor pr win since some people keep saying they saved the game and how much it has been fixed.
This is going to sound cynical, but they may not have given this issue as much thought as we have. It's possible that somewhere out there in SOE land, some 3-piece suit said "let's add another widget to our stables and sell station pass. Just pick something, anything..."
That is possible, but soe didn't go out to find a game to buy in this situation. Sigil came crawling to soe in search of funds to keep vanguard from getting canceled by microsoft.
Soe had all the bargaining power in the aragement and their benefit of a failed vanguard was much better than if vanguard had released as a success.
That is possible, but soe didn't go out to find a game to buy in this situation. Sigil came crawling to soe in search of funds to keep vanguard from getting canceled by microsoft.
Soe had all the bargaining power in the aragement and their benefit of a failed vanguard was much better than if vanguard had released as a success.
Yeah this is what i think happened too. I think SoE thought we can get a stake in VG and a sweet deal. If the game takes of I'm sure they stood to make lots of money and had great terms. If the game dies MS wouldn't want it so SoE would likely be the only stakeholder that might pick up the game for pennies. So for the investment SoE very likely aquired a game, ability to cherry pick the devs, and a revenue stream. Albeit probably not much but I'd bet SoE is making VG stay in the plus side and not letting it bleed.
So when sigil came to SoE desparate for an out, SoE was in a win win situation.
And finally like others have said perhaps they saw VG as a threat and didn't want to put a lot of money into it.
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Ethion