Jumping and swiming?

MMOPLAYER321

One thing I noticed in FFXI was that in battle the animations looked pretty smooth and pulling off spells and weapon skills looked great but outside of combat my characters movement felt somewhat robotic and that made me feel less immersed, I think something that contributed to this somewhat the fact I can't jump. Another thing that kind of bothered me was there was so many locations that had beautiful beaches and water but your character wasn't able to swim in it because of an invisible wall which killed a lot of immersion, it also felt odd fighting pugils on land since they are fish. Would you want to see jumping and swimming added to Final Fantasy XIV?

Edit: Something I would like to add to my original post is that it was so annoying in FFXI seeing a little rock or ledge in front of you but you need to walk around it because you can't just jump over it.

Unknown

Although there are pluses to both, I think the negatives outweigh any benefit to adding either.

For jumping, there's nothing worse than seeing some idiot jump up on places he's not supposed to be, or some spastic 12 year old that has to jump non-stop while fighting.  If SE wants us to be able to transverse the terrain, they'll facilitate it in other ways besides having to jump.

For swimming, it would be nice to have underwater areas to explore or travel though.  However, if they are going to have underwater fighting, then to do it right they'd have to make a whole nother set of animations for every action in the game because seeing the same ones as on dry land just looks quirky.

MMOPLAYER321

I really don't see how for jumping the negative outweighs the positive. Having a few people who jump around a lot doesn't bother me that much plus not many people jump around in combat because it interrupts their spells/moves and messes up their targetting issue. I think your getting confused with strafing around in pvp not jumping. Pretty much every single recent mmorpg has jumping and it doesn't seem lke a problem at all. If anything FFXIV not having jumping would make it seem somewhat outdated. As for swiming it shouldn't be that hard to create swimming animations.

whatamidoing

I agree with sixpax. Having played games where you can jump and can't jump, every one that has the ability to jump (MMO wise) ends up with tons of characters spazzing out for no real reason, which IMO breaks the immersion more than not being able to jump. Swimming on the other hand would be cool but in my experience in most MMOs swimming areas are generally pointless and you end up running into an invisible wall anyways. If they could somehow create content for swimming/underwater and make it not corny looking then I'd be all for swimming.

SSJGotenx268

I usually jump around a lot when im bored, but in FFXI i just sat there and looked pretty ><

Jumping would be awesome. Swimming would be cool too, but jumping more!

majes

personally i think it would be cool if your choco could jump. I can understand your charcter not being able to jump, being weighed down by all the junk you are carring and the tight fiting armour you are wearing.

svann

The quality of design of the world system is important to the feel of a game.  It bothers me in lotro that juming feels awkward compared to other mmo's Ive played, and it seems a bit lame that there is no possibility of swimming underwater.

ic0n67

Question: What would you accomplish by jumping?

---

Answer: You'd be able to jump up on cliffs.

Retort: Maybe ... just maybe ... SE doesn't WANT you to jump up on cliffs. For instance getting to Roc's spawn point. You have to walk through Garilage Citadel to get there. It isn't exactly a hard thing to do -- especially considering you need multiple people to take Roc down and you need multiple people to open the doors in Garilage -- but it is something that is a barrier. Because of this Roc is full contained by basically walls. First you won't have someone just walking up and taking him and holding til help arrives which is cool. Also the item retains more value because it is harder to get (albeit kinda worthless at this point in the game). Look at climbing to the top of the hill for the CoP mission or to get your filter. That isn't very hard to do, tedeous, not hard. If you could jump first off it would be a lot harder to get up there because you need to create the same challege or it is so simple anyone can do it and when you have a game where everyone can do everything you get shit.

There are very few spots in this game where jumping can even be helpful and where those places are SE has made it so you can't so there is some what of a challenge to get there. Most any small ledge that you could possibly fall off of is like a 15 second walk to get to the ramp to do it again.

---

Answer: Because I'm bored.

Retort:

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Answer: Because you can jump in real life.

Retort: Two things first ... you play an MMO meaning you have no athletic ability what so freaking ever. If you're bed sores interfere with life then you probably can't jump more than an inch of fthe ground without causing a small tsunami. More like you want to jump in game because you can't irl. Who play MMOs?

This guy:

or this guy:



(it is Michael Jordan before anyone asks ... and you live a very pathetic life.)

Anywho ... second ... assuming you have athletic ability. How often do you jump outside of playing a sport? Think about the last time you did where you weren't playing or trying to show off how much high you can jump or possibily trying to grab something just out of your reach ... i'll give you an hour or so to think of that. ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... So, you havn't jumped without a purpose in a while eh? (Whodathunk.) Then why oh why do MMO players need to jump nonstop as they are traversing a flat plain? If the answer is bored see above retort. Also add to the fact that jumping up and down as you are walking isn't call jumping; it is called skipping and it makes you look like a freaking fairy hopped up on sugar or speed (for you sake and masculinity pray the second).

---

Question: What would you accomplish by swimming?

---

Answer: Because you can swim in real life.

Retort: .... okay try this again.

This guy

or this guy:



(it is Michael Phelps before anyone asks)

 

---

Answer: So you can swim underwater.

Retort: Which accomplishes what? So you can hide something under water? Why can't you just hide that in a hole on the ground? What is the difference to you. If you have equal accessability to water zones mean you call can swim the same. All that swimming does is it adds extra depth to the zone. This would be exactly the same as everyone suddenly developing wings and flying around to get a gold coin ten feet above thier heads because they can't jump (see how I brought that one full circle).

Also have you played other MMOs where you can swim underwater. You can hold your breathe for a few minutes while first off not floating to the surface and second off have the ability to perform some arduous task such as mining or fighting a mob. Lets just bring this around to the whole idea of "you can do it irl you can do it in game". Do you SERIOUSLY want to try to jump into a lake to mine for copper while being attack by some mutant breed of freshwater shark?

Also something to consider: Maybe ... just maybe ... SE doesn't WANT you to swim. For instance King Arthro. His spawn point is on the other side of the lake in Jugnar forest. If you could just swim over there everyone can do it and can compete for KA. By having him cut off from the rest of the zone by the lake a person who wants to camp has to now walk through -- I believe -- KRT to get there. Less people trying because it is more work yada yada yada. That isn't very hard to do, tedious, not hard. If you could swim to the spot it would be so simple anyone can do it and when you have a game where everyone can do everything you get shit.

Dewm

 

I lol'd so hard...

Brif

I don't play games that I can't jump in.

dylang

no to jumping, yes to swimming. I'd like to beable to swim to islands or locations not accessible by modes of game transportation

xiirot

It is my personal belief that these games are about freedom.  Freedom to be what you want to be, and do what you want to do.

 

If you take away some of the most basic functions of life (human functionality like swimming and jumping) then the game loses some of its freedom.

 

I was a hardcore FFXI player, it was my first fantasy MMO, and I love that game.  But looking back on it now, it always felt like my avatar was glued to the ground, and I didn't have a choice in the matter.  The developers took away freedom from the game so that the mechanics of the game wouldn't be compromised.

pfloydguy84

i hate not being able to jump.Annoying as hell having to walk around a fenced area for example.plus i jump for the hell of it sometimes.If you cant jump, then usually there is only a set path you can go on like guild wars, which sucks and feels less like an open world.

Zorvan

Originally posted by ic0n67


Question: What would you accomplish by jumping?

Answer: You'd be able to jump up on cliffs.
Retort: Maybe ... just maybe ... SE doesn't WANT you to jump up on cliffs. For instance getting to Roc's spawn point. You have to walk through Garilage Citadel to get there. It isn't exactly a hard thing to do -- especially considering you need multiple people to take Roc down and you need multiple people to open the doors in Garilage -- but it is something that is a barrier. Because of this Roc is full contained by basically walls. First you won't have someone just walking up and taking him and holding til help arrives which is cool. Also the item retains more value because it is harder to get (albeit kinda worthless at this point in the game). Look at climbing to the top of the hill for the CoP mission or to get your filter. That isn't very hard to do, tedeous, not hard. If you could jump first off it would be a lot harder to get up there because you need to create the same challege or it is so simple anyone can do it and when you have a game where everyone can do everything you get shit.
There are very few spots in this game where jumping can even be helpful and where those places are SE has made it so you can't so there is some what of a challenge to get there. Most any small ledge that you could possibly fall off of is like a 15 second walk to get to the ramp to do it again.

Answer: Because I'm bored.
Retort:


Answer: Because you can jump in real life.
Retort: Two things first ... you play an MMO meaning you have no athletic ability what so freaking ever. If you're bed sores interfere with life then you probably can't jump more than an inch of fthe ground without causing a small tsunami. More like you want to jump in game because you can't irl. Who play MMOs?
This guy:


or this guy:



(it is Michael Jordan before anyone asks ... and you live a very pathetic life.)
Anywho ... second ... assuming you have athletic ability. How often do you jump outside of playing a sport? Think about the last time you did where you weren't playing or trying to show off how much high you can jump or possibily trying to grab something just out of your reach ... i'll give you an hour or so to think of that. ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... So, you havn't jumped without a purpose in a while eh? (Whodathunk.) Then why oh why do MMO players need to jump nonstop as they are traversing a flat plain? If the answer is bored see above retort. Also add to the fact that jumping up and down as you are walking isn't call jumping; it is called skipping and it makes you look like a freaking fairy hopped up on sugar or speed (for you sake and masculinity pray the second).


Question: What would you accomplish by swimming?

Answer: Because you can swim in real life.
Retort: .... okay try this again.
This guy


or this guy:



(it is Michael Phelps before anyone asks)

 

Answer: So you can swim underwater.
Retort: Which accomplishes what? So you can hide something under water? Why can't you just hide that in a hole on the ground? What is the difference to you. If you have equal accessability to water zones mean you call can swim the same. All that swimming does is it adds extra depth to the zone. This would be exactly the same as everyone suddenly developing wings and flying around to get a gold coin ten feet above thier heads because they can't jump (see how I brought that one full circle).
Also have you played other MMOs where you can swim underwater. You can hold your breathe for a few minutes while first off not floating to the surface and second off have the ability to perform some arduous task such as mining or fighting a mob. Lets just bring this around to the whole idea of "you can do it irl you can do it in game". Do you SERIOUSLY want to try to jump into a lake to mine for copper while being attack by some mutant breed of freshwater shark?
Also something to consider: Maybe ... just maybe ... SE doesn't WANT you to swim. For instance King Arthro. His spawn point is on the other side of the lake in Jugnar forest. If you could just swim over there everyone can do it and can compete for KA. By having him cut off from the rest of the zone by the lake a person who wants to camp has to now walk through -- I believe -- KRT to get there. Less people trying because it is more work yada yada yada. That isn't very hard to do, tedious, not hard. If you could swim to the spot it would be so simple anyone can do it and when you have a game where everyone can do everything you get shit.

 

Maybe Square-Enix doesn't want assholes in their game, either. But as that post made apparent, they're getting one anyway.

garretth

Wow took care of swimming by having very deep water in which you would drown if you went too far - way cool way to limit access.

As for jumping...let folks have some fun.  Give us skipping too!  If I see someone jumping around like a kangaroo,  I think...dang!  he/she has a lot of energy!  Every once and a while...i actually try to jump low fences...in real life. 

We should not be paper dolls in an mmorpg.   The devs should always have something for us to uncover, like a sweet present. 

I know I try to climb mountains...just to see vistas and once in a while, i actually make it to the top by sheer determination.   I always feel pleased when successful.

 

merv808

I played FFXI for years, it was the first MMO i spent a whole lot of time in. I loved to travel the terrain, go out exploring and sightseeing. I spent a lot of time doing this before I got my chocobo liscence. I never missed jumping in the game. Hell, I didn't even realize that the characters couldn't jump. Why? because there is no-in game reason for the ability to jump. Im not gonna jump up and down in combat, like some  crappy FPS, and I'm not platform jumping like Mario.

Even without jumping or swimming the game was and still is the most immersive I've played, and the world felt real. I'm not sure how jumping ruins immersion for people. Immersion is about the way you feel about a games character, story, and world. Since there was no need for jumping in the game, maybe the lack of jumping bothered you because you weren't immersing yourself in the game, instead of the other way around. I mean, seriously. If you're walking and you come to an open field, are you going to walk across it, or jump across it. Or if everything was accesible to you from the ground, would you ever be mad if you couldn't jump? just something to think about.

Chach

Jumping is definitely not needed.  Maybe an auto-jump for some low rocks could be worked in but definitely not gamebreaking.

 

I like the possibility of swimming though.  Maybe it's an additional skill that could be raised by mini games or trials.   This way, certain areas that lead to NM mobs, could require a certain level of skill to use that swimming shortcut or the only way to get to them.

Rogue_Leader

Little, easily jumpable rocks / fences / low walls / pixilated dots have kept characters from the easy path for years in FF.  See a treasure chest with a couple of stones in the hallway between you and it?  Better find that secret passage that takes you 1/2 way around the 'zone' so you can actually get it.

So for the FF world it makes sense that you can't jump or swim.

Now, should they keep it that way?  Eh, doesn't matter much to me.  If they do add jumping likely some players will find a way to use it to climb things they're not supposed to.  So that can be a headache for developers.  Swimming is much easier to control.

xiirot

The developers took away freedom from the game so that the mechanics of the game wouldn't be compromised.

Nikopol

Let us not be able to run while you're at it. People "spazz out" running around all the time, if you give them the ability to. How can you keep running on and on and on, it's silly... What are you, Haile Gebrselassie?

 

Spadez88

Its a MMOJumping and swimming are easy fix's. I mean really how big of a dick do you have to be to insult other players just becase they want 2 very very simple things. 1st off not all mmo players are fat and cant jump or swim. Mabey just mabey and iam just layin it on the table here but most indaviduals play mmo's to kill a few hours at night or on there day off. i mean really i only do 2 to 3 hours of weight training and running in a day and then when i get home i got like 3 hours befor iam tired, so why not just sit back and play a game.

cukimunga

I don't care either way if they add it or not.   I don't jump around when Im in combat but I tend to jump around when im running to places.  I don't know why I guess its just something to do,lol.  In FFXI when I got bored i would walk around all funny and spastic or mess around with emotes doing crazy taru dances.

Kyleran

Game should have jumping and swimming.

If you are worried about people climbing/jumping where they shouldn't, add falling damage.

Swimming ....fill the lake with very hard to kill monsters that no one dare cross solo.

 

Zorvan

Okay, here's my $.02

No Dragon Quest games ever had jumping or swimming. I don't think any Enix game ever did.

Now Squaresoft was the same up until FFX, FFX-2, and FFXII.

So Square-Enix together have a long history of no jumping or swmming in their games and FFXI was built the same way as the singleplayer rpgs before the PS2 generation of games.

I would be happy with just the swimming from FFX ( remember the big ass fish that chases you when you first go back in time to Spira or the big octopus thing when diving for salvage with the Al-Bed? ) and FFXII ( the prison escape in the sewers with the giant snake thing? ) and jumping/climbing in FFX-2 ( where you could jump from ledges/rocks to the other side and climb up rocks/crates/etc. to get to hidden spots/items ).

Grunty

Originally posted by Spadez88


Its a MMOJumping and swimming are easy fix's. I mean really how big of a dick do you have to be to insult other players just becase they want 2 very very simple things. 1st off not all mmo players are fat and cant jump or swim. Mabey just mabey and iam just layin it on the table here but most indaviduals play mmo's to kill a few hours at night or on there day off. i mean really i only do 2 to 3 hours of weight training and running in a day and then when i get home i got like 3 hours befor iam tired, so why not just sit back and play a game.

 

Swimming or flying in a game is not an easy fix. i doubt jumping is much easier.

Stuckov

Originally posted by Zorvan


Okay, here's my $.02
No Dragon Quest games ever had jumping or swimming. I don't think any Enix game ever did.
Now Squaresoft was the same up until FFX, FFX-2, and FFXII.
So Square-Enix together have a long history of no jumping or swmming in their games and FFXI was built the same way as the singleplayer rpgs before the PS2 generation of games.
I would be happy with just the swimming from FFX ( remember the big ass fish that chases you when you first go back in time to Spira or the big octopus thing when diving for salvage with the Al-Bed? ) and FFXII ( the prison escape in the sewers with the giant snake thing? ) and jumping/climbing in FFX-2 ( where you could jump from ledges/rocks to the other side and climb up rocks/crates/etc. to get to hidden spots/items ).

 

Its called evolution and while 5 years ago jumping and swimming were not part of most games they are these days. I mean 10 years ago mounts were something that was considered unique in some games. Now the games that dont have mounts are few and pretty much overlooked. Flight ? well no game had flight mounts back in the day... we should have just not tried it as it wasnt the practiced norm. What I am saying is just couse 500 years ago everyone thought that the earth was flat and the center of the universe does not mean that those same ideas would sink in with anyone. Things change and they evolve for the better, we learn and want more from games every year. It is not much to ask that our favorite games have more features.