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I'm just wondering ... seems like folks here don't like the linear style WoW imposed, but many don't consider MMOs like Second Life.
Would you? Discuss.
Edit: Can someone edit my poll to have a third option, "No (Because I don't like Second Life)"
i voted no, not because i dislike linear games.
but because the people who play second life scares the shit out of me.
where else can you be a popular midget lol
This isn't a signature, you just think it is.
Mack, this wouldn't work.. second life is BASED on real life money being used ingame.. if it became subscription based a LOT LOT less people who DO play it would be playing, second life is like a "buisness" for some people...
Um secondlife isn't a cash shop it IS A shop.
I find it amazing that by 2020 first world countries will be competing to get immigrants.
All 2nd Life is, is a enchanced chat room. Why in the world would anyone pay for that?
Second Life is, in my opinion, not really a game. It's a virtual world simulator.
While there are interesting things in Second Life, I have found when I explored SL that a large number of people who are involved heavily in Second Life are individuals who have significant problems in real life -- often various kinds of mental illness. I know that sounds harsh, but it was my experience with the platform.
Most of the heavier users of the game are either the content creator sorts or the social sorts. The content sorts are more sane, but also not very numerous. The social sorts are largely folks who are looking to fill this or that hole in their personal lives in the real world -- whether that involves having a virtual affair, experimenting with sado-masochism or same-sex relationships, or otherwise living out fairly dysfunctional fantasies in the context of Second Life. It's a very troubled place filled with troubled people. While it's interesting to explore for a bit, once you dip past the surface you begin to see just how screwed up the people who spend a lot of time there in fact are, and it's time to head for the door.
Second Life isn't an MMO.
An MMO is consists of art, sound, animations and logic are all built by the company selling the game.
In Second Life, while you're provided with some "starter" assets; most of the art, sound, animation and logic is decided by the users of the "grid".
Even the landmass of the "grid" is largely controlled by users. Probably 99% of the time when I'm in Second Life, I'm in a "private region", i.e. regions owned and administrated by non-Linden folks.
If you want to play a "game" in Second Life, there's people who've created as much. From scripters who've created whack-a-moles, to private region owners who've crafted urban landscape RPGs with useable guns and all sorts of stuff.
Or, there's regions of museums with NASA photo stills, or regions where people do the same kind of building of neighborhoods they like to do in games like Sims 2. Or corporate owned sims like Microsoft's island which has MSDN classrooms. Or movie theaters where users screen their webisodes.
Second Life is whatever users make it to be. Saying its an MMO is just like saying every website is a browser game; even though only some of 'em actually are. It sees as much diversified uses as the web does; since its really little more than 3D assets swapped in for hypertext.
Sorry this is a bit of a long answer but here you go...
You know in the Relm of MMORPG's there are a few that stand out for different reasons. WOW just because it landed 10Million+ people who pony up a monthly fee to play it, games like EQ who really started the MMO market, or made it more main stream. Asherons Call, Ultima online for showing us what a skill based MMO could be, and even though they are both 10+ years old still are a breath of fresh air in the stagnent MMO market. Games like EVE online and DDO both give you the ability like the games of old, AC and Ultima Online, to do a skill based character system where your not pigeon holed into being a sword fighter, mage, priest. Also in the relm of sandbox MMO's there are only a few that stick out and show there true colors, AC, Ultima Online and EVE, now even though there may be many more out there that I have not played these are the ones that stick out the most in any sandbox discussion. The final, "Game" that sticks out in the same discussion is Second Life. A sandbox game is one where you mold it to your liking just like sitting in a real sandbox, you can make anything your heart desires, a castle, a road...etc, and in this case Second Life is a great Sandbox, but do you consider it a game? There is no game part to Second life unless you are into gambling, and if I wanted to do that then I will just go to party poker or some site like that. To combine Sandbox and game together, you need goals to strive for and this is where Second life to me is not even a game. A game like AC, Ultima Online and Eve are sandbox games and even though each takes a step away from the true "sandbox" each is close enough to warrant the title. So to finally answer your question No I would not pay to join Second life because there are no goals, it is not a game to play it is just a place to go and do nothing. However I will continue to play and pay for my EVE and AC accounts because although they are not 100% sandbox, they are the closest thing I can get to it and still make it fun to play.
IMO, Second life is a virtual dating network for fat, old, and ugly people to find cyber partners.
I do like the idea of having a totally sandbox virtual world, but in a pure form like this it gets populated by creepy folks.
GrymmMMO addict in recovery!EQ,SWG preCU,L2,EQ2,GW,CoH/CoV,V:SOH,Aion,AoC,TR,WAR,EVE,BP,RIFT,WoW and others... no more!
I would pay a monthly fee for Second Life if I wanted to do cyber sex with an avatar that was some kind of animal that looked sort of human. But since I don't want to do that, I wouldn't pay.
Second Life is the epitome of creepy. Well-designed worlds are terribly overshadowed by wacky gothic furry sex clubs.
Currently playing: EverQuest II
Tried: EVE Online (will return someday), Final Fantasy XI (didn't like, sorry)
Originally posted by Villakoira Second Life is the epitome of creepy. Well-designed worlds are terribly overshadowed by wacky gothic furry sex clubs.
I think that would be a hit. 14.95 per month for Gothic Furry Sex Club Online. GFSCO.
That's a money maker right there.
You can put the wacky in an expansion pack.
Second life is not an MMO its a Virtual world filled with little worlds the users make themselves. Even if they added a subscription feature (which would be stupid as hell since every inch of content in the game was built by players and not the developers) I still wouldn't join up. Honestly what would you be paying for if it went subscription certaintly not content? Its techincally free to download and use its just not free if you want to buy virtual land or items from other players.
Runs like crap, looks like crap, and is filled with some real freaks.
I still maintain my stance that MMORPG.com needs to remove all references to Second Life. Its not an MMO and its most definitly not an RPG...its not a Game.
Originally posted by banthis Second life is not an MMO its a Virtual world filled with little worlds the users make themselves. Even if they added a subscription feature (which would be stupid as hell since every inch of content in the game was built by players and not the developers) I still wouldn't join up. Honestly what would you be paying for if it went subscription certaintly not content? Its techincally free to download and use its just not free if you want to buy virtual land or items from other players.Runs like crap, looks like crap, and is filled with some real freaks.I still maintain my stance that MMORPG.com needs to remove all references to Second Life. Its not an MMO and its most definitly not an RPG...its not a Game.
Its more like a social experiment! haha
Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!
There is a monthly fee option for Second Life, actually. It's just optional.
Originally posted by Ihmotepp Originally posted by Villakoira Second Life is the epitome of creepy. Well-designed worlds are terribly overshadowed by wacky gothic furry sex clubs.
I think that would be a hit. 14.95 per month for Gothic Furry Sex Club Online. GFSCO.
That's a money maker right there.
You can put the wacky in an expansion pack.
It sure would make money!
The thing is, there are people in SL who spend a CRAPTON of RL money there. A sim (one of SL's regions, or zones) costs 250-350 USD per month, and that's leaving aside the purchase price, which is 1000-1300 USD. These are costs that are not comparable to any other online platform, really, and they're the primary way that LL makes its money. It's a risky business plan, but it's worked so far because there isn't much serious competition for the specific thing that LL is offering, and there are seemingly a LOT of people who want the kind of escape that SL offers.
You mean I would have to pay a monthly fee AND pay for the hookers too?
No way. I would prefer a non linear MMO myself but not second life.
Sure, there are parts of it that could be used in a MMO but at least 75 % would have to go.
The biggest issue for me personally is that SL is basicly a chat room with graphics.. what you chat about.. can be graphicly shown.
There are some "combat" sims but they are so basic its... not going to hold the average MMO player.
On top of that the entire foundation of SL is built upon not having a flat fee.
The hook is that it appears you can "play for free" and could maybe make some money doing it. The truth is not many people actually make money and some people spend to the point of stupid.
Which is the foundation of SL...
The most basic thing is they never lie or mis represent it.. and the only reason most people spend is..
They either can't make the stuff
Or don't want to take the time.
Oh and they decide they "need" it...
Second life is a game? Certainly not an MMORPG.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
i have some suggestions on a UGC (user generated content) paradigm far different from SL, so if you want to skip my little rant on why SL shoots itself in the foot as far as discouraging people from making quality content, look for a bunch of asterisks (**********).
the reason %90-%95 of everything in SL is crap (that applies to almost everything in life) is more than just because its %99 UGC.
there are alot of people who would contribute to making the world look nice...IF THEY COULD.
there's alot of free work that would gladly be done if they didn't CHARGE YOU EXHORBITANT/LUDICROUS AMOUNTS OF MONEY for the privilege of putting in tons of time into making THEIR world a better place.
if you subscribe (last i knew it was about $10 a month) you are allowed to own a tiny plot of land (512m) for no extra cost a month. if you double that tiny plot of land your subscription fee goes WAY up.
what most people would want to build would never fit on even 1024m. such as a even a normal sized house with a tiny yard. and naturally people aren't going to be that inspired to make even a normal sized house, they want to build a MANSION as this is cyberspace and what good is cyberspace with such real world like limitations?
not only that, each 512m plot will only allow you to place 112 primitives (cones, boxes, pyramids, other elemental shapes that everything is made from). that SEVERELY limits your imagination if you want anything thats not for sparse and underdetailed. even the best looking places in SL use way less objects than they should because of this restrictive prim budget. so even the best looking places have really cheap looking things in them, such the railing around a deck or porch being made up of alphablended 2D sprites with no thickness to them. looks very cheap and breaks immersion immediately.
ALSO, because of these limitations, unless one person owns a whole region, there are a bunch of plots where the buildings and content stretches all the way up to the borders of the NEXT guys land, so there's virtually NO yard or landscape between all these tiny user areas that are all jammed up together in an extremely unrealistic and unnattractive manner. house or building walls jammed right up against the next guys. if they both had windows lined up with each other, you could jump thru from your house right into the next guys bedroom. lol. ugly ugly ugly. the fact that there IS any nice spots in SL is almost a miracle. those people put alot of money and effort into those areas, fighting the whole messed up system all the way.
AND, you see fantasy themed areas jammed right up against fantasy areas, 30's mobster areas, hip hop themed areas, steampunk areas, sci-fi themed areas, etc., etc. VERY much breaking any chance of immersion.
*************** this is the kind of UGC MMO i wanna see *****************
operates like a realtime massively multi-user 3D BBS. for those that didn't ever use a phone modem or bulletin board services (pre-internet mostly), think of internet forums. they were basically like that, but generally only one user at a time could be connected to a BBS. you could also download files and play some primitive turn based games and some other things.
there was a "sysop" who ran the thing and was the central authority. he had the freedom to delete any files the users uploaded that he didn't want, or delete any messages that offended him, etc. i would call him a ServerOp in the kinda of MMO i have in mind, and each different server would have a different ServerOp and therefore a different world. there would be a purpose to explore different servers in this MMO.
everyone can build (practically) AS MUCH as they want, ANYWHERE they want.
in SL, the best and most creative artists are STILL limited to their tiny plots, or to however many islands/sims they own (remember thats around $300 a month for each sim).
if they could build anywhere they would probably build 2x-10x as much stuff
why would you want to turn away FREE LABOUR for your world?
also, when you can build anywhere, i would expect that much of the building that gets done would be additions to things that already exist. improvements and extra details. so you could come back to the same building next week, and it could look much more authentic or more detaild and/or with more rooms and features.
a serverop can reject anything theydon't like.
this allows for there to be worlds that are coherent to one style or setting. one server might be fantasy, another sci-fi. the artwork could all be consistent (depending on how stringent/exacting the serverop is).
stuff that gets rejected will not simply be deleted/discarded. every player would have their own private instance/world they can invite other people to, so they can show them all the stuff that was rejected from the main world for whatever reason. this is even better than player housing since your private instance could be an entire world in itself if you put the time into it, or other friends joined and built onto your world.
there would be different options for each player where you can choose to see new content submissions or not, or see translucent versions of them. this new content has not been reviewed by the serverop and would not have any collision so it couldn't be used to block doorways or dungeons or whatever.
users can review the new content so that there can be a sh*t filter for serverops that don't want to examine every single new thing. they could choose to only look at 4 star ratings and above. they could start their world by allowing practically everything, and get more and more selective over time. simultaneously that old crappier content can slowly be improved and or replaced. up to the serverop.
each world could have different skies. different lengths and ratios for the day night cycle. different weather and gravity settings and such too.
i'm tired, can't think of anything else atm, but thats the basics of a world that would encourage both QUALITY AND quantity (depending on each serverops preferences), and allows for vastly different and yet fairly coherent servers/worlds (depending on how the serverops run them).
i'd like to hear your thoughts on THIS kind of theoretical MMO
Originally posted by Swiftblade13 IMO, Second life is a virtual dating network for fat, old, and ugly people to find cyber partners. I do like the idea of having a totally sandbox virtual world, but in a pure form like this it gets populated by creepy folks.
You are totally cool
It'd be great if MMO developers took a tiny bit of a queue from secondlife.
Not making reletivly useless crap like Ryzom Ring where the developers actually planned on making it LESS useful and fun, But where they actually encouraged developement.
The Admins also intereact with the community, You can go to their calender and for each person who manages an aspect of the game(community, programming, core developement) you have 2 to 4 days out of the week where they actually sit down in game and talk with anyone that shows up. There's a blog post everyday other day if not more that actually relates to the game.
Lets see they also give you a very interesting amount of control over your own instances. And have systems extendable enough to make player housing something that's actually interesting and comfortable.
obviously strapped for ideas. But the large one is that you can actually world craft in the game and that sort. sure 95% is crap but who cares you don't ever see it.
Anyways as they say: "you need to be able to say 3 good things about something before you're knowlegable enough to say bad things about it".