No matter how you cut it the best way for Warhammer to improve is to get people talking in general chat and give them incentive to group up.......Part of the problem with the MMO genre is that too many games are catering to solo players because they feel thats what we want (blame WOW for that)...... The problem is though that a game like Warhammer really should encourage grouping right off the bat so tjhat players learn to work together and develop a feeling of being needed.......I thought the scenarios might be a problem because that is what the players that came over from WoW are used to and probably their preferred style of PVP.......The players that came from DAoC are the ones that want solid RVR PVP..... It sounds like if Warhammer wants to survive long term they are going to have to make serious changes to the core ideas of the game.......
I dont think they care about surviving long term. Its obvious in how they made the game or should I say Halfway made the game.
Agreed 100%.
WAR is the classic modern thinking that is killing modern MMORPGs. Most of the current gen of players don't care though, because, to be frank, they never saw how good these games can be when they have a soul. The only thing that has ever made them good is the players, but they don't seem to get it.
We live in the age of the MMO arcade game, and thats a shame to me personally.
Instead of having golden eggs for the next ten years, they all seem happy to just settle for killing the goose for one big dinner.
So Sad.
Shh.. you're going to spawn the "you suck" whambulance..
The younger generation players who think that we are elitist jerks and that we just dun want to learn to enjoy them games....
So shhh
Actually, gotta say I am pretty amazed at the lack of flames and hate this thread has gotten so far... It really does show where this game is at for so many I think.
The world isn't actually empty at all unless you're on a low/low pop, but that would be your own fault. The chat system is unwieldy which prevents group-ups and smaller guilds forming, etc. An empty chat gives the illusion of a dead community.
My advice to people who are blue because of this, just find a guild for now because the problem will be fixed. There are tons of people there, you just have to be far more assertive at the moment.
___________________ Sadly, I see storm clouds on the horizon. A faint stench of Vanguard is in the air.-Kien
I'm beginning to think that the core design of the game itself is somehow counter-inducive to social interaction. Maybe it's ultimately too much battle-oriented - and being so, it's not a bright idea to flush all that kinetic energy out of the open world via instanced scenarios.
I'm still having fun in the game, I love the careers and the combat mechanics, but I can see storm clouds forming. And here is my fundamental problem: I don't get the feeling that the toons are actual characters depending on each other, they feel more like faceless soldiers on the chaotic field of battle. If it weren't for my guild and some friends from before who are also playing, I'd be hard-pressed to call this a social experience on the scale we're used to seeing in MMORPGs.
The odd thing is, sometimes somebody tries (usually me), and there is some conversation or teamwork, but then it just dwindles. That's why I'm guessing it's not about the community, but more a product of the game design.
The game itself as an action experience is quite catchy, but without rich social interaction, it's not what I'd call a living, breathing world, so I too am doubtful of its longevity.
But then I'm more of a story / immersion / interaction sort of MMORPGer anyway...
I'm beginning to think that the core design of the game itself is somehow counter-inducive to social interaction. Maybe it's ultimately too much battle-oriented - and being so, it's not a bright idea to flush all that kinetic energy out of the open world via instanced scenarios. I'm still having fun in the game, I love the careers and the combat mechanics, but I can see storm clouds forming. And here is my fundamental problem: I don't get the feeling that the toons are actual characters depending on each other, they feel more like faceless soldiers on the chaotic field of battle. If it weren't for my guild and some friends from before who are also playing, I'd be hard-pressed to call this a social experience on the scale we're used to seeing in MMORPGs. The odd thing is, sometimes somebody tries (usually me), and there is some conversation or teamwork, but then it just dwindles. That's why I'm guessing it's not about the community, but more a product of the game design. The game itself as an action experience is quite catchy, but without rich social interaction, it's not what I'd call a living, breathing world, so I too am doubtful of its longevity. But then I'm more of a story / immersion / interaction sort of MMORPGer anyway...
1. Scenerios play too much of a role in leveling up. PvE content should have its exp rewards boosted and scenerios should be reduced.
2. The chat system needs a general channel. There needs to be rally masters in the capital cities so that people have access to the biggest gathering spot in the game. Plus the capitals need a general chat channel too.
Once those two main (easy to fix) problems are taken care of, people will talk, and the open RvR will become important again.
I suggest the people who are having a hard time logging to just take a break and watch for patch updates. These 2 problems must be addressed very soon, and probably within the next major patch. Keep an eye out for that patch, once it hits, log in and see the change.
No matter how you cut it the best way for Warhammer to improve is to get people talking in general chat and give them incentive to group up.......Part of the problem with the MMO genre is that too many games are catering to solo players because they feel thats what we want (blame WOW for that)...... The problem is though that a game like Warhammer really should encourage grouping right off the bat so tjhat players learn to work together and develop a feeling of being needed.......I thought the scenarios might be a problem because that is what the players that came over from WoW are used to and probably their preferred style of PVP.......The players that came from DAoC are the ones that want solid RVR PVP..... It sounds like if Warhammer wants to survive long term they are going to have to make serious changes to the core ideas of the game.......
I dont think they care about surviving long term. Its obvious in how they made the game or should I say Halfway made the game.
Agreed 100%.
WAR is the classic modern thinking that is killing modern MMORPGs. Most of the current gen of players don't care though, because, to be frank, they never saw how good these games can be when they have a soul. The only thing that has ever made them good is the players, but they don't seem to get it.
We live in the age of the MMO arcade game, and thats a shame to me personally.
Instead of having golden eggs for the next ten years, they all seem happy to just settle for killing the goose for one big dinner.
So Sad.
Shh.. you're going to spawn the "you suck" whambulance..
The younger generation players who think that we are elitist jerks and that we just dun want to learn to enjoy them games....
So shhh
Actually, gotta say I am pretty amazed at the lack of flames and hate this thread has gotten so far... It really does show where this game is at for so many I think.
So, yeah, prolly shouldnt wake the dead now
The only that bugs me, as I don't care who likes what, is the smugness that oozes from the glee club members, that you are now a member of.
You, and your fans, all consider yourselves enlightened and righteous having had your little revelation that the game is not for you. The reason you post this topic is for some back slapping and a sing song around the WAR retail box burning session from like minded snobs who poo poo this game for failing to rekindle their flagging enthusiasm for this genre.
The reason there is little flaming here, I seem out numbered, is because I dare say many people are simply bored of reading the same old crap spewing from the fingertips of a fraction of a percent of the retail consumers of WAR.
It is often considered poor show to make comment on a game without reasoning, infact I think it might even be against the rules here. I reckon it would be much better for people to simply say.. I don't like it.
have fun, if you possibly can, in your next adventure.
The only that bugs me, as I don't care who likes what, is the smugness that oozes from the glee club members, that you are now a member of.
You, and your fans, all consider yourselves enlightened and righteous having had your little revelation that the game is not for you. The reason you post this topic is for some back slapping and a sing song around the WAR retail box burning session from like minded snobs who poo poo this game for failing to rekindle their flagging enthusiasm for this genre.
The reason there is little flaming here, I seem out numbered, is because I dare say many people are simply bored of reading the same old crap spewing from the fingertips of a fraction of a percent of the retail consumers of WAR. It is often considered poor show to make comment on a game without reasoning, infact I think it might even be against the rules here. I reckon it would be much better for people to simply say.. I don't like it.
have fun, if you possibly can, in your next adventure.
Yup, you nailed it.. After dozens of threads of the same old thing, clone threads so to speak, usually posted by the same old people, the community in general is just getting tired of responding to it. The only people that still have the energy and desire to continue the endless 'debate' are the ones that like to keep the fire burning.. as this thread proves, you will start to see someone posting how much war has failed them and all the usual suspects who have their own versions of hate threads saying 'I agree!'.
Hope you guys find a game you enjoy.
Waiting for: A skill-based MMO with Freedom and Consequence. Woe to thee, the pierce-ed.
Far from being dead, the PQs on my server are almost ALWAYS active, at least during "prime time" hours. no, you can't find pickup groups for PQs at 4am, but that should come as no shock. I can go wander around tier 2 or tier 3 zones (depending on which character I am playing) and find PQ groups already working the content at about half the PQs. A lot of those groups pop over to another PQ once they've run that one a few times, too, so there's nice variety.
Chat? Methinks someone has spent too much time in WOW. WAR's chat is like Eve, and like AC, and like...oh, darned near every other game except WOW. =P Why on earth would I WANT to listen to the random spam scrolling by my screen from hundreds of people I don't know talking about random topics I really don't care about? I like to listen to my guild, and chat with them - many of them I have known for 5+ years in many games. I don't need to listen to Joe Random cracking inane jokes or some 10 year old asking for the millionth time how to do something that is in the manual.
Guilds? Most guilds suck, V. Fact of life. This is nothing new. Guids that suck, die. Guilds that don't, go on. My guild was formed almost nine years ago - we would never have survived that long as a "utility guild". NONE of the guilds worth belonging to could be described that way. I'm sorry you've had bad guild experiences, but please don't think that's the norm. Perhaps, you need to start your own and build it into what you envision? That's what I did.
PvP is outstanding, the best I've seen in a new game in YEARS. Being able to hop into a scenario is awesome, and the open field RvR is really heating up. We're off to go cap a couple of keeps tonight, and I expect to have perhaps 40+ Defenders online and raring to go. I also expect decent enemy contact, because when people see a keep under attack on Volkmar, they come running. Yes, even at tier 2 and 3.
People need to get it through their heads that this is Not WOW. Let go of the preconceptions, and play the game for what it is, rather than for what you think it ought to be. Or leave, and go find another game you prefer - there are plenty of others out there, and honestly - you're in the minority, so your absence won't be missed. Almost everyone I've spoken to loves the game, and is having a great time.
You know, I hate to say it..but I think the OP is right.. My brain is saying this is a great game, the culmination of the best aspects of the MMO genre combined with lush graphics and cool looking characters. Yet why do I not want to log in? Something is missing..as the OP says, it is the 'soul' of the game. Maybe it's because the game is still young and the community is unsure..remaining relatively anonymous until they decide on a character that they enjoy playing..I dunno. Either way, I just cannot seem to look forward to logging in, and when I do..I tend not to stay long. I had high hopes for this game, maybe I will take a break and keep an eye on it to return at a later date.
Agree with the op and Amafi here. I have played for about 1.5 weeks and not really bothered if I log on or not. In fact I keep playing expecting something to turn up which I havent seen before but my logic is telling me this is a no go. I am a huge Warhammer fan so I wanted this game to succeed beyond anything else. Today I was on a lot and I visited about 10 PQ's and couldnt finish one because there was NO one around! I checked the groups in the area and the most I saw was 2 people 10 min away. So I do what everyone else does and line up for scenarios and pick off NPCs to curb the boredom while I wait.
Another issue stated by the OP is the community. There is a community but we cant freaking talk to each other!! WTH where they thinking not having a main channel for both sides?! I for one like to see the chit chat on the window and it would help soooo much if people could yell out for groups and other trying to organise a proper RvR invasion. Instead we all run around blindly hoping to bump into a group. The real concern for me is the lack of population for such a new game. Its seriously a ghost town in every RvR area I have seen and even general traffic is scarce.
Cant believe I am saying this but I really do prefer AoC over WAR and I am definitely going back to it. No because its a great game but mainly due to the lack of anything else out there.
Originally posted by Theocritus No matter how you cut it the best way for Warhammer to improve is to get people talking in general chat and give them incentive to group up.......Part of the problem with the MMO genre is that too many games are catering to solo players because they feel thats what we want (blame WOW for that)...... The problem is though that a game like Warhammer really should encourage grouping right off the bat so tjhat players learn to work together and develop a feeling of being needed.......I thought the scenarios might be a problem because that is what the players that came over from WoW are used to and probably their preferred style of PVP.......The players that came from DAoC are the ones that want solid RVR PVP..... It sounds like if Warhammer wants to survive long term they are going to have to make serious changes to the core ideas of the game.......
Are you serious? It couldnt be easier to group. I dont have to spam chat to find a group.
- When I am moving through PvE it pops up and tells me what groups are in the area. - If I move into a public quest I can click the open groups icon and find a group doing the quest and join. - if there are no groups in my area but people running around I can left click on a player, then right click on their avatar and select invite. Most of the time people join.
At the moment scenarios are a bit of a zerg fest. Its hard if no healers join so all you can do is fight / die respawn and repeat. Its also hard if the enemy are all in the upper levels for the tier and your team are all in the lower levels. They could use a few NPC healers like Guild Wars had for scenarios.
No matter how you cut it the best way for Warhammer to improve is to get people talking in general chat and give them incentive to group up.......Part of the problem with the MMO genre is that too many games are catering to solo players because they feel thats what we want (blame WOW for that)...... The problem is though that a game like Warhammer really should encourage grouping right off the bat so tjhat players learn to work together and develop a feeling of being needed.......I thought the scenarios might be a problem because that is what the players that came over from WoW are used to and probably their preferred style of PVP.......The players that came from DAoC are the ones that want solid RVR PVP..... It sounds like if Warhammer wants to survive long term they are going to have to make serious changes to the core ideas of the game.......
Are you serious? It couldnt be easier to group. I dont have to spam chat to find a group.
- When I am moving through PvE it pops up and tells me what groups are in the area.
- If I move into a public quest I can click the open groups icon and find a group doing the quest and join.
- if there are no groups in my area but people running around I can left click on a player, then right click on their avatar and select invite. Most of the time people join.
At the moment scenarios are a bit of a zerg fest. Its hard if no healers join so all you can do is fight / die respawn and repeat. Its also hard if the enemy are all in the upper levels for the tier and your team are all in the lower levels. They could use a few NPC healers like Guild Wars had for scenarios.
You are making the classic mistake of confusing the ease of auto join utility groups with what the social crowd find so wrong with this game.
I could not disagree more with the OP. Thats fine, your allowed to :P Far from being dead, the PQs on my server are almost ALWAYS active, at least during "prime time" hours. Well, not on mine, and not on a LOT of others servers. Chat? Methinks someone has spent too much time in WOW. Played WoW for like 2 days, and can't say I thought much of it. Assumptions only make an... WAR's chat is like Eve, and like AC, and like...oh, darned near every other game except WOW. =P Not true, but I havent the energy to educate you here. Why on earth would I WANT to listen to the random spam scrolling by my screen from hundreds of people I don't know talking about random topics I really don't care about? Truth is, YOU DON'T HAVE TO. You CAN TURN IT OFF. If you dont wanna participate, then just don't, but why argue it's bad for the rest of us who want it and see the value of it past lazy cliched thinking? I like to listen to my guild, and chat with them - many of them I have known for 5+ years in many games. Me too, but you know what? I like to meet NEW people as well. After all, thats how I met my original guild in '99.
PvP is outstanding, the best I've seen in a new game in YEARS. Zerg no skill spam PvP is rubbish. People need to get it through their heads that this is Not WOW. Hey, man, thats your frame of reference, not mine. Assumption only makes an.... Let go of the preconceptions, and play the game for what it is, rather than for what you think it ought to be. This really is the last refuge of the beaten debater... Like it or leave.. lol honestly - you're in the minority Actually, the MINORITY play this game... the MAJORITY don't... The MAJORITY choose other games over this one. No refuge there my friend.
Seeing as Mark Jacobs is doing the talking, it's obviously high up on the list of things to do for them.
2. Sorry but I never found an online game that had a decent sense of community before a couple of months. Maybe that's just my personal experience and others have found otherwise.
3. Also from personal experience, tonight I spent 4 hours on a med server doing Open RvR, trying to take a Keep in Shadowlands and then switching to Troll Country. Just clicked, jumped into a warband and started helping with organisation. Seeing as the tanks held back and used Hold the Line and stacking it (before marching the line forward and causing havoc when we had the advantage), healers focused on them and all of the DPS classes managed to focus fire properly, we took down a much larger Destruction force (thanks to luring them into our NPCs as well). I've seen mindless zergs, I've also seen very well organised warbands using tactics... in tier 2. So I can't say I completely agree with the OP. I find plenty of people to do PQs with as well during Prime time hours, just look in the party finder and see what PQs are currently being done.
4. As for the state of MMOs and the direction they are moving in... I think it's great. I can pick up and play and not feel like I have to waste hours to achieve practically nothing.
If you find no drive to play WAR, thats fine. It's not the game for you. Or maybe it will be in 6 months time, who knows.
Two problems with WAR right now. 1. Scenerios play too much of a role in leveling up. PvE content should have its exp rewards boosted and scenerios should be reduced. 2. The chat system needs a general channel. There needs to be rally masters in the capital cities so that people have access to the biggest gathering spot in the game. Plus the capitals need a general chat channel too.
Once those two main (easy to fix) problems are taken care of, people will talk, and the open RvR will become important again. I suggest the people who are having a hard time logging to just take a break and watch for patch updates. These 2 problems must be addressed very soon, and probably within the next major patch. Keep an eye out for that patch, once it hits, log in and see the change.
Ohh well.. let me add one thing. This long list of technical issues does not exactly help.
I could not disagree more with the OP. Thats fine, your allowed to :P Far from being dead, the PQs on my server are almost ALWAYS active, at least during "prime time" hours. Well, not on mine, and not on a LOT of others servers. Chat? Methinks someone has spent too much time in WOW. Played WoW for like 2 days, and can't say I thought much of it. Assumptions only make an... WAR's chat is like Eve, and like AC, and like...oh, darned near every other game except WOW. =P Not true, but I havent the energy to educate you here. Why on earth would I WANT to listen to the random spam scrolling by my screen from hundreds of people I don't know talking about random topics I really don't care about? Truth is, YOU DON'T HAVE TO. You CAN TURN IT OFF. If you dont wanna participate, then just don't, but why argue it's bad for the rest of us who want it and see the value of it past lazy cliched thinking? I like to listen to my guild, and chat with them - many of them I have known for 5+ years in many games. Me too, but you know what? I like to meet NEW people as well. After all, thats how I met my original guild in '99.
PvP is outstanding, the best I've seen in a new game in YEARS. Zerg no skill spam PvP is rubbish. People need to get it through their heads that this is Not WOW. Hey, man, thats your frame of reference, not mine. Assumption only makes an.... Let go of the preconceptions, and play the game for what it is, rather than for what you think it ought to be. This really is the last refuge of the beaten debater... Like it or leave.. lol honestly - you're in the minority Actually, the MINORITY play this game... the MAJORITY don't... The MAJORITY choose other games over this one. No refuge there my friend.
ROFL!
Honestly, I only have a VERY little to add to this thread. Everything I feel and think about Warhammer's "issues" has already been stated. And just an F.Y.I....I was on a high/high core server, and the issues were JUST the same. It has nothing to do with the server size, ultimately, in my opinion.
If I wanted to play Unreal Tournament or Counterstrike while dressed up in fantasy world armor and playing a fantasy world race....well....Half Life 2/CS have LOADS of mods that can accomodate that "niche" desire. I was wanting an MMORPG here, and what I feel I got was CS Source in fantasy clothes. Blech.
I'm not a "fanboi" (or girl, in my case) of ANY other game. I play a LOT of games. I only know that for ME...what is missing the MOST in WAR, is the SOUL of an mmoRPG. And that SOUL, in part, comes from a community. A community is more than JUST your guild. I believe that it's your guild, functioning amongst many other guilds, in large thriving cities full of people talking, "drinking" at the bar, crafting in the crafting halls, sharing stories of their "adventures," and the "scrolling crap"....I just put THOSE few people on ignore.
When I see someone from my faction fighting, out in the fields and zones....I toss them a heal, I stay around and see if they need help...you know...."stupid community crap" like THAT....those things that make the MMORPG genre the SOCIAL thing it was meant to be.
Warhammer = MMOPVPG.....NOT MMORPG. It's almost a totally different genre. It's a genre that some people will love. But it's not the genre for ME.
I could not disagree more with the OP. Far from being dead, the PQs on my server are almost ALWAYS active, at least during "prime time" hours. no, you can't find pickup groups for PQs at 4am,
Yes you can, at least on Skull Throne.
I play WAR in the early morning hours and there are tons and tons of people playing.
"Chat? Methinks someone has spent too much time in WOW"
You continue to claim that the chat is not for practical purposes. I will continue to tell you that it serves a variety of practical purposes, including getting PUGs together for those PQs. In fact it is the #1 problem I face whenever I try to put one together, and it gets worse as people continue to ignore it. As for all the other mmorpgs that you reference, yeah... nobody plays those games and it proves my point.
Originally posted by girlgeek
ROFL!
Honestly, I only have a VERY little to add to this thread. Everything I feel and think about Warhammer's "issues" has already been stated. And just an F.Y.I....I was on a high/high core server, and the issues were JUST the same. It has nothing to do with the server size, ultimately, in my opinion.
If I wanted to play Unreal Tournament or Counterstrike while dressed up in fantasy world armor and playing a fantasy world race....well....Half Life 2/CS have LOADS of mods that can accomodate that "niche" desire. I was wanting an MMORPG here, and what I feel I got was CS Source in fantasy clothes. Blech.
I'm not a "fanboi" (or girl, in my case) of ANY other game. I play a LOT of games. I only know that for ME...what is missing the MOST in WAR, is the SOUL of an mmoRPG. And that SOUL, in part, comes from a community. A community is more than JUST your guild. I believe that it's your guild, functioning amongst many other guilds, in large thriving cities full of people talking, "drinking" at the bar, crafting in the crafting halls, sharing stories of their "adventures," and the "scrolling crap"....I just put THOSE few people on ignore.
When I see someone from my faction fighting, out in the fields and zones....I toss them a heal, I stay around and see if they need help...you know...."stupid community crap" like THAT....those things that make the MMORPG genre the SOCIAL thing it was meant to be.
Warhammer = MMOPVPG.....NOT MMORPG. It's almost a totally different genre. It's a genre that some people will love. But it's not the genre for ME.
Thank you! Exactly!
___________________ Sadly, I see storm clouds on the horizon. A faint stench of Vanguard is in the air.-Kien
Originally posted by girlgeek Warhammer = MMOPVPG.....NOT MMORPG. It's almost a totally different genre. It's a genre that some people will love. But it's not the genre for ME.
I completely agree with the OP. He describes the game perfectly.
The lack of community in this "mmo" is stunning, I couldn't imagine how it could be worse. No general chat to speak of and no one has ever, EVER responded to area chat when I try to get a group together (and I'm on a high pop server - azezel). The interface for communication is horrible, but I'm assuming they fix it in the near future. I'm not done playing this game just yet. The pvp is fun, at least in scenarios where its harder for chaos to use its numbers advantage.
------------------------------ "Everything is awesome. Fundamentally."
The game has no RP, but I didn't care joining a decent RP guild on a RP server either.
The game has no RvR, but I didn't care checking the keep surroundings at peak times either.
The game has no community, but I didn't care joining groups or guilds either.
The game has no grouping, but I didn't care pressing that weird button under the character face display with health and AP bars next to it.
Overall, the game is just pretty much BAD.
Ultima Online 98~04 Dark Age of Camelot 03~07 Final Fantasy XI 04~06 Guild Wars 05~08 World of Warcraft 04~05 Unsuccessful Tries: DFO/EQ2/DRaja/Rag/Req/RYL/9D/Cabal/KO/PSU/RF/GE/TO/TR/DDO/EVE/LoTRO/L2/RZ/SWG/VG
i posted in past that if an mmorpg will try to focus on rvr open mass battles they will have to do it with extreme care otherwise the war ship is going to sink ..Op seems to prove my point
To a point, I have to agree with the OP on 1 point. That is that they need to knock down the experience from scenarios. PERIOD. I try to do PVE of all sorts and RVR, usually with my guild and there isnt enough constant content to cut through, as you dont get jack for xp. so we all decide we would rather run scenarios because they reward more.
I hope to see mythic fix this soon, I play on a high/full server and I tell you, Destro is either in scenarios in force, or a handful range around in RVR.
as for the chat system, first off MOST guilds use Ventrilo or TS. Because coordinating through chat would be a nightmare that only a jackass would do. We win scenarios and alot of our RVR keep battles strictly because we can VOIP communicate.
Chat system eventually will become secondary in future MMOs because guilds will use VOIP. as for being a single player who doesnt want to join a guild, well honestly if you are not looking for a guild, then your not really a social player are you? They also fixed that by adding open grouping though its not top notch, it is a better selection.
Playing: Not much actively. Games played: to many to list, been playing MMO's since 2001 --------------------------
i posted in past that if an mmorpg will try to focus on rvr open mass battles they will have to do it with extreme care otherwise the war ship is going to sink ..Op seems to prove my point
how does he "prove" anything...? I didn't realise he was a mouthpeice for Mythic. I missed your professional pundit credentials also, oh wise one
I completely agree with the OP. He describes the game perfectly. The lack of community in this "mmo" is stunning, I couldn't imagine how it could be worse. No general chat to speak of and no one has ever, EVER responded to area chat when I try to get a group together (and I'm on a high pop server - azezel). The interface for communication is horrible, but I'm assuming they fix it in the near future. I'm not done playing this game just yet. The pvp is fun, at least in scenarios where its harder for chaos to use its numbers advantage.
By community you mean wow-esque garbage on general chat?
WTS xxx
I had your mom
how do I move
PC on XXX
CHUCK NORRISSSSSSSSS
Does the above, scintillating, "community chat" make you feel warm inside, and the lack of this crap make you feel alone in the WAR world?
I completely agree with the OP. He describes the game perfectly. The lack of community in this "mmo" is stunning, I couldn't imagine how it could be worse. No general chat to speak of and no one has ever, EVER responded to area chat when I try to get a group together (and I'm on a high pop server - azezel). The interface for communication is horrible, but I'm assuming they fix it in the near future. I'm not done playing this game just yet. The pvp is fun, at least in scenarios where its harder for chaos to use its numbers advantage.
By community you mean wow-esque garbage on general chat?
WTS xxx
I had your mom
how do I move
PC on XXX
CHUCK NORRISSSSSSSSS
Does the above, scintillating, "community chat" make you feel warm inside, and the lack of this crap make you feel alone in the WAR world?
It's better than an empty chat log.
Oh wait, it's not.
Ultima Online 98~04 Dark Age of Camelot 03~07 Final Fantasy XI 04~06 Guild Wars 05~08 World of Warcraft 04~05 Unsuccessful Tries: DFO/EQ2/DRaja/Rag/Req/RYL/9D/Cabal/KO/PSU/RF/GE/TO/TR/DDO/EVE/LoTRO/L2/RZ/SWG/VG
Comments
I dont think they care about surviving long term. Its obvious in how they made the game or should I say Halfway made the game.
Agreed 100%.
WAR is the classic modern thinking that is killing modern MMORPGs. Most of the current gen of players don't care though, because, to be frank, they never saw how good these games can be when they have a soul. The only thing that has ever made them good is the players, but they don't seem to get it.
We live in the age of the MMO arcade game, and thats a shame to me personally.
Instead of having golden eggs for the next ten years, they all seem happy to just settle for killing the goose for one big dinner.
So Sad.
Shh.. you're going to spawn the "you suck" whambulance..
The younger generation players who think that we are elitist jerks and that we just dun want to learn to enjoy them games....
So shhh
Actually, gotta say I am pretty amazed at the lack of flames and hate this thread has gotten so far... It really does show where this game is at for so many I think.
So, yeah, prolly shouldnt wake the dead now
This is 100% the stupid chat system.
The world isn't actually empty at all unless you're on a low/low pop, but that would be your own fault. The chat system is unwieldy which prevents group-ups and smaller guilds forming, etc. An empty chat gives the illusion of a dead community.
My advice to people who are blue because of this, just find a guild for now because the problem will be fixed. There are tons of people there, you just have to be far more assertive at the moment.
___________________
Sadly, I see storm clouds on the horizon. A faint stench of Vanguard is in the air.-Kien
http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2006/12/13/
The beta testers obviously sucked. WTF were they doing for over a year? The chat system should have been fixed, it's such an obvious problem.
I'm beginning to think that the core design of the game itself is somehow counter-inducive to social interaction. Maybe it's ultimately too much battle-oriented - and being so, it's not a bright idea to flush all that kinetic energy out of the open world via instanced scenarios.
I'm still having fun in the game, I love the careers and the combat mechanics, but I can see storm clouds forming. And here is my fundamental problem: I don't get the feeling that the toons are actual characters depending on each other, they feel more like faceless soldiers on the chaotic field of battle. If it weren't for my guild and some friends from before who are also playing, I'd be hard-pressed to call this a social experience on the scale we're used to seeing in MMORPGs.
The odd thing is, sometimes somebody tries (usually me), and there is some conversation or teamwork, but then it just dwindles. That's why I'm guessing it's not about the community, but more a product of the game design.
The game itself as an action experience is quite catchy, but without rich social interaction, it's not what I'd call a living, breathing world, so I too am doubtful of its longevity.
But then I'm more of a story / immersion / interaction sort of MMORPGer anyway...
Yes, yes, and, indeed, yes.
I posted about this before...
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/194958
Two problems with WAR right now.
1. Scenerios play too much of a role in leveling up. PvE content should have its exp rewards boosted and scenerios should be reduced.
2. The chat system needs a general channel. There needs to be rally masters in the capital cities so that people have access to the biggest gathering spot in the game. Plus the capitals need a general chat channel too.
Once those two main (easy to fix) problems are taken care of, people will talk, and the open RvR will become important again.
I suggest the people who are having a hard time logging to just take a break and watch for patch updates. These 2 problems must be addressed very soon, and probably within the next major patch. Keep an eye out for that patch, once it hits, log in and see the change.
I dont think they care about surviving long term. Its obvious in how they made the game or should I say Halfway made the game.
Agreed 100%.
WAR is the classic modern thinking that is killing modern MMORPGs. Most of the current gen of players don't care though, because, to be frank, they never saw how good these games can be when they have a soul. The only thing that has ever made them good is the players, but they don't seem to get it.
We live in the age of the MMO arcade game, and thats a shame to me personally.
Instead of having golden eggs for the next ten years, they all seem happy to just settle for killing the goose for one big dinner.
So Sad.
Shh.. you're going to spawn the "you suck" whambulance..
The younger generation players who think that we are elitist jerks and that we just dun want to learn to enjoy them games....
So shhh
Actually, gotta say I am pretty amazed at the lack of flames and hate this thread has gotten so far... It really does show where this game is at for so many I think.
So, yeah, prolly shouldnt wake the dead now
The only that bugs me, as I don't care who likes what, is the smugness that oozes from the glee club members, that you are now a member of.
You, and your fans, all consider yourselves enlightened and righteous having had your little revelation that the game is not for you. The reason you post this topic is for some back slapping and a sing song around the WAR retail box burning session from like minded snobs who poo poo this game for failing to rekindle their flagging enthusiasm for this genre.
The reason there is little flaming here, I seem out numbered, is because I dare say many people are simply bored of reading the same old crap spewing from the fingertips of a fraction of a percent of the retail consumers of WAR.
It is often considered poor show to make comment on a game without reasoning, infact I think it might even be against the rules here. I reckon it would be much better for people to simply say.. I don't like it.
have fun, if you possibly can, in your next adventure.
Yup, you nailed it.. After dozens of threads of the same old thing, clone threads so to speak, usually posted by the same old people, the community in general is just getting tired of responding to it. The only people that still have the energy and desire to continue the endless 'debate' are the ones that like to keep the fire burning.. as this thread proves, you will start to see someone posting how much war has failed them and all the usual suspects who have their own versions of hate threads saying 'I agree!'.
Hope you guys find a game you enjoy.
Waiting for: A skill-based MMO with Freedom and Consequence.
Woe to thee, the pierce-ed.
I could not disagree more with the OP.
Far from being dead, the PQs on my server are almost ALWAYS active, at least during "prime time" hours. no, you can't find pickup groups for PQs at 4am, but that should come as no shock. I can go wander around tier 2 or tier 3 zones (depending on which character I am playing) and find PQ groups already working the content at about half the PQs. A lot of those groups pop over to another PQ once they've run that one a few times, too, so there's nice variety.
Chat? Methinks someone has spent too much time in WOW. WAR's chat is like Eve, and like AC, and like...oh, darned near every other game except WOW. =P Why on earth would I WANT to listen to the random spam scrolling by my screen from hundreds of people I don't know talking about random topics I really don't care about? I like to listen to my guild, and chat with them - many of them I have known for 5+ years in many games. I don't need to listen to Joe Random cracking inane jokes or some 10 year old asking for the millionth time how to do something that is in the manual.
Guilds? Most guilds suck, V. Fact of life. This is nothing new. Guids that suck, die. Guilds that don't, go on. My guild was formed almost nine years ago - we would never have survived that long as a "utility guild". NONE of the guilds worth belonging to could be described that way. I'm sorry you've had bad guild experiences, but please don't think that's the norm. Perhaps, you need to start your own and build it into what you envision? That's what I did.
PvP is outstanding, the best I've seen in a new game in YEARS. Being able to hop into a scenario is awesome, and the open field RvR is really heating up. We're off to go cap a couple of keeps tonight, and I expect to have perhaps 40+ Defenders online and raring to go. I also expect decent enemy contact, because when people see a keep under attack on Volkmar, they come running. Yes, even at tier 2 and 3.
People need to get it through their heads that this is Not WOW. Let go of the preconceptions, and play the game for what it is, rather than for what you think it ought to be. Or leave, and go find another game you prefer - there are plenty of others out there, and honestly - you're in the minority, so your absence won't be missed. Almost everyone I've spoken to loves the game, and is having a great time.
Owyn
Commander, Defenders of Order
http://www.defendersoforder.com
Agree with the op and Amafi here. I have played for about 1.5 weeks and not really bothered if I log on or not. In fact I keep playing expecting something to turn up which I havent seen before but my logic is telling me this is a no go. I am a huge Warhammer fan so I wanted this game to succeed beyond anything else. Today I was on a lot and I visited about 10 PQ's and couldnt finish one because there was NO one around! I checked the groups in the area and the most I saw was 2 people 10 min away. So I do what everyone else does and line up for scenarios and pick off NPCs to curb the boredom while I wait.
Another issue stated by the OP is the community. There is a community but we cant freaking talk to each other!! WTH where they thinking not having a main channel for both sides?! I for one like to see the chit chat on the window and it would help soooo much if people could yell out for groups and other trying to organise a proper RvR invasion. Instead we all run around blindly hoping to bump into a group. The real concern for me is the lack of population for such a new game. Its seriously a ghost town in every RvR area I have seen and even general traffic is scarce.
Cant believe I am saying this but I really do prefer AoC over WAR and I am definitely going back to it. No because its a great game but mainly due to the lack of anything else out there.
Are you serious? It couldnt be easier to group. I dont have to spam chat to find a group.
- When I am moving through PvE it pops up and tells me what groups are in the area.
- If I move into a public quest I can click the open groups icon and find a group doing the quest and join.
- if there are no groups in my area but people running around I can left click on a player, then right click on their avatar and select invite. Most of the time people join.
At the moment scenarios are a bit of a zerg fest. Its hard if no healers join so all you can do is fight / die respawn and repeat. Its also hard if the enemy are all in the upper levels for the tier and your team are all in the lower levels. They could use a few NPC healers like Guild Wars had for scenarios.
Are you serious? It couldnt be easier to group. I dont have to spam chat to find a group.
- When I am moving through PvE it pops up and tells me what groups are in the area.
- If I move into a public quest I can click the open groups icon and find a group doing the quest and join.
- if there are no groups in my area but people running around I can left click on a player, then right click on their avatar and select invite. Most of the time people join.
At the moment scenarios are a bit of a zerg fest. Its hard if no healers join so all you can do is fight / die respawn and repeat. Its also hard if the enemy are all in the upper levels for the tier and your team are all in the lower levels. They could use a few NPC healers like Guild Wars had for scenarios.
You are making the classic mistake of confusing the ease of auto join utility groups with what the social crowd find so wrong with this game.
Its ok though, noone blames you.
Well everythings down to personal taste but I guess it won't hurt to point to a few things.
1. Mythic know they have a chat problem and are fixing it. There: http://www.warhammeralliance.com/forums/showthread.php?t=128249
Seeing as Mark Jacobs is doing the talking, it's obviously high up on the list of things to do for them.
2. Sorry but I never found an online game that had a decent sense of community before a couple of months. Maybe that's just my personal experience and others have found otherwise.
3. Also from personal experience, tonight I spent 4 hours on a med server doing Open RvR, trying to take a Keep in Shadowlands and then switching to Troll Country. Just clicked, jumped into a warband and started helping with organisation. Seeing as the tanks held back and used Hold the Line and stacking it (before marching the line forward and causing havoc when we had the advantage), healers focused on them and all of the DPS classes managed to focus fire properly, we took down a much larger Destruction force (thanks to luring them into our NPCs as well). I've seen mindless zergs, I've also seen very well organised warbands using tactics... in tier 2. So I can't say I completely agree with the OP. I find plenty of people to do PQs with as well during Prime time hours, just look in the party finder and see what PQs are currently being done.
4. As for the state of MMOs and the direction they are moving in... I think it's great. I can pick up and play and not feel like I have to waste hours to achieve practically nothing.
If you find no drive to play WAR, thats fine. It's not the game for you. Or maybe it will be in 6 months time, who knows.
Ohh well.. let me add one thing. This long list of technical issues does not exactly help.
www.warhammeralliance.com/forums/showthread.php
ROFL!
Honestly, I only have a VERY little to add to this thread. Everything I feel and think about Warhammer's "issues" has already been stated. And just an F.Y.I....I was on a high/high core server, and the issues were JUST the same. It has nothing to do with the server size, ultimately, in my opinion.
If I wanted to play Unreal Tournament or Counterstrike while dressed up in fantasy world armor and playing a fantasy world race....well....Half Life 2/CS have LOADS of mods that can accomodate that "niche" desire. I was wanting an MMORPG here, and what I feel I got was CS Source in fantasy clothes. Blech.
I'm not a "fanboi" (or girl, in my case) of ANY other game. I play a LOT of games. I only know that for ME...what is missing the MOST in WAR, is the SOUL of an mmoRPG. And that SOUL, in part, comes from a community. A community is more than JUST your guild. I believe that it's your guild, functioning amongst many other guilds, in large thriving cities full of people talking, "drinking" at the bar, crafting in the crafting halls, sharing stories of their "adventures," and the "scrolling crap"....I just put THOSE few people on ignore.
When I see someone from my faction fighting, out in the fields and zones....I toss them a heal, I stay around and see if they need help...you know...."stupid community crap" like THAT....those things that make the MMORPG genre the SOCIAL thing it was meant to be.
Warhammer = MMOPVPG.....NOT MMORPG. It's almost a totally different genre. It's a genre that some people will love. But it's not the genre for ME.
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club
Yes you can, at least on Skull Throne.
I play WAR in the early morning hours and there are tons and tons of people playing.
"Chat? Methinks someone has spent too much time in WOW"
You continue to claim that the chat is not for practical purposes. I will continue to tell you that it serves a variety of practical purposes, including getting PUGs together for those PQs. In fact it is the #1 problem I face whenever I try to put one together, and it gets worse as people continue to ignore it. As for all the other mmorpgs that you reference, yeah... nobody plays those games and it proves my point.
Originally posted by girlgeek
ROFL!
Honestly, I only have a VERY little to add to this thread. Everything I feel and think about Warhammer's "issues" has already been stated. And just an F.Y.I....I was on a high/high core server, and the issues were JUST the same. It has nothing to do with the server size, ultimately, in my opinion.
If I wanted to play Unreal Tournament or Counterstrike while dressed up in fantasy world armor and playing a fantasy world race....well....Half Life 2/CS have LOADS of mods that can accomodate that "niche" desire. I was wanting an MMORPG here, and what I feel I got was CS Source in fantasy clothes. Blech.
I'm not a "fanboi" (or girl, in my case) of ANY other game. I play a LOT of games. I only know that for ME...what is missing the MOST in WAR, is the SOUL of an mmoRPG. And that SOUL, in part, comes from a community. A community is more than JUST your guild. I believe that it's your guild, functioning amongst many other guilds, in large thriving cities full of people talking, "drinking" at the bar, crafting in the crafting halls, sharing stories of their "adventures," and the "scrolling crap"....I just put THOSE few people on ignore.
When I see someone from my faction fighting, out in the fields and zones....I toss them a heal, I stay around and see if they need help...you know...."stupid community crap" like THAT....those things that make the MMORPG genre the SOCIAL thing it was meant to be.
Warhammer = MMOPVPG.....NOT MMORPG. It's almost a totally different genre. It's a genre that some people will love. But it's not the genre for ME.
Thank you! Exactly!
___________________
Sadly, I see storm clouds on the horizon. A faint stench of Vanguard is in the air.-Kien
http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2006/12/13/
I completely agree with the OP. He describes the game perfectly.
The lack of community in this "mmo" is stunning, I couldn't imagine how it could be worse. No general chat to speak of and no one has ever, EVER responded to area chat when I try to get a group together (and I'm on a high pop server - azezel). The interface for communication is horrible, but I'm assuming they fix it in the near future. I'm not done playing this game just yet. The pvp is fun, at least in scenarios where its harder for chaos to use its numbers advantage.
------------------------------
"Everything is awesome. Fundamentally."
Yes, I agree completely with the OP.
The game has no RP, but I didn't care joining a decent RP guild on a RP server either.
The game has no RvR, but I didn't care checking the keep surroundings at peak times either.
The game has no community, but I didn't care joining groups or guilds either.
The game has no grouping, but I didn't care pressing that weird button under the character face display with health and AP bars next to it.
Overall, the game is just pretty much BAD.
Ultima Online 98~04
Dark Age of Camelot 03~07
Final Fantasy XI 04~06
Guild Wars 05~08
World of Warcraft 04~05
Unsuccessful Tries: DFO/EQ2/DRaja/Rag/Req/RYL/9D/Cabal/KO/PSU/RF/GE/TO/TR/DDO/EVE/LoTRO/L2/RZ/SWG/VG
i posted in past that if an mmorpg will try to focus on rvr open mass battles they will have to do it with extreme care otherwise the war ship is going to sink ..Op seems to prove my point
To a point, I have to agree with the OP on 1 point. That is that they need to knock down the experience from scenarios. PERIOD. I try to do PVE of all sorts and RVR, usually with my guild and there isnt enough constant content to cut through, as you dont get jack for xp. so we all decide we would rather run scenarios because they reward more.
I hope to see mythic fix this soon, I play on a high/full server and I tell you, Destro is either in scenarios in force, or a handful range around in RVR.
as for the chat system, first off MOST guilds use Ventrilo or TS. Because coordinating through chat would be a nightmare that only a jackass would do. We win scenarios and alot of our RVR keep battles strictly because we can VOIP communicate.
Chat system eventually will become secondary in future MMOs because guilds will use VOIP. as for being a single player who doesnt want to join a guild, well honestly if you are not looking for a guild, then your not really a social player are you? They also fixed that by adding open grouping though its not top notch, it is a better selection.
Playing: Not much actively.
Games played: to many to list, been playing MMO's since 2001
--------------------------
how does he "prove" anything...? I didn't realise he was a mouthpeice for Mythic. I missed your professional pundit credentials also, oh wise one
By community you mean wow-esque garbage on general chat?
WTS xxx
I had your mom
how do I move
PC on XXX
CHUCK NORRISSSSSSSSS
Does the above, scintillating, "community chat" make you feel warm inside, and the lack of this crap make you feel alone in the WAR world?
By community you mean wow-esque garbage on general chat?
WTS xxx
I had your mom
how do I move
PC on XXX
CHUCK NORRISSSSSSSSS
Does the above, scintillating, "community chat" make you feel warm inside, and the lack of this crap make you feel alone in the WAR world?
It's better than an empty chat log.
Oh wait, it's not.
Ultima Online 98~04
Dark Age of Camelot 03~07
Final Fantasy XI 04~06
Guild Wars 05~08
World of Warcraft 04~05
Unsuccessful Tries: DFO/EQ2/DRaja/Rag/Req/RYL/9D/Cabal/KO/PSU/RF/GE/TO/TR/DDO/EVE/LoTRO/L2/RZ/SWG/VG