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Did Buddha prophecy about Jesus?

2

Comments

  • billiebillie Member UncommonPosts: 400

    Do you like torture? Do you like war and conquest? Do you like killing people? but more importantly, Are you a Klingon? Then Klingons for Jesus is for you.

    According to Klingons for Jesus, Jesus is the messiah the Klingons have been waiting for all along. Here’s some other great selling points:

    Do you like killing gods?

    We know Klingons killed their gods and we Christians also killed our god and we feel really bad about it. As a Christian you’ll be encouraged to rexperience killing god frequently as well as fantasize about drinking his blood and eating his flesh.

    and

    Do you like forcing people to obey you?

    As Christians we believe that it is our mission to force the entire universe to worship as we do and it is our duty to force, bribe or trick them into doing so! And so we have launched a mission to convert the entire universe to Christianity. It’s a big job but we have a lot of pamphlets and sooner or later you will join us too.

    edit
    image
    Zuerst die Fuesse Aug 28 ref

    ...
    Notice Christ's name was Yeshua, that is Joshua with an english accent; jesus was barAbbas' name. Christ's version of Judiasm was called 'the Way' (not christanity) their symbols were the dove and fish (not the latin cross) and those adhering to Christ's teachings where known as the 'Followers of the Nazerine' (not christains). They used the Old Testament (OT) as their scripture focusing on the Resurrection not the crucifiction.

    After his crucifiction (the romans also murdered 8 of the 12 Disciples) the romans exterminated (70 and 136ad) and expelled the Jews from their homeland then later fabricated/cannonized this mostly anonymous 2nd new testament in 325ad, (anti-jewish Marcion had the first nt ~140ad) abridging it to the Jew OT. Most of the nt is a product of saul's dogma (saul was NEITHER a Prophet NOR Disciple.)
    During the first century Christ's brother and Disciple James the leader of the Jerusalem group sent officials after saul/paul telling gentiles saul did not speak for them nor give a true version of Yeshua's teachings.
    saul's dogma became the foundation of the roman catholic apostolic church and christanity, after the romans exterminated most Gnostics and the Nazerines.


    623BC Buddha Siddartha, Hindu prince in Lumbini Nepal advocated three visions: real events of previous lives, sees how deeds (good/bad) performed during this lifetime leads to the nature of subsequent reincarnation, spiritual defilement (cravings, desire, hatred, hunger, thirst, exhaustion, fear, doubt, delusion).

    551BC confucius (Kong Fu-Zi) utilitarian approach to social harmony and defined moral obligations.

    image

  • snipergsniperg Member Posts: 863
    Originally posted by Faxxer


    short answer, they've read NOTHING, only been told by someone what to think. 
    most likely some dumb ass biology proff who starts his semester by emphatically stating that evolution is a FACT, no longer a theory.  oh nm.

     

    Don't be arrogant and presumptuous. Just because some people haven't read tons of stuff that doesn't make their opinions any less valid.

    By insulting them you just make useless whatever knowledge you have gathered and you diminish the efforts of others.

    A friend is not him who provides support during your failures.A friend is the one that cheers you during your successes.

  • qazymanqazyman Member Posts: 1,785
    Originally posted by billie


    Do you like torture? Do you like war and conquest? Do you like killing people? but more importantly, Are you a Klingon? Then Klingons for Jesus is for you.
    According to Klingons for Jesus, Jesus is the messiah the Klingons have been waiting for all along. Here’s some other great selling points:
    Do you like killing gods?
    We know Klingons killed their gods and we Christians also killed our god and we feel really bad about it. As a Christian you’ll be encouraged to rexperience killing god frequently as well as fantasize about drinking his blood and eating his flesh.
    and
    Do you like forcing people to obey you?
    As Christians we believe that it is our mission to force the entire universe to worship as we do and it is our duty to force, bribe or trick them into doing so! And so we have launched a mission to convert the entire universe to Christianity. It’s a big job but we have a lot of pamphlets and sooner or later you will join us too.
     



     

    Something about lipstick and a pig comes to mind.......Instead I'll say WOW!

  • FaxxerFaxxer Member Posts: 3,247

    you forget who started the insulting first.

  • SabiancymSabiancym Member UncommonPosts: 3,150
    Originally posted by Faxxer


    short answer, they've read NOTHING, only been told by someone what to think. 
    most likely some dumb ass biology proff who starts his semester by emphatically stating that evolution is a FACT, no longer a theory.  oh nm.



     

    Are you serious?  Telling people what to think is a staple of Christianity.

     

    "Believe in Jesus, or you will burn in hell"

    "Gay people are evil, because we said so."

    "Throw kids against rocks, it's what jesus would do"

     

    Psalm 137:9

    "How blessed will be the one who seizes and dashes your little ones Against the rock."

  • FishermageFishermage Member Posts: 7,562
    Originally posted by Sabiancym

    Originally posted by Faxxer


    short answer, they've read NOTHING, only been told by someone what to think. 
    most likely some dumb ass biology proff who starts his semester by emphatically stating that evolution is a FACT, no longer a theory.  oh nm.



     

    Are you serious?  Telling people what to think is a staple of Christianity.

     

    "Believe in Jesus, or you will burn in hell"

    "Gay people are evil, because we said so."

    "Throw kids against rocks, it's what jesus would do"

     

    Psalm 137:9

    "How blessed will be the one who seizes and dashes your little ones Against the rock."

     

    So by that logic, all athiests are communists.

  • SabiancymSabiancym Member UncommonPosts: 3,150
    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by Sabiancym

    Originally posted by Faxxer


    short answer, they've read NOTHING, only been told by someone what to think. 
    most likely some dumb ass biology proff who starts his semester by emphatically stating that evolution is a FACT, no longer a theory.  oh nm.



     

    Are you serious?  Telling people what to think is a staple of Christianity.

     

    "Believe in Jesus, or you will burn in hell"

    "Gay people are evil, because we said so."

    "Throw kids against rocks, it's what jesus would do"

     

    Psalm 137:9

    "How blessed will be the one who seizes and dashes your little ones Against the rock."

     

    So by that logic, all athiests are communists.

     

    All Christians are addicted to heroin.

     

    I can make statements without any sort of reinforcement to prove it also.

  • FishermageFishermage Member Posts: 7,562
    Originally posted by Sabiancym

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by Sabiancym

    Originally posted by Faxxer


    short answer, they've read NOTHING, only been told by someone what to think. 
    most likely some dumb ass biology proff who starts his semester by emphatically stating that evolution is a FACT, no longer a theory.  oh nm.



     

    Are you serious?  Telling people what to think is a staple of Christianity.

     

    "Believe in Jesus, or you will burn in hell"

    "Gay people are evil, because we said so."

    "Throw kids against rocks, it's what jesus would do"

     

    Psalm 137:9

    "How blessed will be the one who seizes and dashes your little ones Against the rock."

     

    So by that logic, all athiests are communists.

     

    All Christians are addicted to heroin.

     

    I can make statements without any sort of reinforcement to prove it also.

    I was merely following YOUR logic.

  • DeserttFoxxDeserttFoxx Member UncommonPosts: 2,401
    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by DeserttFoxx


    Religion is a sicknes, a mind warping, crutch. A series of thoughts and ideals clung too by weaker men and exploited by the evil ones.  And while religion has some noble ideas in theory, every great war, tradgedy and massacre can be traced back to some religion, all religions, every one of them have their demons. These arent just my beliefs, they are fact.
    It doesnt even matter if buddha or whatever fat man was being confused for him prophecized the comming of a white man with blonde hair in blue eyes being born in the heart of isreal. Most people dont even know that the story of Jesus is just a spin off of the story of Osiris and the virgin Isis and her son Horus. A black pharroh in egypt,t he story of jesus is the exact same story, word for word with some key substitutions. The story originated 5000 years before the birth of christ.
     
    This doesnt mean jesus was bullshit or that he was blakc, it just goes to show all religions are fairy tales used to govern uncivilized man and the greatest tragedy is that people still use that shit as a crutch in the world today.

     

    What if you are wrong and there is a God, and Jesus was his son, and was crucified and resurrected? Either these things are facts or they are not. What if you are wrong about the facts?

    How do you know you are not?

    I have spent a lifetime studying the myths you are discussing, and find your interpretation 9which mine used to be quite similar by the way) to be lacking. How deeply have you studied the claims you are making and the arguments against them, or different interpretations of what you are saying?

     

    What if i am wrong, im quite certain we are all fucking wrong about god, the after life, heaven and hell and every other uncertainty we claim with aboslute certainty we know all about. You dont know a damn thing about god the same way i dont. that is the problem with all religions, they walk around with that unshakable certainty, they just know what is going to happen and how it is going to go down, it was telegraphed too them. May it be paradise by way of 72 virgins, or eternal damnation, somebody has told them.

    What i do know is, i am content with not knowing what happens after death, unlike most religions which just choose to make shit up. Heaven and hell is absolute garbage, somethng used to govern man with fear, if you are good in life you go someplace good if you are bad you pay for it, make sense yeah, but living your life in fear doesnt make youa  great person, being religious doesnt make you better then anyone, it just means you would go around killing people, or raping people or whatever because nobody said you would be punished for it.

    That is basically the purpose of it, hell, i can imagine a bunch of noblemen and politicians back in the day scheming around a big stone table with some mead making up the rules and calling it "Quotes from god". It started off great too; If you kill someone, you goto hell, if you steal, you goto hell.... then they started getting a little crazy, if you disrespect your parents you goto hell, if you commit adultary you goto hell, if you create a false idol of your god you goto hell, the one that seems to fly right over christians heads since they all seem to worship their tortured lord on a cross, why the son of god would like to be remembered in his worst hour is beyond me.

    But yes, what if i am wrong, what if jesus did die and was ressurected... but what if you are wrong, what if his name wasnt Jesus, and there was no god.. IN FACT, his name was Kalel. and he could fly.. and he was super strong, and he didnt turn water into wine but he moved so fast that he was able to give people that illusion, and his great stories traversed time and he what we regard as the man of steel today,

    That's right! What if Jesus H. Christ was not Jesus, but just a mix up, but he was actually Kalel from krypton, and it wasnt Lucifer that was cause shit and had to be banished but Lex Luther. I think i am on to soemthing, i mean those old sand text get old and degraded, text get garbled, it could happen, in fact i am quite certain I am right and all other religions are wrong, it was superman who was our saviour and not christ.

     

    You cant really prove me worng the same way i cant prove you wrong, unless god has spoken to you directly. But hey, god is all forgiving, so even if i am wrong, i am in no jepardy of being punished for it, according to the rules god will forgive me if i repend on my death bed, so i got some time to be convinced. Well even if i dont repent chances are i will still get in too whatever VIP after life club that is waiting.

     

    A life time.. geez, i would bash the chruch so much if they just spend a life time cleaning up their shit, their track record for depraved behaviour just keeps growning. I know the catholic church is the oldest Man Boy club but come on, lets at least pretend they dont condone rampant pedophila, instead of just shuffling their rapist.... i mean priests from church to church, while claiming to be the sheppards of men.

    Quotations Those Who make peaceful resolutions impossible, make violent resolutions inevitable. John F. Kennedy

    Life... is the shit that happens while you wait for moments that never come - Lester Freeman

    Lie to no one. If there 's somebody close to you, you'll ruin it with a lie. If they're a stranger, who the fuck are they you gotta lie to them? - Willy Nelson

  • FishermageFishermage Member Posts: 7,562
    Originally posted by DeserttFoxx

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by DeserttFoxx


    Religion is a sicknes, a mind warping, crutch. A series of thoughts and ideals clung too by weaker men and exploited by the evil ones.  And while religion has some noble ideas in theory, every great war, tradgedy and massacre can be traced back to some religion, all religions, every one of them have their demons. These arent just my beliefs, they are fact.
    It doesnt even matter if buddha or whatever fat man was being confused for him prophecized the comming of a white man with blonde hair in blue eyes being born in the heart of isreal. Most people dont even know that the story of Jesus is just a spin off of the story of Osiris and the virgin Isis and her son Horus. A black pharroh in egypt,t he story of jesus is the exact same story, word for word with some key substitutions. The story originated 5000 years before the birth of christ.
     
    This doesnt mean jesus was bullshit or that he was blakc, it just goes to show all religions are fairy tales used to govern uncivilized man and the greatest tragedy is that people still use that shit as a crutch in the world today.

     

    What if you are wrong and there is a God, and Jesus was his son, and was crucified and resurrected? Either these things are facts or they are not. What if you are wrong about the facts?

    How do you know you are not?

    I have spent a lifetime studying the myths you are discussing, and find your interpretation 9which mine used to be quite similar by the way) to be lacking. How deeply have you studied the claims you are making and the arguments against them, or different interpretations of what you are saying?

     

    What if i am wrong, im quite certain we are all fucking wrong about god, the after life, heaven and hell and every other uncertainty we claim with aboslute certainty we know all about. You dont know a damn thing about god the same way i dont.

    What i do know is, i am content with not knowing what happens after death, unlike most religions which just choose to make shit up. Heaven and hell is absolute garbage, somethng used to govern man with fear, if you are good in life you go someplace good if you are bad you pay for it, make sense yeah, but living your life in fear doesnt make youa  great person, being religious doesnt make you better then anyone, it just means you would go around killing people, or raping people or whatever because nobody said you would be punished for it.

    That is basically the purpose of it, hell, i can imagine a bunch of noblemen and politicians back in the day scheming around a big stone table with some mead making up the rules and calling it "Quotes from god". It started off great too; If you kill someone, you goto hell, if you steal, you goto hell.... then they started getting a little crazy, if you disrespect your parents you goto hell, if you commit adultary you goto hell, if you create a false idol of your god you goto hell, the one that seems to fly right over christians heads since they all seem to worship their tortured lord on a cross, why the son of god would like to be remembered in his worst hour is beyond me.

    But yes, what if i am wrong, what if jesus did die and was ressurected... but what if you are wrong, what if his name wasnt Jesus, and there was no god.. IN FACT, his name was Kalel. and he could fly.. and he was super strong, and he didnt turn water into wine but he moved so fast that he was able to give people that illusion, and his great stories traversed time and he what we regard as the man of steel today,

    That's right! What if Jesus H. Christ was not Jesus, but just a mix up, but he was actually Kalel from krypton, and it wasnt Lucifer that was cause shit and had to be banished but Lex Luther. I think i am on to soemthing, i mean those old sand text get old and degraded, text get garbled, it could happen, in fact i am quite certain I am right and all other religions are wrong, it was superman who was our saviour and not christ.

     

    You cant really prove me worng the same way i cant prove you wrong, unless god has spoken to you directly. But hey, god is all forgiving, so even if i am wrong, i am in no jepardy of being punished for it, according to the rules god will forgive me if i repend on my death bed, so i got some time to be convinced. Well even if i dont repent chances are i will still get in too whatever VIP after life club that is waiting.

     

    A life time.. geez, i would bash the chruch so much if they just spend a life time cleaning up their shit, their track record for depraved behaviour just keeps growning. I know the catholic church is the oldest Man Boy club but come on, lets at least pretend they dont condone rampant pedophila, instead of just shuffling their rapist.... i mean priests from church to church, while claiming to be the sheppards of men.

     

    So you simply don't care about truth as such?

  • DeserttFoxxDeserttFoxx Member UncommonPosts: 2,401
    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by DeserttFoxx

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by DeserttFoxx


    Religion is a sicknes, a mind warping, crutch. A series of thoughts and ideals clung too by weaker men and exploited by the evil ones.  And while religion has some noble ideas in theory, every great war, tradgedy and massacre can be traced back to some religion, all religions, every one of them have their demons. These arent just my beliefs, they are fact.
    It doesnt even matter if buddha or whatever fat man was being confused for him prophecized the comming of a white man with blonde hair in blue eyes being born in the heart of isreal. Most people dont even know that the story of Jesus is just a spin off of the story of Osiris and the virgin Isis and her son Horus. A black pharroh in egypt,t he story of jesus is the exact same story, word for word with some key substitutions. The story originated 5000 years before the birth of christ.
     
    This doesnt mean jesus was bullshit or that he was blakc, it just goes to show all religions are fairy tales used to govern uncivilized man and the greatest tragedy is that people still use that shit as a crutch in the world today.

     

    What if you are wrong and there is a God, and Jesus was his son, and was crucified and resurrected? Either these things are facts or they are not. What if you are wrong about the facts?

    How do you know you are not?

    I have spent a lifetime studying the myths you are discussing, and find your interpretation 9which mine used to be quite similar by the way) to be lacking. How deeply have you studied the claims you are making and the arguments against them, or different interpretations of what you are saying?

     

    What if i am wrong, im quite certain we are all fucking wrong about god, the after life, heaven and hell and every other uncertainty we claim with aboslute certainty we know all about. You dont know a damn thing about god the same way i dont.

    What i do know is, i am content with not knowing what happens after death, unlike most religions which just choose to make shit up. Heaven and hell is absolute garbage, somethng used to govern man with fear, if you are good in life you go someplace good if you are bad you pay for it, make sense yeah, but living your life in fear doesnt make youa  great person, being religious doesnt make you better then anyone, it just means you would go around killing people, or raping people or whatever because nobody said you would be punished for it.

    That is basically the purpose of it, hell, i can imagine a bunch of noblemen and politicians back in the day scheming around a big stone table with some mead making up the rules and calling it "Quotes from god". It started off great too; If you kill someone, you goto hell, if you steal, you goto hell.... then they started getting a little crazy, if you disrespect your parents you goto hell, if you commit adultary you goto hell, if you create a false idol of your god you goto hell, the one that seems to fly right over christians heads since they all seem to worship their tortured lord on a cross, why the son of god would like to be remembered in his worst hour is beyond me.

    But yes, what if i am wrong, what if jesus did die and was ressurected... but what if you are wrong, what if his name wasnt Jesus, and there was no god.. IN FACT, his name was Kalel. and he could fly.. and he was super strong, and he didnt turn water into wine but he moved so fast that he was able to give people that illusion, and his great stories traversed time and he what we regard as the man of steel today,

    That's right! What if Jesus H. Christ was not Jesus, but just a mix up, but he was actually Kalel from krypton, and it wasnt Lucifer that was cause shit and had to be banished but Lex Luther. I think i am on to soemthing, i mean those old sand text get old and degraded, text get garbled, it could happen, in fact i am quite certain I am right and all other religions are wrong, it was superman who was our saviour and not christ.

     

    You cant really prove me worng the same way i cant prove you wrong, unless god has spoken to you directly. But hey, god is all forgiving, so even if i am wrong, i am in no jepardy of being punished for it, according to the rules god will forgive me if i repend on my death bed, so i got some time to be convinced. Well even if i dont repent chances are i will still get in too whatever VIP after life club that is waiting.

     

    A life time.. geez, i would bash the chruch so much if they just spend a life time cleaning up their shit, their track record for depraved behaviour just keeps growning. I know the catholic church is the oldest Man Boy club but come on, lets at least pretend they dont condone rampant pedophila, instead of just shuffling their rapist.... i mean priests from church to church, while claiming to be the sheppards of men.

     

    So you simply don't care about truth as such?

     

    You are asking me for fact, proof and truth, are we still talking about religion the one and only thing in this world governed 100% on the currancy known as faith, Which is the direct absence of proof, fact and truth?

     

    Correct me if i am wrong.

     

    The only needed truth is, you can througha  dart into an historical book and you can find the chatholic church or whatever Theocratic party happens to be in control at the time doing some attrocity in the name of god, and never god him self showing him self too give a pat on teh back to his loyal subjects.

    Quotations Those Who make peaceful resolutions impossible, make violent resolutions inevitable. John F. Kennedy

    Life... is the shit that happens while you wait for moments that never come - Lester Freeman

    Lie to no one. If there 's somebody close to you, you'll ruin it with a lie. If they're a stranger, who the fuck are they you gotta lie to them? - Willy Nelson

  • FishermageFishermage Member Posts: 7,562
    Originally posted by DeserttFoxx

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by DeserttFoxx

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by DeserttFoxx


    Religion is a sicknes, a mind warping, crutch. A series of thoughts and ideals clung too by weaker men and exploited by the evil ones.  And while religion has some noble ideas in theory, every great war, tradgedy and massacre can be traced back to some religion, all religions, every one of them have their demons. These arent just my beliefs, they are fact.
    It doesnt even matter if buddha or whatever fat man was being confused for him prophecized the comming of a white man with blonde hair in blue eyes being born in the heart of isreal. Most people dont even know that the story of Jesus is just a spin off of the story of Osiris and the virgin Isis and her son Horus. A black pharroh in egypt,t he story of jesus is the exact same story, word for word with some key substitutions. The story originated 5000 years before the birth of christ.
     
    This doesnt mean jesus was bullshit or that he was blakc, it just goes to show all religions are fairy tales used to govern uncivilized man and the greatest tragedy is that people still use that shit as a crutch in the world today.

     

    What if you are wrong and there is a God, and Jesus was his son, and was crucified and resurrected? Either these things are facts or they are not. What if you are wrong about the facts?

    How do you know you are not?

    I have spent a lifetime studying the myths you are discussing, and find your interpretation 9which mine used to be quite similar by the way) to be lacking. How deeply have you studied the claims you are making and the arguments against them, or different interpretations of what you are saying?

     

    What if i am wrong, im quite certain we are all fucking wrong about god, the after life, heaven and hell and every other uncertainty we claim with aboslute certainty we know all about. You dont know a damn thing about god the same way i dont.

    What i do know is, i am content with not knowing what happens after death, unlike most religions which just choose to make shit up. Heaven and hell is absolute garbage, somethng used to govern man with fear, if you are good in life you go someplace good if you are bad you pay for it, make sense yeah, but living your life in fear doesnt make youa  great person, being religious doesnt make you better then anyone, it just means you would go around killing people, or raping people or whatever because nobody said you would be punished for it.

    That is basically the purpose of it, hell, i can imagine a bunch of noblemen and politicians back in the day scheming around a big stone table with some mead making up the rules and calling it "Quotes from god". It started off great too; If you kill someone, you goto hell, if you steal, you goto hell.... then they started getting a little crazy, if you disrespect your parents you goto hell, if you commit adultary you goto hell, if you create a false idol of your god you goto hell, the one that seems to fly right over christians heads since they all seem to worship their tortured lord on a cross, why the son of god would like to be remembered in his worst hour is beyond me.

    But yes, what if i am wrong, what if jesus did die and was ressurected... but what if you are wrong, what if his name wasnt Jesus, and there was no god.. IN FACT, his name was Kalel. and he could fly.. and he was super strong, and he didnt turn water into wine but he moved so fast that he was able to give people that illusion, and his great stories traversed time and he what we regard as the man of steel today,

    That's right! What if Jesus H. Christ was not Jesus, but just a mix up, but he was actually Kalel from krypton, and it wasnt Lucifer that was cause shit and had to be banished but Lex Luther. I think i am on to soemthing, i mean those old sand text get old and degraded, text get garbled, it could happen, in fact i am quite certain I am right and all other religions are wrong, it was superman who was our saviour and not christ.

     

    You cant really prove me worng the same way i cant prove you wrong, unless god has spoken to you directly. But hey, god is all forgiving, so even if i am wrong, i am in no jepardy of being punished for it, according to the rules god will forgive me if i repend on my death bed, so i got some time to be convinced. Well even if i dont repent chances are i will still get in too whatever VIP after life club that is waiting.

     

    A life time.. geez, i would bash the chruch so much if they just spend a life time cleaning up their shit, their track record for depraved behaviour just keeps growning. I know the catholic church is the oldest Man Boy club but come on, lets at least pretend they dont condone rampant pedophila, instead of just shuffling their rapist.... i mean priests from church to church, while claiming to be the sheppards of men.

     

    So you simply don't care about truth as such?

     

    You are asking me for fact, proof and truth, are we still talking about religion the one and only thing in this world governed 100% on the currancy known as faith, Which is the direct absence of proof, fact and truth?

     

    Correct me if i am wrong.

     

    The only needed truth is, you can througha  dart into an historical book and you can find the chatholic church or whatever diety happens to be in control at the time doing some attrocity in the name of god, and never god him self showing him self too give a pat on teh back to his loyal subjects.

    Had you read the thread, I already corrected you.

    That's not what the word faith means. The word we translate as "faith" in the bible is the Greek word pistis, which means, to be convinced by the evidence. It doesn't mean what you think it does.

    I am convinced, by the evidence, that there is a God, that Jesus  is His Son, that He died on the Cross and was resurrected. I do not know this with 'absolute certainty," but I don't know anything with 'absolute certainty." I do, however, feel the evidence FOR this proposition is better than the evidence against it, after years of study.

    Why do you keep bringing up the Catholic Church? They have nothing to do with this discussion. I am not a Catholic, and I am not about to defend them. That would be like attacking all athiests by attacking communism. It's a straw man.

  • DeserttFoxxDeserttFoxx Member UncommonPosts: 2,401
    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by DeserttFoxx

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by DeserttFoxx

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by DeserttFoxx


    Religion is a sicknes, a mind warping, crutch. A series of thoughts and ideals clung too by weaker men and exploited by the evil ones.  And while religion has some noble ideas in theory, every great war, tradgedy and massacre can be traced back to some religion, all religions, every one of them have their demons. These arent just my beliefs, they are fact.
    It doesnt even matter if buddha or whatever fat man was being confused for him prophecized the comming of a white man with blonde hair in blue eyes being born in the heart of isreal. Most people dont even know that the story of Jesus is just a spin off of the story of Osiris and the virgin Isis and her son Horus. A black pharroh in egypt,t he story of jesus is the exact same story, word for word with some key substitutions. The story originated 5000 years before the birth of christ.
     
    This doesnt mean jesus was bullshit or that he was blakc, it just goes to show all religions are fairy tales used to govern uncivilized man and the greatest tragedy is that people still use that shit as a crutch in the world today.

     

    What if you are wrong and there is a God, and Jesus was his son, and was crucified and resurrected? Either these things are facts or they are not. What if you are wrong about the facts?

    How do you know you are not?

    I have spent a lifetime studying the myths you are discussing, and find your interpretation 9which mine used to be quite similar by the way) to be lacking. How deeply have you studied the claims you are making and the arguments against them, or different interpretations of what you are saying?

     

    What if i am wrong, im quite certain we are all fucking wrong about god, the after life, heaven and hell and every other uncertainty we claim with aboslute certainty we know all about. You dont know a damn thing about god the same way i dont.

    What i do know is, i am content with not knowing what happens after death, unlike most religions which just choose to make shit up. Heaven and hell is absolute garbage, somethng used to govern man with fear, if you are good in life you go someplace good if you are bad you pay for it, make sense yeah, but living your life in fear doesnt make youa  great person, being religious doesnt make you better then anyone, it just means you would go around killing people, or raping people or whatever because nobody said you would be punished for it.

    That is basically the purpose of it, hell, i can imagine a bunch of noblemen and politicians back in the day scheming around a big stone table with some mead making up the rules and calling it "Quotes from god". It started off great too; If you kill someone, you goto hell, if you steal, you goto hell.... then they started getting a little crazy, if you disrespect your parents you goto hell, if you commit adultary you goto hell, if you create a false idol of your god you goto hell, the one that seems to fly right over christians heads since they all seem to worship their tortured lord on a cross, why the son of god would like to be remembered in his worst hour is beyond me.

    But yes, what if i am wrong, what if jesus did die and was ressurected... but what if you are wrong, what if his name wasnt Jesus, and there was no god.. IN FACT, his name was Kalel. and he could fly.. and he was super strong, and he didnt turn water into wine but he moved so fast that he was able to give people that illusion, and his great stories traversed time and he what we regard as the man of steel today,

    That's right! What if Jesus H. Christ was not Jesus, but just a mix up, but he was actually Kalel from krypton, and it wasnt Lucifer that was cause shit and had to be banished but Lex Luther. I think i am on to soemthing, i mean those old sand text get old and degraded, text get garbled, it could happen, in fact i am quite certain I am right and all other religions are wrong, it was superman who was our saviour and not christ.

     

    You cant really prove me worng the same way i cant prove you wrong, unless god has spoken to you directly. But hey, god is all forgiving, so even if i am wrong, i am in no jepardy of being punished for it, according to the rules god will forgive me if i repend on my death bed, so i got some time to be convinced. Well even if i dont repent chances are i will still get in too whatever VIP after life club that is waiting.

     

    A life time.. geez, i would bash the chruch so much if they just spend a life time cleaning up their shit, their track record for depraved behaviour just keeps growning. I know the catholic church is the oldest Man Boy club but come on, lets at least pretend they dont condone rampant pedophila, instead of just shuffling their rapist.... i mean priests from church to church, while claiming to be the sheppards of men.

     

    So you simply don't care about truth as such?

     

    You are asking me for fact, proof and truth, are we still talking about religion the one and only thing in this world governed 100% on the currancy known as faith, Which is the direct absence of proof, fact and truth?

     

    Correct me if i am wrong.

     

    The only needed truth is, you can througha  dart into an historical book and you can find the chatholic church or whatever diety happens to be in control at the time doing some attrocity in the name of god, and never god him self showing him self too give a pat on teh back to his loyal subjects.

    Had you read the thread, I already corrected you.

    That's not what the word faith means. The word we translate as "faith" in the bible is the Greek word pistis, which means, to be convinced by the evidence. It doesn't mean what you think it does.

    I am convinced, by the evidence, that there is a God, that Jesus  is His Son, that He died on the Cross and was resurrected. I do not know this with 'absolute certainty," but I don't know anything with 'absolute certainty." I do, however, feel the evidence FOR this proposition is better than the evidence against it, after years of study.

    Why do you keep bringing up the Catholic Church? They have nothing to do with this discussion. I am not a Catholic, and I am not about to defend them. That would be like attacking all athiests by attacking communism. It's a straw man.

     

     

     

    1. 1faith (noun)

    2. 2faith (transitive verb)

    3. article of faith

    4. faith healing

    5. good faith



    Main Entry:

    1faith Listen to the pronunciation of 1faith

    Pronunciation:

    ?f?th

    Function:

    noun

    Inflected Form(s):

    plural faiths Listen to the pronunciation of faiths ?f?ths, sometimes ?f?thz

    Etymology:

    Middle English feith, from Anglo-French feid, fei, from Latin fides; akin to Latin fidere to trust — more at bide

    Date:

    13th century

    1 a: allegiance to duty or a person : loyalty b (1): fidelity to one's promises (2): sincerity of intentions2 a (1): belief and trust in and loyalty to God (2): belief in the traditional doctrines of a religion b (1): firm belief in something for which there is no proof (2): complete trust3: something that is believed especially with strong conviction ; especially : a system of religious beliefs <the Protestant faith>

    synonyms see belief

    — on faith

    : without question <took everything he said on faith>

    Learn more about "faith" and related topics at Britannica.com

    See a map of "faith" in the Visual Thesaurus

    Find Jobs in Your City

    Pronunciation Symbols



    Share this entry: Share this word with digg Share this word with reddit Share this word with technorati Share this word with del.icio.us Share this word with furl Share this word with stumbleupon Share this word with google Share this word with blinklist Share this word with newsvine Share this word with facebook Share this word with myspace

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    MLA Style

    "faith." Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary. 2008.

    Merriam-Webster Online. 2 December 2008

    <http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/faith>;

    APA Style

    faith. (2008). In Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary.

    Retrieved December 2, 2008, from http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/faith

     

    There's my dictionary, wheres yours?

     

    I will take evidence however, if you can prove to me Jesus was alive i will at a minimum, apologize for saying he doesnt exist, i will however call him an asshole for not keeping his flock in check. I say catholic church because that happens to be the religon of choice in america, but i pretty much condemned every religion, so dont worry i didnt leave yours out.

     

    Ps.. you corrected me? I am begining to remember why i have you blocked.

    Quotations Those Who make peaceful resolutions impossible, make violent resolutions inevitable. John F. Kennedy

    Life... is the shit that happens while you wait for moments that never come - Lester Freeman

    Lie to no one. If there 's somebody close to you, you'll ruin it with a lie. If they're a stranger, who the fuck are they you gotta lie to them? - Willy Nelson

  • FishermageFishermage Member Posts: 7,562
    Originally posted by DeserttFoxx

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by DeserttFoxx

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by DeserttFoxx

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by DeserttFoxx


    Religion is a sicknes, a mind warping, crutch. A series of thoughts and ideals clung too by weaker men and exploited by the evil ones.  And while religion has some noble ideas in theory, every great war, tradgedy and massacre can be traced back to some religion, all religions, every one of them have their demons. These arent just my beliefs, they are fact.
    It doesnt even matter if buddha or whatever fat man was being confused for him prophecized the comming of a white man with blonde hair in blue eyes being born in the heart of isreal. Most people dont even know that the story of Jesus is just a spin off of the story of Osiris and the virgin Isis and her son Horus. A black pharroh in egypt,t he story of jesus is the exact same story, word for word with some key substitutions. The story originated 5000 years before the birth of christ.
     
    This doesnt mean jesus was bullshit or that he was blakc, it just goes to show all religions are fairy tales used to govern uncivilized man and the greatest tragedy is that people still use that shit as a crutch in the world today.

     

    What if you are wrong and there is a God, and Jesus was his son, and was crucified and resurrected? Either these things are facts or they are not. What if you are wrong about the facts?

    How do you know you are not?

    I have spent a lifetime studying the myths you are discussing, and find your interpretation 9which mine used to be quite similar by the way) to be lacking. How deeply have you studied the claims you are making and the arguments against them, or different interpretations of what you are saying?

     

    What if i am wrong, im quite certain we are all fucking wrong about god, the after life, heaven and hell and every other uncertainty we claim with aboslute certainty we know all about. You dont know a damn thing about god the same way i dont.

    What i do know is, i am content with not knowing what happens after death, unlike most religions which just choose to make shit up. Heaven and hell is absolute garbage, somethng used to govern man with fear, if you are good in life you go someplace good if you are bad you pay for it, make sense yeah, but living your life in fear doesnt make youa  great person, being religious doesnt make you better then anyone, it just means you would go around killing people, or raping people or whatever because nobody said you would be punished for it.

    That is basically the purpose of it, hell, i can imagine a bunch of noblemen and politicians back in the day scheming around a big stone table with some mead making up the rules and calling it "Quotes from god". It started off great too; If you kill someone, you goto hell, if you steal, you goto hell.... then they started getting a little crazy, if you disrespect your parents you goto hell, if you commit adultary you goto hell, if you create a false idol of your god you goto hell, the one that seems to fly right over christians heads since they all seem to worship their tortured lord on a cross, why the son of god would like to be remembered in his worst hour is beyond me.

    But yes, what if i am wrong, what if jesus did die and was ressurected... but what if you are wrong, what if his name wasnt Jesus, and there was no god.. IN FACT, his name was Kalel. and he could fly.. and he was super strong, and he didnt turn water into wine but he moved so fast that he was able to give people that illusion, and his great stories traversed time and he what we regard as the man of steel today,

    That's right! What if Jesus H. Christ was not Jesus, but just a mix up, but he was actually Kalel from krypton, and it wasnt Lucifer that was cause shit and had to be banished but Lex Luther. I think i am on to soemthing, i mean those old sand text get old and degraded, text get garbled, it could happen, in fact i am quite certain I am right and all other religions are wrong, it was superman who was our saviour and not christ.

     

    You cant really prove me worng the same way i cant prove you wrong, unless god has spoken to you directly. But hey, god is all forgiving, so even if i am wrong, i am in no jepardy of being punished for it, according to the rules god will forgive me if i repend on my death bed, so i got some time to be convinced. Well even if i dont repent chances are i will still get in too whatever VIP after life club that is waiting.

     

    A life time.. geez, i would bash the chruch so much if they just spend a life time cleaning up their shit, their track record for depraved behaviour just keeps growning. I know the catholic church is the oldest Man Boy club but come on, lets at least pretend they dont condone rampant pedophila, instead of just shuffling their rapist.... i mean priests from church to church, while claiming to be the sheppards of men.

     

    So you simply don't care about truth as such?

     

    You are asking me for fact, proof and truth, are we still talking about religion the one and only thing in this world governed 100% on the currancy known as faith, Which is the direct absence of proof, fact and truth?

     

    Correct me if i am wrong.

     

    The only needed truth is, you can througha  dart into an historical book and you can find the chatholic church or whatever diety happens to be in control at the time doing some attrocity in the name of god, and never god him self showing him self too give a pat on teh back to his loyal subjects.

    Had you read the thread, I already corrected you.

    That's not what the word faith means. The word we translate as "faith" in the bible is the Greek word pistis, which means, to be convinced by the evidence. It doesn't mean what you think it does.

    I am convinced, by the evidence, that there is a God, that Jesus  is His Son, that He died on the Cross and was resurrected. I do not know this with 'absolute certainty," but I don't know anything with 'absolute certainty." I do, however, feel the evidence FOR this proposition is better than the evidence against it, after years of study.

    Why do you keep bringing up the Catholic Church? They have nothing to do with this discussion. I am not a Catholic, and I am not about to defend them. That would be like attacking all athiests by attacking communism. It's a straw man.

     

     

     

    1. 1faith (noun)

    2. 2faith (transitive verb)

    3. article of faith

    4. faith healing

    5. good faith



    Main Entry:

    1faith Listen to the pronunciation of 1faith

    Pronunciation:

    ?f?th

    Function:

    noun

    Inflected Form(s):

    plural faiths Listen to the pronunciation of faiths ?f?ths, sometimes ?f?thz

    Etymology:

    Middle English feith, from Anglo-French feid, fei, from Latin fides; akin to Latin fidere to trust — more at bide

    Date:

    13th century

    1 a: allegiance to duty or a person : loyalty b (1): fidelity to one's promises (2): sincerity of intentions2 a (1): belief and trust in and loyalty to God (2): belief in the traditional doctrines of a religion b (1): firm belief in something for which there is no proof (2): complete trust3: something that is believed especially with strong conviction ; especially : a system of religious beliefs <the Protestant faith>

    synonyms see belief

    — on faith

    : without question <took everything he said on faith>

    Learn more about "faith" and related topics at Britannica.com

    See a map of "faith" in the Visual Thesaurus

    Find Jobs in Your City

    Pronunciation Symbols



    Share this entry: Share this word with digg Share this word with reddit Share this word with technorati Share this word with del.icio.us Share this word with furl Share this word with stumbleupon Share this word with google Share this word with blinklist Share this word with newsvine Share this word with facebook Share this word with myspace

    Link to this page:



    Cite this page:

    MLA Style

    "faith." Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary. 2008.

    Merriam-Webster Online. 2 December 2008

    <http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/faith>;

    APA Style

    faith. (2008). In Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary.

    Retrieved December 2, 2008, from http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/faith

     

    There's my dictionary, wheres yours?

     

    I will take evidence however, if you can prove to me Jesus was alive i will at a minimum, apologize for saying he doesnt exist, i will however call him an asshole for not keeping his flock in check. I say catholic church because that happens to be the religon of choice in america, but i pretty much condemned every religion, so dont worry i didnt leave yours out.

     

    Ps.. you corrected me? I am begining to remember why i have you blocked.

     

    When i said "I corrected you," I meant I had already explained how what you were saying was wrong earlier in the thread. Had you read the thread, you would know this.

    Sorry if i wasn't clear. Now, look at your own definitions. Only ONE of them says a belief without proof -- and that's not the primary one. That's also not the biblical one.

     

    www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi

    There is a better set of definitions of the word "faith" as it appears in scripture. Remember the Bible was not written in English. The OT was written in Hebrew, the NT was written in Greek.

    The English  word "faith" has evolved over time. When Aristotle uses the word pistis, he means what I mean by it, That would have been the meaning the Apostle Paul would have known, not the one you are using.

    As to Catholicism, most Christians in America are not Catholic, but either way, that has nothing to do with whether or not Jesus Christ was resurrected or is the Son of God.

  • FishermageFishermage Member Posts: 7,562

    I'm not here to prove anything to you, or anyone else for that matter --  I am merely saying I have found sufficient evidence for my beliefs. I gave a couple of websites to start you out on your quest for the evidence, and if you are even remotely as hard a case that i was, it certainly couldn't be done here in a forum thread.

    If you are willing to challenge yourself, I am confident that you too will be eventually convinced by the evidence. Are you brave enough to study the evidence yourself? Or will you avoid it and attack the Catholic Church for pedophelia?

    I'm telling you I feel the evidence is there if YOU seek it out. Seek and YOU shall find.

     

  • MarleVVLLMarleVVLL Member UncommonPosts: 905
    Originally posted by Sabiancym


    Are you serious?  Telling people what to think is a staple of Christianity.
     
    "Believe in Jesus, or you will burn in hell"
    "Gay people are evil, because we said so."
    "Throw kids against rocks, it's what jesus would do"
     
    Psalm 137:9
    "How blessed will be the one who seizes and dashes your little ones Against the rock."

     

    You quote Psalms 137 massively out of context.. and everything else you mentioned too..

    blessings,

    i study greek and latin

  • GameloadingGameloading Member UncommonPosts: 14,182
    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by sniperg


    Is there a point though in debating religion in the first place?
    For every point a theist can make about his religion there is always a counter point and vice versa. Quoting scriptures won't change that fact in the slightest wether god or jesus is real or not. So unless some dead people come back to life and tell us what is there, everyone can believe whatever deity they so choose including cthulhu if they are feeling kinky.
    I never really get the whole "my religion is better than yours" thing. I mean if you believe it what do you care what the others believe?
     

    But what if someone DID come back to life? If that's true, wouldn't that make what that someone said fairly important and worth considering?

    Christianity is based upon witness testimony of people who saw such an event and shared it with one another, and the world.

    Christianity all comes down to the credibility of those witnesses and that testimony. I find more than sufficient evidence for that.

    That's because you have very low standards to what counts as evidence. In fact, what you consider as "evidence" can barely be considered evidence at all.

     

  • FishermageFishermage Member Posts: 7,562
    Originally posted by Gameloading

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by sniperg


    Is there a point though in debating religion in the first place?
    For every point a theist can make about his religion there is always a counter point and vice versa. Quoting scriptures won't change that fact in the slightest wether god or jesus is real or not. So unless some dead people come back to life and tell us what is there, everyone can believe whatever deity they so choose including cthulhu if they are feeling kinky.
    I never really get the whole "my religion is better than yours" thing. I mean if you believe it what do you care what the others believe?
     

    But what if someone DID come back to life? If that's true, wouldn't that make what that someone said fairly important and worth considering?

    Christianity is based upon witness testimony of people who saw such an event and shared it with one another, and the world.

    Christianity all comes down to the credibility of those witnesses and that testimony. I find more than sufficient evidence for that.

    That's because you have very low standards to what counts as evidence. In fact, what you consider as "evidence" can barely be considered evidence at all.

     

    Ah, the old ad hominem attack. How novel.

    And how deeply have you looked at the evidence yourself? How many serious books on apologetics have you read? Which ones?

  • GameloadingGameloading Member UncommonPosts: 14,182
    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by Gameloading

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by sniperg


    Is there a point though in debating religion in the first place?
    For every point a theist can make about his religion there is always a counter point and vice versa. Quoting scriptures won't change that fact in the slightest wether god or jesus is real or not. So unless some dead people come back to life and tell us what is there, everyone can believe whatever deity they so choose including cthulhu if they are feeling kinky.
    I never really get the whole "my religion is better than yours" thing. I mean if you believe it what do you care what the others believe?
     

    But what if someone DID come back to life? If that's true, wouldn't that make what that someone said fairly important and worth considering?

    Christianity is based upon witness testimony of people who saw such an event and shared it with one another, and the world.

    Christianity all comes down to the credibility of those witnesses and that testimony. I find more than sufficient evidence for that.

    That's because you have very low standards to what counts as evidence. In fact, what you consider as "evidence" can barely be considered evidence at all.

     

    Ah, the old ad hominem attack. How novel.

    And how deeply have you looked at the evidence yourself? How many serious books on apologetics have you read? Which ones?



     

    What you and I consider evidence are two very different things. you consider "Well someone wrote a bunch of people said they saw it so it MUST BE true, even though it goes against the laws of physics". I only consider hard, scientific evidence as true evidence, which christianity does not provide especialy when compared to much more plausible theories such as evolution.

  • FishermageFishermage Member Posts: 7,562
    Originally posted by Gameloading

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by Gameloading

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by sniperg


    Is there a point though in debating religion in the first place?
    For every point a theist can make about his religion there is always a counter point and vice versa. Quoting scriptures won't change that fact in the slightest wether god or jesus is real or not. So unless some dead people come back to life and tell us what is there, everyone can believe whatever deity they so choose including cthulhu if they are feeling kinky.
    I never really get the whole "my religion is better than yours" thing. I mean if you believe it what do you care what the others believe?
     

    But what if someone DID come back to life? If that's true, wouldn't that make what that someone said fairly important and worth considering?

    Christianity is based upon witness testimony of people who saw such an event and shared it with one another, and the world.

    Christianity all comes down to the credibility of those witnesses and that testimony. I find more than sufficient evidence for that.

    That's because you have very low standards to what counts as evidence. In fact, what you consider as "evidence" can barely be considered evidence at all.

     

    Ah, the old ad hominem attack. How novel.

    And how deeply have you looked at the evidence yourself? How many serious books on apologetics have you read? Which ones?



     

    What you and I consider evidence are two very different things. you consider "Well someone wrote a bunch of people said they saw it so it MUST BE true, even though it goes against the laws of physics". I only consider hard, scientific evidence as true evidence, which christianity does not provide especialy when compared to much more plausible theories such as evolution.

     

    I believe in evolution -- so do most Christians, and most theists. That has nothing to do with this discussion -- another typical red herring. In fact, it was the monotheistic worldview that gave rise to the very scientific method itself. It was the idea of a rational universe created by a rational God that directly led to the explosion of science that made the Western World.

    Scientific evidence is the only evidence? Well, that's just false. If it were, our history books would be empty. Observation means nothing? Then there is no astronomy either.

    When assessing historical evidence, one has a whole different set of parameters than when one is assessing scientific evidence.

    One first assesses the quality of the transmission of information. Then one assesses the crdibility of the people. What YOu are doing is illogical -- rejecting evidence outright because of a certain worldview. That is completely irrational.

    I will ask you again -- how many books on the subject have you read and which ones were they? Or are you simply arguing from ignorance?

  • madammomentsmadammoments Member Posts: 9
    Originally posted by kedoremos


    God does not exist.
    All religions are fairy tails spun by aristocracy to control the masses.
    Christ was a carpenter/anarchist who led a bunch of rejects into creating religions based on his beliefs.
    Never did he perform a miracle. Never was he the son of god [sic - no caps].
    Mary was a woman who had an extra-marital affair and blamed the pregnancy on god [god].
     
    You've heard all this before, or maybe you haven't seeing as how you live in the Bible Belt.



     

    i think you will find it was a PERSIAN KING who formed the basis of christianity, dear mmorpg-er. this Persian King was of Pagan religion but wanted a method of controlling all. he actually relinquished his Paganism, although obviously it wasnt ALL him, he was more so apart of the basis. but after several 100 years i am told they believed that the religion needed a divine figure, in this case, Jesus Christ, himself. I beleive this man existed but I dont believe he was divine - but that is just my view.

    i dont think u should sit there and be so blunt about it, people have feelings and some hold their beliefs dear to them, this is not to say that u should state ur beliefs, as it is obvious u do not believe in what they do but to be so brutal about it and state it as a fact is not ur place to do so. afterall, u wouldnt like them to do likewise to you. maybe it is a method of controlling the masses, but have u thought how the world MIGHT be without this? and dont sit there and simply say "yeah a much better one", etc. because u dont know that, but we could have ended up being a completely uncivilised species with no morales.

  • GameloadingGameloading Member UncommonPosts: 14,182
    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by Gameloading

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by Gameloading

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by sniperg


    Is there a point though in debating religion in the first place?
    For every point a theist can make about his religion there is always a counter point and vice versa. Quoting scriptures won't change that fact in the slightest wether god or jesus is real or not. So unless some dead people come back to life and tell us what is there, everyone can believe whatever deity they so choose including cthulhu if they are feeling kinky.
    I never really get the whole "my religion is better than yours" thing. I mean if you believe it what do you care what the others believe?
     

    But what if someone DID come back to life? If that's true, wouldn't that make what that someone said fairly important and worth considering?

    Christianity is based upon witness testimony of people who saw such an event and shared it with one another, and the world.

    Christianity all comes down to the credibility of those witnesses and that testimony. I find more than sufficient evidence for that.

    That's because you have very low standards to what counts as evidence. In fact, what you consider as "evidence" can barely be considered evidence at all.

     

    Ah, the old ad hominem attack. How novel.

    And how deeply have you looked at the evidence yourself? How many serious books on apologetics have you read? Which ones?



     

    What you and I consider evidence are two very different things. you consider "Well someone wrote a bunch of people said they saw it so it MUST BE true, even though it goes against the laws of physics". I only consider hard, scientific evidence as true evidence, which christianity does not provide especialy when compared to much more plausible theories such as evolution.

     

    I believe in evolution -- so do most Christians, and most theists. That has nothing to do with this discussion -- another typical red herring. In fact, it was the monotheistic worldview that gave rise to the very scientific method itself. It was the idea of a rational universe created by a rational God that directly led to the explosion of science that made the Western World.

    Scientific evidence is the only evidence? Well, that's just false. If it were, our history books would be empty. Observation means nothing? Then there is no astronomy either.

    When assessing historical evidence, one has a whole different set of parameters than when one is assessing scientific evidence.

    One first assesses the quality of the transmission of information. Then one assesses the crdibility of the people. What YOu are doing is illogical -- rejecting evidence outright because of a certain worldview. That is completely irrational.

    I will ask you again -- how many books on the subject have you read and which ones were they? Or are you simply arguing from ignorance?

     

    Evolution is in direct contradiction with Genesis,and yes, it has everything to do with the discussion.

    The problem with your "witness testimony" is that there is absolutely no hard evidence outside of those witness testimony. this is dead important as the claims made by these witnesses break the law physics. 

    Also, you do realise that every single religion in the world claims to have witness testimony, right? 

    Why should yours be true and all the others wrong? They obviously can't all be right.

    Heck, there are still people who claim to have seen the monster of loch ness and Bigfoot, I suppose you believe those as well?

  • FishermageFishermage Member Posts: 7,562
    Originally posted by Gameloading

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by Gameloading

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by Gameloading

    Originally posted by Fishermage

    Originally posted by sniperg


    Is there a point though in debating religion in the first place?
    For every point a theist can make about his religion there is always a counter point and vice versa. Quoting scriptures won't change that fact in the slightest wether god or jesus is real or not. So unless some dead people come back to life and tell us what is there, everyone can believe whatever deity they so choose including cthulhu if they are feeling kinky.
    I never really get the whole "my religion is better than yours" thing. I mean if you believe it what do you care what the others believe?
     

    But what if someone DID come back to life? If that's true, wouldn't that make what that someone said fairly important and worth considering?

    Christianity is based upon witness testimony of people who saw such an event and shared it with one another, and the world.

    Christianity all comes down to the credibility of those witnesses and that testimony. I find more than sufficient evidence for that.

    That's because you have very low standards to what counts as evidence. In fact, what you consider as "evidence" can barely be considered evidence at all.

     

    Ah, the old ad hominem attack. How novel.

    And how deeply have you looked at the evidence yourself? How many serious books on apologetics have you read? Which ones?



     

    What you and I consider evidence are two very different things. you consider "Well someone wrote a bunch of people said they saw it so it MUST BE true, even though it goes against the laws of physics". I only consider hard, scientific evidence as true evidence, which christianity does not provide especialy when compared to much more plausible theories such as evolution.

     

    I believe in evolution -- so do most Christians, and most theists. That has nothing to do with this discussion -- another typical red herring. In fact, it was the monotheistic worldview that gave rise to the very scientific method itself. It was the idea of a rational universe created by a rational God that directly led to the explosion of science that made the Western World.

    Scientific evidence is the only evidence? Well, that's just false. If it were, our history books would be empty. Observation means nothing? Then there is no astronomy either.

    When assessing historical evidence, one has a whole different set of parameters than when one is assessing scientific evidence.

    One first assesses the quality of the transmission of information. Then one assesses the crdibility of the people. What YOu are doing is illogical -- rejecting evidence outright because of a certain worldview. That is completely irrational.

    I will ask you again -- how many books on the subject have you read and which ones were they? Or are you simply arguing from ignorance?

     

    Evolution is in direct contradiction with Genesis,and yes, it has everything to do with the discussion.

    The problem with your "witness testimony" is that there is absolutely no hard evidence outside of those witness testimony. this is dead important as the claims made by these witnesses break the law physics. 

    Also, you do realise that every single religion in the world claims to have witness testimony, right? 

    Why should yours be true and all the others wrong? They obviously can't all be right.

    Heck, there are still people who claim to have seen the monster of loch ness and Bigfoot, I suppose you believe those as well?

    Ah, so you are a Biblical expert and you know the proper way to interpret genesis? Most Christians interpret Genesis as allegory and find NO contradiction between it and evolution. What makes you so sure the Fundamentalist interoretation of scripture is the correct one.

    What do you mean by "hard evidence?" There is no hard evidence of MOST of what we believe about history.

    Actually, no other religion makes the same or similar claims as Christianity. I will ask you again, how many books have you read on the subject? You seem to be extremely inexperienced in this area.

    I do not know whether or not those people saw bigfoot or the loch ness monster, but we are talking about a lot more people, and I don't know anyone who went to their death and held up under torture over bigfoot or the loch ness monster.

    I also don't know of people who talk about how, after evaluating the evidence for Bigfoot or teh Loch Ness Monster they came to a deep belief in it, and Bigfoot and teh Loch Ness monster then  changed their lives.

    Anyway, how many serious books on apologetics have you read? Still won't answer my basic question?

  • frodusfrodus Member Posts: 2,396

    atheism is merely the fruit of an underlying worldview of Darwinism, naturalism, and materialism. What each of these has in common is the rejection of any belief, claim, or explanation that relies on anything beyond empirical evidence,all knowledge is explained in natural, material, and physical terms, origins, adaptations, cognition, emotion, and even religious belief. taken to their logical extremes, Darwinism, naturalism, and materialism lead to scientism, the belief that true knowledge comes only through data that is observable, repeatable, and verifiable. nothing beyond the empirical, material, and natural realm can make a valid claim on human experience.

    thus, because they put no stock in the evidence of something as intangible as, say, human tradition, the  Atheists see no distinction between the equally invisible ,Great JuJu at the Bottom of the Sea, and the God of Abraham. this is a hyper-modernist materialism.

     

    see, if you reject the idea of God, then you don’t have to do any of those things that God supposedly commanded you to do. atheism can be a sort of manifesto of moral liberation from rules. and the rules that are most objectionable in our day and age are those that basically say, thou shalt conduct thyself with responsibility, chastity, mutual fidelity, and so on. <-------- more of this in the future

    contrary to popular belief, the fastest-growing religion in the world is not Islam but Christianity. why the misconception? As usual, we americans and europeans tend to bee quite nearsighted when it comes to global affairs, mistaking our own cultural developments for worldwide trends and our own preoccupations for a universal zeitgeist. Thus, the increasing secularization of Western Europe (and, to a lesser extent, the U.S.), when combined with the growing Muslim presence in this same region, has fooled us into thinking that Christianity is on the decline.

    well, nothing could be further from the truth. all we need do is glance below the equator to see that the world is becoming more Christian by the day. In 1900, for example, there were approximately 10 million Christians in Africa. By 2000, that number had grown to 360 million, adn experts predict that it will rise to 633 million by 2025. The same goes for Latin America and Asia, which are expected to have 640 million and 460 million Christians, respectively, within fifteen years. Indeed, by 2050, there will be a whopping three billion Christians on this planet—or one and a half times the number of Muslims.

     

    Yes the the number one book smuggled in to china is the Bible.

    Pythagoras --- whatever misfortunes may afflict you by the will of the gods,bear your fate patiently,and submit without anger.

    Forgive the spelling its late.

    Trade in material assumptions for spiritual facts and make permanent progress.

  • MarleVVLLMarleVVLL Member UncommonPosts: 905

    Just for fun, the Christian and Jewish faith would both be rendered useless if the first few chapters of Genesis was not literal. That does not mean that the first few chapters were 100% chronological, but if Adam really did not exist then the entire premise of the Abrahamic covenant > Christ is a man made supertistion. The entire Christian faith rests upon the Abrahamic convenant which stemmed from Adam. Jesus has to be a literal decendant of a literal Adam for Christianity to work. There is much to say on such a topic, mainly regarding redemption and the narritive of such an epic drama, but I'll leave it there for now as I am running late for class.

    Blessings and please excuse my spelling errors! :)

    i study greek and latin

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