What's the deepest, most complicated MMO out?

larryjr88

What's the deepest, most complicated MMORPG out now? Either F2P or P2P...I'm talking HUGE learning curve.

 

 

Kyleran

EVE has one of the longest..... not that easy to learn, and very hard to master....

centrik91

From my experience, I'd have to say EVE Online.  But some might disagree.

Recant

Can't really argue with EVE.  It's deeper than space itself, and almost as cold.  Makes a difference from orcs and goblins, though I'm sure spaceships and laser beams are their own kind of cliche.

I'd also toss in EQ1, simply because the newbie experience there is pretty traumatic (compared to more modern games), past the tutorial, though they have made it much easier in recent days.  There's still shitloads to learn.   And the world has more content than any newbie will ever hope to consume.

Slanger

Can't really think of another game that could take this prize other than Eve-Online. I know I'm biased since I currently play it, but I've played most of the decent games out there atm. And they simply don't come close to the amount of things going on in Eve-Olnine.

Unknown

It sounds like you may be under the mistaken impression that deep and complicated are related, but the answer is Eve followed by Guild Wars. 

Xix13

Yeah, I'd definitely have to put EVE at the top of that list.  The other complex ones (SWG, Horizons) have sufferred from gross corporate mismanagement.  And, really, the complexity of those two was more from the crafting options than the actual gameplay.  EVE has just so MANY things to do and so many ways to do them that it can take years to fully explore and understand the game.

But, if we're to believe the game makers, people don't WANT complex.  They want simple and mindless.  With the recent demise of Auto Assault (moderately complex itself), and with the loss of SWG and Horizons, I've actually found myself returning to UO.  At least I get to do some crafting there.  I tried Ashen Empires.  That's actually a nice game, but the graphics are pre-UO, which is a little tough to deal with in this day and age.  Good gameplay, but 1990 2D graphics.

Tried LotRO.  AA's quest-driven levelling without AA's speed = tiring.  Crafting's mediocre, expensive and prone to luck.  No complexity.  You all know how to play this one after 10 minutes.

Beta-testing Tabula Rasa.    Uh...OK, I'll try it for a couple of months on release in a couple of weeks, but so far I've not been really impressed.  Crafting is extremely quirky and luck-dependent.  No real complexity to the game.  After the tutorial, nothing else really to learn.

Went back and tried Lineage II.  Too much grinding.  Like the free MMOs but you need to pay for it.

(Yes, I know, we're tired of hearing it, but I want my pre-CU SWG back!)

So that really does leave EVE as the one you have to think about and take a lot of time to learn.  But with all the zoning and lack of an avatar, I keep coming and going with EVE.  It's a great game, make no mistake, and probably the best out there to date.  But it's missing the personal touch that keeps me there for hours and hours over months and months straight.

ianubisi

EverQuest and EVE, for very different reasons.

EQ (the original) has a vast wealth of content and some of the hairiest, nastiest activities you will have to do to get to the end-game content on all expansions. It's not so much complicated as it is extremely involved and very time consuming. Can be quite fun, too, provided you like that kind of thing.

EVE is an extremely complicated game. I wouldn't say it's really overwhelming in content...the content is player created, and your mileage on that type of content may vary. If you aren't involved in 0.0 security corporation/alliance warfare then you won't see much of the truly expansive stuff. Nevertheless, the game will overwhelm you with details.

jldavis

I'd have to add Asheron's Call as a definite candidate to the list. It's not that newbie friendly, at all, there are tons of items, loads of skill combinations (open skill system), a LOT of land to explore, one of the best and most constantly evolving storylines to date, did I mention the incredibly harsh PvP of the Darktide server?

It may be an older game and have fewer players than what is considered mainstream MMOs nowadays, but it well deserves consideration! 

korvix

Imma have to say EvE as well...as said above...you have to get into the politics and player driven elements of the game to get a good taste of what the game has to offer.

Also, pretty much any of the older MMOs are pretty learning heavy...gonna throw a shout out to EQ,AO and Neocron.

 

Flute

Eve, hands down.  Even their faction system is massively complicated, it seems ever NPC is related to some organization that is linked to some corporation that is linked to some cartel which has links with an empire, and the game really does remember and if necessary work out whether that weird little NPC corporation half the game away won't give you a mission any more because you set about merrily blowing up their corporate allies ships for their parts last month for some quick cash.

That and it's the only game I know where players can conquer, hold, exploit and defend game-territory only through what could best be described as incredible amounts of effort.  A few games have contestable zones, but few have completely open areas where you can build all sorts of mammoth things - which themselves are at peril of being targetted by some other PC corporation or alliance.  The deep PvP requires economic success in addition to straight up skill or number of ships in the fleet, there are stealth bombers, logistics ships, interceptors, a myriad of tactical options, full scale electronic warfare (and countermeasures), and skills such as the eloquently named "Doomsday operation" skill for operating doomsday weapons and "Sovereignty".

The biggest thing with EVE is that they are by no means done with the game yet - they keep adding complexity, rather than dumbing things down.  While some bits are simple (load ammo first, get into range, target, fire!), it really is a game where after a year or more you can still say "what the heck do you do with this thing?".  So how do you use an Amarrian Starship Engineering Datacore, anyway?

Xix13

LOL  It's for doing invention on Amarr starships!  The only way to get blueprints for building the Tech 2 ships (like Command ships, Logistics ships, Assault ships, etc.).

spankybus

EVE Online....hands down...I've been playing it for years (on a break from it now though) and i still keep learning new stuff...it is just an unbelievably MASSIVE game.

CactusmanX

If by deep and complicated you mean has many options, then yes I will echo the Eve sentiment.  Anarchy Online also had a large number of skills to choose from.

But do you really mean complicated, that seems like a negative term, usually akin to poorly designed, inefficient and needlessly difficult to learn.  Simplicity and depth are the hallmark of a good design.

In that case I would say GW, it has options but is not complicated, which in my opinion is a good thing.

Aguy

How could you forget WWII Online?  Biggest learning curve EVER, takes you months to learn all manditory aspects of the game, and you will learn something new every day.

And I'm not the only one who thinks so: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WWII_Online#Steep_learning_curve

pahya

While EVE is a good game it is my mind as vast as the ocean and about a deep as a backyard swimming pool. Lots to learn, different paths to take but in the end it's either PvP (which is mostly gate camping) or blowing up NPCs. I spent more time traveling and watching guns fire than I actually did doing anything. If you've never played it, it might be worth a go though.

Saga of Ryzom is my recomendation.

paulscott

www3.neveron.com

 

after learning how to use this baby I pretty much laugh at EvE online users that claim they have the deepest and most complex game.

BigT

I would have to say EVE also.

boognish75

what about myst online mmo, i have yet to check it out myself, but it may be worth a look if yer looking for complicated and deep, the platform games were kinda hard and took thinking.

Netzoko

I'll have to say that EVE is deep everywhere except combat. It's dumbed down there. For the deepest combat I'm going to have to go with Guild Wars.

Cillasi

While running missions with my corporation one day, I happened to notice that one gang member was doing a lot of stuff that looked like a cleric's job (jamming, snaring, recharging, etc.).  Hey, and that little guy there zipping around pew-pew-pewing away while never drawing aggro looks strangely like a rogue....and that guy wayyyy out there hurling the long range missiles....can you say wizard?  And the guy drawing all the fire and doing most of the damage, is, of course, the tank! 

Then I started trying to figure out what skills to specialize for a particular "job" and...my head exploded.  That's how complicated Eve is.  There is no roadmap in Eve.  You can study any skill you can afford to study.  As a result, you might end up with a jack-of-all-trades, master-of-none type character.  It takes a lot of research and careful planning to actually end up with a "career" in Eve.  Even when you know what you're aiming for, it can very well take you a couple years to master it. 

You see, it doesn't matter how much time you spend in Eve because nothing you do in the game advances your character's skills.  Only study does that.  Luckily, your character can study while you're online or offline.  So, you can spend your time in the game concentrating on making money, fighting, trading,  manufacturing and other forms of commerce, your proficiency at which of course depends on your skills

Yep, love it or hate it...it's one of the toughest simply because it has the least number of rules.

larryjr88

Thanks for the replies guys! What about some F2P ones?

Rayx0r

Darkfall Online

I mean, it HAS to be the most complicated game out there.  considering it was slated to be released in what.. 2002?  2003?  Its still a long way away from any sort of public closed beta.. it must be one hell of a complicated game if the developers themselves havnt figured out what/how/huh? they want to make the game

 

oh.. wait.  we must be talking about games already released. 

My vote goes to Eve, and then Lineage 2.  Lineage 2 gets my vote because of the gear competition.  If you're legit you can spend a LOT of time farming mats etc.  Its very gear centric and the gear is extremely expensive to purchase

in the PvE world, Everquest 2. 

F2P, Anarchy Online

he11cod

Heh, people forget about Anarchy online.  If you haven't played it, give it a try, its free.  For those who have played it, cmon, it's such a difficult game.

Yeebo

EVE has a lot of depth to it from all I've read. 

Ultima Online and FFXI also have a ton of depth. 

As far as free, you might check out Anarchy Online.  Big old game with surprisingly complex systems.  Graphics are seriously dated, but if "deep and free" are what you crave it's worth a look. 

I'd also do some research on the game before you start.  It's quite easy to gimp the hell out of yourself if you don't know what you are doing when you first start.

Harafnir

Number one: EVE

Number two: Nothing

Number 3: Anarchy Online

4-7: Nothing.

Number 8: The rest