Im sorry Im not a big fan of either game but come on...
AoC will flop hardcore, the dev. even said the end game is a pve focused game. Besides that the game looks are on par with EQ1 and its been in the final stages for months so thats what it will look like at release, the combat animation looks even worse. The game keeps getting pushed back. I know it will flop hardcore...
WAR backed by Mythic so of course its pvp based and it even says the game is based around pvp. It has a much better name behind it. Dont need to go into anymore really WAR will be the next big MMO like it or not thats the truth.
You make presumptions of "AoC will flop hardcore" based on your opinions of what YOU think that game will be, how it will play, how the graphics look based on your opinions. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but then the more I read your post it sounds more like you're just another WAR fanboi trying to beat down a game that would give it competition. This is where the ignorance comes into play on your part.
Your comment "It has a much better name behind it", meaning that WAR has more of a "name" than CONAN? That makes you look even more stupid. CONAN is friggin legendary, and if you disagree then you're asleep at the wheel and 2 lights are headed straight for you.
Just be honest with yourself. Look at the graphics and animation of AoC it really is on par with EQ1 and DAOC games that are over 5 years old. I said Im not a fan of either game, Im sure I will try WAR because its made by Mythic and pvp centric and Im sure I will not try AoC because its pve centric and to be honest it reminds me of D&L. Its made by Funcom which is known for horrible games, support and random player banning. I dont mean name as in the name of the game. If you think that because its got the name CONAN it will do good your wrong.
If anything its just the opposite. Take a look at LoTRO D&D, Star Treck lol! Those games are a total joke and a pve based games with pvp thrown into it at the last min. You couldnt have a bigger name than LoTR and they made a total joke of a game out of it. Name means nothing as far as MMOs go when I say name behind it I mean Mythic vs Funcom. Funcom has never released a good game, their one big title gets moved back and moved back because they know it sucks.
Just wait and think back to this post when AoC comes out and just flops. I called it with LoTRO and D&D when everyone thought they would be great MMOs.
Originally posted by Gurkz Im sorry Im not a big fan of either game but come on... AoC will flop hardcore, the dev. even said the end game is a pve focused game. Besides that the game looks are on par with EQ1 and its been in the final stages for months so thats what it will look like at release, the combat animation looks even worse. The game keeps getting pushed back. I know it will flop hardcore... WAR backed by Mythic so of course its pvp based and it even says the game is based around pvp. It has a much better name behind it. Dont need to go into anymore really WAR will be the next big MMO like it or not thats the truth.
You make presumptions of "AoC will flop hardcore" based on your opinions of what YOU think that game will be, how it will play, how the graphics look based on your opinions. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but then the more I read your post it sounds more like you're just another WAR fanboi trying to beat down a game that would give it competition. This is where the ignorance comes into play on your part. Your comment "It has a much better name behind it", meaning that WAR has more of a "name" than CONAN? That makes you look even more stupid. CONAN is friggin legendary, and if you disagree then you're asleep at the wheel and 2 lights are headed straight for you.
Just be honest with yourself. Look at the graphics and animation of AoC it really is on par with EQ1 and DAOC games that are over 5 years old. I said Im not a fan of either game, Im sure I will try WAR because its made by Mythic and pvp centric and Im sure I will not try AoC because its pve centric and to be honest it reminds me of D&L. Its made by Funcom which is known for horrible games, support and random player banning. I dont mean name as in the name of the game. If you think that because its got the name CONAN it will do good your wrong.
If anything its just the opposite. Take a look at LoTRO D&D, Star Treck lol! Those games are a total joke and a pve based games with pvp thrown into it at the last min. You couldnt have a bigger name than LoTR and they made a total joke of a game out of it. Name means nothing as far as MMOs go when I say name behind it I mean Mythic vs Funcom. Funcom has never released a good game, their one big title gets moved back and moved back because they know it sucks. Just wait and think back to this post when AoC comes out and just flops. I called it with LoTRO and D&D when everyone thought they would be great MMOs.
WAR will have RvR right where you can take over keeps/towers for Realm "points", and claim ownership of a certain part of an area. That was fun in DAoC for a while but it eventually got really old. AoC on the other hand will have basically the same RvR but with a twist where it's guild's establishments. You gather materials to build up a wall around an establishment, then you can have blacksmiths, markets, mail, bazaar for item trading, banks and everything else that a bunch of players can build. Then it's the siege combat. Other players/guilds try to siege an enemy guild and when they take it over, they get all benefits from that establishment.
PvP in WAR will be good as DAoC was good, but it gets old. PvP in AoC will actually mean something it seems, since you gain something for invading and taking over someone else's establishments other than just frickin realm points.
I never said in one word in my response to your post that I thought AoC will do well because it's Conan. Read it again please. You said WAR has a better name behind it than Conan, and I responded that your statement was ridiculous. Conan has been around for YEARS, and is more widely known. Never did I say once that AoC will be fantastic just because of the name CONAN.
And your ridiculous comment about how LOTRO was a joke and a flop. There you go again making stupid comments. LOTRO didn't have WoW's sub numbers but the game far from flopped. Their launch was ONE of the best in MMO's to date. They just lack some content and some folks are bored now, me being one of them. But the game was very good and did not flop at all.
Both will be awesome. Both will be played by thousands of people. Both will have PvE, PvP, and all those things we've grown to like. Sure, for developers and publishers it's a competition, 'cause there's money involved. But for us gamers, it's not; the fact that they see it as a competition is kind of a guarantee that they will work hard to please us. Bottom line: there's no "vs.", there's only "and". Companies lose or win, but gamers always win.
Right man... Sure AoC sounds great so did D&L and so does DF but that doesnt mean its going to be as good as it sounds. Right no matter what you will always make comments based on opinion and not facts. Im sorry but LOTRO was a flop. DAOC, L1/L2, EQ2, WoW, EVE and the list goes on and on with games with higher subs. When I say flop I mean that as a new MMO with in the first year and it cant even keep subs or get subs to beat games that have been out for years its a flop IMO. Sure some people play LOTRO but some people also playing Wolf Quest I would almost guess that even more people are playing Wolf Quests lol.
Im sorry Im not a big fan of either game but come on...
AoC will flop hardcore, the dev. even said the end game is a pve focused game. Besides that the game looks are on par with EQ1 and its been in the final stages for months so thats what it will look like at release, the combat animation looks even worse. The game keeps getting pushed back. I know it will flop hardcore...
WAR backed by Mythic so of course its pvp based and it even says the game is based around pvp. It has a much better name behind it. Dont need to go into anymore really WAR will be the next big MMO like it or not thats the truth.
You make presumptions of "AoC will flop hardcore" based on your opinions of what YOU think that game will be, how it will play, how the graphics look based on your opinions. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but then the more I read your post it sounds more like you're just another WAR fanboi trying to beat down a game that would give it competition. This is where the ignorance comes into play on your part.
Your comment "It has a much better name behind it", meaning that WAR has more of a "name" than CONAN? That makes you look even more stupid. CONAN is friggin legendary, and if you disagree then you're asleep at the wheel and 2 lights are headed straight for you.
Just be honest with yourself. Look at the graphics and animation of AoC it really is on par with EQ1 and DAOC games that are over 5 years old. I said Im not a fan of either game, Im sure I will try WAR because its made by Mythic and pvp centric and Im sure I will not try AoC because its pve centric and to be honest it reminds me of D&L. Its made by Funcom which is known for horrible games, support and random player banning. I dont mean name as in the name of the game. If you think that because its got the name CONAN it will do good your wrong.
If anything its just the opposite. Take a look at LoTRO D&D, Star Treck lol! Those games are a total joke and a pve based games with pvp thrown into it at the last min. You couldnt have a bigger name than LoTR and they made a total joke of a game out of it. Name means nothing as far as MMOs go when I say name behind it I mean Mythic vs Funcom. Funcom has never released a good game, their one big title gets moved back and moved back because they know it sucks.
Just wait and think back to this post when AoC comes out and just flops. I called it with LoTRO and D&D when everyone thought they would be great MMOs.
WAR will have RvR right where you can take over keeps/towers for Realm "points", and claim ownership of a certain part of an area. That was fun in DAoC for a while but it eventually got really old. AoC on the other hand will have basically the same RvR but with a twist where it's guild's establishments. You gather materials to build up a wall around an establishment, then you can have blacksmiths, markets, mail, bazaar for item trading, banks and everything else that a bunch of players can build. Then it's the siege combat. Other players/guilds try to siege an enemy guild and when they take it over, they get all benefits from that establishment.
PvP in WAR will be good as DAoC was good, but it gets old. PvP in AoC will actually mean something it seems, since you gain something for invading and taking over someone else's establishments other than just frickin realm points.
I never said in one word in my response to your post that I thought AoC will do well because it's Conan. Read it again please. You said WAR has a better name behind it than Conan, and I responded that your statement was ridiculous. Conan has been around for YEARS, and is more widely known. Never did I say once that AoC will be fantastic just because of the name CONAN.
And your ridiculous comment about how LOTRO was a joke and a flop. There you go again making stupid comments. LOTRO didn't have WoW's sub numbers but the game far from flopped. Their launch was ONE of the best in MMO's to date. They just lack some content and some folks are bored now, me being one of them. But the game was very good and did not flop at all.
LotRO was a flop for as much as people were hyping it , that good enough ?
Shadowbane HAS aocs pvp system with segieing etc, minus the fact there there seemed to be much LESS limited places to build... Still the system got boring much more quickly, because when you lose you lose everything you had worked for.
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
i still want someone to explain this to me, in WAR i will select a target, and then press a key to execute an ability / attack. in AoC however, i will stand near a target, and then press a key to execute an attack.
this is the sum total of the difference as far as i can tell. in conan, i have to jump around like i was still playing wow to point at my target, in WAR, i dont.
boobs and blood dont interest me, if i want boobs... well - the internet is for porn.
Originally posted by Xennith it is real time and not auto-attack based.
i still want someone to explain this to me, in WAR i will select a target, and then press a key to execute an ability / attack. in AoC however, i will stand near a target, and then press a key to execute an attack.
this is the sum total of the difference as far as i can tell. in conan, i have to jump around like i was still playing wow to point at my target, in WAR, i dont.
boobs and blood dont interest me, if i want boobs... well - the internet is for porn.
You obviously have never read any of the Conan novels about Hyborian women. Do people not give a shit about Lore at all?
i still want someone to explain this to me, in WAR i will select a target, and then press a key to execute an ability / attack. in AoC however, i will stand near a target, and then press a key to execute an attack.
this is the sum total of the difference as far as i can tell. in conan, i have to jump around like i was still playing wow to point at my target, in WAR, i dont.
boobs and blood dont interest me, if i want boobs... well - the internet is for porn.
You obviously have never read any of the Conan novels about Hyborian women. Do people not give a shit about Lore at all?
Originally posted by Xennith Originally posted by joejccva
Originally posted by Xennith
it is real time and not auto-attack based.
i still want someone to explain this to me, in WAR i will select a target, and then press a key to execute an ability / attack. in AoC however, i will stand near a target, and then press a key to execute an attack. this is the sum total of the difference as far as i can tell. in conan, i have to jump around like i was still playing wow to point at my target, in WAR, i dont. boobs and blood dont interest me, if i want boobs... well - the internet is for porn.
You obviously have never read any of the Conan novels about Hyborian women. Do people not give a shit about Lore at all? no, i play games. i read books, and play games.
Fair enough, but I fail to understand your statement about the difference in WAR combat versus AoC combat. So in AoC you "have" to jump around like a bunny to attack someone, but in WAR you don't? *confused and puzzled look*
And guess what Bethesda used the same engine as Mythic for Oblivion. So the very same graphics engine that powered those great graphics in Oblivion is powering WAR.
The best painting canvas in the world doesn't do a thing if you're using crayola colors to "paint" with. That's essentially what War is doing with that engine.
Granted, they are staying true to the style behind the genre, they cannot be blamed at all for this decision, particularly with the greater freedom with comp requirements.
No man is an island, entire of itself; every man is a piece of the continent, a part of the main. any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind, and therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee. Hemingway
The other topic about how WAR is pretty much built around PvP amazes me. Let me first say that DAoC pvp was fantastic, but the PVE was a gdamn complete and utter joke. You do the same missions over and over and over until you are blue in the face to level up to 50 so you can do the RvR. God help us if WAR is like that because I know for a fact I won't be playing. If WAR has you do the same damn quests over and over to level up, then they might as well hang that shit up right now.
Let's break it down a bit on percentages for the current MMORPG player community:
1. Percentage of players that interested in solely hardcore PVP - 10% 2. Percentage of players that are interested in PVE with PVP when the time arises - 30% 3. Percentage of players that are pretty much only interested in PVE - 60%
You can agree or disagree with these figures, but after watching the communities in every "MAJOR" mmorpg title (WoW, EQ1 and EQ2, SWG, LoTRO, etc), the fact is that there is a larger community of players that would rather enjoy the PVE content aspect of a game. I'm in the #2 spot (30%) where I love the PvP, but I want the PVE too.
In alot of these major titles, there have been WAY more PVE oriented players than PVP ones.
The problem: If what I've read is true about WAR with it being completely PVP eccentric, then it will go down the same road as Shadowbane went down along with some other titles.
Q) Hello! I am a PvPer without doubt, and consider Dark Age of Camelot as the best PvP/RvR game ever. From what Ive seen, I believe this game will take over that title. However, Id like to know whether or not there will be PvE raids in the end-game, or is it all PvP?
A) WAR provides a fully-realized PvE and RvR experience for players to enjoy. This will include plenty of high-end content for both, including dungeons, Public Quests, etc.
AmazingAveryAge of Conan AdvocateMemberUncommonPosts: 7,188
Originally posted by Xennith
it is real time and not auto-attack based.
i still want someone to explain this to me, in WAR i will select a target, and then press a key to execute an ability / attack. in AoC however, i will stand near a target, and then press a key to execute an attack.
this is the sum total of the difference as far as i can tell. in conan, i have to jump around like i was still playing wow to point at my target, in WAR, i dont.
boobs and blood dont interest me, if i want boobs... well - the internet is for porn.
Auto Attack = locks onto target, say your a caster you cast a "fire bolt" at enemy it will go directly to that enemy usually what ever the lay of the land.
AoC has some cones for casting and also you have to manually target the person, by AoC visual for example.
The difference is the foe can run off away, but if he is auto targetted the fire bolt will follow him to his destination.
In AoC melee, you have to face your opponent to attack, there is also "soft targeting" to assist with the directional attacks.
In all the videos shown of combat there is more people jumping around the screen in warhammer. This probably comes from the fact that someone who say has only played wow is used to this type of combat: eg. The jumping/FPS strategy. This has also been shown in AoC recently. Jumping looks in war like one player takes 10 steps in a jump, kinda like a "mario" jump, in AoC is relatively tighter with the focus more on realistic limitations such as player weight, - you can't jump twice your height. Although whatever is said neither game is finished but imo one thing for sure is Orc's are old and tired and over used in fantasy mmorpg's.
Again my take on GvG Vs RvR:
WAR = Factional AoC =GvG
PvP point of view:
In a factional system you have built-in friends and enemies. It's just the way the game is designed. People on your faction are your friends (you typically can't attack them at all except in a /duel), and people on the other faction are your enemies. It's a very black and white situation.
In a guild-based or non-factional system the line is not so clear. The guy that helped you out yesterday might take your head off today. Politics and guild drama run rampant. People in your guild today might splinter off and be your sworn enemies tomorrow. Your enemies today might ask to ally with you to take on a bigger foe. You never know what the game will hold for you. It's a much more chaotic/exciting environment.
I want the freedom to choose my own friends and enemies. GvG gives that to me.
There is little to no accountability for behavior in RvR; punks, gankers, and smack talkers can fade into the anominity and safety of their faction. Not to mention leechers and people there for the ride doing nothing to help in a battle… Often such behavior is encouraged in RvR because the enemy is faceless and the consequences are few. No RvR for me. I want to choose who my enemies are and not have the game choose them for me.
GvG offers more freedom. RvR is repetitive really unless there are more than 2 facets. Once a certain time has passed, the entire regions are reset. There is no long-lasting effect. It just starts all over.
In comparison, in a GvG type game, guilds can hold their assets as long as they can hold their assets. They are able to make a permanent impact on the game world itself, shaping it, forming it, contributing to it. This is AoC’s border kingdoms.
In an RvR system, I am stuck with idiots. I cannot throw them out of my faction. I cannot kill them, and they are free to annoy me with their childish behaviour. I don’t even get to chose who my "friends and allies" are. The Computer decides for me. And in return I get an ever repeating, yet senseless struggle.
Now you have to wonder how long anyone will play the game when nothing they accomplish means anything because the world resets all by itself. - Its a good job war offers some good incentives!
How repetitive is the RvR system going to be? - I played DAoC for 14 months I've experienced it.
How different AoC battlekeeps be, when the lay of the land has impact tactically in your fight. In a PvP fight in WAR you press the shortcut for Auto Attack - stream off your skills, how easy is that, and how many times have we seen that in other games.... Directional Attacks in AoC will make PvP much more fun, and ultimately more skill based as the onus of your movement in game is directly tied to you attacking actions.
Its the new innovative / different approach that Funcom is taking with AoC that excites me, especially Formation Mounted Combat in a PvP area.
I've been there done that with RvR and the same with GvG, in my opinion the flair for difference in GvG make it more fun imo.
What is forsure though, is we won't know fully how RvR in war will play out until its released or your play it. The fact that just because mythic made DAoC doesnt mean to say that RvR will be balanced in war. Just because Funcom made AO, doesnt mean to say the options for GvG will be totally different from what we expect, on the contrary from these pictures of the Guild user Interface from AoC we can see the level of diversity i am talking about:
This are some of the options that you will find only in GvG, factor in the Mercenary into GvG and that gives you a great facet on such a flexible system. GvG is anything but static, politics, alliances, relations all have an effect. In an RvR system you have two sides in the Border Lands for example there is the opportunity for dozens of guilds to present themselves best on the open PvP floor.
Originally posted by joejccva
The other topic about how WAR is pretty much built around PvP amazes me. Let me first say that DAoC pvp was fantastic, but the PVE was a gdamn complete and utter joke. You do the same missions over and over and over until you are blue in the face to level up to 50 so you can do the RvR. God help us if WAR is like that because I know for a fact I won't be playing. If WAR has you do the same damn quests over and over to level up, then they might as well hang that shit up right now. Let's break it down a bit on percentages for the current MMORPG player community: 1. Percentage of players that interested in solely hardcore PVP - 10%
2. Percentage of players that are interested in PVE with PVP when the time arises - 30%
3. Percentage of players that are pretty much only interested in PVE - 60%
Based on your opinion how does war factor it in when they promote the game as 80% PvP 20% PvE ?
In alot of these major titles, there have been WAY more PVE oriented players than PVP ones. The problem: If what I've read is true about WAR with it being completely PVP eccentric, then it will go down the same road as Shadowbane went down along with some other titles. This is just my opinion.
Maybe, just maybe, the reason for your observations is that no one has really brought a good PVP centric game to the marketplace yet...
and maybe WAR (or AOC or Darkfall) will be the first ones ever to do so. Who knows, they might do for PVP what WOW did for PVE.....
Lets give them a chance before deciding that their new approach is "doomed" from the start.....
I for one could really use something different that the current PVE "formula" games we've been getting lately.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Although I have a hard time believing Mythic with Mark Jacobs in control can put a decent game out. Remember DDO, they were also a board game converted to a MMO and it flopped.
Originally posted by joejccva In alot of these major titles, there have been WAY more PVE oriented players than PVP ones. The problem: If what I've read is true about WAR with it being completely PVP eccentric, then it will go down the same road as Shadowbane went down along with some other titles. This is just my opinion.
Maybe, just maybe, the reason for your observations is that no one has really brought a good PVP centric game to the marketplace yet... and maybe WAR (or AOC or Darkfall) will be the first ones ever to do so. Who knows, they might do for PVP what WOW did for PVE..... Lets give them a chance before deciding that their new approach is "doomed" from the start..... I for one could really use something different that the current PVE "formula" games we've been getting lately.
That is so far from the truth its not even funny...
Players want to pve only at 60% and 30% want mainly pve with some pvp thrown in? Take a look at the recent market, D&D pve based game did horrible, LOTRO pve with some crap pvp thrown in did horrible, just take a look at what games are doing the best right now can keep their fan base longer. Games are going away from the pve thing. The guy who made D&D and LoTRO found this out the hard way. For a game to make it today it has got to have a pvp centric theme or it will fail that is all there is to it. Just look at the games that started as pve only every single one of them had to add some pvp to even get people to play the game.
Just to name 3 games with high amounts of players and monthly subs. Compair the numbers of these games to heavy centric pve games. People dont like the games because of their pve system that is just retarded to even say. If you hear people talk about DAOC, or SWG or UO they talk about the pvp system and how fun it was or whatever they never talk about the pve system lol. Pve games and pve systems are becoming a thing of the past its a way to keep people playing and paying that is it. If I want to play a pve game I will play Oblivian, Bioshock a pve only game dont need to pay $15 a month to do that what is even the point? There was a big topic on this when EQ2 and WoW was coming out EQ2 was the pve side and WoW the pvp side and we all know who came out on top there. They also said that a game didnt need pvp when they were coming out with D&D and LoTRO and we saw how quick they put in some kind of pvp system in a last ditch hope to save the games.
WoW good mix of both pve and pvp I cant stand the game but the most populated servers on WoW are of course pvp servers.
L2 a horrible grind but guess what large numbers play because of the pvp the game has to offer.
EVE online horrible pve system but guess what a big following amoung pvp players.
Yea I think WAR will be along the lines of 85% PVP and 15% PVE, while AoC will be 60% PVE and 40% PVP, but that PVP will be the GvG and will be very strong and robust. I personally am looking forward to AoC.
We won't know until they are both out. Although I have a hard time believing Mythic with Mark Jacobs in control can put a decent game out. Remember DDO, they were also a board game converted to a MMO and it flopped. We will just have to wait and see.
A joke right?
MJ from mythic - DAOC
DDO= Turbine , James Jones
DAOC is forever old and still on the top 5 games list on this site and it earned it. (basiclly its an old rating but thats what it got and has maintained)
"Players want to pve only at 60% and 30% want mainly pve with some pvp thrown in? "
I agree i believe more and more players want good pvp, that being said WAr is more pvp then pve. first Teir (area) is 70% pve and 30% pvp , each one after that (4 in all) move about 10-15% from pve to pvp.
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
Oh come on Battlekruse you know thats not true. Since it was announced AoC has been about a PvP focused end game. Hell it wasn't until just this year that they even mentioned end-game raids, barely before E3. AoC is trying to cater to everyone. Casual, hardcore, socializer, explorer, PvPer and PvEer. But the game has always been about end-game sieging. There are a handful of high-end dungeons just for people that enjoy that stuff.
I kinda agree with you Fion, Umm , i feel WAr is bankign on PvP more than AoC is.
However, if you look at the game as a whole WAR is way more PvP focused. This doesn't mean AoC pvp will not rock , because i bet its gonna be pretty cool.
Sorry to double post didn't realize i really want a delete post function (i have not found it otherwise)
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
No one wins. We all lose. And in 25 years when our asses have grown to the size of the moon and we all have ulcers, brown teeth, and no hair, we can blame MMO's for sapping the life out of us and Mountain Dew for everything else. Screw it, I'm movig to the Mojave desert to train!
A) DAoC/Shadowbane Large open combat areas, massive keep warfare with dynamic pvp. Alot of large scale pvp to happen, meaning lag, lag, crashing, but fun. B)WoW/Guildwars Relies on instances for PvP with little to no large scale PvP happening. Meaning a little lag but pvp always in same areas with fixed amount of enemies/allies. ...the best?
if you picked A, AoC is for you, if you picked B, WAR is for you.
The end.
I picked A, WAR is just totally rubbish. give it another year+ noobs will be complaining about WAR like they do about WoW
Comments
You make presumptions of "AoC will flop hardcore" based on your opinions of what YOU think that game will be, how it will play, how the graphics look based on your opinions. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but then the more I read your post it sounds more like you're just another WAR fanboi trying to beat down a game that would give it competition. This is where the ignorance comes into play on your part.
Your comment "It has a much better name behind it", meaning that WAR has more of a "name" than CONAN? That makes you look even more stupid. CONAN is friggin legendary, and if you disagree then you're asleep at the wheel and 2 lights are headed straight for you.
Just be honest with yourself. Look at the graphics and animation of AoC it really is on par with EQ1 and DAOC games that are over 5 years old. I said Im not a fan of either game, Im sure I will try WAR because its made by Mythic and pvp centric and Im sure I will not try AoC because its pve centric and to be honest it reminds me of D&L. Its made by Funcom which is known for horrible games, support and random player banning. I dont mean name as in the name of the game. If you think that because its got the name CONAN it will do good your wrong.
If anything its just the opposite. Take a look at LoTRO D&D, Star Treck lol! Those games are a total joke and a pve based games with pvp thrown into it at the last min. You couldnt have a bigger name than LoTR and they made a total joke of a game out of it. Name means nothing as far as MMOs go when I say name behind it I mean Mythic vs Funcom. Funcom has never released a good game, their one big title gets moved back and moved back because they know it sucks.
Just wait and think back to this post when AoC comes out and just flops. I called it with LoTRO and D&D when everyone thought they would be great MMOs.
Sig by WhiskeyJack1
WAR will have RvR right where you can take over keeps/towers for Realm "points", and claim ownership of a certain part of an area. That was fun in DAoC for a while but it eventually got really old. AoC on the other hand will have basically the same RvR but with a twist where it's guild's establishments. You gather materials to build up a wall around an establishment, then you can have blacksmiths, markets, mail, bazaar for item trading, banks and everything else that a bunch of players can build. Then it's the siege combat. Other players/guilds try to siege an enemy guild and when they take it over, they get all benefits from that establishment.
PvP in WAR will be good as DAoC was good, but it gets old. PvP in AoC will actually mean something it seems, since you gain something for invading and taking over someone else's establishments other than just frickin realm points.
I never said in one word in my response to your post that I thought AoC will do well because it's Conan. Read it again please. You said WAR has a better name behind it than Conan, and I responded that your statement was ridiculous. Conan has been around for YEARS, and is more widely known. Never did I say once that AoC will be fantastic just because of the name CONAN.
And your ridiculous comment about how LOTRO was a joke and a flop. There you go again making stupid comments. LOTRO didn't have WoW's sub numbers but the game far from flopped. Their launch was ONE of the best in MMO's to date. They just lack some content and some folks are bored now, me being one of them. But the game was very good and did not flop at all.
Both will be awesome. Both will be played by thousands of people. Both will have PvE, PvP, and all those things we've grown to like. Sure, for developers and publishers it's a competition, 'cause there's money involved. But for us gamers, it's not; the fact that they see it as a competition is kind of a guarantee that they will work hard to please us. Bottom line: there's no "vs.", there's only "and". Companies lose or win, but gamers always win.
Right man... Sure AoC sounds great so did D&L and so does DF but that doesnt mean its going to be as good as it sounds. Right no matter what you will always make comments based on opinion and not facts. Im sorry but LOTRO was a flop. DAOC, L1/L2, EQ2, WoW, EVE and the list goes on and on with games with higher subs. When I say flop I mean that as a new MMO with in the first year and it cant even keep subs or get subs to beat games that have been out for years its a flop IMO. Sure some people play LOTRO but some people also playing Wolf Quest I would almost guess that even more people are playing Wolf Quests lol.
Dont matter though just watch and learn...
Sig by WhiskeyJack1
You make presumptions of "AoC will flop hardcore" based on your opinions of what YOU think that game will be, how it will play, how the graphics look based on your opinions. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but then the more I read your post it sounds more like you're just another WAR fanboi trying to beat down a game that would give it competition. This is where the ignorance comes into play on your part.
Your comment "It has a much better name behind it", meaning that WAR has more of a "name" than CONAN? That makes you look even more stupid. CONAN is friggin legendary, and if you disagree then you're asleep at the wheel and 2 lights are headed straight for you.
Just be honest with yourself. Look at the graphics and animation of AoC it really is on par with EQ1 and DAOC games that are over 5 years old. I said Im not a fan of either game, Im sure I will try WAR because its made by Mythic and pvp centric and Im sure I will not try AoC because its pve centric and to be honest it reminds me of D&L. Its made by Funcom which is known for horrible games, support and random player banning. I dont mean name as in the name of the game. If you think that because its got the name CONAN it will do good your wrong.
If anything its just the opposite. Take a look at LoTRO D&D, Star Treck lol! Those games are a total joke and a pve based games with pvp thrown into it at the last min. You couldnt have a bigger name than LoTR and they made a total joke of a game out of it. Name means nothing as far as MMOs go when I say name behind it I mean Mythic vs Funcom. Funcom has never released a good game, their one big title gets moved back and moved back because they know it sucks.
Just wait and think back to this post when AoC comes out and just flops. I called it with LoTRO and D&D when everyone thought they would be great MMOs.
WAR will have RvR right where you can take over keeps/towers for Realm "points", and claim ownership of a certain part of an area. That was fun in DAoC for a while but it eventually got really old. AoC on the other hand will have basically the same RvR but with a twist where it's guild's establishments. You gather materials to build up a wall around an establishment, then you can have blacksmiths, markets, mail, bazaar for item trading, banks and everything else that a bunch of players can build. Then it's the siege combat. Other players/guilds try to siege an enemy guild and when they take it over, they get all benefits from that establishment.
PvP in WAR will be good as DAoC was good, but it gets old. PvP in AoC will actually mean something it seems, since you gain something for invading and taking over someone else's establishments other than just frickin realm points.
I never said in one word in my response to your post that I thought AoC will do well because it's Conan. Read it again please. You said WAR has a better name behind it than Conan, and I responded that your statement was ridiculous. Conan has been around for YEARS, and is more widely known. Never did I say once that AoC will be fantastic just because of the name CONAN.
And your ridiculous comment about how LOTRO was a joke and a flop. There you go again making stupid comments. LOTRO didn't have WoW's sub numbers but the game far from flopped. Their launch was ONE of the best in MMO's to date. They just lack some content and some folks are bored now, me being one of them. But the game was very good and did not flop at all.
LotRO was a flop for as much as people were hyping it , that good enough ?Shadowbane HAS aocs pvp system with segieing etc, minus the fact there there seemed to be much LESS limited places to build... Still the system got boring much more quickly, because when you lose you lose everything you had worked for.
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
i still want someone to explain this to me, in WAR i will select a target, and then press a key to execute an ability / attack. in AoC however, i will stand near a target, and then press a key to execute an attack.
this is the sum total of the difference as far as i can tell. in conan, i have to jump around like i was still playing wow to point at my target, in WAR, i dont.
boobs and blood dont interest me, if i want boobs... well - the internet is for porn.
i still want someone to explain this to me, in WAR i will select a target, and then press a key to execute an ability / attack. in AoC however, i will stand near a target, and then press a key to execute an attack.
this is the sum total of the difference as far as i can tell. in conan, i have to jump around like i was still playing wow to point at my target, in WAR, i dont.
boobs and blood dont interest me, if i want boobs... well - the internet is for porn.
You obviously have never read any of the Conan novels about Hyborian women. Do people not give a shit about Lore at all?
i still want someone to explain this to me, in WAR i will select a target, and then press a key to execute an ability / attack. in AoC however, i will stand near a target, and then press a key to execute an attack.
this is the sum total of the difference as far as i can tell. in conan, i have to jump around like i was still playing wow to point at my target, in WAR, i dont.
boobs and blood dont interest me, if i want boobs... well - the internet is for porn.
You obviously have never read any of the Conan novels about Hyborian women. Do people not give a shit about Lore at all?
no, i play games. i read books, and play games.
i still want someone to explain this to me, in WAR i will select a target, and then press a key to execute an ability / attack. in AoC however, i will stand near a target, and then press a key to execute an attack.
this is the sum total of the difference as far as i can tell. in conan, i have to jump around like i was still playing wow to point at my target, in WAR, i dont.
boobs and blood dont interest me, if i want boobs... well - the internet is for porn.
You obviously have never read any of the Conan novels about Hyborian women. Do people not give a shit about Lore at all?
no, i play games. i read books, and play games.
Fair enough, but I fail to understand your statement about the difference in WAR combat versus AoC combat. So in AoC you "have" to jump around like a bunny to attack someone, but in WAR you don't? *confused and puzzled look*
The best painting canvas in the world doesn't do a thing if you're using crayola colors to "paint" with. That's essentially what War is doing with that engine.
Granted, they are staying true to the style behind the genre, they cannot be blamed at all for this decision, particularly with the greater freedom with comp requirements.
No man is an island, entire of itself; every man is a piece of the continent, a part of the main. any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind, and therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee.
Hemingway
The other topic about how WAR is pretty much built around PvP amazes me. Let me first say that DAoC pvp was fantastic, but the PVE was a gdamn complete and utter joke. You do the same missions over and over and over until you are blue in the face to level up to 50 so you can do the RvR. God help us if WAR is like that because I know for a fact I won't be playing. If WAR has you do the same damn quests over and over to level up, then they might as well hang that shit up right now.
Let's break it down a bit on percentages for the current MMORPG player community:
1. Percentage of players that interested in solely hardcore PVP - 10%
2. Percentage of players that are interested in PVE with PVP when the time arises - 30%
3. Percentage of players that are pretty much only interested in PVE - 60%
You can agree or disagree with these figures, but after watching the communities in every "MAJOR" mmorpg title (WoW, EQ1 and EQ2, SWG, LoTRO, etc), the fact is that there is a larger community of players that would rather enjoy the PVE content aspect of a game. I'm in the #2 spot (30%) where I love the PvP, but I want the PVE too.
In alot of these major titles, there have been WAY more PVE oriented players than PVP ones.
The problem: If what I've read is true about WAR with it being completely PVP eccentric, then it will go down the same road as Shadowbane went down along with some other titles.
This is just my opinion.
i still want someone to explain this to me, in WAR i will select a target, and then press a key to execute an ability / attack. in AoC however, i will stand near a target, and then press a key to execute an attack.
this is the sum total of the difference as far as i can tell. in conan, i have to jump around like i was still playing wow to point at my target, in WAR, i dont.
boobs and blood dont interest me, if i want boobs... well - the internet is for porn.
Auto Attack = locks onto target, say your a caster you cast a "fire bolt" at enemy it will go directly to that enemy usually what ever the lay of the land.
AoC has some cones for casting and also you have to manually target the person, by AoC visual for example.
The difference is the foe can run off away, but if he is auto targetted the fire bolt will follow him to his destination.
In AoC melee, you have to face your opponent to attack, there is also "soft targeting" to assist with the directional attacks.
In all the videos shown of combat there is more people jumping around the screen in warhammer. This probably comes from the fact that someone who say has only played wow is used to this type of combat: eg. The jumping/FPS strategy. This has also been shown in AoC recently. Jumping looks in war like one player takes 10 steps in a jump, kinda like a "mario" jump, in AoC is relatively tighter with the focus more on realistic limitations such as player weight, - you can't jump twice your height. Although whatever is said neither game is finished but imo one thing for sure is Orc's are old and tired and over used in fantasy mmorpg's.
Again my take on GvG Vs RvR:
WAR = Factional AoC =GvG
PvP point of view:
In a factional system you have built-in friends and enemies. It's just the way the game is designed. People on your faction are your friends (you typically can't attack them at all except in a /duel), and people on the other faction are your enemies. It's a very black and white situation.
I want the freedom to choose my own friends and enemies. GvG gives that to me.
There is little to no accountability for behavior in RvR; punks, gankers, and smack talkers can fade into the anominity and safety of their faction. Not to mention leechers and people there for the ride doing nothing to help in a battle… Often such behavior is encouraged in RvR because the enemy is faceless and the consequences are few. No RvR for me. I want to choose who my enemies are and not have the game choose them for me.
GvG offers more freedom. RvR is repetitive really unless there are more than 2 facets. Once a certain time has passed, the entire regions are reset. There is no long-lasting effect. It just starts all over.
In comparison, in a GvG type game, guilds can hold their assets as long as they can hold their assets. They are able to make a permanent impact on the game world itself, shaping it, forming it, contributing to it. This is AoC’s border kingdoms.
In an RvR system, I am stuck with idiots. I cannot throw them out of my faction. I cannot kill them, and they are free to annoy me with their childish behaviour. I don’t even get to chose who my "friends and allies" are. The Computer decides for me. And in return I get an ever repeating, yet senseless struggle.
Now you have to wonder how long anyone will play the game when nothing they accomplish means anything because the world resets all by itself. - Its a good job war offers some good incentives!
How repetitive is the RvR system going to be? - I played DAoC for 14 months I've experienced it.
How different AoC battlekeeps be, when the lay of the land has impact tactically in your fight. In a PvP fight in WAR you press the shortcut for Auto Attack - stream off your skills, how easy is that, and how many times have we seen that in other games.... Directional Attacks in AoC will make PvP much more fun, and ultimately more skill based as the onus of your movement in game is directly tied to you attacking actions.
Its the new innovative / different approach that Funcom is taking with AoC that excites me, especially Formation Mounted Combat in a PvP area.
I've been there done that with RvR and the same with GvG, in my opinion the flair for difference in GvG make it more fun imo.
What is forsure though, is we won't know fully how RvR in war will play out until its released or your play it. The fact that just because mythic made DAoC doesnt mean to say that RvR will be balanced in war. Just because Funcom made AO, doesnt mean to say the options for GvG will be totally different from what we expect, on the contrary from these pictures of the Guild user Interface from AoC we can see the level of diversity i am talking about:
This are some of the options that you will find only in GvG, factor in the Mercenary into GvG and that gives you a great facet on such a flexible system. GvG is anything but static, politics, alliances, relations all have an effect. In an RvR system you have two sides in the Border Lands for example there is the opportunity for dozens of guilds to present themselves best on the open PvP floor.
Originally posted by joejccvaThe other topic about how WAR is pretty much built around PvP amazes me. Let me first say that DAoC pvp was fantastic, but the PVE was a gdamn complete and utter joke. You do the same missions over and over and over until you are blue in the face to level up to 50 so you can do the RvR. God help us if WAR is like that because I know for a fact I won't be playing. If WAR has you do the same damn quests over and over to level up, then they might as well hang that shit up right now.
Let's break it down a bit on percentages for the current MMORPG player community:
1. Percentage of players that interested in solely hardcore PVP - 10%
2. Percentage of players that are interested in PVE with PVP when the time arises - 30%
3. Percentage of players that are pretty much only interested in PVE - 60%
Based on your opinion how does war factor it in when they promote the game as 80% PvP 20% PvE ?
Maybe, just maybe, the reason for your observations is that no one has really brought a good PVP centric game to the marketplace yet...
and maybe WAR (or AOC or Darkfall) will be the first ones ever to do so. Who knows, they might do for PVP what WOW did for PVE.....
Lets give them a chance before deciding that their new approach is "doomed" from the start.....
I for one could really use something different that the current PVE "formula" games we've been getting lately.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
We won't know until they are both out.
Although I have a hard time believing Mythic with Mark Jacobs in control can put a decent game out. Remember DDO, they were also a board game converted to a MMO and it flopped.
We will just have to wait and see.
and maybe WAR (or AOC or Darkfall) will be the first ones ever to do so. Who knows, they might do for PVP what WOW did for PVE.....
Lets give them a chance before deciding that their new approach is "doomed" from the start.....
I for one could really use something different that the current PVE "formula" games we've been getting lately.
Yea no problem.
That is so far from the truth its not even funny...
Players want to pve only at 60% and 30% want mainly pve with some pvp thrown in? Take a look at the recent market, D&D pve based game did horrible, LOTRO pve with some crap pvp thrown in did horrible, just take a look at what games are doing the best right now can keep their fan base longer. Games are going away from the pve thing. The guy who made D&D and LoTRO found this out the hard way. For a game to make it today it has got to have a pvp centric theme or it will fail that is all there is to it. Just look at the games that started as pve only every single one of them had to add some pvp to even get people to play the game.
Just to name 3 games with high amounts of players and monthly subs. Compair the numbers of these games to heavy centric pve games. People dont like the games because of their pve system that is just retarded to even say. If you hear people talk about DAOC, or SWG or UO they talk about the pvp system and how fun it was or whatever they never talk about the pve system lol. Pve games and pve systems are becoming a thing of the past its a way to keep people playing and paying that is it. If I want to play a pve game I will play Oblivian, Bioshock a pve only game dont need to pay $15 a month to do that what is even the point? There was a big topic on this when EQ2 and WoW was coming out EQ2 was the pve side and WoW the pvp side and we all know who came out on top there. They also said that a game didnt need pvp when they were coming out with D&D and LoTRO and we saw how quick they put in some kind of pvp system in a last ditch hope to save the games.
WoW good mix of both pve and pvp I cant stand the game but the most populated servers on WoW are of course pvp servers.
L2 a horrible grind but guess what large numbers play because of the pvp the game has to offer.
EVE online horrible pve system but guess what a big following amoung pvp players.
Sig by WhiskeyJack1
Avery very good post I must say.
Yea I think WAR will be along the lines of 85% PVP and 15% PVE, while AoC will be 60% PVE and 40% PVP, but that PVP will be the GvG and will be very strong and robust. I personally am looking forward to AoC.
I'm just glad we have choice between two good looking games.
I hope both do well.
MJ from mythic - DAOC
DDO= Turbine , James Jones
DAOC is forever old and still on the top 5 games list on this site and it earned it. (basiclly its an old rating but thats what it got and has maintained)
"Players want to pve only at 60% and 30% want mainly pve with some pvp thrown in? "
I agree i believe more and more players want good pvp, that being said WAr is more pvp then pve. first Teir (area) is 70% pve and 30% pvp , each one after that (4 in all) move about 10-15% from pve to pvp.
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
I kinda agree with you Fion, Umm , i feel WAr is bankign on PvP more than AoC is.
However, if you look at the game as a whole WAR is way more PvP focused. This doesn't mean AoC pvp will not rock , because i bet its gonna be pretty cool.
Sorry to double post didn't realize i really want a delete post function
(i have not found it otherwise)
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
so, who wins?
MyBrute = addicting mini online game!
No one wins. We all lose. And in 25 years when our asses have grown to the size of the moon and we all have ulcers, brown teeth, and no hair, we can blame MMO's for sapping the life out of us and Mountain Dew for everything else. Screw it, I'm movig to the Mojave desert to train!
I picked A, WAR is just totally rubbish. give it another year+ noobs will be complaining about WAR like they do about WoW