World of Darkness Online

TheGaymerAz

Well ok it is old news now that the makers of EVE have joined with White Wolf Games, and are in the process of making a WOD MMO. I am also sure there are other threads about this topic, but what ever. 

What would you all want to see done in a WOD MMO? (mind you I do not know much about werewolf and mage)

I think it would be cool if they did something along the lines of COH and COV where the two are stand alone games but can also be played as one. So example you would have a Vampire Game, Werewolf game and Mage game, These games could be played by on there own, Each game would have a diffrent setting Vampires would have a major city feeling to it where as werewolf would have more a nature feel. and mage a more magical feel the suroudings. Each game could have access to coman areas like PVP zones and such.

There could be a Faction based combat system, similar to POTBS's Nation vs Nation. Where each Clan (in the case of vampires) are fighting for control of the city. This would lead into the politcs side of the game, that have been a big part of the games.

So there are some of my Ideas, what do you think they could add?

TheGaymerAz

Hmmmm 71 people have read this and not a single post other then mine.... ohh well.

-Jan-

Ok, Ill give this a shot.

 

I assume that the game is about Vampire the requiem. 

I'm pretty sure that the game is going  to use a skill system similar to EVE-online, I have no objections to that, it fits the game.

 

I would like to see a heavily instanced cities where most event locations are randomly created and only some main locations are carefully designed to give the particular city its character. The city view would be just a map where the key places are marked and event locations appear when appropriate.

I know this may sound lame to you but this kind of city structure would make possible to create vast number of cities for the game, and IMO this is needed to fit in  million+ subscribers. I'd like to see cities with manageable number of vampires for the Prince. (If that position is even playable...I hope it is)

 

The game should be a a total sandbox game (glorified chatroom to you critics) where the theme of the game is survival and powerstruggle.

Players should be constantly fighting over the limited resources and influence within the city through bakstabbing missions and kinred/kine politics.

Some "illegal" or "unappropriate" missions should be available at all times against other players, the high reward missions would also create traces or "dirty secrets" for other players to find out, which in turn could be used for blackmail/influence the Vampire to vote against his will or perform a mission etc.

In general opportunities to betray other players trust should be plentiful and rewarding, that is what Vampire is all about.

 

I'd like to see players having only 1 Vampire character and other playable characters for him would be ghouls, retainers, blood dolls etc. which would evolve and be very useful in their own way. The Vampire character should not be enabled for perma-death but the same would't be true for the "support characters". That is a great way to introduce horror for the game. I don't want the game to fall to GTA type of rampage, the killing of the players "support character" should be a complex task which would take time (missions, framing, politics).

TheGaymerAz

I like your ideas alot!!!!

But I think Perma Death is one of the more intresting things about VT:R, and I think this is one of the few games where perma death would work. Perma Death in the game always adds a bit of emotion to the story for the other players. I think after you hit the max level your toon should be open to perma death. Perhaps the death is opened by a story arch or something. The way the devs could make perma death "ok" is once your toon is killed it opens up a new slot for a new toon, this slot would have enough xp to get you half way to the max lvl. Most games have "famous" players who everyone knows by reputation, Just think how fast the story of  Billy Bob's death by a Gangrel would spread through the server. It would add tension between the clans even more, and open up a intresting world for pvp.

(sorry if this does not make sense, I am kinda sick and cold meds are makeing me a bit loopy)

Aragoni

I hope there won't be even one instance, I hate instances. take EVE and transform it into a WOD game

TheGaymerAz

instance's do not bug me so much, ONE thing I hated about SWG was when you were trying to do a cave or something and you had to wait forever for the boss to respawn cuz everyone and there mother was running the cave.  Nothing kills imersion for me more then going to a mission where there are six other people doing six other missions. Now I have never played EVE so I do not know how they do things. But perhaps a way to find a comman ground is to have the story arch missions instanced and the rest not. The Story arch's could be similar to Pirates of the Burnning sea, where it is almost like a choose your own adventrue. But the only way you could do that is through Instance.

-Jan-

Imho perma-deaths (PD) most important purpose would be to prevent the game from warping into boring homogenous high lvl fragfest where all vamps know every discipline available, and the feel of gothic punk world is destroyed, when young vampires are few. Only high level content is added to satisfy the playerbase and  the whole game transforms to something unintended.

 

However arguments against PD are sound and it is seen as a "bad" game design in mmorpg dev community. Losing your character due connection problems is unfair and bound to cause the game problems due unhappy players regardless if they  "volunteered for the PD mission" or not...that is just the way ppl are. It is not worth the hassle.

 

 I am also for PD in general, because it can be used to prevent the game from spinning into that homogenous high lvl community I hate so much.

The only way I would see it being done in Vampire the requiem (V:tr) would be if PD would never happen through combat but by politics or some extreme conditions.

 

Politics: picture a Prince calling for a tribunal where all kinred would attend. In the tribunal it becomes clear that one of the vampires is accused of a crime that is punishable by death. Now the player is considered captured and proof of his guilt will be presented. The accused can try to build a defense for himself (convince ppl, call in favors/ blackmail ppl to vote not guilty etc.) for few days and then a vote will be cast by all vamps which seals his fate. This kind of procedure would eliminate all connection problems from ruining the intended game experience and therefore is acceptable method for PD in mmorpg.

 

Extreme conditions: When the vampire loses all his humanity he can be considered permanently dead, since this is a matter of moral choices in game and not a combat related issue this would be acceptable way to cause DP for the character, connection problems wouldnt be an issue here.

Also, gaining enough severe dearrangement could force the Vamp to commit suicide and die for good. Since gaining dearrangements is not affected by connecton problems, I could accept this method for causing PD in V:tr.

 

I would like to add that so far CCP hasn't announced what type of gamer they intend to do from White Wolfs IP...so this is mere speculation, maybe it is not about Vampire at all.

Airspell

Perma Death has to exist from the first moment you play the game. If it isnt most people will never choose to max out. They will just stay under the limit. I know I would. 

  A system also has to be in place where griefing is somehow controlled to a minimum, to stop people from just creating new characters in order to kill off others at no real risk to themselves. 

Tenebroso

I think they should do werewolfs, vampires, mages and human hunters in their own deals. What i mean, is that they should be treated as 1 race agaisnt alll the others, with their unique classes and powers. Now that would rock.

 

I also would start the game in the 600 BC, a medieval setting....releasing expansions and advancing in time. That would give the game more storylines and more content than they would ever need.

 

I am looking forward to an WoD MMO, but i know its about 4 - 7 years away.....i just hope it stays true to the WOD world.

 

 

Peace

Oso_True

This is my first post but I have been a life long player of not only the rpg table top but LARP as well.

 

I would like to hope they will put it out for all of the world of darkness but realistically I don't think this is going to happen. The money is in the expansions. Most likely be vampire and human then slowly introduce expansions and then new Creatures of darkness, and so on. Thats where the money is. Just slowly introducing creatures.

I would like to see them start newbs out as humans doing missions for whatever vampire clan, in order to become certain clan.  Sorta WoW like. Then complete missions through out the city until become a certain level, and then be inducted into certain covenants This is only to not alienate the first timers of the world of darkness and keep things fair for the newbs to vets of the game.  I don't think they will introduce final death until you've died too many times, most likely have a elder bring you out of torpor. I think that theres going to be allot of facets in the game, but I hope they stay true to the "Storytelling game of personal horror"

 

TheGaymerAz

I agree I am very intrested to see where this game goes.  I can not wait for the first screenshots/vids to come out.

legolass11

I would hope a horror themed mmorpg not just another game with vampires as race selection... Since it would be something completly new its hard to find equivalent on other mmorpgs for features I would like to be in WOD.

Although I would like to see:

Game kept true to White wolf's books.

The eerie aura on some zones that you would get on Vampire Redemption (ex. the tzmisce zones, the haunted mansion.. I felt unconfortable on those areas)

Quality over quantitiy on pvp (its a ccp game, you know it will have pvp. And it just fits the game even if its just faction pvp). 

A great character customization feature.. Its one of the features players always enjoy but companies always go cheap here.

 

rcorvin

A lot of people seem to have the expectation of permanent death being a part of this game. I wouldn't count on that: Simple fact of the matter is that MMOs these days are extremely light on death penalties -- people didn't like being smacked around the way they were when they died in EVERQUEST, they're not going to like it in a WoD MMO...

 

And while I agree that there is a certain level of "horror" that must be maintained, permanent death and extensive loss of progression is more likely to drive people off than it is to gain memberships. EVE does have some harsh penalties for death, but it also has a way to back your character up so you don't lose all your stuff completely.

Deatrix

First off, ive been waiting for a WoD MMO for quite some time, huge fan of the table top game, have been for years. But i have a really tough time believing that a WoD:Online game will satisfy any of the hardcore WoD fans. The people that will be happiest with this game will most likely be the audience that has never seen a WoD book. the World of Darkness has always been an extremely in depth setting. Its the perfect setting for a PvP/RvR or faction based warfare game. Vampires, mages, werewolves, hunters and changelings(im doubtfull, but one can hope!) all fighting for their place in the World of Darkness, wich can be easily done (it would be similar to WoW, but a way better setting.) perfect to appeal to the masses as another MMORPG, but real WoD fans will want the intrigue of Underground Politics wich are always present in a Table Top game no matter what creature of night you are. Political structures are essential to the integrity of the game. But how can a MMORPG properly represent that? Ive only been able to think of a few ways. Toss them around in your head a bit and let me know what you think.

 

1: Kine/Sleepers/humans, what ever you want to call them, will obviously be NPCs, and essential to the game. Now in table top Controlling the masses is easily enough described by the Story Teller, but how does that get shown in a game? One Idea i had ( might seem a bit extravagant) was to have a constant "Awareness" level. actually have a Veil to protect instead of just talking about it in quest logs. The more you use your disciplines and arcana, or the more you turn all big and furry in town the more you get hunted by NPC Hunters. Situations to that effect would add alot to the game. 

2: Inter-Faction PvP has to exsist. its a must. If i cant remove that pesky Malkovian by using blackmail or paying some mage to nuke him, i better be able to put a stake in his heart my self. now thats thinking as a table top player again, All I am trying to say with this is it shouldnt be all the Vamps on one team Vs. all the Mages on another, things dont always  work like that in WoD.

3: back to the previous Perma-Death discussion. I think perma-death should also be a function of a WoD mmo. otherwise what else keeps the creatures of the night from causing havoc constantly? the fact that "the things that go bump in the night" are all out numbered 1,000,000 to one. with PD , factional warfare will have alot more risk, but the rewards should also be greater. WoD would be good for perma-death for another reason as well, just looking at a vampire wont nessecarily tell you how powerfull they are. Not like in WoW, where you can see your targets shiny purples from a mile away. one constant in WoD is typcally "Always fear for your life".

im sure ill have more to say as time goes on about this, please let me know what you think of my ideas and please add any of your own, maybe White-Wolf/CCP will see our threads and use the ideas!!! LOL yea right. and if you guys want a taste of what real WoD fans will want to see, go take a look at any of the online role-playing sites for White-Wolf games, basically big chat rooms with dice rolling programs.

grndzro

As long as I can play an Assamite with blood thaumaturgy I will be happy.

Deatrix

Odds are it will be New WoD, so for Vamps it will be Reqium. I havnt seen assimite, but. you can find things close to blood thaum..

Astralglide

First of all, I really hope they don't use Requiem rules for the WOD on-line (I thought the new systems sucked a whole lot). I supposed that they could have competing factions, (Werewolf, Changeling, Demon, Vampire, Mage, Hunter, etc) but that might crowd the world a little bit and the game would get pretty chaotic really quick.

Deatrix

my guess is if they do any of the "creatures" besides Vampire, they will save it all for expansion material. Vampire the Req. offers enough material to be a stand alone title, and enough source materials to get any nub accustomed to the WoD setting.

Threnody

I haven't rp'ed WoD since Masquerade but this is intriguing, I will definitely keep an eye out now for progress on this endeavour.  I don't have anything to add to what I'd like to see (great ideas listed above by all) but I'm really hoping a WoD mmo doesn't go the DnD online route. 

Domenicus

Unfortunatelly, no MMO company will allow PD in their game... Its considered a suicide move (in comercial terms). I do remember the thrilling to know that Lord of the Rings would have PD... That´s before Turbine take over it. But it is a fact, and they may be right on this point. PD would be wonderful on theory and a disaster on reality.

However it MUST be a way to prevent what someone perfectly called a ´homogenuous high level feast´, everyone max level (or the majority at some point). It could be an alpha class, like it was on SWG, where you start as a ghoul and became a Vampire through embrace, and then, when you became alpha class you can diminish in power (lose experience when dead or when you lose humanity) or let the live REALLY hard to sustain it on high level, it would force Vampire players to be more segregacious, as it should be. As a Vampire it would be a total new game... Everyone would start as a ghoul of some clan, with limited powers (sorry if I do make some mistake, because I never played or read Requiem, only Masquerade). The difference between a high level ghoul and a Vampire wouldnt be so big, in fact it can be in a manner that a high level ghoul would think twice before becaming a vampire (it can have many limits to a Vamprie player, specially if there is a day-night cycle).

The expansions would be the Werewolf, for example (I cant imagine a Mage MMO, the Magick is too complex, the world would be too complex).

About PvP, well thats something really dangerous... You see, games PvP based ,like WoW, tend to unbalance the game to keep everyone happy. The BH system of SWG would be great to keep the Vampires players over control, but this has to be more planned than it was on SWG.

 Oh, I almost forgot, no instances, please... That would be totally anti-climax for a game based on WoD, where the very World of Darkness is a character... I just imagine a decadent, gothic city, where I may go everywhere and hide nowhere...

Deatrix

Originally posted by Domenicus


Unfortunatelly, no MMO company will allow PD in their game... Its considered a suicide move (in comercial terms). I do remember the thrilling to know that Lord of the Rings would have PD... That´s before Turbine take over it. But it is a fact, and they may be right on this point. PD would be wonderful on theory and a disaster on reality.
However it MUST be a way to prevent what someone perfectly called a ´homogenuous high level feast´, everyone max level (or the majority at some point). It could be an alpha class, like it was on SWG, where you start as a ghoul and became a Vampire through embrace, and then, when you became alpha class you can diminish in power (lose experience when dead or when you lose humanity) or let the live REALLY hard to sustain it on high level, it would force Vampire players to be more segregacious, as it should be. As a Vampire it would be a total new game... Everyone would start as a ghoul of some clan, with limited powers (sorry if I do make some mistake, because I never played or read Requiem, only Masquerade). The difference between a high level ghoul and a Vampire wouldnt be so big, in fact it can be in a manner that a high level ghoul would think twice before becaming a vampire (it can have many limits to a Vamprie player, specially if there is a day-night cycle).
The expansions would be the Werewolf, for example (I cant imagine a Mage MMO, the Magick is too complex, the world would be too complex).
About PvP, well thats something really dangerous... You see, games PvP based ,like WoW, tend to unbalance the game to keep everyone happy. The BH system of SWG would be great to keep the Vampires players over control, but this has to be more planned than it was on SWG.
 Oh, I almost forgot, no instances, please... That would be totally anti-climax for a game based on WoD, where the very World of Darkness is a character... I just imagine a decadent, gothic city, where I may go everywhere and hide nowhere...

you are absolutly right, no permadeath is ever gonna be prominent in an MMO,, but there should be, especially in WoD online, some negatives/penalties to dying, like a loss of Blood Potency(or a raise of generation if it is old WoD). something to that effect. i think you are also right about mages, it would be way to complex to put into a game, and if they tried , i doubt i would be satisfied.

letum6030

What about having PD if someone dies a lot of times within a given time frame?  Something like five times within a twenty-four hour period, twenty times in a week, or seventy times in a month.  This way, if you die due to lag, you only raise the stakes.  If you die twice because of lag, maybe log out for a bit so that you don't blow all of your chances.  It'd give you a chance to fix your connection (if possible) before you become FUBAR.  This would play well into PvP becasue there WOULD be an end to a conflict.  Kill the person four times, they sure as hell won't come back that same night because they'd be afraid of PD.  Could have a counter on the screen showing you how many more deaths you could have before it was PD.  Maybe a sun rising for vamps.  Players would have to gauge how much PvP they would get involved in and to what extent prior to engaging others.  It would also "force" tactics and group oriented PvP.  If you try to zerg a group of prepared players, you may take a couple of them out, but most likely your side will lose or have greater casualties.  I think this would (for the most part) take out the lag PD.  This would give the player the option of risking their character knowing they have already died once or twice due to lag.  It would add in a personal element to the game.

Raheed

I hate to say it but PD which im a huge fan of wouldnt ever work....   BUT say as your char gets old(levels up/gets more powerful) he takes longer to wake up.  Maybe have the entire thing ranked say you start as a thin blooded wimp and as you lvl you get buffer but if you die more then said number of times you dont get near as buff as what you could have been?

Zorvan

Originally posted by letum6030


What about having PD if someone dies a lot of times within a given time frame?  Something like five times within a twenty-four hour period, twenty times in a week, or seventy times in a month.  This way, if you die due to lag, you only raise the stakes.  If you die twice because of lag, maybe log out for a bit so that you don't blow all of your chances.  It'd give you a chance to fix your connection (if possible) before you become FUBAR.  This would play well into PvP becasue there WOULD be an end to a conflict.  Kill the person four times, they sure as hell won't come back that same night because they'd be afraid of PD.  Could have a counter on the screen showing you how many more deaths you could have before it was PD.  Maybe a sun rising for vamps.  Players would have to gauge how much PvP they would get involved in and to what extent prior to engaging others.  It would also "force" tactics and group oriented PvP.  If you try to zerg a group of prepared players, you may take a couple of them out, but most likely your side will lose or have greater casualties.  I think this would (for the most part) take out the lag PD.  This would give the player the option of risking their character knowing they have already died once or twice due to lag.  It would add in a personal element to the game.

So, I just spawn-camp people 1-2-3-4-5 BAM! Go roll a new toon, I'll be waiting for ya, sucker. So no, time frame could and would be exploited by griefers, no matter what you did to prevent it.

Perma death = game death.

maxstone

Back to the basics of this post:

 

I'm gonna make some obvious predictions and dare you to tellme they won't happen

1. It will be nWoD because it's the new shiny toy in the box

2. The 3 "iconic" factions will be in game (Vampire, Mage, Werewolf)..the others will not be NPC's at the start because it is supposed to be rare that they run into each other with any kind of awareness of each other.

3. It won't be twitch-based..it will be the same old skill/stat based game we've played for years.

4. The UI's will be skinned according to faction, but otherwise look like rip-offs of WoW because WoW ripped it off from every other game and just made it work right.

5. PvP will be a high-level game rather than FFA because all-out bloodshed amongst AND within the 3 main factions is frowned on..so don't get a hard-on for PK

6. No matter how well it's written..there will people that will say they ripped off someone.

Zorvan

Originally posted by maxstone


Back to the basics of this post:
 
I'm gonna make some obvious predictions and dare you to tellme they won't happen
1. It will be nWoD because it's the new shiny toy in the box
Possible.
2. The 3 "iconic" factions will be in game (Vampire, Mage, Werewolf)..the others will not be NPC's at the start because it is supposed to be rare that they run into each other with any kind of awareness of each other.
Let's face it, they'd have to make a new type of all-out storyline, as there will suddenly be thousands of Vamps, Lycans, and Mages running around in the open (players). Dear God, please no Elder vamps dancing in their underwear for gold.
3. It won't be twitch-based..it will be the same old skill/stat based game we've played for years.
As an RPG based gameworld, this would be preferred.
4. The UI's will be skinned according to faction, but otherwise look like rip-offs of WoW because WoW ripped it off from every other game and just made it work right.
Possible. Or people will just mod their UIs like they do in most other games.
5. PvP will be a high-level game rather than FFA because all-out bloodshed amongst AND within the 3 main factions is frowned on..so don't get a hard-on for PK
I'd say this is probably a good assumption.
6. No matter how well it's written..there will people that will say they ripped off someone.
Guaranteed.