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Read the info, then make a decision
Rehmes
Member Posts: 600
As the title says, there have been newer allegation which most of us are well aware of. There has also been an offical responce by CCP concerning the matter. What this thread is about isnt to discuss whos right and who isnt, whos lying and who isnt. The purpose is to have people honestly take the time and read through BOTH sides of the aisle and then make your OWN decision. Some people have the need to be sheep in everything they do in life and this case is no different. They join every bandwagon that seems cool and go with the flow without ever using 2 braincells to decide on their own whether what they are reading is true or not.
On the haters side you will never please the jaded kids who cant seem to move on. Some have never evenplayed EvE but feel compelled to speak on the issue as if it matter to them at all, even more they feel like their experts in the matter and have all this info to tout as if they were there. Any 'proof' CCP shows has to be manipulated documents since we all know such thing are possible these days. To them it doesnt matter wether the proof is real or not, to them it has to be fake; these people will NEVER accept proof provided by CCP as true. So in the end nothing CCP does will change their minds. Then we have players who hate and hate yet still pay for the game. Honestly would you keep playing something you feel isnt worth it? gamers have a vote and thats our freaking money, dont play something you feel is rigged cuz its never fun, we know that. So you love the game too much and thats why you cant leave, or there just isnt anything better to play? well lean over and take it in the ass buddy your downfall. In this case you either believe or you dont, but if your paying for something you honestly dont believe in your just throwning away your money and your time.
From CCP, nothing will ever be wrong since admiting any kind failure is detrimantal to business and who whats that eh? Ofc they may be lying again or they may not be, but they have stated that they are speaking the truth and that much has gone into these investigations. And while the community still doesnt feel like all questions have been answered CCP feels that they have addressed all the allegations brought up. Go figure. Only choice we have is to either believe in their proof, or give them yet another chance. They have statements defending every argument raised and ofc the strongest would have to be that its their business and cheating in their own game would be bad for business. We either accept that or just leave i guess.
I have read all sides of the aisle, from the goons, from CCP, from jaded players in this site and the official forums. Ive taken all of these days off to play other games and refresh my approach to the whole situation. I will keep playing, and i will do so believing in the game im playing and believing in the devs who run the game. I wouldnt pay a cent to play EvE if i believed they rly were up to no good this time. I could be wrong, and something in the future may show that i was dead off, but at least i nkwo i made my OWN decision and i stood by it rather than be swept away by CCPs halfassed replies and the haters campaign. It was my own decision and no one elses. EvE is a good game btu it isnt the end all of games and if i felt cheated you bet your ass id be in another game in a flash. Im not some hardcore lunatic swearing CCP are saints and could do no wrong but im also not fond of tinfoil hats.
So to all of you who play the game, those who left and those who are thining on trying this game, i ask that you become aquainted with the information both sides privided, and sit back and think about it. Make your own informed decision and go along with it, if it was wrong thats fnie, at least it was your own decision. If you got swept away by either side and in the end they were wrong ull feel like a bigger idiot than if youd just done it yourself.
/end rant
Comments
did ccp ever address the issue of the t20 fellow and his overseeing the account-sharing cap ship section of bod?
they just sort of ignored that accusation and didn't touch any of the bod accounts involved.
think that says a lot about ccp and their trustworthiness. not to mention the lengthy list of things they've ADMITTED to, and continue to do, all in the name of well, themselves being da ubers.
what other games allow staff to play the game on dev-power-having toons and allowing staff to tell others that they ARE staff?
that alone, without knowing anything else about any cheating or allegations of cheating, is reason enough to condemn the game and it's makers.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
The two biggest things that are out is BOD admitting they are in constant contact with DEV's. Hell, they said DEV"s need friends too on their forums. The second biggest thing that is recent is the ISD volunteer was thrown out, but that the person who wanted him out was BOD and they contacted CCP thru MSN. They have a direct connection to get fast response whenever they need it? Who needs the BAT signal when you got MSN?
BOD = Band of DEV's....1) admitted to being friends with CCP employees and obviously have their support (isn't T20 still in BOD?) (2) MSN contact if need fast response for BOD to CCP friends (better than BAT SIGNAL).....
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The game is dead not, this game is good we make it and Romania Tv give it 5 goat heads, this is good rating for game.
What really ticks me off is how CCP is putting many of their customers in a tough situation. I'm thinking that the majority are caught between liking EVE, and hating themselves for liking EVE so much. Because now, they have to choose between doing what they like, and doing what they think is the right thing.
__________________________
"Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it."
--Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints."
--Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls."
--Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
The two biggest things that are out is BOD admitting they are in constant contact with DEV's. Hell, they said DEV"s need friends too on their forums. The second biggest thing that is recent is the ISD volunteer was thrown out, but that the person who wanted him out was BOD and they contacted CCP thru MSN. They have a direct connection to get fast response whenever they need it? Who needs the BAT signal when you got MSN?
BOD = Band of DEV's....1) admitted to being friends with CCP employees and obviously have their support (isn't T20 still in BOD?) (2) MSN contact if need fast response for BOD to CCP friends (better than BAT SIGNAL).....
yes its not like anyone can log on to IRC (on the coldfront servers) join #eve-chaos and speak to a dev any time they like...
Oh wait...
They can...
And oh my... did kitty forget about the petition that was sent in.. and the news that this goonie ISD member had already recived a string of complaints and was caught bumping bob cap ships.. plus when asked to leave mouthed off at them.. or did kitty have his little blackcat head in the litter tray..
Its interesting how people have come to belive that this isd member was banned also instantly... yet the ISD member who was banned said that it took 3 hours. So please rtaher then twisting half a story to your own CCP hating ways start giving full info..
For example.. the who thing about storylines being leaked and such happend last year back in October http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=405843 ... yet all of a sudden this was brought to light AGAIN..
The whole thing with Sharkbait.. happend at the start of the month and turns our he was dealing with a bug with a job that couldn't be claimed... yet it seems that a director of DS1 had petitioned about some BPOs that wouldn't lock down as well.. yet they say "oooo we never sent any petitons in.." ... yet as i said this happend at the... why wait till the end of the month and the spam fest to report it?
Now we have the claims of them quitting the game etc... (doub't it will happen..) yet... tbh its more then just bob and their pets are happy to see them leave .. more so after the failed hate campain.
So please if your going to run around with your y-fronts over your jeans wearing your EVE hater t-shirt and you white bed sheet cloak.. please do it using both sides of the argument using full information rather then twisting a tiny little bit of info and running round with your little banner shouting "Whaaa CCP R bad.."
And If your going to keep using T20 as the basis of your whine.. please remember that, he was punished at the start.. yes the punishment was wrong and he deserved the sack. But unfortunatly he couldn't be punished for the same thing twice.. As much as so many people hate it.. its a fact of life.. also it lead to the creation of the IA dept.. (something that should have been there in the start like so many other companies have..) but unlike other companies.. at least they have the balls to speak to the players, share their finding and not cover it up.. like many other companies..
But tbh .. it makes no difference as haters like you would refuse to belive anything told to you as your so attached to you hate of ccp and the witch hunt train that bacofoil has you as a prefferd customer.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
The two biggest things that are out is BOD admitting they are in constant contact with DEV's. Hell, they said DEV"s need friends too on their forums. The second biggest thing that is recent is the ISD volunteer was thrown out, but that the person who wanted him out was BOD and they contacted CCP thru MSN. They have a direct connection to get fast response whenever they need it? Who needs the BAT signal when you got MSN?
BOD = Band of DEV's....1) admitted to being friends with CCP employees and obviously have their support (isn't T20 still in BOD?) (2) MSN contact if need fast response for BOD to CCP friends (better than BAT SIGNAL).....
yes its not like anyone can log on to IRC (on the coldfront servers) join #eve-chaos and speak to a dev any time they like...
Oh wait...
They can...
And oh my... did kitty forget about the petition that was sent in.. and the news that this goonie ISD member had already recived a string of complaints and was caught bumping bob cap ships.. plus when asked to leave mouthed off at them.. or did kitty have his little blackcat head in the litter tray..
Its interesting how people have come to belive that this isd member was banned also instantly... yet the ISD member who was banned said that it took 3 hours. So please rtaher then twisting half a story to your own CCP hating ways start giving full info..
For example.. the who thing about storylines being leaked and such happend last year back in October http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=405843 ... yet all of a sudden this was brought to light AGAIN..
The whole thing with Sharkbait.. happend at the start of the month and turns our he was dealing with a bug with a job that couldn't be claimed... yet it seems that a director of DS1 had petitioned about some BPOs that wouldn't lock down as well.. yet they say "oooo we never sent any petitons in.." ... yet as i said this happend at the... why wait till the end of the month and the spam fest to report it?
Now we have the claims of them quitting the game etc... (doub't it will happen..) yet... tbh its more then just bob and their pets are happy to see them leave .. more so after the failed hate campain.
So please if your going to run around with your y-fronts over your jeans wearing your EVE hater t-shirt and you white bed sheet cloak.. please do it using both sides of the argument using full information rather then twisting a tiny little bit of info and running round with your little banner shouting "Whaaa CCP R bad.."
And If your going to keep using T20 as the basis of your whine.. please remember that, he was punished at the start.. yes the punishment was wrong and he deserved the sack. But unfortunatly he couldn't be punished for the same thing twice.. As much as so many people hate it.. its a fact of life.. also it lead to the creation of the IA dept.. (something that should have been there in the start like so many other companies have..) but unlike other companies.. at least they have the balls to speak to the players, share their finding and not cover it up.. like many other companies..
But tbh .. it makes no difference as haters like you would refuse to belive anything told to you as your so attached to you hate of ccp and the witch hunt train that bacofoil has you as a prefferd customer.
talking to them on IRC isn't the same as talking to them on MSN. The biggest difference is you don't know them personally, and talking to them where a whole group are already there, 30-40 people in a room, while MSN is a private message. Also, imagine CCP saying, hey BOD so and so, my friend, versus hello stranger....
I wonder what their response would of been if someone went on that IRC channel and asked them to Ban an ISD member for bumping them? probably would of said something like go thru normal petition channels where we can ignore it easier.
Let me ask you, are you part of BOD? lol Has anyone not heard BOD saying that CCP DEV's need friends too, and don't deny their relationship?
some of the things you said I didn't mention, Goonswarm I don't really care about.....most of what transpired between them and CCP isn't as important as the other stuff....
ask just joe smoe if they are aware of CCP corruption. The more we get the message out, the more people won't be shocked when they finally notice it directly affecting them....
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The game is dead not, this game is good we make it and Romania Tv give it 5 goat heads, this is good rating for game.
Um... actually you're mistaken. You can use a /whisper command in IRC which is the same as a private message... in fact you can enter a totally private chat in IRC as well... which is even more secure than MSN. MSN is a pale shadow in comparison with the power of IRC when used properly.
I don't know if the person you responded to is part of BOB or not but I certainly am not. My alliance (you can check if you like) is part of the Northern Coalition and has been since before this war began. We have sent numerous fleets to assist our allies in the war as well. So, speaking only for myself, no... I'm not part of BoB... in fact I've never been part of BoB or any corporation it is allied with.
Selective memory? Or just actual ignorance? Goonswarm has done more CONFIRMED cheating in this game than any other organization, in fact more than any 4 other organizations combined. They have hacked the game client (CLEAR EULA violation) been part of the GTC Scandal as well. Not to mention using many/all of the same tactics you so revile BoB for.
What corruption? The corruption of 1 DEV who has been punished for what he did? *I AGREE* the punishment wasn't harsh enough in my opinion but it is not my call, nor yours, as to how a company handles internal discipline. Other than that ONE mishandled incident I don't see any signs of corporate corruption as you so like to call it. I see a situation, *again* an internal company issue, regarding how the termination of an ISD member was handled. Granted not how I'd have done it but it is generally how volunteers are handled. The timing is a bit strange but hey, guess what, it could have just been the straw that broke the camels back for this guy. We just don't know.
Other than the T20 incident I have yet to see ANY issue that has arisen to cause me to question CCP's integrity. And while they handled that situation about as badly as a company can they DID handle it. Eventually.
Do I trust CCP? No more or less than any other corporate entity. In the grand scheme of things no corporation is out to be your buddy or your friend. They are out to make money, just like you and I. Anyone who's in it for profits will make questionable judgement calls from time to time. That doesn't make them corrupt... it makes them human. Is Microsoft Corrupt? Is Intel corrupt? Is AMD? Is EXXON?
My point is this: Be careful where you toss stones. Saying a company is a corrupt entity is a pretty broad brush stroke. Especially when there has never been ANY evidence that CCP as a whole is corrupt. Yes, T20 was corrupt. Yes, the situation was handled poorly. But was CCP "corrupt"? No... they just mis-managed a bad situation and made it worse. I can forgive that given that once they DID get their crap together they put in place all the things they should have. The only thing they really did wrong was they didn't fire T20. But, like I said, not my call, nor yours.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
so, being part of the northern coalition, you knew about the artificial cap on the system when bod lost that first cap shipyard? you were aware, ahead of time, that for the first time ever, that the player limit would be lowered for that one battle?
a simple yes or no, honestly given, is all i'm asking.
because if you say, yes, you knew; then, you're the only non-bod'er that knew (not saying that bod knew, but saying that the opposing force did NOT know).
if you say, no, then you just invalidated your previous post. because, you only know of one time some t20 guy cheated.
this is ONE incident, in recent memory which was freely admitted to. one incident out of many, which has been freely admitted to.
edited to add:
are ceo and presidents of companies responsible for what said company does? if ccp's main form of revenue was/is eve-online; then, wouldn't the people running the company sorta be responsible for how the company does business? aren't they, after all, responsible for the bottom line? if you have game developers admitting to SOME cheating they have done, then it being covered up, yes covered up BECAUSE the person was not let go and everything he did (probably not everything he admitted to doing, but i'm betting everything he did) is known by the people doing said cover-up; then how is the company not culpable? how are the suits not responsible?
mci/worldcom's problem wasn't creative accountants -- it was corrupt leadership, i.e. ceo, cfo, etc.
if you have non-corrupt leadership, it's a LOT harder for the worker bees (and the middle management, lower management, etc) to be corrupt. even moreso if it's a small company (say 100 or less?). it's not like everyone is going to be working in a building way far away from "the big boss", or that he won't ever just drop on by to see everyone, raise moral, etc.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?