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Nierro
Member UncommonPosts: 1,755
Unbalanced. Completely and totally 1 sided, bull crap.
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Nierro
Member UncommonPosts: 1,755
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Yeah the PvP in this game blows pretty bad. They came up with a fun system (I liked the vertical element) but implemented it fairly poorly.
Villains blow for so many reasons. Defenders have unresistable debuffs, /regen scrappers have nice, loose builds plus high burst dmg along with unresistable crits, and Blasters have unresistable dmg. on villain side only stalkers have unresistable dmg assuming they can get close enough to pull off an Assassin strike. But, keep in mind no hero worth their salt in RV/Arena will let a stalker get that close since they can see them clear as day with outside +perception buffs.
When cryptic made villains they totally didnt think bout pvp. Villains are way weaker then heroes in reality however no one will notice unless they participate in a lot of pvp. To prove my point, no villain VG has ever beat a half decent hero SG as far as I know
Well CoX pvp has many levels to it too.
You can do the pvp missions in the zone, only at risk to and from the door, getting good xp and helping out your side with a zone-wide buff.
You can do the zone specific missions: meteor shards in bloody bay, bounties in sirens, missile in warburg or pillboxes in RV. More pvp-risk but still possible to have no actual pvp.
Then there is the find someone and take em out pvp too.
The balancing needs work I will agree with that. Stalkers one-shotting anything cept a tanker (or invul scrapper) when supposedly being one-shotted was removed from the game. I have both a stalker and scrapper so I been the Assassin Striker and Strikee before. My scrapper had Focused Accuracy (+perception), Tactics on him (+perception), Weave (+defence), Tough (+leth/smah resist), Manuevers (+defense), Stealth (+defense) AND chewing yellows like Altoids and he still got 1 shotted by a stalker I didn't see. On the other side there are times I can go right up to a hero with my stalker and he doesn't react and other times he sees me 100's of yards away. With all the difference powers and slotting availabe it's hard to balance things out I'm sure.
At least CoX pvp isn't half a**ed like WoW's is.
hey good points-
edit- I enjoyed pvp in both WoW and CoX however I believe WoW has the best potential to support the best pvp since it was built for it + already has massive 40v40 wars + much easier to respec your skills in WoW. I dont play either MMO atm but I personally think WoW has much better support for pvp. they will have balanced factions in crusade + you can earn epics from pvp I hear. I had fun in CoX pvp but on many days I wanted to simply just burn that MMO. I never felt that way with WoW. I left WoW cause I hated raiding for epics
I've played both WoW battlegrounds and CoX pvp zones.
One problem with WoW is the queue, having to wait to get in. They kinda fixed that with the cross-realm battlegrounds but it also had the negative effect of breaking up the pvp community. What I mean is before, the usual people would go to AV (or where ever) so it kinda felt like a second guild, familiar faces and expectations. With cross-realm you don't know your fellow players so you don't know what to expect from anyone. Plus before since you waited to get it, each fight was more meaningful. I can remember 10 horde holding back about 25 alliance in Drek's keep while our offense punched into Vann. Now, it's pretty much the Zerg The General and win or lose we'll get back in.
There are some nice purples to be bought from the pvp vendors if you have the rep. They aren't as good as raid gear of course, but if you have enough gold they are pretty nice.
Another problem with WoW pvp is that once you max out the rep you have far less to play for. That may change with the honor system revamp though. At least in CoX if I get all the possible badges from a zone I can continue to do the pvp missions or the zone-specific missions are repeatable. I do like my shivan!
As far as a battleground type pvp I still think DAoC has the best. Not only fighting against players but there is a castle siege too. Leave battleground and go to the frontier and there are more keeps to be taken, some with relics that can give a buff to every single player of your realm.
Personally I dont care to fight the same people over and over. That's what I love bout Battlefield 2142 never know what will happen. As long as my brother or real life friends show up I have a lot of fun.
But I think you make a valid point- its really great if you can fight *alongside* the same people whenever possible. My old real life friend just called me up yesterday and said our old WoW guild is having fun going into the battlegrounds and fighting side-by-side against different enemy guilds. So, I think the problem you refer to can be easily rememdied just by hitting the Battlegrounds with your guild. Now, the problem he mentioned they have to use a mod to allow them to join the BG together. However, the new patch also adds 2v2, 4v4, etc arena battles. I've watched many films they look sweet. You can easily join this with friends
The new patch, as I've been told, you can get high warlord gear from the new honor point system. And, honor points will no longer decay. I think Blizzard is really heading in the right direction there. edit- Many players agree the High Warlord gear is just as good or better than raid gear cause the warlord gear is aimed at PvP.
Haven't played DAoC but I've heard lots of good things bout it. Currently I'm swamped playing NWN2 so probably wont have time to try anytime soon. But if I were to subscribe to a current gen MMO it would be WoW for the new pvp updates and burning crusade. I visited the Blizzard booth at E3 they're doing some cool things with burning
What's sad is that CoX could've easily been just as good as WoW pvp. CoX has great vertical movement. All they had to do was make an attempt to balance pvp to a certain degree, give Hamidon enhancements and those accolades from PvP (I hated grinding for badges in PvE killing the same things over and over bores me to tears), and add a fun zone (or FFA zone for level 50s like their fans request). Instead they gave their PvP populace the middle finger. Every couple of days I visit their pvp forums and everyone always seems so pissed at _Castle_ for making Badges #1 and pvp low priority.
btw I forgot to correct you on something. You refer to zone PvP. That's NOT the real pvp in CoX. It's Arena. Every serious SG/VG does arranged Arena battles against other SGs/VGs. At one point, base raids were also considered serious competition but Cryptic quickly dropped the ball on that feature.
In Arena, most any hero SG worth their salt will bring Empaths. Empathy + Focused Accuracy = Dead stalkers, period. They will also bring rad/psi defenders + ice/em blasters. No villain can hope to survive that spike for long. When you get a chance go to the CoX PvP forums and ask bout hero vs villain balance. Veteran pvpers dont ever complain bout stalkers in serious, high level pvp because they always bring Empaths. Clear Mind + Tactics will reveal stalkers clear as day.
I did a lot of Arena / RV competitions in CoX I know it baclwards and forwards. So when I say WoW pvp is much better well designed you'll quickly agree after asking around. Many of my sgmates left villain side for heroes. Entire SGs have left CoX for WoW cause Blizzard is actively improving pvp and actually trying to lsiten to their fans. Sure, it takes Blizzard months and months to do it- but at least they try.
edit- so your post is incorrect. The +perception cap is much higher than the stealth cap. It is IMPOSSIBLE for a stalker to hide against a decent hero team that has +perception (overlapping tactics, Clear Mind, Clarity, +perception auras, etc). Don't take my word for it there's a perception guide just ask around on the stalker boards.
I didn't mention Arena pvp since most of the time when people talk about "CoX pvp" they are referring to the pvp zones. They will be adding to Pocket D to let heroes and villains fight in a Arena-like setting, so that will give more options.
I've done some Arena fights, I prefer the gladiator as it's a nice change from the same ol' pvp.
Plus I don't see how you can claim my post is incorrect. I stated what my scrapper had running and I still didn't see the stalker. I was standing in a pillbox with all turrets on aggressive and he hit me from the front (probably to show off). He most likely had Stealth+Hide, since they do stack, and I wasn't at the perception cap. Point I was trying to make is with 2 toggle powers a stalker can be virtually undetectable unless the hero has many more effects on him. That's a tad unbalanced I would think his two toggles vs hero's several.
Also, I do play a stalker as well so I know how it is from that point of view too. With just Hide I can't often sneak up to a hero, but with Stealth running too very few see me before I get the Assassin Strike off. Some stalkers rely soley on Hide and I think that is where some of their complaints come from, can't be sure of that though it's just a guess.
I also don't agree that Blizzard listens to their fans. When they announced Horde Paladins and Alliance Shamans there were many negative posts in the official and other forums. Sure some people either didn't care or liked the idea but it was quite clear the majority were against the idea. Blizzard went ahead anyway. Not to mention the players want to know about Hero Classes, yet Blizzard is stubbornly refusing to even talk about them. They were promised at release and they haven't delivered.
Finally I think WoW pvp sometimes gets the nod is due to the fact there are tangible rewards from WoW. You're playing for that sword, staff, etc at exalted. CoX pvp is mainly about the badges first and the pvp second.
yeah you make good points. I dont know about the current state bout how people feel bout paladin/shaman. I think Blizzard wants to make the factions balanced. they are probably tired of alliance whinning bout shaman and horde whinning how paladins are better in PvE raids.
you bring up good points. and yeah zone pvp is 'real' pvp in CoX. I just felt that Arena pvp was better cause its organized. I feel the same way bout guild wars too. but unorganized is real pvp to a certain extent. Although certain weaknesses an AT has can be covered up by another. you know what I mean... edit- In any case I think I'm coming off a lot more arrogant then I mean to...
and yeah- in just RV a stalker can possibly drop you especially if they work fast. An EM stalker can down lotsa reds and one shot a scrapper. i know on my brute I could down like 7 reds and nearly one shot. but a stalker can do this much more easily hehe
Yeah thats a large part of it that cannot be argued. Thats what made the 40 vs 40 fun cause if they didnt give such great rewards then you wouldnt have as many ppl doing it. And the ability to roam the zones and gank was fun. but getting ganked wasnt fun at all. so yeah I cant argue with that logic. In the end, its a personal thing too but I must confes i wouldnt have pvped as much in WoW if I didnt have epics to look forward to